Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Good Evening Ladies,

Based on the subject of this thread and the wide spectrum of women we have in our community (i.e. length on hrt, social situations etch). I want to request some feedback based on your personal account how long did you keep passing as a male?

I am excited about this thread. I have read the old thread back in 2013 and I am curious to know both the ladies that were here back then and the newer transitioners about their experiences.

A bit about me, I started HRT 6 months ago and have been reasonably passing. I had several instances of male fail but I am keeping everything on the DL as much as I can until I go FT at work.

Your feedback is appreciated ladies.

Love and Respect,

April

I'm not at the passing stage yet. At least, I'd assume not. I don't generally make any attempt to, and I really can't see it being at all possible until I start doing something about my voice. I'm waiting until I get down to a certain weight before I start putting effort into presenting female. I've only been on hormones for around a month. I haven't noticed much change. Even if I don't see any more change by the time I'm where I want to be weight-wise, it won't stop me. Weight and voice are my two big concerns at the moment.

The goal is, of course, to be as beautiful as that girl up there ^ someday. ;)

At the nine month mark of being on HRT, I started to have male fail.  Now at One year and a couple of months it happens all the time.  But it depends.  The day before and the day of electrolysis I will almost always be gendered as male.

The other odd thing is I am not out at work yet (next month!), and people see me there as male, but if someone does not know they assume I am female.  Even at work.

I think the answer is for people who know you, you can go along time and pass (enough) as male.

Babe, I know you can do it. I also lost a lot of weight recently about 50 lbs. it was a lot of work and when I first started doing my program I thought I will never see the end of it but I did it and so can YOU!

You are such a kind, sweet woman. If you need anything let me know :)

Love,

April

Quote from: Sunderland on March 01, 2015, 09:01:22 PM
I'm not at the passing stage yet. At least, I'd assume not. I don't generally make any attempt to, and I really can't see it being at all possible until I start doing something about my voice. I'm waiting until I get down to a certain weight before I start putting effort into presenting female. I've only been on hormones for around a month. I haven't noticed much change. Even if I don't see any more change by the time I'm where I want to be weight-wise, it won't stop me. Weight and voice are my two big concerns at the moment.

The goal is, of course, to be as beautiful as that girl up there ^ someday. ;)

Jessica thanks for your feedback. I am scheduled to go full time next month at work and I don't have the same length of time you have been on HRT.
However, it is truly inspiring to hear your experience.

Best of luck,

April

Quote from: jessical on March 01, 2015, 09:09:48 PM
At the nine month mark of being on HRT, I started to have male fail.  Now at One year and a couple of months it happens all the time.  But it depends.  The day before and the day of electrolysis I will almost always be gendered as male.

The other odd thing is I am not out at work yet (next month!), and people see me there as male, but if someone does not know they assume I am female.  Even at work.

I think the answer is for people who know you, you can go along time and pass (enough) as male.

For me it was around 6-8 months. Round then I bought new glasses and the receipt came back "Ms male name" (I wasn't trying, just andro cloathing and a backpack. They got my name of my insurance and medicare card). Of course milage may vary for different people, but this was me. Also around this time people who knew me personally would refer to me as he/him/sir. While people that didn't would more then likely use her/she/mam, or just be extremely gender neutral

Thanks for the feedback :)
Very inspiring

Quote from: immortal gypsy on March 01, 2015, 09:48:16 PM
For me it was around 6-8 months. Round then I bought new glasses and the receipt came back "Ms male name" (I wasn't trying, just andro cloathing and a backpack. They got my name of my insurance and medicare card). Of course milage may vary for different people, but this was me. Also around this time people who knew me personally would refer to me as he/him/sir. While people that didn't would more then likely use her/she/mam, or just be extremely gender neutral

I'm 3 months in (today marks month 3) and I get occasional male fail. Very rare though.

At work some people definitely know something is up. One friend at work (a TV reporter) asked me about my hair. He said it was kinda "cute." Yeah ok, I think he's figured out something.

However most people know me as a guy at work. We are kinda casual where we are and the CTO's assistant did comment on my "skinny jeans" once. But given that her boss knows she probably knows now. She says absolutely nothing now.

Outside of the office, it's usually genderless. Some people would call me "sir" once they hear me talk.

However when I wear a winter coat that makes me look much bigger than I am it's an instant "sir."

I notice that my regular places such as the Indian restaurant know me and call me "sir." Indian people tend to not hold back, "sir" all the way. That is, those that don't try to talk to me in Hindi (I don't understand Hindi, only English and Spanish).

All of this is while presenting male. Presenting female I pass. My incidents in the other thread are definitely due to facial hair shadow, which is less of a problem now.

At this rate I figure I have about 3-4 months before I get male failed to the point where I should just give up presenting male. I won't be fooling anyone. At least that's my hope. :)

BTW I shunted any problems at work by telling my manager and HR. I report to a VP and he reports to the CTO so they know. They've both pledged full support and there will be zero tolerance for any kind of harassment, which is also illegal under NYC law. So there is that as a backup. But I have a plan and it seems to be going swimmingly.

Quite honestly, after looking at your avatar Kate - you will get there in less time (male fail)
xoxo

April

Quote from: ImagineKate on March 01, 2015, 10:07:18 PM
I'm 3 months in (today marks month 3) and I get occasional male fail. Very rare though.

At work some people definitely know something is up. One friend at work (a TV reporter) asked me about my hair. He said it was kinda "cute." Yeah ok, I think he's figured out something.

However most people know me as a guy at work. We are kinda casual where we are and the CTO's assistant did comment on my "skinny jeans" once. But given that her boss knows she probably knows now. She says absolutely nothing now.

Outside of the office, it's usually genderless. Some people would call me "sir" once they hear me talk.

However when I wear a winter coat that makes me look much bigger than I am it's an instant "sir."

I notice that my regular places such as the Indian restaurant know me and call me "sir." Indian people tend to not hold back, "sir" all the way. That is, those that don't try to talk to me in Hindi (I don't understand Hindi, only English and Spanish).

All of this is while presenting male. Presenting female I pass. My incidents in the other thread are definitely due to facial hair shadow, which is less of a problem now.

At this rate I figure I have about 3-4 months before I get male failed to the point where I should just give up presenting male. I won't be fooling anyone. At least that's my hope. :)

BTW I shunted any problems at work by telling my manager and HR. I report to a VP and he reports to the CTO so they know. They've both pledged full support and there will be zero tolerance for any kind of harassment, which is also illegal under NYC law. So there is that as a backup. But I have a plan and it seems to be going swimmingly.

