Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I'm getting my gender on my identity card changed on Friday since my letter finally came in the mail. Since I will be legally able I'm going to start using the women's room but I'm super nervous. I'm still going through electrolysis and will be for at least another year or two.  For about three to four days of the week I can't shave. Has anyone else done it anyway? In my state I should have zero legal issues with this once cards are changed. I'm just worried about a bunch of unnecessary drama. I'm not even confident of using it when I am clean shaven. My voice is a dead giveaway still. All in all I'm super anxious. Among other reasons, I want to get my legal change done NOW just in case the rules change down the road. My employer told me once I legally change it I'll be *required* to use the women's room anyway at work.

I don't use anything but gender neutral restrooms. Therefore I sidestep all the issues nicely.

Then again, sometimes it means that I just don't go since they're not always available. But no drama!

Well, I can't avoid using the restroom personally.

How much facial hair do you have remaining and are you do anything to cover it in between electrolysis sessions. Knowing this probably help us give you a better answer otherwise you may need to use gender neutral bathrooms as your best option.

Quote from: Skeptoid on December 23, 2014, 03:50:57 PM
Well, I can't avoid using the restroom personally.

I used the women's room once in Meijer's when my wife was in there. It was in the late evening. I first went in the men's room and found the only stall occupied. I had to pee really bad and felt like I couldn't wait. I determined that my wife was the only person in the women's and went into the other unoccupied stall. While we were both in the stalls, another woman came in.  I waited for my wife to finish and the other woman to get into the stall. I then exited and went back into the men's to wash my hands. The stall in there was still occupied. Don't know what would have happened if I had been caught.

The electrolysis stuff makes it tough. How is your voice? If your voice is fem enough it can override the facial hair problem.

On a side note, I do use the ladies if I'm presenting female because I get really weird looks if I use the men's.

Skeptoid, passability is not, not, not, not a requirement for using the Women's. I have a lot of MtF friends who don't pass, but who use the Women's all the time.

You are a woman. The women's room is where we go. It just is. You have just as much right there as any woman. Anyone who gives you a hard time about using the restroom, either because of their opinion of your gender (which doesn't count) or because of any other equally irrational and unreasonable basis, is in the wrong.

When we are presenting as women, passable or not (it doesn't matter), the Woman's room is the place for us to "go".

Quote from: suzifrommd on December 24, 2014, 06:20:23 AM
Skeptoid, passability is not, not, not, not a requirement for using the Women's. I have a lot of MtF friends who don't pass, but who use the Women's all the time.

You are a woman. The women's room is where we go. It just is. You have just as much right there as any woman. Anyone who gives you a hard time about using the restroom, either because of their opinion of your gender (which doesn't count) or because of any other equally irrational and unreasonable basis, is in the wrong.

When we are presenting as women, passable or not (it doesn't matter), the Woman's room is the place for us to "go".

I make an exception for work, where I really don't present fully female yet but it's rather obvious, as I've done everything short of walking in wearing a dress. I don't want to be fired or destroy the goodwill I've gotten from them with regard to my transition. But when I start presenting at work the ladies is where I will be.

Quote from: Skeptoid on December 23, 2014, 02:51:43 PMMy voice is a dead giveaway still.

It should not be necessary to use one's voice in the restroom. I try to avoid talking anywhere unless it is necessary, and can sometimes let out a feminine tone depending on my reflux that day.

Quote from: zog on December 23, 2014, 02:54:53 PM
I don't use anything but gender neutral restrooms. Therefore I sidestep all the issues nicely.

Then again, sometimes it means that I just don't go since they're not always available. But no drama!

Unfortunately, I have found that many facilities do not have a gender-neutral bathroom, and when there is one, it is often a single stall for people with disabilities and is already occupied, often by someone who will not be quick. As a fairly obvious queer, I prefer not to loiter near bathrooms.

Quote from: Skeptoid on December 23, 2014, 03:50:57 PM
Well, I can't avoid using the restroom personally.

I usually can, though it often means being in agony and having multiple accidents. I am sure there are many hateful people out there who love the thought of that, and by avoiding the facilities I am giving them power. Still, I do not pass well enough to feel comfortable in the women's room, and men typically do not like to see me in their room wearing a somewhat fitted shirt and analyzing my hair/scalp in the mirror. So I try to avoid the situation altogether unless it is an emergency for #2. Change is hard.

Quote from: suzifrommd on December 24, 2014, 06:20:23 AM
Skeptoid, passability is not, not, not, not a requirement for using the Women's. I have a lot of MtF friends who don't pass, but who use the Women's all the time.

You are a woman. The women's room is where we go. It just is. You have just as much right there as any woman. Anyone who gives you a hard time about using the restroom, either because of their opinion of your gender (which doesn't count) or because of any other equally irrational and unreasonable basis, is in the wrong.

