Community Conversation => Transitioning => Hormone replacement therapy => Topic started by: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 02:09:54 AM Return to Full Version
Title: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 02:09:54 AM
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 02:09:54 AM
Just wondering how long it took you all of for that to stop happening. I'm sorta praying it stops, I'm too dysphoric to even kiss as a result.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: kelly_aus on November 20, 2014, 02:12:29 AM
Post by: kelly_aus on November 20, 2014, 02:12:29 AM
If it hasn't stopped by now, it's probably not going to. Hormones are not the magic libido killer that many people claim.. Nor does having a zero T level prevent erections..
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 02:39:28 AM
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 02:39:28 AM
Crap. See, this is a problem because it's very literally preventing any contact between me and my partners. And I don't have 20k...why the hell did I have to be the ONE trans girl I know who still has this problem!?!?!?!?!?!
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: kelly_aus on November 20, 2014, 02:43:37 AM
Post by: kelly_aus on November 20, 2014, 02:43:37 AM
Quote from: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 02:39:28 AM
Crap. See, this is a problem because it's very literally preventing any contact between me and my partners. And I don't have 20k...why the hell did I have to be the ONE trans girl I know who still has this problem!?!?!?!?!?!
Makes me glad I'm not so worried about it...
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Railgun on November 20, 2014, 04:28:27 AM
Post by: Railgun on November 20, 2014, 04:28:27 AM
From a more medical perspektive:
Well you could ask your doctor if there's a safe way (remember: safety comes first!) to incrase your prolactin levels. A high prolactin level can cause erectile dysfunction and loss of libido in men, since it partially counteracts dopamine (which causes sexual arousal), and causes breast growth in women during pregnancy, so it >>could<< also help temporarily with breast growth (no data on that). However a too high prolactin level can cause lactation and increases the risk of breast cancer, so consult your doctor.
The other possibility would be a dopamin-blocker, but that would lead to unforeseeable side effects since dopamin is far to important for numerous body functions. A few of the side effects would be probably loss of motivation, depression, partial loss of motoric abilities, parkinson, ADHD, RLS, and so on...
Well you could ask your doctor if there's a safe way (remember: safety comes first!) to incrase your prolactin levels. A high prolactin level can cause erectile dysfunction and loss of libido in men, since it partially counteracts dopamine (which causes sexual arousal), and causes breast growth in women during pregnancy, so it >>could<< also help temporarily with breast growth (no data on that). However a too high prolactin level can cause lactation and increases the risk of breast cancer, so consult your doctor.
The other possibility would be a dopamin-blocker, but that would lead to unforeseeable side effects since dopamin is far to important for numerous body functions. A few of the side effects would be probably loss of motivation, depression, partial loss of motoric abilities, parkinson, ADHD, RLS, and so on...
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Hikari on November 20, 2014, 06:30:32 AM
Post by: Hikari on November 20, 2014, 06:30:32 AM
I hope this isn't like tmi but basically liquid stopped at a short time (within 2 months on bicalutamide) but like while erections don't randomly happen anymore I certainly maintain the capability to have them. Like even when I switched to spiro when I couldn't afford bicalutamide like, it still didn't change the situation. I will not have an erection unless I am aroused but, upon arousal it still happens. I generally tuck using this shapewesr thing so the erection is contained, it wouldn't really be noticeable no matter what I am wearing.
For some people an orcidectemy does the trick, but it doesn't for everyone.
For some people an orcidectemy does the trick, but it doesn't for everyone.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Nicolette on November 20, 2014, 07:56:44 AM
Post by: Nicolette on November 20, 2014, 07:56:44 AM
A lobotomy may help, although I haven't tried it myself. :laugh: Having been on hrt, including AAs, for 19 years and then 13 months srs post-op, I can confirm that I still get aroused. Women get aroused. It's never been a problem. I enjoy it, even.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Steph34 on November 20, 2014, 08:16:23 AM
Post by: Steph34 on November 20, 2014, 08:16:23 AM
Quote from: kelly_aus on November 20, 2014, 02:12:29 AM
If it hasn't stopped by now, it's probably not going to. Hormones are not the magic libido killer that many people claim.. Nor does having a zero T level prevent erections..
