Susan's Place Transgender Resources

i know there is another thread going on about "what made you realize you are a woman". Now my question u can say is maybe in the same subject but not completely. I want to know at least from anyone who wants to share, what is it that made you want to be a woman? i know a lot of people say "ive always felt like a woman" but as people born in the wrong gender how does one know what it is like to feel like a woman if you have never been a woman. Its kind of like experience cis people would not know how it is like to be transgender if they do not have those feelings. The same for the ftm crowd. A lot of people also say that gender is socially constructed for example girls like pink and dolls and boys like blue and trucks, that is more of a stereotype but id say its pretty accurate.  If a person is born male regardless of how one feels inside, that person will be treated as a male and will experience life as a male. So in regards to that how does one know how it is to feel like a woman or vice versa. I would not like to think that it all comes down to interests for example "i feel like a woman because i like dresses and make up" if we were to say that than it would just be a stereo type since liking to bake and play dolls is not the interest of every girl on earth. I hope my post is understandable, do we want to be woman because we like girly things? what is ur explanation?

As far as gender is concerned, I think I'm already female.  Mostly I just feel like my physical sex is incorrect, and it hinders me from living the life I want to live.  I don't really know why.  I've tried to think of specific reasons, but saying "I want to be a woman because I want breasts and a vagina" at this point would seem kind of redundant.  Still, if it was just about having feminine interests I don't think I'd feel the need to transition.

In my case it is an issue with "mind-set".
You have tried and tried to be male like cis-male, and just don't get it, don't like it, have very much different interests, are bored by cis-male conversations, feel often an aversion to cis-male attitudes. I often found cis-males repulsive in my youth. They tried to treat me like a cis-person and all I wanted to just run away.
It's just not who I am at heart and soul.

Secondly there is an inner yearning to be female with females, because you feel you "click".
BUT because you are in the wrongly sexed body, the door to "being female is closed".

Transition is the only way to get some relieve from this, and for some of "us" it is the knowing that only SRS will make one "complete".

I say "some of us", because there are many intermediate steps were trans-persons become comfortable enough to stay at. SRS need not be the final out come.

Axelle

I agree, physical bodies aside, the outward presentation of gender is a social construct.  Boys could (can and do) wear pink and they're still boys.  Girls are still girls even if they play sports or do other typically "masculine" activites.

As far as my own understanding, it wasn't so much a choice to be a female as it was to not pretend to be a male anymore.  I got depressed watching children play on the beach, who does that?  And when I fully understood it, it was depressing to watch children just be children without that "noise" (I compare it to a radio broadcasting static, rather loudly) in their head that we (non-cisgendered) experience at some point or another.  Had I grown up with a female body, I would have avoided all the chaos that went with being a transgendered child in the (early) 1980s.  Again, it wasn't about being male or female, it was about not having to fight mental chaos.

I don't like my male body.  I do like the parts of me that are female(ish), my breasts, etc.  If that was male, I'd like being male, but it's not and I don't.

I invented SRS when I was five years old, because I knew that I didn't want what I had for genitals.

Quote from: Sarah7 on August 11, 2011, 01:51:31 PM
For me this question is too backwards. I know that parts of my body are wrong and that being perceived as male is wrong and that testosterone makes me miserable. That's it. That's why I'm a girl. I don't know what people mean when they say they "feel like a woman" or "want to be a woman."

Girls come in all kinds. Being a walking stereotype of femininity is hardly required.

QFT.

Quote from: Sarah7 on August 11, 2011, 01:51:31 PM
Being a walking stereotype of femininity is hardly required.

QFTMFT

(and yeah, I know regan also quoted it, but the MFT cannot be quoted enough  :laugh: )

Quote from: Ann Onymous on August 11, 2011, 03:05:50 PM
QFTMFT

(and yeah, I know regan also quoted it, but the MFT cannot be quoted enough  :laugh: )

Apparently I didn't get the memo. :laugh:  I'm a girlie girl through and through, but that's just me, not me trying to be a stereotype of anything.  I was very effeminate even when I tried to pass myself off as a guy, and I've been like that my entire life.  My honest and genuine nature is extremely female, probably what most people view as stereotypical.

