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Treatment for Transsexuals?

Started by MaggieB, July 30, 2009, 10:19:37 AM

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MaggieB

I have been researching what the religious right says transsexuals should do instead of being trans.  Since they are so convinced that we are not who we say we are, I wondered just how do they explain the phenomenon and how a "Christian" should deal with it.  The site that came up first was Help4Families and I found this fascinating page detailing what they think causes transsexuality.

http://www.help4families.com/causes.htm

There are lots of other "resources" on the site to help family members deal with a transsexual but not so much for the transsexual.  Has anyone else seen this site and if so, what is your take on their view?

Maggie
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ilikepotatoes

There was an episode of "Born in the Wrong Body" on MSNBC about a trans woman who went back to living as male after pressure from her church and regrets the decision.

Reparative therapy involves trying to convince a transsexual that he or she is really just a homosexual and then work on curing the gayness.
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MaggieB

I noted that the site says this for pastors who are presented with a transsexual parishioner :

"You as a pastor or professional therapist do not need to know everything about gender identity disorders to be qualified to help. Learn to depend upon each other within the church and readily enlist others in the community of faith for this person's restoration."

Imagine going to a doctor who doesn't think s/he needs to know everything about your malady...

It seems like all they really think is that get the person away from all outside influences then pray over him until God finally listens... 

But it was the causes of the condition that really got me.  It says for example, that the physiological female structures in the MTF TS brain come from years of thinking like a female.  They cite brain changes in people who are taxi drivers as an example.

Also note that they totally exclude anything of the FTM side...

Maggie
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sneakersjay

I think they don't understand and are misguided.  And it drives me nuts how they claim you ladies all had absent/abusive father figures and an overbearing mother.  They never even mention trans men. So, I had an absent/abusive mother and an overbearing father?!  I had a traditional, happy, non-dysfunctional upbringing which included going to church, Sunday School, and summer Bible school. 

Trying to place blame on the family isn't the answer.


Jay


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MaggieB

They seem to claim that they have an answer that has worked for many but if that was the case, you would think that the "cured" would want to tell her friends about it.  For example, if I was "cured" and was truly happy about it as they claim, I would be honor bound to announce it to folks here. But I have not ever seen such a post let alone dozens.  If it is real freedom from the "abomination" then where are the legions of the "cured" and why are they silent?

Just for the record, I had an absent father and an abusive mother who ignored me and hoped that I would get killed.  She did say I was supposed to be a girl. 

The interesting thing about my transition was because my mother said I was supposed to be a girl, I FOUGHT it harder....

I didn't understand that I was female until late in life.  Instead, I had one gender related problem after another never connecting the dots until my late 40's.  I guess I am slow on the uptake.

Maggie
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sneakersjay

Well, I was 47 before I connected the dots.  Primarily because I WAS raised in a religious household and churches who said transfolk were obviously mentally deranged, perverted, freaks, or just plain messed up.  Like that site.  And I knew I wasn't that.  So trying to put together why I felt male, why I didn't feel female, why I was so uncomfortable with myself and my body was difficult.  I wasn't one of THOSE people.

And yet I was.  Because THOSE people aren't who my church said they were.  They're pretty normal people, like me.


Jay


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ginger39

Maggie I grew up under very similar circumstances. I know for a fact my mother didn't like me much, but I wouldn't describe her as abusive towards me because she really didn't care if I was alive or dead and rarely spoke to me. Heck, when she found out I was going to be salutatorian she flipped out. Had no idea that I had ever made an A in school. She actually thought I was a "worthless p.o.s" who would never amount to anything.

As for the religious thing, I just don't understand what these people's malfunction are. I quit going to church when I was about 6 or 7. Everyone had had enough of trying to convince me that it was all on the up and up. Didn't buy into it then and don't buy into it now. Look I don't begrudge anyone who believes in it but please don't tell me I am going to hell, or that I am an abomination, or that I am confused, or that I can be cured from something that isn't even a disease. I think any religious kook who thinks they can "pray away the gay" are completely insane.


I often wonder what these people would do if we could magically switch places with them. My bet is that they are so weak minded that they'd kill themselves inside of a month. Not many people can deal with what we go through. I think it takes a special, special person to survive being a member of the GLBT community in this world. I could not imagine how bad it would be for those poor people whose families buy into that crap and force them into those reprogramming camps, etc. Goodness, faced with that kind of pressure and hate I'd crack in just a matter of days and certainly wouldn't survive it.
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Julie Marie

Point by point:
1. I never had any issues about being or feeling like a man. It just wasn't something that mattered to me. But I did often hear I was very secure in my masculinity. I guess when you're not worried about it, it comes across as being secure.

2. I integrated quite well in the masculine world. Most of my years in construction were in a supervisory capacity and I was almost always able to earn the respect of the men.

3. Most of the things I like to do and do well are considered male interests. Building, designing, math & science and sports.

4. Yes, I did envy the girls and wished I could be one. Of that, there is no doubt. But I never stared at my daughter's breasts nor did I feel any envy towards her.

5. I went farther in construction than most anyone in my trade. Only 5% make it to project manager, just one of the positions I attained.

