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Predictors of success during transition?

Started by Soapyshoe, February 22, 2009, 02:17:51 PM

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Soapyshoe

Hey guys and gals,
I'd like to share some of my thoughts on what predicts success during transition. 

The word "transition" means a lot of different things to a lot of different people.  In common usage, it means that an individual stops living as their currently assigned gender/sex, and takes steps to live as the opposite one or a different one, with the goal of living a more fulfilling lifestyle (and/or to permanently eliminate negative emotions stemming from gender conflict).

While it's easy to define transition, I feel that almost everybody has a unique concept of what it means and what it entails.  One ubiquitous problem is that our concept of transition is driven by a desire to change our outward appearance.  When we use the Internet to seek out those who have successfully transitioned, we have difficulty assessing the INTERNAL changes that have occurred, and there is very little information about how to bring about those desired internal changes (aside from "go see a gender therapist").

Therefore, I believe that the single most powerful predictor of success during transition is an individual's ability to ADAPT.  Synonyms for this are guile, craftiness, flexibility, and/or cleverness.  It means that an individual is good at solving problems.

What factors predict whether an individual will be good at solving problems?  I believe that previous life experiences unrealted to transitioning are the key. 

Emotional intelligence is HUGE.  Do you know what will and will not make you happy?  Will you carry around psychological baggage that makes it difficult to accept yourself?  Can you emotionally handle bringing your new self into a harsh, rejecting world? 

Emotional intelligence is typically gained via therapy.  Some transgender children display high levels of emotional intelligence when insist they aren't their assigned gender, despite anticipating a negative reaction from those around them.  They know what will/won't make them happy, and they act on it. As adults, though, we often LOSE emotional intelligence because we bottle ourselves off emotionally, never talking with others how we feel.  Therefore, the tools that we would otherwise have to tackle emotional problems have rusted.  Creating and refining a set of tools to guide oneself through rough emotional time are absolutely critical to coming out of transition a happier, more successful person. 

Another area of intelligence is what I call "analogical intelligence".  These intelligences help one accurately answer the question, "What is it like to transition?  What tools will I need to do it successfully?" 

Here are some examples:  1) Transitioning is like acting (at first).  A good actor can make another person genuinely believe what they are saying.  2) Moving like a female is a lot like ballet; ballerinas exemplify feminine grace.  3) Finding your female voice is a lot like playing an instrument; it takes years to master the technical skills, but once completed, allows an individual a completely new level of gender expression.

You can probably think of some other analogies I haven't included.  Analogies carry out a simple function, namely, to apply knowledge from an unrelated domain to the domain of interest. 

TG/TS children have less difficulty transitioning because childhood IS A TRANSITION.   Children readily accept the fact that they don't know anything, and show a keen willingness to learn and grow.  You never hear an adolescent say, "I just can't figure out how to speak like my assigned gender"...unless they're TG/TS. 

The later in life a person gets, the more difficult transition will seem.  I have personally accepted the fact that, if I choose to do HRT, I will have to go through a second puberty.  I will have to re-learn everything that was automatically handed to everybody else.  I DO NOT look at this as "work".  Transitioning to my target gender is a blessing and a privilege that is afforded to me by modern society.  When problems arise during transition (I know they will), I will do everything in my power to overcome them.  In my opinion, it's ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL that one accepts the reality that years were lost, and that one must "regress" to some degree in order to achieve a successful transition.  We must embody the best of what children have to offer: small egos, courage, an open mind, and willingness to make mistakes and learn from them.

Internet forums like this are a blessing, because those who have some kind of knowledge can share it with others.  This empowers our community, and allows us to adapt to a world that has always treated us harshly when we were less-well-informed pre-Internet.

Those are my thoughts.  What are yours?

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Arch

What you say about different intelligences and survival tools rings true with me, but perhaps since you seem to be speaking to an MTF crowd, some of your other observations don't work for me at all. I have never known what to think when people say that transwomen have to learn a whole new set of skills and body language. I have mixed feelings when you say that early transition is like acting. Ideally, a person should be able to simply be himself or herself, and to heck with anyone who doesn't like it. Realistically, the situation is not so simple. Most people seem to recognize that there are different kinds of women in the world, but at some point the balance tips: if a transwoman doesn't have enough stereotypically female traits and behaviors, then she is clocked by others.

