Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I dance in an LGBT group, and there is one guy there whom I talk to from time to time.  He is the only other trans person I interact with regularly, and I find myself becoming more and more uncomfortable around him. 

I think that it's not really him, as he is rather easy to get along with.  Instead, it seems to be more that he is a constant reminder of my own body, and I don't really want to be talking or thinking about my gender when I'm doing things that actually help get my mind off of it.  Because of this I have a tendency to avoid him, and I feel like an ass for doing that.

Does anyone else have this issue around other trans guys?  I know that I would feel bad if I knew someone was avoiding me because of my gender, but I don't know what would be a better approach.

I have this issue more with cisguys, especially gay ones.

With other transguys I do I guess get a little uncomfortable, but it's mostly because I too often get distracted with thoughts of removing clothing and comparing notes. :P

I can't say that I am uncomfortable around other transguys, but the few that I know IRL are a lot younger than me and have socialisation/partying as a priority in their lives.  I just am not into that and thus don't have much in common with them.  But as for reminding me of my trans-ness - they don't really - I guess they might if I hung around them more.

Its kinda weird...I do feel a little uncomfortable around other transguys. There is this guy at a gym I used to go to who was trans but not 'out' I just didnt want to get too strong a connection to him.

I guess we all just want to be considered as 'regular guys' and just blend in.

Its a difficult issue thats for sure....

I am not uncomfortable around anyone any gender i don't worry or reflect how i look and feel by looking at others as we are all diffrent in many ways

My therapist is a Transguy and so was the lawyer that did my name change and I wasn't uncomfrtable with either of them, but they're the only ones that I know.

I guess theres pretty much 2 groups of transgenders.

the ones who are pretty "out and proud" openly trans,
and the ones who are more to fit in and live a "normal kind of life"

whatever I feel confortable or unconfortable around transgender people depends on the person, but do think the first 2 groups of people dosent tend to be mixed together very well..

just my exepriense. and maybe its something like that our facing?

With like-minded trans dudes I'm okay, but I hate the "out and proud" ones I've come across because they've all outed me when I've requested them NOT TO. Can't stand the disrespect.

Since I don't personally know any IRL it's kind of hard to say. Occasionally when I'm out and about I'll see another dude and kind of wonder if he's trans. But I really don't want to assume and I have a hard time distinguishing different types. Like I've seen lesbians (that I know or have talked to) that look exactly like a trans guy. That's no disrespect to either party but it would be kinda impossible for me to tell in some situations. There was one time I was in Whole Foods and I kept noticing this guy looking at me. It made me kinda uncomfortable after awhile. I didn't know if he was trans or what, but anyone kind of staring at you tends to make you feel uncomfortable anyway. I don't think if I actually knew or met other trans guys they would make me uncomfortable just talking with them or being around them.

Quote from: insideontheoutside on April 21, 2012, 07:53:24 PM
There was one time I was in Whole Foods and I kept noticing this guy looking at me.

Did you consider the possibility he found you attractive?

Quote from: Zerro on April 21, 2012, 04:47:33 PM
With like-minded trans dudes I'm okay, but I hate the "out and proud" ones I've come across

Okay, I think this might be part of the issue.  People generally think I'm a girl, so outing me isn't exactly a problem.  However, I'd just prefer for gender stuff to not be a part of the conversation...

I guess it just bothers me that out of all people he seems to be the one who treats me as something other than just another guy.

I'm not really in my local trans community anymore because, frankly, I seem to have less in common with those guys than with cis guys. But I especially struggled with my conflicted feelings about a trans guy who was pre-transition. Sometimes I would get mixed up because it was like he was living a double life. He was male to me and a few other folks, but female to everyone else. Being out in public with him was weird because I had to suddenly start labeling him as female, so I avoided pronouns whenever possible. I frequently wished he would just transition already--and I know that's not fair. He had his reasons for not transitioning (yet). We're not really friends anymore, so...well, problem solved. I was pretty hurt about losing him as a friend, actually, but I can be philosophical about it now.

