Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Hi,

I got in to a discussion with an mtf friend of mine and we got to discussing relationships with cismen. When I was prepuberty I did hang out with cisboys (though I think the fact that I am Aspie kept me from doing better with any kids), but after puberty that all stopped. Right now I have one cismale friend.

Also don't much like common cismale activities like sports. What I do with my cisfemale friends is go out to eat, go to movies, stuff like that. This mtf friend of mine didn't think cismen did that that much, he put it "go out to lunch with your lady friend (ugh!)" The only word that wasn't used was "luncheon". But don't think she was suggested I was not trans or anything. (BTW, my cismale friend and I usually go out to eat and watch movies. It is not the slightest romantic.)

I don't doubt that I am ftm, because I think this is all gender roles and expectations not gender, but I wonder about other guys here. Do you have cismale friends and what do you do with them? Do you think you fit into cismale society whatever that might be?

BTW, I have trans male acquaintances, we don't really get together out of group. But I notice a lot of times the transmen and transwomen segregate themselves just like cismen and ciswomen do.

I am pre-everything and do not pass. BTW, I have only been transitioning since May or so.

--Jay

I had a lot of cis male friends when I was younger. We sort of lost touch because they started bullying me, plus I just found more female friends. We (myself and the male friends) never really did much, just talked about stuff, watched TV shows and movies, went to McDonalds or whatever.

I don't really have any male friends to this day. But it's more habit than anything else. I just found it easier to gravitate towards females, especially as my field is dominated by women.

I've always gravitated towards females (and vice versa). It seems like I've never had much in common with cis males I've known. I don't really care to watch sports, tinker with cars, or hang out in a garage. I like Science, museums, theatre, Sci Fi, computers, the occasional horror film, etc. The most stereotypical male things I do every once in awhile is go fishing or when I get to the beach I like surfing (even though I am admittedly mediocre at it, lol).

I'd rather go out to lunch or go shopping with females then sit at home and watch Nascar on Sunday. I don't think my choice of friends has anything to do with gender more than it has to do with the people I know. I'm sure I could find some other like minded nerdy cis male friends to hang out with if I wanted to. I really don't know anyone who likes the things that I do. I just find females have more tolerable interests so I would rather be in their company.

Edit: I also don't equate interests with masculinity or femininity. I think it is interesting when people do that. I pass most of the time and I'm a typical thick strong looking masculine guy. Guys approach me with "You watch the game last night?" or whatever and I'm all "Nope, I was watching the History channel and playing Star Wars: The Old Republic." Then they say "oh..cool" and that's about the end of it, lol.

It really depends on what you do for a living, and what your friend pool is. I'm a student in Video Game Development, there are only a couple women in my course, much less career path, so it just makes sense that most of my friends are male. As a teenager, I had more female friends, probably because I hung out with the artist crowd, which attracts more girls.

If you want male friends, just interact with more men. *shrug*

Quote from: aleon515 on December 26, 2012, 01:43:46 PM
.This mtf friend of mine didn't think cismen did that that much, he put it "go out to lunch with your lady friend (ugh!)" The only word that wasn't used was "luncheon". But don't think she was suggested I was not trans or anything. (BTW, my cismale friend and I usually go out to eat and watch movies. It is not the slightest romantic.)

I'm not sure I understand this correctly?
to me it seams wierd why "cismen shouldn't eat together or watch movies. (WTF? why?)
Cis-men are ALOT of people. generally all men who arn't trans. I dont find it to be wierd for too guys to eat together or watch movie together, I done that alot of times before with guys for just a hanging out thing.
--
Anyway, I got pretty much mix of male and female friends and I always had, I dont jugde my friends on genders, sex or sexualety, I jugde them on whatever I like them or not.
I arnt typical hetronormativ, (I wont say I dont fit cis-male sociaty because cis-men are so many diffrent kinds in first place)
I like to play soccer, but not to watch,
I can only play video games due to illness,
I love cars and moterbikes as look but dont know a ->-bleeped-<- about them.

