Depression and E

[BunnyBee]

Since I have been taking it I have had a constant slightly euphoric feeling, in a way that I had only begun to  feel intermittently in the weeks prior to HRT. I think it is actually called happiness, but since it is many years since I experienced it for prolonged  periods I am not sure.  I hope so.

Karen.

Lol this made me smile .  Yes that weird slightly euphoric feeling you have been experiencing is probably what they call "happiness."  It's nice, isn't it?

PS- Zoe these boards are here to support people, it is their purpose.  I get why you feel hesitant to vent, but please don't.  If it helps you feel better, just post when you feel good about life too and we'll call it even .

[Jacelyn]

Oxytocin is also the hormone that can reduce the symptom of anxiety and it is produced in the body, the lack of it could cause depression. Simulate the nipples increase its secretion.

[JungianZoe]

Oxytocin is also the hormone that can reduce the symptom of anxiety and it is produced in the body, the lack of it could cause depression. Simulate the nipples increase its secretion.

Whoa... I've studied oxytocin quite extensively and never even thought about that!  Worth a try; at least I'd get some fun out of it. 

But whatever is going on, I may need to call the doctor earlier than my June visit because this is getting out of hand.  Had a bit of a fight with a friend of mine over texts, which is far too easy given that she's Russian (a political refugee) and sometimes doesn't construe the meaning of my words too well, and sometimes she's incredibly blunt about things.  Well she was telling me about a program she worked for a few years ago and suggested I should try to get in when it starts in August.  I told her that my economic reality is that I need to find a job ASAP, spend my evenings researching more grad programs I want to get into, and then I can think about doing other things (including the program, which sounded great and I would love to do it)

Now I'll admit that I'm a bit jealous because she got into both grad programs she applied to, and I only got one interview from all the applications I sent in (but didn't get into the program, which was the same school where I did my undergrad).  But when she told me that I always snub opportunity, I kind of lost it.  I graduated with a 4.0, got Latin honors (summa) after doing a 35-page honors thesis on the factor structure of the Beck Depression Inventory-II in postpartum depression (where I also did my oxytocin research), scored 1380 on the GRE (650 verbal, 730 math, 5.0 writing), was an officer in two honor societies (Golden Key and Psi Chi), student affiliate of the APA, and worked three and a half years as a psychology tutor for the university, doing scheduled hourly individual and group sessions (including tutoring students with physical and psychiatric disabilities).  The only opportunity I didn't take was clinical experience, and that was purely a time issue--I had to work 30+ hours a week to pay rent, pay bills, and eat.  It turns out, by the way, that my lack of clinical experience was the only reason I didn't get into the program at my school.  Every other interviewee had it and the committee wouldn't take my tutoring experience as a substitute (this according to my professor, who said he tried to plead my case to deaf ears).

From that comment my friend made about my relationship with opportunity, I just spiraled down and down and down some more, until I was laying in bed at 2:30, still unable to sleep after two hours of crying.  All I could think was that I was a total failure who would never make it in this world no matter how hard I try.  I now have no grad school to look forward to, no job lined up after mine ends this Thursday, and I'm so depressed when I think of any of it that I don't even have the presence of mind to update my resume.  And I'm not sure I could handle another round of grad school rejections.

A normal person would look at all the love they have in their life, buckle up, find that job, not think themselves a total failure, and carry on.  I'm just defeated, and I know I shouldn't feel this way.  I know it's probably the hormones talking, and I want to talk louder than they do, but my eyes tear up every time I open my resume and look at all the things I did that led me nowhere.  All of the dreams that now seem unattainable.

I know there are other paths... all I tried was Ph.D. programs, which was stupid.  But I listened to my advisors at school who said I'd make the first cut at any school given my credentials.  How wrong they were, and how stupid I was to blindly follow.  I should have tried Masters programs like my friend (who, as I said, got into both of her programs).  She didn't even apply to psych Ph.D. programs because of how competitive they are.

In any case, I'm rambling again.  Just another night where I spent at least two hours crying, two hours dwelling... this isn't like me.  I'm changing physically in all the ways I want, but emotionally it's become a serious struggle to even get out of bed at a time when I need to be at my best.

So yes... I'm calling the doctor today.

[Caith]

I consider myself very spiritual, but not religious. 

We share that attribute.  I think it's a rather good thing.

