post-gender and body modification

[DRAIN]

someone on my livejournal friends list posted a link to this body modification e-zine article about a TG person and their various body modifications, piercings, surgeries and stuff. she (they use she in the article referring to her) talks about how her mods enhance and affect her "post-gender" body image.

http://www.bmezine.com/news/pubring/20070804.html
(warning for graphic pics of a cervical piercing, but they're small and you can scroll right past...the gender stuff is towards the bottom of the article)

and now for some of my favorite quotes:

Post-gender is about realizing that gender performance is elaborate and complex, but when you strip it down to its component parts, there's nothing really there. Almost nothing about a person is truly gendered, although most things can be, in context. Post-gender means choosing not to "do" gender. People will still see gender in you because we are all raised to see gender in everyone (and you can choose to play with those perceptions) but as a post-gender person you have that awareness that gender is not a real thing. A haircut is just a haircut and a chest is just a chest. You bring that awareness to the way you think of yourself and interact with others.

i like that, kinda the same idea as genderf**k

Post-gender is absolutely not a transitional point between genders. That phrase implies that there are two proper genders to travel between and post-gender is somewhere you stop off on the way.  [...]  I see post-gender as a useful viewpoint for looking at society in general rather than a sort of half-way place between genders at which individuals can choose to reside.

OK, so let's take a more challenging example: Breasts. Most people think these are fundamentally female.. but are they really? If so, how did the concepts of "man boobs" and "b*** tits" ever come to exist? Why does the body modification called "male chest reduction" exist? It's not just FtMs having this done!

i thought it was interesting that she was turning her body (genitals at least) into something more like intersex...being gender fluid, i definitely see the pros of this .

so what do you think about...body mods in relation to gender, this "post-gender" concept, do you have mods? etc etc. <3

[RebeccaFog]

Hi Drain

   That was a really interesting read.
   I don't have any mods of any type.  I wanted to lose some of the "weight" between my legs for some years, but lately it hasn't bothered me so much.  I don't believe in tattoos or piercing for myself.

   I like the post-gender concept.  I never heard of that term before.

   God, I wish I were 20 again.  I would try some things that I can't so easily pull off now.


Rebis

[no_id]

First off all:
... h0mg! DRAIN posted a topic! o.O!
Now then, onwards chipmunks!

I have to agree with Rebis that it was definitely an interesting read, although somewhere along the line I kept on trying to figure out how on earth they pierced their own cervix... (first cup of coffee images included) Alas!

Additionally, the more I read about post-gender (despite being an interesting concept), the more I felt I was more pre-gender although not implying that as a point where one chooses between one gender or the other, but more as a concept where the male and female genders have not yet influenced the body's sex. However, I would like to see the interviewee telling a TS or IS that 'gender is not a real thing'. Especially since they do note that 'others will still see the gender within you', and thus post-gender, in my eyes, may be an interesting philosophy but fairly unattached to reality and the parameters of society.

Nevertheless, perhaps that's more black and white thinking from my side although everyone knows (or at least should know) that I'm definitely aware of the grey, and accept and recognise it likewise. Yet, to me black, grey and white are still all part of the same colour scale and none can be disgarded.


Edit: I suppose I got a tad too into this and completely forgot noting the body modifications I consider!...

Well then, I'm going for binding first, but would like to have my Cup D reduced to at least a Cup B (depending on what is cosmetically possibly and medically approved) to make binding a lot easier. For now I don't have any desire to modify my groin, but that is also because that area of my body doesn't participate in sex. However, if my breasts fell off one day (or had to be removed for medical reasons.. so not literally as in *plop plop*) I wouldn't care, but more likely think along the lines of "Cool, that saves me some work". Basically it's the same for if I would need an hysterectomy for medical reasons; "Cool, no more periods".

All with all I aspire a n0ll-gender appearance, and most of that will be reflected in my wardrobe, my hair, voice and overal behaviour. Sounds good to me.

[Pica Pica]

 (I would say I prefer pre-gender aussi).

My body and my mind fit very well together, no mods here.
It´s trying to get that to fit with every other thing around that is the hard part.

[Kendall]

I like the article. I like how it breaks down transitions not into one thing, rather is several separate procedures, or options. And how the author admits that this is something unique to themself, not something all post-gender (yet another word like androgyne, genderqueer, gender**ck, intergender) go through.

So whats the definition of post-gender?

I have had a few mods, I might consider a few more.

I think the reason why most important is the sentence that says

I suppose what made me stick with it was that my androgenised body really worked for me in terms of changing the way people viewed and responded to me in social, romantic, sexual, and professional contexts — basically, in every area of life. While there were some changes that were negative, in general the changes were positive.

I can relate to those two sentences.

Ken/Kendra/KK

[Davilee]

Auuggghhh..they fight over this subject on several tribes on Tribes.
Some of the people there are like aggressively non-gender.....they attack over using certain descriptions/words...it drives me nutty
How are people supposed to communicate in a text medium if they cant use certain words to convey what they are talking about?
It would get quite confusing and bland,and there will be no discussion.
I cant be non gender in my mind,Im more feminine in my mind and heart.
It would be a struggle now to revert how I feel,...and Ive denied myself for so long anyway.
I always have been I think,I just could disguise it at times,if it was going to cause conflicts.
So,I guess I was non-gender for a long time in the past but I am really female in my orientation.
It confuses me too sometimes.
As to body mods,Im planning on having some...its for my own wellbeing....and how I want to be considered,...I want my exterior to reflect even moreso what I am.

[shazlovely]

I think the new 3 votes per post rule will make me do two things. Not post AND not vote. I like coming on and reading the odd article and posting my own blogs. Does that mean I'm not active? Just because I don't vote doesn't mean I don't visit blogs from this site.




^{unauthorized link}

[Pica Pica]

don't get it..

[Vyn]

Post-gender is about realizing that gender performance is elaborate and complex, but when you strip it down to its component parts, there's nothing really there. Almost nothing about a person is truly gendered, although most things can be, in context. Post-gender means choosing not to "do" gender. People will still see gender in you because we are all raised to see gender in everyone (and you can choose to play with those perceptions) but as a post-gender person you have that awareness that gender is not a real thing. A haircut is just a haircut and a chest is just a chest. You bring that awareness to the way you think of yourself and interact with others.

This is how I've pretty much felt for the past few years.

And did this post just get necrod by a troll?

[Flan]

This is how I've pretty much felt for the past few years.

And did this post just get necrod by a troll?

a spammer more accurately

[Vyn]

a spammer more accurately

Duly noted.  I noticed this after I posted a response.  Oops.

[RebeccaFog]

Still. The thread is 3 years old. People may have changed their opinions, or there may be new members who are interested in this.

I'm not body modding anything, but see nothing wrong with it. Pre-gendered, Post-gendered? I'm the gender with the gun.