Feeling Guilty, any advice?

[smores2921]

So I guess I should give a lil background first. My boyfriend, who's ftm, and I have been dating for about 8 mo now and we were actually friends prior to dating (for about 6 mo). He was part of the drag troupe that I was once in, so we had the same circle of friends and that's how we met. We became friends at the beginning of his transition so I've seen him come a long way. Now, since I was about 17 I struggled with my sexual identity and eventually came to realize that I was a lesbian. And when my boyfriend came into my life, we both thought it would be just casual. Boy, we're we wrong.
We now share a beautiful love for each other, supportive and push each other to be better in life. Now comes the tricky part..  Now, I'm ok with the "category" of being queer, i still like women but i am very attracted to my boyfriend. I've known from the start that he wanted his top surgery, but he told me he didn't want the bottom which I was fine with.

But yesterday he confronted me with a new surgery that offered transmen a penis that could actually feel enough stimulation to orgasm, and also looked fairly "real" (it's called musculocutaneous latissimus dorsi flap) and told me that after maybe another 5 to 10 years he might want this surgery. Honestly, that idea scared the crap out of me. I felt like it would change our relationship. I am scared I wont enjoy it, and I understand that we both have needs to be fullfilled. And with this surgery there will no longer be a hole, which I do enjoy.
I have some emotional blocks with having relations with a "real" penis as well. This stems from my father being muslim, and so I was brought up in a conservative household and viewed a woman having sex was "slutty and dirty" and so that's how I've felt previously with men. I was also raped (although it wasn't violent).
Now we've been talking about getting married within the next year or two, but I am scared of the change this surgery might have on our relationship. I am feeling guilty and selfish for possibly being responcible in a torrent in our relationship and to hurt my partner whom I love very dearly. I do not want to give up on this person who has brought such peace and happiness in my life. Can anyone offer any advice for me?

[TamTam]

Hey,

Firstly.. don't feel guilty or selfish about the way you're feeling.. you can't help the way you feel.  You're not feeling these things on purpose to hurt him.. so there's no reason to feel guilty, and the very fact that you feel bad about it is proof that you're not selfish.

It might be helpful to try and figure out why you feel this way. Do you not enjoy sex with men because you're not attracted to them, or is it because of your previous experiences and your upbringing?  If it's the former, then most likely, you won't be able to change it- sexuality can be pretty fluid, but if you simply don't like penises, that's unlikely to change.  But if it's the latter, or if you suspect it might be the latter, getting therapy might be a good idea.. to help you move past your emotional blocks in a healthy manner.   If it's emotional blocks holding you back, then when they are worked through, you might discover that you can enjoy sex with men just as much as sex with women.

But if that's not the case, and you're sure that you just plain don't like penises, then I think you should tell him where you stand.  Let him know that you think it could affect the nature of your attraction to him.  Attraction isn't something you can help; you can't turn it on or off like a switch, and so if penises turn you off, of course him suddenly having one would affect you in some way.  Maybe by then you'll have become more accustomed to the idea and it'll affect you less.  But whatever happens, make sure he knows.  And make sure he knows it's not something you can help- it's nothing personal.  If he knows that you don't intend to keep him from having the surgery, and that you still support him and love him, then I would hope he wouldn't be too hurt.. I mean.. he knew you identified as a lesbian, right?  And he knew you weren't expecting him to have surgery.  Your feelings about it shouldn't come as a surprise.   This isn't about you loving him less, it's about something very physical and difficult to change.

Also, you can be in a loving relationship that doesn't include sex. And there are other things that people can do that don't involve interfering with the lower regions.  You don't have to give up on him, not at all.

Good luck.

[I'm a gay woman dating a mtf woman. ^_^ ]

[smores2921]

Thank you so much for your responce!!!
It's nice to know that someone can understand where I'm coming from. How did you handle your change in your relationship and your personal identification as a gay woman? I would love to learn about your relationship.   
I don't know if it would be inappropriate to ask you some personal questions about the lovemaking aspect that we experience now, pre-op, versus my experiences with biologically born men and get your opinion on whether it's attraction or an emotional block?
Oh btw.. Although it would be a romantic idea that we could have a relationship without necessarily having sex, my boyfriend and I understand we have strong needs that have to be fulfilled.. It can be a curse I guess lol.

[TamTam]

No problem! ^_^

Well, we started dating before she decided to transition and become female. At that time, we had agreed that it would just be a relationship without a sexual aspect, since I'm.. really not attracted to guys' bodies at all.  My experience is a little different from most other's.. I know I'll actually be more attracted to her when she transitions, so.. I didn't have to compromise anything to be happy about her decision.  I'm actually more attracted to her even now [she hasn't actually started physically transitioning yet], just for being able to think of her as a woman instead of a man.  Just goes to show how much of attraction is mental. But the most important parts of our relationship, like.. the love, and the trust, haven't changed.  Unless maybe they've gotten stronger..

But.. I do remember what I felt when I was still thinking of her as being male.  And back then, I still kept my identity as a gay woman.. I just thought to myself, "I'm a gay woman who's made an exception, and anyone who has a problem with that or doesn't understand can ->-bleeped-<- off."   There were a few small things that worried me a little, but.. I knew that none of them were big enough to make me love her less, so it wasn't very hard at all.   Everyone's experience is different, though.

