Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Okay here is a voice clip. I don't think my voice has changed since the last time I posted a voice clip though. Does it pass as male? Does my voice go either way, male or female? It is normal for my voice to be this high still on T  over a year later?

Voice Clip (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmlvszGH7eE#)

Hate to burst your bubble but your voice sounds like a teen age boy.

You voice passes as male completely.

It sounds male, if I heard it I wouldn't question it. I don't know if you sing, but it sounds like a male alto-tenor.

--Jay Jay

Quote from: LordKAT on June 02, 2012, 02:54:18 PM
Hate to burst your bubble but your voice sounds like a teen age boy.

I agree.
I actually couldn't read that voice as anything other than the average teenage boy which actually could be a good and bad thing for Dominick.
The good thing is the voice is totally male, but the bad thing is that Dominick is not teenaged. Now that I think of it, he doesn't exactly look anywhere near his actual age either though....hmm.

Dominick
I'm going to ask a question that I don't think anyone has, but do you frequent groups of people that look more like what your actual age is? If you do, I think that can play a part in you getting misgendered - females tend to look younger and if you have a softer, more teenaged face, and are around a bunch of thirty year old men, in comparison to them, others may assume you're either a girl rather than just some random young boy that they're walking around with.
  Also, as I said many times before, your confidence levels likely have something to do with it too.

Thanks guys.

@LordKAT: It's okay if I sound like a teenage boy. I hope in time it will get deeper, but as long as I sound male I'm okay with that for now.

@JasonRX: "do you frequent groups of people that look more like what your actual age is?"

Not really. I only have like 2 friends. One of my friends is 30 like me, he's like 5'6 or something I'm not sure of his height, and my other friend is like 36 I think and he's a tall guy. Everyone is short compared to him. I don't see him too much though b/c he's always working and he doesn't live near me. I usually just hang out with my one friend on Fridays. He's doesn't look 30 either. He can pass for a guy in his early 20's. 

@aleon515: Thanks. I don't sing, but I wish I could.

@Casey: My cousin who is 15 gets female sometimes over the phone and he hates that. But to me his voice doesn't sound female at all over the phone or in person.

@Malachite: Thanks.

I'm going to be honest and none of this is meant to be offensive; take from it what you will.  You sound like a very, very young guy OR a younger woman with a bad cold.  Personally, I think your voice sounds very nasally, coming from higher up than it should and some voice training/coaching would likely be beneficial for you.  A lot trans guys have that problem.  I think it's because they keep trying to talk in their old, higher range (I'm occasionally guilty of this myself, especially when talking to children).

Don't get discouraged.  In the grand scheme of things, you haven't been on T that long.  It's about 2.5 years for me and I'm still changing.  First puberty takes a lot longer than 1-2 years.  Give your body some time to adjust and develop with the T.

@Adio: It's cool. People have told me I have that nasally sound to my voice. I think it's been mentioned here on the board too when I posted a voice clip before. Thank you for your honesty.

You sound 110% male to me - but definitely like someone who's in their late teens/early twenties as the oldest, and sort of like you have a cold.

I can see how your voice could sound female on the phone, especially if you're talking faster - but honestly, there's no way I would read your voice as anything but male without you taking it up half an octave (which, again, usually happens on the phone). In the clip you have some female inflections (as most trans guys do), which can be hard to get rid of. Talking to a voice coach about helping you to be less nasally and working on your inflections should help you quite a bit.

@Cameron James: Thanks. I have no idea where to find a voice coach and have no money to spend on that. I just hope in time that it will get deeper. I can start practicing talking from a different part of my throat. I just have to remember to do that. I forget a lot of the times or my voices goes back it fourth between my normal speaking voice and trying to talk from a different part of my throat.

You sound like a teenage boy to me, but some women have voices that are similar. However, I notice that your esses sound very sibilant, and that is a trait usually associated with women. A lot of trans guys I've met have pronounced esses, which is probably one reason they are read as gay.

It's funny. In the crowd I used to run with, the straight trans men were often read as gay, whereas the gay ones came across as straight (including me). I've speculated that it has to do with the people we used to keep company with. The straight guys were former lesbians and often spent all of their personal lives around women, whereas the gay guys tended to spend most of their time with men.

Anyway, I'm not sure whether the esses were more pronounced because of the equipment you were recording with. And I'm not sure of the remedy if it's your current vocal pattern.

