Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I think this is a very important question because I'm sure all of us here have had on and off doubts about wether or not a lack of confidence in a male role may lead to the want for a female role.

Quite simply, I would define a "popular boy" as someone who, during some period of their middle to high school education, was the type of guy that all the guys looked up to, that all the girls wanted to have sex with, the type of guy who constantly was at parties or just was surrounded by great attitudes and admiration (because that's no "in the movies" concept, most straight guys that I went to school with applied to this lifestyle.) Was anyone here that type of popular male?

And I do not strictly mean that in a jock, football player sense, you could have been popular in an alternative sense, in a druggie sense, in a rock band sense, in a stylish sense, popularity meaning if you always had supportive friends in a male role that truly fueled your ego and weren't just friends you tolerated because you were desperate or confused. Were you ever the leader, the cool kid that everyone wanted to tell a joke to or ask how the summer went? Did people naturally admire you?

Just curious!

I guess I was an underdog. The one girl I dated in High School said a lot of girls were interested in me. I didnt see that. lol
But she wanted me to post this, so, here are her words:

"you should mention, that there's a bisexual woman in the UK that would leap your bones, whether you identify as a man or a woman, because the important thing is the package, and yours is beautiful, and always has been."

She thought I was the coolest boy in school because I was doing my own thing. I didn't follow the latest trends. Truth be told, I was trying to figure out who and what I was. So if I fit into a classification or definition I would have been the Goth chick who is polite and wishes the other students would leave her alone.

I was well liked in high school once I learned how to chameleon enough.  I don't think I'd define myself as popular the way you do though.  I had plenty of friends and plenty of girls that were interested in me.

I didn't like (and still struggle) getting attached to people because I was afraid of acting like myself and people thinking badly about me, takes a few years for me to be able to "act myself" around people. So I just had a tight knit group of friends and still do really. I kept to myself and my few friends and people left me alone, never got bullied or picked on, probably because I'm not easily offended and don't give much reaction.

One thing I hope I will gain from transitioning is confidence in feeling like myself so I'm less of a mute in social situations. See myself as a kind of extrovert with social anxieties because I want to and would love to go out and make friends but at the same time when I go my brain kinda goes "nope" to it.

Very few friends, recognised as being non-masculine. Usually tolerated. Not bullied. Didn't mingle with people with whom I had no interest, which was most of them. I never developed male bonding stuff and was totally freaked out by it, still am.

It was no lack of confidence, I was fully confident I was female.

Cause and effect models need incredible controls that are very difficult to have in sociology models. That is the reason most sociology models are crap and the results are contradictory.

Cindy 

You ask: "Did people naturally admire you?"

In short: NO, NONE what so ever. Maybe a gay older person or two, though I did not really look girlish at all. Yet must then already have this certain something they noticed. Some femme vibe, which was there through all my boy-mode life.

Once going through puberty I worked hard to defend myself so I would not be bullied, and I wasn't. Had a tough time learning to be mean-ish when required, but at least once recall I got wiped out by some older REAL mean SOB dude.

In general I was mostly "invisible" and only was noticed for my substandard performances in primary and high school, which I left early to learn a trade. Tech college and apprenticeship were quite hard in the beginning. Just more "bully beef" and hard lessons how to be more "male". How to walk, how to talk, endless "how toos". One endless violation... and in early transition experienced as having been raped, very degrading (not sexually though).

I do know some guys that pretty well fit your description, they always seemed to be a sort of "main man". Could NEVER get that right as it was just not me.
Axelle

PS: was never exactly a wimp, having gone through a constant stream of maltreatments, but clinically depressed ever since I went to primary school, high school, college, Air Force, etc.

I went to a very hard working class 'all boys school' and got beaten up every day and called 'girl' because I looked like a girl. I wasn't popular! Several times I would come home with blood all over my face, beaten up by eight boys with doctor Martin boots who were kicking me in head! It was like putting me in with vultures. I missed a lot of my education because of this.

lower school I was very out spoken and formed a close friendship with two other boys, we dominated the basketball courts during the mornings and breaks and generally were looked up to. I went on to become the main sports captain for the last year and one of the others a prefect. A prefect is like a mediator/role model for other kids in the same year and below. In hindsight it didn't matter who or what you achieved it was just given to the most popular boys and girls.
During high school I forged my own personality that was unique in my year.. for what could of easily set me aside as a freak it had the reverse effect and I made friends easily both the same year, year below and the two years above me. I had just as many girl friends (both the alternative and prissy) as I did boys. The girl that I knew the best who I spend the most time with out side of school later told me when I asked, it was because I was different.. more or less. I had my own personality that was original and stood out. I didn't really understand it at the time, I was a skater and just wore skate clothes and anime t-shirts that got a lot of attention! And listened to music that was not mainstream. That was what got me friends with older guys who were friends with the musical bunch who I ended up becoming closest with after school.
I had no issues with school even though I was technically a dork, wore glasses and hid my bubble butt under baggy jeans, I was lucky to find people that saw beyond that I guess.
Did I ever get picked on? I think I took part in three or four altercations.. the first I didn't even fight back as I was too busy picking up coins I dropped, the other two were provoked and I just snapped. I guess I had it in me to stand up for myself even with the last one being with a guy that was way bigger than me.. one hit was enough to defuse the situation though.