The earliest male fail I can think of though was at about a year. I was window shopping at a store in completely male clothes hanging out with my gfs at the time. They wanted to try on prom dresses and so we picked our dresses and proceeded into the changing room. The lady who was working in that area ended up stopping me because she thought I was a guy from behind, she said it was because of my hair. I wasn't really trying to pass at all. Long story short she apologized and I went into the women's changing room

The second noticeable male fail was when I was picking up prescriptions for my family. The pharmacist knows my family and says to me, "Oh I didn't know they had another daughter". At the time I had a full beard shadow lol and again I was wearing male clothing.

I have to admire anyone who can hold out.   By the time I started HRT, I was ready, so when people started asking questions a month later, and just plain male-fail a month after that, I went full time.  My plan was to wait at least another 6 months.   I'm happy I didn't.

I'm in an unusual situation and in the closet as I need to pass as a male because of my work in Banking and Finance. In my city, I had a reputation as an ultra Alpha male that was flambouyant and gregarious. So, even though I have been on HRT for almost two years I still pass but its getting more difficult, especially since Bruce Jenner hit CNN news. I was in my 2nd home in Phuket Thailand and there I am easily ID'd  because of the culture of acceptance and I'm quite open about it there.

For me passing or not, is mostly a matter of what I wear, my behavior, my voice is interchangeable, and I'm 5ft 7in and 133 lbs with a full head of hair which is way below my shoulders - which I tie in a pony tail and very fine features. Maybe my passing as a male is just me fooling myself. I am going to change my avitar and post a slightly blurred pic in the next few days, it will be the first time I post a real pic of myself.

well today marks 19 months on hrt for me, i am still living in boy mode and i rarely ever male fail to my knowledge, i do have a very small world i live in though and i have an extremely low voice with a very masculine personality that i have developed up to this point in my life, i believe most people judge you more on your personality than your appearance

I'm around 11 months in and have gotten one confirmed "male fail".  It was about a month ago and in a darkened restaurant but I'll take it!

My wife tells me I get questioning looks all the time but apparently I'm oblivious lol...  I was hoping for more by this point but I rarely even try to present lately due to my extremely demanding work schedule.  It's supposed to finally lighten up in the next few weeks.  That coupled with winter hopefully coming to a close and I won't be wearing a heavy coat everywhere should help!

I went FT after 2 months. I didn't worry about 'male-fail' or passing. I just had to be me.

Nowadays almost 3 years in I pass all the time. Or if I don't no one has ever referred to me as a guy!

I know no one will believe me, but I can still pass 100% as male if I need to. I'd rather not, of course, but I can. It's usually the day or two after electro, I feel so ugh about my face that it's more stressful trying to pass as female than it is spending an hour in dude mode. Last time I did get a few odd looks but no one doubted I wasn't "male". :)

Increasingly it is a weird experience, the sooner I never ever have to do it again the better.

Quote from: Cindy on March 02, 2015, 12:56:41 AM
I went FT after 2 months. I didn't worry about 'male-fail' or passing. I just had to be me.

Wow, Cindy.  That's exactly what happened to me.  Started E on 1/21/13, Full time 3/21/13.

I didn't consciously go full time, it just kind of happened.  One day I just felt so ridiculous in guy clothes that I took them off and never put them back on.

Does drunken crying in public count?  I was really stressed out and I broke down about two months after starting HRT.  Super embarrassing, so I won't go into specifics.  Especially since I don't let people see that part of me, or used to not let ... Ugh, why am I sharing this?

I think most of my life was a series of male fails.  Most of the issues I've had in the past were because people reacted to me as though I were a typical boy.  When I acted feminine, they didn't know how to respond, and/or "helped" by negatively reinforcing my behavior.  I'm pretty sure I knew to not be completely open with people by age 6.  And I never discussed with people why I periodically shaved off my body hair as a teen.  Although it did prevent me from having to rip out leg hair when I had to tape my ankle for soccer...

Anyway, after HRT I thought I could get by with androgyny, but spent more time hiding in bulky clothes and/or avoiding socializing.  But I never really thought of it as male fail once I finally stopped trying so hard to be androgynous.  I was getting ma'am-ed and sir-ed about 50-50 when I decided to donate my boy clothes to charity and go full time.  I guess, I sort of felt like I was always male failing for the 18 months I transitioned in stealth.  And my desire to want to crawl in a hole and die when clocked, faded through experience.  Now I just glare, arch an eyebrow and thinly purse my lips if I bother to acknowledge it at all.

Not sure if I stuck to the prompt exactly...
Also, can we call it "female-victory?" Or something less negative?


     Hugs,
- Katie
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote from: Jill F on March 02, 2015, 01:14:02 AM
One day I just felt so ridiculous in guy clothes that I took them off and never put them back on.

So did that happen at home or in the middle of the street...?  ;D

I started getting male fails about a year into HRT. By then I was talking to my therapist about a plan to come out because it was clear to me I could not hold out in guy mode for much longer  :)

Quote from: Ms Grace on March 02, 2015, 01:06:14 AM
I know no one will believe me, but I can still pass 100% as male if I need to. I'd rather not, of course, but I can. It's usually the day or two after electro, I feel so ugh about my face that it's more stressful trying to pass as female than it is spending an hour in dude mode. Last time I did get a few odd looks but no one doubted I wasn't "male". :)

Increasingly it is a weird experience, the sooner I never ever have to do it again the better.

A) You're beautiful.
B) I judged this solely based on your face and smile in your avatar pic.

We react slowest to changes in our appearance, and have a level of scrutiny that tends to be unsurpassed by any of those around us.  However that magnifying lens blinds us to the big picture, and we often aren't really looking at our reflection anymore.

I kept a set of nice clothes to have a guy-costume on standby for weddings and funerals of my extended family.  I don't want to get into it with them, and would rather let those days be about the people they're meant for.  Not their eccentric cousin.  (Those who are well-to-do aren't crazy)


     Hugs,
- Katie
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote from: Ms Grace on March 02, 2015, 01:16:29 AM
So did that happen at home or in the middle of the street...?  ;D

It was on the subway...  :P

No, actually I was getting groceries one day at the usual store.   I showered, washed all of the makeup off my face and put on a slim fitting shirt and a nice pair of jeans.  I probably looked OK, but I felt like crap.  I drove to the store, saw myself in the mirror and wanted to cry/barf.  As I walked in to the store, I looked down and saw the beginnings of my nascent mammary protuberances standing at attention.  It became clear to me at that moment that I could never wear that shirt again.  I cried a bit on my way home and after putting the groceries away, I changed into a black maxi-dress and beat myself with the pretty stick.  Instead of making the dinner that I had planned, we went out to a rock star magnet Mexican restaurant in Hollywood across the street from Guitar Center.   

