Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I had looked up information on this. but I wanted to make a new post to get some personalized advice relevant to me.

Ok so I am 22 years old, will be turning 23 in February. I have had a receding hairline since highschool. so probably since I was 16. I honestly dont know when it started. i always had long hair so I dont think I paid too much attention to it.  I do know that it was there at 18 for certain. because that is when i cut my hair into a mohawk. I had been shaving it like that for about 4 years. this past year has been the first yeah for me to grow my hair out since then.

since i had been shaving it so long I didnt pay attention to how much it was receding nor did it seem apprent. but now taht my hair is growing out and with transition in mind this has become one of my top 3 worries. and its something that even makes me cry...I feel liek theres no real solution. and I cant possibly be ok with this. I know Clever hairstyles can hide it. but I need a real fix...if there even is one for me.

well anyway enough complaining. We live in the real world so I need real solutions. I have read a little about finasteride, rogaine, and transplants. seeming to be my only options. but I don find much information about how these products will work with HRT. or if I can even maybe possibly have hope that HRT will fix the problem.

I am due to start HRT soon. so I need a gameplan for my hairline. heres some pics of how it is right now
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi78.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fj89%2Fninjaseikai%2Fme%2F1021110057.jpg&hash=09de6513680c90aa6f37d20e0aebc2824eaee8b5)(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi78.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fj89%2Fninjaseikai%2Fme%2F1124110548.jpg&hash=93b05b38c4e6f93d555cd13bdba4c99a8aadfe1b)

so my question is what advice do you have for me? will HRT possibly be enough? will finasteride or a rogaine be a good choice? should I consult a doctor? if so what do i look for? and is hair transplants a good idea/ even conceivable with all the other costs im saving up for?

just any advice, experiences or facts would be great.

Hello Eve,

it seems like both Finasteride and Rogane might but only might help in the Temple region of you scalp.
I am guessing you would talk to your cardio or who ever is prescribing the HRT about the usage of Finasteride and the HRT together.
Rogane is just a product of the shelve so read the instructions of the box if you decide to go for it.

In my experience the HRT is definitely doing something to the receding line but the HRT and the beard removal changed my face shape so much
that the receding hair line became a bit of a non issue. I cut my bangs recently as I have a lot of unevenly long hair in front and I do have to pull quite a bit hairs from the middle of my scalp but it works. It took me relatively long time to figure out what to do with my hair but I feel relatively relaxed about my receding hair line as it either slowed dawn to the snail tempo, stopped all together or reversed the fall out all together. The time will tell but I feel less freaked out about it as a lot of other aspects of my body became very feminine. I am now just a year on HRT.
It is all about the balance of someones features in my experience. While pre transition my receding line was just another blow on top of many others in my face, now it is one of very few masculine things I still care around.

Google something like frontal hair loss and see what more you can find out about it.

best of luck!

I had recession at about that same age, and it has come back a lot.  Of course I let mine go till I was 35, so mine is only now looking like yours.  I saw a picture from my sister's wedding yesterday and was shocked at how far back my hairline was then.

It will come back some.  I've been on some form of T blocker for 2 years now and I have used both finasteride and dutasteride, but am back on finasteride since it is cheaper.  I also used rogaine for a few years, but stopped a while back and did NOT lose the hair I had gained back.

If you still aren't happy FFS can reposition your hairline.  I've got a phone consult with Dr Z tomorrow for that very thing.  If that isn't an option for you then there is also hair transplants (maybe someday they'll get the cloning of hair right).  And then finally there are the places like Apollo hair systems that give you a false hairline.

Multi-prong attack, in the following order, assuming money is not a problem:

Spiro & finasteride to reduce dihydro testosterone (D culprit)
scalp advancement,
follicle transplant,
meditation & exercise to reduce stress (decrease cortisol, an stress hormone that causes hairloss)
No excess alcohol,
No marijuana or tobacco,
look out for work related exposure to heavy metals, they can cause hair loss


Maintenance:

Spiro & finasteride, estrogen with a bit of progesterone
sulphur- free shampoo,
keratin conditioner (Coppola),
apply rogain before going to bed
multivitamins
sensible diet

Jen61

PS Stay away from the herbs

There was another thread like this. Had some good info on it too.

https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,108713.0.html (https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,108713.0.html)

I'm actually thinking about doing Avodart which is talked about in this thread. :)

Hugs ;)

Avodart is dutasteride.  I did it for around a year, but switched back to finasteride because it is cheaper.  Of course I'm not DIY anymore (and to follow the forum rules I will say you shouldn't either), so it will be finasteride since dutasteride isn't cleared for hair loss use yet.