When we are presenting as women, passable or not (it doesn't matter), the Woman's room is the place for us to "go".

I agree with that on principle, but I fear a cis woman would call the cops. I have been ticketed, intimidated, kidnapped, threatened with death, and even assaulted by cops without ever violating a single law. I am convinced the police departments are organized crime units and I really do not want to draw their attention, especially now that I am 'out' as a transwoman.

Do what you feel is comfortable Skeptoid. If you want to use it and feel comfortable use the womens. If you don't, then don't. If I was not feeling passable I wouldn't want to use them. I am still at an androgynous stage personally so since I am more comfortable with it I generally use the mens toilets if I have to. I am pragmatic, it is easier for me and I don't care cause it doesn't give me any dysphoria or anything. It wouldn't be worth the anxiety for me at this stage.

I would add to be ready the first few times to face someone who may challenge you...if you're not pyschologically ready and you get brow-beaten, it could affect you for a long time.

Go in, and remind yourself "hey, I'm a woman just like any other; if someone has a problem with me, that is THEIR problem, not mine." After you've been in a few times, confidence develops and if you're confronted after that happens you may find that the haters are rather ridiculous in their opinions.

Quote from: Beth Andrea on December 24, 2014, 02:00:40 PM
I would add to be ready the first few times to face someone who may challenge you...if you're not pyschologically ready and you get brow-beaten, it could affect you for a long time.

Go in, and remind yourself "hey, I'm a woman just like any other; if someone has a problem with me, that is THEIR problem, not mine." After you've been in a few times, confidence develops and if you're confronted after that happens you may find that the haters are rather ridiculous in their opinions.

I agree after a few times it will become natural for you. I go potty with girls that know, and they really just don't care. Just do your business and leave. It's really no big deal. Females really just don't care. Plus, you ARE a female.

Quote from: Jaz650 on December 24, 2014, 08:34:53 PM
I agree after a few times it will become natural for you. I go potty with girls that know, and they really just don't care. Just do your business and leave. It's really no big deal. Females really just don't care. Plus, you ARE a female.

Huge, huge difference with you though. You are extremely passable, beyond what most trans women are. Those of us that look more than a little masculine could arouse suspicion, even to the point of the word "perv" being thrown at us and the cops being called. This is why I really only use the ladies when I'm pretty sure I'd pass.

If your ID says female, you are empowered by law to use the washroom the gender marker says you are. Not much to think about!

I just use the ladies anyway ... nobody seems to care!


Well, there is a back story. I was at a gay club this time last year, all dressed up of course.

I hadn't yet been to the ladies at that point. So I went to the mens'.

I gave a bunch of guys stage fright! They were very disconcerted by having a trans-girl in the mens' room.

So ... it's been ladies' ever since ....

I used the men's room for the first time since starting to use the ladies room over the weekend. I was at the theater watching night at the museum and had to go during the movie. I could not find the ladies room anywhere. Since there was a line at the family room, I said screw it and used the men's room. I felt weird going back in there, but I was out of options. After the movie my mom (my parents were visiting me for christmas) needed to use the restroom. She too couldn't find it. As we were just about to leave we found the ladies room. So next time I go there I'll know where it is.

Well, I got my ID last week and I've been using the women's room for a few days now. Oddly enough, I have yet to run into another women at the same time I was entering or leaving.

Quote from: Skeptoid on December 30, 2014, 03:12:05 AM
Well, I got my ID last week and I've been using the women's room for a few days now. Oddly enough, I have yet to run into another women at the same time I was entering or leaving.

That is rather unusual for the women's room.

I've been using the ladies room for over a year now. No one's said anything to me, except one lady who was letting me know which stall wasn't disgusting :P

I've just come across an interesting and relevant situation. So I'm at my dentist, and they have male and female restrooms but you have to ask for the key...which could get awkward if they hand you the wrong one. When I use the bathroom I just don't linger long and I've been fine so far...but that'd an extra complication I hadn't considered.

I've often wondered why we're more nervous in the ladies' room than just about anywhere else.  It's much the same experience as any other.  If you're read, you're read.  That's always uncomfortable, wherever it happens.  The difference is that the consequences of being read in the ladies' room are potentially more serious than elsewhere.  That's where we can get called "pervert", "sexual predator", etc., and that's where perhaps the management or cops can be called in.  Not something to look forward to. 

Nonetheless, I still think it's basically the same experience we have in lots of other places.  We shop, we work, we go places for entertainment, etc.  We've got lots of things to do, and whatever we're doing, there's always a risk that things won't turn out well for us.

My experience in the ladies' might be relevant.  I've been using the ladies' for over two years now and have never once been challenged.  I have the advantage of being very passable, and at 5'3" I don't call attention to myself.  Also, my voice is very passable.  It never gives me away.

