Susan's Place Transgender Resources

So for my new job I'm left with what to wear? i went to the job dressed in a suit so I am kinda stuck for now unless they bring it up and tell me I can or hint at it. But until then or until I have been there for six months to a year, I feel I should dress semi-male or androgynously. I mean really I am not big on business skirts and dresses so this is how I would dress if in any event. But if I buy the clothes in the women's section, they will show off my curves. I have very femme body. male clothes don't fit. So I am faced with this dilemma: hide it in baggy male clothes or dress for comfort and style but still adrogynous. My mom says just wear business causal clothes for now as the job is the most important thing. I need it to pay for SRS. before today, I had no idea how I would I felt stuck. I feel in a year or so i will be able to have surgery now. I am going to save every penny.

i was thinking this:

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1056.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft372%2Fdedalus3333%2F01_womanhandinpocket_full_zpsd3d1bf41.jpg&hash=21bc3d643ce11547a88121eea16847d838afaa73) (http://s1056.photobucket.com/user/dedalus3333/media/01_womanhandinpocket_full_zpsd3d1bf41.jpg.html)

That picture, to me, is basically just a womanly-bodied woman dressed in absolutely male clothes. The overall picture is androgynous because the person and clothes don't fit, but I don't see how the clothes are anything but purely male. I honestly think your best option is casual-serious clothes, unless really everyone in the office is wearing stern classic business clothes. That will likely offer many more androgynous options to make you feel comfortable, in the women's section particularly.

And really, I don't begin to understand what is wrong with showing your curves. You're hired now. What do you expect? Sorry, sir, you look womanly, so you're fired? Or do you really think your breasts will go unnoticed?

My first girlfriend, prior to transitioning, while on HRT, tried her hardest to hide her breasts with the baggiest XXL t-shirts and still got stares all the time. And not sure she had even reached a B cup at the time, not to mention her body is larger than yours, which should hide things better. I think trying to hide it will only make you look awkward.

Skinny jeans, converse sneakers and a teeshirt. Simple. If everyone sees your boobs, that's a good thing cause if anyone asks, you say, yes, I'm a trans woman, my name is Joanna and I'd like it if you'd use female pronouns with me :) easy peasy!

Quote from: A on September 06, 2013, 01:17:41 AM

Or do you really think your breasts will go unnoticed?

My first girlfriend, prior to transitioning, while on HRT, tried her hardest to hide her breasts with the baggiest XXL t-shirts and still got stares all the time. And not sure she had even reached a B cup at the time, not to mention her body is larger than yours, which should hide things better. I think trying to hide it will only make you look awkward.

That's not only because of breast development but also HRT development showing on a 'man's' face making one look like a chimeara, or too androgynous tipping the scale to the male side considering head size, overall  body sizes, comportment etc.

Quote from: Isabelle on September 06, 2013, 04:22:58 AM
Skinny jeans, converse sneakers and a teeshirt. Simple. If everyone sees your boobs, that's a good thing cause if anyone asks, you say, yes, I'm a trans woman, my name is Joanna and I'd like it if you'd use female pronouns with me :) easy peasy!

Yup! That's exactly my style except for tee. Skinny denim or velvet jeans - both look fine and velvet IMO is even more feminine. Male cut tees and buttoned shirts (both long and short sleeved) for Your bust, lol, would be totally wrong (I have A cup in Tanner 3 and M sized shirts are already getting tight in my armpits - my forward parts are pushing the fabric err...forwards :P ). With Your C size... You would need L or XL and even then they could be pushing out, probably... Besides, larger sizes are larger everywhere - shoulders, armlength etc so the overall impression would be like "Hey! I am Your staff scarecrow, fresh from the corn field!" (I have exactly that look in L sized jackets now...).
Besides, You can always add a sleeveless hoodie, if that's acceptable in Your company. With hoodies its kind hard to tell if they are male or female cut and with proper colors they are kinda alright :).

I think you might be forgetting that she is going to be working in a relatively formal environment. Formal enough for it to actually be appropriate for her to go to the interview in a suit at least. I think that breasts or not, sneakers, t-shirts and maybe even jeans are going to raise eyebrows.

In reply to your OP Joanna, I think the clothes in the photo are fine. They appear on the male side of androgyny due to style and cut, but should achieve what you need if there's nothing else obvious which would give you away. :)

Quote from: A on September 06, 2013, 05:37:00 AM
I think you might be forgetting that she is going to be working in a relatively formal environment. Formal enough for it to actually be appropriate for her to go to the interview in a suit at least. I think that breasts or not, sneakers, t-shirts and maybe even jeans are going to raise eyebrows.