I guess FTMs have certain advantages over MTFs. Sure, I've heard transguys asking, "Do I have to stop gesturing with my hands? Should I stop hugging people? How can I appear more masculine?" But I think a lot more FTMs can simply transition without making any big changes to their usual habits and mannerisms.

I have no plans to change anything about myself during or after transition. I gesture with my hands a bit, but I'm bloody well not going to stop. In fact, I picked it up from my very male partner, who is straight. I'm a pretty good listener, and I see no reason to stop that. I do hug close friends sometimes, but I usually guard my personal space. I dress and walk in a way that I find comfortable and right. The way I look at it, I'm still going to be me--the me that's been coming out for months now--but the only real changes will be from T and probably surgery.

I'm middle-aged and don't expect to find transition all that difficult compared to younger guys' experiences. My decision to transition, yes, that was much more difficult, I think. After all, I've been fighting this for years, and I have a lot more baggage than most twenty-year-olds.

When you say that we need to regress in order to successfully transition, I also have mixed feelings. In the first place, I don't know whether that's true for many people. In the second place...well, I have always felt myself to be stuck at the age of thirteen anyway. If regression is needed, I don't need to regress because I'm already there. What I'm doing now is getting unstuck and moving forward.

These are one boy's observations, of course. Make of them what you will.
"The hammer is my penis." --Captain Hammer

"When all you have is a hammer . . ." --Anonymous carpenter
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Nero

Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
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Soapyshoe

@ Arch,

I'm glad you shared your experience.  I had a feeling the FtM experience would be somewhat "less involved" than MtF.

I already had a couple reasons in mind:
1. Genetic women are allowed to dip into the world of masculinity without too much trouble.
2. Testosterone lowers the voice, so very little if any vocal work is needed.  As one's voice is lowering, the male persona and changes to the inner voice will automatically occur.  As one begins to think in a lower voice (due to auditory feedback), one will begin to feel more masculine, and vice versa.  MtFs have to do ungodly amounts of work on their voice, and it's a massive struggle to get rid of that male inner voice that's been ->-bleeped-<-ing you up your whole life.
2b. Testosterone creates bone; MtF's have to get FFS to have their faces appear genetically normal.
3. Femininity is more complex.    Guys have a few simple rules they follow.  Guys spend 3 minutes on their appearance each day.  The female world is insanely complex from the perspective of someone who's been trying to breech it for more than 10 years.  (I'm overgeneralizing here, but you get the point).  Western women spend an average of 1 hour working on their appearance each day.  Appearing female is work...
4. It's more socially acceptable for a single loner female to socialize with a group of guys than it is for a single guy to socialize in a group of females.  "You're just one of the girls" implies that a guy is gay, and gay he can never be if he hopes to avoid a traumatic existence.  "You're just one of the guys" is a term of endearment used for women who are cool/chill.

I think MtF's have an easier time in certain cultures, where expressing femininity as a man isn't so closely associated with social inferiority, powerlessness, and degradation/humiliation.
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Hazumu

Allow me to toss something else into the blender here:

My first gender therapist remarked that brain cross-gendering can happen at any IQ level, but the lower a person's IQ, the less likely they were to transition.  His take on that was that low-IQ folks were less likely to figure out or even notice that their feelings and reactions to the world at large were at odds with their assigned gender role.

Another tidbit - somewhere I read that the LGBT communities' average IQ is 130

FWIW;

=K
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Nero

Quote from: Karen on February 22, 2009, 05:44:20 PM
Allow me to toss something else into the blender here:

My first gender therapist remarked that brain cross-gendering can happen at any IQ level, but the lower a person's IQ, the less likely they were to transition.  His take on that was that low-IQ folks were less likely to figure out or even notice that their feelings and reactions to the world at large were at odds with their assigned gender role.

Another tidbit - somewhere I read that the LGBT communities' average IQ is 130

FWIW;

=K

Interesting. Do you think the same could be said for the rest of the LGB? That the higher the IQ, the more likely someone is to come out as gay?
Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
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Mister

Quote from: Karen on February 22, 2009, 05:44:20 PM
Allow me to toss something else into the blender here:

My first gender therapist remarked that brain cross-gendering can happen at any IQ level, but the lower a person's IQ, the less likely they were to transition.  His take on that was that low-IQ folks were less likely to figure out or even notice that their feelings and reactions to the world at large were at odds with their assigned gender role.