I've had very little hairloss overall during my life (I'm 29 now). My crown and hairline are still where they need to be, but over the past year or so, I've noticed my temples receeding more. 3 months ago, I started taking Finasteride and Spiro. Since, I have noticed some regrowth at the temples. The regrowth has basically been at the areas which I've lost over the past year or so. The thing I've read is, the temples are really the only spots that are not very consistent with medication, unfortunately. However it is best at the crown and will usually regrow the frontal hairline.

Also, if you use Rogane, beware if you have a cat. Minoxodil is extremely toxic to them!

try dutas/avodart

It grew my hair back four times faster than finasteride (Avodart with a prescription was 4 dollars a month for me). Also, make sure you are on Spiro or another similar medication. Avodart, finasteride, and Rogain will not be as effective without HRT because you have all the constant Male Pattern Baldness you have to fight uphill with. On HRT, most of that will be blocked off so the medication can be more effective. I tried Finasteride but I was not enjoying the very slow results.

With Avodart, my hair grew fully back in less than two years....I mean..no bald spots, no receding hair line. Nothing. Just to give you an idea, 0.5mg of Avodart/dutas is slightly more stronger than 5mg of Finasteride.

My hair was a lot worse than yours:

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm3.staticflickr.com%2F2682%2F5861116081_613ec57648_z.jpg&hash=fbcac6eeea82e7963a98d626e2f1deb7f8374f44)
Julyish 2009

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm8.staticflickr.com%2F7151%2F6395585555_b196e7cafa_z.jpg&hash=61b5480e17e83cbc081635ea657bd46cdd32c1b4)
November 2011

Unfortunately, hair medication is largely a YMMW thing. Some people might have amazing results with it; some might have poor results. Most hair doctors recommend waiting at least one year after you have gotten on finasteride, spiro, and estrogen to see how they have affected your hair before moving on to the hair transplant option.

Also, there is hairline lowering surgery, which moves down your hairline instantly which means you don t have to wait a year for the transplanted hair to grow out again (the transplanted hair grafts tend to shed after being relocated due to shock). Most hairline lowering doctors prefer that you have full hair at the frontal line, however, so most males with MPB are not eligible because their hair is thinning as well. Females usually tend to qualify because they are not experiencing MPB. But, if you have thick frontal hair after a while on HRT, you can look into hairline lowering surgery as another option.

And... for the record, I would like to state that Avodart (dutasteride) also inhibit Type I in addition to Type II, and Type I is present in the brain tissue. Long-term research has not been done yet on how inibiting Type I enzymes in the brain tissue will affect humans in the long-term.

Currently, there are no human studies because no one have been born with a Type I enyzme defiency. There are already people who have been born with a Type II enzyme deficiency, which is why finasteride was cleared for long term hair loss with the information gleaned from those subjects' health. That is why most hair doctors are uncomfortable recommending dutasteride as the first mode of attack - they usually will prefer you try out finasteride first to see how you react to it before moving on to dutasteride, because - basically, you are gambling with your brain tissue and how it will be affected in the future, especially once you get to elderly age.

Dutasteride was intended for bengin prostatic hyperlasia in natal males - a medical treatment that is not intended for hair loss and certainly not a lifetime regimen. They move on to other options including surgical removal if the prostate gland does not shrink in response to dutasteride.

I just wanted you to proceed with caution, armed with information about Avodart (dutasteride). :)

Quote from: Annah on November 24, 2011, 11:54:22 AM
try dutas/avodart

(Avodart with a prescription was 4 dollars a month for me).

