Susan's Place Transgender Resources

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I am not sure to what extent mileage could vary on hormones, but I would like to say that your face was pretty even before starting estrogen. ^^

Maybe the best thing to do would be to consult your doctor with your worries. It might be that your estrogen dose is too low, or that you lack in estrogen receptors, but only bloodwork will let you and your doc know for sure!

 Well, it would be good to know your height and weight. Being underweight would certainly explain your lack of feminization... If you're at a proper weight, then you need to get your hormones in their appropriate ranges. This may require an increased dose of what you're already taking, or the addition of new medication, or a switch to new medication.

After that, I wouldn't know what could be done. You'd have to see your doctor for further advice, since we shouldn't give medical advice over the Internet.

It's very frustrating when you see little in terms of feminization. I hope you're doing well, emotionally.

I will definitely point out that facial hair will not change on estrogen, and that finding a way to get it removed would be your best bet. If your facial hair is dark, than I'd recommend laser hair removal over electrolysis. Laser is less permanent than electrolysis, but even taking into account potential future touch-ups (years down the road), it is still less painful, expensive and time consuming than the latter. Window shopping before making that investment is advised, since the price varies widely from place to place.

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Quote from: girl you look fierce on February 11, 2013, 10:38:39 PM
Well my height is 5'4 and weight is about 140 so basically my bmi is a lil over 24, I still have a lil muscle I can't really seem to lose though.

The problem is... my endo and most endos don't have enough experience with trans people to handle the special cases, she is trying but right now I am just looking for more suggestions to make when I can get another appt, maybe someone knows some weird condition I have never heard of r something.... anyway my E dose was doubled a weekish ago at least, I don't feel any different but hopefully that will have some kind of effect.... still puzzled why it has not had any yet.

Thank you for your concern and I am doing OK I am just dying to know what is up!!

Well, your levels were pretty low. I don't know what your doses were at, but if they have recently been doubled, and if you don't have the tests back yet, it's important to be patient, get your levels, reassess your situation, and then make further alterations if necessary. Being patient sucks when you're in your first year or two of HRT, for sure, but there's not much else you can really do.

Estrogen insensitivity is unheard-of, though I don't have any data on partial estrogen insensitivity. I would assume that it, too, is very rare, but assumptions are known for being full of fluff and stuff.

Here's hoping that things will unravel without much issue.

Quote from: girl you look fierce on February 11, 2013, 10:51:20 PM
acked much change w/ proper levels though even if it sounds terrible of me :)

Well, I'm happy about it, too, in a way. Maybe because it restores my erroneous belief in the justice of nature, or something - but just the same, I feel awful about it. I've been on HRT for a little over two years... and, well, I try to avoid topics about HRT because it's a dangerous line of thought. It leads me down a corridor of, "Why me"s, and "If only"s.

There's nothing I can really do about it all. It's probably a weight problem for me - I'm hanging out at around 100lbs, being at 5'4". Gaining weight isn't easy for me, and I can't afford it either, so I'm stuck with being unattractive until my body slows down and decides it wants to keep fat.

I would give the new dose at least a month.
Some girls respond better or worse to different means of administration, so an endo can switch one from oral to patch or injectable if oral absorption were subpar. Some docs swear by injectables because they create higher peak levels, and it is thought that it is the peaks more than the average that seem to stimulate growth.

Quote from: girl you look fierce on February 11, 2013, 09:50:42 PM

So, I don't know, any ideas ??? I am willing to consider any explanation at this point and the plan is to switch to a GNRH agonist when I see my endo next as well as get tested for AIS but I'm afraid that those won't help the other side of the story which is the fact that the E is just not doing much.... my E levels were not stellar, about 65-70 pg/ML but that should at least be enough to feminize....

I understand being impatient.  I think the results that come from your next visit will be interesting though, if you can just find a way to be patient?  Maybe then you will get some answers to these questions.  Also, if you were on low dose E, maybe that explains why you haven't seen huge effects?  If you have breast growth, that shows that you are not immune to it's affects I would say.  Finally, like somebody said, if you don't have any fat, then there is less to move around on your body, you know?  I didn't really get any breast growth till I gained some weight, so in that sense you're ahead.

Oh and last thing for reals, your face is super feminine looking for being on low dosages of E and having high T levels, like even for a young person.

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Quote from: muuu on February 11, 2013, 11:10:27 PM

Try bread with lots of butter and cheese and whatever other high kcal things you can find, bread is one of those dangerous things if you're trying to lose weight.

I practically live on the stuff.

Cookies, too, and ice cream, and meat, and lots of bread.

When people say that I'm blessed that I can eat anything I want without gaining weight, I scowl and smile at the same time. It is a blessed curse.

Being able to eat all the ice cream you could ever want to eat can never be called a curse! :P

Quote from: Jen on February 11, 2013, 11:08:13 PM

if you don't have any fat, then there is less to move around on your body, you know?  I didn't really get any breast growth till I gained some weight, so in that sense you're ahead.

I also had the same problem and still do. after 18 months in to HRT I am still slightly underweight. I have considerable amount of breast tissue but very little volume to them. I think this is due to little amount of body fat. But compare to where I started I think I have improve a lot. But it took lot of time. It took 15 months to start to gain some development in my hips. But it is happening lol. So give it few more months and I'm sure you will notice the changes.

