Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I'm not saying 100% all but hell yeah, MAJORITY of them are just fakes and hypocrites. They pretend they love you blah blah blah and will never leave you no matter what but once they know what you are they dump you heartlessly.

My best friend was with a guy and as much as bogus this may sound, she's pre-op and has been having anal sex with him for 6 month every single day without the guy even suspecting. She's 200% passable. Her technique was weird, she was using a sort of thing to flatten her stuff completely and even you put your hand down there it looks flat. SHE WAS NOT DOING THIS WITH BAD INTENTION BUT COS SHE WAS DEEPLY IN LOVE WITH HIM.

And her excuse for no vaginal sex was according to her religion it was a sin to have vaginal sex before marriage, so the guy is european and she's asian.

She wanted to have the nationality here so she even planned to get married with her without the guy even knowing. On her passport her name is male but here in europe sounds a rather neutral name and he never bothered to check her details as gender on passport etc...but it was not all about papers, SHE REALLY LOVED HIM SO MUCH AND DIDN'T WANNA LOSE HIM NO MATTER WHAT.

Last time they were fighting so bad making noise that neighbours denounced them and they both were brought to cell. Even police thought she was female but only at the final turn when the policewoman told her to undress to do check up that she realized what she was and her boyfriend too came to know.

That guy pretended to love her as mad and vowed and promised NEVER to leave her NO MATTER WHAT and look what happened by the end. They both left the cell the next day but by the end the guy left her.

ONCE THEY KNOW, CONSIDER THAT MORE THAN 90% OF CASES, IT'S OVER!!! In very RARE cases a 'real' straight guy might accept, but most of the time if they accept, I guess it should be just a ->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

So basically she lied to him and didn't trust him, when he found out he left?

... and therefore it is him who is a 'fake and hypocrite'?

I don't think you can condemn all of mankind on the basis of what happened to your friend, who wasn't blameless in the situation.

Sorry, if this is true (which I question) she is the one in the wrong. 

Quote from: kira21 ♡♡♡ on March 13, 2014, 10:40:39 AM
So basically she lied to him and didn't trust him, when he found out he left?

... and therefore it is him who is a 'fake and hypocrite'?

If she told him in the beginning, he'd NEVER EVER EVER date and love her for 6 months and would have been dumped from the very second he knew. She told me she prefer lives in lies and be loved temporarily by a straight guy that be with a ->-bleeped-<-. And sorry honestly is NOT the best policy for us T-Girls on stealth mode. We need to shield for everything, whether to have a job or to be loved. We just want to be considered as a NORMAL woman and NOT A FREAK.

She isn't a "normal woman".
She still lied, deceived him.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions...

Quote from: kira21 ♡♡♡ on March 13, 2014, 10:40:39 AM
So basically she lied to him and didn't trust him, when he found out he left?

... and therefore it is him who is a 'fake and hypocrite'?

I don't think you can condemn all of mankind on the basis of what happened to your friend, who wasn't blameless in the situation.

This is the truth, like it or not.

I've disclosed to many people and everyone has been respectful. Respect breeds respect.

I agree with the above: if she was having anal sex with him and somehow managed to conceal that she is trans (which I really dont know how that would work), but didn't trust him enough to tell him then guess what? Their relationship is toast. That's so unfair to him. Really, after that, if he stayed, he must be a saint. If she was post-op, it would be a 100 percent different story. I just think if you haven't had surgery it is only fair to disclose if you are going to have anal sex. Now, if it was just oral sex, this would change the equation. I cant say why there is a difference between disclosing for sex pre-op vs. post-op i just know there is one.

Quote from: mandonlym on March 13, 2014, 11:11:33 AM
I've disclosed to many people and everyone has been respectful. Respect breeds respect.

Oh and this^. I've only had sex the back way with two guys and I disclosed to both but I have had oral without disclosing and I cant tell you how effing scared I was cause they kept going for my  crotch, tugging at my pants. And I had to slap their hand away and be like I'm having my period, please I want to but I can't. I will never put myself in that situation again. I could have been killed. There is a high rate of trans murder in Philly and i dont want to be a statistic.

Not every guy who knows the truth and continues to pursue is a ->-bleeped-<- >_>... if you live your life thinking that no guy wants to be with you because of what you are, then you are pulling that experience towards you. Law of attraction.

I'm married but when people hit on me, I'm always honest (if i really ever need to be, though I don't because my voice or the fact that I'm just starting out always gives it away) and I am always treated with respect... I've never run into any ->-bleeped-<-s other than online.

There are actually people out there who are interested in you because of who you are and not which genitalia you were born with...

It's a curious story. 6 months in an intimate relation having daily contact with that area of the body and never having a hand slip down there is pretty good . as far as wanting to marry the person why would someone want that after having been lied to for so long . Unless  she was planning on surgery before getting married which would mean  going months without having sex and expecting the guy to understand without questioning anything and then expect a marriage proposal.  as far as someone being a hypocrite and a fake.

OK, so how does a guy not know? He never touched her down there at all? Just stuck it in, no foreplay or anything else? I don't care what religion or anything else when things get hot the hands start moving. I wanna' feel, touch and taste. :embarrassed: But enough of that.

I think she was in the wrong on this one. I can see going on a date and not disclosing although I am upfront about it but when getting closer actually falling in love with someone and someone falling in love with you that is something you really need to disclose and let them make up their own mind. There are plenty of straight guys that can love us but it takes a special one that is extremely secure in his own sexuality. A lot are and a lot aren't. If I was him I would have felt betrayed, lied to and probably felt a little used.

Men are a dime a dozen. We are in charge of you we love to be with. I've posted so many times on TS dating sites, so many men have responded & all want so much detail as though they were in charge. I am the woman & I'll choose what I tell a man or do for a man.

Hold your ground girl friends. Men want & need us more than we need them.

Evolving Beauty,

It's really not about whether they deserve the truth. Whether they deserve the truth is a moral concern for them. It's a safety concern for you. Whether the guy is a hypocrite or fake who didn't deserve to be told is not going to matter if he's beating you with a fire extinguisher (real case). being upfront is more for you than it is for them. In your friend's case, he only dumped her. It could have been a lot worse. And if you're really in the line of work you've claimed to be in other posts, you need to be upfront. You don't want him to find out and get pissed and violent. This is about you and your safety, not them.

Quote from: LittleEmily24 on March 13, 2014, 11:56:26 AM
if you live your life thinking that no guy wants to be with you because of what you are, then you are pulling that experience towards you. Law of attraction.

:o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o

       

Quote from: stephaniec on March 13, 2014, 12:03:16 PM
It's a curious story. 6 months in an intimate relation having daily contact with that area of the body and never having a hand slip down there is pretty good . as far as wanting to marry the person why would someone want that after having been lied to for so long . Unless  she was planning on surgery before getting married which would mean  going months without having sex and expecting the guy to understand without questioning anything and then expect a marriage proposal.  as far as someone being a hypocrite and a fake.

She always told him NOT to touch that part of her BEFORE marriage due religeous/cultural reasons and as he was a gentleman he respected that and never even tried to touch and that guy loved anal more anyways but was NOT gay nor a ->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-.                       

Sorry, I'm tending to side with the majority opinion on this one. I'm sure your friend had her reasons, but when was she going to tell him? Never? That was never going to have a happy ending, it would have come out eventually (which it did). The guy may have been a cad for dumping her without at least trying to work it through but he was being deceived by her and has a right to feel aggrieved. If you can't have honesty in an intimate loving relationship it isn't going to be a healthy open relationship. Plus, they were fighting so much that the cops were called and they were taken down to the precinct, put in a cell and strip searched? Doesn't sound like a great relationship to be honest.

I hope your friend can find someone who accepts her and loves her, who she doesn't feel she needs to hide herself from.

I don't think anyone has the "right" to know your medical history if you don't feel they should. So long as it has no bearing on their health. So unless there is something like an STD/STI sure, he doesn't have the right to know...

That is my firm opinion, but we do live in the real world, and the truth is, if you are pre-op you will be found out eventually. That could also be a very big risk to one's health as men have been known to be very violent in this circumstance.

I don't think she was in the wrong per se, but I also don't see how she can really feel bad about what happened anyway, after all what did she expect would happen? She got in a bad situation but, enjoyed her time in love, more than she thought about her own safety; there was no way it was going to end well.

I don't see anything wrong with stealth, but you have be smarter about it. The way culture works, it would be an incredibly rare thing for a partner to find there is a penis when one wasn't expected and be indifferent to it. That is just the way things are, and they are unlikely to change soon.

Quote from: FA on March 13, 2014, 01:27:47 PM
Evolving Beauty,

It's really not about whether they deserve the truth. Whether they deserve the truth is a moral concern for them. It's a safety concern for you. Whether the guy is a hypocrite or fake who didn't deserve to be told is not going to matter if he's beating you with a fire extinguisher (real case). being upfront is more for you than it is for them. In your friend's case, he only dumped her. It could have been a lot worse. And if you're really in the line of work you've claimed to be in other posts, you need to be upfront. You don't want him to find out and get pissed and violent. This is about you and your safety, not them.

I back her up cos me and her swing the same style. I'm facing the same situation but in DOUBLE circumtances. I conceal both in a relationship I'm with with a guy who is my housemate whom I'm in love and with my 'clients' which I conceal purely for sex & money. I even needed to stop working on the streets just so that the guy I love don't see me and went to work in a house but there I need to give them a certain % of money while on street all would be just for me.

And concerning safety we girls on the streets are robust mentally. If I have to end up as Gwen Araujo whatever happens happens but I prefer die once than to die inside my heart/head everyday being rejected for what I am.