I probably could have been, had I chosen to live my life a certain way. It's not hard to give people what they want, when you know what that is. I was never interested in being an actress though, and people seeing an projected image of you is worse than people never seeing you at all. Not to mention the interests which would have led to that 'popularity' held as much interest for me as watching a paint dry.

So I opted for just being myself. Which led to largely being ostracised from both males and females. Perhaps that was subconsciously pushing people away, who knows. I was never really exposed to living a female role or a male role. It was something I've had to discover for myself throughout my life. As a result of which, I've never really gone for the "Well I've tried it one way and that sucked, so I'll try it the other way and see if people like me more." approach, and still don't. I don't care too much about other people's approval one way or the other. I've had friends in my life who've attempted to fuel the maleness and make me act like a 'bloke', but I've always tended to shy away from that aspect as it felt, and still feels unnatural.

I am very extroverted and i def was in high school. I loved high school a lot and had very fond memories of the place. Undergrad college was fun for me as well. Even in graduate school i love to socialize.

But for high school, I loved it very much. I would consider myself very popular in my high school. I was Drum Major for two years, I participated in the Exchange student program (AFS) and my family took in a German Exchange student.... her and I are good friends to this day. I also did Varsity track and field and Varsity Soccer. My senior year I was class President.

While I did go out on a few dates, i never made it a priority only because dating men was not the "in thing" in the early 90s, so that aspect of my life i just didn't bother with.

I guess being popular came with my personality? I just loved making friends despite what "clique" they were in. I had wonderful friends who were band geeks, goths, football players, cheerleaders, etc etc.

Matter of fact, my best friend growing up (we were best friends from 1st grade to about graduation of college) transitioned to female and I just found out about it last year. She is married to a wonderful man and they adopted a baby about 3 years ago. Neither of us knew about each other's little secret. Pretty awesome story about that.

But, yeah, I considered myself to be very sociable in high school and was popular. Even after my transition, all of my classmates took it very well. Matter of fact, I am organizing our 20th high school reunion for next year.

I would say I was a middle-of the road type in HS.

I wasn't exactly captain of the football team, but I was co-captain of my Soccer team and had a bunch of friends through a very outgoing personality. I held onto friendships I made in my younger days, and as 'clicks' started to appear once we moved forward in school, I was just as comfortable hanging out with my friends in the smoking section as I was the jocks, the troublemakers, the brains, the band kids, etc.

I was dying inside on a daily basis due to at times pretty severe GID after puberty hit, but looking back it was my full bore Oscar-worthy performance of regularly being the fun happy-go-lucky guy next door that people didn't seem to mind hanging out with me. I was smart enough to keep my real feelings hidden and know when to play the roles. 

As far as the girls...I never had confidence as a male to bed the girls.  My personality was always enough to get them interested, but after a few dates they got the hint pretty quick I wasn't the regular dude they were hoping for and it ALWAYS fizzled.  I just couldn't perform and male instincts (intimacy) didn't come naturally to me. I was always criticized for being too passive and letting them take the lead. Often left me embarrassed. God knows what they talked about me with their friends after a night of disappointing teenage unfulfillment.  Come to think of it, scoring with girls is probably the one place I never could mask my true self.  I was just too young and sexually confused to learn how to fake it/get through it as I would do in my mid-20s.

Tried as I might to get amped up about a big date and 'afterwards' with a girl to brag to my buddies, my burgeoning attraction to guys was playing havoc with me every time.  I used to hate myself and feel so guilty about that.  Now I embrace it. 

I was in a sense popular.  In third grade I beat up a sixth grade bully and he got expelled for it.  I became, "king of the schoolyard" for that.  I changed schools after that, so it was short lived.  In middle school I stopped caring what people thought ( though I still compartmentalized my whole self), and became a member of, "the ditch crowd".  We were the smoker's and stoners who held reverence throughout the school for our nonconformity.  Later in high school I transcended the class structure, was friends with mainly upper classmates, and had a following of people, that would be drawn to my charismatic nonconformist attitude.  In retrospect, I ended up starting a number of trends with fashion, and attitudes; but it was due to my nonchalant, nonobservance of them that caused that.  So, in a nutshell, I was very popular with the fringe element.  Geeks, nerds, diseffected youth, and those "invisible" factions.   