Even so, I can be quite nervous at times.  E.g., if there's a queue.  You'd like to get in and get out, but if you're forced to wait, you fear the delay will give others a chance to read you.

Now a lot of people say that women are more likely to have a chat in the loo than men are, and so the chances are greater that you're going to have to engage with someone face-to-face (and voice-to-voice).  I'd agree that on the whole women chat more in the loo than men--but it's usually when they're in a group.  My feeling is that an individual woman isn't any more likely to engage an individual in conversation than a man is.  This is to say that in two years I've very rarely been forced to get into conversation with someone.

Other people will no doubt disagree with me, but I personally haven't found the ladies' all that different from the gents'.  Individual women tend to just go about their business and then leave--which gives you the chance to do the same.

So my view is that the risks we face in the ladies' are often over-stated.  I personally don't feel they're much greater than they are anywhere else.  So my strategy in the loo is the same as anywhere else: I simply go about my business with confidence as if I have every right to be there (which I do).  If you act like a woman who knows exactly what she's doing, I think the chances are that's what people will see and they won't challenge you because they'll hardly even take note of you.

The scariest experience I ever had: I was at a play and during the intermission I had to go.  Knowing that there would be a rush, I got there in a hurry in order to get in and out before the place was too busy.  Now it turned out that I was the first one in.  But when I came out of the stall, the place was absolutely packed.  I was terrified.  But I simply reminded myself, "Be cool!  Act like you're a woman who has every right to be here."  That's what I did, and I didn't come to grief.

So my feeling is that even girls who are less passable will probably be OK in the ladies' as long as you don't do stuff that will attract attention to you.  Perhaps I'm wrong about this.  I hope not, because like everybody else on this planet sometimes we need to go--and like everybody else we should be able to exercise the simple right to go.  And what makes me angry is this view that transwomen are a threat to other women.  Rubbish!  One of the main reasons to use the ladies' is because there are certain cisguys who are a huge threat to us.

At any rate, those are my views--but I'm well aware that other people's experiences will be different from mine, so their views will be different from mine.

Quote from: Ellesmira the Duck on December 31, 2014, 12:01:19 PM
I've just come across an interesting and relevant situation. So I'm at my dentist, and they have male and female restrooms but you have to ask for the key...which could get awkward if they hand you the wrong one. When I use the bathroom I just don't linger long and I've been fine so far...but that'd an extra complication I hadn't considered.

Apparently they both were single user so there was not any difference.

I was at a Halloween concert this year and went to use the girls bathroom, big long line so I followed a couple other girls into the empty men's room and used a stall like they did...how ironic, lol!

Quote from: Michelle G on January 01, 2015, 02:26:21 AM
I was at a Halloween concert this year and went to use the girls bathroom, big long line so I followed a couple other girls into the empty men's room and used a stall like they did...how ironic, lol!

Girls are able to do that without a problem.

Before I legally changed my name and gender I used the ladies room when I was presenting female and the gents room when I was presenting male. The great majority of the time I never ran into anyone in the ladies room, so I did not have to use my iffy voice. My appearance wasn't enough to get someone to call security on me.

Women do chat in the ladies room, so be prepared for that. Now that i'm legally a female I still find myself wary in the ladies room because of my voice. I have acid reflux and some days I just can't get my voice to make that clear high feminine sound like I can on non-reflux days. The ladies room has tile walls and they amplify how I sound so if it's an acid reflux day I do not sound like a female with my voice echoing around those walls. I try to limit what I say on those days but sometimes a coworker comes in and starts up a chat with me.

I have also had strangers start chatting with me and I have managed to produce a female voice each time thank heavens.

My voice remains the one thing that I can never be sure about because of the acid reflux. It's the one thing that may reveal my past when i'm in the ladies room.

Eve,

Please stay on top of taking care of your acid-reflux.  I know of one poor fellow who felt his lymph cancer was due to untreated acid reflux, he passed in less than a year after his diagnosis.  I myself take a daily dose of Ranitidine.  One trip I'd forgot it and wound up using OTC version, taking two pills to make my prescription dose.

Back on topic, I've only lady's a few times, as I've been occasionally presenting as female in public only since August.  But I always make sure to wash my hands, and take the time to refresh my makeup.  I did read about on X-dresser got arrested for taking photo's in the lady's at Antelope Valley Mall.  Ugh, that gives me pause to go there and people watch, to be taken as one of those :embarrassed:

I've been using the ladies for almost a year now and not a single problem. I had my first experience with having to queue recently - a bit uncomfortable since one can't just duck in and out but even having to stand in a line for five minutes wasn't a problem (good thing I wasn't busting!).