I'm getting very scared mine knows but it can explode anywhen as I'm not that perfectly passable as my friend, I conceal adam's apple with scarf constantly as we're in winter, in summer I'll die. I need to escape to reach Chettawut for both vagina & adam's before summer creeps in.  :o

All I can say is, be careful. That little money a trick gives you is not worth your life. I think there are probably a lot of guys who will still see you if they know. Pretending to be a cis girl without SRS while having sexual encounters is extremely dangerous. Cis hookers are killed and dumped all the time for no reason. You can't keep this secret. What about the guy who wants vaginal sex and won't take no for an answer? What about the guy who wants anal sex and notices you've got something more? And... it's not always a quick or peaceful death. Many are tortured to death, mutilated. Really, this is not a good idea. I'm sure you know women who've been killed. If not, I can send photos. You don't want to be a statistic or die a horrible, painful death.

Quote from: FA on March 13, 2014, 02:58:41 PM
All I can say is, be careful. That little money a trick gives you is not worth your life. I think there are probably a lot of guys who will still see you if they know. Pretending to be a cis girl without SRS while having sexual encounters is extremely dangerous. Cis hookers are killed and dumped all the time for no reason. You can't keep this secret. What about the guy who wants vaginal sex and won't take no for an answer? What about the guy who wants anal sex and notices you've got something more? And... it's not always a quick or peaceful death. Many are tortured to death, mutilated. Really, this is not a good idea. I'm sure you know women who've been killed. If not, I can send photos. You don't want to be a statistic or die a horrible, painful death.

Thanks a lot for your concern dear but in 2 months more I hope all this nightmare will be over as I'm flying to Thailand. I've been playing this dangerous game since 2009 when I began transition, lost my high-paying prestigeous job, family and the only way out was to do that to survive. And I can't work with ->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s as other girls do anyways cos most of ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s are passive gays who want to be topped, lol and I don't wanna have to do anything with my thing down there that I hate the most.  >:-)

Quote from: Evolving Beauty on March 13, 2014, 02:33:27 PM
If I have to end up as Gwen Araujo whatever happens happens but I prefer die once than to die inside my heart/head everyday being rejected for what I am.

Please bear in mind that an expert witness who examined Ms. Araujo's body concluded she'd been beaten to death over a period of 3 to 4 hours. It was not quick and painless: she was tortured to death.

Quote from: Evolving Beauty on March 13, 2014, 03:10:52 PM

Quote from: FA on March 13, 2014, 02:58:41 PM
All I can say is, be careful. That little money a trick gives you is not worth your life. I think there are probably a lot of guys who will still see you if they know. Pretending to be a cis girl without SRS while having sexual encounters is extremely dangerous. Cis hookers are killed and dumped all the time for no reason. You can't keep this secret. What about the guy who wants vaginal sex and won't take no for an answer? What about the guy who wants anal sex and notices you've got something more? And... it's not always a quick or peaceful death. Many are tortured to death, mutilated. Really, this is not a good idea. I'm sure you know women who've been killed. If not, I can send photos. You don't want to be a statistic or die a horrible, painful death.

Thanks a lot for your concern dear but in 2 months more I hope all this nightmare will be over as I'm flying to Thailand. I've been playing this dangerous game since 2009 when I began transition, lost my high-paying prestigeous job, family and the only way out was to do that to survive. And I can't work with ->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-s as other girls do anyways cos most of ->-bleeped-<- ->-bleeped-<-s are passive gays who want to be topped, lol and I don't wanna have to do anything with my thing down there that I hate the most.  >:-)

I really hope so hon. I don't know your routine, where you're at or what exactly you're doing. But it only takes one. One night, one hour. One violent customer. No matter who he is, what he's paying, or where you're meeting. Please be careful.

Quote from: Evolving Beauty on March 13, 2014, 01:56:23 PM
She always told him NOT to touch that part of her BEFORE marriage due religeous/cultural reasons and as he was a gentleman he respected that and never even tried to touch and that guy loved anal more anyways but was NOT gay nor a ->-bleeped-<--->-bleeped-<-.                       

just curious , what religion  and culture advocates anal intercourse as a lesser  premarital taboo,

Quote from: Hikari on March 13, 2014, 02:26:15 PM
I don't think anyone has the "right" to know your medical history if you don't feel they should. So long as it has no bearing on their health. So unless there is something like an STD/STI sure, he doesn't have the right to know...

Normally I'd agree wholeheartedly - thing is mental health is a big factor in this, someone could kill themselves after this kind of revelation and I don't believe it is fair enough to say they need to get over their transphobia and prejudice.

Quote from: Ms Grace on March 13, 2014, 04:47:41 PM
Normally I'd agree wholeheartedly - thing is mental health is a big factor in this, someone could kill themselves after this kind of revelation and I don't believe it is fair enough to say they need to get over their transphobia and prejudice.

I need to agree with Grace on this point . we are not talking about hiding the fact that I ate too much candy on Halloween as a child and needed all my teeth extracted and replaced with dentures.

Quote from: stephaniec on March 13, 2014, 03:31:10 PM
just curious , what religion  and culture advocates anal intercourse as a lesser  premarital taboo,

Funny that you mention that Stephanie. I was listening to an SXM station yesterday, I ain't gonna say which station but a conversation came up about a virgin girl letting her boyfriend do anal instead of vaginal. She still considered herself a virgin and saving the other for marriage. Doesn't make sense to me but different strokes I guess.

And Evolving Beauty, just be really careful out there. We all gotta do what we gotta do to survive and I have been on the wild side myself when I was younger under different circumstances and there are some really derainged people out there. I think that I met every one of them at one time or another. Don't let yourself get into a bad situation and always have something to protect yourself with.

It just occurred to me that this story might be a bit too "Madam Butterfly" to be real...

Ι can imagine that most people would dump you knowing you are trans,,,

yet the love of your life isnt most people ...so ...

Quote from: Ms Grace on March 13, 2014, 04:47:41 PM
Normally I'd agree wholeheartedly - thing is mental health is a big factor in this, someone could kill themselves after this kind of revelation and I don't believe it is fair enough to say they need to get over their transphobia and prejudice.

I agree with this. It frustrates me sometimes that we expect so much understanding from people and yet we demand so much of the people we're with. Many of us take years and years to get over our own internal transphobia and be ourselves, whereas we just demand that other people get over theirs. We claim our right to be the gender we want to be yet rationalize being dishonest with people we're supposed to care deeply about. I don't get it sometimes.

Quote from: mandonlym on March 13, 2014, 05:45:46 PM
I agree with this. It frustrates me sometimes that we expect so much understanding from people and yet we demand so much of the people we're with. Many of us take years and years to get over our own internal transphobia and be ourselves, whereas we just demand that other people get over theirs. We claim our right to be the gender we want to be yet rationalize being dishonest with people we're supposed to care deeply about. I don't get it sometimes.

yes, this is so mind boggling to me that people feel no need what so ever to divulge such a fundamental truth about themselves and expect the person they're with to be totally ok with the with holding of that information until the time the other partner comes across it. Of course I'm pre op so I can't speak as a post opt, but it still strikes me as strange when your talking of loving some one and wanting total love in return.

Quote from: JamesG on March 13, 2014, 05:12:20 PM
It just occurred to me that this story might be a bit too "Madam Butterfly" to be real...

Glad I am not the only one with this thought. :)

Quote from: Ms Grace on March 13, 2014, 04:47:41 PM
Normally I'd agree wholeheartedly - thing is mental health is a big factor in this, someone could kill themselves after this kind of revelation and I don't believe it is fair enough to say they need to get over their transphobia and prejudice.

If anyone were to kill themselves over being with someone who is trans and not knowing, then they had issues far deeper than transphobia in the first place. And not everyone has had to come to terms with being trans. I've been gender non-congruent forever, and I've never had any issues with myself other than lack of money from being born in the wrong class structure. But that's all I got to say, there was an argument about this awhile back and some of the best, most prolific posters are now gone...forever. Maybe. Really, what someone does with their life is their business. It's as simple as that. I know I'm not well liked on this forum, but it's still the truth whether it's from my mouth or someone who is all wise and has 10 bazillion patcha on the back points.

In 1987 and 1989 I ran on two males who were tricked by trans women who would disagree the statement just made. They identified as cis male hetero's by the suicide note who said they couldn't live normally anymore because of the sexual encounter and the truth abut their partners. I am not making any judgment here just stating the fact that cis male hetero's who are tricked respond when the truth is out in several different ways. Violence, suicide, acceptance or revenge. Do we have the right to do this to anyone without their knowledge, NO we don't. If someone is secure with their sexuality we don't have the right to trick them, period.

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 07:17:05 PM
In 1987 and 1989 I ran on two males who were tricked by trans women who would disagree the statement just made. They identified as cis male hetero's by the suicide note who said they couldn't live normally anymore because of the sexual encounter and the truth abut their partners. I am not making any judgment here just stating the fact that cis male hetero's who are tricked respond when the truth is out in several different ways. Violence, suicide, acceptance or revenge. Do we have the right to do this to anyone without their knowledge, NO we don't. If someone is secure with their sexuality we don't have the right to trick them, period.

So, I get it. I'm not a real woman, it's just a trick? So, I should have to disclose to everyone because they might get their feelings hurt becaus two crazy people killed themselves...I'll say again, if someone kills themselves over a sexual encounter, they far deeper issues and woulda killed thmeselves anyway for some other reason. Period. BUT...Seriously, tricked? Is this a support site for transsexuals?

Yeah I think of it as an ethical rather than a moral issue. I don't think anyone is morally obligated disclose, but I do think that if one commits to spending one's life with someone, there's an ethical obligation for the partner to know important details about the person's life. And one of those details is their gender history. I've dated people, sometimes for long periods of time, without disclosing. But I've always told anyone I've loved.

Also, if we extend our sympathy towards transwomen who become suicidal over the issue, how can we dismiss the issues of their partners so easily?