Since bringing my T level down in the summer, I have no desire at all, and I am so glad it is gone. It really interfered with my feminine self-expression and social interactions. I do still get excited around people, perhaps more so than before, but it is no longer sexual in nature. I find myself admiring beautiful strangers, but never wanting them.
Unfortunately, I still sometimes have "accidents" while half-asleep at night, like I am in this dreamlike state and then suddenly I will wake up with this awful release. Although they have been dry since my first month on a T blocker, they still happen involuntarily and seem to cause temporary masculinization for a whole week afterwards. This is very distressing to me. I am on two medications that have increased prolactin as a side effect, but it has not helped much. I am not sure what I can do, as these involuntary events at night are really holding me back physically. :(
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Missy~rmdlm on November 20, 2014, 09:17:21 AM
Post by: Missy~rmdlm on November 20, 2014, 09:17:21 AM
Quote from: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 02:39:28 AM
Crap. See, this is a problem because it's very literally preventing any contact between me and my partners. And I don't have 20k...why the hell did I have to be the ONE trans girl I know who still has this problem!?!?!?!?!?!
I was sexually active right up to SRS. It's not that unusual. Though real voices are often drowned out.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: kelly_aus on November 20, 2014, 03:22:16 PM
Post by: kelly_aus on November 20, 2014, 03:22:16 PM
Quote from: Missy~rmdlm on November 20, 2014, 09:17:21 AM
I was sexually active right up to SRS. It's not that unusual. Though real voices are often drowned out.
Indeed, we often are drowned out.. Or worse..
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Jill F on November 20, 2014, 03:39:11 PM
Post by: Jill F on November 20, 2014, 03:39:11 PM
I had an orchi 4 months ago. It didn't kill my libido nor my ability. I don't get nearly as many spontaneous ones as before, but morning wood is not out of the question.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: KayXo on November 20, 2014, 05:04:53 PM
Post by: KayXo on November 20, 2014, 05:04:53 PM
Quote from: Railgun on November 20, 2014, 04:28:27 AM
However a too high prolactin level can cause lactation and increases the risk of breast cancer, so consult your doctor.
A too high prolactin level causing breast cancer? First I hear of this. Any actual controlled studies confirm this unequivocally? Or suggest this might be the case? Because some women breastfeed for years, some get pregnant several times during their lives, prolactin levels are very high during these times and science has found that women who have more offspring (thus spend more time with high prolactin levels) have a lesser risk of breast cancer.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 09:30:29 PM
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 09:30:29 PM
My understanding is that prolactin increses the risk of liver damage and blood clots.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Railgun on November 21, 2014, 04:38:48 AM
Post by: Railgun on November 21, 2014, 04:38:48 AM
Quote from: KayXo on November 20, 2014, 05:04:53 PM
A too high prolactin level causing breast cancer? First I hear of this. Any actual controlled studies confirm this unequivocally? Or suggest this might be the case? Because some women breastfeed for years, some get pregnant several times during their lives, prolactin levels are very high during these times and science has found that women who have more offspring (thus spend more time with high prolactin levels) have a lesser risk of breast cancer.
Increasing the risk doesn't mean it is causing it - sorry for being unclear in my previous post. But if you get it prolactin will promote the development of tumor cells in the chests and can thus speed up cancer progression.
http://www.biochemia-medica.com/content/role-prolactin-human-breast-cancer
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23783576
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: primrose on November 21, 2014, 05:08:08 AM
Post by: primrose on November 21, 2014, 05:08:08 AM
my libido has not dropped one bit and I've been on oestrogen for more than a year with T levels at around 1.1 which is quite low. My doctor told me that he has seen men with high T levels that have erection problems and there is no simple correlation between T levels and sex drive. Unfortunately, I am very much frustrated with my high libido at times but it's just what it is.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: KimSails on November 21, 2014, 05:43:04 AM
Post by: KimSails on November 21, 2014, 05:43:04 AM
This thread is very surprising. Both my libido and ability to get erect fell through the floor within the first three weeks of HRT (I've now been on HRT for three months).
Half-erections are the maximum possible . This is fine most of the time, but is a disappointing when my wife and I are *trying* -- knowing that SRS (and the ability to have sex again) is probably a couple years away or more.
In that sense, androgynouspainter, it seems that we are each frustrated by the opposite side of the same issue.