Hey Annah, I keep asking you questions about this. lol. Sense this topic got brought up again. I was curious about the prescribed method. I currently go to this Womens Care Clinic for my HRT. I called them up and they mentioned they had never prescribed that before and to talk to the doctor on my next appoint. :( Something tells me that will be a waste of time. Did you get the prescription for Avodart by the same doctor who prescribed the HRT for you? Or do I have to go to a Dermatologist or a General? Years ago I went to a Dermatologist to get the Propecia, but he sounded out of date with things.

Anyways,
Giant Hugs to all :)

Quote from: BrokenCode on November 24, 2011, 12:52:41 PM

Hey Annah, I keep asking you questions about this. lol. Sense this topic got brought up again. I was curious about the prescribed method. I currently go to this Womens Care Clinic for my HRT. I called them up and they mentioned they had never prescribed that before and to talk to the doctor on my next appoint. :( Something tells me that will be a waste of time. Did you get the prescription for Avodart by the same doctor who prescribed the HRT for you? Or do I have to go to a Dermatologist or a General? Years ago I went to a Dermatologist to get the Propecia, but he sounded out of date with things.

Anyways,
Giant Hugs to all :)

Please, please, read what I wrote about avodart above.

Quote from: MsDazzler on November 24, 2011, 01:03:23 PM
Please, please, read what I wrote about avodart above.

Sorry I missed that. I'm really tired today, been up really late.

Thanks,

Hug :)

Edit: BTW what resource did you get that from?

@dazzler

Im fine. My doctor knows it was originally used for the prostate. My hair grew and my body is just fine. My doctor would not have prescribed this if it would have hurt me. Plus when you r on hrt u dont need to take it forever since i do not have the t to lose what i grew. I did my homework too.Finasteride was created to shrink the prostate as well. With any drug there are risks. Spiro is much nastier with risks but i still take it. Why? Because the benefits outweighs the risks.

@brokencode

Yes my endo nad prescribed it for me.  I hope this helps!

hmm well this is all very good interesting information.
this Avodart is not something I knew about so its a consideration. its looking like HRT is the first step though. and yet another reason to be impatient.

this evaluation seems like its taking forever uuuugh

but i guess whenever I get  doctor for HRT I will bring these up and see what is recommended.

I went from baby fine hair to thinning receding hair by the age of 14. :( All the joys of not wanting to be a male to start with plus why not make it even worse trying to be a young balding one. Add in all the comments about how much testosterone must be flowing through your veins for further suicidal interest. By your age I already had a very pronounced widows peak and thinning on back/top.

How well any treatment will work depends on genetics. I had a grandfather that was as bald as a que ball by age 35, my dad's hairline wasn't much better then my own at age 20 and he was 40.

I do hope you find a treatment that works or slows things down a lot. Having to use wigs sucks in many ways, especially for full-time. Using a wig on a chrome-dome sucks the most. The bright spot is the ease at changing styles, lengths, and colors. Still, I'd much rather have my own.

Quote from: MsDazzler on November 24, 2011, 12:40:06 PM
Also, there is hairline lowering surgery, which moves down your hairline instantly which means you don t have to wait a year for the transplanted hair to grow out again (the transplanted hair grafts tend to shed after being relocated due to shock). Most hairline lowering doctors prefer that you have full hair at the frontal line, however, so most males with MPB are not eligible because their hair is thinning as well. Females usually tend to qualify because they are not experiencing MPB. But, if you have thick frontal hair after a while on HRT, you can look into hairline lowering surgery as another option.

I had a phone consult with Dr. Z today and he said that the frontal hairline thickness is not a disqualifer for hairline lowering.  He actually said that he prefers that all transplant patients have lowering done FIRST so don't let a thin hairline keep you from at least talking to a FFS specialist about hairline lowering.

I MAY have a FFS appointment for 12/27/2011.  He has an opening then and I could pull that off, but I want to make sure it is in my price range before I commit.

Quote from: Jeneva on November 25, 2011, 03:26:31 PM
I had a phone consult with Dr. Z today and he said that the frontal hairline thickness is not a disqualifer for hairline lowering.  He actually said that he prefers that all transplant patients have lowering done FIRST so don't let a thin hairline keep you from at least talking to a FFS specialist about hairline lowering.