I have another trans friend I've been sort of getting fed up with lately, but it's more because he's scatty and unreliable and, for the past nine months or so, has been taking much more than he's been giving. I also get tired of hearing him complain about being called "she" occasionally when he isn't willing to correct people. Or people will "she" him after they find out he's trans, and that bugs him. I figure that if you're going to be openly trans, you have to take the bad with the good, and live with your decisions. Sure, it sucks that people suddenly switch pronouns when they find out. But then it's your job to CORRECT them; otherwise, they'll just keep on doing it. So either do something about it or deal with it--or be stealth and correct the odd person who uses the wrong pronoun.

Sometimes I'll be socializing with a trans guy I see every few months, and I'll suddenly become acutely aware that he isn't a "regular guy." That freaks me out a bit. It shouldn't matter, but it does because I am tapping into my own Pinocchio complex. I want to be a "real boy" with typical equipment, and this guy can make me more aware that I'm not.

Not really. I usually feel more at ease around guys like me.

I do get kinda nervous if he is not as masculine as I am for fear that I will make him feel less manly.

Interesting topic; I was going to make one like this myself. I met up with a guy my age (only two weeks younger) earlier this week to catch up and share experiences, and it was just awkward and generally uncomfortable for me.

I mean, he was nice enough, but I just felt odd. He didn't know nearly as much as I do, and he wasn't respectful when talking about other trans people in the community he attends either. I'm not sure if this is because I have trouble connecting with trans guys, or if it's just my usual trouble connecting with young people. :P I really don't have the same priorities or goals as teenagers in general, and his talking about clubbing and 'getting ->-bleeped-<--faced' and whatnot just really left me feeling alienated.

I had thought being trans would kind of tie us together -shared experiences and all that jazz- but it just wasn't so. I guess just having one thing in common with a person really isn't enough to base a relationship on, and I think that forgetting that and expecting to find some sort of connection, and then not, could be the root of this problem.

Quote from: Bane on April 24, 2012, 06:17:38 AM
Interesting topic; I was going to make one like this myself. I met up with a guy my age (only two weeks younger) earlier this week to catch up and share experiences, and it was just awkward and generally uncomfortable for me.

I mean, he was nice enough, but I just felt odd. He didn't know nearly as much as I do, and he wasn't respectful when talking about other trans people in the community he attends either. I'm not sure if this is because I have trouble connecting with trans guys, or if it's just my usual trouble connecting with young people. :P I really don't have the same priorities or goals as teenagers in general, and his talking about clubbing and 'getting ->-bleeped-<--faced' and whatnot just really left me feeling alienated.

I had thought being trans would kind of tie us together -shared experiences and all that jazz- but it just wasn't so. I guess just having one thing in common with a person really isn't enough to base a relationship on, and I think that forgetting that and expecting to find some sort of connection, and then not, could be the root of this problem.

for me it dosent sound like a good start either, to talk behind others back of the trans comunety, specially if he dosent know your well, the trans comunety is pretty small so there could be a great risk you where apart and knew the people he where mention, maybe you where friends with them..
its not that clever of him ;)..

anyway, your right, just because we are trans dosent nessesarry mean we fit together,
I do feel I am able to connect with many trans people because, yeah we have stuff in common, but we are all people with diffrent personalety and opinons and some of them are people we like and some arn't. it counts for all people, if we where a group of shopping girls, if we where a group of black men, if we where a group of people interesteed in cars.

Quote from: Bane on April 24, 2012, 06:17:38 AM
I had thought being trans would kind of tie us together -shared experiences and all that jazz- but it just wasn't so. I guess just having one thing in common with a person really isn't enough to base a relationship on, and I think that forgetting that and expecting to find some sort of connection, and then not, could be the root of this problem.

I do run into this problem sometimes. I'll go to a trans event and be confused at the not-always-harmonious interactions, and then I remind myself that lol we have ONE thing in common, and that doesn't guarantee we'll have anything else in common. :P

Quote from: dalebert on April 22, 2012, 08:16:02 AM
Did you consider the possibility he found you attractive?

Didn't seem like that kind of "checking out" ... it went on for awhile and it felt different to me, then of course the more I noticed it, the more I noticed the guy might also be trans, but didn't want to make any judgements.

Even when people are obviously checking me out it makes me uncomfortable anyway, so either way, uncomfortable, yeah.

I tend to be just as likely to have a hard time with a trans guy as with a cis guy. Read: I probably won't become close friends but can make conversation.
There have been FTMs I couldn't stand, and FTMs who I have adored. I'm in a serious long-term relationship with one.
It really depends on personality, like with anyone else.
I will admit I sometimes get jealous of guys who pass better, or feel worried about getting outed by hanging with FTMs or MTFs who are clearly trans, but I cope because if it's someone I like enough to bother spending time with, they are worth it.

