Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I have been on 2 for 2 years 2 months or so.  I feel like it is making me less intelligent. I am slower at reacting to questions or even hearing people when they say something. I have trouble thinking in general, or coming up with words that I need to use in a sentence.  Or remember the name of things.

I don't know if it is because the hormone is effecting me, or it males are just different that way, or if my overdose a few months ago effected my brain, the doctors say that my brain was not damaged. They tested something with my eyes or something. (if you don't know that situation, I overdosed on alcohol, anti psychotics, and sleeping pills till unconsciousness. My stomach was not pumped. 

so my boyfriend says he feels T has made him dumber too, "brain farts" he says.

Anyone else feel this way, or am I having a problem?  Because I am really concerned.  I've never been a genius in any way, but I didnt used to be so slow.

I've noticed a little more "brain fog" as well. I think it's because the brain is still adjusting to different hormones and different "circuits" activated in the brain. (I'm MTF, 9 months HRT)

For you though, you may want to have them re-check you, mainly for the anti-psychotic OD stuff. Those meds can mess you up.

Yeah, anti psychotics can cause brain damage even if they're used "properly." I also don't think there's a quick test that can definitely say that no problems were caused although I guess you probably don't have whatever they specifically tested for.

I'd be surprised if it was the testosterone, anyway.

I wouldn't say dumber, but different. Well, I'm MTF and hate everything that is or was male about me, so I actually would say dumber.

But from an objective point of view, I wouldn't.

Sex hormones do change the way you think in various ways. They don't affect everyone the same way or to the same extent, and many people make many of those lie very much, but still, in average, that's true. Dumb, common examples would be (and males and females refer to the hormone levels only here):

-Males get frustrated; females get sad.
-Males analyse; females get a feeling.
-Males are quick to react and slow to think; females are the contrary. (Think, hunters will more often have to "act now, think later" than home-bound mothers)
-Males are more prone to ADHD - this could be related to testosterone or brain sex, no one knows. Or even genetics. Who knows.
-Males are more prone to be aroused without the situation calling for it than females.
Etc.

Again, those are vastly generalisations and, while true, don't apply universally, of course.

Those, I think, are a big mix of three factors, and the prevalence of those varies a lot (plus education, but since it's not biological and definitely won't change, not really relevant I guess):
-Personality
-Sex hormones
-Sex of brain

Some trans people barely feel any change short of physical ones with HRT, while others almost feel like a new person, for example.

Now that that's explained, you haven't become dumber. Just, you don't think exactly the same.

I'm not sure, but I think those stereotypes have now been vastly attributed to which toys parents gave children. But for the sake of the example because it's known and easy, let's say it's because of the hormones, like other elements could be.

Girls are good at language; boys are good at maths.

If that were true, you might have lost language ability, but gained maths ability. Not that simple, but you get the idea.

A more likely theory is that your approach to problems and learning has changed without you noticing it. You know how some people are more visual (learn with examples and charts and colours), auditory (learn with people explaining to them and every word of the theoretical rule) or kinesthesic (learn with experience, feeling, touching, trying).

Everyone is a mix of those in various percentages. And the averages aren't the same in boys as they are in girls. Could it be because of sex hormones? Why not? If testosterone increases aggressivity, it's logical to think that it might push towards more practical (kinesthesic) approaches, for example.

So if your dominant learning approaches changed, but you're still used to your old ones, and still trying to learn through those, well, you might indeed feel dumber, because you're using strategies that are no longer the most appropriate for you. But globally you're the same. You lost "stat points" in a category but put them elsewhere.

And even if, say, academically, this made you weaker, I'm quite sure you'll have gained other advantages. Increased social skills? Better introspection? Better critical sense? Etc.

In my mind, it's similar to physical changes. In a MTF's case, you lose a lot of strength and physical potential. But in exchange, you gain such a healthy skin. Give and take everywhere. Of course, if we didn't prefer the other side, we wouldn't transition, but objectively, men and women are equal, aren't they?

I hope this wasn't too much of an useless, eternal novel.

Some really great posts in here already.

Quote from: Beth Andrea on December 03, 2012, 11:31:32 PMI think it's because the brain is still adjusting to different hormones and different "circuits" activated in the brain.

I recently read a study (and can't find it anymore for the life of me) that said something to this effect. This is puberty after all, we get to go through all that good stuff all over again, but this time due to our ages we are more lucid and cognizant of the changes.

There's been a marked difference in my thought patterns since starting HRT. It was by no means an overnight process, just something that gradually built up more and more. I do feel dumber in many regards... I used to love reading anything, now the only books I have the patience and interest in are Stephen King novels. I just can't seem to concentrate hard enough, and I fumble with words more. I'm a wreck when I have to speak out loud. I've gotten to be quite inarticulate.

My intelligence is the same. No worse and no better. The only thing that's really changed is my tolerance for verbal communication... especially if the topic drags on and on and never quite gets to the damn point (so let's include idle chit-chat, my tolerance for that is so low all I want to do is run away from it). My mind will and does wander then. Attention span also, same deal. It's like if I'm reading fanfiction and its droning on about what the color of this was, what the sky looked like and etc. and just slams you with erroneous and even downright irrelevant information that has nothing to do with the plot, I'll have to stop because it is now that annoying to me. I'll probably never again get through an Anne Rice book due to this lmao. Then again, since the T, a hell of a lot of things seem to amuse me a lot more too... so I don't know. Doesn't really have anything to do with IQ though so I'll shut up.