Well, I have no idea how formal that environment is :(. For example, I went to my job interview in a suit and I still have two sets of suits in my office in case I need to attend formal meetings with representatives of legislative, executive or judiciary. But in my daily work - I work for the government btw, I dont meet with people- its mostly paperwork, so I can dress "borderline casual " - atm I have black tight velvet jeans, black All Stars gumshoes (sneakers?), burgundy buttoned shirt (looks like a blouse). My boss approves this style (she would not allow shorts and sandals in the office though...), she also knows I am TG, but not that I am on hormones. The only time when I got a mild disapproval was when I tied my hair with rubber band (she did not say me to take it out directly, but I got the message).

Where I am it's polo shirts and khaki pants. We can be more formal but if you are a "guy" then our options are limited. I'm looking forward to fall and winter so that I can wear a fleece jacket. I haven't had any breast growth yet but I'd like to hide and protect them until I can brave it out enough to talk to HR and legal.

I think that Joanna is doing the right thing until she can work it out with her employer.

They told me business casual to casual casual. So skinny jeans, a cute top and flats or low top converses (I like em!) would be fine. i told them i will dress business casual at first which she said that works great. I am prolly going to dress like the woman in the photo. I don't know why everyone thinks they are male clothes. They are cut to flatter curves and there is no way i can hide those curves in anything other then a suit.

Quote from: SamC on September 06, 2013, 05:58:35 AM
In reply to your OP Joanna, I think the clothes in the photo are fine. They appear on the male side of androgyny due to style and cut, but should achieve what you need if there's nothing else obvious which would give you away. :)

Well my 13 inch shoulders, C cup boobs, 28 inch waist and 36 inch hips tend to make me look very female lol I am pretty sure they know i am trans or suspect I have some hormonal condition. My face is femme. My BF was with his friend today and I was in one of my  "gawd i don't pass who I am kiddin'" funks and so he was with his best friend from childhood so he told him that I was trans and played a game to see if he could spot me as a man. He kept asking about every girl that passed if she was trans. And when I passed, I passed lol he said to him, "No that's a girl too definitely." He's so sweet. he;s half the reason I got the job because he kept telling me to apply for jobs as I am so talented and to take advantage of it. And that if you want laser and your SRS you need a job. I really like him.

Tangent. Sorry. Thought it was a funny story and a nice thing he did for me and the fact he doesn't mind being seen with me with his friends or family.

But I'm going shopping I'll show you the clothes later.

Uhm. Because that kind of clothes isn't remotely female at all? You can cut clothes for the body you want, if it's very heavily stereotypically male, it won't look like female clothes. Honestly I cannot in my greatest imagination efforts to stretch this to even the androgynous status. I'm sorry, but to me not only is this very male, but it's also not quite my idea of "business casual". Rather "slightly less stern business".

But I should stop. Obviously I haven't seen enough "business" to have proper judgement on its clothes, that has a very special (hard to understand) code.

Uh actually that is how most professional business women dress. it is the definition of androgynous female attire. I mean you reall think this woman looks like she is wearing male clothes? There are certain cuts and fabrics and stitches that make something female. I don't and won't wear a dress to work. I mean I would wear something like that or if casual what Isaballa said: skinny jeans a top and flats. I bought clothes, female ones, just like that. they fit great cause I tried them on. Not sure about the shirts. But my mom saw them and flipped ->-bleeped-<-. So there must be something female about them.

I really don't know what to do. My mom says ill be fired. of course she said if I dont stop acting femme and wear makeup I wont get the job. i got it. So there. Also, notmatter what I wear they will see the boobs. No doubt. And I dtold her what about these. I mean really you think they wont notice c cup breasts?

I should be happy and now im all stressed. At least my BF is on my side and came and saw me today.

Quote from: Joanna Dark on September 06, 2013, 05:09:41 PM
Well my 13 inch shoulders, C cup boobs, 28 inch waist and 36 inch hips tend to make me look very female lol I am pretty sure they know i am trans or suspect I have some hormonal condition. My face is femme.

