Susan's Place Transgender Resources

i went to my third meeting at the local transgender group last night, as i am wanting to connect with the people there.
i feel like neither fish nor fowl when i am there.  The girls that are further ahead or have completed their transition
have much more in common with each other than with me, i just feel like i´m intruding, it´s torture for me and breaks me down.
Been feeling low all day. i don´t want to give up and become a recluse again, but maybe i should just wait until some time after my HRT starts.
Seems all i do is hurt myself when i go there and i am trying so hard to build myself up.  i am not blaming the girls, it´s me,
i just don´t fit in.  i know i should put myself forward, take part in conversations but it´s so hard for me, am painfully shy and introverted
and it´s like they are speaking some language i cannot yet fathom and not sure if i even want to learn it.
If i give up i will feel like crap, if i continue probably the same. :-\

It's a rare person who can leap right into a new social group and feel totally at ease. Remember, most of those women at that group would have had a starting point similar to yours. Certainly being an extrovert to any degree helps but everyone has to start somewhere and it can take a few goes before the others accept and open open up to you. For people who are introverted it can be difficult, especially in a large engaged group. My suggestion is to not seem desperate, to ask a question every now or then of the friendlier people, make sure you've got an interesting, short and amusing story to tell, ask others how they've been, etc...that's what socialising is all about!

Quote from: Ms Grace on February 05, 2015, 03:26:36 PM
It's a rare person who can leap right into a new social group and feel totally at ease. Remember, most of those women at that group would have had a starting point similar to yours. Certainly being an extrovert to any degree helps but everyone has to start somewhere and it can take a few goes before the others accept and open open up to you. For people who are introverted it can be difficult, especially in a large engaged group. My suggestion is to not seem desperate, to ask a question every now or then of the friendlier people, make sure you've got an interesting, short and amusing story to tell, ask others how they've been, etc...that's what socialising is all about!

It´s more being disinterested and out of place than desperate.  It´s like sitting in a Chinese theater, it´s interesting for a while but soon you are eying the exit.
i don´t take part in many of the conversations here, but i do read them with interest because they often seem relevant to me, it´s like i have much more
in common with the people here than the ones closer to me.  Perhaps not a fair comparison, because here i am "safe" in my living room but still.
The way i figure it at the moment, if i´m not getting anything out of it and don´t feel like i have anything of interest to them, why bother.

How do you know you have nothing of interest to offer? :)

Quote from: Ms Grace on February 05, 2015, 04:04:41 PM
How do you know you have nothing of interest to offer? :)

i did try a few times but was largely ignored.  Twice i was asked my name and both times i got a huh, what did you say?
As if it was outlandish of me to claim to be called Linda.  No i was not mumbling, they heard me alright,
you know what i do blame them that did that.  i like the foreman of the group and her two close associates,
but the younger ones that i don´t know, that´s a different story.  Anyway i probably should not have brought this here,
it´s impossible to describe in words how it was, but i know that i don´t need that sort of socializing.
Thanks for replying and giving advice, i hope i don´t come off as being ungrateful Grace.

I am also an introvert and have always had a very hard time in groups. Lately I've been thinking it would be helpful to go to a group support meeting, however there aren't any near me. I know the feeling that you're talking about though. I experienced that when I was going to AA meetings. There was one particular meeting that felt more like a club that I wasn't welcome at. It wasn't ever the person putting the meeting on, it was the regulars who had been going there for years. Every time I talked they gave me certain looks that just made me feel like I wasn't welcome. One member approached me after one of the meetings and rudely criticized me about something I said to the group. I was was so angry I never went back. That's probably what his goal was since I wasn't part of his "click".

If it is just a couple of people who are making you feel unwelcome in that group, maybe you can just ignore them, you're not there for them. You said you like the foreman of the group and her two close associates, so maybe just focus your attention on them. Don't let the bad apples of the group ruin what could be a good experience for you. Just my thoughts.