Quote from: Joanna Dark on March 13, 2014, 07:09:17 PM
If anyone were to kill themselves over being with someone who is trans and not knowing, then they had issues far deeper than transphobia in the first place. And not everyone has had to come to terms with being trans. I've been gender non-congruent forever, and I've never had any issues with myself other than lack of money from being born in the wrong class structure. But that's all I got to say, there was an argument about this awhile back and some of the best, most prolific posters are now gone...forever. Maybe. Really, what someone does with their life is their business. It's as simple as that. I know I'm not well liked on this forum, but it's still the truth whether it's from my mouth or someone who is all wise and has 10 bazillion patcha on the back points.

well. people might be hard pressed to kill themselves, but it is true that someone can get totally unhinged if they found out they've been sleeping with someone that in their pre modern  vision of femininity might cause a considerable amount of mental rage. l 

Quote from: Joanna Dark on March 13, 2014, 07:24:17 PM
So, I get it. I'm not a real woman, it's just a trick? So, I should have to disclose to everyone because they might get their feelings hurt becaus two crazy people killed themselves...I'll say again, if someone kills themselves over a sexual encounter, they far deeper issues and woulda killed thmeselves anyway for some other reason. Period. BUT...Seriously, tricked? Is this a support site for transsexuals?

No one said that, especially me. I consider you a woman just like I do myself. The difference is our histories can hurt the right people if we do not take their feeling into our consideration. Like it or not we have histories and all the surgeries and name changes will never erase that. I just personally feel I owe it to someone special to allow them access to my past just as I would expect access to theirs. How else will there be a relationship based on trust and respect. :) Finally, this IS a support site, but you cant trash it because you don't agree with someone. Attack me, but not Susan's as this place has helped thousands over the years and should not be held accountable to my opinion. :)

I think FA hit it on the head.  It's not our place to condone or disagree with someone else's actions, but we should acknowledge there are risks.  If someone decides to follow through after considering everything, that's there choice.  I really sympathize with those that choose to not disclose and will never judge them, but I don't think that is something I'd be comfortable with for myself.  Having said all that, I definelty understand why the op feels the way they do as I fear that I'll never meet an understanding guy.  I can't judge. 

I'm not going to argue, but ill leave you this: the American Bar Association recently issued a decision that any lawyer who uses the trans panic defense in the assault or murder of a trans woman will be disbarred. Why? Because it's bunk. If you're that unhinged that kissing a letting a trans woman perform oral sex on you makes you murder someone or kill yourself, then you have deeper issues that need to be addressed. Like now. Or yesterday. Here we are again arguing about the same issue of disclosure yet how many people on this board have been in that situation where they are taken for cis and been in a sexual situation? I have. It's not so black and white as you may think. Sex happens. At least to me it does. And sometimes you're just talking to someone and flirting harmlessly and next thing you know, you're kissing and down on your knees. BTW, I disclosed to my ex-BF the day I met him, but he's now just my BFF and person I sleep with occasionally like, uh, three hours ago/ So this is an issue that actually really effects me. It's not some academic argument. It's my life. I wasn't trashing the site or you; I just take issue with the word, tricked. That it. No biggie. I gots my big girl panties on so it's all good...or maybe i'm just happy and satisfied today cause I got the only person I actually care about back. So yeah. Sorry.

Quote from: learningtolive on March 13, 2014, 07:40:40 PM
I think FA hit it on the head.  It's not our place to condone or disagree with someone else's actions, but we should acknowledge there are risks.  If someone decides to follow through after considering everything, that's there choice.  I really sympathize with those that choose to not disclose and will never judge them, but I don't think that is something I'd be comfortable with for myself.  Having said all that, I definelty understand why the op feels the way they do as I fear that I'll never meet an understanding guy.  I can't judge. 

And this^ It's better if someone far more emotionally stable then me talks. So Ill shut up.

Lol on me being more mentally stable!  I'm like the craziest person here! ;)

Quote from: learningtolive on March 13, 2014, 07:54:37 PM
Lol on me being more mentally stable!  I'm like the craziest person here! ;)

I turned to craaaaazy into an artform lol don't be treading on my turf :-)

Quote from: mandonlym on March 13, 2014, 07:31:11 PM
Yeah I think of it as an ethical rather than a moral issue. I don't think anyone is morally obligated disclose, but I do think that if one commits to spending one's life with someone, there's an ethical obligation for the partner to know important details about the person's life. And one of those details is their gender history. I've dated people, sometimes for long periods of time, without disclosing. But I've always told anyone I've loved.

Also, if we extend our sympathy towards transwomen who become suicidal over the issue, how can we dismiss the issues of their partners so easily?

I don't know ethical or unethical, why would you want to keep that kind of information hidden, only out or fear of rejection, By having that fear you acknowledging to your self that there is some not right in withholding that information. Your free to live how you want to live, but your consciousness is acknowledging that there is something not right in doing so. Your forced to carry that burden the rest of the relationship.

With people to whom I haven't disclosed, I don't know, I just didn't think the relationship was substantial enough and it wasn't really any of their business at that point. Like, if I had breast cancer that went into remission ten years ago, that's an important part of my life I would tell someone I love, but not necessarily something I would tell someone I'm dating but haven't gotten that close enough to yet. As much as I believe in openness, I also think people have a right to privacy.

I really don't see how it is tricking them or lying to them.  Yeah, it's not telling them something about your past, but if i didn't tell someone I had cancer, I haven't tricked them into being with me.  If they have a problem with it if they find out before I decide to tell them, isn't that their problem?  I understand from a safety point of view it's probably good to tell.  But from an ethical or moral point of view, no it's up to me when I feel comfortable telling and if they have an issue, it's not on me and guess what? They probably weren't worth it anyways, and that's the only thing on me is wasting my own time on a loser.

Quote from: Caysee Danielle on March 13, 2014, 08:08:40 PM
I really don't see how it is tricking them or lying to them.

If they have indicated they prefer not to have a relationship with a Trans person or are secure with their chosen gender identification it is. :)

The problem is, when is a lie a lie? Is it a lie if you go with a man who identifies as straight, and you just don't tell him you don't have a vagina? Of course it is. Is it a lie to tell a man who hasn't identified himself as straight, bi or poly? That's where the gray area lies.

It's easier for those of us who prefer other women, because the most a woman is going to do is walk away- you're not likely to be beaten, raped or murdered (or all 3) by a woman who feels spurned, but you are likely to by a man who does.

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 08:23:49 PM
If they have indicated they prefer not to have a relationship with a Trans person or are secure with their chosen gender identification it is. :)

Most of the time there is no indication that they are against transgender people either.  Sure, it's easy to assume they may not be open to it, but how are you really going to know without discussing it?

I don't know.  Straight guys that had no problem sleeping with women without knowing their partner's history or background shouldn't act all holier than thou when they find out.  I mean they don't care about their partners background or history at all unless they are trans?  So everything else being ommitted but trans status is okay?  I don't know, it just sounds odd and sort of arbitrary for that to be the one thing that they care, especially when they aren't really showing that they are interested in their partners background at all.

Again, I'll likely be disclosing myself as I can't imagine dating otherwise, but it pissess me off how unaccepting and self righteous some of these straight guys are. 

Quote from: KelsieJ on March 13, 2014, 08:32:16 PM
The problem is, when is a lie a lie? Is it a lie if you go with a man who identifies as straight, and you just don't tell him you don't have a vagina? Of course it is. Is it a lie to tell a man who hasn't identified himself as straight, bi or poly? That's where the gray area lies.

It's easier for those of us who prefer other women, because the most a woman is going to do is walk away- you're not likely to be beaten, raped or murdered (or all 3) by a woman who feels spurned, but you are likely to by a man who does.

this is exactly what I have been trying to say. Thanks Kelsie. :)

that's the problem . that's the nature of the beast. Why are there bullies from time immemorial . It's the nature of the human condition from when the first group of monkeys attacked and killed another monkey then proceeded to make a meal . the goal of the human condition should be enlightenment but it seems it's going to take a while to get there.

 Men lie to us all the time. They swear they are straight just wanting sex, then most admit they are gay & want us to just be a gay man with them. It's so upsetting. I've meet so many men like that. It's all a game & we should take care of ourselves first, be honest but take care of yourself GF's.

It's very difficult to tell a man who's interested that you're trans, and very dangerous not tell a man who's interested that you're trans. What I suggest to friends who are transitioning is that they go to gay bars during their transition, which brings it's own issues. But if someone is in a gay bar and interested, they're probably bi, or poly, or.....etc, etc, so it brings a great deal of safety.

But a trans*woman picking up a cisgender male in a cis-bar is something I strongly recommend people against, especially during the early stages of transition, when you're still defining yourself.

I just think about a topic like this ending up on a cis site where trans people are called "losers", "deceivers" or "dime a dozen" because we think we have a pass on not disclosing our true selves. I can see this from a flip side of the coin. It can breed contempt for us and further complicate OUR lives as well if they think we are ALL trying to hide ourselves and intentionally deceive. This will not do us any good in the long run and keep us where we are now. I am just trying to see this issue from both sides. How are we ever going to get people to accept and trust us with this issue out there. Just food for thought, no judgment intended. :)

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 09:09:03 PM
I just think about a topic like this ending up on a cis site where trans people are called "losers", "deceivers" or "dime a dozen" because we think we have a pass on not disclosing our true selves. I can see this from a flip side of the coin. It can breed contempt for us and further complicate OUR lives as well if they think we are ALL trying to hide ourselves and intentionally deceive. This will not do us any good in the long run and keep us where we are now. I am just trying to see this issue from both sides. How are we ever going to get people to accept and trust us with this issue out there. Just food for thought, no judgment intended. :)

makes sense.