I've never seen a full shot of you Joanna, so hard to know what you're working with, but that description will get you in trouble  >:-)

Quote from: Joanna Dark on September 06, 2013, 05:09:41 PM
My BF was with his friend today and I was in one of my  "gawd i don't pass who I am kiddin'" funks and so he was with his best friend from childhood so he told him that I was trans and played a game to see if he could spot me as a man. He kept asking about every girl that passed if she was trans. And when I passed, I passed lol he said to him, "No that's a girl too definitely." He's so sweet. he;s half the reason I got the job because he kept telling me to apply for jobs as I am so talented and to take advantage of it. And that if you want laser and your SRS you need a job. I really like him.

Tangent. Sorry. Thought it was a funny story and a nice thing he did for me and the fact he doesn't mind being seen with me with his friends or family.

You make me smile... Nice to see you have a supporting partner in this rather extraordinary time in your life.  :D

Quote from: Joanna Dark on September 05, 2013, 10:18:06 PM
i was thinking this:

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1056.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft372%2Fdedalus3333%2F01_womanhandinpocket_full_zpsd3d1bf41.jpg&hash=21bc3d643ce11547a88121eea16847d838afaa73) (http://s1056.photobucket.com/user/dedalus3333/media/01_womanhandinpocket_full_zpsd3d1bf41.jpg.html)

You have me a bit confused.  The outfit you point to is going to make your breasts obvious -- after all, your bf did say they are "giant" !  :o   :D  You are going to be out on the first day.  So what's with all the dilly dallying about having a dilemma, hinting and hiding and so forth?

Just dress comfortably and show your curves in a normal manner, keep it at the level of dress casual they have specified.  Don't bind, just wear your normal bra and that top in the picture ...and edit away!  Be confident, proud of your shape!

Quote from: Joanna Dark on September 06, 2013, 10:21:49 PM
Uh actually that is how most professional business women dress. it is the definition of androgynous female attire. I mean you reall think this woman looks like she is wearing male clothes? There are certain cuts and fabrics and stitches that make something female. I don't and won't wear a dress to work. I mean I would wear something like that or if casual what Isaballa said: skinny jeans a top and flats. I bought clothes, female ones, just like that. they fit great cause I tried them on. Not sure about the shirts. But my mom saw them and flipped ->-bleeped-<-. So there must be something female about them.

I really don't know what to do. My mom says ill be fired. of course she said if I dont stop acting femme and wear makeup I wont get the job. i got it. So there. Also, notmatter what I wear they will see the boobs. No doubt. And I dtold her what about these. I mean really you think they wont notice c cup breasts?

I should be happy and now im all stressed. At least my BF is on my side and came and saw me today.

I still disagree about your clothes, but looks like we have an unresolvable disagreement there. I guess being in a business setting for a while enables you to see that as something else than manly clothes.

But seriously, no, don't worry. You won't get fired. You didn't lie, did you? Actually if the interviewer didn't notice something was off, even in a suit, they weren't paying attention. Just do what you have to do, and if/when you want to come out, just do it. I really don't see the big deal about it. Only thing they might eventually maybe be angry for is that you hid it from them. Then you just tell them that you were afraid they'd judge you for it. End of story. Maybe you'll be the talk of the office for a week. Maybe.

Well, when speaking about smart casual, women tend to get away with REALLY A LOT of things there (unlike guys do). Pretty much everything, if mix-matched properly and only lightly accessorised could fit into female smart casual range. And, btw, I disagree with the statement that lady in the picture above is dressed in female business woman attire - she looks like she just raided her bf's wardrobe. She does not need those trousers and that awful belt - and a plain blouse with no tie or just a bow-tie would suffice. Besides, she needs jacket :)

This link offers a handful of androgynous-specific clothing lines and stores (some casual, some not): http://www.buzzfeed.com/lilyhiottmillis/9-androgynous-clothing-labels-you-should-know

Quote from: -Emily- on September 07, 2013, 11:35:24 AM
Well, when speaking about smart casual, women tend to get away with REALLY A LOT of things there (unlike guys do). Pretty much everything, if mix-matched properly and only lightly accessorised could fit into female smart casual range. And, btw, I disagree with the statement that lady in the picture above is dressed in female business woman attire - she looks like she just raided her bf's wardrobe. She does not need those trousers and that awful belt - and a plain blouse with no tie or just a bow-tie would suffice. Besides, she needs jacket :)

Unless her BF is really small, I doubt that. yes, i agree, they don't look female. They look androgynous. That is the look I am going for: androgynous. Enough that they may think I'm wearing women's slacks but can't be sure. I want to prep the ground so it's not a giant surprise. BTW, my avatar, other then the horrid purple eyeliner, I'm not wearing makeup. That is how I look.