6. Emotional wounds – everyone suffers some. It's unavoidable. And each person handles them differently.

The idea of boys being "lead into manhood" is seriously flawed.  It's almost as if you don't do that he will end up never reaching manhood.  You are who you are.  If being a man is something that is natural for you, you'll do it, without being led.  I have met many effeminate men who are great husbands, fathers, brothers and sons.

It seems to me the author would rather blame her father for failing to be a man than accept the fact her father was TG.  Her denial has helped her create yet another guilt filled account of someone who can't face the truth.

Julie
When you judge others, you do not define them, you define yourself.
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K8

I was raised in an Ozzie-and-Harriet, Leave-It-to-Beaver household.  But I knew at age 4 that something was wrong - that I should be a girl.  How did that happen, given the guidelines outlined in the article?

I believe in the scientific method - observe reality, come up with a hypothesis, test it against further observation, revise the hypothesis, and repeat until the hypothesis matches observation as best you can get it. 

I always have trouble with the pop-psych, pseudo-religious thinking that tries to shoehorn reality into pre-conceived notions.  It just doesn't work and causes a lot of pain in the process.

- Kate
Life is a pilgrimage.
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sd

Possible causes, my you-know-what. What they blame as the cause, were actually the symptoms.

I want to know how truly happy this person was when they went back to pretending to be a man.
And had these people supported her, odds are it would have turned out very different.


I'm sorry, but like many of you, I knew something was wrong right from the start as well.
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Julie Marie

I wrote Denise and said this:
My heart went out to you and your father when I read your story online.  The part at the end "My dad's heart ached because of what he had lost; his inner self and his family" made me wonder why he lost his family. 

Did you all leave him when he transitioned?  Or did he leave you?

Many families leave the transitioning family member.  I can think of no crueler way to treat someone going through this.  Transition is a time when the family should be there to show support and love, not abandonment and criticism.  I have seen it and it is selfish and heartless.  I watched when a friend was cast out of her family as they tried to pressure her to be what she is not, a man.  All they could think of was what they wanted and had no regard for what she was and is going through.  They called her selfish but she gave up over forty years of happiness for them to be happy.  But when she asked them to give her some happiness they turned their back.  I cry sometimes knowing how cruel they have been to her.   

I hope this is not the reality your father had to live with to his dying day.
 

In Peace,
Julie


She replied  shortly afterward ending with "God had allowed the healing to take place within our family before my dad passed away.

Blessings,
Denise

She had said her dad "left his family to persue this life style".  From the website and Denise's account, it seems her dad was plagued with guilt and only received negative feedback about her being trans.  Many leave when confronted with the choice of being themselves and satisfying everyone else.

But she did reply.  I don't expect, however, anything will persuade her that the rejection of family was what troubled her dad the most.

Julie
When you judge others, you do not define them, you define yourself.
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Julie Marie

The whole selfish concept is mired in being selfish yourself. When someone says, "You're being selfish" what does that really mean? Does it mean, "You're not giving me what I want"?  In many cases, yes.  And when those who aren't getting what they want decide to leave you as punishment, the degree they are being selfish goes through the roof.

The author of this book seems very focused on her own feelings and totally out of touch with her father's struggle. Being trans, I know her account of her dad's life is told through her own eyes and not through her dad's eyes.  And in doing so is spreading misinformation about her father and trans people everywhere.

Our heartache does not come from our struggle to be true to ourselves, it comes from our struggle to be accepted for who we are and the rejection we experience from family and friends as we begin to live our lives as our true selves.

Julie
When you judge others, you do not define them, you define yourself.
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K8

Quote from: Julie Marie on July 31, 2009, 08:59:39 AM
Our heartache does not come from our struggle to be true to ourselves, it comes from our struggle to be accepted for who we are and the rejection we experience from family and friends as we begin to live our lives as our true selves.


Amen.

- Kate
Life is a pilgrimage.
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Janet_Girl

I am sorry but once again it is written by a person who has not walked a mile in our shoes.  Homosexuality can not be cured, nether can Transsexuality.

A cure would imply a cause or disease.  Treated, yes, as in HRT, transition and SRS.

IMHO,
Janet
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wannalivethetruth

Quote from: Leslie Ann on July 30, 2009, 07:37:38 PM
Possible causes, my you-know-what. What they blame as the cause, were actually the symptoms.

I want to know how truly happy this person was when they went back to pretending to be a man.
And had these people supported her, odds are it would have turned out very different.


I'm sorry, but like many of you, I knew something was wrong right from the start as well.

I have to 2nd that. They are clueless and wrapped up in a figure of words in a book. If they really needed to know the answer to anything, wouldn't it be easier to ask God himself? Oh, and abomination? Not really.

Who want's to be cured for ONLY being themselves? There is nothing to be cured, but the physical appearance of someone.
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Miniar

On the Cause/Symptom front...

These things they call causes, the big ones at least, I never experienced them.
I had good relationships both with my mother and my father and still do, even if dad can be a handful.
I am attracted to men and have had fulfilling relationships with them, (as well as women, but that's beside the point).

But that doesn't matter.
When people settle on a stereotype, they only "register" those people that fulfill the pattern they expect.



"Everyone who has ever built anywhere a new heaven first found the power thereto in his own hell" - Nietzsche
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