The Widest Girl in the Mall

[rejennyrated]

... you really shouldn't feel self concious because you do look beautiful.

As do you my dear Helena - never doubt that!

Mothers have special selective vision. They always see what they want to see depending on the point that they are trying to make to you at the time.

Truth is both you and Andream are far from masculine, and already pretty darned attractive. 

[barbie]

I told her that I though my arms were still a bit thick looking. She looked at and nodded, and then said that my shoulders look really big too - (she didn't just say a bit - she said really big). I was pretty much floored, but as I was brought up to be non-confrontational and polite in company, I just continued the conversation as if she hadn't said a thing. What is really stupid is that she is rather short, about 5"2 or something, and quite rotund, and if we were the same height she'd have wider shoulders than me, so WTF?

I suspect possible side effects of hormone, causing depression.

My shoulders are also very wide compared with most women here, but narrower than most men.

A few days ago, I saw a young girl who was as tall as me. She was very slim and her shoulders were far narrower than me. But I do not envy her. To my eyes, narrow shoulder is not sexy at al. And it does not look healthy. I like wider shoulders (if not so fat) and narrower waist. As I can not decrease the shoulder width, I just try to decrease waist girth. Of course, I can make my shoulders look a little bit narrower by exercise and diet, but there is a limit, and moreover I do not dislike my wide shoulders as long as they are not so much fat. My shoulders tend to become scanty in summer as I exercise more.

My point is that it depends on your mind. Wide shoulders can look sexy.

And, I am sure my shoulders are wider than yours, even considering height (mine 6 feet). I love my wide  (compared to women) shoulders:

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php?action=mgallery;sa=item;id=2125
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php?action=mgallery;sa=item;id=2126

Barbie~~

[Kristyn]

I honestly can't figure out why people continue with the archaic notion that women must conform to some defined body standard.  It is simply not true anymore.  Women's bodies have been evolving over the last fifty or so years.  Many women today are much stronger, bigger, and more muscular than women of the seventies were.  The eighties ushered in a new era which saw women gaining interest in building and toning their physiques.  It is not unusual to see women with defined abs and lean muscle mass.  Some, like female body builders go to extremes to build mass.  I'm personally not appalled by it, but it is a little too much to my liking.   I've lost half my size--primarily fat and some muscle mass over the last year or so--and replaced that with all around lean muscle tissue.  For the first time in my life I get to wear and feel comfortable in sleeveless tank tops and nobody questions it or looks at me funny.  Except, you guessed it, the two holier-than-thou epitomy of perfect womanhood LESBIANS who live next door to me.  When I tried to pull the same look off when I was heavier, I got called everything in the book.

Don't be afraid or ashamed of how you look Andrea, because you look damn fine--and don't let anyone ever tell you different.  ESPECIALLY someone whose subculture revolves around bad hair and a poor fashion sense

I found this video on youtube showing the evolution of the female physique.  There are also other videos to show how many women are now getting involved in building their bodies.  It's time to lose the outdated notion that women HAVE TO BE soft, fat, curvy, dependent and fragile like little petunias.  The woman in the blue toward the end of the video holding the dumbell is pretty well how I am shaped

 

[lilacwoman]

Butch dykes hate MtFs because we are raping them by trying to live in their space...see janice raymond's book about such crap ideas...so ignore her.
your pix shows a figure to die for.
if she seems to be doing the 'he' deliberately then you need to write to the head of the institute and mention political correctness...idiots like her have to be straightened out.

[Kristyn]

Hey, what the hell?
Butch dykes most certainly do not!
The people you're actually talking about are a subset of radical feminist, some of whom happen to be butch dykes.

Saying "Butch dykes hate MTFs cuz..." is no different to saying "Trans women hate men cuz..."

This is definitely not my experience with the lesbian community.  When I first moved to Toronto, I was offered a job at a print chain by a women who was a dyke.  I thought to myself hey, this is so cool, if anyone has an understanding of my situation it would be her, right?  After all, we are all part of the "rainbow flag of diversity"--sisters in a sense.  Boy was I wrong!  This woman (if you can call her that) after three months began to harass and abuse me verbally.  She brought over her lesbian friends, some of which worked at other locations, where she then began to ridicule me in front of them.  She would constantly micro manage me.  She would shut down my programs or restart my computer without saving my work while I was away on a break.  She would promise customers delivery of jobs, then leave for the weekend without informing me about her promises to clients.  I was then left to defend myself from an outraged client as to why their job was not completed.  She would have the overnight guy call me late at night to inform me of a serious issue that needs to be corrected as soon as possible and I have to go to the job site.  When I arrived I would find that this so-called emergency was something the he could have taken care of himself.  The list goes on and on.  Six months later she fires me!

Fast forward four years.  I'm now living in the apartment of my dreams which took me three years to discover.  When I moved in, I had some really nice neighbors living beside me.  So nice that I really didn't mind that they would sometimes party late into the night.  About a year later they moved out.  Then these two lesbians move in.  I'm out on my balcony when one of them says hi.  I respond with some small talk, then silence.  Then they start laughing.  From that day on everytime I was on my balcony and they were on there, they would make some sort of comment about me.