But those are women's clothes in the picture. Soemwomen like to dress masculine yet with a subtle femme flair. Subtle being the key. All I know is my mom is all pissed off at the clothes and they look like the ones in the picture. But it's prolly just because they are women's clothes. if I listened to her, I wouldn't have the job. Plus, in Philly, you can't be fired for gender ID and it's not like they are very femme they are andro. I just don't know what to do. My mom will say something everyday trying to break me, just not caring how that effects me. She seems perfectly willing to make me dress male even thought the consequences are terrible, i.e. I will be doing heroin within the week. She knows I'm clean and knows I got clean at the same time I started doing this.

I'm just going to follow my heart and dress andro. That is the best course of action now. In six months, Ill have the conversation and come out, if not sooner. they had to notice how femme my face is. Yet they hired me. Plus I was wearing makeup: foundation and blush and clear lip gloss. If I dress andro, even if I look more male, I will be happy and that is what counts. if I am happy, i will be a pleasure to work with. If I dres in ill-fitting male clothes I will become depressed. Just wearing the suit made me depressed for days and then made me think I no longer passed. When I do. yesterday, they escorted me into the women's changing room and told me I should shop in the Misses department as the clothes will fit better.

Uh-huh. I'm happy it's going well for you. Whether a stranger like I (or even your mother) likes your new work clothes shouldn't matter and I'm glad it doesn't. Really I think I'm in a pretty bad/stubborn mood for some reason and I'm glad you didn't fall to my insistance about your clothes.

I'm sure things will go really well. And hopefully your mother will understand at some point, seeing how you're much happier the way you are.

Good luck! Not that I think you need it.

Quote from: A on September 07, 2013, 01:18:36 PM
Uh-huh. I'm happy it's going well for you. Whether a stranger like I (or even your mother) likes your new work clothes shouldn't matter and I'm glad it doesn't.

yeah i just ant to be comfy so i can be an energetic happy person to work with. In their ad they said they wanted an energetic, enthusiastic and vibrant person. They said that because they couldn't say we want a female. because that is how you can describe most females. But males don't act that way. I do as long as I am dressed in a way i feel comfy and stylish. Fashion matters a lot to me. In fact I am watching a marathon of ANTM (Top Model). And I feel like I willl be comfy if I know I am wearing women's clothes, cause I am a woman, hormonally and now that I have this job, it will soon be vaginally as well.

I am going to take some of the clothes back as the sports bra set I bought is a 44. Bleh. I though it said 34. Though I am a 32. All I need is another another nice pair of slacks and two tops or clouses. There isn't many andro clothes though. I looked. I found these one blouses from Jones NY and they were PERFECT! But they were $62. Ugh.

But I do know what you mean A and Emily, but I am going for andro or a woman who is dressing andro. Im afraid in the clothes I will pass as male. that will become depressing real fast. That's my main worry. This woman hired me because I have the expereince and also because I seem so pleasent. And I am.

Hopefully they havent created my email cause I am going to tell them to call me Matty. Now you know my real name. Or is that too far?

Uhm, with all that considered, I'm not so sure I understand anymore. Why in this situation are you bothering with going as remotely male? Sounds like it's a pain, but what's the goal?

And uh, dunno, honestly. Whether they accept to call someone (especially in "official" communications like a business email address) something different from their real name is up to them, I guess. But what do you lose by asking? Though I have a feeling that asking them to call you your female name sort of equals a coming-out, no?

I'm sure there's a meaning behind all of this, but I can't seize it right now.

Quite a passionate exchange and probably no one fits all answer, all the more so as it is all about fit, isn't it ?    :)  (my apologies for the pun! )

I have been in a similar situation to Joanna for over a year now with just one significant difference, I don't have big boobs,  somewhere between A and B. I do however have shoulder lenght hair which I wear in a ponytail to work, beardless face and arms and far more feminine facial features than pretty well any guy of my age.

Also, even dressed male, (when traveling for example)   I have been Madamed regularly by third parties in front of colleagues and I know from those that I have come out to, about ten people now, that lot's of people have asked questions about my gender.