You also have quite a few hesitations, but many people do that when they are recording themselves or leaving a message; they don't feel completely comfortable and have a lot of gaps in their speech. But that type of pattern tends to come across as tentative, and I would be more likely to read it as female rather than as male.

@Arch: Thanks. I'm not sure what you mean with the esses but It's cool. I was using my ipod b/c it's the easiest to upload and I can't afford a chip or whatever for my camcorder.

Yeah, the hesitations was b/c it's kinda weird talking to a camera and I wasn't sure exactly what to say.

But the thing to me is that these traits shouldn't matter b/c I should look completely male over a year on T or have masculized in some way and I haven't. Every person I've seen on this site and on youtube has changed on T in just a couple of months, with a few exceptions. T has not masculinized me in any way. When you got more than 10 people telling you that you look exactly the same as you did pre-T, something is wrong, and I'm upset cause I'm losing my hair and getting hair in unwanted places for nothing. If T was working I wouldn't be so upset about that.

Quote from: Dominick_81 on June 03, 2012, 07:56:27 PM
But the thing to me is that these traits shouldn't matter b/c I should look completely male over a year on T or have masculized in some way and I haven't. Every person I've seen on this site and on youtube has changed on T in just a couple of months, with a few exceptions. T has not masculinized me in any way. When you got more than 10 people telling you that you look exactly the same as you did pre-T, something is wrong, and I'm upset cause I'm losing my hair and getting hair in unwanted places for nothing. If T was working I wouldn't be so upset about that.

Honestly I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall when I reply to you because after you just keep saying the same things as before.  I and a few others have said that a year and a half on T is nothing, it's a drop in the bucket.  There are guys out there who didn't experience changes till way more time on T.  My changes aren't even that great and I'm over a year and a half on T.  Puberty takes time, as in years.  It sounds like it's time to re-evaluate why you are still on T, if you are this unhappy with it and think about stopping T.  I feel there is no reason to keep taking it if you get no changes you like and all changes you get you hate. 

Another thing, you keep saying "T should have done this by X time" but the truth is that no it shouldn't have.  There is no timeline of what should happen by when.  That T will automatically make miraculous changes to a person super quickly is a myth and fantasy that a large portion of the trans community sadly believes to be true.

@Andy8715: the thing is now it's  too late to get off T b/c the hair won't stop growing it will only grow at a slower rate, so I almost don't see the point of going off T since the negative effects are irriverseable.

The only reason I believe changes should happen by an x amount of time is b/c that's what I've  seen on YouTube. I'm just frustrated b/c I want changes to happen now b/c no one takes me seriously as a guy and no one treats me like a guy. If I had changes and looked like a boy I would hope that I would get treated like a guy from my family. They make no effort to use the right pronouns or to call me Dominick. I thought if I was able to grow a decent beard or something they would have no choice but to call me Dominick. Also, my family is teaching my 1 year old  cousin to call me by my female name.

Quote from: Dominick_81 on June 04, 2012, 12:39:57 AM
the thing is now it's  too late to get off T b/c the hair won't stop growing it will only grow at a slower rate, so I almost don't see the point of going off T since the negative effects are irriverseable.

I'm sorry, Dominick, but if this is really how you look at the situation, then perhaps you should see a therapist or something to talk about your personal issues. It sounds like you're not even sure why you started testosterone. As for me, I started testosterone because I wasn't okay with my body being controlled by female hormones and needed that to change. For a lot of people, going through this process is a "do or die" decision and you seem to shrug it off as it really doesn't matter either way. You're so easily dissuaded that you're not changing as fast as everyone else does, but I'm also sure there are other people who experience changes as slow as you and some of these people might even be men that were born into the right body. Essentially, you're going through puberty again and the process takes different time for everyone as all have already said. Also, before starting HRT, you should have been aware you don't get to pick and choose the changes you get - it's all based on genetic pre-dispostion and how receptive to testosterone your body may be. I think to assume you would only get changes you like is another reason you might need to see a therapist, because you keep stating that point over and over, and it's really unrealistic thinking. Also, your self-confidence isn't too stellar.

If this comes off too harsh, I apologize, but I think it needed to be said one way or another. You obviously have other issues going on.

@JasonRX: I do see a counselor and she knows all this stuff. I knew before starting T that I didn't get to pick and choose what changes I get. But watching youtube videos I'd assume I would change on T, but I was wrong. I'm not gonna go off T b/c I really want changes and going off T will make the fat distribution back  to female and I don't want that. I don't want a female body. I just hope in time my changes will eventually come.

