Office staff comfort - your opinions please

[Flo]

Posted this once but wasn't saved from  a server upgrade.

Decided years ago I would transition (MtF) when I turned 50 or my father (whom I love dearly) moved on.  He is now 87 and I turned 50 MArch 2007.  So I came out.

Question being concerns my staff.  My wife and I run a very nice business, she is the president and I run all the operations.  Starting wearing full makeup, nails, nice hair dye/cut and unisex clothes (Aramani/Boss/Gaultier) pretty much full time.  Lots of jewelry..can never have enough.  Not too tacky as my wife is very fashion conscious.

Anyway,  my staff of  12 must have noticed the difference...duh...but have said nothing.  Who could they really say it too?  "Oh Karen...is Flo gay or what"?  Can't talk to the boss when she is married to the trans...make sense?

Anyway..should I ask my employees if they are comfortable of let sleeping dogs lie?  No different treatment from them.  Or ask my secretary, who is a good friend, if there has been any problems?  Our employees have been with us for years...very much liked and valued...we are a small family.

Thanks for any help

Flo

[Sarah Louise]

Why not just be straight forward and make an announcement to the staff?

Sarah L.

[NicholeW.]

I like Sarah's idea, Flo. From all you wrote, I'd think they'd have to be pretty much catatonic not to know something's up. Telling them rather than letting them decide this or that on their own seems like a very good idea to me.

Nichole

[Kate]

Don't you HAVE to tell them? What about when you change your name? When you change your legal sex? How will they know to use female pronouns?

~Kate~

[Flo]

Agree..in most aspects. But if there are too many that have a concern I would rather resign than see the business go down.  Most have 10 plus years, customers love them (1200 across Canada) so where and who is to sacrifice?

Maybe will try my secretary tomorrow...get her opinion.  Noticed most of our loca customers are fine..some homophobes...some religeous groups that it is a sin...big diversity here in Toronto

Will keep trying

Flo

Posted on: July 10, 2008, 05:39:21 PMKate...missed your comment.

I don't have to tell them anything as the privacy laws in Canada are very strict.  Plus I can lock the door to the office/warehouse (not that I ever would..extremist might)..and shut the company down.  I would rather leave.

They have accepted so far...thought I should let them know the difference between gay/CD/TG/TS...get my drift?  Just to make them understand...even if they don't accept.

Flo

Posted on: July 10, 2008, 05:45:02 PMThink I am talking to myself here...like in therapy...but your comments have stirred some thoughts and are greatly appreciated.  Hope you know what I mean and I am not dismissing your comments..understand?

Will simply just ask them one on one if they have a problem.

You are great people...thanks so much for your help

Maybe I'll survive this....

Flo

[Kate]

What I've found is that people tend to reflect the consideration you show them.

If you just show up "enfemme" without any explanation, they may feel you're taking advantage of them as a "captive audience," since they know that you know that they can't really say anything without risking their jobs. Plus, they're depending on you as their employer to provide direction and stability in the workplace, but if you don't tell anyone what's going on, I suspect the office gossip of everyone trying to figure out "what's up with the boss?" is going to become a distraction... and create insecurity and confusion with everyone. Which leads to resentment, animosity, etc.

People tend to reflect the consideration you show them.

And when you go fulltime, they won't know to address you with female pronouns, or what your new name is unless you tell them.

Do you have a therapist? They can really help you work out a plan and timetable to transition, while minimizing the risks and problems as much as possible. They've seen what works and what doesn't, and can help you avoid the most common pitfalls.

~Kate~

[Flo]

Thanks Kate,

You are very much right with your comments.  I should let them know, so will  tell my secretary this morning and see how it goes.  Secretary is not politically correct..but somehow still valid?  She is a sweet  person and friend.

Was in therapy for 10 years in the States, moved here and took a break but have started up again to go on with HRT.

Then comes family, who are 1000 miles away.

Flo

[pennyjane]

i guess there is a line of thinking that goes...i, me, mine.  no, you don't owe them anything and i don't see how you could be held morally bound to one decision or another.  as a practical matter though, i think it's in nobody's interest to let the sleeping dog lie.  some people are afraid of dogs and will worry about when that thing is going to wake up and bite them.

the human imagination is very nearly infinate.  if you leave others to speculate about what's going on with you they will most certainly come up with all kinds of answers of their own design, nature hates a vacuum.  by default you leave them wondering if you're going nuts or what.  why not just make everyone as comfortable as you can by telling them the truth from the get go?  tell it with dignity, unashamed and unabashed.  if, and it's a remote possibility, one or two can't stand the fact that you are transitioning they have every right to leave.  just my opinion, but what do i know?  i'm just a girl.