As for me I wasn't a "popular boy", but interestingly enough I was liked and befriended by a few friends that were. I crossed lines and didn't care about being popular, just being myself or what I wanted to be at the time. Funny thing was it made me popular  with some of my younger friends. On graduation night from High School I suddenly realized how many people I didn't know, and several days later it didn't matter anymore. My popularity came later when I was in the Navy, I had a car!

Hm, I had some kind of popularity coming from the fact I was the caricature of a slow, confused, sympathetic and soft person, so everyone knew me and 99% people were at least remotely friendly with me. But no, I was not "popular". I was mainly alone and even my friends did not do much with me.

I was popular when I was younger, but from around 11 onward I became fairly unhappy, reclusive, and anti-social.  I've never really fit properly into a male role, but I don't think that influenced my popularity all that much one way or another.  I just got sick of trying to make friends after moving around every year or two, especially after a lot of bullying in a few cities I lived in.

I went to a very small (grad. class of 62) college prep school, so there were few cliques.  We were forced to work together despite/or perhaps in spite of, personality problems.  So we were very good at working together and that really dampened the entire popularity deal.

Quote from: A on July 06, 2011, 10:45:22 AM
Hm, I had some kind of popularity coming from the fact I was the caricature of a slow, confused, sympathetic and soft person, so everyone knew me and 99% people were at least remotely friendly with me. But no, I was not "popular". I was mainly alone and even my friends did not do much with me.

this sounds pretty similar to my high school experience

I wasn't a class officer or a superlative but those who were were my friends because I could play guitars and sing, or turn a wrench if someone need it. If there had been something called Goth back then that is what I would be classified as but back then we wore frayed bell-bottoms and army fatigues with the long hair of course.

There were always girls who wanted to go out with me but I wasn't interested. I was into smoking a joint and sitting in the woods while reading a book-or tearing something mechanical apart to see how it worked. I learned to fight from my brother and father who gave me the school of hard knocks. So when the time came to fight those who thought they could fight, I usually mopped the floor with them and a couple of their buddies!! After that those guys would give me plenty of room to be who I wanted to be and the others looked up to me for it.

Little did they know I just wanted to go paint my nails!!

Randi

I never considered myself popular, but by my Senior year I was friends with people from all different cliques. Early on in high school I was kind of the leader of the nerdy types but I started to cross barriers and make friends with the jocks, and the loners, the artsy kids, etc. I went to most of the popular parties my senior year.  Was an athlete myself, member of the student council, was in the drama club, and had a large role in the senior play where I was cast as a cross dresser so I played the entire role in drag and everyone loved it. (If they only knew how much I did too). In my senior year book I was voted "Best all around" whatever that means, so I guess I was somewhat popular.

Sexually though, no, that was one area I remained shy and confused about as I hid all my feelings.  Still was a virgin at graduation.

I was very well liked and popular in highschool.. I was the kid who smarted off to the teachers and got sent to the headmaster everyday.  When I started highschool kids began to pick on me because I was so tiny, but I had a very quick whit and was able to defend myself easily with witty remarks and come backs... often making the other person look dumb or foolish.  After that, nobody seemed to bother me because they knew I would get the best of them in conversation.  I even had one guy push me up against the wall in the bathroom and I while he was holding me there I made a smart ass comment about something he had just said, and all his friends laughed at him.  He put me down and left the bathroom.  He found me later that day and told me that nobody had ever stood up to him and that he wanted to be my friend... we stayed great friends for a long time (until he switched schools).   He had a reputation of being the best fighter in school, so he made sure nobody messed with me from that point on.  Still, highschool was miserable inside my head.  I was incredibly envious of all the girls in my school, thinking that I should be one of them... it was torture on my mind. 

i was pretty imprisoned during school years. i was just very quiet, and didn't bother with the peers. i was never a socialite, and am still not (asperger's.) there was people who seemed to pity me, because i was pretty much the bottom of the pyramid as far as popularity. i had no friends whatsoever, just pity.

For the girls I was funny, charming, and suave. For the boys I was the leader, martial artist, motocross champ, and chick magnet. For the old people I was cordial, friendly, respectful, good manner, helpful.

I was so popular not only with the boys, but also with the girls and the old folks. To the people who knew "strawberry" I was a paradox, something they could not wrap their minds around.

I must qualify this reply by saying that I was never a male, people just thought so.

I was never really the type who knew everybody, etc. My brother was, though that's another story... I had a few friends. People always said I had a good sense of humor (which I never understood what they saw there at the time). I was popular for about a week in high school when I wrote a calculator program that could do the chemistry homework. It wasn't too popular with the teacher though...

I wrote a calculator program that could do the chemistry homework. It wasn't too popular with the teacher though...

My HS would have written a press release for you.