As far as reaching out goes, I'm just not good at it.

  . . .

I don't want my friends to disappear because I'm not smiling.

Ugh... I'm just going to shut up now.

Don't shut up too much.  Your friends here won't abandon you, no matter how much you you tell us about your feelings.  Many of us have had similar experiences and feelings, and we understand and appreciate how difficult it can be.  I hope you can talk to your physician about lowering your dose of DP, or even switch you to natural progesterone, which doesn't always cause the same symptoms as synthetic medroxyprogesterone does.

[JungianZoe]

I hope you can talk to your physician about lowering your dose of DP, or even switch you to natural progesterone, which doesn't always cause the same symptoms as synthetic medroxyprogesterone does.

I'm going to be doing just this when I see the doc in two weeks, because the situation just isn't improving.

At the same time, this depressed feeling is so confounded that I have no clue what might be the cause.  The depo?  All the changes lately?  In the last month, I've gone through my name change (will be legal in 10 days), had fights with one of my closest friends, made up with her, had her come to town (then go back home), got outed in front of a group of about 75 people, lost my job (by law, nothing I did) and was unable to spend much time with any of my other friends because almost all of their lives are falling apart spectacularly.  Add to all of this the lousy weather, constant clouds and rainstorms, and I know my seasonal depression has relapsed due to lack of sun.  Then, as a lovely topping on this cake, my dad severed all contact with me after finding out I was trans before I had the chance to tell him.  I'm still not sure how... he was simply the last person I was coming out to because I needed to muster all the strength and support I could get before doing it.

So that's been the last 25 days of my life...

I look back on the last 25 days and I honestly don't know where they went, nor can I even account for what I did.  All I feel is this terrible weight around me that takes every one of my thoughts down with it, good or bad.  I've spent between 2 to 8 hours of every single day in tears, I can't even look for a job without breaking down, I can't make a phone call without breaking down, I can't even think of applying to more graduate schools, much less doing it.  Nothing really sticks out to me, like I've lived every second in a fog.

My darkest, darkest thoughts have returned and there have been nights that I've been terrified to be alone.  And then I had this electrolysis appointment (my second, and with a different person than my first) that I'm terrified damaged my skin, and my skin is one of the few things about myself that I truly love.  If I willfully damaged it... now I start crying.  I can't handle all of this.  It's all falling apart around me.

I wish I could go see my therapist but I'll be bankrupt in two days as it is.  All I have is this overpowering feeling that the world doesn't need me.  My heart knows that's wrong (dead wrong), but my brain is so screwed up right now.

Can't even write any more through the tears.  Something has to give soon.  I keep praying this hopeless feeling is because of the depo and I'll feel okay once it leaves my body, and I'll have enough power to start putting my life back on track.  I simply can't stand this depression any longer.  I look at the circumstances of my life, that I shouldn't be experiencing this.  I'm blessed with a lot of love and support, so why can't I even get out of bed?

[Caith]

Can't even write any more through the tears.  Something has to give soon.  I keep praying this hopeless feeling is because of the depo and I'll feel okay once it leaves my body, and I'll have enough power to start putting my life back on track.  I simply can't stand this depression any longer.  I look at the circumstances of my life, that I shouldn't be experiencing this.  I'm blessed with a lot of love and support, so why can't I even get out of bed?

You can't even get out of bed because you're suffering from all of seasonal, situational, and chemical-induced depression, simultaneously.    Before taking anti-depressant medication, I had entire weekends (and sometimes weeks) like that.  I seriously hope you can hang on until seeing your physician and switching to natural progesterone.  Don't give up!

[JungianZoe]

You can't even get out of bed because you're suffering from all of seasonal, situational, and chemical-induced depression, simultaneously.    Before taking anti-depressant medication, I had entire weekends (and sometimes weeks) like that.  I seriously hope you can hang on until seeing your physician and switching to natural progesterone.  Don't give up!

Thank you...   I'm hanging on.  Just barely sometimes, but working at it.  Unfortunately, I need to be so much more than "hanging on" right now, I need to be at my top performance.  That I'm sometimes too depressed to stand up (I swear, it physically hurts) makes it pretty difficult.

