Susan's Place Logo

News:

Based on internal web log processing I show 3,417,511 Users made 5,324,115 Visits Accounting for 199,729,420 pageviews and 8.954.49 TB of data transfer for 2017, all on a little over $2,000 per month.

Help support this website by Donating or Subscribing! (Updated)

Main Menu

Estrogen in soy???

Started by Ryuu, August 30, 2009, 01:08:55 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Ryuu

I just saw this somewhere. I'm freaking out for no reason. Is it true? I was vegan for about 4 years which means I ate quite a bit of the stuff. I know there's really no reason to be freaking out, because my pre-T body has way more estrogen than any amount of soy I could eat, but for some reason this just worries me. Is it something to be avoided, especially once hormones are started?
I swear, even if there is no harm, I may never eat soy again. ANY excess estrogen is just...bad.
Lol, calming down a bit now....
  •  

Miniar

Yeah it's true. Sort of.
There are chemicals in soy that behave like estrogen in the human body.

I don't think it's enough to make any significant difference, but I don't eat any soy products none the less. The more processed the soy is, the more estrogen-like chemicals. (Tofu worse than soybeans.)
I even avoid soy in other processed food...
technically I avoid processed food in it's entirety.



"Everyone who has ever built anywhere a new heaven first found the power thereto in his own hell" - Nietzsche
  •  

Nimetön

#2
The old wives' tale of xenoestrogen/phytoestrogen/isoflavone activity is right up there with your toenails, and seawater, containing gold (and uranium): an extremely tiny nugget of truth wrapped around a vast sea of irrational passion.  It's pop-science at it's worst, but it's also such an interesting and colorful little myth that it's discussed often on internet forums and written up in women's magazines.

I don't have numbers handy, but I've seen people run this sort of calculation before.  In short, these substances are present in food in extremely small quantities, such that, if they had a direct injection effect, you might see an effect if you ate several pounds of tofu each day.  Since the tofu is absorbed through your digestive tract and much of that material is broken down in the process, the quantity required becomes several dozen pounds per diem, assuming still that the substances are equal in activity level.  Since the biological activity level (it's effect on estrogen-receptors and associated metabolic pathways) is usually on the order of a hundredth to a ten-thousandth of normal, you'd then have to eat several tons of tofu, or similar foods, per diem, for many months on end, to see an effect similar to a low dose of estrogen.

Unless you scarf more than ten tofurkeys per day, I wouldn't worry.  If you are pre-HRT, your body produces a vastly greater hormone load, and the increase is noise.  If you are post-HRT, your injections contain a vastly greater hormone load, and the increase is noise.

If you need to know more, ask your endocrinologist, visit your local university librarian, or poke around Snopes.com and other such sites.

P.S.: A slightly more interesting topic is the presence of more toxic byproducts in tobacco which may inhibit androgens, not to mention the radiation load from tobacco smoke inhalation.

- N
While it is entirely possible that your enemy entertains some irrational prejudice against you, for which you bear no responsibility... have you entertained the possibility that you are wrong?
  •  

Myself

A friend of mine is a vegetarian and ate soy and tofu for a very long time, I think maybe even from start or before of his puberty.
It didn't affect his growth a bit as a guy, he has quite a deep voice, he is tall and he is guyish.
If it didn't affect a guy from early life, you shouldn't worry it, especially if you are at the end of the teen years.
  •  

Thorndrop

I can't see much truth in that.  I'm vegan myself so I eat loads of it and don't really have a 'femenine' body that I guess estrogen would give.  As in, I have no curves and hair everywhere.  And this is without T.
  •  

KaydinTheSquire

Quote from: Chaz on August 31, 2009, 08:03:01 AM
I can't see much truth in that.  I'm vegan myself so I eat loads of it and don't really have a 'femenine' body that I guess estrogen would give.  As in, I have no curves and hair everywhere.  And this is without T.