Not me. Never been popular.

Definitely not.
I was always picked on throughout elementary school by both boys and girls, not because of my personality or anything but just because I was relatively short (shortest in my class all the way to grade 9 or so when there was one girl that was the same height as me (literally one). I would avoid standing up for myself because I was acting under the assumption that they were trying to get a reaction out of me. However, after giving them many many warnings and chances to back off, I would eventually fight back, becoming as vicious as possible. In general, they would leave me alone after that, and the teachers were always on my side of things.

Aside from bullies, I was very quiet and composed. Anything I would say was carefully calculated beforehand, but I would not talk often. Most my mental time was spent observing others and analyzing them... usually coming to the conclusion that there were many people I thought were idiots and didn't want to associate with. If I met someone new, I'd be polite, but shy and avoid them almost entirely, until I had enough observational data to make a conclusion as to whether I wanted to associate myself with them or not. The most common comment people would say about me is that I was "weird", though thats usually as far as the critique would go.

In high school it was much the same story. I would have a good relationship with the teachers because I was one of the very few students that actually did my work, and didn't cheat constantly, and was quiet, polite, and followed the rules. I'm pretty sure I managed to get through high school without anyone really noticing. I had a running joke that I'd never appear in school pictures or be mentioned anywhere for one reason or another (In a class picture for the yearbook for example, I'd always seem to be blocked by someone or something, even though I was putting no effort into doing so). I was fascinated to hear from a friend that one of the other teachers actually held a impromptu class discussion about me in a class section that I was not a part of. I still don't know what was said, but the teacher seemed curious and concerned. That teacher was unanimously hated by both the student body and their parents and was eventually fired. One other teacher eventually noticed me and was concerned enough that he pulled me out of class to chat, and later talked to my parents and encouraged them to send me to a psychologist. Though, for the wrong reasons. The goal of those sessions was to correct my "personality problems". I don't remember much of those sessions except for a few things: the doc wanted me to try and be more open, worry less, and just try to have a little more fun... Reserve some time for me. The teacher that spoke to me, in retrospect, seemed to be entirely concerned that I had hated 99% of the student body. Using my usual "observation and assessment" routine I came to the conclusion that, with the exception of a number of students you could count on two hands, the entire student body was made up of immature, spoiled brats and I wanted nothing to do with them. I didn't go to any parties (not that I was invited, but I wouldn't have gone even if I was) and even skipped my semi-formal. I would have skipped Prom as well, but the principal decided to make it mandatory. I have NO idea why but they also decided to make it mandatory that every student bring a date... Though I was interested in girls, I never made any moves because I both didn't actually want to have any of the girls in my school be my girlfriend and because I felt that I would not fit the role of a boyfriend whatsoever. I hated the whole situation. Eventually my Dad ended up finding a date for me. Some friend of his's daughter I had never heard of. After I was informed of the arrangement, I ended up speaking to the girl over the internet, but I could never keep a conversation going for more then 20 seconds. Then we met when we picked her up on the way to the Prom. My anxiety was through the roof the whole night... it was so awkward. At one point we had to dance, but after what seemed like forever (about 30 seconds) I couldn't take it anymore. I was basically crying at this point. I just said I was sorry and that I hope she has a good time and walked back to my seat at one of the tables. Ehh I just felt horrible about everything.

Anyways... Today I'm in university. My mindset is different now but I'm still very anti-social. I've been at this school for 5 years now and I never struck up a conversation with any classmates. I don't know anyone other then people my pre-existing friends have introduced me to, and I've completely forgotten the names of people in my high school. I am sure many people here share my feelings of anger regarding the loss of a meaningful childhood. Whenever I think about it I can't help but come to tears.

So yeah... There's my school experiences in a nutshell. I'm glad that some of you seem to share my experiences, at least partially. It's nice to not be alone.

Quote from: HitOrMiss. on July 06, 2011, 11:03:50 PM
I am sure many people here share my feelings of anger regarding the loss of a meaningful childhood. Whenever I think about it I can't help but come to tears.

Oh yeah, you're definitely not alone in that. I often wish that I could have had a normal childhood, normal college experience, etc. Maybe in my next life...

I had contact with the popular boys... usually with their fists.  And then I got suspended for getting hit because Columbine was a ruthless place for a goth, and the administration allowed popular kids to do what they wanted to anyone who wasn't popular.

Not at all, unless one considers being picked on by bullies to be "popular" :(   I was very much a loner, and immersed myself in playing and listening to music and reading books. My few friends in high school were other outcasts.

Z

I'm a loner. Everybody acts nice to me, but I don't talk to them or anyone, including my friends.

I can't.