Going to ask my doc in two weeks about switching my AA and/or going on antidepressants.  Believe it or not, I've suffered very severe depression since I was 11 and I've never tried antidepressants before.  Part of my brain told me I needed to fight it through sheer willpower, but when I can't walk a straight line or get out of bed, it's tough to fight.  All four of my parents said growing up that depression was just a sign of weakness.  I'm starting to find flaws in that logic, especially after going through a psychology program at school (trying to get into grad school for it now).

I never believed that depression was a sign of weakness in anyone but me though... I'm so unforgiving of myself.  But I'm working on fixing that too.

[JungianZoe]

Tomorrow's the big day!  Perhaps, at last, my doc can help me kick this depression either by adjusting my hormones or or helping out with some antidepressants.  It's a huge mental barrier to overcome, admitting that I can't handle this alone, that I can't fight it through sheer willpower.  But I can't.  Not any more.  I don't even know what's happened to the last month and a half, it's like I've lived in a daze.  Each day is just a blur.  I got nothing done... nothing at all.

I'm not expecting miracles, just the hope that there's some medical way to lighten the load on my brain and body.

[April Dawne]

Maybe it's also because I have the flu, but this weekend truly sucked and I never got out of my apartment due to illness.  So all this time alone, friends busy and not answering calls, no responses to texts, and now my thoughts are in doom and gloom mode.

"I didn't get into grad school and everyone I know who applied did."  Oh, so I'm a total failure.
"I haven't had a date in three years."  Now I'm ugly and unapproachable too.
"Why doesn't anyone pick up the phone?"  Because I'm being clingy and needy and I should stop.
"I'm depressed."  Nobody wants to hear it, it's only me, and who cares anyway?
"Really?  Your happiness doesn't matter?"  Got that right.

This is just so typical of my thoughts lately, and they should be gone by this time of year.  I'm trying hard to be confident, but it's difficult when I feel like I'm the ugly duckling who'll never pass in a million years.

WOW. You sound exactly like.... me. I relate to all of that in an uncanny way.

All I know is that...
1. Transition is hard, and much can be lost before we are finished.
2. We are going through a female puberty, complete with the emotions and mood swings that accompany them, but with adult worries and fears. I have my days where all I do is sleep, or cry, or feel like my chest is going to explode from anxiety because nothing seems to be moving forward at all. I sit and think "I could die and nobody would care, because they don't even check in to see how I am at all." That's not true, of course, but our body chemistry is changing, our bodies are changing, and our minds are changing and adjusting.

The only advice I can offer besides talking to your therapist or Dr about changing dosage is to try not to spend too much time alone. Hugs.... it does get better.

[Just Shelly]

Zoe,

I just noticed your original post, I am sorry to hear how life seems to be lately. I say seem because when things start to get back to normal this is how you will think about that time. "boy life seemed so terrible months ago". I have been where you are now and I have been to where I look back and say "Wow! I don't feel like that now". The problem is I can't stay like that, I try but I think my mind is so use of staying miserable that I intentionally go back in that dark hole.

I just love it when someone knows about your depression and says "you just have to stay busy, and not think bad thoughts. Ya like I wake up and say to myself "you know I want to feel like crap today and think of ways to kill my self". They are right in saying keep busy, but its harder then hell to even walk when your stomach is literally aching from the depression, you feel like puking but your not the least bit sick and how can you do anything when any type thought turns you into a sobbing mess. I have always tried to think good thoughts when I get like this, even then they turn to tragic thoughts. My thoughts of my children make me happy, when I get a bad episode I think happy thoughts of my children to help but they soon turn to thoughts of them dying and then I'm a complete mess.

I am writing this to tell you, YOU ARE NOT ALONE IN YOUR THOUGHTS! Things will get better, it may not even stay good for too long, but eventually good turns to better, better turns to not to bad and not to bad turns to GREAT. I have not gotten to the part where everything is great, I honestly don't feel I ever will (maybe after SRS) but I would like to get to the point that I could say "ya knooww life ain't that bad" I'm not sure I can even get to that point.

I sunk into deep depression 5 years ago, 2 years ago I started hrt. I will say I am not in constant deep depression but there are times I fall into darkness and those times have sometimes been worse then the times I was in constant deep depression. I am on Spiro and my T is down to about a 3. I'm on injects for E twice a month,  I am not sure what my E is, havn't had it tested in awhile. I am also on anti D's. It does seem like I have big downs but not too many and not to big of ups. I feel my worst at times my second week into my shot, I'm not sure if its the E getting low or if its because I am not with my children.

