Susan's Place Logo

News:

Visit our Discord server  and Wiki

Main Menu

Developing a female voice....Should you?

Started by Ms Bev, October 14, 2008, 10:24:13 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Ms Bev

I know some transwomen, mostly from forums and such, that think they should not have to feminize their voice.  I agree.  They should not have to if that is their feeling.

However......this is how it was for me:
I tried several times to feminize my voice, and found it nearly impossible, and so frustrating that I gave up.  I thought I would never develop a female voice, and almost gave it up.

But then, I had the following thought:
Somehow, by a quirk of nature, I was 'cheated' out of being physically female, but now I am. 
So.....I was also 'cheated' out of having a female voice, which I dearly wanted.
This epiphany drove me to teaching myself to have a female voice.  It took a long time, but then, so did my physical transition.  But, after a lot of very hard work, Beverly has her female voice.  She can still summon 'Mike's' voice on occasion, but it's getting harder and harder to remember.  Kind of like my old face.....harder and harder to remember.

What do you think?  Should you feminize your voice?


Bev
1.) If you're skating on thin ice, you might as well dance. 
Bev
2.) The more I talk to my married friends, the more I
     appreciate  having a wife.
Marcy
  •  

sadieone

My personal opinion, yes you should develop.  Society is messed up enough as it is and looking female and not sounding like one....well I can see repercussions because of it. 

  •  

deviousxen

Mines in an in between state, and I'm usually not trying to pass on a day to day basis cause I'm not full time yet and its kind of embarrassing to practice around my roomies.

The one reason why I can barely do what helped me so much before hormones, is that I have no car to drive around in.

I used to sing in the minivan to 8 bit and Dream Theatre and Queens of the Stone Age almost every day cause I drove so much.

Now I have no wheres to sing at the top of my lungs.
  •  

ColleenW

Quote from: sadieone on October 14, 2008, 10:32:05 AM
My personal opinion, yes you should develop.  Society is messed up enough as it is and looking female and not sounding like one....well I can see repercussions because of it. 



I agree, at least for me. There's only so much "sailing against the cultural norms" that I have the strength for.
  •  

christene

Ive been thinking about this a lot too...I pass very well other than the voice. Its funny because I think I have the female voice down pretty good, but get nervous about using it for some reason and I continualy question if I need a female voice (I always conclude I do)...
For some reason I feel it will be the most difficult part for others to accept, my new voice vs. the physical changes...
  •  

almost,angie

I have decided I will not get FFS till I can sound like a female . I absolutly have always hated my voice and can`t wait to change it. I`m in the frustraited stage at the moment but am looking into getting voice therepy soon. I have tried all the web sites and DvD`s I can get my hands on and nothing worked after a year of all that practice.
  •  


Silk

When I'm posing as a woman, I have no trouble at all coming off as a woman who simply speaks in a low tenor. It goes with my slight masculine qualities, anyway. I even keep my hair cut short, and I wouldn't be caught dead in a skirt or a dress (at least not out in public). I don't do anything to try to raise the pitch of my voice. It's more in the harmonics and body language than anything else, and that's something you learn more through usage than through practice. Also, don't worry about what gender people think you are. Whether you're male, female, or transitional, you shouldn't be associating with people who have trouble treating you as an individual.
  •  

Wendy C

Yes! For me its getting way too difficult to keep switching back and forth. Its bad enough that my female voice needs much work yet to be having slips in public when you are preparing for FT. I find that I also slip at work into a female voice and Im not out there yet. You also have to be extremely careful of where you practice at.  ;D

I recently had one of my most embarrasing moments in a mens john at work. I swear I looked when I went in and saw no one else in the other stall that was there. Here I was just doing my piddling and practicing my female voice when I hear a male voice softly clearing their throat. :o  I thought I was going to die. Talk about getting real quiet and making a hasty exit.  :embarrassed:

Wendy
  •  

NicholeW.