All of that being said, what people notice most is the work I do, so, even if my appearance raises a few eyebrows, I have no reason to believe it has been a problem internally . Basically, people are mostly sensitive to change and the people I work with are now used to seeing an unusually feminine looking manager and probably only give any thought to it when a third party, who meets me for the first time,  brings it to their attention again.

Regarding dress, I have also arrived at a stage where dressing as a guy is almost painful and I haven't bought a single item of mail clothing since 2011. In my place of work, standard is business casual to casual casual, very like what Joanna described.

I mostly dress at the casual, casual end of this spectrum wearing almost exclusively female clothing ie. jeans (Levi's  demi curve, size 30, for me as I also have a few curves, especially my rear end.. :)), chinos, blouses (mixtures of cotton & silk for example) , woman's leather jacket, women's casual shoes etc..

Even with my smallish boobs I still avoid tight fitting blouses though as they would make even my breasts look too obvious and while I have clothes something  like those in the picture above (closer fitting though), which in my opinion woud be very feminine with a little jewelry and nice shoes, I have not yet worn them to work. That will happen when I can finally come out to everyone and even then, I would consider that pretty formal, on par with suit shirt and tie for a guy.

So Joanna, while I believe you should at least come out to your boss very rapidly (I did that with mine one month after staring my new job), if you don't yet feel ready to come out to everyone, I think it is pretty easy to find sufficiently androgynous female to be able to dress comfortably and still maintain a minimum of stealth until you and/or your company are OK with making your status public.

Wishing you every success no matter what!
Hugs
Donna     

Kia Ora Joanna,

Metamorphosis means "gradual change" and this is what most trans-people do/have done/are still doing...
They start with the slightly andro look (Pupa/Cocoon) and 'gradually' progress(Gradual Pupation-body plus clothing transformation)through the androgynous stage...Some take months (even years) to complete their metamorphosis...

So enjoy the androgynous journey...there's no rush...

Metta Zenda :)

What do you do when your body no longer agrees to be hidden? C-cup boobs for example?

Quote from: A on September 07, 2013, 01:51:34 PM

• Uhm, with all that considered, I'm not so sure I understand anymore. Why in this situation are you bothering with going as remotely male?
  
  Though I have a feeling that asking them to call you your female name sort of equals a coming-out, no?

Well I am asically going to dressed as a man, kinda. And androgynous femme man. There is not other option. that is as male as it gets. I got in a huge fight with my mom and long story short I basically have to leave. She said that she doesn't care about it, doesn't believe it and thinks I am being influenced or something or that it's "Learned", and I need her to take me to the train otherwise I have to bike. Thing is she said she is ashamed of me and worries someone she knows will see me on the streets. The horror. I'm like Pygmalion to her or the ugly step sister.

Yesterday she was so nice until she saw the pants and shirt/blouse I bought. I took them back and bought andro male clothes. I have to choose my battles. the one shirt I bought is a snap on shirt with pearlish snaps and is white with light purple verticle stripes, the other buttown down shirt has smal olive polka dots on it, I also have women's flats that are kinda andro as men's shoes don't fit, I also have a blue striped shirt that is the most male but I am wearing that with women's grey slacks that are cute and are androgynously female. They make my butt look fab. I also have a woman's watch that is kinda andro as men's watches don't fit and I am going to wear a small, semi-delicate silver necklace. I wish I had some rings. Either way, when I shop, and took back these sports bras she asked why I was returning them and I told her they were the wrong size and I thought it said 34. She thought I was female without a doubt. Even in these clothes I will come off as very femme. they won't masculinize me the way a suit can and the shirts are slim fit so they will show off my shape, but still they are from the men's.

As far as the name, it all depends on if they created it yet. I imagine they didn't. They will prolly ask what I prefer to be called: matthew or matt, hopefully. And I will tell them matty. But we'll see. I'll say it is what everyone calls me which is true and people just do I never asked. It might raise an alarm but I don't know. this is all just a plan and I may change it depending on circumstance. But if I can get the Matty on my email and articles I write it would be fabulous and make my life easier in the future.

Quote from: Donna Elvira on September 07, 2013, 02:23:57 PM
All of that being said, what people notice most is the work I do, so, even if my appearance raises a few eyebrows, I have no reason to believe it has been a problem internally . Basically, people are mostly sensitive to change...

Regarding dress, I have also arrived at a stage where dressing as a guy is almost painful and I haven't bought a single item of mail clothing since 2011. In my place of work, standard is business casual to casual casual, very like what Joanna described.