I MAY have a FFS appointment for 12/27/2011.  He has an opening then and I could pull that off, but I want to make sure it is in my price range before I commit.

Who is Dr. Z?

Think as a girl and be as a girl. Your hair will grow as a girl.

Quote from: MsDazzler on November 25, 2011, 03:41:15 PM
Who is Dr. Z?

Dr. Zukowski in Chicago

http://www.mlzukowskiffs.com/ (http://www.mlzukowskiffs.com/)

Quote from: ♥ Alyssa Case ♥ on November 25, 2011, 03:44:39 PM
Think as a girl and be as a girl. Your hair will grow as a girl.

::)

Quote from: ♥ Alyssa Case ♥ on November 25, 2011, 03:44:39 PM
Think as a girl and be as a girl. Your hair will grow as a girl.

Lol doesn't quite work that way.

Im sorry this is happening to you, i too have a semi high hairline but i havent really thought too much about it. The only thing i can tell u, as i have no experience with hair loss is that ur problem has a solution. Well that's a quote from my mom "everything has a solution, you just have to find what's right for you".

Quote from: Annah on November 24, 2011, 08:29:34 PM
@dazzler

Im fine. My doctor knows it was originally used for the prostate. My hair grew and my body is just fine. My doctor would not have prescribed this if it would have hurt me. Plus when you r on hrt u dont need to take it forever since i do not have the t to lose what i grew. I did my homework too.Finasteride was created to shrink the prostate as well. With any drug there are risks. Spiro is much nastier with risks but i still take it. Why? Because the benefits outweighs the risks.

Are you saying you are willing to gamble with your brain tissue into your old age since you are also blocking Type 1 enzymes as well as Type 2? Just because your doctor prescribed it doesnt mean it is FDA approved or safe for long-term use.  As well,  I know many doctors have prescribed Avodart as an off-label medication for many desperate balding men who are willing to try anything after having exhausted other avenues.

The fact is, we do not know what will happen to our brains after blocking both Type I and II enzymes for a long time. There were clinical trials conducted on use of dutasteride for hair loss but it never reached Phase III. The word is that the company figured it was not worth pouring millions of dollars into the trials, subjects, and research because finasteride was just so similar to dutasteride and it does its job, so the company dropped the trials.

Which is so unfortunate because we could have gleaned information about how blocking both Type I and II enzymes for a long time affect the brain from those trials.  :icon_anger:

Once someone has SRS, do they still need to worry about DHT?

Quote from: Ava C on November 26, 2011, 06:29:16 AM
Once someone has SRS, do they still need to worry about DHT?

No, testosterone levels will drop significantly after SRS to the point where the amount of DHT produced will be very insignificant enough to even play a role in hair loss. That is why eunuchs do not bald at all.

Quote from: MsDazzler on November 26, 2011, 01:06:11 AM
Are you saying you are willing to gamble with your brain tissue into your old age since you are also blocking Type 1 enzymes as well as Type 2? Just because your doctor prescribed it doesnt mean it is FDA approved or safe for long-term use.  As well,  I know many doctors have prescribed Avodart as an off-label medication for many desperate balding men who are willing to try anything after having exhausted other avenues.

a. That has not been proven
b. Sweet and Low causes cancer in rats. I still use it.
c. HRT can kill you with a stroke. I still take it.
d. I can be killed being a transsexual. I'm still fulltime.

Point is, I really don't care nor do I worry about it. The benefits outweighs the risks for me.

If you don't want to take dutas then don't. But don't dictate medical ethics to me. You are in no position to tell me what is best for me. It really will not work.

I'm happy with my results.

Quote from: Annah on November 27, 2011, 12:32:22 AM
a. That has not been proven
b. Sweet and Low causes cancer in rats. I still use it.
c. HRT can kill you with a stroke. I still take it.
d. I can be killed being a transsexual. I'm still fulltime.

Point is, I really don't care nor do I worry about it. The benefits outweighs the risks for me.