on the other hand I also like more girly stuff so im very much mixed in steryotypes but in general people decribe me femenine because "if your read as male they will notice your being femenine and if your read as female they will read your masculine sides".

well, I do have trouble with the hetronormative friends, its not cause I cant fit in, I feel it normal to go with guys also pre everything, however, I find it hard when your first got to accept all the gay, trans, and non gender steryotypes thing to fit in certain of those groups cause many guys still feel they need to fit in and prove there manhood. they can easly get to make bad comment of transgender or gays or your personal style for not fitting in this bugs me like for any other kind of person who would speak bad about those things.
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for what I do generally I drinks beer, talking, general hanging out, eat, watch movies,play soccer, fight for fun, stuff like that, but again it depends who im with.

A lot depends on one's socioeconomic background...I come from a blue-collar history, and going to any movie with only a guy friend would be seen as "gay" (unless the movie was a war/action movie).

I made very few friends, and of those, we mostly did hiking, camping, and shooting. I could have went bowling, but "luncheon" would cause several good laughs and some teasing.

I have about an even mix of male and female friends.
With either male or females we usually just watch movies, play video games, loiter around the mall, etc. I think i play more video games with my guy friends but that's the only difference

In regards to my cis girl friends, mostly they're the kind of girls who just dont really care about their gender if that makes sense? I wouldn't like say theyre masculine necessarily, just kinda neutral. Not sure if that makes a difference.

i have cis male friends we get drunk and chase girls mostly, but we watch movies eat food. none of us are really into sports we met via school we build sets for the plays. we also have friends who are girls and we all hang out together. im also friends with girls and the difference is we talk more then me and my guy friends. thats about it. also our ages vary from 16-20.

I don't really have any cismale friends outside of the internet.  In school, most of my friends were female.  Nowadays, I don't have any friends.  If I did have any cismale friends, then I'd probably play video games and watch the fights on tv with them (if they wanted to of course).

Do I think I fit into the cismale society?  At this time, no since I'm still living as a female.  In the future, maybe.

I've always had mostly cis male friends.  For most of my high school years I hung out with computer geeks, which are usually male.  The majority of my friends now are gay guys.  I find it much easier to be around females now than I used to.  Probably because I don't feel pressured to be like them anymore.

This is off topic, but when I see one-word constructions like cismen and cisman and cismales, I think of superheroes.

I have some cismale friends now, and going to the bar or out to coffee or burrittos is the thing around here.

I've never heard of just guys going to the movies, it's usually with a group of men and women.

I'm probably not the best one to answer this since I am heading for transition, but the few guy friends that I have usually just like to go out for lunch or dinner, see geek movies (like The Hobbit), or shoot pool. They all like at least one of the typical activities associated with men that I don't tend to like, but we don't do them together (because I don't like them). Oddly enough it's my girl friends that like going to strip clubs (with women dancing). The guys I know can't get into it and I have to say I'm with the guys on that one!

Quote from: Beth Andrea on December 26, 2012, 03:54:07 PM
A lot depends on one's socioeconomic background...I come from a blue-collar history, and going to any movie with only a guy friend would be seen as "gay" (unless the movie was a war/action movie).

I made very few friends, and of those, we mostly did hiking, camping, and shooting. I could have went bowling, but "luncheon" would cause several good laughs and some teasing.

Well "luncheon" was what the term "lady friends" (which I don't think of my friends as my "lady friends") made me think of. I don't go to luncheons, I go out to eat (at a restaurant). I've never said (and no one said to me), "let's go out for a luncheon".
A luncheon is where you go to someone's house and eat little cucumber sandwiches with the crust taken off them. I don't go to luncheons.

BTW, I don't believe at all that all this defines gender. I think it's an interesting topic.