You can always talk to your doctor and by mean time just be patient.  :angel:

And you look really really good and once the HRT really start to kick in you will look stunning.

Quote from: Jen on February 11, 2013, 11:18:19 PM
Being able to eat all the ice cream you could ever want to eat can never be called a curse! :P

Amen......!! to that lol

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Quote from: muuu on February 12, 2013, 12:14:14 AM
Are you completely sure about this? I think (<- key word) I've started having a lot of white/grey/transparent (hard to tell) hairs now, especially on my chin.

Wow... you are one lucky Girl.

Usually facial hair will not change. Once they started to grow they will keep coming up. Only way is to do laser of Electrolysis. For me even Laser didn't help. may be because of my brown skin lol.

Quote from: anya on February 12, 2013, 12:11:48 AM
I also had the same problem and still do. after 18 months in to HRT I am still slightly underweight. I have considerable amount of breast tissue but very little volume to them. I think this is due to little amount of body fat.

I can relate.  My boobs are kind of pathetic, but at least there is something there now lol.

Yup 15 months lol. But lucky for me like you I also had a wide hip bone.   ;).
Pilates is the best way to get you tummy in to shape. It is helping me to keep my waist in 26 mark lol.

Quote from: Jen on February 12, 2013, 12:25:05 AM
I can relate.  My boobs are kind of pathetic, but at least there is something there now lol.

Well You have a gorgeous face to compensate for everything Jen. ;)

Awe thanks Anya :).

The only thing I wanted to add is that there is a medication that most endos dont know about. Its called suprefact, it is actually a cancer medication designed to eliminate hormone production at the source. That would help you t levels if your worried, plus it doesnt have the duretic effect and potassium retention that spiro has. Though have to say you looked pretty feminine before hrt so the changes are going to be subtler than most.

There are a number of ways your doctor could help.  Your dose could be modified for both spironolactone and estrogen.  If you have insurance, you could do the patch estrogen, which is a more potent form.  Then, there are other pharmaceuticals that could lower T as well.  Doctor has to work harder.

However, you look good right now.  Like really good.

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yeah... that's true   :(. It didn't came to my mind till you mention.

Some people don't get the results from HRT they expect and it happens for a variety of reasons.. Diet and genetics are just 2. I've had fairly good levels all along and after almost 2 years, I still don't fill a AA. My gyno suspects that I'm either E-receptor deficient or the receptors are 'odd'..

Quote from: Stephanie G on February 12, 2013, 01:02:33 AM
The only thing I wanted to add is that there is a medication that most endos dont know about. Its called suprefact, it is actually a cancer medication designed to eliminate hormone production at the source. That would help you t levels if your worried, plus it doesnt have the duretic effect and potassium retention that spiro has. Though have to say you looked pretty feminine before hrt so the changes are going to be subtler than most.

The issue with buserelin, is that it's not suitable for long term use. It's use with other sex hormones is also contraindicated.

It is? I have read alot on it just to know about what im taking and I have read no contraindicated effects. Do you have a link or anything? Now im kinda curious.

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Quote from: Stephanie G on February 12, 2013, 01:45:29 AM
It is? I have read alot on it just to know about what im taking and I have read no contraindicated effects. Do you have a link or anything? Now im kinda curious.

Sorry, cribbing from a family members Mims account..

It might reduce the natal estrogen production but the majority of the estrogen comes from the medication which has no direct correlation to the gland that is supressed if anything it offsets the side effects due to lack of sex hormones. At least thats what I have extrapulated from all the information I have read on it.

I'm assuming you are posting this because you want opinions. My thought is welcome to the world of hormones. To be really really honest as someone who has taken hormones for a very long time, they don't do much. It's a nice mental state. I feel like I am very balanced person. Yes I can fill out a pair of jeans nicely but I attribute that to diet and exercise. The real physical changes come from surgery not hormones. I know that's not going to win me any popularity points for saying that, but that's my opinion. They are way over rated as a tool of change. Forget all this my hormones levels are x, y or z. It just doesn't matter. All it may say is that your doctor is doing a good job, or maybe a lousy job. Who are any of us to say. I'm sure not a doctor. I do my estrogen by injection, only because that's what my endo suggested. He knew my goal, and that's what he said I should be taking. If you want real change you need to go under the knife, it's pretty much that simple. To be honest, I personally think you look fine. The only thing you need to learn is "the secret smile of women". That smile that says yes I'm a female, but we still rule the world :)

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When your face is starting out so feminine, I think the best you can hope for is subtle changes.  When I go back to my pre-HRT pictures Idk, there just isn't that huge of a diff.  I have to find weird camera angles to be able to see it.  Straight on pics of me,  like the ones of you above, make me feel like nothing's even happened.

The breast growth is your proof that something is happening though.

9 months is still a really short time and you already look feminine to begin with. Female puberty lasts on average 5-6 years!

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Oral estrogen is estradiol.  Better is ethinyl estradiol as it's more active but it would need to be as a patch or injected.  However, the patch is expensive, can cause skin difficulties and injections aren't fun.  Most forms of estrogen will also lower testosterone so once there is enough in the body, estrogen will help further lower testosterone. 

A rather odd option could be depo provera.  One injection each month in addition to your current meds.  It helps lower testosterone and as a derivative of progesterone, there MAY be some additional feminization effects. 

My doc targets estrogen to be between 200 and 400, testosterone less than 50.

Talk to the doc.....