Sounds like you didn't do enough research before starting T.  I've felt frustrated by the fact that my changes didn't come as fast as I wanted them to, but for me T is necessary.  I can't live a live in a body filled with female hormones.

If you want your family and those who know you to refer to you and treat you in a certain way you have to stand up for yourself.  Tell them what's what.  You can't take such a passive stance and expect them to magically change.

Quote from: Dominick_81 on June 04, 2012, 01:11:53 PM
But watching youtube videos I'd assume I would change on T, but I was wrong.

Perhaps it's time to stop watching youtube videos.

@Andy8715: I guess I didn't do enough research.

I'd get yelled at if I told my family to call me Dominick and treat me like a man. Their not accepting in that way. I have to deal with them not accepting me until I can move out and away from them.

@Casey: Thanks Casey for understanding my frustrations. I keep thinking that too all the time, "maybe in few months I will pass",and I don't and so on.

@Adio: Yeah, I gotta stop doing that. I did stop for a while, but started up again.

I still wish you all the best, Dominick, but you really can't fear being "yelled" at. I come from a family that if I stood up to myself when I was a kid, I'd get beaten down in a second (if it was going into "sassing" territory or not "respecting authority" territory) but I came out and still stand up to my mother when she calls me my birth name. I don't live with them, no, and I understand that you live with or near your family and that makes it more difficult, but you really need to establish some kind of emotional ground there.. for better or worse

Also, I feel like you have changed a bit on T... You still haven't taken pics from the same angle as your pre-T ones, but I still see a few years of age in regards to your appearance in this year on T.

I don't know what to say, but I really do - again - wish you all the best. I didn't hear your voice clip though, so I cannot tell you whether I believe your voice passes or not.

I'm not on T because I didn't like changes and I don't want to lose my hair so some may think I'm a "faker" or a vain little prick but oh well, that's just me. I also know that passing 100% is very rare for me because I can't grow a beard (not that there's even some cis guys out there that can't grow beards but I have more and more of a hunch that's a big part of getting "ma'am'd").

If I were in your shoes and in spite of knowing you can't pick and choose changes, etc. I went on T and stuck it out for as long as you have with no really noticeable changes I'd feel pretty frustrated as well. I don't think you're "whining" or whatever, I think you're just frustrated. But like everyone says, "second" puberty takes a different amount of time for everyone. I think for FTM guys there's even more variables too. You're not starting from a "baseline" like a cis male, where the only thing that's getting activated is T. You have a body producing a crap load of E. I think in some cases it's like trying to reverse a freight train that's going full speed. You can't really. You have to slow down, stop, then start going in another direction - slowly.

Also, if you're in a situation where you haven't been able to get a job and you're stuck living under your family's roof, I don't think yelling/demanding they conform to your views on the matter is a good idea. I remember you posting that they were uber religious, etc. I think that would cause you more grief, so I say keep doing what you're doing there and keep looking for work so you can get the hell out of there and reboot your life.

As for the voice ... yeah it pretty much sounds like the last time you posted a clip. I'd say maybe on the phone I'd think you were a teenage guy. In person though, I'd think you were just a dude with a voice on the higher range. There's plenty of FTM guys I've seen (including some of the more well known guys who have been on T for a very long time) who just have naturally higher range voices. Maybe yours will drop more, maybe not but don't let that alone be the deal breaker for you. I think once you get out on your own you can build that confidence up to actually correct people when they misgender you.

@Hayzer12: Thanks. The thing is my mother can't talk about trans stuff for too long, it upsets her too much. And whenever there is company either at my grandmothers house or my house, they don't want anyone to know that I'm trans, their embarrassed and/or ashamed, I don't know. And another thing is, people in my family don't share secrets, so not everyone in my family knows I'm trans. I don't even know who knows I'm trans in my family. I think my immediate family knows though, but relatives that live in other states don't know and my mom and grandmother don't want them to know, it's a secret. If that got out, I'd be in trouble.

QuoteAlso, I feel like you have changed a bit on T... You still haven't taken pics from the same angle as your pre-T ones, but I still see a few years of age in regards to your appearance in this year on T.

Thank you. I forget what angel I take pics from and end up taking pics in the opposite angle, lol.

QuoteI don't know what to say, but I really do - again - wish you all the best. I didn't hear your voice clip though, so I cannot tell you whether I believe your voice passes or not.

Thanks. Yeah, I just took that down, I thought everyone was done listening to it.