It wouldn't be inappropriate. I'd like to help.  I'm not a therapist, though.

[Sephirah]

Well, since TamTam is the love of my life, I could probably add a little to what she's said.

Before I'd decided to transition and become myself, the way I felt about her was love in its purest sense. By that I mean very little was based on physical attraction (although she is drop dead gorgeous ) But it was more the fact that I loved (and still love) who she is as a person, the way she makes me feel, the way we totally connect with each other and can be totally honest with each other about everything. The bond we have with each other and the way we make each other stronger by being together... that overcomes all physical attributes.

After deciding to go ahead with my transition, nothing really has changed. The way I feel about her hasn't changed, if anything it's got a whole lot better since I can be myself with her and I love the way she makes that feel so special. At this point I still don't really think about the sexual aspect too much, since she is so much more that I really don't need to. The intimacy, that's something I cherish, and close physical contact... absolutely. But with regard to downstairs... whatever happens or doesn't happen... will happen or not happen.

It wasn't her gender or sexuality that made me fall in love with her, it was who she is as a person, and the way I feel with her... her entire personality. She's amazing. That will never change. And with that as a basis, I think that most things can be worked through and adapted to.

[TamTam]

::blushes:: 

[ftmshubbie]

Smores,

SInce Tam Tam and Leindra have said it s well, there's little that I can add. I'm married to an FtM. I've known Robin for 30 years, and we've been married for 27 of those. He came out to me about 4 years ago and, a year after that, we began transitioning together.

I say "together," because both of you need to fully appreciate that you both will go through changes through all stages of transition. Your worries about whether or not you can, or want to, deal with a neophallus, are absolutely genuine, normal, and justified. Each couple has to honestly decide what steps will be, and will not be, allowed in a transition.

It's very common for trans folks to believe that any resistance we SOs show to their transitioning is "non-support." But they must learn that love is a two way street, and a relationship is a partnership. Clearly you care deeply for and love your partner. That you are still there and worrying about the future with him is plenty of evidence of that. But he needs to appreciate that, as he emerges into the self he was always meant to be, he is asking you to step into a closet and become what you never thought you were.

Make sense? His joyous liberation, in fact, requires that you suppress much of your "true self." Well, in order for us SOs to do that, we need our sweeties to know that we have something to say about it. If it's "my way or the highway" for either of us, then it's not a true partnership.

By the way...there is still way too little research and experience with these new phalloplasties. His ability to fully function and achieve orgasm is far, far from certain if he undergoes that procedure. Ask him if he honestly wants to give up both his love and his love life! He may see what is really important. My catchphrase is "It's about love, not plumbing!"

Hugs to you, Smores!

Dan
Come Visit me on #chat in the evenings sometime!

[pennyjane]

ummm....emme.....ummmm....ok...i guess.

i think tam tam just said the one most important and universal truth for all of us, ts and spouse/lover.  guilt should not be in the mix.  none of us have anything to feel guilty about.  none of us are perfect, none are even close...but we're all trying.  this is a life that just hasn't been charted enough to even stay close to the shipping lanes.  we're all adrift and finding our way on wings and prayers.

i can only speak from my own experience and perspective.  i don't know much about the "normal" sex drives so anything i could offer from that place would just be shooting in the dark.  i can't even point to a successful post-op sex life between two willing partners, we haven't found that for ourselves as yet...but we're still looking.  but, from love i can speak. 

i have found in the past that the conventional wisdom when it comes to trans-marriages is that they won't work.  sometimes i'm a little shocked at how easily some of us accept that and assume it to be true....or should i say presume it to be true.  we too often approach it from the perspective that the odds are against us and it probably is going to fail.  whether we use the words or not, the thought is so often in our hearts.

one diffuculty we have is that we have no good measure of who's being truthful with us and who isn't when most of our information is coming from on line.  it's not all that uncommon for fantasy to be portrayed as truth and therefore much misinformation, and unwise guidance is often offered up....basically from vicarious sources.

i would strongly recommend you meet people in person.  see them face to face, get involved with their lives so you can see just what is happening, what's real and what is working in the real world.  there are models, you just have to find them.

the transsexual experience is very, very different from all the others under the tg umbrella term.  where most of the tg dwellers have their translives based in sexuality, transsexualism is not associated in any way with sexual identity, orientation or any sexual activity...it is only about gender identity and perception.  drag, transvestism and such are about fantasy, that's the reality of the act....it's about fantasizing a gender presentation, transsexualism is the antithesis of that, it is about what's very, very real.....fantasy is detrimental to the transitioning transsexual, it gets in the way.

so, to us, myself and my annie, we have had to compartmentalize.  not that we particularily like it, but since neither of us knows a way to fit a mutually positive sexlife into the different places we are coming from we have had to just separate sex out, to leave it be....for the time being anyway.  we hope to one day be able to celebrate a happy and healthy sexlife, but until we can make it healthy and mutually uplifing we find being unfullfilled preferable to finding individual fullfillment.

that's just one model, i don't know how unique we are in that we make it work, but at least we can say that in some instances anyway, it's viable.  God bless with...