Quote from: Silk on October 14, 2008, 01:51:08 PM
When I'm posing as a woman, I have no trouble at all coming off as a woman who simply speaks in a low tenor. It goes with my slight masculine qualities, anyway. I even keep my hair cut short, and I wouldn't be caught dead in a skirt or a dress (at least not out in public). I don't do anything to try to raise the pitch of my voice. It's more in the harmonics and body language than anything else, and that's something you learn more through usage than through practice. Also, don't worry about what gender people think you are. Whether you're male, female, or transitional, you shouldn't be associating with people who have trouble treating you as an individual.

I think this is the jumping-off point between gay males, drag queens, other varieties of TG and TS. (refer to Hypatia's thread: https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,45511.msg291810.html#msg291810 ) I truly believe that experience tells me that other TG-types don't quite "get" the transsexual-thang and especially prone to that failure are gay males.

I don't think what is realized is that TSes are not 'posing as a woman (or man.") We simply are female and male, just like you.

Like Hypatia I am not especially fond of being viewed as TG. That has nothing to do with who makes up the transgender rainbow, has nothing to do with the frivolity involved in saying that since Charles Prince coined the term (which he didn't,) that one shouldn't use it since he was all for wiping out transsexuals altogether. (Join hands Virginia/Charles with Janice Raymond and mAndrea.)

I am not transgender, although I support transgender causes and embrace people who refer to themselves as transgender. For that matter I embrace gays and lesbians as well. O, better not leave out the nons, some of my best friends are non and straight! But I have no interest in "posing" as anyone at all. I simply am Nichole. I simply am female. Period. (to quote Tink. :laugh: )

Is there something terribly wrong with that? Not as I see it. One does voice simply because she's not trying to cast an illusion, make a fantasy or a caricature. She's working toward becoming the very self she is. Like a person who through accident has lost the power of speech, there is therapy, rehab, that makes a voice that, if not the one "one might have had," at least can be passably recognized as female.

Is that important? Not to everyone perhaps, but to me it has been. Yes, it's been hard work. Has it been worthwhile to hear people on the phone invariably use "ma'am" or "miss?" Yes. Has it been worthwhile to not be outed by my voice in a public situation at a restaurant, on the street, in an office, to my clients? Yes.

Along with the other facts of changing one's material self to emulate and match one's heart/soul/mind/brain, voice goes along with breast development, genitalia reformation, touching the places one has always lived in and touching them with life and depth, not a wannabe, but someone real, true, no poses. Just woman.

I don't expect that to be universally understood. I expect many to wish to "break the binary" and they are welcome to do so, as far as I am concerned. I don't require the binary to be myself, but am reasonably comfortable within it as well.

I'm not for segregating ourselves into distinct, separate and mutually exclusive clubs and associations. Why should anyone be left behind? Why should anyone gloat that some could be or have been? That is simply cruel and shallow in my estimation. There's no need to hurl anyone else anywhere at all for me to live into myself. That self, in this life, is female. It's not a pose of any kind.

And I will associate with any other human being. Not always as friend or disciple, but as another human being who deserves whatever respect I give other human beings. Who they are, where they come from, what they believe be damned. It is what it is and their blood is as red as my own, their tears as briny, their laughter as infectious.

Nichole
  •  

Silk

#10
Quote from: Nichole on October 14, 2008, 03:47:28 PM
Quote from: Silk on October 14, 2008, 01:51:08 PM
When I'm posing as a woman, I have no trouble at all coming off as a woman who simply speaks in a low tenor. It goes with my slight masculine qualities, anyway. I even keep my hair cut short, and I wouldn't be caught dead in a skirt or a dress (at least not out in public). I don't do anything to try to raise the pitch of my voice. It's more in the harmonics and body language than anything else, and that's something you learn more through usage than through practice. Also, don't worry about what gender people think you are. Whether you're male, female, or transitional, you shouldn't be associating with people who have trouble treating you as an individual.