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 09:09:03 PM
I just think about a topic like this ending up on a cis site where trans people are called "losers", "deceivers" or "dime a dozen" because we think we have a pass on not disclosing our true selves. I can see this from a flip side of the coin. It can breed contempt for us and further complicate OUR lives as well if they think we are ALL trying to hide ourselves and intentionally deceive. This will not do us any good in the long run and keep us where we are now. I am just trying to see this issue from both sides. How are we ever going to get people to accept and trust us with this issue out there. Just food for thought, no judgment intended. :)

Well said :)

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 08:23:49 PM
If they have indicated they prefer not to have a relationship with a Trans person or are secure with their chosen gender identification it is. :)

Are you talking about just pre-op trans women or post-op women. See the difference there. Once I have SRS in a year and a half, I will no longer consider myself trans at all, but a woman.  So do I go about disclosing my entire very confusing, incredibly complicated life? When I was three, I wasn't allowed to walk and was in a hospital because of sciatica and issues with my genitals. 'Nuff aid about that. But, hopefully this is moot for me and things works out with the guy I am in love with right now. He has issues with me not having a vagina. But he does love me, it's just so hard. And sometimes I wish I met him when I was post-op just so I could have never have told him and then we would perfect cause we're perfect for each other. He told me yesterday how it's so weird how everything we do turns out so perfect. But do go through all this disclosure business again...when I'm post-op...ugh. Do you know how hard it was getting to this point?

There will be no way to tell I was in any way male once I do this. None. I don't understand why I have to get people to trust trans people. I only identify as trans cause it's easier. I'm intersexed. And I have chromosomes to prove it. But I'm still trans cause i'm transitioning, even if it's from I-to-F. I have people who know I'm trans and will talk about non-passing trans women right in front of me. It can be awkward.

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 09:09:03 PM
I just think about a topic like this ending up on a cis site where trans people are called "losers", "deceivers" or "dime a dozen" because we think we have a pass on not disclosing our true selves. I can see this from a flip side of the coin. It can breed contempt for us and further complicate OUR lives as well if they think we are ALL trying to hide ourselves and intentionally deceive. This will not do us any good in the long run and keep us where we are now. I am just trying to see this issue from both sides. How are we ever going to get people to accept and trust us with this issue out there. Just food for thought, no judgment intended. :)

If one judges from ->-bleeped-<-, which is probably the most popular general online forum, then people are reasonably understanding of non-disclosure, even for pre-ops actually. Because 1. it's a privacy issue, and 2. transwomen are women, pre-op or post-op, and it's the sex partner's prejudice that causes them not to be perceived that way, and one shouldn't condone prejudice. So the only reason for a lot of people to suggest disclosure is for safety reasons.

For the record, I agree that full disclosure is *ideal* politically (it educates people), but I don't think it's unethical not to disclose to someone who you don't consider an important part of your life. People don't disclose possible disqualifiers about them all the time. It doesn't hurt anyone or ruin anyone's life to sleep with a transwoman once or a few times.

I think there might be some idealism here form people who haven't extensively lived this experience. I was *really* out for a few years in grad school, and it was *really* exhausting to have to answer all these questions when you just want to have sex with someone. It's really not sexy. Sometimes you just want to have fun, casual sex and it really ruins the mood to be talking about all this heavy stuff. For better or for worse, I haven't managed to integrate "By the way I'm trans" into my seduction routine. :)

So yes, I'm having sex tomorrow with someone I haven't disclosed to and it's going to be awesome and fun (we've done it before so I know that). I don't feel dishonest about it because he can't tell the difference, and his only reason to potentially reject me would be him being transphobic. We might get more emotionally involved and at that point I'll tell him. But for now we're just having fun and I don't feel an obligation to tell him.

Quote from: Joanna Dark
Are you talking about just pre-op trans women or post-op women. See the difference there. Once I have SRS in a year and a half, I will no longer consider myself trans at all, but a woman. 

The problem with this, is that you're in a minority. The vast majority of trans* women are non-op, or pre-op......but out of those who identify as pre-op, very few actually have the bottom surgery done due to the cost.

You're a woman anyway, no matter if you have an innie or an outtie down there. It simply doesn't matter. What does matter is how people react to you. You're very, very lucky that you can afford to have SRS. It's the exception, not the rule though,

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 09:09:03 PM
I just think about a topic like this ending up on a cis site where trans people are called "losers", "deceivers" or "dime a dozen" because we think we have a pass on not disclosing our true selves. I can see this from a flip side of the coin. It can breed contempt for us and further complicate OUR lives as well if they think we are ALL trying to hide ourselves and intentionally deceive. This will not do us any good in the long run and keep us where we are now. I am just trying to see this issue from both sides. How are we ever going to get people to accept and trust us with this issue out there. Just food for thought, no judgment intended. :)

Like I said, I have no problem with disclosure and will do it myself, but I find it hypocritical of a man that hides his entire past before a one night stand sit and judge a woman for not disclosing something from hers.  And I see that all the time.  Like the girl owes him all the details in the world, but he can keep everything secret.  Personally, that's why I'm not a fan of those sort of things and believe intimacy should be had only after emotional connection nor can I see that developing without full honesty, but it does change the fact that this happens and not everyone shares my view.  In those cases, I don't think the girl is any more guilty than the man for not disclosing their background before hooking up.

And regardless of what we say or do, there are many in the cis world that will call us names to no end.  Even if we are doing the "right" thing or try to win their approval.  It will never happen.  It's sad but true. 

Quote from: KelsieJ on March 13, 2014, 09:33:44 PM
The problem with this, is that you're in a minority. The vast majority of trans* women are non-op, or pre-op......but out of those who identify as pre-op, very few actually have the bottom surgery done due to the cost.

You're a woman anyway, no matter if you have an innie or an outtie down there. It simply doesn't matter. What does matter is how people react to you. You're very, very lucky that you can afford to have SRS. It's the exception, not the rule though,

I haven't had SRS. I'm poor. I am on food stamps. But I am managine to save money. It's a matter of choices. Does having a nice phone matter, or transition. I got my phone from Obama. Does going on vacation matter, or transtion. I walk arounf with my ex-BF now BFF, soon to be agin BF. I'm young, have no family, i live with my mom who let me move back so I could save money for SRS. I mean if you have a fmaily and kids, yes, it's harder. But if you're young and have no kids, you can save the money for SRS. or take out a loan. You can also go to South America where it doesnt cost 21,000. It costs half that. I'm pretty sure there are tanssexuals in SA and they are not coming to the US for surgery. So, why would I do it here when I could do it there for half the cost. It can be done. I will make it happen or die trying. It's about how much you want it. But I dont want it. I need it.

OK, I will try a hypothetical here:

You go out with a cis male who identifies as hetero. You don't tell him you are trans and sleep with him. At some point a co-worker or someone knows who you are and tells the guys boss who is a homophobe. The guys boss fires him from his job after several years of service. The guy want to know why he is being fired and finds out you are a transsexual and his boss doesn't accept him sleeping with you. Now he is pissed because you did not tell him, got him fired and he loses everything. What do you think he will do to you? ??? You're actions affect other people and their lives. How do you casually dismiss their feelings and potential damage?

Quote from: mandonlym on March 13, 2014, 09:29:34 PM
If one judges from ->-bleeped-<-, which is probably the most popular general online forum, then people are reasonably understanding of non-disclosure, even for pre-ops actually. Because 1. it's a privacy issue, and 2. transwomen are women, pre-op or post-op, and it's the sex partner's prejudice that causes them not to be perceived that way, and one shouldn't condone prejudice. So the only reason for a lot of people to suggest disclosure is for safety reasons.

For the record, I agree that full disclosure is *ideal* politically (it educates people), but I don't think it's unethical not to disclose to someone who you don't consider an important part of your life. People don't disclose possible disqualifiers about them all the time. It doesn't hurt anyone or ruin anyone's life to sleep with a transwoman once or a few times.

I think there might be some idealism here form people who haven't extensively lived this experience. I was *really* out for a few years in grad school, and it was *really* exhausting to have to answer all these questions when you just want to have sex with someone. It's really not sexy. Sometimes you just want to have fun, casual sex and it really ruins the mood to be talking about all this heavy stuff. For better or for worse, I haven't managed to integrate "By the way I'm trans" into my seduction routine. :)

So yes, I'm having sex tomorrow with someone I haven't disclosed to and it's going to be awesome and fun (we've done it before so I know that). I don't feel dishonest about it because he can't tell the difference, and his only reason to potentially reject me would be him being transphobic. We might get more emotionally involved and at that point I'll tell him. But for now we're just having fun and I don't feel an obligation to tell him.

Well , there is no need to feel an obligation. at this stage your taking each other at face value. Your both out to have a good time. Your both adults and that what adults do.

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 09:43:38 PM
OK, I will try a hypothetical here:

You go out with a cis male who identifies as hetero. You don't tell him you are trans and sleep with him. At some point a co-worker or someone knows who you are and tells the guys boss who is a homophobe. The guys boss fires him from his job after several years of service. The guy want to know why he is being fired and finds out you are a transsexual and his boss doesn't accept him sleeping with you. Now he is pissed because you did not tell him, got him fired and he loses everything. What do you think he will do to you? ??? You're actions affect other people and their lives. How do you casually dismiss their feelings and potential damage?

In this case the problem is not that you are trans. The problem is that the guy's boss is a homophobe. Just transform this situation from gender status to race. Say you're 1/8 black and don't disclose to a guy. His boss who is a member of the KKK finds out and fires the guy you slept with. Is it your fault? I would say no.

Quote from: Joanna Dark
I haven't had SRS. I'm poor. I am on food stamps. But I am managine to save money. It's a matter of choices. Does having a nice phone matter, or transition. I got my phone from Obama. Does going on vacation matter, or transtion. I walk arounf with my ex-BF now BFF, soon to be agin BF. I'm young, have no family, i live with my mom who let me move back so I could save money for SRS. I mean if you have a fmaily and kids, yes, it's harder. But if you're young and have no kids, you can save the money for SRS. or take out a loan. You can also go to South America where it doesnt cost 21,000. It costs half that. I'm pretty sure there are tanssexuals in SA and they are not coming to the US for surgery. So, why would I do it here when I could do it there for half the cost. It can be done. I will make it happen or die trying. It's about how much you want it. But I dont want it. I need it.