I never did end up wearing guy clothes again.  I figured I'd probably have to at some point, but after a week and a half in uninterrupted girl mode, I decided that I needed to fully transition and come out to the world. 

And then, my first wardrobe purge...  :D

I gave away every single piece of male clothing the weekend before I went to work FT on the Monday - I made sure that I had not only burned but obliterated every bridge.

Actually, just another angle to that - when I do present as male I am quite a reserved and withdrawn. I am 6'3" of scary - as opposed to when I am in girl mode... happier, cheerful and 6'3" of gorgeous! ;D

Quote from: Jill F on March 02, 2015, 01:38:52 AM
...after a week and a half in uninterrupted girl mode, I decided that I needed to fully transition and come out to the world.

For me it was that I really hated having to shift gender gears - I was going to work as a guy, and increasingly going out in the evening as a gal - it was really doing my mind in with all the changing back and forth. Ugh, so glad those days are behind me.

Quote from: Obfuskatie on March 02, 2015, 01:38:13 AM
A) You're beautiful.
B) I judged this solely based on your face and smile in your avatar pic.

Well, thank you, ma'am!  :D

I find that if I don't overly dress feminine I will get gendered male in public do to the circumstances I'm in when I do go out pretty much 95% of the time. My hair's at that point where its starting to be just a bit longer then a pixie but its still short. The major thing though is I'm always out with my wife and my son and when people see 2 adults equally attending to and coddling a toddler they want to place one as the mom and one as the dad. If I have a day where I want to just put on jeans and a shirt because we're going to the supermarket for an hour and then home the rest of the day, I'm gonna get seen as male or dad. When I do go out by myself on rare occasions its usually female nowadays or genderless.

3 years and counting, then again I'm on lower HRT dosage.
Only one male fail incident, and strangely enough that was when I was wearing a suit.

I can't pass as male even if I wanted to. Back when I was getting the male fails, I was technically full time I just didn't have a female wardrobe yet.

Given that I have spent most of my life living and socialising as a guy, I pretty much know the rules and ropes... So, I can pass as male - lets say, I had to wear my L size suit for official job purposes and people did not roll their eyes when they saw me - maybe a couple of extra checking stares from police security personnel, but as long as my picture in ID matches my face, there are no questions. I do get some sideglances in male restrooms, but I usually walk in with confidence, shoulders wide and posture straight (and if questioned, I can drop my voice down really low) - anyway, there are far less consequences for being considered female in male restroom than vice versa.

As for daily routines, I have little clues for how other people see me and language is very much gender neutral (I can speak about myself in gender neutral language, avoiding gendered constructions and forms) and we very rarely use the equivalent of "Sir" or "Miss" here. But I have realised that there are situations when no matter what I wear or what I think about my looks, people would gender me female nevertheless.
Technically, I am not full-time, although I do not wear distinctive male clothes (with some exceptions when for work reasons I simply must put on power suit in order to to speak to government), at the same time, when I wear more female-leaning outfits, people do not give extra stares or bat their eyes - on the contrary, I am catching much more stares when wearing flat, baggy male winter attire...

Twenty months today on hrt and if I don't make an effort I am always, and I mean always read as male. If my face is scrubbed clean, no jewellery etc but I have made my hair as feminine as I can, and wearing woman's trousers and top I still get read 100% as male. Disappointing? That does not begin to describe it; and that is before using my hideous voice.

Quote from: Cindy on March 02, 2015, 12:56:41 AM
I went FT after 2 months. I didn't worry about 'male-fail' or passing. I just had to be me.

Nowadays almost 3 years in I pass all the time. Or if I don't no one has ever referred to me as a guy!

I'm quite sure they'd never do it again if they did.

Quote from: Ms Grace on March 02, 2015, 01:16:29 AM
So did that happen at home or in the middle of the street...?  ;D

:laugh: :laugh:

3 months before people at work began to suspect something, and my boss took me aside and I ended up coming out to her. Six months before "absolute male fail," where I was in mostly male clothes with a baseball cap and still could not get a stranger to believe my male ID was actually me.  I'd guess somewhere in between there was the point at which I could not *reliably* pass for male. (Though the real deadline was how long I could keep it going at work; I'd been planning and hoping to come out about three months longer, but oh well.)

I am 16 months on HRT and seemingly still passing at work. Everyone at the office that I work with see me as male. There have been a few confused stares from people at work outside of my normal circle of co-workers. No one has said anything to me about my change of appearance.

At work http://s36.photobucket.com/user/iam_leila/library/image_1 (http://s36.photobucket.com/user/iam_leila/library/image_1) Password is letmein

Outside of work has been a differing experience and so long as I keep my mouth shut or don't reveal my assigned at birth name, I am presumed female.

Quote from: Leila on March 02, 2015, 07:41:39 AM
I am 16 months on HRT and seemingly still passing at work. Everyone at the office that I work with see me as male. There have been a few confused stares from people at work outside of my normal circle of co-workers. No one has said anything to me about my change of appearance.

Outside of work has been a differing experience and so long as I keep my mouth shut or don't reveal my assigned at birth name, I am presumed female.

This is very much true! I believe that those people who are used to see You as male will just re-adjust their inner image of Yours and still go on seeing You as male no matter what. On the other hand, I spoke with a couple of co-workers and explained them what is going on and nobody seemed that much surprised. The rest... well, they still see me as a guy and then once for a while a new co-worker arrives and suddenly decides to hold a door for me... awkward :D.

Outside in completely strange environment, things are completely different though :).

My mom told me that with my longer hair, she's afraid people will start staring at me, etc... But I don't see it much... And I always male failed on the phone, I never got sir... So there is that...

I think it depends on a case by casis, though I'm pretty sure after the 8th to the one year mark, it's pretty obvious xD

Leila, I think your coworkers are simply remembering the male you or just being polite.

I figure once I pass really well I might look for another job. Just to avoid the questions.

However there is high turnover in our department these days so that may not be an issue. But I've been wanting to make a move anyway.