I think this is the jumping-off point between gay males, drag queens, other varieties of TG and TS. (refer to Hypatia's thread: https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,45511.msg291810.html#msg291810 ) I truly believe that experience tells me that other TG-types don't quite "get" the transsexual-thang and especially prone to that failure are gay males.

I don't think what is realized is that TSes are not 'posing as a woman (or man.") We simply are female and male, just like you.
I think your feelings so far are quite understandable, but you seem to have misunderstood me. Let me be clear: I identify as female. I identify as very female. To put it very roughly, I consider myself to be an incredibly well-adjusted, young woman in a man's body. That's not perfectly accurate insofar as my understanding of the subject, but it is sufficient for the layman. I don't identify as male. I don't have any desire to be functional as one. I want to be completely functional as a woman. I want the uterus. I want the periods. I want the capacity to bear children.

Quotenot a wannabe, but someone real, true, no poses. Just woman.
I can assure you...as someone who is far more educated and literate than most people in the area of neuroscience...that you are absolutely the picture of womanhood, and there is no need for such insecurities. It is highly unlikely that you differ significantly from a normal anxiety-ridden female. Transsexualism is well-supported by the empirical sciences. In fact, it's one of the favorite curiosities of many geneticists.

QuoteAnd I will associate with any other human being.
Whereas I have no desire for the company of individuals who are incapable of tolerating mine. The reasoning is beautifully simple, really.
  •  

Carolyn

My voice jumps back and fourth but more or less it no longer sounds like a male voice on the phone or Xbox Live. It passes mostly. I've been working on it for I think three to four months and thus far it sounds good, just need to work on a few everyday words and I'll have it down. Good bye Josh's Voice hello Carolyn's Voice!
  •  

Hypatia

There's no question about it. It's an imperative necessity. I don't know how all these beautiful women can perfect their looks, their moves, their entire female presence -- and then be OK with how they destroy it all as soon as they open their mouth. For me, the looks took a lot of effort to get right (the body language came naturally) and having put all that effort into myself, it made sense to invest that work in my voice too. It was so worth it, I get ma'amed on the phone every time now. I cannot imagine how my transition would have been this successful without the voice feminization.
Here's what I find about compromise--
don't do it if it hurts inside,
'cause either way you're screwed,
eventually you'll find
you may as well feel good;
you may as well have some pride

--Indigo Girls
  •  


Nero

I'm not sure. I know women who pass despite having their 'male voice'.
Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
  •  

cindybc

Hi Bev, wow this subject makes it's rounds often enough, but as it should. I think for anyone who is transitioning from M-F it is crucially important to train their voice more towards a female voice if they have a desire not to out themselves as soon as they open their mouth.

I trained my own voice although I was fortunate that I didn't have a deep male voice to begin with. It just need tuning up.

Every time this subject comes up I of course bring my friend along with me.

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=s7qSJ19f_QU&feature=related

You are also welcome to visit my Blog, Cindy's Ramblings Blog.

Cindy
  •  

Alyssa M.

Passing isn't the main issue for me. I just hate my voice. What I hear in my head is totally disconnected from what comes out. It's like having a nasty cold all the time.
All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy; for what we leave behind us is a part of ourselves; we must die to one life before we can enter another.

   - Anatole France
  •  

Silk

Quote from: cindybc on October 15, 2008, 01:32:17 PM
Hi Bev, wow this subject makes it's rounds often enough, but as it should. I think for anyone who is transitioning from M-F it is crucially important to train their voice more towards a female voice if they have a desire not to out themselves as soon as they open their mouth.

I trained my own voice although I was fortunate that I didn't have a deep male voice to begin with. It just need tuning up.

Every time this subject comes up I of course bring my friend along with me.

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=s7qSJ19f_QU&feature=related

You are also welcome to visit my Blog, Cindy's Ramblings Blog.