I got into a very uncaring mode for several years of high school. So, I supposed I rebelled quite a lot which naturally put me into a "popular" position. I was angry at well... pretty much everyone, particularly my dad for forcing me to be something I wasn't. So, I took it out on everybody else. Some how this equated to me being really well liked and a rock star of sorts. To this day I don't know how that happened. It's ironic, because one of the points in my life when I was most liked was also what I consider the darkest moment of my life.  ??? I will admit though, I had a blast making the jocks fight for "control." :D

Prior to high school though was a nightmare. Like many others, I was picked on a lot because of "personality problems." I think that also had a hand in me saying screw it.

To this day I still have some of that rebellious fight in me though.

Quote from: Pinkfluff on July 06, 2011, 11:15:44 PM
Oh yeah, you're definitely not alone in that. I often wish that I could have had a normal childhood, normal college experience, etc. Maybe in my next life...

I agree, In the U.K I was a target for the bullies at a badly run down gritty all boys comprehensive school where physical violence against me happened on a regular basis everyday.....it was about as far away as you could get to the middle class mixed American high School setting! my childhood and schooling were the worst years of my life.

I didn't even make it to high school. I was thrown in a mental hospital for wearing womens clothes and i never went to high school. I ran away in 1969 and ended up at a gay / lesbian commune in N. Calif by 1970 in southern humboldt county.

In junior high 7th grade i was harrassed and beaten up but treid to fight for my life. Some girls did like me because i had long hair but that was short lived. I was in catholic school until 6th grade where i was sexually abused by a nun.. I then was put in a mental hospital two times in 7th grade in junior high. I never went back to school.

No i was never popular.. maybe popular for screwing up and being a class clown.. and being kicked around and during grade school having my legs separated and my body ran into a sign pole by the bigger kids..

Interesting question....
I was not popular with the boys, but I was always with the girls. I was excepted with them with no questions asked, so I was popular in that senesce, but not with the boys... I mean I could go hang around with that group and they were fine with me being there. But as soon as they started to do something that would get them into trouble I would leave ect.
I was never a party person, I went to like 3 parties going though high school. I would get invited to one almost every week, but I hated that environment! So I just never went unless it was like my best friends party.

Time is an interesting telescope.  I did not think I had ANY degree of popularity in high school or lower, but at my last two class reunions (35Th &40Th year) I have had people tell me how much they remember about the good things I did, and how important I was to the class (1966).  They are going to get a shock a little later this year though when I show up as ME.  I had been a sports team manager (water boy/statistician) and had "saved" a school athletic record because I had taken a picture at a critical moment of and athletic event, I had also appeared in two school plays in junior and senior years, although I had "forced some real acting" by totally forgetting my lines.  (Funny, but the two roles were male characters and while in a play, I liked the male roles, it was offstage that they were tough. 

I was sexually molested in both Junior and Senior high school by the same other boy, the first time, on a Boy Scout overnight (Kicked and grabbed in the crotch and also in the High School locker room, same story as before. The scoutmaster and the gym teacher both brushed the incident off as "boys will be boys".  The teacher had been one of my Sunday School teachers as well.   Its only been the last two years I have been able to give what the classmate did the full, proper name, molestation.  He is one of the "lost classmates" on our class list, hmmm, I wonder--------Nawww!!   

I was a ghost a secondary school(Junior High and High school combined).    Some times I hated being so isolated and yet at other times I liked being invisible.    I didn't have any girlfriends(in the non-sexual sense or otherwise) as the girls were either snooty and held themselves aloof from the boys or they only ever had eyes for the alpha boys.


When I was at primary school(age 5 to 12) I was quite popular and certainly more conspicuous than I became later.   I played football(soccer) as lunchtime and at each break - though not every day.     I knew I was different from the other boys, I used to look over at the girls whistfully and want to hang about with them, and to be one of them.   At the time I couldn't explain why I felt like that.  I had never heard of transsexuality or ->-bleeped-<- so I just thought that I was weird in some way.

I did alright during jr high, as the school was on base(army).  Once in high school, I was bullied.  I moved to another high school when dad got out of the army and was bullied some more.  I did have a small group of loyal friends though.  I wasn't necessarily quiet--I was just "different" ???

Quote from: Princess of Hearts on July 07, 2011, 07:36:18 PM
I knew I was different from the other boys, I used to look over at the girls whistfully and want to hang about with them, and to be one of them.   At the time I couldn't explain why I felt like that.  I had never heard of transsexuality or ->-bleeped-<- so I just thought that I was weird in some way.

100%.
**edit**
I just wrote another big post about this, but I decided it was too off topic so here is a tiny version =P

I had thoughts like that quite often, yet every time I would think about it I'd forget about the thought almost right away. I'm not sure if was some sort of defense mechanism or something, but it was really powerful. One night I finally came up with the idea of ->-bleeped-<- (don't ask me how that happened... I have NO idea) and, while thinking about if that was what I was, I had lots of flashbacks where I recalled all the instances when I had envious thoughts of girls or just flat out said "Wouldn't it be awesome to be a girl?", and every instance where my behavior or thought processes were "girly". The historical evidence seemed to answer the question pretty clearly for me =).