I guess because i'm stealth i feel severely uncomfortable hanging around 'out and proud' trans guys, i know there's nothing wrong with them and they can be great people, but my own paranoia gets in the mix. i don't like the idea of people knowing about me, prefer to just blend in and so the thought of hanging around openly trans people makes me worried that i may be outed.
as for trans people in general, i consider men as men, i wont feel uncomfortable by the fact that he's trans, that doesn't even make sense. it'll be as stupid to me as feeling uncomfortable around a cis guy. its just the very open ones i stray away from so that i don't get outed.

I don't think other trans-people make me uncomfortable per-say...but while I'm in the gender clinic waiting room or within close proximity with other trans people I do get a weird sensation of "eehehehe omg that dude has a vagina!/that woman has a penis!" (or used to, in some cases) and it seems like the strangest thing in the world. Even though I'm one of them. I hope I don't offend anyone with this post, that's not my intention.

I got pretty weirded out when I saw someone in the pub once who might have been a trans woman, but I was in a very strange mindset at the time.  It was a mix of emotions that was being unsure of whether she was trans or not, and then if she was, part of me wanting to pour everything out to her, part of me wanting her to suspect that I was (I'm always read as female at work and that's all the other staff know me as) and part of me wanting to run a million miles away.  I don't think I exchanged more than about two sentences with her though.

My ex has discovered since breaking up with me that they're trans* of some description, I don't know whether they ID as female, nothing or both, and I'm not entirely sure they know either.  Part of the reason I don't know is because I don't want to talk to them about being trans, I try to ignore it as much as possible and just be a person and think of gender as little as possible while still knowing that I'm male.

I don't know any trans guys though.

I really don't interact with other transguys since the somewhat biggest community near me is 1,5h train trip away so I'm pretty much "the one and only" I know. :P

But I've been in meetings and I've always felt kinda uncomfortable or awkward, at least. I think it's because I'm stressing about my appearance, especially since I'm pre-everything, and whether or not all the "equipment" looks okay (aka binder and packer).
In other words, I'm worried if the other transguys think I pass for a guy.

And of course everyone else looks so much more likely pass than me so it's really not helping.
I'd have to fix my own thoughts about this. :laugh:

I've only met one other trans person in my life so far; she was a complete bitch.

Made fun of me, and made my blood boil.
All I wanted to do was knock her in the damn face and point out everything about her that was manly
just so she'd feel as dysphoric as she made me feel...

But I was at work, so I nicely took all the insults she had to throw at me...

-

Right now, my girlfriend is the only trans individual I'd hang out with.

Update: And Jason(JasonRX) xP

While I'm not a trans guy, I have felt this way around other disabled people. Even though I'm in a wheelchair myself, I have no disabled friends and actively avoid becoming involved in the disabled community. I think this stems from a desire to feel normal, and that might play a role in what the OP is feeling.

If they are stealth and never mention it in public, I'm fine with it.  If they are super open in public about it, I don't want to associate, or hang out with them.  I have a friend who is trans but he is stealth and we only talk about things regarding our medical history in private. 

It really depends on the personality of the guy.

I can think of two people I recently met - surprisingly they both live somewhat close to me.

One is several years into his transition but is very vocal about things. I told him I wanted to keep things quiet about me and while he never actually outed me, he has made some comments in public that people could have heard..that kind of thing surely made me uncomfortable.

There's another guy I know who likes to (often) talk about the girl's jeans he wears. I never see the point of why he brings it up. It's kind of like I'm a man, GRRR! But look at these jeans, I bought them in the girl's department, ;D I'm not trying to make fun of this person but he has said such things..He lets people call him his birth name& use female pronouns while I stick to his male name and pronouns. It's definitely uncomfortable for me. I really don't care what clothes people wear but..he always wants to bring it up when I don't care to talk about clothing..

There's one other guy I met awhile back though he always acted like I was much younger than him& therefore didn't know as much about trans-things. I was put off by it.

I think if I met a trans man whose personality I fit with, I'd be fine.