Another tidbit - somewhere I read that the LGBT communities' average IQ is 130

FWIW;

=K

Is this documented anywhere?
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Sephirah

IQ and self-awareness... hmmm... I'm not sure I'd agree with that. There are many types of intelligence, and the types of skills necessary to score well on an IQ test aren't really the same as the ability to be in touch with yourself and know your own feelings.

In fact, it could be argued the other way, that the lower a person's IQ, the more likely they are to feel things by instinct and intuition, less 'thinking things to death and trying to deconstruct everything'... more emotional than rational and analytical.

So... I don't know, personally I don't think it makes a great deal of difference what a person's IQ score is. High or lower may just be two paths to the same realisation.

You don't have to be a genius to be able to feel something is wrong.
Natura nihil frustra facit.

"You yourself, as much as anybody in the entire universe, deserve your love and affection." ~ Buddha.

If you're dealing with self esteem issues, maybe click here. There may be something you find useful. :)
Above all... remember: you are beautiful, you are valuable, and you have a shining spark of magnificence within you. Don't let anyone take that from you. Embrace who you are. <3
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Ashley315

Good points everyone has made here.

Karen, that is interesting about the average IQ's of GLBT people.  I've often thought to myself that we all as a whole seem to be rather intelligent people.
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Soapyshoe

Quote from: Karen on February 22, 2009, 05:44:20 PM

My first gender therapist remarked that brain cross-gendering can happen at any IQ level, but the lower a person's IQ, the less likely they were to transition.  His take on that was that low-IQ folks were less likely to figure out or even notice that their feelings and reactions to the world at large were at odds with their assigned gender role.


So its apparent that there's a lot of skepticism to this position.

Here's my take:

1. IQ tests measure a specific sub-set of skills, such as analogical thinking, pattern matching, arithmetic, etc.  Computers can be programmed to do these tasks better than humans.  Therefore, it's quite clear that these tests are indicators of a limited subset of intelligence; symptoms of rather than causes of intelligence (for example, "speed of processing").

2. Intelligence is something that is difficult to measure.  I can have high emotional intelligence, low social intelligence, high book smarts, and low kinesthetic intelligence.  Therefore, I long ago abandoned using the word intelligence in the traditional sense.

3. Intelligence simply corresponds to the robustness of knowledge a person has in a particular domain.  INTELLIGENCE IS RELATIVE.  An intelligent doctor in 1700 would seem mentally retarded by today's standards.

I believe that TS/TG individuals who choose to transition have a much more robust set of problem solving skills than those who do not.  And I believe that people who transition end up happier, more fulfilled, and probably make A LOT of other positive changes to their life besides their gender identity.

Having solved a lot of life's other problems pre-transition is just good preparation for the hardship of transition.  And transition is preparation for the other hard parts of life. 

IQ tests were designed by eugenicists so that social planners could more effectively assign educational resources (which are typically limited in planned socialist/communist states due to lack of robust economy).  They are purposefully designed to measure things like "speed of processing", which are woefully inadequate to predict an individual's educational success.  (Personality is probably a stronger predictor).

In conclusion, I feel that IQ tests pick up somewhat on the "intelligence" of our community, but our collective intelligence runs SO MUCH DEEPER!!!
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Hazumu

Damn...

I can't tease that bit of data out of Google (about LGBT subset having a mean IQ of 130) -- the noise is extremely difficult to filter out.  Anecdotally, I think there is some truth to it.  But until someone finds the attribution, it'll have to be 'some sources say'.

Ya win some, an' ya lose some...

=K
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Soapyshoe

130 could be on the high end (2 standard deviations above the mean, which is top 10% of the population?), but it does seem plausible.

In my experience, trans-people are generally articulate, quick-witted, and generally seem more aware of their world than the "average" person. 

It makes sense, because in order to come out and transition, you HAVE to adapt, or you'll just go back into your depressed world and fare a far worse fate.  I believe the vast majority of depression is behavioral rather than biochemical; we just have to deal with our issues because they're so heavy and so dysphoria-inducing that it's deal or die
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Alyssa M.

 
Quote from: Ashling on February 22, 2009, 02:17:51 PMWe must embody the best of what children have to offer: small egos, courage, an open mind, and willingness to make mistakes and learn from them.