Living with your mom has to be an immense help, as is being young. Again though, it shows that you're one of the lucky ones, because most of us don't have understanding parents or people to support us through transition. Most of us lose our families and loved ones, our husbands or wives, our kids, our homes, our jobs, etc.

I'm genuinely happy for you that you have the things you need in place to transition, and yes, it is a need. But please understand that I wasn't attacking you at all, just saying that you're in a minority. And you are.

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 08:23:49 PM
If they have indicated they prefer not to have a relationship with a Trans person or are secure with their chosen gender identification it is. :)

If they have indicated this, why the hell am I dating them?  Where did this come from?  I'm talking about average joe not being owed a complete history of everything private about me that he might not like.

Quote from: KelsieJ on March 13, 2014, 09:50:06 PM
Living with your mom has to be an immense help, as is being young. Again though, it shows that you're one of the lucky ones, because most of us don't have understanding parents or people to support us through transition. Most of us lose our families and loved ones, our husbands or wives, our kids, our homes, our jobs, etc.

I'm genuinely happy for you that you have the things you need in place to transition, and yes, it is a need. But please understand that I wasn't attacking you at all, just saying that you're in a minority. And you are.

Oh I totally got what you were saying. I know I'm lucky. I know I'm very lucky. I should prolly thank God. Ok, Just did. haha hehe

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 09:43:38 PM
OK, I will try a hypothetical here:

You go out with a cis male who identifies as hetero. You don't tell him you are trans and sleep with him. At some point a co-worker or someone knows who you are and tells the guys boss who is a homophobe. The guys boss fires him from his job after several years of service. The guy want to know why he is being fired and finds out you are a transsexual and his boss doesn't accept him sleeping with you. Now he is pissed because you did not tell him, got him fired and he loses everything. What do you think he will do to you? ??? You're actions affect other people and their lives. How do you casually dismiss their feelings and potential damage?

Why does everyone hate trans women in your scenarios? I can't help if the guy's boss is a bigot. It's prolly unethical to work for and continue to support people like that, truthfully. Do you know how long I have planning this? Pretty long. Ever since I got of prison when I was 20 years old, 11 years ago. Ya see, having messed up genitals kinda messes ya up in the head and when I was 15 I started shooting heroin. I don't wanna go back to that. I went to school, graduated head of my class and was runner up for Valedictorian and became a women's magazine editor. I'm prolly going to go to grad school in order to finish my transtion and then start over. But ill be damned if my hellish nightmare life that is finally turning into a beautiful dream is derailed by anyone. And yes disclosing to someone just because its the right thing to do could blow up in your face. You disclose after you know them. You can read them. Not before. That might take awhile. It depends. Life is not B&W.

BTW, not everyone is as bad as you think. My BF, ex, whateva, is a conservative Christian yet he tells everyone about me. But I'm also a hermie so, that prolly helps.

Quote from: Caysee Danielle on March 13, 2014, 09:56:49 PM
If they have indicated this, why the hell am I dating them?  Where did this come from?  I'm talking about average joe not being owed a complete history of everything private about me that he might not like.

^This. Very well said.

Quote from: Joanna Dark on March 13, 2014, 09:59:46 PM
Why does everyone hate trans women in your scenarios?

Only for the fact we are talking about MTF and what should or not be disclosed to cis males.

There is no hate in me at all. A question was asked and I replied with my opinion, nothing else. How do we come to understandings without both sides presenting their views? I have not attacked anyone tonight, just debating a topic in a mature manner. :)

Sidebar!

Quote from: learningtolive on March 13, 2014, 09:40:03 PM

And regardless of what we say or do, there are many in the cis world that will call us names to no end.  Even if we are doing the "right" thing or try to win their approval.  It will never happen.  It's sad but true.

Never say never. We are rapidly approaching "Singularity" (good book BTW), a no-going-back-point of technology where nanotechnology and genetic engineering will allow people to edit and modify themselves pretty much at will (assuming the machines don't just do away with humans). If you can make yourself blue with octopus arms, being transgendered will seem pretty tame. The social norms of today will either adapt to that reality or be replaced by something else.

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 10:09:22 PM
Only for the fact we are talking about MTF and what should or not be disclosed to cis males.

There is no hate in me at all. A question was asked and I replied with my opinion, nothing else. How do we come to understandings without both sides presenting their views? I have not attacked anyone tonight, just debating a topic in a mature manner. :)

Again are you talking about pre-op or post-op disclosure? They are different beasts.

so basically the problem is, if you want to have a night of sex , there is a statistical advantage to not mentioning your birth gender.

Quote from: stephaniec on March 13, 2014, 10:20:39 PM
so basically the problem is, if you want to have a night of sex , there is a statistical advantage to not mentioning your birth gender.

For a corresponding increase in the probability of winding up alone with a black eye...  :(

Quote from: stephaniec on March 13, 2014, 10:20:39 PM
so basically the problem is, if you want to have a night of sex , there is a statistical advantage to not mentioning your birth gender.

I don't have problems picking guys up (or them picking me up, whichever), and I'm pretty sure most of the ones I sleep with wouldn't care. But it totally ruins the mood to have to talk about it in an early-date situation. I only disclose if I decide that I want to be in a relationship with the guy, although my activism is becoming increasingly public so soon people can probably ID me using a google search.

Quote from: mandonlym on March 13, 2014, 10:39:41 PM
I don't have problems picking guys up (or them picking me up, whichever), and I'm pretty sure most of the ones I sleep with wouldn't care. But it totally ruins the mood to have to talk about it in an early-date situation. I only disclose if I decide that I want to be in a relationship with the guy, although my activism is becoming increasingly public so soon people can probably ID me using a google search.

I wasn't trying to be disrespectful. It just seems everyone that was posting only concern was that if they said anything the guy was taking off . I really meant not to be mean , it was just an observation.

Quote from: stephaniec on March 13, 2014, 10:45:40 PM
I wasn't trying to be disrespectful. It just seems everyone that was posting only concern was that if they said anything the guy was taking off . I really meant not to be mean , it was just an observation.

Oh no I wasn't offended. I was just being explanatory. You'll be able to tell if I'm offended. I get on top of a big old high horse. :)

Quote from: Ms Grace on March 13, 2014, 04:47:41 PM
Normally I'd agree wholeheartedly - thing is mental health is a big factor in this, someone could kill themselves after this kind of revelation and I don't believe it is fair enough to say they need to get over their transphobia and prejudice.

I have to respectfully disagree. Not that someone couldn't kill themselves, sure they could and has been mentioned have, but that it wouldn't be the fault of the transperson.

My logic is the exact same reason why I have broken up with people who threatened suicide if I left. I am only responsible for my own actions, unless I am being actively coercive. If I for example, threatened to blackmail, harm, etc unless someone does what I want then I am being actively coercive. If a partner says they will slit their wrists if I leave do I have some sort of moral obligation to stay? I don't think I do.

I would wager far more people kill themselves after being sent a divorce notice than sleeping with a transsexual; yet we never blame someone for wanting a divorce. To me, it just seems impossible to really blame someone for someone else's self harm. Which means yes, I take the unpopular view that bullies should be punished for bullying, but if the person they bullied committed suicide they are still not murderers. Unless there is some actively coercive element (i.e. goading someone to do it, threatening harm on others if one doesn't commit suicide, etc) I just cannot transfer the blame to those who didn't commit the action.

I do however fully understand how you could view it the way you do, and I used to view it in much the same way until I had the threat of suicide from a girlfriend (It wasn't a credible threat in my view, but you can't assume anything when it comes to suicide). After that I reevaluated my moral judgements on these things, after all should I be constrained by the threat of someone else's self harm?

Edit: For double negative, my English teacher would be mad lol.

How do I know what part of my past history is going to potentially end up making someone commit suicide because I had sex with them and they didn't 'know'? Will it be the part of my genes that say I'm part Jewish, perhaps even part African? I didn't do my due diligence thoroughly and they're a closet Nazi. Oops. Oh well, there'll be a future where we'll be able to have our genome analysed and all traits, behaviours, predispositions, future tendencies, ethnicities etc. exposed. A potential partner will then be able to request this data for them to pore over for compatibility. Everyone will be happy! For example, potential partners will be able to avoid being tricked into marrying someone they thought was one gender only later to transition to another. If 'trick' sounds offensive, that's because it is. I apologise. Judge not, that ye be not judged, blah..

Anyway, there appears to be an obvious divide here. Today, I read very little about goings-on in the "community", ignore anti-gay and transphobic diatribes and do not personally know any other transgender people in real life. Only people very close to me know about me. When I was fresh into transition, I was all ears and all eyes. Any transphobic remarks I took personally. I was up on all LGBT current events. I also had an 'acceptable' image to defend to the few people I came out to. Things were a little different back then. Opinions were different. Live a few years, they'll change. Nothing's written in stone. As mandonlym said, it does sound like idealism. You know, like students fresh out of college etc.

How I proceed in my relationships is of my own concern, only.

As you were.

But of course the man we are about to start dating has a right to information about our most personal and embarrassing struggles and a complete run down of our medical record! Shish! If we don't inform we are basically rapists (or so I've been told...soundly). Not telling a guy and going to bed with him is fraud and rape by deception. Just like women who have been raped, have been molested as children, have had psychological issues, had many sex partners while young, had an abortion, have a grandmother of mixed race etc, we must also immediately confess, because the guy has a RIGHT to know about these things in case they should be some kind of a turn off for him. If we don't fess up we run the risk of potentially forcing the poor man into caving our skulls in with a tire iron, and that is not good. Killing a trans woman can be a rather big nuisance to a man. If the murder should happen to be investigated, the poor feller could end up missing work to attend the trial, and we can't have that.