[Kate]

tell it with dignity, unashamed and unabashed...

^^^ What she said ^^^

I've been through this too. I'm just an employee, but in a similar-sized office where we're all family too. And after giving the first few employees (I told them individually) quite a speech and education on GID, I soon realized people just don't CARE about all that. They just want to know what to expect, how it'll affect them, and if you're sure and happy.

If you start by apologizing with, "are you OK with this?" it'll sound like YOU think there could be something "wrong" with it. On the other hand, forcing it on them with a "deal with it or else" attitude won't make you many friends either. If you just stick with the facts, it seems to work best in my experience.

And IMHO, avoid calling yourself a "transsexual" or saying you have a medical condition called "GID" and all of that, or they'll think of you as "a transsexual" and someone with a mental illness. Keep it personal, between you and them, not between a "condition" and someone you want permission from. If you keep it personal, you'll find support from people who would NEVER support "a transsexual." But they'll support YOU.

The fact is you're transitioning, and could really use their support and help as friends and coworkers. Present it that way, and if you have a good relationship already with these people, they'll rally around you.

~Kate~

[pennyjane]

ditto kate.  i really, really dislike that "i'm me, take it or leave it" approach.  you begin with confrontation and ultimatum.  and it really does then signal your own discomfort with yourself by acknowledging from the onset that there may be a perfectly valid reason to "leave it."  there isn't.

if you expect that they will accept this process for just what it really is then you signal that it's perfectly alright to be doing it.  it is.  i agree about not asking for acceptance, expect it...count on it...be shocked and disappointed if you don't get it.  don't try to downplay it's importance but don't make it earth shaking either.  it's just a natural process for people born intersexed with hbs.  these are neither psychological illnesses, they are physical anomalies.  gid is often a result but is very treatable and you probably have completed that process before you transition.  you are doing what is right for you, that's the bottom line.

[sneakersjay]

Pennyjane & Kate said what I was going to say, only more eloquently.

But:  How do you tell them without using the words transsexual or GID?

Something like, hey, you may have noticed I'm dressing a little more feminine lately, and I wanted to let you all know that I'm transitioning to become a woman? (reverse for me)

Curious.

Jay

[Kate]

But:  How do you tell them without using the words transsexual or GID?

"I'm changing my sex. I'll be changing my name to Kate in a few months, and living entirely as a female from then on."

Honest, that's pretty much what I ended up with eventually. No explanations as to "why," no lecture on GID theory, no justifying it. Just "this is what's going to happen..." The more you try to explain why it's ok to do, the more it sounds like it's not. Thou Doth Protest Too Much.

A few people asked questions, which I answered... but most were about "are you sure?" and "what's going to happen to your marriage?" moreso than "are you insane?" lol...

My boss said some of the wisest words I've heard yet: "The bigger a deal we make of this, the bigger a deal they'll think it is."

The one mistake I made however was leaving things open-ended when I came out regarding my name and pronouns. I told people I was transitioning, but didn't mention WHEN to start using female pronouns and my new name. I thought I was being considerate by letting them start calling me HER and KATE whenever they felt comfortable with it, but it only created confusion and resentment over time with everyone sorta floundering around in confusion, wondering what to do. They felt awful calling me HE, knowing what they knew, and yet didn't know if SHE was appropriate yet either yet.

So even though I wasn't really passing and still looking pretty androgynous, I still quietly let everyone know that Kate and HER were fine with me... and everything went smoothly from there.

~Kate~

[sneakersjay]

Slightly off topic, Kate, but did you go through management first before announcing it to coworkers?  I won't be coming out at work for a while yet but trying to plan ahead.

Jay

[Kate]

Slightly off topic, Kate, but did you go through management first before announcing it to coworkers?

Absolutely.

I requested individual meetings with all five Officers, and told them what was going to happen. Then we all sat down and worked out a plan for how best to present it to the employees with the least disruption.

What I've found is that people tend to reflect the consideration you show them.

IMHO, it wasn't my "right" to just go straight to the employees with it. I was about to cause a disruption in the workplace, so management deserved to know first so they could decide how best for me to proceed in their company. It worked out great, as they had time to figure out policies "just in case," anticipate and plan for bathroom issues, etc. Only once ALL that was in place did they allow me to tell the employees themselves.