I was not very popular or unpopular... just normal but emotionally my relationship with school was a very bad one. I skipped class a very significant number of times because I didn't want to be there, I could not relate to my "friends" who were boys but I was too young to be able to, as a boy, make friends who were girls.

I left school very young though (just after 6th grade). I had a lot of anxiety about it and the then-pubescent boys made me more and more uncomfortable as they started to get into more "teenager" things and getting more aggressive and competitive... I just could not stay there at the time.

By the time I went back to college I was decided on transition though and while I still hated being treated like "one of the guys" (though I had kind of a weird status as the small, short, young one that put me in slightly different category at least) I was able to ignore it because I knew I only had to put up with it for a little longer, and because of the support of my boyfriend.

Quote from: Princess of Hearts on July 07, 2011, 07:36:18 PMI knew I was different from the other boys, I used to look over at the girls whistfully and want to hang about with them, and to be one of them.   At the time I couldn't explain why I felt like that.  I had never heard of transsexuality or ->-bleeped-<- so I just thought that I was weird in some way.

You just reminded me of myself so much!

  It is nice to hear from you "popular boys".  I went to my class' website and found a lot of the "head boys" and others like this with no info of their current status or is deceased, I saw one of them in an obit about 20 years ago during the first AIDS epidemic.  All of the "head girls" reported successes, one of them is one the organizers of this 40th reunion later this month.  But alas, I may not attend that reunion because of a previous commitment out of state for that weekend.   Plus a lot af bad memories, even though people change in the 40 years!
  Joelene

Quote from: RhinoP on July 06, 2011, 01:56:37 AM
I think this is a very important question because I'm sure all of us here have had on and off doubts about wether or not a lack of confidence in a male role may lead to the want for a female role.

Quite simply, I would define a "popular boy" as someone who, during some period of their middle to high school education, was the type of guy that all the guys looked up to, that all the girls wanted to have sex with, the type of guy who constantly was at parties or just was surrounded by great attitudes and admiration (because that's no "in the movies" concept, most straight guys that I went to school with applied to this lifestyle.) Was anyone here that type of popular male?

And I do not strictly mean that in a jock, football player sense, you could have been popular in an alternative sense, in a druggie sense, in a rock band sense, in a stylish sense, popularity meaning if you always had supportive friends in a male role that truly fueled your ego and weren't just friends you tolerated because you were desperate or confused. Were you ever the leader, the cool kid that everyone wanted to tell a joke to or ask how the summer went? Did people naturally admire you?

Just curious!

No, I was and still am, a loner.

I had a few friends but mostly i was unpopular.

if there was someone populair, it wasn't absolutely not me.
I was a softy, so the other boys could prove how tough they were by beating me, I was a very easy victim.
In puberty all the boys get hair, legs chest, except me, so the girls didn't like me either.They liked the manly guys.
At the end it was a big advantage, no hair removing but at my time at school it was a dramatic thing.

I became more populair as a girl
Annette

I was kind of a loner. Kids tried to bully me in middle school but I fought back and they left me alone. Still a loner.

Popular? Nope, not at all. I had one or two (male) friends and was pretty much ignored by everyone else. I never made trouble, kept a low profile. Not into sports at all. Always one of the last to be chosen during gym classes for whatever game the teacher chose to play (often softball). In retrospect I think, to put it in computer terms, I had this constant "background process" using/blocking "mental resources". I became somewhat accustomed to feeling a constant low level of miserable all the time. I wasn't really part of any group.

In my mind puberty (the wrong one) and middle/high school are more or less linked, and I don't have to tell anyone here what going through the wrong kind of puberty feels like.

Quote from: HitOrMiss. on July 06, 2011, 11:03:50 PM
I am sure many people here share my feelings of anger regarding the loss of a meaningful childhood. Whenever I think about it I can't help but come to tears.

Ditto on that. My feeling is that growing up in a male body has, for lack of a better description, "irreparably damaged" me in terms of social interaction with other people, self respect, etc. These days I get along adequately, but not much more than that. I will never be the life of the party.

The other day my father said something interesting. He said something along the lines of: "when you were young you were this happy outgoing child. Then around the age of 7 or 8 the sparkle in your eyes went out". I never realizes this, but I can tell you what caused it.....

the next thing is, i pretty much hated every day of school because i had zero self-esteem and felt like i wasn't worth anything. i managed to get really good grades between 4th and 6th grade. my mom pretty much intimidated me, so i really stressed out over making sure i did all my homework and making sure i could get a 90 or above on every test. it wasn't easy to also have asperger's, expressive receptive language disorder, and then a mathematics disorder. none of those were diagnosed until i was 17. it was just so convenient *sarcasm.* anyway, i hated school. people blamed me for stuff that wasn't my fault, i had zero self esteem, zero self confidence, lots of anxiety, and then nothing to show for it. no one did anything for me. transitioning really brought my self esteem and self confidence to life, which makes me feel like i can actually do things now.