Actually I don't really feel this way anymore. I used to though, but I guess my Stockholm syndrome just gave out over the years. In my daily life my transition has become so distant and irrelevant I never tell anyone anymore. Should I however develop a fetish for being treated like dirt, then I might reconsider, but for now I'm good living a life that doesn't really involve a lot of trans-related issues.

This is a delicate subject for many including myself. I would first like to say that anybody, straight, gay, women, trans....whoever, deserve to know the truth!! when to do that....is the question. I don't announce to anyone about my born gender, unless there is a need too....doctors, children's teachers (not all) and possibly new friends or boy friends.

I had always thought I would inform anyone at first contact, I later changed to the view of informing them the first time we met. The few dates I have had, I failed to inform them at all. The first few dates were just a one and done...another went on for a little while but no intimate contact. My last relationship went on for awhile and things became much more intimate then I expected...but it felt so good...and so right. He did want to have sex but I told him this is something I will not do and cannot at this time....I left it at that. He accepted that and things went on ok.

Things eventually ended. I could of stayed with him...but in truth I think it was the lack of sex that created distance in us. I also wanted to end things rather than tell him the truth of my born gender. I do feel very bad that I could not tell him my background before the first kiss....but it was not intentional. In fact in the 6 months we were together, we probably seen each other 6-8 times. Mostly due to busy schedules but also because I kept telling him I couldn't see him any more without an explanation.....but he kept coming back!!

It wasn't that I felt so terrible about deceiving him of what parts I had that ended the relationship, but more that I could not be truthful of my past and even present things in life. Even if I had surgery and was able to have sex correctly....I can't hide who I was in the past and I can't hide the fact I am the father of my children. I so much enjoy being held and caressed by him!! I miss him very much.

I have decided that from here on I will inform anyone prior to the point of the first kiss....but I don't feel I need to any earlier than this. This shouldn't be a problem though since I have decided not to pursue anyone in the near future. The problem is I have a hard time preventing not being pursued...I have met some very nice men that would like to have a date....rather then tell them the truth of my born gender I respectfully decline.

This is a part of being trans that really SUCKS!! I never ever thought I would attract any attention form anyone...therefore never planned on what to do if it happened. Just today one of my co workers wants to set me up with her brother-in law...good looking man, but alas...no can do!!!

interesting perspective.

I can't help but feel curious how the FtM "straight" members feel about this thread...   ;) :icon_ashamed:

Quote from: Nikko on March 14, 2014, 06:14:56 PM
I can't help but feel curious how the FtM "straight" members feel about this thread...   ;) :icon_ashamed:

This totally!

Come on guys help us with this one, please! What is your perspective on this issue? ???

maybe the problem is just that the trans population needs to be a lot more self affirming than self denying , None of this would be an issue if the trans population had a far healthier view of itself. I'm not post op so I can only theorize, but you are what you are , it shouldn't be such a handicap . What are you looking for in an encounter. If nobody questions your appearance and wants you what's the big deal. If you feel safe then fine. I don't know it seems you can always bring up topics that will reveal the persons nature before you hit the bed if that's your purpose. This is a difficult topic because I'm not post op. I know for myself if someone wanted me and I felt the same it wouldn't bother me in the short term to just go with the moment. I just for myself would feel the need to be upfront in a longer perspective  for my own consciousness to feel right.

Quote from: Nikko on March 14, 2014, 06:14:56 PM
I can't help but feel curious how the FtM "straight" members feel about this thread...   ;) :icon_ashamed:

Um, my boyfriend, Leo (also a member here) and I can't help but wonder what you mean by the quotation marks, Nikko..

Straight ftm here. (no quotation marks or winky faces needed)

No one gets a pass for being selfish and sociopathic just because they love someone, loving someone is not an excuse for manipulating them. MtF, FtM, or completely natal male or female: you are WRONG for manipulating someone in any way that only benefits you and has the potential to hurt the other person.

Do you need to tell someone everything about you the moment you meet them? Of course not but its disturbing to think anyone would think it's okay to not tell their possible significant other something that could emotionally damage them. Andd yes, for some people finding out they had intercourse with a transgender/transsexual person can be extremely hurtful and harmful and you shouldn't judge them for what they find damaging as if transphobia can be cured overnight (assuming it's actually transphobia in the first place and not just humiliation at being emotionally exploited).

I'd really love to hear the guys' input on this one too. As for the straight gay or bi deal, I am bi and proud of it. Less limitations on finding that one true love. Me personally I see guys that are attracted to transwomen as straight, just as I see women that are attracted to transguys straight pre or post op and/or pre or post hormones. But it seems more taboo that a hetero guy to be attracted to a transwoman and from my experiences those guys are extrememly comfortable and confident with their own sexuality and self identity. Me personally I am upfront and take it from there, this is just me and causes a lot less problems in the future. As for anyone else it is their own business when and even if to tell but... the problems and or the danger that comes along later when the truth comes out is what I try to avoid. And just like in this instance the truth is always eventually gonna come out whether from past life or medical or another 1001 things.

A hypothetical. Girl, full SRS and all, meets boy. Boy and girl fall in love and get married. If younger there would be no children(Medical). Girl tells boy she can't have children and Boy believes that. They are deeper and deeper in love as the years go by. Something happens to girl and she dies or maybe from just old age, an autopsy is performed and Boy, Man or Old Man finds out that Girl was not who he though he dedicated his life too and is crushed, feels betrayed and in severe emotional pain. This is the main reason for me to be upfront. No matter what I never want to hurt anyone that I love. I could never live with myself if the is indeed an afterlife. Not to mention if Boy finds out and the thin line between love and hate is crossed and Girl ends up dropping off the face of the earth. 

I've only read the first page, but I don't need to read the others to post the following:

HOW IN THE WORLD does a guy stick his thing up a butt, EVERY DAY, for SIX MONTHS, and not have an inkling?  Even a stinkling?  Telling me she gave herself an enema at least every other day?  Did she never eat?  Sorry, but this one sounds far fetched.

I'd like to start by saying that i'm in the awkward phase & definately not dating right now, i'll also mention that I often say on here that it's your life & your choice how to live your life & I stand by that statement.

One of the reason I decided to transition is that I was sick to death of living a lie so if I don't tell a prospective partner then my life will continue to be full of lies, i'd have to edit my life history to omit the fact that I was born with a male body & after over 30 yrs of living with the fear that i'd slip up & reveal i'm trapped in the wrong body, if I wasn't honest about my past then i'd replace that fear with the fear that i'd one day slip up and reveal the truth about my past.

With regards to the title of this topic i'll add my past experience & hopefully a different perspective.
I was with my ex for 8 yrs before I ended the relationship & then came out, she was hurt by the fact that I hadn't been honest at the start of the relationship & said that it was something we could have worked around, probably by just being friends with benifits or maybe just as very good friends.
As a result of the hurt caused by my lack of honesty my ex embarked on a campaign of mind games for the next 2 yrs, she knew I was suffering depression & she played on it with little digs & comments designed to make me feel worse about myself & my situation.
This eventually resulted in a very nasty argument & falling out, I do not have the right to label all women as hypocrites & fakes because of this, I chose my path & I then reaped the results of not being honest from day one.
If you are not honest about something major from your past & it comes out then it should come as no shock that the revelation can destroy trust & hurt feelings, broken trust is a very quick way to destroy even the strongest relationship.

Once/if I do pass 100% then the only person I feel will have a right to know about my birth gender is a prospective partner, I feel that I owe it to both them & myself to be honest, if I met a man who wasn't comfortable dating a trans woman then I wouldn't want to be with them & would want to know how they felt about my past before I became emotionaly involved.

Quote from: Joanna Dark on March 13, 2014, 09:23:36 PM
Are you talking about just pre-op trans women or post-op women. See the difference there. Once I have SRS in a year and a half, I will no longer consider myself trans at all, but a woman.  So do I go about disclosing my entire very confusing, incredibly complicated life? When I was three, I wasn't allowed to walk and was in a hospital because of sciatica and issues with my genitals. 'Nuff aid about that. But, hopefully this is moot for me and things works out with the guy I am in love with right now. He has issues with me not having a vagina. But he does love me, it's just so hard. And sometimes I wish I met him when I was post-op just so I could have never have told him and then we would perfect cause we're perfect for each other. He told me yesterday how it's so weird how everything we do turns out so perfect. But do go through all this disclosure business again...when I'm post-op...ugh. Do you know how hard it was getting to this point?

There will be no way to tell I was in any way male once I do this. None. I don't understand why I have to get people to trust trans people. I only identify as trans cause it's easier. I'm intersexed. And I have chromosomes to prove it. But I'm still trans cause i'm transitioning, even if it's from I-to-F. I have people who know I'm trans and will talk about non-passing trans women right in front of me. It can be awkward.

I'm a little taken back by this.  So, you're just using the trans community because of a technicality, and not because you identify with us?  Once you've had your SRS will you close your account here?  If not, will you still post here?  If so, on what conditions, and about what things?  I'm sorry to say this, but you seem ashamed of the trans community, and hell bent on 'proving' you are just here out of politeness, or something along those lines.

-goes and grabs more popcorn-

Quote from: ath on March 15, 2014, 06:59:35 AM
-goes and grabs more popcorn-

Want to share? 