I think I'm better off with those born anatomically male or stealth-y guys as most times I don't want to think about being trans anymore than necessary..and the guys I've met thus far want to bring it up often.

Quote from: Jayr on August 15, 2012, 11:45:17 AM
I've only met one other trans person in my life so far; she was a complete bitch.

Made fun of me, and made my blood boil.
All I wanted to do was knock her in the damn face and point out everything about her that was manly
just so she'd feel as dysphoric as she made me feel...

But I was at work, so I nicely took all the insults she had to throw at me...

-

Right now, my girlfriend is the only trans individual I'd hang out with.

*cough* and Jason(JasonRX). :3

I'm pretty much the opposite of what a lot of people have posted here. I don't feel awkward at all around other trans people. I actually feel more comfortable around them. However, I didn't really like the few times I've been around "stealth" types irl (which is rare since they seem to avoid the lgbt community). The whole mentality of "wanting to be 'normal'" and that there's something wrong with being trans irritates me and makes me feel like I should be disgusted with myself or something. So I guess, again, the opposite of this thread in that I prefer to be around trans people who are either "out and proud" or who are comfortable with themselves as trans people.

Quote from: Berserk on August 15, 2012, 05:58:02 PM
I'm pretty much the opposite of what a lot of people have posted here. I don't feel awkward at all around other trans people. I actually feel more comfortable around them. However, I didn't really like the few times I've been around "stealth" types irl (which is rare since they seem to avoid the lgbt community). The whole mentality of "wanting to be 'normal'" and that there's something wrong with being trans irritates me and makes me feel like I should be disgusted with myself or something. So I guess, again, the opposite of this thread in that I prefer to be around trans people who are either "out and proud" or who are comfortable with themselves as trans people.

I don't see why.  I'm comfortable with myself, but I don't want to go around having conversations about my medical history or letting it be known to others what my medical history happens to be.

Quote from: Berserk on August 15, 2012, 05:58:02 PM
I'm pretty much the opposite of what a lot of people have posted here. I don't feel awkward at all around other trans people. I actually feel more comfortable around them. However, I didn't really like the few times I've been around "stealth" types irl (which is rare since they seem to avoid the lgbt community). The whole mentality of "wanting to be 'normal'" and that there's something wrong with being trans irritates me and makes me feel like I should be disgusted with myself or something. So I guess, again, the opposite of this thread in that I prefer to be around trans people who are either "out and proud" or who are comfortable with themselves as trans people.

In my opinion, a trans person who "out and proud" is just as annoying as someone who constantly goes on about what exactly is in their pants. I think it's silly and don't know how having the wrong parts is something to ever be proud of. It's kind of like a guy pointing out how huge his penis is all of the time just so he can draw some attention to himself.

I go to a trans center. My counselor is a transguy. I feel pretty comfortable there, but I haven't socialized with transguys. Many of them are younger than I am, so I wouldn't have all that much in common, but I enjoy hanging around at the center.

I've only gone out once in the general public. There were about 10 of us (also a transgal or two) from the center at a city event. No one pointed anyone out. I felt totally fine with it. But it would have been awkward if anyone pointed anyone out or outed anyone. I am not "out" as trans. So I guess I figured no one else is.

--Jay Jay

Online I'm okay talking to other people who are trans, but I could never do it in real life without feeling uncomfortable. I want to be stealth, I don't want people to know. I feel like if I associate with other trans people, I will be disrespected and outed and people will associate me with them when I just want to be left alone.

It's interesting that most people here are uncomfortable being around "out and proud" trans guys, yet those people are obviously around.  Makes me wonder if they feel the need to talk about being trans a lot in real life because they don't have somewhere online like here to talk about it.

I'm actually dating a trans guy right now.  He's pre T and out.  Tbh sometimes both of those facts bother me, but I really care about him so I've learned to look past it.  He does plan on getting on T very soon which we are both happy about.  I wonder if he'll be more private about his trans status as he begins to pass better.  I'm really not sure and I don't know if he knows either.

It's mostly in public when I'm uncomfortable talking about his trans stuff.  I don't discuss my medical history in public unless it's very subtle and/or I know no one else will hear or understand.

Going to trans meet ups and making friends with trans people is very difficult for me.  I think as long as the person was "stealth" and didn't discuss it in public, I wouldn't have an issue being around them. 