Quote from: Zoë Natasha on August 11, 2011, 03:12:14 PM
Apparently I didn't get the memo. :laugh:  I'm a girlie girl through and through, but that's just me, not me trying to be a stereotype of anything.  I was very effeminate even when I tried to pass myself off as a guy, and I've been like that my entire life.  My honest and genuine nature is extremely female, probably what most people view as stereotypical.

In my case, I can't think of a stereotypical cis-female in my family.  Strong and indepentant come to mind, but that's about it.  About the same for my personal and professional life.  I just don't have anyone truely "girly" in my life to be able to aspire to be like.  :)

I don't know what it is like to be "a woman"... I only know what it is like to be me.

Am I a male? Or am I female? I don't know (and I doubt I ever will).

All I know is I'm attracted to certain qualities and ideals for myself (some would say these are "female" qualities, but I prefer not to gender them... as plenty of men have a variety of the qualities I like). So, the effects of female hormones I see as all positives.

A year ago I was a guy. Sure I had "feminine" feelings, but everyone (including myself) saw me as a guy (just not your average one). And now, because my body is changing, I could be thought of as female? ~shrug~ I find that odd.

Male or female, again, I have no clue... and it doesn't matter. The entire thing is a huge mess created by society trying to dictate what nature "should be", which I grudgingly have to navigate through (so have to be careful with how I express things)... but I'm not going to let myself get caught up in the stupid game with how I think about myself.

So, male? Female? Those labels just are filled with so much social baggage and false information that I can't really tell.

I am just me :)

Quote from: Rabbit on August 11, 2011, 03:45:03 PM
So, male? Female? Those labels just are filled with so much social baggage and false information that I can't really tell.

I am just me :)

I think that's an excellent point! ;D  I'm only a girlie girl type because it just so happens that 90% of my repertoire consists of things considered (societally) to be mostly feminine.  But I will never give up my drums or my guitars.  Or... um... my ability to belch words. :laugh:

(My sister's been able to outdo me in the belching department since she was 8 years old)

So it's tough to say!  I do think you have the right idea though: screw the labels, we're all just being ourselves. ;)

Quote from: Zoë Natasha on August 11, 2011, 03:49:40 PM
So it's tough to say!  I do think you have the right idea though: screw the labels, we're all just being ourselves. ;)

I think its been said before, but why would we put ourselves through all of "this", just to try to force ourselves into another stereotype.

Okay for me it was more i was fed up with being treated as a boy no matter what i did!
So i had enough, and yes people treat you diff for how you look. I simply am changing my look so people will change how they treat me  :) oh plus h8 my body duh!  :)
always been a girl never looked it but always been it  :)

My likes, dislikes? Sure. Disgust of my body? Yep, that as well. But, really, it's how one thinks. Let's face it, male and female brains are completely different. Social norms came from somewhere don't you think? It's because of the way we are wired. Maybe that's not what people want to read, but it's reality. (see http://www.relationship-institute.com/freearticles_detail.cfm?article_ID=151 (http://www.relationship-institute.com/freearticles_detail.cfm?article_ID=151))

Before starting therapy, I had a few weeks on holiday. The entire time I spent thinking as to whether or not I was just crazy, or transsexual. I started reading a book focused on "how women think." I've read plenty of "how to be a gentlemen" etc. type books, of which I could never finish... because they made absolutely no sense to me. Suddenly I am reading this book and everything becomes clear about who I am, and why I think the way I do.

Like Ann said, it's hardly a desire to be female. We ARE female.

Chaz Bono knew what he was talking about when he said "gender is between your ears, and not between your legs."