Hugs  :)

Quote from: Raquel on February 06, 2015, 10:45:56 PM
I am also an introvert and have always had a very hard time in groups. Lately I've been thinking it would be helpful to go to a group support meeting, however there aren't any near me. I know the feeling that you're talking about though. I experienced that when I was going to AA meetings. There was one particular meeting that felt more like a club that I wasn't welcome at. It wasn't ever the person putting the meeting on, it was the regulars who had been going there for years. Every time I talked they gave me certain looks that just made me feel like I wasn't welcome. One member approached me after one of the meetings and rudely criticized me about something I said to the group. I was was so angry I never went back. That's probably what his goal was since I wasn't part of his "click".

If it is just a couple of people who are making you feel unwelcome in that group, maybe you can just ignore them, you're not there for them. You said you like the foreman of the group and her two close associates, so maybe just focus your attention on them. Don't let the bad apples of the group ruin what could be a good experience for you. Just my thoughts.

Hugs  :)

Sorry about what happened to you at the AA meeting Raquel, that goes against the principals set out there and can well understand that it hurt you.
Had the same experience many times over during my long stint at AA, there were always cliques where some were cleaner than others but i learned
to avoid those people and stick to the real winners, the ones going with the program.  It´s a good example you draw up and i can see a comparison
between these two groups of people.  Been thinking about it for a couple of days and have reached the same conclusion that you pointed out to me.
i am there for me and i do already have a fairly good starting connection with some people there, i am going to continue.
Also, i think going there will help me with my chances of being offered HRT, it shows that i am serious about this and won´t be side railed.
Thank you kindly for your input.
Linda

Linda, good for you for deciding to stick with the group for your own benefit  :eusa_clap: I have a feeling once you break through the initial awkwardness of trying to fit in with a new crowd things will be much easier for you and you will start really looking forward to going to these meetings.

As far as those AA meetings, I did find a different one where they fully accepted me and my stories and I actually looked forward to them up until the time I moved to the sticks in SW Kentucky.

Hugs, Raquel

Quote from: lindagrl on February 05, 2015, 03:18:10 PM
...
i just don´t fit in.  i know i should put myself forward, take part in conversations but it´s so hard for me, am painfully shy and introverted...

lindagrl, I have the same problem in groups, especially when I'm new. More than once I have just slipped out the door in embarrassment at being unable to connect.

I actually went to a hypnotist once to see if he could help me get over it. The hypnosis didn't work, but he made an interesting suggestion: "Find someone else who looks as uncomfortable as you feel, and go introduce yourself".

Is there someone like that in your group?

Linda, I'm an introvert by nature. When I attended my first support group meeting I listened as I was new and seeking answers to the many questions I had. I bode my time and a few meetings later I did speak. You have every right to be there and no one has the right to put you down. There will be people who are over infatuated with their own importance and then there will be people who are really great.

There's a saying that you have to show yourself friendly in order to make friends. It's something I did ages ago and has carried me all these years.    

:)

Newgrrl and Gennee, I really like your tips. I'll remember to use them the next time I'm in an uncomfortable group setting - "Show myself as friendly", and "Find someone else who looks as uncomfortable as I feel, and go introduce myself".

Hugs, Raquel

Quote from: newgrrrl on February 07, 2015, 01:08:19 PM
lindagrl, I have the same problem in groups, especially when I'm new. More than once I have just slipped out the door in embarrassment at being unable to connect.

I actually went to a hypnotist once to see if he could help me get over it. The hypnosis didn't work, but he made an interesting suggestion: "Find someone else who looks as uncomfortable as you feel, and go introduce yourself".

Is there someone like that in your group?

The meeting was held in the foreman´s home because the regular housing for the meetings is being changed and is not ready yet.
The living room area and kitchen is the same space really, so most of the others were sitting on and around the sofa in the living room
and me and a trans guy were sitting at the kitchen table.  The trans guy was having an even tougher time than i was and i wanted to
try and speak to him but he just stared straight ahead with a frozen smile on his face and i could not make eye contact.
This was not a normal meeting because of the situation with housing i think.

i did find someone as uncomfortable as me, but failed at introducing myself.  Maybe i will get another chance next time. 
It´s good advice, thank you Newgrrrl

Quote from: Raquel on February 07, 2015, 12:54:36 PM
Linda, good for you for deciding to stick with the group for your own benefit  :eusa_clap: I have a feeling once you break through the initial awkwardness of trying to fit in with a new crowd things will be much easier for you and you will start really looking forward to going to these meetings.