Quote from: ImagineKate on March 02, 2015, 09:56:52 AM
I think your coworkers are simply remembering the male you or just being polite.

Maybe they are. It is the kind of environment where people here are generally quite respectful of others. Although not be being out yet, I do wonder how far one day I could push my gender expression in the office and still not illicit any comments said to my face regarding it.

It really depends.  I have been on hormones for 5 years, and sometimes still pass as a boy.  It's funny too, because when I try to pass as a boy, it's always a fail. It's my androgynous look that can put me either way.

For example, my girlfriend and I are having a baby, so, to avoid confusion, I dress boyish when we go to our doctor appointments.  Without fail, every time, a nurse asks if we are sisters, or friends, and often times they ask if the father of the child is still in the picture.  They are always very surprised when I chirp in, saying I'm the father, and I can tell they rarely fully understand.  We had some pregnancy complications last week, and I spent 5 hours in the room with a nurse, and I tried to explain to her that I was the dad.  She still continued to call me she, and by the end of the visit, I realized that she thought we were lesbians, and that we had sought out a sperm donor. 

This brings me to another important point... hormones don't always make you sterile! =)

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi57.tinypic.com%2F2n06moj.jpg&hash=42b13bd5f0bcafdcd579b8ad51e92c695b458997)
me as a boy

Quote from: Leila on March 02, 2015, 10:14:44 AM
Maybe they are. It is the kind of environment where people here are generally quite respectful of others. Although not be being out yet, I do wonder how far one day I could push my gender expression in the office and still not illicit any comments said to my face regarding it.

At my office, I think short of me showing up in a dress and high heels most people will play along for now.

So much depends on how androgynous your body was preHRT and the effect hormones have on your mind. Throw in confusing secondary gender markers like androgynous clothing (male or female), long/feminine styled hair, groomed eyebrows, earrings or any makeup, and all bets are off.

It's a bit self-evident when you think about it, but hormones have the most drastic physical effect for people whose bodies exhibit strong secondary sexual characteristics of their gender assigned at birth. The changes will be hard to hide but in and of themself will not keep a person from passing as their GAAB. I am extremely androgynous. My female alter had no problems with people seeing her as a woman preHRT and I don't have any problems with people seeing me as a guy after 5 years on a full transition level regimen.

As powerful as the physical side effects of hormones can be, the effect they have on the mind is even more significant. Once the brain begins to receive the correct chemicals from HRT, gender dysphoria begins to subside. Many people simply lose the ability to perceive themself as their gender assigned at birth and become "unable to pass." For others like myself, hormones simply give peace, with no change in sense of self or desire to transition.

Quote from: VannaSiamese on March 02, 2015, 10:27:27 AM
This brings me to another important point... hormones don't always make you sterile! =)

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi57.tinypic.com%2F2n06moj.jpg&hash=42b13bd5f0bcafdcd579b8ad51e92c695b458997)
me as a boy

Cute pic!

(Un)fortunately for me, short of what I have in cold storage I think my days of fathering new offspring are over.

Vanna, there's no way I'd ever believe you were a guy, either. Your face is super feminine. If you weren't wearing a suit, I honestly would not even know which one was you and which was your girlfriend.

If you're growing your hair out and actually trying to feminize your appearance, it varies. Could be anywhere from a few months to a couple of years before you start male-failing. For me, the threshold happened at about 13 months of HRT when I started passing without even really trying. With my growing hair combined with my feminizing appearance and my unisex work uniform, people stopped being able to tell which sex I was. People were even switching back and forth between "he" and "she" within the same sentence.

(If you want to see what I looked like at the time, here is a "presentation check" video I made in my work uniform at the EXACT point where people generally started calling me "she" intermittently.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F_vDWgAyPI

(This was almost exactly one year ago, by the way. So obviously, that 2nd year on hormones makes a BIG difference. After one year, I was just starting to get to the "androgynous" phase, where now with my hair, body, and mannerisms, I don't know if I could pass as male even if I tried. Maybe if I was wearing a business suit and deliberately walking with my legs apart in a dominant manner and speaking in a super-deep voice? I dunno.)

If you're NOT trying, though, if you keep your hair styled in a stereotypically "male" style and don't try to change your voice at all or feminize your appearance or mannerisms at all, and still wear male clothes, frankly the duration can be more or less indefinite. Hell, I've even heard stories from people who have gotten FFS while still keeping short hair and presenting as male who still could easily keep being accepted as a guy by people. And it makes sense. Even cis women, who never went through a male puberty in the first place, can get "sir"ed when they have short hair and wear masculine clothes. So if you sound the part too, and act like the part, trust me, people can and do easily overlook a little bit of boob development, butt development, and softer features.

Also, this is another thing that I've noticed... especially with the voice thing... people will listen to what you tell them. If you sound like a guy, look somewhat guyish, and have a deep voice, people will readily still accept you as male as long as you tell them that you are male and go by a male name. You can get away with a LOT of s*** in terms of gender-nonconforming features as long as you have confidence in who you are. Even after the point at work where I stopped passing as male to pretty much every single customer, the other poker dealers still accepted me as a guy.

I wouldn't stress out about it too much. There's a LOT of leniency in terms of what people will accept gender-wise when you're still wearing masculine clothes.

Quote from: Obfuskatie on March 02, 2015, 01:15:44 AM
I think most of my life was a series of male fails. 

Also, can we call it "female-victory?" Or something less negative?

^THIS^  I knew I liked you!

Quote from: VannaSiamese on March 02, 2015, 10:27:27 AM
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi57.tinypic.com%2F2n06moj.jpg&hash=42b13bd5f0bcafdcd579b8ad51e92c695b458997)
me as a boy

Ah,... no. You dressing as a boy. You don't look any more male than your girlfriend does.

In our male-dominant society, it is generally assumed that a person is male until they prove they are not. But regardless of whether you are MAAB or FAAB, it comes down to having enough markers of your target gender to be accepted that way. Specifically, MAAB's need to add enough female gender markers to create doubt about their maleness. FAAB's need to remove enough female gender markers to remove doubt about their maleness.

Carrie Liz says it very well:
If you're NOT trying, though, if you keep your hair styled in a stereotypically "male" style and don't try to change your voice at all or feminize your appearance or mannerisms at all, and still wear male clothes, frankly the duration can be more or less indefinite.

In the bigender world we call this "Mister Potato Head." Stick on a few pieces and people see you as a guy; stick on some others and people see you as a girl.