If you don't want to take dutas then don't. But don't dictate medical ethics to me. You are in no position to tell me what is best for me. It really will not work.

I'm happy with my results.

Hardly dictating medical ethics at all. I am just wondering. That s all.

Well, that's funny; because in reply #8, 10, and 22 it sure doesn't sound "like you're wondering."

I had a 55 yr old friend who transitioned. She was bald except for on the sides of her head. I told her how i got castrated / orchiectomy and how my hair came back and stopped thinning.. She did it too and got back 95% of her hair.. It wasn't thick but it was there. She did wear a wig many times but the surest way is to stop the T from testes..

Quote from: Annah on November 27, 2011, 07:06:15 AM
Well, that's funny; because in reply #8, 10, and 22 it sure doesn't sound "like you're wondering."

Right - I was wondering out aloud because given all the information, you were, indeed, doing it. That is my style - I tend to ruminate, ponder, and question. Not telling you what you should do or not do. Cross my heart.  :)

Quote from: Jeneva on November 25, 2011, 03:26:31 PM
I had a phone consult with Dr. Z today and he said that the frontal hairline thickness is not a disqualifer for hairline lowering.  He actually said that he prefers that all transplant patients have lowering done FIRST so don't let a thin hairline keep you from at least talking to a FFS specialist about hairline lowering.

I MAY have a FFS appointment for 12/27/2011.  He has an opening then and I could pull that off, but I want to make sure it is in my price range before I commit.

Really? I consulted with several hair doctors in the bay area about hairline lowering - they said the opposite. Hmph! Maybe I should have been talking to FFS specialists instead - they seem to have a different opinion about hairline lowering?

Quote from: MsDazzler on November 27, 2011, 01:15:55 PM
Really? I consulted with several hair doctors in the bay area about hairline lowering - they said the opposite. Hmph! Maybe I should have been talking to FFS specialists instead - they seem to have a different opinion about hairline lowering?

Because of your posts in this thread I specifically asked him about thinning and hairline lowering.  He seemed to think it would make a big difference.  He is one of the bigger FFS names, but it is possible that he was just selling an extra procedure, but he actually advised me against a few things so I'd tend to think not (I've only been on full strength E for 3-4 months [I did half doses for a year before that] and he said to wait on the BA).

Quote from: ~~♥BebeLyss♥~~ on November 25, 2011, 03:44:39 PM
Think as a girl and be as a girl. Your hair will grow as a girl.

Hmm no it doesnt work that way ;). First of all the genetics play a role and also hormones, and you also have to take care of your hair (something that really makes the difference).

~As a general rule, flutamide is more effective than either spironolactone or cyproterone acetate, dutasteride is more effective than finasteride, and any (oral) anti-androgen when also used routinely with a topical estrogen, e.g., 17B-estradiol, will have a positive synergistic effect. Lastly, inositol, biotin, iron and zinc supplementation may be of some mild benefit for hair loss.

To achieve a perfect hairline, however... You may require a scalp advancement.

Quote from: Carolina1983 on December 21, 2011, 02:28:12 AM
Hmm no it doesnt work that way ;). First of all the genetics play a role and also hormones, and you also have to take care of your hair (something that really makes the difference).

Exactly. I really feel for the girls (and guys) that have this unfortunate problem.

Quote from: Akashiya Moka on December 21, 2011, 08:04:27 AM
~As a general rule, flutamide is more effective than either spironolactone or cyproterone acetate, dutasteride is more effective than finasteride, and any (oral) anti-androgen when also used routinely with a topical estrogen, e.g., 17B-estradiol, will have a positive synergistic effect. Lastly, inositol, biotin, iron and zinc supplementation may be of some mild benefit for hair loss.

To achieve a perfect hairline, however... You may require a scalp advancement.

Exactly. I really feel for the girls (and guys) that have this unfortunate problem.

A perfect hairline would look a little too artifical, IMHO.

I wonder how it is that some women have so lustrous, glorious, and thick locks without even taking any supplements.

I had been taking MSM and Hair, Skin, & Nails for almost two months now, and finally I am seeing an improvement in the quality of my hair - although, hormones have definitely helped it along