As far as those AA meetings, I did find a different one where they fully accepted me and my stories and I actually looked forward to them up until the time I moved to the sticks in SW Kentucky.

Hugs, Raquel

Well if i keep showing up i am giving myself a chance.  A bit embarrassed about how irate i was in the first posts about this, but i see the light now.
i really love this place, it´s folks like you that direct me to the right path again.  Hugs to you Raquel.

Glad you found a AA group where you feel at home, took me some time to find one also.

Quote from: gennee on February 07, 2015, 02:09:45 PM
Linda, I'm an introvert by nature. When I attended my first support group meeting I listened as I was new and seeking answers to the many questions I had. I bode my time and a few meetings later I did speak. You have every right to be there and no one has the right to put you down. There will be people who are over infatuated with their own importance and then there will be people who are really great.

There's a saying that you have to show yourself friendly in order to make friends. It's something I did ages ago and has carried me all these years.    

:)

i am taking every word you wrote on board Gennee, i am a friendly person just need to conquer my fear and feelings of awkwardness
and to stand by myself as some try and put me down, but in the right manner.
Very much appreciate your wisdom.
Hugs Linda

I attend 2 groups here, every 2 weeks, so I have only 3 or 4 visits in to each. I puked in the parking lot before each first time, forcing myself to go in. And I have walked back to my car a couple of times, in fear, but forced myself to return. I don't do new people or new environments very well at all, and 'trans' was a brand new thought process for me. I'm not sure what I was expecting at first, maybe to be in intense therapy, which is not what has happened - it is always a strange combination of angsting and socializing, personal insights and mindless chatter.

I don't feel accepted into brotherly or motherly arms at the groups. But I don't feel shut-out either. After awhile, I think I have learned a way to be, for now. In the silences that invariably happen, I will throw out a topic or problem that is bothering me, as a 'have you ever...' kind of thing. And I have also found, that if I listen to each person as they relate some part of their life, I often have something I can say to or for them, and this will engage them and even others into a discussion. Not always, and if there is not an opening for me to have a say, I simply let it go.

I have felt a few times that I should just get up and leave, that I was just wasting my time. But I have found, every time so far, when Im driving home afterwards, that I feel lighter, happier, calmer. Whether I felt the meeting was going well for me or not, apparently it has always, so far, had a positive impact on me.

Hi JayEm
The more i think about it, the better i am appreciating the role that the foreman of the group plays, she tries to keep it lighthearted
because most of us there are so self conscious.  i had preconceptions too about the meetings being some sort of therapy sessions,
but in reality just getting the people to sit in a room together for a couple of hours is an accomplishment in itself.
i haven´t puked before going in, but i really have to push myself not to start the car again and drive off, that´s a small victory.
i am going to take my time and try not to be so hard on myself or others for that matter, but next time i want to engage more
with the group, the way you do it sounds sensible to me.  This is a challenging path we are treading, not many signposts on the way.
Thank you for your input.
Linda

Quote from: lindagrl on February 09, 2015, 12:28:53 AM
Hi JayEm
The more i think about it, the better i am appreciating the role that the foreman of the group plays, she tries to keep it lighthearted
because most of us there are so self conscious.  i had preconceptions too about the meetings being some sort of therapy sessions,
but in reality just getting the people to sit in a room together for a couple of hours is an accomplishment in itself.
i haven´t puked before going in, but i really have to push myself not to start the car again and drive off, that´s a small victory.
i am going to take my time and try not to be so hard on myself or others for that matter, but next time i want to engage more
with the group, the way you do it sounds sensible to me.  This is a challenging path we are treading, not many signposts on the way.
Thank you for your input.
Linda

Many of us have perfected the art of being alone, so the thought of socializing with a group of strangers is terrifying. It just seems safer not to go.