Quote from: annette on July 11, 2011, 01:20:35 AM


I became more populair as a girl

I was never popular as a boy, always a victim by bullies, school was the worse time of my life, when I left school I started my transition, I became more popular as a girl, specially with guys. I was a total failure as a boy, I became more successful as a girl / woman.

I am considered an "emo cute boy" people generally keep their distance because i have a knife at all times ::) ::) But simple thing is it allows me to live my life in secrecy OH but i used to be the popular jockey boy until the only sports offered were gender split then i quit being that kinda of person.

Quote from: LilKittyCatZoey on July 12, 2011, 02:43:42 PM
I am considered an "emo cute boy" people generally keep their distance because i have a knife at all times ::) ::) But simple thing is it allows me to live my life in secrecy OH but i used to be the popular jockey boy until the only sports offered were gender split then i quit being that kinda of person.

i just did one year of t-ball. it was when i was only 6. i sucked at it, but i only joined it because the neighbors daughter was also going to be in it, and i liked playing with her. i couldn't hit the broadside of a barn, and it's pretty much the same now.

Oh definitely not popular. :( I suppose I was more likeable than I thought at the time, but I was pretty convinced by highschool that I was broken, and I sort of pushed people away. I always had a few friends, and I definitely wasn't bullied; at least, no more than a couple of little things that happened; but I wasnt on top by any measure.

I think this is just a sign of the times, but in my high school, there were plenty of open gays and even semi-crossdressers. If they were physically attractive, everyone loved them; they'd become the life of the party. If they were ugly, they were automatically labeled a freak or a loser. Just like the celebrity world, people in my highschool had more personality freedom the more attractive and popular they were; hardly of the any "all gays/trans are freaks" mindsets applied. My generation grew up with freaks on the TV (everyone my age loves Marilyn Manson and Jeffree Star), so the stigma tends to be pushed aside onto a divide that's honestly more frequent in my generation; the divide between being attractive and quite ugly.

And I'm quite ugly, so needless to say, no one ever admired my transition or personality in the way that they did for the more attractive souls of my high school, and I can count how many friends I had on one hand. I never was anti-social or negative, I just could not make friends because everytime I tried, either a boy or a girl would ask "What's wrong with your face?" - I'd say I got asked that by random strangers in school well over 100 times. It really got to me after awhile. I was very strange looking in the face both for a male or female role, I really couldn't 'break through' anywhere, though I tried many things.

And in that position, really the last groups a person tends to get along with are the "nerds" or the "marching band/academic" folks, but I just had way different interests than all the computer/video game "nerds" (I was always a film/art freak myself, very few of those in my school), and the academic folks really just never seemed to have a good grasp on the problems that really happen in the world to take the time to get to know who I am. Some of those folks, though mature and nice, could hear the words "Oh, I was raped by my father a couple years back." and run for the hills.

In the end, my life hasn't improved one bit, I'm still ugly as crap and I haven't been in a relationship or sexual encounter for over 5 years (probably a world record for any teenager in the 21st century) despite how social I try to be, and it really takes it's toll.

I only became "popular" at my 25th year class reunion when my classmates realized who I used to be

I was not popular at all; most of my friends were the other outcasts that no one else was friends with. I was physically short for my age so sports was out (and i threw like a girl anyway LOL....). I was also quite shy and didn't have a clue what to do with girls so there was no success there either. I was  bigender even back then (although i didn't know it at the time) and that just made me weird and a target for abuse from other boys. I managed to avoid most fights and to stay out of trouble but there was a lot of verbal abuse. I did happen to drive a cool car and i met a few friends that way and spent many friday/saturday nights just cruising around by myself in it. I was smart but an apathetic student; i could not see the point in it. I hated the things that other boys did but did them to try to "man up".