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 13, 2014, 09:09:03 PM
I just think about a topic like this ending up on a cis site where trans people are called "losers", "deceivers" or "dime a dozen" because we think we have a pass on not disclosing our true selves. I can see this from a flip side of the coin. It can breed contempt for us and further complicate OUR lives as well if they think we are ALL trying to hide ourselves and intentionally deceive. This will not do us any good in the long run and keep us where we are now. I am just trying to see this issue from both sides. How are we ever going to get people to accept and trust us with this issue out there. Just food for thought, no judgment intended. :)

You may be playing devils advocate here, but I think your post reeks of victim blaming and battered wife syndrome. If the cis-population has a problem with me just being me, then that is on them. I'm not going to degrade and drag myself through the mud by catering to other peoples ridiculous notions about my being. They're wrong, so why should I submit to their demands? I'm not hiding or intentionally deceiving anyone. I always present as my true self.

Also there is the question of why trans-status is the only thing that is every expected to disclosed out of ethical or moral concerns. Why is it that only trans people don't have a right to their own privacy? Why is it unethical for us not to disclose all of the while everyone else is privileged with the right to their own privacy?

I'm not talking about practical aspects here, only the moral/ethical concern.

Quote from: thevaliantx on March 15, 2014, 07:40:23 AM
Want to share?

Wellll I suppose, I hope you like butter though.

Quote from: ath on March 15, 2014, 08:04:51 AM
Wellll I suppose, I hope you like butter though.

Does it come with Valium salt as well, this may be a long movie!*giggle* ;D

Quote from: MariaMx on March 15, 2014, 08:00:14 AM
I'm not talking about practical aspects here, only the moral/ethical concern.

So it is totally moral and ethical to make a cis male feel like he is in a relationship with a cis female when she is not? No one can hide their past these days and what happens when that past is revealed to him? Do you really see a good outcome if he identified as a cis male hetero? I am not talking about divulging to everyone on the planet I am trans in a special news flash, only those with whom I am trying to have a long term intimate relationship with or choose to tell. They are the only one's who count and should know about your past. It is one thing to lie about an affair or something of that nature. It is another thing totally to lie about who you are. As far as the comment about being a battered wife or victim blaming, where did that come from? I blame no one for anything and heaven help anyone who tries to batter me. :)

Quote from: thevaliantx on March 15, 2014, 06:57:15 AM
I'm a little taken back by this.  So, you're just using the trans community because of a technicality, and not because you identify with us?  Once you've had your SRS will you close your account here?  If not, will you still post here?  If so, on what conditions, and about what things?  I'm sorry to say this, but you seem ashamed of the trans community, and hell bent on 'proving' you are just here out of politeness, or something along those lines.

Very good point thevaliantx. No matter how she tries to deny it, someone will always know her from 'before' - family, friends, neighbors, etc....even if she moves and changes state, chances are she'll bump into someone someday who goes "hey, i know you" and then that person will tell another person, and that person will tell another, and soon the secret is out.

I'm intersex and not just chromosomally, but true gonadal intersex. Anyway, it doesn't matter - if the world has always seen you as one way, then no matter how well your body adapts to the other hormone, someone will always know, and someone will always let the cat out of the bag at a time you least expect it, and shatter the world you've built for yourself. I am intersex, and I am trans.

The world around you only sees trans, so you just have to be honest with yourself and own it.

Kelsie

Quote from: KelsieJ on March 15, 2014, 10:54:43 AM
Very good point thevaliantx. No matter how she tries to deny it, someone will always know her from 'before' - family, friends, neighbors, etc....even if she moves and changes state, chances are she'll bump into someone someday who goes "hey, i know you" and then that person will tell another person, and that person will tell another, and soon the secret is out.

The world around you only sees trans, so you just have to be honest with yourself and own it.

Thank you Kelsie and Valiant! Well said and just the point I have been trying to make. People ALWAYS find out. The only thing is how much damage the truth does and how many lives are destroyed. :)

after the millionth post on this thread and the many other threads with the same question, I still can't figure out why people think it's alright to hide such a major part of their life from their loving partner. I don't know if the shoe was on the other foot and you were married to someone for 10.20.30 or40 years and they told you that they had been born the opposite gender would it go down as easy as those that suggest it's none of their partners business. I'm sorry I know the analogy with having cancer has been used, but still there seems to be quite a difference between cancer and being born a different gender. also why wouldn't you disclose having cancer to someone who loves and cares for you.

Just posting to keep my place.

*lurker*

What I think this really comes down to is really getting to know the person we are with before we form an intense emotional relationship with.  One night stands, who cares!    If the person we are with is only comfortable about having heterosexual relationships, and things any other relationship is sinful, why have a relationship with them?   Are we not just falling back into the same pattern of hiding we were in before we transitioned, or lies and fear. 

If we find that the person we are with is open minded and cares about the person they are with, and their now gender or birth gender doesn't matter,  why not tell them.   

If the person we are with is totally clueless about transgenders, and hasn't had to face the question upfront and personal about having a relationship with someone who is transgender, then I feel, perhaps, exposing them to the existence of transgenders, and helping them work through their conflicts as a friend, might be helpful.

It all depends upon, rather, we are looking for a life partner, who we don't have to hide who we are from, who is a help mate, and a friend, is really the issue.   Or do we want to go back to the days when we hid in the closet in our pseudo gender, and fear being who we really are.

I know some times we just fall into relationships without even really knowing it,  but having just barely surviving an almost thirty year relationship with someone whom I thought was my friend, and finding out she was not really my friend,  but a schemer, who hid her true feelings and only showed me a well rehearsed mask,  I discovered that I had just wasted years that I could have spending discovering who I was as a female, and that instead of being closeted, I should have been my female self, and let the chips fall where they may.   

Find out who the other person, as well as ourselves, really are and how they really feel about us, before committing, or we are just moving into another closet of fear, and not really moving on.

As far as men go, one night stands, who cares if we tell them or not.   Just make sure they are not violent and do not carry a gun or a club.   Why put your life in danger for a one night stand???????

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 15, 2014, 10:39:44 AM
So it is totally moral and ethical to make a cis male feel like he is in a relationship with a cis female when she is not? No one can hide their past these days and what happens when that past is revealed to him? Do you really see a good outcome if he identified as a cis male hetero? I am not talking about divulging to everyone on the planet I am trans in a special news flash, only those with whom I am trying to have a long term intimate relationship with or choose to tell. They are the only one's who count and should know about your past. It is one thing to lie about an affair or something of that nature. It is another thing totally to lie about who you are. As far as the comment about being a battered wife or victim blaming, where did that come from? I blame no one for anything and heaven help anyone who tries to batter me. :)

I'm not making anyone feel I'm a cis female, I'm just being me. I'm not pulling a trick on them. You talk about it as if there's a difference between a cis woman and a trans woman that actually matters. There isn't. It's all in their minds, and I have no intentions of letting preconceived notions and crazy ideas in other peoples heads dictate how I live my life.

The victim blaming was a reference to the idea that not informing will breed contempt and complicate our lives. I just don't buy that. If they have a problem it's all on them. If someone decides to bully me it's not my fault, even when the bullying is targeted at me for being who I am.

A long time ago, while I was transitioning and a short while thereafter, I used to feel that I had an obligation to warn the poor cis population about me so that they wouldn't have to have anything to do with a disgusting filthy ->-bleeped-<- such as myself. I used to totally think this was completely reasonable. In time I've come to realize that I feel this way because I grew up observing the disgust and derision expressed by cis people, so naturally I believed that what they said was true, that I truly was a disgusting freak of nature and that wearing a warning sign and paper bag over my head probably would be for the greater good of society. I had been conditioned to believe I deserved to be treated like dirt by the cis population and that I should be kiss their feet in appreciation for not having my face kicked in by them, and that is why I'm likening it to battered wife syndrome.

Quote from: Jessica Merriman on March 15, 2014, 10:39:44 AM
So it is totally moral and ethical to make a cis male feel like he is in a relationship with a cis female when she is not? No one can hide their past these days and what happens when that past is revealed to him? Do you really see a good outcome if he identified as a cis male hetero? I am not talking about divulging to everyone on the planet I am trans in a special news flash, only those with whom I am trying to have a long term intimate relationship with or choose to tell. They are the only one's who count and should know about your past. It is one thing to lie about an affair or something of that nature. It is another thing totally to lie about who you are. As far as the comment about being a battered wife or victim blaming, where did that come from? I blame no one for anything and heaven help anyone who tries to batter me. :)

I agree. I will tell my partner and people close to me that I'm Transgender.

I have to accept that I am trans and not cis-gendered. I was still born female; sex is biological and gender is what role you identify with.

I've seen this issue come up more times than I care to remember, and it doesn't usually end well.  For anyone.

What I would say is sometimes it's better to agree to disagree. This issue very often splits people into two diametrically opposed views. The proverbial irresistible force and immovable object meeting at a point where neither is likely to convince the other of how they feel and only leading to hurt feelings.

My view is that everyone is different. Everyone's circumstances are different. Their perspectives, values, mindsets and worldviews are different. And I feel each person, as an individual, should decide what's right for them. Do what they feel is right for them. And whatever happens after that is theirs to do with as they see fit.

When the tone changes from "This is what I would do" to "this is what I think everyone should do", then... well, threads like this one often become problematic.

Do what you feel is right as it relates to your own life and your own situation. And let everyone else do the same. That's what I think. :)

Quote from: stephaniec on March 15, 2014, 11:23:15 AM
after the millionth post on this thread and the many other threads with the same question, I still can't figure out why people think it's alright to hide such a major part of their life from their loving partner. I don't know if the shoe was on the other foot and you were married to someone for 10.20.30 or40 years and they told you that they had been born the opposite gender would it go down as easy as those that suggest it's none of their partners business. I'm sorry I know the analogy with having cancer has been used, but still there seems to be quite a difference between cancer and being born a different gender. also why wouldn't you disclose having cancer to someone who loves and cares for you.

The difference is in peoples heads, not in reality. There is no real difference that actually matters in any real way.

Quote from: thevaliantx on March 15, 2014, 07:40:23 AM
Want to share?