I applaud you for sticking with it - it takes time but you should eventually make some contacts and find your place. Remember - there will be people at these meetings that are just as terrified as you. One day you will be the old timer, and you can make the effort to talk to the new people.

If a group just isn't accepting after a few visits maybe it's time to find a new group. This happened to me when I found a group at a local well known LGBT center that consisted of old timers and everyone else. I got the message and quit going there. I blame the moderator for not reminding the old timers that the purpose of the group is to support people, and that the new people need a lot of it. It is not a social club for the "in" members.

Quote from: Eva Marie on February 09, 2015, 12:48:46 AM
Many of us have perfected the art of being alone, so the thought of socializing with a group of strangers is terrifying. It just seems safer not to go.

I applaud you for sticking with it - it takes time but you should eventually make some contacts and find your place. Remember - there will be people at these meetings that are just as terrified as you. One day you will be the old timer, and you can make the effort to talk to the new people.

If a group just isn't accepting after a few visits maybe it's time to find a new group. This happened to me when I found a group at a local well known LGBT center that consisted of old timers and everyone else. I got the message and quit going there. I blame the moderator for not reminding the old timers that the purpose of the group is to support people, and that the new people need a lot of it. It is not a social club for the "in" members.

This is the only group in the country, so i don´t have a choice, it´s make it there or do this by myself and the thought of that does not appeal to me.
It´s fair to say that i have perfected the art of solitude, placing me in solitary confinement for months on end would not have affected me in the slightest,
but i am sick of it and now that i am going through these earth shaking changes i need to feel that i belong among others.
Yes i need support, but i am resigned to the fact that i am probably not going to get much of that there, so i will just have to make the best of it.
i will not be run out, whether some like it or not i am going to stand by who i am. i get support here and for that i am ever so grateful.
Hugs Linda

The thing about trans groups is that sometimes the only unified thread the members have between them is their gender struggles. Beyond that there may be a world of difference in likes, dislikes, interests and everything in between. Doesn't really make for much of a social environment at the best of times.

I find this topic to be very insightful and interesting, as I am starting to run a support group here and am very curious to avoid as much obstacles as possible. Trying to generate topics which would be interesting to discuss for all participants and avoid those which are specific to only one group is one of the challenges. Moderating the group is another.

Quote from: Ms Grace on February 09, 2015, 02:22:30 AM
The thing about trans groups is that sometimes the only unified thread the members have between them is their gender struggles. Beyond that there may be a world of difference in likes, dislikes, interests and everything in between. Doesn't really make for much of a social environment at the best of times.

At least there i am referred to as she, however grudgingly it is something to savor.
Okay, i am grasping at straws here but i think a bit of Pollyanna is called for under the circumstances.
Also as has been pointed out in the thread i can in time have my say as to how the group develops,
that´s an opportunity and a challenge to keep me focused on positives.

Quote from: ♡ Emily ♡ on February 09, 2015, 02:27:28 AM
I find this topic to be very insightful and interesting, as I am starting to run a support group here and am very curious to avoid as much obstacles as possible. Trying to generate topics which would be interesting to discuss for all participants and avoid those which are specific to only one group is one of the challenges. Moderating the group is another.

Glad you find this thread of interest, was not expecting it to receive so many comments.
i am learning a great deal from it as well.
Good luck with the support group  :)

Yeah, I hope it does not sound like a selfish purpose - and I do feel sorry that You have run into this kind of situation - but this is exactly the situation I will trying to avoid when we will (hopefully) start attracting more people. And I will say it again - it appears that Your group is not organised very well, or do You manage Your meetings and topics for discussion by Yourselves (and in case of affirmative, maybe senior members are taking up all the time and do they really need support of the group - of they just come there to socialise, while others might be seeking support)?

Quote from: ♡ Emily ♡ on February 09, 2015, 03:04:24 AM
Yeah, I hope it does not sound like a selfish purpose - and I do feel sorry that You have run into this kind of situation - but this is exactly the situation I will trying to avoid when we will (hopefully) start attracting more people. And I will say it again - it appears that Your group is not organised very well, or do You manage Your meetings and topics for discussion by Yourselves (and in case of affirmative, maybe senior members are taking up all the time and do they really need support of the group - of they just come there to socialise, while others might be seeking support)?