"I could die and nobody would care, because they don't even check in to see how I am at all."

This is true for me. I have my children every other week, on the weeks I don't have them if I were to die in bed or somewhere at home, it would be my children to find me a week later. My phone doesn't ring, no one comes over and I am self employed. No one would care or even know. Life as a hermit is great! I can joke about this now as I am feeling ok, but at those times of darkness, it was something else to dwell on and I'm sure I will again.

Your neighborhood hermit
Shelly

[JungianZoe]

Thank you both, April and Shelly!

All of these thoughts are far too familiar after fighting this for 23 years.  I was only 10 years old when I felt it all starting to unravel and my entire adult life has been like scratching the bottom of the barrel hoping for a spark.  I've rarely ever felt fulfilled, ecstatic, peaceful, confident... all of these are foreign to me.

The worst part is that I know my brain is playing tricks on me.  Yes, I was the recipient of more parent-inflicted head beatings than any child should ever endure.  Yes, I was emotionally abused and used as a pawn in my stepmother's game of revenge against my mom.  Yes, I was told by my dad and stepmom on a near-daily basis that I'd always be a failure, I was a horrible person, and I deserved to die.  What I don't understand is how I internalized all of that and why I believed it.  Why did I believe people I didn't even like and who abandoned me after years of forgiving them?

People who don't suffer depression of this magnitude rarely understand what it's about.  Like you said, Shelly, we're told to do something to distract ourselves.  But as you eloquently pointed out, those distractions turn as fatalistic as the thoughts we try to escape.  Think you're worthless?  Distract yourself by going to the park.  Look at the lake, see the birds, and cry because you feel like you're not even a part of life, that the animals have far more right to be here than you do.  Think then that you really are worthless and all the beauty stands in contrast to how ugly you and your soul are.  So you go get some food to escape the thoughts, and you cry because the taste of food is far too good for the likes of you.  You deserve nothing.  And so you go home to a lonely place and collapse on the floor, unable to move a muscle and sobbing all the while.  But it's not sobbing, it's wailing.  You pound the floor, feel the carpet, and think if you died right there, it wouldn't be bad.

It's sick how pervasive these thoughts are, how they seep into everything.  Happy thoughts, bad thoughts, and the indifferent.  And I just can't go on living this way.  It's destroyed too much of my life.  I've already lost two hours of sleep tonight to crying.

I'm not looking for a miracle tomorrow, but I feel like I need a miracle.  All I want is to experience life like those who can feel joy... it would be such a nice change.

[April Dawne]

Oh how I wish I could just reach through here and give you a big hug 

I know all too well the feelings you talk about, as do many others here I am sure. I had a very bad day two days ago, yesterday was good, today was indifferent. I feel joy but it's bittersweet, because part of me knows it's fleeting and will be gone as quickly as it came and I'll be stuck back here alone with nothing but myself and my thoughts. It's so easy to succumb to the darkness that I lived in for so many years, but somehow I manage to pull myself out of the funk before it takes me completely. Or like you, I just reach out. You truly aren't alone in this. I know how much it can feel that way. I know how the loneliness can hurt. I know about feeling that "I don't deserve to witness the beauty of life". But I really do deserve it. So do YOU. You deserve it so much more than you know. Hang on.

I wish I could offer more than strings of text as a way of helping, but it's all I have. You can make it. I can make it. WE can make it.

[Sephirah]

Honey, there are other ways to manage depression besides anti-depressants. I was diagnosed with clinical depression when I was 14 (long story, won't bore you with the details), and I was given anti-depressants to take, but they made me violently nauseous and distrustful of my own feelings.

Anyway, the upshot of it was that it was suggested I undergo CBT (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy - also known as the 'talking cure') and for me, it worked. It doesn't make it go away entirely, but it does give you some tools to be able to deal with it, without being reliant on taking a pill to make it go away.

Is this something you've considered?

*hug*

[Just Shelly]

@ Sephirah very nice advice I may check into that myself.

Zoe

I wish I could say something to make any of these thoughts disappear, I can't I am struggling my self again!

I'm so lonely but if someone were to call or even come over it still wouldn't take the loneliness away.

We all will have better days, I know this!! I will stop for now I don't think I could write anything to possibly make anybody feel better, all I can do is relate to how familiar everyone's thoughts are the same as mine.