Kim
Half-erections are the maximum possible . This is fine most of the time, but is a disappointing when my wife and I are *trying* -- knowing that SRS (and the ability to have sex again) is probably a couple years away or more.
In that sense, androgynouspainter, it seems that we are each frustrated by the opposite side of the same issue.
Kim
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Hideyoshi on November 21, 2014, 09:52:23 AM
Post by: Hideyoshi on November 21, 2014, 09:52:23 AM
Quote from: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 02:39:28 AM
Crap. See, this is a problem because it's very literally preventing any contact between me and my partners. And I don't have 20k...why the hell did I have to be the ONE trans girl I know who still has this problem!?!?!?!?!?!
I still get aroused all the time, but I don't really get unwanted boners or anything. It's there if I want it to be there, but I don't consider it a bad thing for me since I don't absolutely hate my thing.
I think it's much more of a mental matter than a physical one.
I have noticed over the years that it seems the later one starts to transition, the more effective HRT is at killing libido and erections. My doctor told me that likely I'd get little to no changes in libido or erections, since I started younger when my sex drive was raging.
HRT for me more controlled my sex drive, where 2-3 times a week is plenty enough, when before, 3-4 times a day is what I would want.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: KayXo on November 21, 2014, 11:54:01 AM
Post by: KayXo on November 21, 2014, 11:54:01 AM
Quote from: androgynouspainter26 on November 20, 2014, 09:30:29 PM
My understanding is that prolactin increses the risk of liver damage and blood clots.
But if that were the case, what to say of ciswomen who are pregnant or breastfeeding who have VERY high prolactin levels? They don't seem to be exposed to a greater risk of liver damage or blood clots than men.
Quote from: Railgun on November 21, 2014, 04:38:48 AM
Increasing the risk doesn't mean it is causing it - sorry for being unclear in my previous post. But if you get it prolactin will promote the development of tumor cells in the chests and can thus speed up cancer progression.
And yet, breast cancer appears to be less in those women who've spent more time being pregnant when prolactin levels increase significantly. Strange...
Quote from: primrose on November 21, 2014, 05:08:08 AM
my libido has not dropped one bit and I've been on oestrogen for more than a year with T levels at around 1.1 which is quite low.
I've found that estrogen actually increases my sex drive and if too low, my libido plummets. I'm post-op, my T levels are very low.
Quote from: Hideyoshi on November 21, 2014, 09:52:23 AM
HRT for me more controlled my sex drive, where 2-3 times a week is plenty enough, when before, 3-4 times a day is what I would want.
Same for me. It is much more under control but still there and can get quite intense...and emotional. :)
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 21, 2014, 01:04:10 PM
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 21, 2014, 01:04:10 PM
Yes, actually, they are at a higher risk for blood clots! Where are you getting your facts? Over a prolonged period of time, it gets risky.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Rachel on November 22, 2014, 06:34:20 AM
Post by: Rachel on November 22, 2014, 06:34:20 AM
Perhaps a different anti-androgen would help. Perhaps your HRT doctor can recommend a different med.
At 3 weeks I had a considerable decrease the ability to have an erection. At 6 weeks it was near impossible and orgasm was very difficult. That has improved considerably but I have no spontaneous erections. in order to be with my wife I must have a very high concentration of Cialis and my erection is not full.
At 3 weeks I had a considerable decrease the ability to have an erection. At 6 weeks it was near impossible and orgasm was very difficult. That has improved considerably but I have no spontaneous erections. in order to be with my wife I must have a very high concentration of Cialis and my erection is not full.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Steph34 on November 22, 2014, 08:34:58 AM
Post by: Steph34 on November 22, 2014, 08:34:58 AM
I am very ashamed of this, but I still have spontaneous partial erections (and sometimes even involuntary releases) while alone at night, even after almost 3 months of HRT and 4 months of T blocker. I am either asleep or half-asleep, and then suddenly it happens, usually with no emotion at all. This is holding back feminization and making my hair fall out. Does anyone have any suggestions for preventing it? I just want it to be gone already. :(
Since starting HRT, I tend to say way too much. :embarrassed:
Quote from: Hanazono on November 20, 2014, 10:13:45 AMI agree; I still get mentally aroused around people, but it is no longer sexual in nature. Now it is a positive feeling about not being alone. I like it this way, much better. :)
Arousal happens in my head, not in my body. The manifestation of it, on the other hand, does change...
