Susan's Place Transgender Resources

When I joined this forum, I admit I was rather confused by the whole concept of androgyny.

Now that I have started HRT, I find myself identifying with y'all. While I am trans, and you can pry my HRT out of my cold dead hands, the MTF in me is not very girly at all, although I do lean more that way than towards male.

HRT really helps me between my ears. I am actually grounded in myself for the first time in decades. The body stuff, after all these years of wanting to be a cis female, seems like medical side effects.

I just thought I would pop in and say, "Hi". I will keep an eye on this forum from now on.

Usually you can find me in the MTF forum, but I have trouble relating to the countless posts about vanity issues. I am surprised that I really don't care how I do/will look now that I am on HRT. Any body issues I had pre hormones seem to have vanished. I am now taking a "Let's see what hormones do to my looks" approach. I rather dig the versitility of androgyny. It is liberating.

I can't speak for the entire community, but I happen to believe in the gender spectrum, in which relatively few of all people reside at the extreme endpoints of the gender spectrum (the "binary" points of 100 % male/masculine or 100% female/feminine).

I think that most of us are in some greater or lesser degree genderfluid and pansexual.  I look especially at all of the MAABs and realize they all started out as "female" in utero, until carefully timed hormonal showers reshaped us.  Some more than others.

Just my opinion.

Welcome to the Andro-Section Tori! I've seen you in the MTF section, and I think I've posted a few comments to some of your posts too.  I agree with the gender spectrum concept as well ... There is a wide diversity of "home bases" between the two extremes, and frankly, not too many people desire to be at one of the extreme binary points, even amongst the "normal" population.

Some of us lean towards the feminine form while maintaining a male lifestyle ... Sometimes due to social, family, work, etc. pressures, and others just because we feel more comfortable in a Dad role rather than a Mom role, etc.  When I discovered this site, and the androgyne community, suddenly I realized that I was a perfect fit for the definitions that were presented, and that I had been in that "fit" for decades.  It was comforting to know that I was not alone.

Again, welcome ... And I'll continue looking for you in both areas!  Roberto

Quote from: Tori on December 26, 2013, 06:33:59 PM
When I joined this forum, I admit I was rather confused by the whole concept of androgyny.

Now that I have started HRT, I find myself identifying with y'all. While I am trans, and you can pry my HRT out of my cold dead hands, the MTF in me is not very girly at all, although I do lean more that way than towards male.

HRT really helps me between my ears. I am actually grounded in myself for the first time in decades. The body stuff, after all these years of wanting to be a cis female, seems like medical side effects.

I just thought I would pop in and say, "Hi". I will keep an eye on this forum from now on.

Usually you can find me in the MTF forum, but I have trouble relating to the countless posts about vanity issues. I am surprised that I really don't care how I do/will look now that I am on HRT. Any body issues I had pre hormones seem to have vanished. I am now taking a "Let's see what hormones do to my looks" approach. I rather dig the versitility of androgyny. It is liberating.

I wouldn't want to discourage you to post here Tori. The androgyne section is the most supportive part of Susan's Place, and that's saying a lot.

But I would point out that that a lot of cis women have trouble relating to vanity issues, and that doesn't make you any less feminine or less of a woman. Like cis women, trans women are allowed to be whatever type of women we want.

That said, I like that this forum is tolerant of the fact that I still feel like a man "inside". I'm thrilled to transition and to be living full-time as a woman, but non-binary gender is my reality and it's nice to be among people who feel the same.

Of course, you are correct about cis women and vanity, I never meant to imply otherwise. I am just surprised that my interest in that particular hobby has actually reduced since I started HRT, and I find myself embracing certain aspects of my masculinity like never before. I am just riding the hormones. These responses are not guilt or shame driven. I always joked that I am a bull dyke, but I may be more of one than even I suspected. I love this newfound freedom of allowing myself to be as feminine or as masculine as I please at any given time.

I have been liberated from my dysphoria. Now I get to learn who I really am without that monkey on my back.

