hip bones. how much crossover is there in natural born sexes?

[Eve of chaos]

ok So i haven't been able to get on much since with being homeless and all but thankfully such a thing as public internet exists.

I had a burning question that's been bothering me for days and google hadn't given me any answers so i thought id ask here.

ok so i know the general differences in male and female hip bones and i know nothing can be done to change that, so my question is about me finding a way to cope with this.

and the way I've been able to cope with just about everything so far is finding it on Natal females. so my question is this.

is it possible for a Natal female to be born with male hip bone structure?

like maybe its a birth defect or something, but is it possible? does it happen often?

I know that HRT can mask it so no one would know but a doctor but its not about fooling people for me, I want to be able to feel like a real girl, and if its something that never happens to natal females I will always feel distanced because of that little bit. 

it also has to do with the walk I believe I read that females walk with a wiggle because the hips bones are wider and point inwards a bit. and I dont want to feel like I have to fake a walk the rest of my life. I want to feel as "natural" as possible.

maybe that's a delusion though, and I think if thats my goal that I'm not suited for this.

but I am taking this one step at a time, so that's my question, dont ask my why the whole neo-vagina bit doesn't bother me, I couldn't tell you that. all I know is that I seem to be completely ok with that at this point, and its one step at a time.

also if anyone wants to send me pics of their hips after some HRT id really appreciate it, I cant find any on the web, mostly just face. haha I'm not asking for nudies, I just want to see some of what can be done and I'm not having much luck with google.

thanks in advance! I'll try to follow it as much as I can.

[Rock_chick]

i'm not qualified to say if a natal female could have male pelvic structure, but as the difference between male and female pelvic area are all to do with child birth i think it's unlikely. This however does not mean that every single woman in the world has nice wide hips and a classic hour glass figure...a lot of natal females have quite narrow hips and fairly boyish figures.

The wiggle is more down to how you walk and it's also not a prerequisite for walking in a feminine manner. try some people watching next time you're out and about and see how many girls are actually wiggling...it'll be less than you think.

My best advice is try not to worry about it, if you obsess to much over something like this, which you can't do anything about you'll end up in a deep dark pit of depression. if you're young enough you may just get some change in the hips, otherwise it'll just be a case of fat redistribution...either way, the simplest option is to just buy clothes that flatter your body shape...just like any other girl out there, natal or otherwise.

[SnailPace]

I found this picture:


I think that it's hard to find pictures of small hipped girls because celebrity pictures always turn up.  And celebrities often have "ideal" body shapes.  I have seen some girls and women in real life with quite a small hip to waist ratio.  (i.e. a "boyish" figure)

[Catherine]

If you want to walk in a feminine style then just place your foot in front of your other one when pacing. Keep your shoulders steady. Your hips will swing if you walk this way.

IF you need a graphic example of this look at how catwalk models walk on the cat walk.

You hips will not grow out at al on hormones unless you are young enough to be still growing. You may be lucky and get some fat deposited around that area.

My suggestion to you would be to work with what you have and accentuate your hips by learning to swing them when you walk and when you stand always push your hips out to one side as it gives you the ilusion of hips and a waist.

[rejennyrated]

Like anything else pertaining to sex and gender what we have here is a spectrum with typical females ate one end and typical males at the other. In between in the grey area a surprising number of people do exist, so the answer is that while its not likely that a girl would have a totally male structure she might be in that middle ground as indeed may you.

Hip structure is not formed at birth, but rather at puberty. By the age of somewhere between 19 and 21 it is pretty well game over for most people with regard to hip shape development which is why I personally strongly hold the controversial view that HRT intervention should be permitted prior to puberty for children who have clear and consistent cross gender identification. Failing that it is the best argument I know for getting on with transition as young as you possibly can.

Edit - oh yeah and one other thing I should probably say. Transition HRT and SRS isn't a game to play if you are going to be too perfectionist. It is all a bit of a compromise. We do it because it gets us much closer to where we want to be, but the truth is this isn't a perfect world so I fear you are going to have to understand that there will always be some differences, however slight. Personally I would still rather get as close as I can to my ideal even if the result isn't perfect.

[Tad]

There is cross over. Like they were saying above, pelvis shape can vary greatly.

I got this off a specialist's site regarding pelvis structre.

