Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Oh nevermind.

What are masculine ways of being nice to people? Because I don't know any and I hate the only ways I do know with a burning passion.

Not sure I believe that there are differences like that. But stereotypically I've heard that men are nice by "doing stuff" versus saying stuff.

--Jay

What kind of "stuff?"

This is for men that have respect for people.

Not every man has these values and these most ofter never apply.

Men shake hands, Hand shake is mostly right handed and with a firm grip to other men. Done for greeting of men, women can be peck on cheek or light hand shake.

Men can turn from gutter mouth to respectful words in a turn of a word

Men respect there mothers about everything

There are so many men rules that are taught over the years in respectful speech and mannerisms.

Men are assertive for sure.

So now others can add to this .

Er... I am and am generally in the company of a very different sort of man. Thanks anyway though.

Kind of a vague question, Edge.

I'm struggling a bit trying to figure out what you're asking. Can you give an example?

Quote from: Edge on August 07, 2014, 10:00:10 PM
What kind of "stuff?"

Hmm... well, like guys will buy a lady flowers. Or a guy will do something to help you out, like fix something or buy you something instead.

Common courtesy has no gender, my friend.

Quote from: Kreuzfidel on August 07, 2014, 10:58:37 PM
Kind of a vague question, Edge.

I tried making it specific at first, but then I realized I'd be far more likely to get actual responses this way. I was right even if they're not quite what I had in mind yet.

Quote from: christopher on August 07, 2014, 11:02:50 PM
I'm struggling a bit trying to figure out what you're asking. Can you give an example?

If I knew of any, I would give one. Unfortunately, I don't know of any which is why I'm asking.

I should probably clarify that I and most of my friends are in our twenties, are very much informal, have gutter mouths, and if one of my friends suggested I respect my mother, I would punch them.

Quote from: conformer on August 07, 2014, 11:12:52 PM
Common courtesy has no gender, my friend.

It does when the only way I know how to be nice/affectionate is to act like a f-ing pathetic, weakling, cute, passive girl which is an automatic, broken defence mechanism left over from the mask I used to pretend to be that made and continues to make me miserable because that is NOT me.

It's okay . . I understand that that is not you. The way you imply that being feminine is weak is a bit insulting.

Open doors, let others go first, say "thanks" instead of "thank you" when in informal situations, typing in "masculine mannerisms" on google pulls up a ton of links.

I would suggest to stay away from any giggling and practice making eye contact when talking more. It helps with giving off more assertive-ness without coming off as too assertive.

*edit* Sorry I didn't mean to be so aggressive with that, so I edited it.

I think I understand what you are getting at. As part of your female defense were you sort of appeasing? (can't think of a better word)

Ok, I'm not sure if this will make sense. I think part of being nice is knowing the person. Being nice isn't about flattery, it's about giving.  So, the way I'd be nice to one person is different than what I'd do with someone else.

For example, there's a guy I work with and I use humor with him. Like the other day he figured something out and I said "Hey, you actually had a good idea!". And yeah, that's kind of immature but it also fits him. He'd feel really awkward if I was all serious on him.

Today I saw a different coworker/friend and she was wearing a nice shirt and I told her that. I know she feels bad about her looks and compliments mean a lot to her. I also told her we should get together for dinner sometime because I know she is lonely.

For someone else, being nice can simply be listening. Like asking "how are you" and seriously wanting to know and taking the time to pay attention and ask questions.

Or maybe someone has a cold and you offer to bring them something to drink.

I guess what I'm saying is there is no one way to be nice. It depends on the circumstance and the person.

Does that help at all?

I don't associate being feminine with being weak. People who are genuinely feminine aren't weak for being so.
I associate acting like someone I'm not when I don't want to because I'm afraid of the other person with being weak.

Quote from: Edge on August 07, 2014, 11:35:06 PM
I don't associate being feminine with being weak. People who are genuinely feminine aren't weak for being so.
I associate acting like someone I'm not when I don't want to because I'm afraid of the other person with being weak.

Sorry I edited my post some. Didn't mean to be so aggressive.

Quote from: conformer on August 07, 2014, 11:36:16 PM
Sorry I edited my post some. Didn't mean to be so aggressive.

No you didn't. I still never implied it was weak to be feminine. You did that on your own.

Quote from: christopher on August 07, 2014, 11:33:28 PM
I think I understand what you are getting at. As part of your female defense were you sort of appeasing? (can't think of a better word)

My general thought process was along the lines of "oh gods please don't hurt me." I'm much more comfortable when they do hurt me though.

Quote from: christopher on August 07, 2014, 11:33:28 PMDoes that help at all?

Yeah that does actually. Thanks.

I know it's ok for guys to be effeminate and that I don't have to be hyper masculine. I'm not trying to be. I'm trying to be me. I am really sick of people assuming I'm not who I actually am.

Quote from: Edge on August 07, 2014, 11:41:43 PM
My general thought process was along the lines of "oh gods please don't hurt me." I'm much more comfortable when they do hurt me though.

I totally understand this. I also understand why you think it's weak when you do that. I am dealing with similar issues

QuoteYeah that does actually. Thanks.

Oh good.

Quote from: christopher on August 07, 2014, 11:47:49 PM
I totally understand this. I also understand why you think it's weak when you do that. I am dealing with similar issues.

Any luck with them?

Hmmm... I guess some. Lots of work in therapy :P

Ah. I've gotten to the end of what they can help me with in therapy. This is a good thing and is more because they no longer think I need it. I still struggle with this though and describing it to people is difficult since no one gets it. I don't even get why I do it. It's not like they can genuinely hurt me and, if they don't like me, then f them.

Without context my advice will be vague.

Be helpful. Move the heavy thing(s) for them. Hold the door open. Give praise when it's due, but be brief in doing so (the phrase "Good work" and/or a thumbs up is suitable for many situations). Express well-wishes for people when an opportunity arises, again being brief in doing so ("Good luck", "You'll do great", "Go get 'em", whatever).

In the words of the one and only Wil Wheaton: "Don't be a dick". That's pretty much everything anyone needs in a philosophy, right there. And since I'm such a big fan of throwaway, one-line philosophies, how about the wisdom of Bill S. Preston, Esq. and Ted 'Theodore' Logan?: Be excellent to each other... and party on, dudes!

In all seriousness: I honestly think we all need to go easy on ourselves. Yes, it can be frustrating that you & I have been socialised inappropriately. I know exactly what it feels like instinctively to default to female-socialised behaviour at the most inappropriate times. I understand how emasculating that can be.

But we need to cut ourselves some slack: nobody can blame us for acting that way on instinct, particularly if we feel threatened or insecure. We were deliberately trained to respond in that way for X number of years; there's no need to beat ourselves up over something that was beyond our control, or that we learned as a defence mechanism. So if you find yourself responding in a way you find uncomfortable, simply acknowledge what's happened, accept that this is something that can rear its ugly head from time to time, and try to make a conscious effort to do something different next time. You can do this by thinking about the situation later when everything's calmed down. Think about how you'd prefer to act if you had the choice... and then try it out next time. If you keep doing this, you can train yourself into new patterns of behaviour.

So my suggestion is to experiment with being more active rather than passive... whilst keeping Wheaton's Law in mind at all times.