Fast forward to this summer/spring.  As mentioned in previous posts, I've done a lot of work to my body--I'm buff and I'm not shy to say that I look good.  This is confirmed by my dealings with people on the street.  I guess over the winter, the couple had broken up.  The fat little militant midget with the bowl cut who wore heavy mens second hand blazers in the deadly heat of the summer was no longer there.  She was replaced by something resembling a sock puppet who, to my astonishment turned out to be pretty nice, at first.  We chatted a few times and exchanged pleasantries when passing in the hall.  Then the first heat of the summer hit.  I'm a sun worshipper and spend a great deal of time working on my tan.  I was out on the balcony when the sock puppet came out.  I was wearing my denim shorts and a halter--similar to what I wore last summer while in the sun when they had moved in.  She took one look at me and was speechless.  I said hello, then her partner--one of the original occupants of the apartment came out.  she was speechless as well.  She then dragged the sock puppet into the apartment and slammed the door.

Since that day, the sock puppet no longer talks to me.  Whenever I am out there and they come out, they spend a great deal of time making comments about me and laughing--I ignore it.  Whenever they have a friend over, they have to make a mention that I'm a 'guy'.  Nobody else calls me a guy.  NOBODY.  Nobody looks at me strangely or double takes me on the street.  NOBODY.  Other people in the complex are quite friendly and sociable, but not these people.

These experiences have been enough to turn me off of an entire sub culture.  Gay men have no problem with me.  As a matter of fact, gay men are actually quite respectable and sociable with me.  Young girls don't have a problem with me--most think I'm actually "super cool" given my age and my interests.  Women who take care of themselves and who have no hang ups about their appearance have no issues with me. So what gives?  I no longer even give these people (lesbians) a chance as I know that they are all one of the same.  If, when I resume my job search, I accept a position and find a lesbian(s) working there--I will quit.  This is how strongly I feel about the issue.  This is how deeply I've been affected by these people.  To me, the 'rainbow flag of diversity' has now become the rainbow flag of hypocrisy!

I apologize if this offends anyone but I am not afraid to speak my mind concerning disrespect towards the trans community and I refuse to stay silent when it occurs.

[barbie]

O.K. As I have never met butch or femme dyke , I am just wondering whehter butch dyke tends to have wider shoulders 

Barbie~~

[spacial]

Doesn't offend me Kirstyn. Seems some lesbian people have formed themselves into a self defensive community.

It's understandable. While gay men tend to be the subject of jibes and threats, lesbans tend to be labeled as object to watch.

Ultimately, yet another example of the societial enforced perversion of men really.

I can only hope that, as transgendered people begin to establish themselves and become more accepted, that none of our number go down that route.

I would like to think we, as transgendered people can take our place and part of society. Working toward the common good. Not forming small groups intent upon inflicting onto other what we believe was done to us.

[Little Darkling]

Kristyn, I've had far more positive experiences with lesbians & bisexuals in a short amount of time. Saying that you'd quit your job just because a lesbian just so happens to work there...that upsets me. A few bad experiences shouldn't paint an entire group of humanity as vindictive and malicious.

---

Andream, I often have the exact same insecurities about my own shoulders. I really think, though, that it comes down to us having impossible ideals that we construct for us to try to live up to...it's near impossible to have precisely what we want, or rather, what we think we want. There's always going to be that one quirk or trait that we detest and wish we could rid ourselves of, or change...but that's just the way people are.

We always focus on and narrow down to a problem, for better or worse.

I can't say she was doing so to hurt you...but I have had my experiences, good and bad, with different counsellors & psychs throughout the years. You find some of them just can't be what you need them to be...they are just people, after all. Sometimes, they say the wrong thing, and sometimes they make the wrong assumption.

People can say the wrong word, or agree with you at the wrong time, and that can stick with you. But hey, chin up; I personally think you're beautiful. And I know a lot of people here would agree. :]

[Ayaname]

I've had a similar situation with a therapist once. I went in 'guy mode' to my therapy sessions because I still hadn't had hair removal done and was self conscious. He asked me if I was on hormones (I had been for over a year) and when I told him that I was he flat out told me that he didn't think they were working and that he didn't think that they ever would.

By the way your shoulders look fine in your pic. If I saw your picture on any other site I wouldn't even second guess that you were anything but female.

...I've just had to deal with my mother pointing out how masculine all my features are. Regardless of what I'd say she always had an answer. I feel totally self conscious now and it feels awful.

I hate this too. My mom recently told me that I couldn't possibly look any more male than I do.

[Megan]

i know a gg with large shoulders
and even a guy *i eavesdrop* said to her, 'you have broad shoulders"

she's pretty though.

i don't see really huge shoulders on you, just can't tell, but it wouldn't be something i would obsess with since i can't change that.

[lilacwoman]

over the years I've done tons of research into wedding fashions and the whole wedding thing and seen thousands of pix of happy couples from all parts of the world of all ages from the last 100 years or so and until very recently the groom was almost always taller and wider than the bride - I say it's simple biology and genetics about which we can do nothing.
What is interesting in theswe pixs is that some of the widest tallest peopl are the mothers and aunts of the happy pair.
Moral is if your mother syas your shoudlers are too wide go ask her to look at her wedding pix. No, perhaps you'd better not.

[Cindy]

In my experience through meeting lots of people of diverse gender, creed, colour, whatever. There are nice people and there are nasty people. Gender, creed, colour whatever is irrelevant. Don't get caught by the old, "she, he, it are a Xism, don't trust them. A friend of a friend had one who tied dynamite to their cat, there all the same aren't they."
No they are not.
People are people, look for the nice and ignore the nasty.
And ALWAYS treat people as you wish to be treated yourself.

Cindy