It takes a tremendous amount of effort to find a balance. I'm a rail skinny 5'10" and 144 pounds with a shoulder length grunge. My body has always been very androgynous; 5 years on hormones did little to change that. My breasts look like good pecs when I go without a shirt in the summer, and my female alter doesn't feel a need to shave the fine hair on my chest, legs and under my arms to wear a bikini to the beach. She styles my shoulder length hair, I keep it a tousled mess. I have a deep baritone voice, she sounds like Sofia Bush. I had my beard removed except for my VanDyke; she shaves it off and I let it grow. I have my wardrobe, she has hers. My electrolysist thinned my eyebrows to look like I did when I was a teenager and I keep my nails with about an 1/8" of white showing. At 55, I grew up in a world where only prostitutes had their ears pierced so my female alter wears clip-ons. When I am clean shaven wearing bootcut jeans and a tee shirt, I can literally walk into the mens room and letting my female alter front, people will see her as a female when I come out.

Quote from: Jill F on March 02, 2015, 12:14:56 PM

Quote from: Obfuskatie on March 02, 2015, 01:15:44 AM
I think most of my life was a series of male fails. 

Also, can we call it "female-victory?" Or something less negative?

^THIS^  I knew I liked you!

We need NASA speak?
Gender conformity
Or
MAABBNPAF ?

Quote from: Jill F on March 02, 2015, 12:14:56 PM

Quote from: Obfuskatie on March 02, 2015, 01:15:44 AM
Also, can we call it "female-victory?" Or something less negative?

^THIS^  I knew I liked you!

We need something with more punch. "Male fail" is, at least, alliterative. How about "female domination"? [emoji14]

Dee

"Sticks and stones can break my bones, but whips and chains..."

I notice something as well.

The first thing people notice about me is that I lost weight.

Then that proceeds to general "what's up with you" questions.

Today I came out to a coworker in that same sequence.

"Hi R, how are you? I see you've lost a lot of weight, are you OK?"

"I said, well yes but there are major things going on in my life right now."

Then we talk a bit and I spill the tea. She has nothing but support and encouragement and gave me a hug.

So yeah, maybe people see that you're different but can't quite place it because they're accustomed to you.

I started transitioning at 24 and hrt in June of 2013.  Its been a long time and so much has changed from that time period.   Recently, like September of 2014, I started taking estradiol injections which was another big step as my levels were finally impriving from where they were on oral hrt.  Besides the medication, I've been doing laser hair removal for a year or so, which has significantly removed my facial hair, I've grown my hair out quite long and usually straighten it and my eyebrows are done in more of a feminine manner.  Even after all this, I'm still making changes and working on getting where I want to be.  I no longer really pass as a cismale and its more of an androgynous thing. Its obvious to people that I'm changing and I get gendered multiple ways depending on the day, including on the phone which really phases me when I don't try.  I'm very close to fulltime and have been working on my emotional stability as well as finances and family, besides my appearance, before full jumping the gun.  Everything has changed very gradual and I can't pinpoint the exact moment people have picked up on it, but people knowim trans and I can't hide that fact anymore. Like at work, I'm still showing up as a guy, but I know my coworkers must be aware something is up and one that I came out to said that she suspected it for a while.  And people start treating you differently and start treating you more like!e your identified gender.  Even in boy clothes, you see people are taking you differently and interpreting you as female. After being in transition for a while, I no longer see passing in black or white terms.  Sometimes it just happens even when you are not trying.  But male fail or tricking people into thinking you are a cismale are two things that don't really happen in the middle of your transition.  People!e gradually pick up on it as you go on and its hard to hide obvious changes.  But I say this having prolonged the androgynous phase.  Its different for everyone, but you can only get away with it for so long.  Eventually, people will know or guess.  You really can't hide a transition forever and all the small changes will gradually be picked up on which is a good thing in the end as that's sort of the point,lol.  Yoiu don't go from point a to point b.  You go to point a to b to c to d, etc...., ya know?  So expect to lose your ability to pass as a cismale at some point and don't expect to pass as a cisfemale right away.  I guess the overall point is you will gradually change and people will pick up on it at different points, but its hard for me to say when as its all been very gradual and still is.

TY Jill [emoji5]️
Once acronyms can't be said in two syllables, they are too long IMO Cynthia [emoji53]

Quote from: Dee Walker on March 02, 2015, 02:03:00 PM
^THIS^  I knew I liked you!

We need something with more punch. "Male fail" is, at least, alliterative. How about "female domination"? [emoji14]

Dee

"Sticks and stones can break my bones, but whips and chains..."

Perfect rhyming yeah.  Alliteration always allots a lot more alike sounding consonants. 
And I just realized that quote is from a Rihanna song [emoji33]...
Alternatively, I'd prefer we alighted on something slightly less exciting, if you'll allow...[emoji6]

Does Charlie Sheen have a copyright on "winning?"
Because it could be something like:
   Winning - being correctly identified as your chosen gender when you're not even trying.
   Or some spelling variation thereof... As long as it is not confused with a horse's whinnying.
   Or maybe winsome?

Hooray for rebranding/reframing!  For realsies though, failing sux IMO...


     Hugs,
- Katie
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote from: learningtolive on March 02, 2015, 02:25:59 PM
...
I no longer really pass as a cismale and its more of an androgynous thing.
...

This part is where hetero-cisnormativity causes people to give you odd looks.  Thing doesn't fit their worldview.
Remember It's Pat on SNL?
  "Are you a brotha or a sista?"
  "Actually I'm an only child."
  It's Pat!  Shrug...

Is it weird I always want to push people into the pool?  Especially when they are slowly inching in to acclimate.  Rip off that band-aid!  The slow acclimation process is agonizing.  I know, because I'm a hypocrite...[emoji41]


     Hugs,
- Katie
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote from: VannaSiamese on March 02, 2015, 10:27:27 AM
It really depends.  I have been on hormones for 5 years, and sometimes still pass as a boy.  It's funny too, because when I try to pass as a boy, it's always a fail. It's my androgynous look that can put me either way.

For example, my girlfriend and I are having a baby, so, to avoid confusion, I dress boyish when we go to our doctor appointments.  Without fail, every time, a nurse asks if we are sisters, or friends, and often times they ask if the father of the child is still in the picture.  They are always very surprised when I chirp in, saying I'm the father, and I can tell they rarely fully understand.  We had some pregnancy complications last week, and I spent 5 hours in the room with a nurse, and I tried to explain to her that I was the dad.  She still continued to call me she, and by the end of the visit, I realized that she thought we were lesbians, and that we had sought out a sperm donor. 