Since starting HRT, I tend to say way too much. :embarrassed:
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: kelly_aus on November 22, 2014, 08:47:11 AM
Post by: kelly_aus on November 22, 2014, 08:47:11 AM
Quote from: Steph34 on November 22, 2014, 08:34:58 AM
This is holding back feminization and making my hair fall out.
Umm, what? Got some science to go with this claim? Because I've certainly never seen anything that would support it.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Clhoe G on November 22, 2014, 09:13:11 AM
Post by: Clhoe G on November 22, 2014, 09:13:11 AM
I can say from experience cyproterone will stop unwanted erections n that's why I stopped it, i have also have used domperidone then stopped using it because it killed my desire to have any sex what so ever (but I could still get erect) domperidone also increases prolactin for lactation, as you know, which is why I used it >:-) lol, but anyway prolactin increases after orgasm so dopamine levels go down after sex (dopamine rises during arousal) but using prolactin to decrease erections probably won't do much other then stop you from wanting any sex what so ever.
In short I would recommend trying cyproterone and depo provera if you really want to get rid of erections but this combination may prevent you from getting any fertility back tho you most more than likely still have anal arousal, which I'm guessing you want to keep, but if not dutasteride may reduce that in some people, I only use finasteride on a low dose because personally I love it.
Don't forget to speak to a doctor about any advice given before you do anything with medications
In short I would recommend trying cyproterone and depo provera if you really want to get rid of erections but this combination may prevent you from getting any fertility back tho you most more than likely still have anal arousal, which I'm guessing you want to keep, but if not dutasteride may reduce that in some people, I only use finasteride on a low dose because personally I love it.
Don't forget to speak to a doctor about any advice given before you do anything with medications
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Clhoe G on November 22, 2014, 09:22:12 AM
Post by: Clhoe G on November 22, 2014, 09:22:12 AM
O n one more thing if you do use domperidone n start lactating be shore to milk by pump 6times a day for half an hour to decrease risk of cancer, but this will also increase breast milk supply, but I really don't think it would be something you would want.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Steph34 on November 22, 2014, 10:28:07 AM
Post by: Steph34 on November 22, 2014, 10:28:07 AM
Quote from: kelly_aus on November 22, 2014, 08:47:11 AMMasturbation (but not arousal) increases T and DHT levels. Nocturnal stomach contact is presumably no different than rubbing, since it is the release (and not the anticipation) that raises T and DHT. It is meaningless that E also goes up, since the endogenous E is 'swamped' by T and in any case trivial compared to what I would be getting from HRT.
Umm, what? Got some science to go with this claim? Because I've certainly never seen anything that would support it.
http://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/archive/index.php/t-34144.html
Since T and DHT prevent feminization and DHT causes hair loss, this is consistent with my personal observation that such nocturnal incidents have those effects on me. Even with blockers, my androgens are not totally gone.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: KayXo on November 22, 2014, 02:23:15 PM
Post by: KayXo on November 22, 2014, 02:23:15 PM
Quote from: androgynouspainter26 on November 21, 2014, 01:04:10 PM
Yes, actually, they are at a higher risk for blood clots! Where are you getting your facts? Over a prolonged period of time, it gets risky.
Getting my facts from science and from what we observe in the real world. I've also personally known several transwomen over the age of 40 who've thrived on high levels for decades without complications. Just think of those women who get pregnant several times during their lives and/or who breastfeed for years...Breast cancer is highest in older women whose estrogen, progesterone and prolactin levels are all LOW. Food for thought...
Quote from: Clhoe G on November 22, 2014, 09:13:11 AM
In short I would recommend trying cyproterone and depo provera
Depo-Provera is associated with several side-effects, notably the onset of depression in some so that it's best to at least start with pills to see how one reacts than to risk being stuck with it for longer periods of time in one's body. As always, consult an experienced doctor and see what they say. Cyproterone is also associated with depression in some.
I'm post-op, have very little T and do get arousal to the point where I even feel erect down there due to all the blood going to that region and causing, even sometimes pain! I like to feel "erect" (and aroused) despite the pain. But, I understand that it may be annoying due to still having male genitalia although personally, it never really mattered much to me.