"Some males are born with relatively tall pelvic bones. A typical male the top of the ilium
bone (pelvic bone) is at the level of the belt on pants. Some individuals the top of the
ilium bone is a good 2 fingers width above the belt line, inferring the ilium is taller than
most. This does not occur in females as their pelvis is shaped differently than males.
Depending on your point of reference these individuals are described as being short
waisted or tall waisted. Much like describing the weather two terms can describe the
same observation. Some describe the weather a partly cloudy where as others would
describe the same weather as partly sunny. A tall pelvis can be described as short waist or
tall waist. The waist is short because the distance between the pelvis and ribs is short.
The waist is tall because the pelvis is tall."

Now, he says that this does not happen to females, and yet I have less then an inch between my ilium bone and the bottom of my ribs. My pelvis extends close to half my torso. So see, some bio women have weird manly structures too. XD

[CaitJ]

is it possible for a Natal female to be born with male hip bone structure?

No, it is not. The person would need to be intersex and the development happens at puberty, not birth.

like maybe its a birth defect or something, but is it possible? does it happen often?

No, only in intersex people would there be variation enough to blur the gender (meaning that the person is not a 'natal female').

I know that HRT can mask it so no one would know but a doctor but its not about fooling people for me, I want to be able to feel like a real girl, and if its something that never happens to natal females I will always feel distanced because of that little bit.

A doctor will only be able to tell if you have a pelvic x-ray.
If you never have a pelvic x-ray, only autopsy will show the distinct male shape of the pelvis.

it also has to do with the walk I believe I read that females walk with a wiggle because the hips bones are wider and point inwards a bit.

No. it's a combination of factors, such as weight distribution, ligaments and musculature. The bone structure is only part of that. Many MTFs have naturally 'girly' walks even though their bone structure is typically male.

and I dont want to feel like I have to fake a walk the rest of my life. I want to feel as "natural" as possible.

Then don't. There is a lot of variation in how women walk.

also if anyone wants to send me pics of their hips after some HRT id really appreciate it, I cant find any on the web, mostly just face. haha I'm not asking for nudies, I just want to see some of what can be done and I'm not having much luck with google.

Here you go 

[Eve of chaos]

No, it is not. The person would need to be intersex and the development happens at puberty, not birth.

sometimes I wish I was at least born intersex, because If i was technically neither sex it would be a lot easier to feel female.

but o well, thanks everyone, it gives me something to think about. at least i know now. I guess its possible for hips to be close but even though its well hidden itll always be a male piece I cant get rid off...

I guess it could be worse though, it could be something that's more out and center.

but yeah thanks for the quick replies, and thank you vexing for the pics, its exactly what I wanted to see, and it helped put me at ease^.^

[CaitJ]

but yeah thanks for the quick replies, and thank you vexing for the pics, its exactly what I wanted to see, and it helped put me at ease^.^

No problem, really glad that I could help 

[wannalivethetruth]

I dont think the hip thing is 100 percent true with genetic girls. i seen girls who had boyshish figures and i had more hip than them! So...really it just depends on the person lol. And lke i ready...you really shouldnt worry about this or it will get you n a state of depression.

[VeronikaFTH]

Though you still may be able to tell in x-rays and scans of the hip, there is considerable overlap in physical appearance to the naked eye.

I see genetic women around all the time with hips and shoulders that appear to be more towards the realm of what you would call the male range. It's not uncommon...

[pebbles]

It's the most sexually dismorphic bone in our body, And if you have a skeleton the easiest way to guess if your looking at a male or female skeleton.

It can be ambiguous but it's exceptionally rare for it to be so, The second most dismorphic bone is the skull so yeah compare the number of males who look more female than male and vice versa and about half that number to get an approximate number of the number of pepole who would belong to an "Ambiguous" group.

[LilDoberman]

Forgive me if I'm  butting in, I just wanted to comment on the walking part.  I don't wiggle when I'm wearing sneakers.  A lot of women wiggle due to high, uncomfortable heels.   I'm not saying there's not some physical reasons behind walking differences, but I think that things within our control are perhaps even more important.  I don't think anyone could possibly strut in open backed 4" heels.  Likewise, women who shake and wiggle in sneakers look funny (at least to me).

[Randi]

I was born with feminine shaped hips and they have gotten a bit rounder since HRT. If it's possible for me to be made this way, it's certainly possible for cis girls to have masculine shaped hips. Like Jenny said there is much space in the middle ground for variation between male & female traits in any given individual.
Randi