This brings me to another important point... hormones don't always make you sterile! =)

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi57.tinypic.com%2F2n06moj.jpg&hash=42b13bd5f0bcafdcd579b8ad51e92c695b458997)
me as a boy

That is probably because you still look like a girl in that picture.

People were commenting - a lot - that is was looking younger. But that was mostly people who I hadnt seen for a few months at a time. Even after someone at work finally twigged that my legs and arms were hairless (I'd already been waxing them for like six months) and after I had my ears pierced no one twigged to anything. If anything they probably just presumed I was finally letting my "obvious gay identity" loose lol. Once I came out though all the pieces fell into place in a very major "that explains that" kind of way.

I think that the truthful answer to the question is, "it depends." No? 

Some people will reach "male-fail" very quickly.  (Sorry, I can't think of an equally catchy "female-succeed" equivalent :)).

Some people will never pass.

Most people will fall somewhere between the two extremes.

Where you fall depends on your own individual combination of genetics, age, hormonal variations, sensitivity to transition meds, and willingness/ability to spend on various procedures.  A lot of it really is luck of the draw.

In law school, I learned that the answer to every legal question is, "it depends."  I find that "it depends" is a very good answer to transition related questions too. :)

If you're looking for a catchy replacement for male-fail, how about contracting feminine and winning to form, feminin'ing

First time I got mam'ed, I was 26 with long hair in an androgenous pair of green sweat pants and sweat shirt.  I'm still 6 weeks out from any form of hormones my body didn't already have in it.  Now at 46, I'm not so certain that I'll ever really pass.  But I really don't care anymore, I'm planning on working on my presentation anyway. 

Kate, congratulations on feminin'ing at the doctors office.  That's quiet the kudo. 
Hugs,

-Alana

HRT did nothing for me. It was all attitude and weight loss. After I had surgery, nearly two years after I started HRT,  I did get some breast development but I've lost most of that as I have slimmed down significantly.

Quote from: Obfuskatie on March 02, 2015, 01:15:44 AM
Also, can we call it "female-victory?" Or something less negative?

LOL! I love this. I am going to use this from now on.

I had an interesting experience today.

I had a vendor meeting. These guys flew in from out of town.

They gendered all of my colleagues, "him" and "his" but absolutely refused to gender me. I am in male drag today.

Only one of them kind of reluctantly said,"sorry about that man" when he bumped into my chair.

My manager knows about me being trans but he keeps it quiet and obviously won't out me to a vendor.

My days of passing as a male seem to be coming to an end. At least I hope so. I have to keep it up for a couple of months yet, don't know if I'll make it. :)

"female-victory" here I come!

Quote from: Alana_Jane on March 02, 2015, 08:36:42 PM
Kate, congratulations on feminin'ing at the doctors office.  That's quiet the kudo. 
Hugs,

-Alana

Thanks Alana. :)

Without FFS, I think I could always pass as male if I wanted to. I might now look like a rather frail man, and possibly one that is a little strange looking, but I am guessing most people would just think I am not well. My therapist said to me recently that she has never seen anybody who can look as radically different from boy mode to girl mode as I do, and she has been a trans therapist for more than 20 years. I am 6'3", and even though have developed the start of a female voice, I can still drop it into the cellar if I need to get heard. I have had a little fun a few times meeting people in boy mode, who have known me only as female, and not having them recognize who I was. I sort of think of that as a backwards form of passing

Quote from: Ms Grace on March 02, 2015, 03:43:53 PM
People were commenting - a lot - that is was looking younger.

I got that when I started HRT. My friend didn't have a clue until I came out though.

Interestingly enough it was from a friend who was in a glam rock band and wore makeup and women's clothing as part of the show. :)

Quote from: April Lee on March 03, 2015, 02:20:42 PM
My therapist said to me recently that she has never seen anybody who can look as radically different from boy mode to girl mode as I do, and she has been a trans therapist for more than 20 years.

I would say that, but I think more time on HRT could change that.

You do have a sense of style though, and I like it a lot.

Just last Thursday I had the truck in for on oil change, and when I walked into the seating area there was an old acquaintance there talking to garage manager, and at first didn't see me.  However, when he was finished talking to the manager and had started to turn around, I said "Hi", and immediately he was doing a double take, since even though I was not presenting female (I had some makeup on top of my sunscreen to give me color so that people didn't think that I was a "ghost", and a small claw clip at the back of my hair, I wasn't trying to present feminine, just getting an oil change, and had thrown my look together rather quickly, plus I had my blue light glasses on because I knew that I was going into a place with fluroescent lights) I could tell that he was trying to remember me, but also my appearance was confusing him, since he wasn't sure if he was talking to a man or woman.  We talked for a little bit, and at one point he asked me if I was transitioning, and I never gave him an answer, since we got interrupted by the manager asking him something about his car, and afterwards, he and I talked some more, but we never got back around to him asking about my transition.  Of course I'm not yet out to my family, and he's a friend of my brother, so I didn't want him telling my brother when I haven't told my brother yet.  However, I still got a thrill that I am starting to male fail when I'm not trying too.

And a few weeks ago when I was at the store, I did get someone who called me "she" and then corrected themselves.

Ok just had one I didn't expect but I just had someone on the phone (one of those annoying "we're doing an environmental survey..." nuisance calls), and the woman at the other end called me "Mrs.____". I've never had vocal training or anything like that, but I guess I sounded female to her. 

At some point if you have been blessed with female features, it can be very hard to pass as a male.  That is because you just look female to most people, at least at first glance.

However, if you have distinct male facial features, are really muscular, very tall, hairy, or with a clearly male voice, then it can be quite awhile before you male fail. 

Be aware that there are some CIS females that look more male than female though.  Maybe that comes with age in part.  Others just do not look very feminine.  Perhaps that look is intentional by some, but not for others.

Hormones for transitioning, managed appropriately by your physicians, can do wonders.

I get clocked when people overhear some of my speaking more than at any other time.
If I am careless with clothing (too unisex, as an example) or get really sweaty that does not help either.

Look at many of the other woman here, they look so nice.  They have different transitioning stories, some have had surgeries, and some started MTF hormones perhaps much earlier than others.  Everyone is different.  Just look at the other posts made so far.