Ditto to that last part. My brother, sister and I are acctually allergic to real (cow) milk so we eat/drink a ton of soy milk, soy ice cream, ect. I don't look or sound very feminine for a bio-female and my bro is not female like in the least. My sister turned out very feminine in appearance but that's more of a DNA thing. :) If soy does have estrogen or estrogen like chemicals, it's most likely not anything notable.
  •  

Ryuu

Okay. I know my reaction was irrational, it wasmore of the "ICK WHY PUT MORE OF THAT IN MY BODY?!?!?" lol
  •  

barbie

I have loved tofu since my childhood. Nowadays I eat it everyday, as it is fresh, easily avaialbe and inexpensive in my country. Probably I eat more tofu than rice. However, there are many manly men who have eatern tofu more than me.

Soy and tofu can contribute to decreasing CO2 and the global warming, not to mention health and diet.

Barbie~~
Just do it.
  • skype:barbie?call
  •  

Silver

#8
Yeah soybeans and yams have phytoestrogens. Dropped them when I found out, as I'm a vegetarian. Take rice milk or something. It's probably not a significant amount anyway though so there isn't much reason to worry.

Edit: Removed redundant sig.
  •  

Adrian

Quote from: Miniar on August 30, 2009, 02:54:55 PM
Yeah it's true. Sort of.
There are chemicals in soy that behave like estrogen in the human body.

I don't think it's enough to make any significant difference, but I don't eat any soy products none the less. The more processed the soy is, the more estrogen-like chemicals. (Tofu worse than soybeans.)
I even avoid soy in other processed food...
technically I avoid processed food in it's entirety.

That sucks! It's a great thing to drink if you're working out. I'm not buying it anymore either. D:
  •  

icontact

I'm pretty young, and have been having some sort of soy product at least daily for long periods of time totaling at least two years, and I pass 100% without hormones. It has no effect.
Hardly online anymore. You can reach me at http://cosyoucantbuyahouseinheaven.tumblr.com/ask
  •  

Lisa Howard

Vegan for 20 years and been eating /using soya products all this time. As many say here you would need to eat pounds and pounds of the stuff. Just to confirm, 20 years of eating soy has had no feminizing effects that I can see

Lisa
  •  

pebbles

This knowlage was a big thing for me... for a time anyway.
I forced myself to like and eat soy products for the exact same reason you all stopped eating I hoped said phytoestrogens would have a morphogenic effect on my body.

There was of course no effect of course the dosage is much too low to have any effect on anything.

Curiously tho despite these effects if your starting HRT as a MtF you really ought to stop eating soy or at least limit it's intake not because of anything to do with the phytoestrogens but soy is a huge source of Potassium and depending on what anti-androgens your taking (Spiro specifically) you can easily come down with this and make yourself very sick.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperkalemia
  •  

Myself

Actually soys could be good for ftm because it replaces more powerful estrogens in the body with lesser ones.
Don't worry about it, their effect is weak and as I said above, pre-T they might even benefit.
As for guys, many already said and I too join to say that I know guys that ate a lot of soy during puberty years and they grew tall, big and manly.
  •  

emil

i had heard about that, too, and asked my vegan friends about it, none of them noticed a difference and some of my friends have an enormous soy intake..
now i'm a vegetarian, but i read that eating a lot of chicken can lead to guys developing female-like breasts ..
  •  

LordKAT

Quote from: emil on February 28, 2010, 08:04:45 PM
i had heard about that, too, and asked my vegan friends about it, none of them noticed a difference and some of my friends have an enormous soy intake..
now i'm a vegetarian, but i read that eating a lot of chicken can lead to guys developing female-like breasts ..

Vegetarians don't eat chicken. Not that it would have any difference on gynomastica or however you spell it.
  •  

barbie

Of course, strict vegetarians do not eat chicken. Emil just stated that eating a lot of chicken can lead to guys developing female-like breasts. This can be true as I heard that nowadays farmers feed a lot of female hormones to boost egg production by hen.

Barbie~~
Just do it.
  • skype:barbie?call
  •  

LynnER

If plant estrogens worked at all.... MtF's would be plumping themselves up with soy and yam and all sorts of other plants.  Bottom line, they dont work. I'n chat every time someone new comes in and asks about "herbal estrogens" I want to roll my eyes and whap the person upside the head with a rolled up newspaper.

There are so many hormones and pseudo hormones in all the foods humans eat, yet we show little to no effect from them. I think there's an evolutionary reason for that... Its probably the same reason that hormones in pill form have little to no effect on most people.

I'd say eat what you like and enjoy yourself.
  •