It was so unnatural for me to be a man.
I tried it very hard, i think i deserve an Oscar for it but it didn't work, it was not me.
That's why i think I'm female, it feels natural.
So, i am just me now, for the last 30years and i still love it, just being me.

I could counter you and say, "how does a cis person know they're their gender if they don't know what it's like to be the opposite gender?" It's kinda like, where's the control in this experiment?

I just hate the effects testosterone has done to my brain and body. I especially hate what society expects (in general) upon setting its first eyes on me. I always hated trucks and stuff like that as a kid but always played with that crap because I wanted to fit in. Thing is, the more I act effeminate - the more I experiment with the ways that girls are "expected" to be, the more happy I become. I mean, as an example: I cannot understand having sex with a penis, which I have tried and it just never worked out. However I've never had a vagina but any time I climax, I can only imagine what having sex with a vagina feels like. It's like... an amputee ... they say an amputees brain still recognizes the lost limb. It's as if my brain recognizes that I have a vagina.

I never "wanted" to be female. I am female. I was simply born with a birth defect that made the world erroneously assume that I am male.

And when I tried to express my feminine inclinations people assumed it was a phase and/or I was gay.

Quote from: Alainaluvsu on August 11, 2011, 06:18:24 PM
I could counter you and say, "how does a cis person know they're their gender if they don't know what it's like to be the opposite gender?" It's kinda like, where's the control in this experiment?

QFM(ore)T lol

from something I wrote here before:
I remember those days when, as a child, I would be with my female friends and feel such kinship of spirit, feel so like them, and ache so much on the inside if only to be like them on the outside. No matter what I could do, that always separated me and set me apart from them, and from everyone else. I didn't understand how I could have been so cruelly regarded by God to be cursed in this way, thrown to the bottom of a hole, frightened and alone with no way out.

You just know... you know?  it's like asking how do you know you're human?  Because that's what your brain tells you, and because it fits who you are.  Like Zoe I've always been a girly girl.  It wasn't an affectation; it was simply who I was inside.  This gets further reinforced and confirmed by social interaction with those most like you- for me it was other females.  Over the years you learn to hide some of those things carefully for obvious reasons, especially if you live in an abusive environment (which I did), but it comes out anyway despite your best efforts.  Everyone just used to assume I was gay.  My father used to grill me on that constantly.

"No dad, I'm not gay."  (I just like boys)

edited to add: There are plenty of scientific studies to suggest that gender identity is at least partly biological/genetic in origin.  If this is true, then there is a scientific basis for even our most subjective feelings of gender.  Though it may indeed be all in our heads, our heads are in fact made of chemicals.

Let me answer without reading through the rest of the thread: testosterone was ruining my body,  I was not free to explore parts of my identity as a perceived male,  I loved hanging around the girls...  Are they answers?  Dunno, but I like this path better than the old one.

Quote from: elsaG on August 11, 2011, 08:45:34 AM
i know there is another thread going on about "what made you realize you are a woman". Now my question u can say is maybe in the same subject but not completely. I want to know at least from anyone who wants to share, what is it that made you want to be a woman? i know a lot of people say "ive always felt like a woman" but as people born in the wrong gender how does one know what it is like to feel like a woman if you have never been a woman. Its kind of like experience cis people would not know how it is like to be transgender if they do not have those feelings. The same for the ftm crowd. A lot of people also say that gender is socially constructed for example girls like pink and dolls and boys like blue and trucks, that is more of a stereotype but id say its pretty accurate.  If a person is born male regardless of how one feels inside, that person will be treated as a male and will experience life as a male. So in regards to that how does one know how it is to feel like a woman or vice versa. I would not like to think that it all comes down to interests for example "i feel like a woman because i like dresses and make up" if we were to say that than it would just be a stereo type since liking to bake and play dolls is not the interest of every girl on earth. I hope my post is understandable, do we want to be woman because we like girly things? what is ur explanation?

This is what i wanted to say, but i no speak english XD
and for me, i think is only problem with body, no more

I for one find it a very interesting question.