Quote from: Alex000000 on August 15, 2012, 08:18:53 PM
It's interesting that most people here are uncomfortable being around "out and proud" trans guys, yet those people are obviously around.  Makes me wonder if they feel the need to talk about being trans a lot in real life because they don't have somewhere online like here to talk about it.

No, that's not it all. I live with and have lived with other trans people both currently and in the past. I actively seek out trans community irl because I'm far more comfortable around that community. In fact, I feel more comfortable there than online community because trans community irl tends to be more trans-positive. I started participating in trans forums online just because I'm used to internet forums (for other purposes) and also find it a good place if I want to ask about something that I don't feel like bringing up in a random discussion with trans friends/acquaintances irl, since I find its more likely to find a variety of suggestions and reviews online than asking one or two people irl.

I also wonder about this stereotype floating around here about trans people who are "out" and not wanting to live stealth constantly talking about "what's in their pants" and trans stuff in general. It's so unrealistic its almost funny. To me when I talk about people who are "out and proud" I'm talking about activists or people involved in the trans/queer community in some way.

Quote from: Andy8715 on August 15, 2012, 06:16:42 PM
I don't see why.  I'm comfortable with myself, but I don't want to go around having conversations about my medical history or letting it be known to others what my medical history happens to be.

I guess it depends on what you see as your "medical history." I don't see being trans so much as my "medical history" as my personal history and a part of who I am. It's a part of my identity as a person. Does that mean I'm going to go to the grocery store and shout it out for all to hear for no particular reason? No. But I will participate in community and help further trans awareness and rights where I can, and I certainly won't hide it and try to pretend to be cis when the subject comes up. I personally despise this whole cis as "healthy and normal" and trans as a "disorder" thing. That's why I am uncomfortable around "stealth" trans people irl when the occasion does arise.

Quote from: JasonRX on August 15, 2012, 06:35:14 PM
In my opinion, a trans person who "out and proud" is just as annoying as someone who constantly goes on about what exactly is in their pants. I think it's silly and don't know how having the wrong parts is something to ever be proud of. It's kind of like a guy pointing out how huge his penis is all of the time just so he can draw some attention to himself.

Uh yeah, you're analogy makes little sense whatsoever. Being trans and out about it has nothing to do with informing the world about "what exactly is in their pants." A lot of trans and intersexed activism is about denormalizing the cis myth.

If being trans wasn't a disorder, or medical we wouldn't be using surgery and hormones and going through doctors to treat it.

Every day at Susans I read "If someone has a problem with who I am, or how I present, it is THEIR problem." It seems to apply here as well.

I actually don't hang out with too many trans men and the other day I hung out with this cool trans guy. He did make me feel dysphoric (unfortunately) as many trans men seem to do without intending to. It was a matter of where he was physically in his transition vs amount of time on hormones compared to my situation.

Quote from: Berserk on August 15, 2012, 08:43:27 PM


Uh yeah, you're analogy makes little sense whatsoever. Being trans and out about it has nothing to do with informing the world about "what exactly is in their pants." A lot of trans and intersexed activism is about denormalizing the cis myth.

Actually, being "trans proud" has everything to do with sex organs and breaking the norm of what is expected of what's normally in the pants of that gender role. Anyway, it is just my opinion though and your response with "uh yeah" at the beginning is kind of rude and unwarranted.

Quote from: JasonRX on August 15, 2012, 06:35:14 PM
I think it's silly and don't know how having the wrong parts is something to ever be proud of.

That particular way of describing it was jarring for me. I probably would have said something like "parts that are out of alignment with societal expectations for one's perceived gender" instead of "wrong". Wrong is very subjective.

Quote from: dalebert on August 16, 2012, 01:25:55 AM
That particular way of describing it was jarring for me. I probably would have said something like "parts that are out of alignment with societal expectations for one's perceived gender" instead of "wrong". Wrong is very subjective.

Again, I did make sure to add that it was part of my opinion, and honestly, I do think that's the correct word for my feelings on the subject.

To answer the OP: I don't really know any trans folks in real life save for one of my old patients, but I thought she was just a sweetheart. Would I feel awkward? If they were weird, sure. If they were normal, then no. I tend to get along fine with most people. I don't make it a habit to associate with one type of person over the other. If I like someone, I don't really care what their gender/genital status is. I think its fine if someone is out and proud trans or stealth, and again, as long as they weren't jerks or creepers, we would probably get along fine.