I recently bought so corn cobs that you stick in the microwave and it pops right off the cob.   I'll share with you!

Quote from: stephaniec on March 15, 2014, 11:23:15 AM
after the millionth post on this thread and the many other threads with the same question, I still can't figure out why people think it's alright to hide such a major part of their life from their loving partner. I don't know if the shoe was on the other foot and you were married to someone for 10.20.30 or40 years and they told you that they had been born the opposite gender would it go down as easy as those that suggest it's none of their partners business. I'm sorry I know the analogy with having cancer has been used, but still there seems to be quite a difference between cancer and being born a different gender. also why wouldn't you disclose having cancer to someone who loves and cares for you.

I am totally fine with it because my entire system of morality is based upon the concept of doing what is best for me in the long term. The idea here is that long term selfishness means, that if you had a really good chance of keeping it from a partner and they would never know, then it is in your best interests to keep it hidden. The potential downside if they do find out, is really high, so usually it would be best to tell, but I could certainly see where it could be hidden without it ever being found out.

I have had partners keep things from me before, and I can't say it is a great feeling, but if it isn't putting my health in danger I can either move on past it or leave. I don't see what the big deal is. People keep things from their partners all of the time, I would be much more worried about someone cheating and bringing some sort of STD back to me than I would be if they had IDK killed someone by driving drunk for example. (I don't use the gender example as obviously I would have no problems dating a transwoman)

My philosophy here is this:

I might not tell before the first date, or on, or even in the first few dates.  I will however tell before I am intimate with my partner, pre-op or post-op.

I'm sorry, but every human has a right to be selfish on what they want and are attracted to.  We don't owe anyone our attractions, and no one owes us theirs.  There are people out there for which being trans is not a deal breaker, and there are people for which it is.  How would you feel if the situation was reversed.  We all have things that are deal breakers, and how would you feel if a deal breaker for you was kept from you and your partner spent years actively lying to you about it?

I'm not condemning anyone for doing things differently, this is just my opinion.  But I can't be with someone in a committed relationship and keep this huge burdensome secret secret.

I've done that for the last 30 years, and it was full out killing me.  I'm not going to go around and tell everyone I'm trans, I'm not going to broadcast it, I'm not even going to tell most dates.  Because a date is just a date, it's a pre-cursor to a relationship.  I will however tell anyone that I am interested in a true relationship with.  And I will not sleep with anyone without being up front about it.  Too often this is a cause of violence against us.  The discovery that they unknowingly slept with a transwoman, and too often it ends badly.  One such case I heard about recently after a husband learned after 20 years of marriage his wife was trans.  His rage and assault was fueled by the deceit more than her status as trans.  Furthermore, this just seems to me to be perpetrating the idea that trans* people are out to "trick" unwilling people.  It's not what we're doing, but a lot of people out there do think this.

Maybe my attitude will change one day and I'll be tired of disclosing.  But I still think I'll tell before intimacy and anyone who I want a relationship with. 

Quote from: Hikari on March 15, 2014, 12:30:43 PM
I am totally fine with it because my entire system of morality is based upon the concept of doing what is best for me in the long term. The idea here is that long term selfishness means, that if you had a really good chance of keeping it from a partner and they would never know, then it is in your best interests to keep it hidden. The potential downside if they do find out, is really high, so usually it would be best to tell, but I could certainly see where it could be hidden without it ever being found out.

I have had partners keep things from me before, and I can't say it is a great feeling, but if it isn't putting my health in danger I can either move on past it or leave. I don't see what the big deal is. People keep things from their partners all of the time, I would be much more worried about someone cheating and bringing some sort of STD back to me than I would be if they had IDK killed someone by driving drunk for example. (I don't use the gender example as obviously I would have no problems dating a transwoman)

It's kind of like that Woody Allen movie that was based on extreme selfishness . I forget the name of it . the main character murdered some one for personal reasons and got away with it and in Woody Allens perspective there was nothing wrong with it because he got away with it .  crimes and misdemeaners

You are surprised that after so many treads like this that people don't agree with you?  Maybe because you're not right.  Now I'm not attacking you.  I'm specifically and intentionally not saying you are wrong.  Just that you are not right.  I hope you understand the difference.

To elaborate, I don't think there is one right answer, simply because everyone's circumstances, moralities, life experiences, etc are different.  I think it's okay to disagree on the subject and this will not likely be the last thread on the subject.  And the people who came into the thread with one perspective are likely to leave with the same one. 

Quote from: Caysee Danielle on March 15, 2014, 12:58:44 PM
To elaborate, I don't think there is one right answer, simply because everyone's circumstances, moralities, life experiences, etc are different.  I think it's okay to disagree on the subject and this will not likely be the last thread on the subject.  And the people who came into the thread with one perspective are likely to leave with the same one.

Likely very true. I do find it interesting to note how strong of a response this sort of topic normally elicits. I am sure it will come up many more times though.

Yes I have to agree Caysee.

In matters such as this, there will never be black and white.  And what works for one person doesn't work for everyone.

Quote from: Colleen♡Callie on March 15, 2014, 01:09:44 PM
In matters such as this, there will never be black and white. 

TRUCE it is!! I want to thank everyone for not attacking during this topic. Respect earned!  :)

a moment of peaceful coexistence. Where is anatta

See, we can all get along without flames, or Kum Ba Ya, lol :P

Quote from: stephaniec on March 15, 2014, 02:46:06 PMWhere is anata

Karma monitor crashed! ;D

G'day Peeps! New to forums and my first post.

Read this thread and thought I'd comment. I feel sad that some of you have ended what may have been a wonderful relationship with someone rather than tell your prospective partner about your gender. I do understand you may have this fear that this person you just met will walk away however, I believe you should be upfront whether it be a one night stand you are about to have or a potential relationship.

By keeping quiet, in a sense, you are deceiving them and yourself. You will forever be walking on eggshells hoping it will all go smooth but when they find out, which they invariably will. What kind of reaction do you think they will have? Like FA said. It can turn very nasty very quickly and you may become another statistic.

I'm not saying tell all and sundry but tell those of whom you enter a relationship with or may become interment with.

I feel that getting it out the way early and being upfront, you can relax and be comfortable and don't have to worry. Sure, some guys will react badly, the most that will happen is you being called a name and they walk away as opposed to you keeping quiet over a few weeks and or months and then telling Him which then may put your very being in jeopardy.

Thanks.
R.A

As some of you already know I'm xxy, and have been transgender since my childhood. Me, even though I only like and date girls, I have been upfront and honest about myself with each and every one of them as soon as we began dating steadily. I've been married twice, and was upfront with both of my wives about myself -long story short, I'm upfront about myself with my current partner though we only fool around because she knows how uncomfortable I am with what's still between my legs after all these years. We love each other though we've both tried denying it a few times and broke up but we always end up back together. Because I'll be finally (and I do thank God for this) having my SRS after a reasonable time on hormones/hrt she is having a hard time with it because she doesn't know if she want's to commit to a lifetime with another woman. Even though we've never had what any of you would call sex we've been together for the five years I've lived in my current home.

I'm scared to death of losing her because I've never loved anyone the way I love this woman, and I've told her this. She is a few years younger than I, and could easily attract any guy she wants. Still she stays with me which I'm grateful for. However and I've made this clear to her, If she cannot accept me as her partner after my SRS I'll be very hurt but I'll understand, and we can just be very good friends. I've also explained to her why I must fully transition, because for me life isn't worth living if I don't. Being in the medical field she understands this too.

I guess what I'm trying to say with my spiel above is that I can fully understand both sides of this argument. Why some of you may be afraid of losing someone if they know, or, those of you who just whish a casual good time sex with someone might not wish to disclose. However and here's the part where my older age comes in, It is my opinion that if someone truly loves you and you are becoming close that honesty is the best policy, and eventually after they've had the time to get over the initial shock they'll stay with you if indeed they truly love you. I'm originally from out west and lived in L.A. for a while, and have sadly saw the results of men who are biggots beating transwomen when they found out either by accident or a last minute disclosure. What can happen to you isn't pretty and I would hate to hear about it happening to anyone here.

Whichever route you choose be careful and before getting intimate enough with a guy for him to stumble upon something that shouldn't be there, at least be sure you know his character well enough that a severe lengthy beating or worse, doesn't happen to you, and be safe. I'll shut up now, lol! ;)

I know somebody necroed this post, but I can't help but to chime in myself.  This story is fake as hell and I don't buy it one bit.  I seriously don't usually claim things are fake, but 6 months without knowing there wasnt something else downstairs?  Puhleaze give me a break.   It is of my opinion you should notify a potential partner, especially if you plan of having sex, BEFORE your clothes are off and on the floor.

I know it can be awkward, scary, and a plethora of other emotions telling someone, but it has been my experience that most guys are respectful if you respect them as well.  While you may not view it as lying, just as a safety precaution, they definitely feel hurt if you hold some thing like that from them.  Guys may be a different breed than us sometimes, but they are humans too and deserving of respect and honesty.

Edit: After thinking about it, I suppose it IS possible to hide something like that with A LOT of effort because I recall a story of something similar happening.  Its just really hard for me to believe.

Quote from: Samantha007 on June 26, 2014, 08:10:21 AM
Evolving beauty,

Although I had some reservations when I read some of your posts, I realise now you are such a strong and remarkable woman, to have gone through what you've been through. We say "what doesn't kill you, makes you stronger" I mean most transwomen go through hell before they complete their transition, but - judging by your last post on srs with Chett, I realise gone through a lot more than the average woman among us. May you be blessed hun!

hugs

Samantha xx

Thanks hon!

And those who don't believe it, you're not forced to but I swear on my mother's head this story is TRUE whether you believe it or not. I have nothing to gain inventing fairy tales here.

This topic violates TOS 5 and will not be allowed to continue.

Topic locked.