Those are certainly not traits I tend to see in children. Most kids I know are incredibly egotistical, closed-minded, and timid. That's not to say I don't like children; I just don't believe they're terribly noble. Just think about your average fifth-grade recess period.

I'm not sure what goes into a successful transition, though I sure wish I did. But I imagine the most important things are a realistic outlook and support from friends and (ideally) family.
All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy; for what we leave behind us is a part of ourselves; we must die to one life before we can enter another.

   - Anatole France
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sabrina

Quote from: Ashling on February 22, 2009, 02:17:51 PM


if I choose to do HRT, I will have to go through a second puberty. 

You seem to have a lot of opinions for somebody who is still obviously undecided with what you need/want to do with your life. 

Is there or not a section that is specifically for people who are pro-actively transitioning?  I don't have any problems with cross-dressers or transgendered people, but I would like a place to share my own personal feelings and thoughts with others who are actually dealing with the same issues I am.  Maybe this is the wrong place for me and I should go back to the porn forums.  This is supposed to be a place on this forum for M2F Transsexuals & I just don't feel comfortable opening up with so many people here who in my opinion might identify as transgendered but have yet not done anything to transition themselves. 

Edit:  I have made up my own mind and I think online support groups are a joke.  Nobody has to be real and it is far to fake.  I will do what I always have done and support myself.  Canceling my account as of now.
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Hazumu

Quote from: Alyssa M. on February 22, 2009, 09:07:02 PMI'm not sure what goes into a successful transition, though I sure wish I did. But I imagine the most important things are a realistic outlook and support from friends and (ideally) family.

I imagined all the things that could go wrong, and all the hurdles I might possibly have to overcome.  Then I decided that; a) if everything I imagined came true, I still had to go through with transition, and b) that probably only 10% of the bad stuff I imagined would actually happen.

=K
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Alyssa M.

Karen,

I guess that's part of what I mean by realistic. So far, the 10 percent figure seems about right, maybe even a bit high, mostly because of the friends I've found. :)

I struggled for a long time with questions about the potential costs and benefits, not really able to get a good grasp of either, much less the balance between them. Eventually I decided that I'd figure it out as I went along.

~Alyssa
All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy; for what we leave behind us is a part of ourselves; we must die to one life before we can enter another.

   - Anatole France
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Soapyshoe

Quote from: sabrina on February 22, 2009, 09:12:19 PM
You seem to have a lot of opinions for somebody who is still obviously undecided with what you need/want to do with your life. 

Is there or not a section that is specifically for people who are pro-actively transitioning?  I don't have any problems with cross-dressers or transgendered people, but I would like a place to share my own personal feelings and thoughts with others who are actually dealing with the same issues I am.  Maybe this is the wrong place for me and I should go back to the porn forums.  This is supposed to be a place on this forum for M2F Transsexuals & I just don't feel comfortable opening up with so many people here who in my opinion might identify as transgendered but have yet not done anything to transition themselves. 

Edit:  I have made up my own mind and I think online support groups are a joke.  Nobody has to be real and it is far to fake.  I will do what I always have done and support myself.  Canceling my account as of now.

The therapists are that way --->

I would never advocate online forums as a replacement for genuine social interaction.  If you're trying to deal with extreme emotional issues, therapists are a great thing for that. 

Crossdressers fall under the umbrella of transgender, and therefore anybody facing MtF related issues can post here. 

You (falsely) believe that I'm undecided about what I want to do with my life.  The fact is, I've decided to tackle my problems one day at a time rather than turning into a ->-bleeped-<- mess.

A lot of people just jump in and automatically assume that transitioning to full-time is right for them because they're depressed.  I think of my gender identity as something under MY control and not the control of my emotions.  Just because I suffer from gender dysphoria DOES NOT mean that transitioning to full-time female is automatically the right thing to do.  If I try to transition and somehow "fail", I could easily spiral into a deep depression.  Emotional issues MUST be worked out in advance of making big decisions.

It sounds like you're putting out a cry for attention here.  If you genuinely need help, I'm sorry, you're going to have to seek the services of a professional.  All I can do is offer my opinion on stuff via this anonymous forum. 

Also, before passing judgment, you'll have to keep in mind that each person is different.  I don't look at my gender identity the way most TG/TS people do.   