Quote from: Steph34 on November 22, 2014, 10:28:07 AM
Masturbation (but not arousal) increases T and DHT levels.
I VERY much doubt this or at least in a significant way. I masturbated quite often pre-op, never experienced problems.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 22, 2014, 02:31:39 PM
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 22, 2014, 02:31:39 PM
I don't know anything about the cancer risks, but high prolactin is well documented to be associated with blood clots. Just because it's more likely to happen doesn't mean it WILL happen, but it's still not something you want accumulating in your system for an extended period of time. I'm not going to argue over this, I've seen more than enough medical literature to understand the facts here, and I urge you to get yours straight. I don't want someone to see what you're saying and think that they shouldn't worry about those levels, because it is very unhealthy.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: KayXo on November 22, 2014, 02:37:58 PM
Post by: KayXo on November 22, 2014, 02:37:58 PM
Quote from: androgynouspainter26 on November 22, 2014, 02:31:39 PM
I don't know anything about the cancer risks, but high prolactin is well documented to be associated with blood clots. Just because it's more likely to happen doesn't mean it WILL happen, but it's still not something you want accumulating in your system for an extended period of time.
But then, why do women who breastfeed for several years whose prolactin levels are very high not suffer more from blood clots? I just want an explanation, that's all. I'm open to what your saying but it must fit with what we observe.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: kelly_aus on November 22, 2014, 04:43:00 PM
Post by: kelly_aus on November 22, 2014, 04:43:00 PM
Quote from: Steph34 on November 22, 2014, 10:28:07 AM
Masturbation (but not arousal) increases T and DHT levels. Nocturnal stomach contact is presumably no different than rubbing, since it is the release (and not the anticipation) that raises T and DHT. It is meaningless that E also goes up, since the endogenous E is 'swamped' by T and in any case trivial compared to what I would be getting from HRT.
http://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/archive/index.php/t-34144.html
Since T and DHT prevent feminization and DHT causes hair loss, this is consistent with my personal observation that such nocturnal incidents have those effects on me. Even with blockers, my androgens are not totally gone.
Most of the links on that page disagree with you. However, one of them makes an interesting point - abstinence caused T levels to increase by as much as 14% after 7 days. Another also pointed out that prolactin appears to play a part in hair loss..
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 22, 2014, 09:36:17 PM
Post by: androgynouspainter26 on November 22, 2014, 09:36:17 PM
Wow, thanks for the great replies from all of you. Fiugred I'd put out a Part II question for all of you-Mood stuff!!!
How do you deal? I think my E levels are getting a bit higher just because of how my diet is changing, and also because I got more consistent about taking everything. I'm also finding myself overly emotional though...either very depressed, or...well, not manic, but fairly happy. I never used to have issues with self esteem and depression and everything before I started E, although my anxiety was fairly bad and has since receded. So...I'm fairly sure hormones are adversely effecting my mental health. Obviously lowering the dosage or stopping is NOT something I want to do. Thoughts?
How do you deal? I think my E levels are getting a bit higher just because of how my diet is changing, and also because I got more consistent about taking everything. I'm also finding myself overly emotional though...either very depressed, or...well, not manic, but fairly happy. I never used to have issues with self esteem and depression and everything before I started E, although my anxiety was fairly bad and has since receded. So...I'm fairly sure hormones are adversely effecting my mental health. Obviously lowering the dosage or stopping is NOT something I want to do. Thoughts?
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: skin on November 23, 2014, 01:02:36 AM
Post by: skin on November 23, 2014, 01:02:36 AM
I don't have any suggestions, but I can sympathize. At first I was feeling stronger emotions and loving it. Now they're too strong. After not crying at all as an adult, I feel like I've had a constantly leaking set of eyes all of this week. It has legitimately been a pretty terrible week, but I still feel like I am not dealing with it as well as I could have even just a month ago. The depression I can sort of deal with, but right now I'm dealing with levels of anxiety I never experienced pre-hrt. I'm just sort of trying to ride it out and hope it gets better soon. So if you learn how to deal with it before I do, be sure to share the secret ;)
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Clhoe G on November 23, 2014, 01:56:35 AM
Post by: Clhoe G on November 23, 2014, 01:56:35 AM
Quote from: androgynouspainter26 on November 22, 2014, 09:36:17 PM
Wow, thanks for the great replies from all of you. Fiugred I'd put out a Part II question for all of you-Mood stuff!!!