I did get in touch with other trans guys through my therapist and we talked a few times, but I couldn't stand them. They were ... we had different opinions on what was important. They were so focused on being trans and everything that it entailed. Its just another part of my life to me, and I have navigated it just fine for 25 years. I have more in my life than my gender/genital disagreements. They were also a little elitist in that since I wasn't so horrified every day about my body that I couldn't do anything, I wasn't "trans enough". So if they were like that, I wouldn't want to talk to them. Not because they make me feel dysphoric or anything like that - I just can't stand uppity/hyper sensitive people.

It's interesting reading everyone's perspectives on this.  Since first posting this I have met several other trans guys who are not as out and proud, and I enjoy hanging out with them.  I think that rather than being around trans people, it was the talking about it that made me uncomfortable.  I just don't want to have my physical issues brought into my social life.

This thread makes me wonder what role visibility has in societal acceptance? I think that this is a very important discussion.

What's the parallel between  "looking for attention" and "talking about what is in their pants" and homophobic comments like "keep it to yourself" and "no need to wear your sexuality on your sleeve" like it's something to be ashamed of and hide?

Or is there no connection at all because the goal for most trans people is to be stealth?

Is social acceptance even important when it's just a "medical condition"?   How does this tie-in with violence against trans people and  things like judges refusing name changes when they know it's for a transition and over-all discrimination and marginalization? Who is responsible for helping to break it down and prevent it and work towards real change?

I personally don't have a clue where I stand on all this - my knee-jerk reaction is to think people should keep personal business to themselves much like the opinion JasonRX is expressing, but what is the lasting impact of that? Do we have any responsibility to "come out" much like gay people have over-time to work towards normalization?

I cringed at Chaz Bono and hated that he put himself out there as the face for all trans people. Should I have? Isn't it better that someone is talking about it at all? To have that conversation and highlight the prejudice inherent in a lot of people's first opinions about trans people?

I mean, ultimately I guess it does to come down to personal choice and people that want to be activists should do it and people who want to be stealth should do so. But would all trans people be better off in the future if more people were open about it?

^ THIS.

This is what I have been trying to say, in a number of places, for ages. But I couldn't find the words and you hit it on the head as far as I am concerned.

I have some issues being around people who, as transmen, live as if they are different from any man. In my own transition, all I have ever wanted is just to be one of the guys. But have never been able to, until I got a bit into T. Now that I am getting closer to just being me, who is a man, I crave that normalcy even more.

BUT I do think I may have some insight into the questions you posed, at least if we are comparing gay and trans. The challenge is that many people promote a politics of difference. That being gay or lesbian is somehow different than being straight. At the end of the day, it isn't - in my opinion, we need to promote the notion that love is simply love, regardless of the sex and/or gender of those involved. Similarly, a transman is no different from any other man, barring some socialization, extra challenges, and other experiences.

But it's a hard line to walk sometimes.

Quote from: spacerace on August 16, 2012, 07:05:26 PM
homophobic comments like "no need to wear your sexuality on your sleeve" like it's something to be ashamed of and hide?

I don't believe that is a homophobic comment.  Sexuality isn't something you have to hide, but what relevance is it in 99% of interactions?

Quote from: Andy8715 on August 16, 2012, 11:46:43 PM
I don't believe that is a homophobic comment.  Sexuality isn't something you have to hide, but what relevance is it in 99% of interactions?

I should have emphasized my point clearer - I was referring to when people jeer at same sex couples holding hands and make those comments. Or when people see others they believe to be gay out in public and make those comments.  "Keep your business in your bedroom"  "They should keep their sexuality to themselves instead of flaunting it".   These comments tend to mean gay people should be shameful and hide their deviance. Remember just under half the country thinks gay people shouldn't even have the right to marry.

Edit:  I know comparing these comments to disliking openly trans guy talking about their gender and transition is a bit of a hyperbole to say the least. But how much talking about it is okay? Do we need to talk about it?

What about when closeted gay people used to dislike it when other gay people around them came out because it they felt it could have compromised their own position and drew unwanted attention? Is that not the exact same conversation we are having now when we talk about people needing to keep their business to themselves? Think about this in context of how much better it is now overall in terms of acceptance for gay people once more and more people came out publicly and can now be comfortable without fear of "being found out".