Chrissy

Quote from: ChrissyRyan on August 03, 2024, 03:57:06 PMAt some point if you have been blessed with female features, it can be very hard to pass as a male.  That is because you just look female to most people, at least at first glance.

However, if you have distinct male facial features, are really muscular, very tall, hairy, or with a clearly male voice, then it can be quite awhile before you male fail. 

Be aware that there are some CIS females that look more male than female though.  Maybe that comes with age in part.  Others just do not look very feminine.  Perhaps that look is intentional by some, but not for others.

Hormones for transitioning, managed appropriately by your physicians, can do wonders.

I get clocked when people overhear some of my speaking more than at any other time.
If I am careless with clothing (too unisex, as an example) or get really sweaty that does not help either.

Look at many of the other woman here, they look so nice.  They have different transitioning stories, some have had surgeries, and some started MTF hormones perhaps much earlier than others.  Everyone is different.  Just look at the other posts made so far.

Chrissy

In my case I'm intersex as well so my original puberty did not have the same effect on me as other AMAB's, and seems to have me follow both puberties for both males and females. So there were parts that never developed as male but as female.  Or like my voice it never dropped as much as other males.  Of course for a while the doctors thought I had Kleinfelter's, but my kerotype test came back saying that I have XY chromosomes, so they are not sure why I have features of Kleinfelter's.

So my current HRT seems to be building on the natural female part of my original puberty.

Quote from: NancyDrew1930 on August 03, 2024, 08:31:51 PMIn my case I'm intersex as well so my original puberty did not have the same effect on me as other AMAB's, and seems to have me follow both puberties for both males and females. So there were parts that never developed as male but as female.  Or like my voice it never dropped as much as other males.  Of course for a while the doctors thought I had Kleinfelter's, but my kerotype test came back saying that I have XY chromosomes, so they are not sure why I have features of Kleinfelter's.

So my current HRT seems to be building on the natural female part of my original puberty.

I wonder if Androgen Insensitivity has something to do with it. With that condition, testosterone is produced but the androgen receptors in the body are "insensitive" to it. In essence, testosterone would have no effect. Typically, this would result in a feminine appearance despite XY chromosomes.

I don't know if Androgen Insensitivity is all-or-nothing (either you have it or not), or if it can be in a range from mild to severe, where only some areas are unaffected. I don't know enough about it.

Quote from: Lori Dee on August 04, 2024, 12:07:45 AMI don't know if Androgen Insensitivity is all-or-nothing (either you have it or not), or if it can be in a range from mild to severe, where only some areas are unaffected. I don't know enough about it.

Same. I am working with my medical professionals about this, as they learn more from me and this condition. Additionally, I joined intersex communities on other forums to look for answers. It's going to be interesting what we all learn about this condition.

Quote from: NancyDrew1930 on August 03, 2024, 08:31:51 PMSo my current HRT seems to be building on the natural female part of my original puberty.

Same. But I'm already on low dose Estradiol and Spironolactone. I called my doctor and I asked if there's anything lower because I don't want to feminize my self to much. She said we will know what is going on when they check my levels in September, which is my first pit stop.

In the meantime she said I can bite the Estradiol and Spironolactone tablets in half if I become to concern about my progress.

I am thinking of facial surgery but it is probably better to save the money instead.
So I think I will keep the status quo.

Chrissy

Quote from: Lori Dee on August 04, 2024, 12:07:45 AMI wonder if Androgen Insensitivity has something to do with it. With that condition, testosterone is produced but the androgen receptors in the body are "insensitive" to it. In essence, testosterone would have no effect. Typically, this would result in a feminine appearance despite XY chromosomes.

I don't know if Androgen Insensitivity is all-or-nothing (either you have it or not), or if it can be in a range from mild to severe, where only some areas are unaffected. I don't know enough about it.

I might have Androgen Insensitivity, since when they looked back on my records my testosterone was always right on the border of the crossover zone where if AMAB people are in it it is considered low, but for AFAB people it is high.  (It might've been 0.1 or 0.2 inside or just outside, but I always seemed to be on the fence of that zone). Aside from my recent tests over the past few years, my older records did not show any tests on my estrogen levels so they don't know how much estrogen I naturally produced prior to my baselines for MTF HRT.

But right now with my other issues, finding out if I have Androgen Insensitivity or what made me Intersex are on the back burner, unless something comes up where they need to find out more about it.

However, with my X chromosome there are other things I was born with that are linked to mutations on my X, so it's possible that I do have Androgen Insensitivity because of a mutation on my X chromosome that caused my body to not fully be able to use testosterone.  Of course another theory that has come up is that my Y was only working at half power and when it joined with the X from my mom, it didn't have enough power to "flip all the switches" on my X from female to male, so they are wondering if my X was working with half its switches in the male mode, and the other half in the female position all my life.

Woman at work were saying I looked different at about 6 months. They were saying my face looked softer and whiter. At 9 ,months a guy at work put his hand on my back and asked if I was wearing a bra. I needed FFS and Hair transplants. My hair was down to just above my shoulders at 2 years.

I came out at work at at 3 years, FFS & GCS & Hair transplants at 4 years BA at 5 years. Wearing female clothing was really difficult because I thought I in not way passed until I had the procedures.

After the work above I could not be seen as a guy if I tried. I knew when I had FFS (first procedure) that there was no going back. The night before FFS I looked in the mirror and asked myself if I was sure. I replied yes. I remember taking the bandages off in the short stay at day 4 post op FFS. I cried. I did not recognize the person looking in the mirror. I look like my sister.

I have been on HRT for 12.5 years and people think I am 10 plus years younger than I am.

Once I started HRT in May 2018, it took about two years until I couldn't pass as male anymore. And realistically, it was more like a year. The first year I spent more time off HRT than I did on, and went about 6 consecutive months completely off HRT. I don't think HRT did much in that first year since I kept flip flopping due to fears and anxieties about my marriage and career.

I buckled down with HRT in May 2019, started growing my hair out in January 2020, and had a few laser hair removal sessions. By around June of 2020, I was pretty consistently being addressed as "ma'am", "miss", etc. in public even though I was still wearing men's clothing. I continued to grow my hair out and have some more laser hair removal sessions and went full time living as a woman in January 2021.

I think a lot of people overestimate the impact of muscles on the ability to pass. I am very muscular and pass with ease. Passing has a lot more to do with skeletal structure, voice, and body language than how much muscle mass you have.

