Outed By The Social Security Administration

[Julie Marie]

Julie and I went to the bank yesterday to open up a business account.  Two people were working with us.  The woman I am working with asks me to type in my SS# and when the screen pops up with the information for my number, there in big bold letters is my current name AND MY OLD NAME!!!  She went to the next screen pretty quickly so I wasn't completely sure.  So when it was Julie's turn and she typed in her SS#, sure enough, there it was for her too, her present and former names.

There was no question to the bank employees we both had male pasts all thanks to the SSA.  They opened the doors to prejudice and discrimination.  Thankfully the bank employees were totally polite and respectful but had this been an employment opportunity, what then?  And since the bank is right across the street from our business, the bank employees could easily gossip to the community members and affect our business.  If people suspect, that's one thing, but when they know it's quite another.

I was living with the comfort my old name had been changed and would never again show up on any records when using my SS# but I now know that isn't the case.  I wonder how many other databases are out there just waiting to out us? 

Julie

[tekla]

Lots, including I would guess a lot of credit reporting companies, government records, anywhere you changed it, I'm sure there is a notation of when it was changed and from what.  Just bookeeping details.

[Flan]

Data mining is a big business especially after 9/11. However, an automated SSA record check via SSNVS doesn't really say much

[Arch]

Is there an easy and accurate way for a person to check his or her own SSA record and find out whether such information is lurking around to jump out unexpectedly? I mean, if you could check and find out in advance that your old name will show up, then maybe you could take steps to suppress or correct that information so that this doesn't happen again.

Come to think of it, I changed my legal name years ago, and I have no idea what my SSA record shows these days. I guess I should ask when I go to change my gender marker. But will I get a straight answer?

[tekla]

You can get some info changed on SSA records, but like any bureaucracy - and they are one of the biggest in the US, they note all changes (as they should, there is a lot of money involved, so potential for fraud is great) and getting them to suppress anything that they do on each and every form.

[mickie88]

yep, i figured it would be in bold print, here in Ohio at least in my neck of the woods, it's excellent grounds for legal discriminiation. the government wants to make sure we are not terrorists this badly. not everyone will be able to keep their composure like this woman did. around here they ask questions till they get the answers they want.

[MMarieN]

Banks generally pull info from the various credit agencies rather than from the SSA. Chances are that your info with the SSA is fine, it is the credit agencies that are the problem. Also, I suspect that it is difficult, if not impossible, to remove all traces of your history at this point in time. As someone above said, data mining is big business.

To me, this is just another part of being trans in the 21st century. It's still frustrating.

[tekla]

if, by some amazing acid trip, you think that by changing your genatalia is somehow going to get you off your past credit record, your dumber than you look.  And why, WHY, should those people NOT care about who you were before?  Just because you were X before, and now are a Y, I don't see where it makes you any more, or less, likely to pay on time.

Really.

[Michelle.]

Tekla as usual the voice of reason.

I would also point out that the disclaimer on Government related mail probably apllies here. "Official Mail Penalty for Private Use..."

The SSA, credit reporting co., etc are able to "mine" our past, its the manner or purpose that said info is used for that the law addresses.

[Julie Marie]

if, by some amazing acid trip, you think that by changing your genatalia is somehow going to get you off your past credit record, your dumber than you look.  And why, WHY, should those people NOT care about who you were before?  Just because you were X before, and now are a Y, I don't see where it makes you any more, or less, likely to pay on time.

Really.

What are you talking about?  "Get you off your past credit record"? "Who you were before"?  HUH?  You act as if changing your name with the SSA is an attempt to create a fake identity (and anyone with half a brain would change their SS#).  This isn't about credit reporting and paying off bills, it's about opening up a bank account where they get my money and give it back when I ask.  I'm the one who should be doing a credit report on them. 

Besides, there was no credit report details when the screen came up with my former and present names, just the names (because they didn't need a credit report).  And the SS#, not your name, is how they track your credit and almost everything else.  WHY would anyone care about the name when they have all your information with your SS#?  Think before you share your 'wisdom'.

Julie

[Annwyn]

if, by some amazing acid trip, you think that by changing your genatalia is somehow going to get you off your past credit record, your dumber than you look.  And why, WHY, should those people NOT care about who you were before?  Just because you were X before, and now are a Y, I don't see where it makes you any more, or less, likely to pay on time.

Really.

All the more reason why a name shouldn't be relevant, just credit history.

[V M]

I love Taco Cat

But seriously, after you've made so much effort to be who you are now and made the proper legal changes as part of that. Does the gov't need to step on you and remind you and everyone else who you once were? I could understand if someone was a criminal of sorts. But what is the point of embarrassing an up standing trans person? Maybe business as usual needs to change a bit more and be considerate of actual people who don't like to be embarrassed any more than anyone else 

[Michelle.]

In our post 9/11 world there is greater oversight of the banking industry. Do I like that on a personal privacy basis? No.

Do I like the fact that close to 3000 Americans haven't been horrificly killed in one day, on American soil? Yes.

[V M]

I have noticed that when I present my ID at the bank and other places, I have to be sure and wear a zipped up jacket and no make up. Otherwise, the person asking for my info. will stare at my breasts and totally scrutinize me. I haven't changed my name yet. When I'm waiting in line, they often say "I'm open over here ma'am" and wave me over. Then the ID and info. thing comes up. Except for the folks who recognize me now. They just wave me over

[tekla]

Now, I don't care how many times you've changed your gender.  I doubt the lenders, or the people who are going to put money in your business do either.  (Assuming, they are smart).  But I damn sure care about your record of handling money, how you get loans, how you pay them back, what money you owe, and to who.  Damn skippy I do.

I don't care about what names you did it under, but I have a right to know what names you did it under, particularly for a business account.

removed part of post

[V M]

My, My....Is someone in a mood. I think we're talking about people with good credit that have kept their bills up. The fact that they don't like to be embarrassed in public seems to be the issue 

[tekla]

OK, I'll go real slow here.

A business account, in a bank, is a public deal.  It gives you some tax advantages (huge if you work it right). 

If you want a stealth life.  Don't try to do very public stuff.

[V M]

Avoiding the public may be good to a degree. But if you are working on improving a situation for yourself and others, sometimes you have to go out and do things that require interaction with others among the public just to get things done. If you hide away and avoid it all, how much will you get done?

[tekla]

Well, nothing.  So you can't hide.  That's exactly where you have to be out and proud as it were.  When it comes to money, there are no secrets in the USA.

[V M]

Maybe I'm looking after the bank employee's sanity. Looking at my ID and staring at my boobs seems to make them dizzy. I want them to be able to concentrate on the business at hand