Now, it's relevant because visibility is one of those things that eventually breaks down the barriers and helps work towards acceptance. What may or may not be relevant is whether or not this even applicable to trans people choosing not to be stealth to dismantle transphobia by exposure. What other ways are there? Is it even important? That's the real question.

I don't know how to resolve this, by the way. Additionally, being around other trans people does make me uncomfortable and super-aware of my own shortcomings.I get flustered and awkward. Also, my goal is to be stealth so I don't have to worry about being trans defining me in every social situation.

However - I can't help but think hiding and normalizing ourselves into the gender binary perpetuates targeted trans violence, transphobia in general,  people's revulsion and mis-understandings. Hiding doesn't solve workplace discrimination, legal barriers to name/gender marker/birth certificate change, health insurance denials. If even we are bothered by being around other trans people and think it's something to keep hidden and locked away, how can we ever expect any of the above to change?

I'm not calling anyone out by the way, I'm more just rambling at my own cowardice without implying it applies to anyone else. I'm especially not telling anyone that they shouldn't define it as a medical condition that is being treated and resolved. I also know that being stealth is crucial to safety in many circumstances, and that most people just want to transition and get on with their lives.

I think the problem is one only one person is out, like Chaz. It seems like a display almost. If there were thousands of people out it would be like being gay. No one would think that much about it. Of course, that's the person's decision. I am not out.

--Jay Jay

Trans people who are uncomfortable around other trans people are uncomfortable with themselves, IMO.

Another thing, without those "out and proud" people, most of us would never have realized that transition is possible. We still don't have equal rights in most states and we certainly aren't going to obtain equality if all of us are stealth.

Quote from: Chamillion on August 21, 2012, 03:23:13 PM
Trans people who are uncomfortable around other trans people are uncomfortable with themselves, IMO.

No, I just don't feel my medical condition is something to go around blurting out and don't want to hang out with people who thinking it is.

I'm perfectly fine with hanging out with guys who don't mention their history unless in private.

Quote from: Andy8715 on August 21, 2012, 03:29:13 PM
No, I just don't feel my medical condition is something to go around blurting out and don't want to hang out with people who thinking it is.

I'm perfectly fine with hanging out with guys who don't mention their history unless in private.

^This.

I do not befriend people based solely on whether or not they're trans. It doesn't make me a horrible person or someone who's insecure in himself. I just don't like to be around "out and proud" people. It's not my cup of tea.

I only really consider one guy at the trans center a friend. I like hanging around with them there, but I don't feel any desire to hang out with them otherwise. I think I'd just call them acquaintances that I see in a certain context and not others. Some of them are much younger than I am, and I find the age difference in real life is more of a border than their trans status. Somehow the age difference doesn't make a difference on line.

--Jay Jay

Quote from: Andy8715 on August 21, 2012, 03:29:13 PM
No, I just don't feel my medical condition is something to go around blurting out and don't want to hang out with people who thinking it is.

I'm perfectly fine with hanging out with guys who don't mention their history unless in private.

Just seeing this now, apologies.

I feel the same way, I don't mention my trans status if it's not relevant, and 99% of the time it's not. I'm as out with it as I am about my heritage being mostly British... meaning I don't hide it but it doesn't come up all that much. I just didn't understand the ideas in this thread that all out trans people are constantly talking about it and outing people, I wouldn't want to hang out with someone like that either. My point was only that if someone is uncomfortable around a known trans person, then they are insecure in themselves. So clearly that isn't you, because you don't have an issue being around other trans people, you just don't like being around annoying people.

Quote from: Lee on April 21, 2012, 02:48:40 AM
I dance in an LGBT group, and there is one guy there whom I talk to from time to time.  He is the only other trans person I interact with regularly, and I find myself becoming more and more uncomfortable around him. 

I think that it's not really him, as he is rather easy to get along with.  Instead, it seems to be more that he is a constant reminder of my own body, and I don't really want to be talking or thinking about my gender when I'm doing things that actually help get my mind off of it.  Because of this I have a tendency to avoid him, and I feel like an ass for doing that.

Does anyone else have this issue around other trans guys?  I know that I would feel bad if I knew someone was avoiding me because of my gender, but I don't know what would be a better approach.

Have you tried talking to him and telling him how you feel? ???