No it´s not selfish, i started this thread but don´t own it, am genuinely glad it´s of use to you.
Yes i believe they just come there to socialize, there is no moderation really, the senior members take up most of the time.
i think it´s because of lack of adequate housing that it turned that way, the first meeting i went to was moderated to some degree.
It´s hurtful to be left sitting there twiddling thumbs, but i am still glad that this group at least exists.
The housing problem should be resolved at the end of the month, so i hope that´s when it will start to become better for newbies.
But there is one place where i will draw the line.  If i ever get a "huh what did you say?" again when i state my name i am going to make a scene.

Quote from: lindagrl on February 09, 2015, 07:14:20 AM
But there is one place where i will draw the line.  If i ever get a "huh what did you say?" again when i state my name i am going to make a scene.

Linda, at least it wasn't a "huh what did he say?"  ;D Seriously though, I was just sitting here thinking about a situation like this that happened to me that made me realize in the end, it was just a misunderstanding. Is it at all possible that they just didn't hear you clearly when you introduced yourself? I know from experience that when we're nervous when we speak to a group we hear one thing in our head and it comes out sounding completely different to other people and you don't realize it until you hear a recording of yourself. Could they have just been wondering what you actually said your name was, perhaps they heard Lyndon but weren't sure and didn't want to embarrass you?

Hugs, Raquel

Just my 2 cents.

Remember that you are fairly new to the group (at least that is what I assume), many in the group will have an anxiety about new members just the same as you have an anxiety about participating in the group. To use a fairly extreme terminology, everyone is going through a threat assessment. Are you going to be a good fit for the group, is the group going to be a good fit for you.

Probably as time goes on and you start to feel more comfortable with the group and they with you then you will fit with the group better. Even if you never feel comfortable with speaking up, learn from the group. Let this be a place where you can start to come out of your shell.

Quote from: Raquel on February 09, 2015, 10:51:09 AM
Linda, at least it wasn't a "huh what did he say?"  ;D Seriously though, I was just sitting here thinking about a situation like this that happened to me that made me realize in the end, it was just a misunderstanding. Is it at all possible that they just didn't hear you clearly when you introduced yourself? I know from experience that when we're nervous when we speak to a group we hear one thing in our head and it comes out sounding completely different to other people and you don't realize it until you hear a recording of yourself. Could they have just been wondering what you actually said your name was, perhaps they heard Lyndon but weren't sure and didn't want to embarrass you?

Hugs, Raquel

Hi Raquel
Well i suppose it´s possible, but i thought i was making sure that i said it clearly, at least the second time. (happened twice that evening)
i have been told by a T that there is division within the group, that some there consider themselves more women than others, especially
those that are just starting their transition. This is the reason apparently that many don´t go to these meetings.  The second one that said huh
was the first trans woman in the country and when i repeated my name, she was not friendly about it, just turned away and did not speak to me again.
Like i wrote in earlier replies there are three there that i like and am getting to know a little bit, so it´s a start and i am going to try and connect more
with them, but i am serious about standing up for myself, anyone turning their nose up at me for no reason will get to know the bitch in me. (sweet smile)

Quote from: White Rabbit on February 09, 2015, 11:33:55 AM
Just my 2 cents.

Remember that you are fairly new to the group (at least that is what I assume), many in the group will have an anxiety about new members just the same as you have an anxiety about participating in the group. To use a fairly extreme terminology, everyone is going through a threat assessment. Are you going to be a good fit for the group, is the group going to be a good fit for you.

Probably as time goes on and you start to feel more comfortable with the group and they with you then you will fit with the group better. Even if you never feel comfortable with speaking up, learn from the group. Let this be a place where you can start to come out of your shell.

Yes those are good points White Rabbit and i will be giving everyone a benefit of the doubt, until it´s beyond doubt that there is hostility.
Would be best if i just ease into the group slowly as you say and that´s what i will be trying to do.