I hated school - it was a lonely, hateful place full of social angst and it held absolutely no appeal for me.

i would say yes i was one of the more popular kids in school i wouldnt go as far to say i was the one guys wanted to be and girls wanted to be with i was more of the one everyone went to for help in everyday life to school work or help study for a test at the same time i was the guy everyone went to find out all the gossip and where the parties were at the person if you needed a shoulder to cry came to me if you needed a bag of weed i knew where it was if you were throwing a party and had no one to buy booze i had the buyer. i was friends with basically everyone jocks goths geeks nerds prepps sluts what ever you wanna lable them as. however thru all that is was around this time that i started to think i wasnt meant to be a guy ppl were telling me i had a girlie figure girlie hand writing and even tho i worn "male" cloths i still had the female figure and was even confused as a girl by ppl that really didnt know me or the new kids in school i was never confused as being gay or anything like that

Quote from: Herwinteress on July 06, 2011, 08:38:30 AM
I was dying inside on a daily basis due to at times pretty severe GID after puberty hit, but looking back it was my full bore Oscar-worthy performance of regularly being the fun happy-go-lucky guy next door that people didn't seem to mind hanging out with me. I was smart enough to keep my real feelings hidden and know when to play the roles. 

As far as the girls...I never had confidence as a male to bed the girls.  My personality was always enough to get them interested, but after a few dates they got the hint pretty quick I wasn't the regular dude they were hoping for and it ALWAYS fizzled.  I just couldn't perform and male instincts (intimacy) didn't come naturally to me. I was always criticized for being too passive and letting them take the lead. Often left me embarrassed. God knows what they talked about me with their friends after a night of disappointing teenage unfulfillment.  Come to think of it, scoring with girls is probably the one place I never could mask my true self.  I was just too young and sexually confused to learn how to fake it/get through it as I would do in my mid-20s.

Tried as I might to get amped up about a big date and 'afterwards' with a girl to brag to my buddies, my burgeoning attraction to guys was playing havoc with me every time.  I used to hate myself and feel so guilty about that.  Now I embrace it.

I can certainly relate to this. Sounds a lot like me back in the day. I was clueless what to do with other women. I was very passive, and despite my tough guy appearance, they soon found out that I wasn't what I appeared to be.

I was very reclusive when I hit puberty. I didn't like the way things were changing with my body, and the boys and the girls really separated apart at that time. No girls wanted to hang out with me after that, and I didn't fit in with the boys. While other people hung out with their friends, I spent most of my time pecking away at my Commodore 64.

It wasn't until my senior year that I started hanging out with all the other outcasts, the punks, the goths, the metal heads. After that, I just pretty much killed all the pain for a while with alcohol and drugs.

In regards to the OP's statement about lack of confidence in a "male" role leading to the want for a "female" role, that's certainly not the case for me. I've never felt male. It doesn't have anything to do lack of comfort with a stereotypical male role. I became very good at taking on the typical "male" role in my late 20's.  So if a lack of comfort before was the driving factor in my gender dysphoria, you would think it would have resolved itself once I became skilled at living that role. In fact, the dysphoria only got worse.

Popular.  No.  Except for the geeks and misfits.  Most of the girls viewed me as a gal pal.  They would talk to me about everything girls talk about.  Boyfriends, periods, other girls and dress.  It was interesting.  I had many BFFs who were girls.

But then again they may have felt safe around me.  Not to say I wasn't interested in a couple of them.  ;D

The jocks viewed me as a target.  Learn really quick to keep things real close.  Still hard to be close to anyone.

Quote from: Irish Janet on July 16, 2011, 11:56:44 PM
Popular.  No.  Except for the geeks and misfits.  Most of the girls viewed me as a gal pal.  They would talk to me about everything girls talk about.  Boyfriends, periods, other girls and dress.  It was interesting.  I had many BFFs who were girls.

But then again they may have felt safe around me.  Not to say I wasn't interested in a couple of them.  ;D

The jocks viewed me as a target.  Learn really quick to keep things real close.  Still hard to be close to anyone.

I could have written most of that!  Right down to the fact that I went to prom with one of my friends as my "date."  We went with another "couple" who were also just friends of ours.  None of the four of us were dating any of the others, we just did it so we didn't have to feel alone.  To this day, my friend tells me she asked me to do that because I was safe and she knew I wouldn't pull anything.  Mind you, that was 16 years ago and I didn't come out to my friend as trans until this past March.

I was very popular in grade school, known by all; as all my friends were in middle school and was very popular the highschool. The funny thing is that except for not having a girl's name or dressing up as a girl; I acted completely as I was, people even emulated my clothing choice often as I was a goddess at androgynous fashion. I did not project myself and at times would try to go under radar, but every one knew me and told me how pretty my hair/face and cute/handsome i dressed if they hadn't seen me in a while.

;D. In middle school and early high school I had to beat quirky girls off me with a bat, and in later highschool I had to beat back both genders at times..... I was like a poorly written anime character as I even was pretty repulsed by sexual organs and touchy feely in general.

I'm still very good friends with my highschool/middle school crowd. Kids not brainwashed by bigoted adults are very accepting as long as you are attractive, and studies with toddlers and babies has shown this over the years.

Adults either loved me or treated me like a landmine that they didn't know what to do with and that really disturbed me. I only ever hid my true inner self from my homophobic parents.