Quote from: Alyssa M. on February 22, 2009, 09:07:02 PM

I'm not sure what goes into a successful transition, though I sure wish I did. But I imagine the most important things are a realistic outlook and support from friends and (ideally) family.

I suppose the fact that none of us really know is why gender therapists aren't out of a job.

I think social support is good for depression (makes things easier), but unless everybody is SUPER supportive (sisters teaching you everything you wanted to know about being female) it may just bolster your resolve.

I agree, a realistic outlook is absolutely imperative.


Quote from: Karen on February 22, 2009, 09:28:41 PM
I imagined all the things that could go wrong, and all the hurdles I might possibly have to overcome.  Then I decided that; a) if everything I imagined came true, I still had to go through with transition, and b) that probably only 10% of the bad stuff I imagined would actually happen.

=K

EXCELLENT PERSPECTIVE.  Another way of stating this is that you have to have the willpower, courage, and resolve to transition.  If you don't have the courage to do it, then you're just going to continue to face depression, with all of the addiction, etc. that comes along with it. 

I think the risks temporarily scare a lot of people off who really are suffering from GID/GD.

Transition is not for the timid.   
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Krissy_Australia

#17
Ashling

Are you writing a thesis for a doctorate or something. You just have sooo many questions and opinions on everything. Everyone has questions but IMO the answer does not reside in online forums as to whether to transition or not. This is up to the individual and it does not matter how many 'correct' or 'incorrect' answers there are to an individuals questions.

There is no logic or resoning to transition or not to. Its a personal decision.

Grow up and be the man or woman that you are
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Arch

Quote from: Ashling on February 22, 2009, 08:22:57 PM
130 could be on the high end (2 standard deviations above the mean, which is top 10% of the population?), but it does seem plausible.

Folks, ever since I was a kid, the official stat has always been IQ 130 or higher = 2% of the population. Definitely not 10%.

Not to hijack the thread, but that seems to already have happened.
"The hammer is my penis." --Captain Hammer

"When all you have is a hammer . . ." --Anonymous carpenter
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Soapyshoe

Quote from: Krissy_Australia on February 23, 2009, 01:46:20 AM
Ashling

Are you writing a thesis for a doctorate or something. You just have sooo many questions and opinions on everything. Everyone has questions but IMO the answer does not reside in online forums as to whether to transition or not. This is up to the individual and it does not matter how many 'correct' or 'incorrect' answers there are to an individuals questions.

There is no logic or resoning to transition or not to. Its a personal decision.

Grow up and be the man or woman that you are

ROFL, you'd think I was in the process of writing a dissertation about TG/TS issues.  But alas, no.

To be honest with you, gathering information is just my style.  I feel like a lot of people make big life decisions without properly understanding the risks, and/or having a realistic outlook.  I've known for a long time that transition is risky, and I"ve heard enough horror stories that I know better than to jump in unprepared.

Before I started seeing a therapist, I had a pretty unrealistic outlook on transitioning.  Spending time on these boards between therapy sessions has given me a MUCH more realistic outlook of what to expect.  I've learned way more here than I would have in months of support group meetings.

Example: Dr. Ousterhout is worshipped by so many in the trans community.  I always felt creeped out by Dr. Ousterhout, and I never cared much for his FFS outcomes.  After reading peoples' opinions on this god of surgery, I've come to understand precisely why i don't like his surgical methods, and I have a much clearer understanding of what kinds of surgical options are available.

My transition-related decisions are driven by therapy, not discussion boards.

Also, I have very mild gender dysphoria b/c of my personality, so the long-term outcome of transition has to outweigh the risks.  (Most people will disagree with me that gender dysphoria can't be mild, but that's their experience, not mine).

Finally, I share my opinions because I'm opinionated.  Through writing, I'm able to sort out my thoughts.  I don't care if people think I'm crazy for typing so much, I do it for myself, not them.



Quote from: Arch on February 23, 2009, 10:37:14 AM
Folks, ever since I was a kid, the official stat has always been IQ 130 or higher = 2% of the population. Definitely not 10%.

Not to hijack the thread, but that seems to already have happened.

If you go to Mensa.org and click on their information tab, they explain that each IQ tests have different scales.  The percentile rather than the raw score is what matters. 
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