--Jay

Quote from: LearnedHand on December 26, 2012, 08:01:23 PM
I've never heard of just guys going to the movies, it's usually with a group of men and women.

Hahaha, I can think of a bunch of times me and my cis-male friends went to the movies, or go to lunch, or whatever. BUt its usually during/after class....

I've never really had cismale friends. In childhood it was probably because of the differences with hobbies. I liked to stay indoors doing my own things while other boys wanted to run around and play soccer or something like that.

Well, I still don't have many cismale friends. A few though but all the things we usually do is talk about games and gaming. My good friends have always been cisfemale and we usually share hobbies (drawing, music, etc).
The guy I mostly hang out with just usually expects me to know every new turn in the gaming and internet world and starts talking about it with that assumption, leaving me all confused like "what the hell are you talking about". But he's a great guy anyway.

But I'm usually the only guy when I go out to the downtown with my two ex-classmates (both cis-girls) but it doesn't really bother me. The only thing that annoys me is that they go scavenge the make-up sections and I'm suffocating because of the perfume smell. :D

I have a pretty mixed group of friends, but I'm much closer to my cismale buddies (with a few exceptions), mainly because we share the same interests- good music, video games, watching guys give each other concussions (read: football) and the like. I've always had issues relating to girls, and used to be tortured in my early years for it. Now people know not to ask me about "girly subjects".

On a side note, I'm always pretty reckless, but my bros seem to bring that side out way more, probably since most of them are too.

I have cis male friends; we play games, watch movies, always hang out in groups as opposed to one on one. Unfortunately none of them respects my gender, they just see me as a "chick" even though I'm not really into most girly things.

I used to have cismale friends before I came out. Now I don't know much about them, I moved from home one year ago and made only female friends. There are guys I'm friends with but not that close. I think I was always jealous of cisguys, that's because I couldn't make a close friendship with them.

I wouldn't describe anything I do is girly even with girls (ok at this point, women).
Funny thing though, I think the socioeconomic thing is very on target, I probably do a lot of stuff my dad would have done. My dad did not hunt or fish either. He was kind college professor egg headish. I'd say I am a nerd. If I had been in the right place at the right time I might have been writing software.

--Jay

Timely question for me. Well, I've never really had any female friends except for one girl when I was 7 that I was in love with.  :P This was not by choice really. They just didn't accept me and also I was always very shy around them. I never had many friends growing up, but those I did have were 'cis male'. Back in school we mostly just hung out, no going out to movies or anything. I met them in ROTC and later at work and we just hit it off. They thought I was hilarious. I was sort of a bully, so most conversations centered around the fruits of my labor there. I could never shut up about whatever scene I had caused and we would laugh about it into the night. You know, just cutting on people. Mature, I know. :P Other conversations centered around skin rags and their girlfriends.

Later friends were also cis male and we would basically just do dope, lie, cheat, steal, etc. More maturity.  :P

Right now, I really don't have any friends except a few people I'm close to online. I still find it easy to hang out with guys BUT not totally comfortable yet. I don't get it. I've never felt awkward around guys in my life. I guess I feel self-conscious now. They try really hard to be friends with me and I end up ditching them. Oddly enough girls can't get enough of me now either. I don't know. I'm having a difficult time adjusting. Maybe I'll blog about it if I get enough courage (which is seemingly difficult to sum up these days).

Good thread.

Come to think of it, I never had many friends as a kid. Or as a teenager. I still have zero people I can say I hang with. Wow, that's kind of sad. Lately I've got a male friend (online, figures) I'm slowly figuring out how this man friend thing works out. Cars. Sports. Video games. No excess "fangirling." Making friends shouldn't require remembering a list of rules.  ::)

I was just thinking about this and I wish I had a big group of trans friends (cis friends are nice but I am never comfy with them). Many times trans folks are neurotic, anti social, socially awkward, or narcissistic but I love em' all anyways, lol. (I can't judge because I am known to be laid back and sweet yet I am extremely stubborn and set in my ways. I'm trying to get better about it though, lol.)  ;D

Odd, I have a pretty even amount of cis friends who are men and women, and we all just hang out like normal. We go to the movies, for drives out in the mountains, to the gym, sometimes to games or concerts, etc. It's not really seen as 'gay' or weird if we want to see a movie or something. We're seeing a movie, not screwing. But I dunno, I guess attitudes vary from place to place.