How do you deal? I think my E levels are getting a bit higher just because of how my diet is changing, and also because I got more consistent about taking everything. I'm also finding myself overly emotional though...either very depressed, or...well, not manic, but fairly happy. I never used to have issues with self esteem and depression and everything before I started E, although my anxiety was fairly bad and has since receded. So...I'm fairly sure hormones are adversely effecting my mental health. Obviously lowering the dosage or stopping is NOT something I want to do. Thoughts?
There are a few reasons that could n can happen some medications in some people can cause depression, you could raise this issue with you doctor n ask for a different type, I do know that premarin (conjugated estrogen) can cause depression in some people.
Andropause (male equivalent of menopause) can also cause it even during onset.
Estrogen will make your emotions stronger on pretty much every level, so you could try doing something that has always made you happiest.
Can I also say that if you feel your erectile function is causing this, I don't think that medroxyprogesterone n cyproterone will cause you to get worse because I noticed that cyproterone made me very depressed, as I was no longer functional on it and that also gave me a sexual frustration, basically the reverse of your case.
And kayxo is right there is a very small, like tiny amount of testosterone produced when masterbaiting.
On prolactin most women whom have had children breastfeed so prolactin is no only used it prevents prolactin over build up, so blood clotting n cancer is not really a problem, infact it has been suggested that breastfeeding will even lower the risk of getting cancer those that choose not to breast feed sometimes use a dopamine agonist to dry up milk supply.
Prolactin decreases dopamine so it can cause depression and it can quite possibly contribute to women's Postnatal Depression
Dopamine may reduce depression but it will also increase sexual desire, because dopamine increase during arousal n orgasm, but prolactin will kill all sexual desire.
So weighing up the risks n benefits with the information on this tread, prolactin n dopamine are out, cyproterone n medroxyprogesterone are likely to help much more, they will most more then likely stop unwanted erections but still keep sexual desire in the way you want it.
Wow I think I'm running out of information on this one
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Steph34 on November 24, 2014, 04:55:49 AM
Post by: Steph34 on November 24, 2014, 04:55:49 AM
Quote from: androgynouspainter26 on November 22, 2014, 09:36:17 PME does make emotions stronger; that is one of its benefits in my mind. I like having stronger feelings and being able to express them, even if they are sometimes negative. However, emotional problems can often be caused by unstable or fluctuating E levels. If that is the case, it could help to find out the effective duration or half-life of the form of E you are using, and make sure your doses are spaced closely enough to prevent crashes. Given the effects of hormones on mood, maintaining a steady level could significantly lessen these swings. If I am even two hours early or late for my E, there are significant changes to my mood.
I'm also finding myself overly emotional though...either very depressed, or...well, not manic, but fairly happy. I never used to have issues with self esteem and depression and everything before I started E, although my anxiety was fairly bad and has since receded. So...I'm fairly sure hormones are adversely effecting my mental health. Obviously lowering the dosage or stopping is NOT something I want to do. Thoughts?
Quote from: kelly_aus on November 22, 2014, 04:43:00 PM
Most of the links on that page disagree with you. However, one of them makes an interesting point - abstinence caused T levels to increase by as much as 14% after 7 days. Another also pointed out that prolactin appears to play a part in hair loss..
The very first link reported increased T and DHT from release, which helps explain why I would lose so much hair and masculinize shortly afterwards.
Prolactin levels are higher in women than men, and prolactin levels are incredibly high during pregnancy. Interestingly, pre-menopausal women almost never have severe hair loss, and most women enjoy a decrease in hair detachment during pregnancy. Estradiol also raises prolactin, and women tend to lose hair during menopause when E levels (and thus prolactin) decline. In fact, I lose more hair when my E level (and thus prolactin) are lower. It therefore stands to reason that prolactin is good for hair maintenance, not bad. Manly men and their sympathizers are always trying to cast doubt on the consensus that DHT causes hair loss, but to implicate prolactin is fraudulent. There are only two references to prolactin on that page. The claim that prolactin can worsen hair loss by raising free T levels is meaningless, because it is DHT and not free T that causes hair loss; furthermore, they fail to provide any scientific evidence that prolactin actually does raise free T. Since prolactin is elevated during feminizing processes, it is silly to worry about it raising free T, a claim that lacks scientific backing anyway. The one study on prolactin presented there, regarding rats' prostate glands, is irrelevant. Even the few people who do honestly believe that prolactin causes hair loss should abstain, because masturbation raises prolactin levels, too.