@insideontheoutside: I totally understand about you not wanting to get on T b/c of hair lost and some other changes your not into. Losing my hair was one of the big things about not wanting to take T, but my solution to that is a wig. Hopefully no one will be able to tell I'm wearing a wig. I still freak out and worry about my hair loss. I worry everyday about it.

I'm sorry that it's hard for you to pass pre-t. I rarely passed pre-t too.

QuoteI don't think you're "whining" or whatever, I think you're just frustrated

Yes, this is true, I am very frustrated. Like I've said before, when people I haven't seen in years don't notice anything and tell me I look exactly the same, it's frustrating.

QuoteAlso, if you're in a situation where you haven't been able to get a job and you're stuck living under your family's roof, I don't think yelling/demanding they conform to your views on the matter is a good idea. I remember you posting that they were uber religious, etc. I think that would cause you more grief, so I say keep doing what you're doing there and keep looking for work so you can get the hell out of there and reboot your life.

My mom has told me that moving out would be the best thing, that way I could make a fresh new start where no one knows me as female. She says too many people know me here. I don't think too many people know my here though. My mom has told me many time she would never kick me out and I can stay and long as I want. But we both know moving out would be the best thing. But I can't seem to find a job and need repairs on my car that I can't afford so if I don't get a job soon to pay for the repairs my car has to come off the road and then my mom might have to sell my car.

QuoteAs for the voice ... yeah it pretty much sounds like the last time you posted a clip. I'd say maybe on the phone I'd think you were a teenage guy. In person though, I'd think you were just a dude with a voice on the higher range. There's plenty of FTM guys I've seen (including some of the more well known guys who have been on T for a very long time) who just have naturally higher range voices. Maybe yours will drop more, maybe not but don't let that alone be the deal breaker for you. I think once you get out on your own you can build that confidence up to actually correct people when they misgender you.

Yeah, it sucks it still hasn't got'n deeper since the last clip I posted months ago. The thing about my voice is that I don't want to be mistaken as a gay guy since my voice is still high. I really hope it gets deeper.

QuoteI think once you get out on your own you can build that confidence up to actually correct people when they misgender you.

I hope so.

I watched the Kentucky Derby on TV a couple of weeks ago. They went to interview one of the jockeys, and you know they're all small guys like yourself. When I finally heard his voice, I was like WOW, he sounds FTM, like his voice was still changing, or like his voice hadn't quite dropped all the way. He was just a small cis-dude. I am so used to hearing all the voice clips from all the boys on here, and he sounded JUST LIKE THAT. Just like you sound. And it's fine! You sound totally male. Young, but MALE!  :)

Quote from: Andy on June 05, 2012, 03:47:53 PM
He was just a small cis-dude.

How do you know?

<<How do you know?>>

Good point! I wonder if any of those jockey guys are FTM--! This was the guy who rode "I'll Have Another," who was the winner.

Quote from: Andy on June 05, 2012, 03:47:53 PM
I watched the Kentucky Derby on TV a couple of weeks ago. They went to interview one of the jockeys, and you know they're all small guys like yourself. When I finally heard his voice, I was like WOW, he sounds FTM, like his voice was still changing, or like his voice hadn't quite dropped all the way. He was just a small cis-dude. I am so used to hearing all the voice clips from all the boys on here, and he sounded JUST LIKE THAT. Just like you sound. And it's fine! You sound totally male. Young, but MALE!  :)

Thanks! :)

the way i see it, the changes may take time but think of it like this you lived your life (insert number of years here) without t so now you hve to keep pushing along. think of how happy and worth it itll allbe. try to be positive :) i hvent started mine yet so always try to remember youre one of the lucky ones. some people never even get to start them : stay positive friend. ps sorry for crappy typing.(dumb phone:p)

Quote from: AlexanderReese on June 10, 2012, 12:30:02 AM
the way i see it, the changes may take time but think of it like this you lived your life (insert number of years here) without t so now you hve to keep pushing along. think of how happy and worth it itll allbe. try to be positive :) i hvent started mine yet so always try to remember youre one of the lucky ones. some people never even get to start them : stay positive friend. ps sorry for crappy typing.(dumb phone:p)

Do you plan on taking T at some point?

I don't consider myself lucky being on T b/c of the negative effects, like hair loss, etc... I'm trying to stay positive though. One of my cousins did say I've changed on T and my counselor said I've changed too, but others say I look the same, so I'm kinda confused as to if I've changed or not on T...?