That;s why I am trying to make it easier in the beginning by being andro. We'll see how it goes. but it's my attitude and work that counts, I hope. As long as I can remain pleasant, and I should be able to as I am very happy, all I have to do is my job and do it extremely well. That's my goal more then the clothes.

And yes it will be painful being dressed kinda male after dressing female and being treated female all summer, but i need to sacrifice for SRS. it's only temporary and I will come out. I juts need to leave my house and be an excellent employee first and make them love me. My BF says I'm very adorable and lovable so I just need to be myself. And in any event, I'll look female because I look female. The only thing that can change that is a suit and as soon as I untuck the shirt on the suit, i look female.

Quote from: SamC on September 07, 2013, 05:19:44 PM
What do you do when your body no longer agrees to be hidden? C-cup boobs for example?

I have a sports bra but it only got me down to a C. It is constricting my band size to 31 inches and bust size to 34 inches. I am actually nearly a D now. My band size is 32 and my bust is 36. So yeah, this only could get me busted! Ha! couldn't resist.

Oh, and thanks Kuan Yin. I totally agree. Slow and steady wins the race. There is no rush. 

Oh, the name. I'm completely clueless with English names, so I thought Matty was your chosen female name.

And uh, I'm still not following on the clothes. x.x You said why you're not going as 100 % male, but you didn't say why you're not going as 100 % female. You don't live with your mother, do you? Does she still have such a strong influence on your choices that you feel forced to still wear stuff that is more male than you'd like?

And heh, I hear you on "why do you need it so much?". Before, my mother used to tell me she didn't see the hurry, that I should just do like XYZ lawyer she saw on TV and get a career and family before doing it at maybe 40 years old, that it would be easier then. Yeah, right! My mother's open-mindedness was always rusty and limited, haha.

yeah I still live with my mom... for now or I would be going in clothes that are way more femme. the reason I don't go 100 percent female is I want to feel the place out because I went to the interview in a suit. I mean I look really female today in the face so I won't be able to hide it for very long if even one day. Plus the sports bra is too painful. I am not going to wear it. They are meant to be worn for an hour or so while you exercise. not all day at work to bind. It's to stop bouncing. that's it. plus, They are still big even in it. I guess we'll see. I have a feeling they know something is up on some level. What 30 year old man weighs 130 lbs and has a compltely smooth "pretty like a girl" face

You're almost a D cup after six months of hormones?? What the actual frack?! I want my money back.

Quote from: Isabelle on September 08, 2013, 10:54:04 AM
You're almost a D cup after six months of hormones?? What the actual frack?! I want my money back.

Yeah I'm pretty happy about it. TBH, by the time I was 11 i was prolly a tanner stage 1. My chest became slightly elevated. Not much but it was no longer flat at all. And this is the time you are supposed to start becoming stronger and I remember looking in the mirror and being like it looks like I'm grwing boobs. I started researching intersex condtions but I never really matched the descriptions and I was 11 and though I was/am smart it was kinda over my head.

by 12, I saw a a show with transsexuals on it. I think it was Phil Donahue. After that I idetified as a transsexual and have since. But by the time I was 18 I had noticable boobs and everyone said stuff. "hey look Mal (thats what people called me) has boobs." "What are you like a B cup?" I wasn't fat in fact i was about 118 lbs. My thighs grew too and now I have stretch marks everywhere on them. Plus, I looked like a girl. I shaved my head and people were like "You look like Manson girl now. All you need is the swastika on your head."

So I think I have some type of hormonal disorder. Don't know. But it certainly wasn't normal development. I never fully virilized either. But my point is I started at like a 36A/B. I wasn't expecting this much but Im not complaining lol

That's awesome :) not to sound pervy but.... I kinda wanna see :p two and a half years or so of titty skittles has me barely at a 32b... You can imagine my jealousy.... :)

Quote from: Isabelle on September 08, 2013, 11:41:42 AM
That's awesome :) not to sound pervy but.... I kinda wanna see :p two and a half years or so of titty skittles has me barely at a 32b... You can imagine my jealousy.... :)

Well for five bucks lol jk maybe i just will show a body shot. Personally i think they look like Bs but the cloth tape measure say otherwise. they def don't look like Ds. Not at all. i dont care if there is a four inch difference or not. I should prolly try on my clothes to see if they are noticable. But damn is that sports bra uncomfortable. Are they supposed to be that way? I bought a bigger one and it was just way loose and the 34 is super tight. i couldn't work in it all day.