Hi Nancy

I noticed the following quoted passages and are listed in order of time, the first one:

Quote from: NancyDrew1930 on April 18, 2024, 12:37:19 PMLast night I was out for dinner with a group I volunteer with, and I'm not out to them, however I just saw a photo on Facebook and I was in the back in the photo, and at first I was like "Who's that woman?  I don't recall seeing her there."  Then I realized that it was me!  The way I had my hair, I really had that feminine look even though I was presenting male.

The second one:

Quote from: NancyDrew1930 on June 24, 2024, 01:29:08 PMWe talked for a little bit, and at one point he asked me if I was transitioning, and I never gave him an answer, since we got interrupted by the manager asking him something about his car, and afterwards, he and I talked some more, but we never got back around to him asking about my transition.  Of course I'm not yet out to my family, and he's a friend of my brother, so I didn't want him telling my brother when I haven't told my brother yet.  However, I still got a thrill that I am starting to male fail when I'm not trying too.

The third one:

Quote from: NancyDrew1930 on July 18, 2024, 09:42:32 AMI didn't say anything but it was nice that I could tell it that to them I was giving off a more fem vibe than a male vibe.

The fourth one:

Quote from: NancyDrew1930 on August 01, 2024, 09:34:29 AMOk just had one I didn't expect but I just had someone on the phone (one of those annoying "we're doing an environmental survey..." nuisance calls), and the woman at the other end called me "Mrs.____". I've never had vocal training or anything like that, but I guess I sounded female to her

The question you should be asking yourself is this; "I wonder if I went out completely as Nancy", I would not be surprised if you were successful presenting as a female.

It's good to hear that things are going well for you.

Love and Hugs
Sarah B
Official Greeter
@NancyDrew1930 

Quote from: ChrissyRyan on August 03, 2024, 03:57:06 PMIf I am careless with clothing (too unisex, as an example) or get really sweaty that does not help either.

That was different from my experience. Pre transition, after over a year on HRT, electrolysis nearly done and a hair style that could work either way, dressed casual male (though not strongly gendered clothing) no one at work at had clue, but when at a restaurant dressed that way (but seated) I was often taken for female by the waitresses.

But when I dressed unambiguously (but appropriately and not overdone ) female, i was often read. That has never changed.

Oh well, at least it helps keep my clothing expenses down!;)

- Karen

Quote from: Karen_A on August 11, 2024, 10:49:59 AMBut when I dressed unambiguously (but appropriately and not overdone ) female, i was often read. That has never changed.

It is likely that your fashion style emphasized or highlighted your male gender markers.

As a guy, advice is to dress in a monochome, to make me look taller.
Now that my waist is well below 24 inches, contrasting tops and bottoms emphasize my hourglass figure!
Light colored skirts are often at a good discount, as they aren't as popular as dark colors.

I can also wear nail polish, as my hands are small.

Many of us have nice legs.  Fashions that show off the lower half of the may be a good goal.

Marion

Quote from: Maid Marion on August 11, 2024, 11:39:04 AMIt is likely that your fashion style emphasized or highlighted your male gender markers.

Overall build.

Quote from: Maid Marion on August 11, 2024, 11:39:04 AMMany of us have nice legs.

Not me... My legs are very bulky as well no hips along with the broad shoulders and big hands.

That said, at my current age it does not matter so much.

- Karen

Quote from: Karen_A on August 11, 2024, 10:22:47 PMOverall build.

Not me... My legs are very bulky as well no hips along with the broad shoulders and big hands

The Inverted Triangle body type. Very common here.  Not so with GGs.
Which means the usual fashions for GGs don't work so well.

A white pleated skirt would bulk up those hips. Perhaps pair with a dark colored top.
Maybe a beige nail polish that is feminine but not something that would draw the eye.

https://www.landsend.co.uk/article/co/how-to-dress-the-inverted-triangle-body-shape.html#:~:text=What%20exactly%20is%20it%3F,is%20wider%20than%20your%20hips.
When you're trying to draw the eye away from your shoulders, you'll want to consider the necklines of your tops. With an inverted triangle body shape, you should avoid wide and low necklines. That includes styles like boat necks, V-necks, and plunging necklines. Women's crewneck tops and button-downs will be your new go-to.

We do have many style options for our clothing.  Some cuts/styles/necklines simply do not look good for some of us.  If you go shopping with another woman, she can be honest and helpful with her comments on if an outfit you like looks nice on you.

Chrissy

Hi Sarah,

I haven't gone out fully dressed as a woman because right now I am in a conservative area and a number of family members are extremely conservative, also I am in a very conservative college program right now.  I am pushing the boundaries with what I wear in my hair (or even how long it is), and a few other things, so while some are wondering, I still have to be careful.  At least I am on HRT, so my body will not masculinize anymore. 

I had tried coming out to my family twenty years ago but it was a disaster, so this time I am trying to go easier and make it look more natural. 

Quote from: Sarah B on August 11, 2024, 01:02:32 AMHi Nancy

I noticed the following quoted passages and are listed in order of time, the first one:

The second one:

The third one:

The fourth one:

The question you should be asking yourself is this; "I wonder if I went out completely as Nancy", I would not be surprised if you were successful presenting as a female.

It's good to hear that things are going well for you.

Love and Hugs
Sarah B
Official Greeter
@NancyDrew1930 

Hi Nancy

Thank you for your reply.  It's disheartening that you live in an area that is 'conservative'.  I understand that you are taking things steady given the situation you are in and your safety is paramount.

When I read your reply, I immediately thought, that maybe you could go away for a weekend and be yourself!  As they say "there are more than one way to skin a cat".  It's also good to hear that at least you are on hormones and they will not masculinize you anymore.

Yes be careful in what you do.  However, since you are around family and friends they will not notice the subtle changes that are occurring to you.  Some of those changes could be increasing your HRT dosage, continue to grow your hair and just wear it as a straight pony tail or plait and work on your facial hair.

If they ask you questions or remark that something is different about you.  Then think of a plausible excuse, for example, I like long hair.

Something that may be of help.  I just wrote a reply to another member called 'anonymous24'.  The actual thread is called "A question regarding transition", one of my replies can be read by clicking this link:  My Reply. (https://www.susans.org/index.php/topic,248454.msg2276201.html#msg2276201)

All the best, take care and I hope everything goes well for you.  Oh one question, what are you studying at college?

Love and Hugs
Sarah B
Official Greeter
@NancyDrew1930