I am always careful to read science in its proper context. The spike after 7 days of abstinence is not necessarily caused by the abstinence. On the contrary, it could be the masturbation 7 days beforehand (rather than the abstinence thereafter) that causes the spike. The study merely points to the existence of the spike, not whether it was caused by the abstinence or the prior physical acts. Given my experiences, I would assume it is the latter.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: kelly_aus on November 24, 2014, 08:13:49 AM
Post by: kelly_aus on November 24, 2014, 08:13:49 AM
You know what, Steph? Believe what you like. There's so much quasi-science and anecdotal rubbish floating around the trans community about hormones and what they can and can't do that I'm not going to bother arguing this.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: KayXo on December 04, 2014, 09:51:47 PM
Post by: KayXo on December 04, 2014, 09:51:47 PM
Quote from: Clhoe G on November 23, 2014, 01:56:35 AM
And kayxo is right there is a very small, like tiny amount of testosterone produced when masterbaiting.
I don't think I ever made that statement (?). LOL.
QuoteProlactin decreases dopamine so it can cause depression and it can quite possibly contribute to women's Postnatal Depression
My understanding was that it was the other way around, that dopamine inhibited prolactin production so that if dopamine is reduced, prolactin is now allowed to be produced and is increased as what happens with cyproterone acetate. Also, post-natal depression could be due to several factors but studies have shown that it is often the drop in estrogen (and progesterone) that cause this and administration of either can significantly improve symptoms, more than anti-depressants, interestingly enough!
Quote from: Steph34 on November 24, 2014, 04:55:49 AM
Prolactin levels are higher in women than men, and prolactin levels are incredibly high during pregnancy. Interestingly, pre-menopausal women almost never have severe hair loss, and most women enjoy a decrease in hair detachment during pregnancy. Estradiol also raises prolactin, and women tend to lose hair during menopause when E levels (and thus prolactin) decline. In fact, I lose more hair when my E level (and thus prolactin) are lower. It therefore stands to reason that prolactin is good for hair maintenance, not bad.
If both an increase in E and prolactin are associated with an improved scalp hair situation, then we really can't say which of the two has really helped or if it was a little of both. We need to isolate variables before saying for sure prolactin is good for hair but yes, if it was bad, then it stands that this would negate E's apparently favorable effects on hair which is not the case so perhaps prolactin is neutral. I've personally noticed a significant improvement in my hair since on E injectable. Thicker, shinier, softer. :)
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Steph34 on December 06, 2014, 01:04:42 PM
Post by: Steph34 on December 06, 2014, 01:04:42 PM
Quote from: KayXo on December 04, 2014, 09:51:47 PMI really need a higher dose of E before I go bald. No hair, no future. Even at just a low level of E, my thickness and softness improved. If I go off my E for even a few hours, my hair falls out all over. If I take it a few hours early, so that doses overlap and my level rises, I lose less hair. If my doctor is unwilling to prescribe a sufficient level of E for me to have healthy hair, then I may need a new doctor, as there is nothing I would not give for hair. If ending my transition would save my hair, I would end it tomorrow, but of course that is not the case. Estradiol is the next best thing I have ever done for my hair, second only to dutasteride.
If both an increase in E and prolactin are associated with an improved scalp hair situation, then we really can't say which of the two has really helped or if it was a little of both. We need to isolate variables before saying for sure prolactin is good for hair but yes, if it was bad, then it stands that this would negate E's apparently favorable effects on hair which is not the case so perhaps prolactin is neutral. I've personally noticed a significant improvement in my hair since on E injectable. Thicker, shinier, softer. :)
There are three ways I am aware of E being beneficial to hair:
1) It reduces DHT levels, and DHT causes hair loss and thinning
2) It reduces stress, and stress causes hair loss
3) It reduces scalp oil, and scalp oil is toxic to hair follicles over time
Some men on hair loss boards have tried to implicate E in hair loss, based on correlations. When T production rises in men, all other steroid levels (including E and DHT) tend to go up, too. The protective effect of E is simply weaker than the damaging effect of DHT, especially at the low levels of E present in men. As such, men may lose more hair when they have higher levels of estrogens, and given their nature, they prefer to blame the estrogens. Such arguments are not only unscientific, but defy common sense. The case against prolactin is no different.