It's really a shame that some women feel so insecure with their own transitioning that they feel the need to make others feel bad about theirs, especially at what is supposed to be a support meeting. It's really too bad that there isn't some kind of etiquette that needs to be adhered to nationwide at these meetings like there is at AA meetings so that you know that this kind of behavior isn't supposed to be tolerated and could be reported to a higher up. If only there were more structure for our Trans community.

Hugs, Raquel

Quote from: Raquel on February 09, 2015, 12:22:29 PM
It's really a shame that some women feel so insecure with their own transitioning that they feel the need to make others feel bad about theirs, especially at what is suppose to be a support meeting. It's really too bad that there isn't some kind of etiquette that needs to be adhered to nationwide at these meetings like there is at AA meetings so that you know that this kind of behavior isn't supposed to be tolerated and could be reported to a higher up. If only there were more structure for our Trans community.

Hugs, Raquel

You know i was thinking the same thing, there is a need for guidelines within the group community.  Am a bit surprised they have not been developed yet.
Yeah, it´s a shame that people with the same interests can be petty to each other, but it happens within every group of people.
i can appreciate that an honor hierarchy develops in all groups, you often have to start at the bottom and work your way up and to some degree it is fair,
but when it comes to trans groups and recovery groups the newcomer really needs to be made to feel welcome.  If i make it into being accepted within
the group i hope i don´t forget that.
Hugs Linda

Quote from: Ms Grace on February 09, 2015, 02:22:30 AM
The thing about trans groups is that sometimes the only unified thread the members have between them is their gender struggles.

And Ms Grace is totally correct!  Linda, there's no reason why you should feel obliged to attend this group just because the only common thread is transness, if such a word exists!  I'd suggest that you give it a couple more tries, but don't stress if you really find that there's not much to talk about. 

xxx
Julia

Quote from: Julia-Madrid on February 09, 2015, 01:50:09 PM
And Ms Grace is totally correct!  Linda, there's no reason why you should feel obliged to attend this group just because the only common thread is transness, if such a word exists!  I'd suggest that you give it a couple more tries, but don't stress if you really find that there's not much to talk about. 

xxx
Julia

Ms Grace is correct i am sure.  The thing is i do feel obliged to attend this group, i want to be granted HRT and to get that i need to show
that i am coming out and am serious about transitioning, but okay i won´t stress if i have little to talk with them about, where i am heading
is the most important thing to me and i won´t lose focus on that.  If the group does not like me attending, tough trans titties, i will anyhow.  :)

Linda, I wasn't able to view your profile until today so I just thought it was a typo when you said that the group you're going to is the only one in the country. Now I see that you're in Iceland! Wow, so I guess you really have slim pickings huh? I thought it was bad in Southwest Kentucky, but at least I wouldn't have to go to another country to find a group. What are the chances any of those girls are members of Susan's? It's a small "Trans" World. Just keep that in mind, if any of those girls do have evil thoughts and have read what you've been posting, they might just try to provoke you and screw with you on purpose since they know that they are getting to you. I don't say this to make you paranoid, just to make you aware.

Hugs, Raquel

Quote from: Raquel on February 09, 2015, 02:48:01 PM
Linda, I wasn't able to view your profile until today so I just thought it was a typo when you said that the group you're going to is the only one in the country. Now I see that you're in Iceland! Wow, so I guess you really have slim pickings huh? I thought it was bad in Southwest Kentucky, but at least I wouldn't have to go to another country to find a group. What are the chances any of those girls are members of Susan's? It's a small "Trans" World. Just keep that in mind, if any of those girls do have evil thoughts and have read what you've been posting, they might just try to provoke you and screw with you on purpose since they know that they are getting to you. I don't say this to make you paranoid, just to make you aware.

Hugs, Raquel

Raquel, it´s fine if they are members here, i have only written the truth as it appeared to me.  i come here for info, advice and writing about what´s on my mind.
i can´t imagine any of them objecting to that and if some do it´s their problem really.  But point taken, will be on my guard.