That stated, what you're describing is very likely the result of the OD. In fact, I can tell you from personal experience that they can and do really screw with you and for a long time after the fact, especially those kinds of drugs. When I was 13... I wanted to die and so I took bottles and bottles of Lithium and Welbutron (IMO, the two meanest SSRI's there are and also IMO, have no business in the human body but I digress) and it really messed me up. I also took hundreds of tylenol, for added measure. I was very fortunate to have been force-fed bottle after bottle of activated charcoal both on the way to and at the hospital. It would definitely have killed me otherwise.

But anyway, it is going to take some time for your brain to heal itself and to balance out the affected chemicals again (in my case this was the serotonin and dopamine balance) and it isn't going to happen in weeks. More like months and months. It took me at least six months get back to my typical cognitive abilities after my OD. Far as I can tell, there's no lasting damage. My IQ is now 141 (it had been only 107 or so back then) so, its not permanent what you're experiencing... or it shouldn't be at any rate, depending on just how much it was you took and how long it was permitted to be active without being neutralized and etc.

Just take it one day at a time. All you can really do for it now.

And I'm not saying the T can't have anything to do with this... it very well could, but the the only way for you to know that for certain, if its the T or the OD, would be to go off of it for a little while and I don't think you probably want to do that.

when a mtf friend of mine where to get homones she said it where wrotte that it would make her more stupid as female has less braincells than men. LOL..

well.. tecnically I dont think I have become less inteligent.
But.. compared to before where I I used my nights having alot more deep thoughts -__-,
and now its mostly:

Sex!
PIZZA!
HOTTY!
FOOD!
Smexness!!
MORE FOOD!
on my brain.

I kinda feel feel less inteligent at times...................

Quote from: Elijah on December 03, 2012, 11:01:00 PM
I have been on 2 for 2 years 2 months or so.  I feel like it is making me less intelligent. I am slower at reacting to questions or even hearing people when they say something. I have trouble thinking in general, or coming up with words that I need to use in a sentence.  Or remember the name of things.

so my boyfriend says he feels T has made him dumber too, "brain farts" he says.

Anyone else feel this way, or am I having a problem?  Because I am really concerned.  I've never been a genius in any way, but I didn't used to be so slow.

I am not on T, so I am not really sure if I should even answer here,  but...

I think it's probably from your OD, you should go get a second opinion. Especially since you've been on t for over 2 years and have really only noticed this since your OD. I've never OD, but I have had 11 concussions and all that jolting around of my brain has really affected the way that I think. I too have "brain farts" all the time, always forget the names of things, don't always register what people say, and am bad at verbally communicating.

If your bf also experiences some of the same problems, it could also just be aging related. Everyone starts getting more forgetful as they get older; or you guys just have better things to think about that the names of things you probably don't need to use on a daily basis.

Quote from: LearnedHand on December 04, 2012, 09:16:29 AM
Especially since you've been on t for over 2 years and have really only noticed this since your OD.

I noticed the dumbing down before my OD as well, all of my memory problems and things got worse after my breakup, but I had been experiencing them before the breakup and before the OD

Maybe you could look into help regarding this. A special educator, orthopedagogue, or uhm, I dunno who. The same kind of people who show people with learning difficulties to function normally could, perhaps, show you function normally again after your mind changed.

I'd say it's probably the anti-psychotics. Overdose or not, those can mess you up.

most of the overdose was the sleeping pills, I probably only took a couple anti psychotics, I may not have taken any, I just know I took some of my moms meds, and she is bipolar, I probably took 3-4 of her pills

i used to be able to do one thing for hours on end and had a spectacular attention span
my attention span is now pathetic and it does affect my grades. twas the only bad side of T for me :(

I find I have a much harder time focussing on multiple things at once. that doesn't bother me, but it's a problem when I am trying to listen to someone while I am busy. If they're talking to me while I am busy, I literally don't hear it, lol. I just enter a silent little place in my head as I work.

I've heard males aren't as good at multitasking. OTOH, I've heard that the ability of anybody to multitask in everyone is overrated.

--Jay

Regular use of sleeping pills dulls out your brain, so I think an overdose of sleeping pills could have the same effect.

This change could also be related to depression.

I don't think T has made me dumber, I feel like I think better. Though I started studying again 6 months after starting T and I am far less depressed than what I was. So I think in my case it is a contribution of things, as it could be in your case.

  E caused some brain fog in me that lifted quickly, even that was eclipsed by the positive changing train of thought.  I was a teenager once with the ragin' T hormones.  That happens.  As comedian Redd Foxx said in one of his nightclub standups: "My little acorn of a boy, whom I nutured and gave the greatest care, grew up to be a big nut!"  Enjoy the T ride!  Been there, done that!

  Joelene

Nope!

I feel like I can think fairly clearly. I have been on T for as long as you have (I think) and I don't remember feeling stupid because of it. There are many things that could do that, though, like sleep deprivation and depression and so on. I think you should look at other factors to find the cause.

Good luck.

Hmm, if anything I'd say T (and before that estrogen blockers) have made me smarter. Well I've always been smart, but I had a REALLY short attention span, when I had work to do I would have music on...tv on...have like 20 internet tabs open that I would flit back and forth between and the actual work would take forever. Since the brain fog of estrogen has lifted, I can focus much more easily, when I have work to do I get in the zone and everything else around me gets blocked out.

Yes, I find myself doing and thinking things that used to aggravate me when my ex did them, back when I was still F.  I have a terrible case of I don't give a sh**.