If E raises prolactin, and E is good for hair, then higher prolactin levels will be correlated with better hair whether or not prolactin itself improves hair.
Quote from: KayXo on November 22, 2014, 02:23:15 PMYou also seem to have had higher E levels, so perhaps your E was more effective at suppression. Whenever I masturbated, I would notice head enlargement, redistribution of hip weight to the shoulders, increased hair loss, increased agitation, and increased urinary frequency/urgency - all androgenic problems. Interestingly, those problems were reversible if I abstained for 8 days or more, but the hair would not regrow. Given all of those ailments, I found it easy to quit once my T level came down.
I VERY much doubt this or at least in a significant way. I masturbated quite often pre-op, never experienced problems.
Quote from: Clhoe G on November 23, 2014, 01:56:35 AMFaster as well as deeper, like it no longer takes a while to realize my feelings.
Estrogen will make your emotions stronger on pretty much every level
Quotethere is a very small, like tiny amount of testosterone produced when masterbaiting.In people whose hair follicles are hypersensitive to DHT, the cause of my hair loss, even a small amount of additional T (and thus DHT) can be devastating for hair over time.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Carrie Liz on December 06, 2014, 01:13:37 PM
Post by: Carrie Liz on December 06, 2014, 01:13:37 PM
OP, it still happens to me too. Not just partial erections, but full ones. And I've been on HRT for 23 months, and I've had T levels that are even lower than the normal range for cis women since my freaking 2-month blood test. (Mine are consistently 22-28, base female range is 25-95.) And trust me, I WISH I didn't have those stupid erections. Every single time it happens, not only does it make me extremely dysphoric, it hurts like hell because HRT has rendered that area so damned sensitive.
Spontaneous erections have more or less gone away, and the constant inundation of sexual thoughts that come with them, but in terms of constantly dealing with them every single time a sexual thought actually does enter my head, and every time I think about getting "intimate" with someone, I feel your pain. :( And yeah, I'm VERY jealous every time I hear another trans woman say that she can't get them at all anymore. I wish. I hate those damned things so much.
Spontaneous erections have more or less gone away, and the constant inundation of sexual thoughts that come with them, but in terms of constantly dealing with them every single time a sexual thought actually does enter my head, and every time I think about getting "intimate" with someone, I feel your pain. :( And yeah, I'm VERY jealous every time I hear another trans woman say that she can't get them at all anymore. I wish. I hate those damned things so much.
Title: Re: Still getting, er, aroused after almost two years...
Post by: Lady_Oracle on December 07, 2014, 01:54:21 PM
Post by: Lady_Oracle on December 07, 2014, 01:54:21 PM
Quote from: Carrie Liz on December 06, 2014, 01:13:37 PM
OP, it still happens to me too. Not just partial erections, but full ones. And I've been on HRT for 23 months, and I've had T levels that are even lower than the normal range for cis women since my freaking 2-month blood test. (Mine are consistently 22-28, base female range is 25-95.) And trust me, I WISH I didn't have those stupid erections. Every single time it happens, not only does it make me extremely dysphoric, it hurts like hell because HRT has rendered that area so damned sensitive.
Spontaneous erections have more or less gone away, and the constant inundation of sexual thoughts that come with them, but in terms of constantly dealing with them every single time a sexual thought actually does enter my head, and every time I think about getting "intimate" with someone, I feel your pain. :( And yeah, I'm VERY jealous every time I hear another trans woman say that she can't get them at all anymore. I wish. I hate those damned things so much.
Same here, I've been on hrt for about 33 months now, thankfully the spontaneous erections don't happen anymore. I only get it if I'm sexually aroused and that kicks my dysphoria back up so I'm in the same boat as some of you. Its frustrating especially now that I'm in a relationship, makes me not want to be intimate with my partner at all. The pain can be really bad sometimes too... :(