We all say we know our gender, but just how?
How do we know we aren't just imagining and dreaming it?

After all, human minds can often be absolutely convinced of things that aren't actually true. A billion people think Jesus is God and another billion think Allah is God, while rejecting the other party's assertion, so they can't both be right. Yet millions of people are absolutely convinced they are right about God.

And here we all say we know we are female. How can you be so sure? How do you know it's not your brain playing tricks on you?

I tend to think it's undecidable (at least by the current messy meaning of gender). I leave open the possibility that I really am not the gender I think I am, i.e. that if I am somehow examined rigorously scientifically there would be no basis on which I call myself a girl. However, I believe I'm a girl (but will not ascertain it with absolutely certainty), and a girl is what I want to live as, even if there is in fact no intrinsic basis for me being female.

Quote from: elsaG on August 11, 2011, 08:45:34 AM
do we want to be woman because we like girly things? what is ur explanation?

I actually don't like many girly things. Not even guys, I'm a lesbian. And what I want is irrelevant. I've always been a woman, like it or not. Believe me sometimes it's not too. Life would certainly be easier if I were a guy since I find myself in a male body, but that just isn't how things are. As far as how I know, all I can say is that I know myself. Not this body, not its brain or genetics or wtf ever else. Only I am me.

We're all entitled to our own interpretation of reality. Really,  that's all anyone ever has. /philosophy

Because my personality, my interests, my way of living isnt 'flowering' as I am dreaming of....its like a kettle that stays on the fire. I cant live like this! I am suppresing myself

I'm also sick and tired of being perceived as gay by a lot of people, sick of being perceived as some kind of artsy alternative guy. No no no, that's not me...what they see now is a person who isn't conforming totally because I refuse to 'man up' or be the total opposite of what I feel....so I choose something in between, which isn't making me anymore happy at all

I have quite a few 'girly' interests and the way I behave and move leans more towards feminine. And no, I dont like pink (That's for girls, I am 27....Purple is an adult colour!:P) and I dont like mini-skirts and 8 inch heels (I'm not a dress up doll...if I want to look good I'll dress elegantly)

Sometimes its so hard to explain but I prefer to see myself as just casual with a little bit of femme flair ..something a lot of cis-women do aswell

Edit:

Quote from: elsaG on August 11, 2011, 09:45:34 am

    do we want to be woman because we like girly things? what is ur explanation?

I dont really consider that question in my transition. I am more girly..or let's say..feminine than the vast majority of guys both in (stereotypical) behaviour and interests but that's who I am. My body is what I am, and it destroying my chance to live who I am, slowly but surely

If free to do so - you ARE who you want to be.

Actually quite simple.
All the WHYs are not really helpful in this.

And I like girl things because I'm a girl/woman/female it's what I am, and also want to be.

:-)
Axelle

I spent all my time trying to disprove myself. I got all the boy toys and was happy but I wanted some girl toys also. Things were not to bad growing up. I throwed a fit we I saw a bicycle with flowered set and my mom kept saying it was a girls bike. When I entered my teens iwas shaving my legs and stealing clothes from  women that I knew to wear. It was not a sex thing. I just need to express myself. I got to the point of trying to disprove myself. I tryed tostay away from my own feelings. I regret not learning who I am. somethings are me only because noone can see the diffrence so I could express that area of myself. But I have decorative side of me that is very under develeped because I have said one to many times whatever, I don't care and so on. I went to clothing store the other day not to many people there. All that was going through my mind was what would look good on me. What colors go good together my mind was free to explore. I went back because I felt so liberated but it was filled with people. I was afraid to do anything that would make people look at me weird. I  said all of this because for me I have had to learn to understand myself not ignore who I am. I am very tomboyish but when it was time to be a woman all I could think about was how I looked.

I grew up into a woman wanting to be more girly instead of tomboyish then I hit the gender wall.


Sorry I tryed combine the two post but my phone wound not let me.