Cindy
Okay, now that I've seen how much of a difference it makes, I can imagine how this could affect one's self-image.

I think that part of the reason I can get by is that I already have a slightly feminine voice, and it already has slightly musical qualities. I occasionally get "ma'am" and "miss" over the phone, and I look attractive enough as a woman to erase most suspicion. Strike that, I look hot, and I flaunt it. I really didn't take into account that most people don't have that kind of luck.

A few of you have delivered some very strong arguments, and I have greatly reconsidered my initial stance on the subject. Seeing it on video really drove it home.
  •  

Janet_Girl

I have practiced getting to my feminine voice.  And now I have a really hard time bring up my old male voice.  And that is perfectly fine with me.
  •  

Kim6

Quote from: Nichole on October 14, 2008, 03:47:28 PM

I think this is the jumping-off point... <snip>
Nichole

Wow...  I am encouraged :)  In the past I tried to share my very similar feelings and was accused of all sorts of terrible things like, "Deciding who is a "real" woman and who isn't."  Simply for being so naive as to share my own needs, goals and desires while thinking that there were others who could identify or sympathize with me.  And I am talking about another website, long ago and far away.  But.. at that particular website you either identified as transgender and realized that everyone was just as valid of a "pretend" woman or you would be dressed up as a straw man and burned.

It is nice to know that I can relate to you and probably others and that I don't have to worry about being tarred and feathered for being transsexual and for not identifying as transgender.

For a long time trying to speak in a feminine voice felt very unnatural to me.  And I wanted for people to realize that I was being 'authentic' by transitioning.  Trying to speak in a feminine voice seemed to betray my own feelings of authenticity and really tore me up inside.  It was like I had a real conundrum to face, the most difficult aspect of transition to me.  How do I speak in a feminine voice without every cell in my being resonating that I am going against reality or playing a part or acting?

I think part of it had to do with my situation.  Not having yet been full-time made it nearly impossible for me to talk like a woman on cue and feel like a real person.  Going full-time helped a little or it set in place another part that would bring me closer to my goal - of being able to speak as a woman without feeling fake.  The next important thing for me was to be around people who did not know me from before, that and practice helped me to begin to feel that I could speak in a female voice and still feel like I was being authentic to myself.  Now and living around some people who know about me.. I am struggling to speak consistently in my good female voice around people like my parents and neighbors.  It is really difficult for me.  So difficult in fact that I told my parents I could no longer speak to them at all until I had some time to recover from the negative comments my Mother would make because she didn't want to loose that last little bit of her son, his familiar voice.  She would constantly tell me just to speak in my "normal" voice, my "natural" voice and she would say that my female voice was an "unnatural" "strain" and that she just wanted me to be "me".

It is especially difficult right now, not having spoken to my parents in several months now that I have found out that my brother is in intensive care, in a coma, from Insulin Shock and it is expected that if he does survive, he will have permanent brain damage.  My parents love me and I love them.  My sister thinks I am a Satan worshiping sex freak, rapist and child molester (because I transitioned) and she is a "Christian", married to a Liberal Jewish man  ::)  It is just odd how she can justify whatever she wants and how for her religion is simply a tool to use to maintain hate or fear or whatever she is suffering from.  But anyway... I remember long ago someone saying how you need to be prepared to loose Everything when you transition, I never realized how heavy the costs would be or maybe I kinda knew but knowing the reality of it is a lot different than considering the possibilities before the fact.

Everyday I learn more and more that the most precious thing we have is time and the second most precious thing we have or don't have is health and money.  Money can buy you happiness, it can buy you a vagina, nice breasts, a beautiful Dr. Ousterhout face... Money is everything to a transsexual woman and I wish I had some.  I am just trying to figure out how to make the most of my time without dedicating my life to someday having a life.  It isn't easy being a transsexual, especially one like me who cannot, absolutely cannot tolerate being regarded by people as, "The man who..." as a preface to every idea they have about me.
  •