Tori - that's great to hear that you feel a libration! I feel like I'm in a similar position as you, and as yet not on HRT. I too have a strong masculine side with a male identity, but also a strong feminine side with an emerging female identity. Sadly, the NHS over here (and most people I speak too) do not seem to accept this identity, so the general consensus is that I'm just a guy who's a bit girly sometimes, so they're seemingly trying to waste my time in the hope I'll just get fed up and give up with them.

Its ridiculous, but its perfectly fine and acceptable for a cis woman to identify as a massive tomboy but yet still wish to be identified as a woman. But a MTF has to be a stereotypical woman in order to have her femininity validated. You can't be a MTF AND be a tomboy, you're just not allowed. :p So go wear something flowery or they won't believe you! That's the attitude I feel they have. And perhaps its just the same for FTMs? No feminine transmen allowed, perhaps?

"You can't be a MTF AND be a tomboy, you're just not allowed. :p "

I see the "I'm kidding" emoticon, but just to be clear, it really is okay.

In fact, I find tomboys and femmeboys very attractive.

Quote from: "I'm Stella Stanhope, and that's why I drink". on December 27, 2013, 07:46:34 PM
Tori - that's great to hear that you feel a libration! I feel like I'm in a similar position as you, and as yet not on HRT. I too have a strong masculine side with a male identity, but also a strong feminine side with an emerging female identity. Sadly, the NHS over here (and most people I speak too) do not seem to accept this identity, so the general consensus is that I'm just a guy who's a bit girly sometimes, so they're seemingly trying to waste my time in the hope I'll just get fed up and give up with them.

Its ridiculous, but its perfectly fine and acceptable for a cis woman to identify as a massive tomboy but yet still wish to be identified as a woman. But a MTF has to be a stereotypical woman in order to have her femininity validated. You can't be a MTF AND be a tomboy, you're just not allowed. :p So go wear something flowery or they won't believe you! That's the attitude I feel they have. And perhaps its just the same for FTMs? No feminine transmen allowed, perhaps?

The NHS blows my mind. As progressive as y'all are socially and when it comes to health care compared to us Yanks, I keep seeing posts like yours that give me relief I live where I live.

The only person I know of to get on HRT quickly from the NHS went in, in full woman mode, and in no uncertain terms made it clear that this was how she intended to continue going, although I think she was also self medicating at the time which may have caused her doctor some concern.

I just think being andro/non-binary is more blasé in your culture than it is in ours. Docs don't take it as seriously. From fops to David Bowie to The Rocky Horror Show, the concept may seem so normal over there, those in need of medicine get overlooked.

Quote from: Tori on December 27, 2013, 09:33:17 PM
I just think being andro/non-binary is more blasé in your culture than it is in ours. Docs don't take it as seriously.

Not sure about that. Certainly in the cities there is a culture of negative politeness, that if you don't interfere with another person's daily life or do anything criminal, then you can be tolerated. Certainly there is more tolerance then acceptance - the other person can do as they wish as long as it doesn't get in the way of what I am doing.

Sadly, it doesn't seem like its OK to be a tomboy transwoman, though.

Just like its not OK to be a feminine guy if you are not gay and effeminate.

It really messes with people's heads for some reason. You can be a non-conformist cis person, but not a non-conformist transperson. perhaps its just too much variation and choice for people to accept. Like being confronted with too many types of cheddar cheese at the supermarket.

Its another one of those weird binary paradoxes that exist in human systems, that few people question, so the majority in their billions just blindly run with it. 

I do feel much more confident in myself now that I've stopped trying to wear women's clothes I guess I'm supposed to wear. I've gone back to wearing smart suits all the time again - just this time they are women's trouser suits. Now I can be both formal and feminine. (I tend to prefer looking formal or smart-casual instead of casual, I'be always liked an extreme preppy look :p

Quote from: "I'm Stella Stanhope, and that's why I drink". on December 29, 2013, 09:43:30 PM
Sadly, it doesn't seem like its OK to be a tomboy transwoman, though.

Just like its not OK to be a feminine guy if you are not gay and effeminate.

It really messes with people's heads for some reason. You can be a non-conformist cis person, but not a non-conformist transperson.

Not sure that you can be a non-conformist cis person either, society always wants you to fit in some box. You can only be a non-conformist that's part of an accepted group of non-conformists that are all the same.