And things turned out great! Total non-event

~Kate~

[pennyjane]

yes, i think you did it about as well as it can be done kate.  "open ended", that's a phrase i've been looking for.  if we don't make people aware of where we are and where we're going then how are they supposed to know?  for a long time i corrected every he...i did it nicely, but firmly.  i let people i was around alot know that using the wrong pronoun hurt me, made me feel uncomfortable.

one woman, a friend from my old church insisted that she would always call me "steve".  i told her i guessed that was alright as long as she never expected an answer.  the truth is i haven't heard any of those things for sometime now.  i think, no matter how you look, you eventually just get comfortable in your own skin and just automatically exude your true gender.  the subtle signals you send eventually just overpower the obvious ones.

[Flo]

Hi all,  quite a good bunch of thoughts and opinions.

Took the first step today with my secretary (administrative assistant), was quite different than I expected. 

Started off in the morning trying to work the courage up, major panic/anxiety attack by around 10:00 am.  Wasted a Xanax over what turned out to be a sorta non-event.

After lunch we were both standing outside having a smoke (I know I know...Doctor has threatened me) and just started talking about me changing, about how I made a decision years ago to come out of the closet and transition when I was 50 or when my father moved on.

Her comment was "what are you transitioning into, I know you're not gay, so?"

I basically told her I was transgendered, (not transexual to start off as I wanted to avoid the term "sex" altogether...I have had bunches of HR training), and that this transitioning was a constantly changing event with steps leading to an unkown end.  She knew what transgendered meant and said everyone had noticed the gradual change and from her perspective, and others, there wasn't any issue.

She told me I still treat everyone with the same concern and respect I always have, care more for their well-being and their families than the bottom line, and everyone loves their jobs, and the family feeling.  She said "families are all about change".  Gotta love her.

We talked about the subject in general for 15 minutes, seemed just like a "normal" conversation...

Made me aware that if people truly know you, deep down, and you have treated them fairly with respect, and kindness, they can accept change.

I think part of this is because I am taking steps, not going from "Robert" one day to walking into the office like Mimi on the Drew Carey Show.

Guess I do have a slight advantage as far as position in the company, but that makes this even more important that my continued transition needs to take into account those that rely on me.

Thanks again for your support, comments and direction.  I think I like it here...

as always....Flo

[NicholeW.]

not going from "Robert" one day to walking into the office like Mimi on the Drew Carey Show.

Yep, Flo, not doing that is a very good move!! 

Sounds like you managed to get some good knowledge about the people who work for you and how they are probably feeling. I'd say if absolutely nothing else, you've found that your employees love and respect you. That says o-so-much! All good!! 


Nichole

[pennyjane]

ditto nichole, a good person is just a good person regardless of gender.

Posted on: July 11, 2008, 04:30:27 PMi sometimes wonder how my transition might have been different if i had not gone from steve to pennyjane overnight.  in some ways i think just doing it and getting it over with was an advantage, while on the other hand i believe doing it that way created some difficulties that might have been avoided.

in my case it wasn't a decision i actually made.  i chickened out and let the decision be made for me by my wife.  she was very concerned about my life being in jeopardy so she just had it done immediately.  i more or less just let it happen.  it's worked out ok, and i sometimes wonder if i'd have ever made the decision to do it left to my own devices, so i can't complain about anything that's happened.

when it happened i called each and every member of my family and gave them a heads up.  i didn't go into it very much, just let them all know that when they saw me again i would be enfemme.  from my brother and sister i got, "nothing new here, i knew that thirty years ago."  of course that was true, but what they knew wasn't very much.  been alot of ups and downs in both their cases.  from my mother, "well, you're a grown man, i guess you can do whatever you please with your life."  pretty clear there was alot of work to be done there.  all in all, my family has come around much better then most i've heard about.  i'm kind of thinking this was really the best way for it to happen with them.

for my chruch family it was very different.  i belonged to a small congregation at that time, each member was a bigger piece of the whole then in the larger churches, so we were all very close and very interdependant.  i think the sense of betrayal they precieved was exponentiated by the immediate turn around.  they may have taken it alot better if i'd have eased into it.  as it happened i lost that chruch and the whole family i was a part of there.  i believe the slower approach might have been more successful there in that a couple of years later i was invited back into the fold.

in the case of my friends, i didn't have a whole lot of close friends that weren't a member of the church.  but the ones i did have all stayed with me.  my best old male friend is still that.  we've gone thru some stuff together over this but are just as good a friends as we were before.  in his case i just showed up at his door a couple of days in, dressed nicely.  he was shocked!  "what in the world are you doing??...get in here before somebody sees you!"  from that somewhat auspicious beginning we managed to work thru it.

so, i guess in the end...there were good parts and bad parts.  just like all the rest of this...i think it depends on the individual and how they go about doing things.  God bless us all with...