I don't know...I *feel* like dressing androgynously in a business environment seems difficult. To me, either you dress as M or F. That's only because the styles are so different. Even the "masculine" women's business clothes are feminine in nature. I also think that style you posted a picture of is total female. The shirt definitely. @A, I'm sorry to disagree with you :P  It's the collar that really does it. Male collars stop a little closer to the buttons and are less loose. Not to mention the hip area on the pants that is pretty absent in male pants. But, as Joanna said, they were in fact, women's clothes.

From all of the guy business casual/casual clothes that I've seen/wore, all of them are tighter fitting, especially the shirts/jackets/sweaters/vests. The women's are a little  more loose. It would definitely raise suspicion in my part of the world to wear something like that as a guy. Though it wouldn't matter for the job, but it would confuse people..."what do we call you?"

Of course it's up to you and if you're comfortable, but I think if you're going to do it, go for it.

Well I went, it was awesome, and I stll got ma'amed in those clothes and my boss kept showing me the women's restroom's lol and then said use whatever one you want. it's a small office. IDK

That's awesome! You go girl!

Guess you don't need to come out any more either.

Great to see how this turned out, Joanna !

With six months waiting to begin HRT with basically nothing else to do, i did some of what you did.  Shopped.  Carefully.  I am pleased to report that for the first time _ever_ in my life, cis women are complimenting me on my look and on items of clothing. 

It means so much to me, being noticed and feeling attractive to others.  Could it be, because I personally feel confident and attractive, and give that vibe?  When not looking in a mirror,I  sometimes forget that i'm presenting as male...  Or, could it be that I'm getting some respect as a fashion trailblazer, wearing that which most men wouldn't be brave enough to wear?

Joanna, the Katherine Hepburn Rebel Chic look that you showed us, was made 'safe' for cis women to wear in public and professionally by a generation of women who really had to struggle for acceptance and respect:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/12/katharine-hepburn-rebel-chic_n_1960010.html (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/12/katharine-hepburn-rebel-chic_n_1960010.html)

So today it's finally considered feminine :)    Woooooot !!!!

You can see quite a bit of this on sites like etsy; for example:

http://www.etsy.com/listing/157666354/vintage-1940s-pale-blue-wool-womens (http://www.etsy.com/listing/157666354/vintage-1940s-pale-blue-wool-womens)

I like it !!!

Cheers,
Karla

Guess times are better. I had a job interview in the '90s under similar circs - maybe I was 28 - it was really annoying and sort of funny at the same time. They went to this trouble, and there were about six people sitting in on it in this dauntingly large meeting room. So I showed up and... well, The End. "We only called you in for a chat and sefkhdg dgf sekghsgkjhser dfbgmmbg..." Absolute gibberish, trying to get around the fact that one look at me was enough. But then I had no properly formal clothes for such, and although overall it was acceptable I looked like a total hash. Wore a very heavy sweater to hide boobs. Got caught in rain on the way too just to make me an even more (not so) hot mess. And BTW I was only following shrink's orders. Get a job before because they can't fire you on a job for that reason. (In THEORY.) I was like, "Okay, I tried!" I wasn't heartbroken though. Just wanted to show willing.

Well now that I have to present sem-male I get laughed at and called names and this guy today was like "What's up DUDE?" Implying that I'm not a dude. Then hi and his friends all laughed. I must still look like a chick because I was plugging in my phone charger on the train and the conductor yelled at me from like 50 feet away "Miss, you can't plug that in there. Some one might open that door." No one laughed or whispered or implied, wow that's a chick. People looked but it was like they just aceepted it. But Im getting a lot more hostility from men too. Hostility I didn't receive presenting female. Then I got hit on a lot. it's weird. I don't like it but oh well. I kepp my eyes on the prize: SRS.

Quote from: smile_jma on September 09, 2013, 04:46:24 AM
I don't know...I *feel* like dressing androgynously in a business environment seems difficult. To me, either you dress as M or F. That's only because the styles are so different. Even the "masculine" women's business clothes are feminine in nature. I also think that style you posted a picture of is total female. The shirt definitely.

Yup. it was next to impossible to find andro women's business attire. I found one or two shirts ad they were $10o. I get paid this friday so hopefully Ill start laser this weekend. I imagine it will make me look even more femme.

I'd really like it though if you could explain why you have to masculinize yourself for that job. I'm really not following.