My trans friends aren't any weirder than I am-- though I do know a basket case or two.
I think I am not seen as male-- so I don't know except at work where I get on well with the guy teachers, I just don't have cismale friends. I'm wondering if that changes as you transition. I do notice the sort of casual way males have with each other, and I am a bit envious.

Quote from: aleon515 on December 29, 2012, 01:08:53 AM
I do notice the sort of casual way males have with each other, and I am a bit envious.

They got a lot friendlier and sweeter all of a sudden. And more touchy feely. Like a guy will rest his hand on your back even if you don't know each other well. I don't know, maybe a gesture of friendship? I got that a lot. And much more willing to help each other out. Like teamwork. Yeah, a lot of team work.

Its totally normal for guys to catch a film or have a meal together, I've always done it.

Quote from: aleon515 on December 26, 2012, 01:43:46 PM

Also don't much like common cismale activities like sports. What I do with my cisfemale friends is go out to eat, go to movies, stuff like that. This mtf friend of mine didn't think cismen did that that much, he put it "go out to lunch with your lady friend (ugh!)" The only word that wasn't used was "luncheon". But don't think she was suggested I was not trans or anything. (BTW, my cismale friend and I usually go out to eat and watch movies. It is not the slightest romantic.)

--Jay

Hi Jay, One thing all this transition business taught me, do what I want, not because of what's between my legs, but because it's something I like doing.

I know for a fact I am not the only transwoman who likes banging up their knuckles working on a car. In fact I know a lot of regular women who do. I also know a lot of women, who can't be bothered. I'm guilty myself of pulling off the batting eyelashes dumb chick bit only because I was going out somewhere and didn't want to get my hands dirty so I asked the nice guy at auto zone to work on my car for me lol.

Back before I transitioned I tried the hyper masculine thing.  I've gone to movies with other guys, it's not unusual when one is young and single although less so with a married man. For a man, marriage is thing that seriously restricts what a man can do, and why I have seen that as men get older they whittle down hobbies to a few things such as hunting, cars, yard work, wood working, etc.

Guys have a whole list of silly rules about touching, eye contact, can't talk while in the bathroom, etc. I can come out of the ladies room and have a 25 year history of the woman who was in the next stall over lol. Women seem to have none of these rules except their personal zone of comfort.

To me these are the social customs of the sexes. How a man or a woman is supposed to behave socially.

One thing I will say is I personally don't associate activities with only male or female. It's true that there are some activities that are either male dominated or female dominated, but neither sex can claim exclusivity. As I hinted at before, I incorporated the parts of my old life that I really liked and then sought out like minded females and lo and behold I found they existed.

I don't really have many cismale friends.
I used to have a few back when I worked at Michael's (Arts and Crafts)
But, as you can imagine, there weren't many guys working there,
And the ones that did where usually on stocking, because they didn't want to be seen in a "Woman's Store,"
But even when I did have a few there, the majority of them where gay,
And as soon as they found out that I was trans, the gay ones didn't treat me seriously about it...and yet the straight one did o.o;
I don't get it...

But anyway, I now work in a small coffee shop,
Where literally, I am the only male that works there,
I think...If I worked with some cismen, I might befriend them.
We've had three cismen journey through our coffee shop as co-workers,
We weren't 'friend friends' by any means, but we got along well and we'd chat it up while work was slow.
I typically pass, and at work, all of the guys just treated me like another bloke, so...it was good.
I'd like to work somewhere where I have the chance to work with other guys, it's weird working with literally ALL women xD