Please continue to post, even though many may not able to reply with any advice including myself for the fact of they are feeling the same. This may not sound good but it helps to know I am not the only one with very simular thoughts and feelings.

Please take care, we're all put here for a reason.
Shelly

[Hikari]

Well Zoe, I can't contribute much to the topic of hormone balance not having much experience, but I do want to say that the only thing that has been keeping me sane and from going off the deep end is communication, I am taking things one day at a time, but just by communicating how I feel and what I am thinking I am preventing a total meltdown, and despite how bleak things look I am starting to think I might just be alright, I am not even sabotaging opportunities for myself as I would have done in the past. So please, don't feel bad venting, your feelings are important and you deserve to be happy.

I had so many more opportunities in life, then I ever was willing to admit, I focused totally on the negative, and then when an opportunity came along I came up with all these excuses to ruin it for myself. I understand now, that I felt I didn't deserve to be happy, and I was just waiting on something, anything to happen to solve my problems, but I am finally on the cusp of understanding that I too deserve a good fulfilling life, and communication is central to that.

Best of luck, and hang in there it will be alright. Hopefully after the hormone balance gets fixed you will be happier.

[JungianZoe]

Not sure what to say about this morning, only hoping that I didn't get myself into trouble.

Basically, we didn't change my hormones.  I even got another three-month depo shot.  The doctor pointed out that I didn't have any reaction to the first shot (which is true).  Also, my depression didn't start until a month after my second shot.  She didn't say that it couldn't be because of the hormones, but the onset of my depression didn't correspond with the start of this regimen or any dosage changes.

She asked if this had ever happened to me before, and it had.  Many times.  The last time I remember feeling this bad was after a seven-day time period where I lost three family members, my ex filed for divorce, and I lost my job (not necessarily lost it, but it was ending because of summer break).  I was also anorexic at the time and 100 pounds.  Before that, the last time I remember being this depressed was during a month where I got laid off, lost my health insurance, got dumped, moved, and had my second serious bout of gender dysphoria.  That was in 2005 and was also the last time I attempted suicide.  Maybe the anorexia was a suicide attempt too, just not so obvious...

This time, I suffered grad school rejection, loss of job (thanks to state law), loss of half of my family (the ones who hurt me, and yet it still stings), adjusting to a new body and body chemistry, going bankrupt, and am feeling really lonely after three and a half years of being by myself.  But the catalyst for my sudden slide downhill was the moment I opened my final grad school rejection letter from my alma mater.  From that point (mid-April) to now, it's just been really tough.

It's a sure bet that the hormones have made me more emotional and so maybe the pain is burning a bit brighter, but an important distinction between the times before and now is that I haven't done a single thing to physically hurt myself this time.  In fact, I've remained kind to myself in the face of my brain screaming at me how I "deserve" punishment.  The kindness is something new and something positive, and yet it makes me cry as well because I've never been nice to myself as long as I've lived and it's putting into contrast how vicious I was to myself in the past.  So have the hormones helped me calm down to the point of keeping this depression somewhat manageable?  It doesn't feel like because it still feels like my life is totally out of control and I've been crying too much lately to do anything about it.  The second I try, I start crying.

So I have an appointment with my therapist on Monday and I'm going to tell her about all of this.  She hasn't seen me until two weeks into this slide, when I wasn't really sure it was a slide at all.  Then again, that was four days before my job ended and so I was still preoccupied with something I loved (and I truly loved my job).  What my doc said today was that, from a physical standpoint, my HRT regimen has been a miracle in the last three months.  We finally got my numbers where they need to be and she was shocked at my breast development (whereas I thought it was anemic... she told me it's a lot of growth for such a short time).  She was loathe to change the regimen and I agreed.  But she also said that if therapy wasn't helping and if, in a month, I still feel like I do now, to call her and she'll prescribe antidepressants.

I only hope this wasn't a mistake... but it's so typical of me to learn the hard way.

Thank you all for your continued advice and for sharing your own stories in this thread!  I take it all very much to heart and am glad to hear from others who've been here.  Many, many hugs to you all!

[jamie nicole]

estrogen is a natural depressant...

[Just Shelly]

estrogen is a natural depressant...

Well I'm sure this really will help Zoe

[Joelene9]

estrogen is a natural depressant...

That depends, girl!  To me, estrogen trumped the antidepressants that was given me before my HRT. 
  Joelene