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I always thought Dean was undoubtedly a male name but I've recently run into a lot of classmates calling me Dean but also 'she' and 'girl' and it's confusing to me. Is Dean a gender neutral name or something in other places? It's extremely discouraging to continually be misgendered in class by students and I want to know if name isn't helping. They only know me by Dean, not other names.

well i don't think so, but it happens (ryan is a good example of this). dean can be short for deanna just like max can be for maxine. however, if they only know you by that, maybe it is how you're presenting yourself? i know that's discouraging but i rather be honest so you know instead of thinking of completely changing your name and it happening again because if you chose a more masculine name and you're still not presenting yourself in a masculine way that gets recognized, people will just be like, "that's a boys name" or "that's a weird name for a girl." etc.

Quote from: CursedFireDean on May 18, 2015, 03:31:25 PM
I always thought Dean was undoubtedly a male name but I've recently run into a lot of classmates calling me Dean but also 'she' and 'girl' and it's confusing to me. Is Dean a gender neutral name or something in other places? It's extremely discouraging to continually be misgendered in class by students and I want to know if name isn't helping. They only know me by Dean, not other names.

I've only ever heard it as a boy's name.

ETA:  Namipedia and nameberry (I didn't look further than that), has it as both a girl's name and a boy's name.  Also Dean was the name of a character on Gilmore Girls and that was a famous TV show at one point.  Regardless, you just have to hold out my friend.  There will come a day that you will never be misgendered!  Dean is a good, solid name.  I've always liked that name.  You made a good choice.  It will get better!

I've only known Dean as solely a male name too. You said in your other post that being on T has meant you're misgendered more than pre T, so that's probably it. If you like the name you should stick with it. And I saw you're vid, you look totally male, I don't get how people can be so blind :/

These days there are many crossovers with names ( with some exceptions of course) Jo and Joe for one. I've seen Riley used for both male and female...sammy or sam and there are more.
I wouldn't really sweat it if I were you. Even my name deviates from the common "marley" ( of course, I chose that name) but I could've chsen something like Marlee even. so maybe you can settle with Deen, or consider it a shortening of, perhaps, Deana.

Quote from: CursedFireDean on May 18, 2015, 03:31:25 PM
I always thought Dean was undoubtedly a male name but I've recently run into a lot of classmates calling me Dean but also 'she' and 'girl' and it's confusing to me. Is Dean a gender neutral name or something in other places? It's extremely discouraging to continually be misgendered in class by students and I want to know if name isn't helping. They only know me by Dean, not other names.

It's not your name that's causing the misgendering.  Dean is a typical male name. 

Dean is a typical male name, but there is probably a lot of crossover these days. They are probably being confused by something else and calling you female pronouns as a result.

maybe they're making confusion between "Jean and Dean" 😊

Dean in definitely a male name where I'm from.  So sorry about the misgendering, especially when you were once not misgendered.  I heard you talk about T-bloating. Could that be it?  If so, then maybe in a few months, it will be okay.

I'm using my preferred name, too, even though I don't pass.  Some people are mishearing and turning it into a girl's name, sometimes not even close to the name I gave them.  Interesting to see which people cling to their boxes and which people adapt more easily.

Since I've never passed, I can't understand the full extent of your disappointment, but I can imagine it's  very disheartening. I'm looking forward to hearing about when it turns around for you.

I'd never call anyone named "dean" as female. Totally a dude name. There is def crossovers these days such as "Blake" for a female or "Jordan" as a female but even those names to me at least are WAY more common for men. Even my name (which I always consider far more male than female) is suprisingly common for girls/women, and I've never experienced any Mis gendering (keep in mind I'm on T 10 months) I think it has way more to do  with how one presents. If your name is Dean and you present as male but people are callin you "she" that's pretty stupid on their behalf.

I've only known men named Dean. Like others have said, it seems that names are becoming more neutral, but I doubt that that's the reason. It could be people are reading subconscious behaviors or something in their mind isn't connecting dots. I'm not sure if you're out to everyone, stealth or comfortable with correcting people, but a simple "it's he" could help. My birth name is gender neutral (Erin vs Aaron) and I still get "is that spelled with an E or A?" I figure it's their way of trying to guess my gender. I don't go by it anymore, but I still have ally paperwork under my birth name.

Dean is definitely neutral at the very least, but I feel the frustration. There are a few people at my school that call me "Drew" instead of "Andrew" because Andrew is closer to my birthname and gives them an easier opportunity to slip up. I call it laziness, but whatever. I hate Drew being associated with me because then there's more room for doubt in people that didn't know me beforehand. So yeah, I feel that feel.

If I remember right, you're in college and stealth? College atmospheres are odd, because people are almost expecting 'different' so if you don't fit the perfect gender norm, that wiggle room can become a giant hole in your identity toward others. I'd say behaviour, possibly your voice, and small facial indicators (things we might not pick up on in the mirror) are your giveaways, because Dean is not something I would primarily associate with being feminine or even neutral, really. If someone started talking about their friend 'Dean' in neutral terms, I'd immediately think them a guy without even meeting them.

If it is any consultation, my mine goes right to Dean Winchester. XD

Dean sounds completely masculine to me. As others have said, any misgendering is likely from other factors. When I was new in transition I used to get "Felix she" comments, and I still get misgendered when people see my old documents and realize I'm trans. My voice is low and I have facial hair and my gender is never questioned in my everyday life, but people who knew me back when still mess up my pronouns. I don't know how to get that to stop happening but I think your name is not ambiguious.

I've been having this problem as of late myself. My chosen name is primarily a guys name but I have found that some females hold my name as well. But I agree with Bimmer Guy, there will come a day when we will never get misgendered. I just think the in between stage is when things get wonky, at least I know for me. Just keep your head up, time is our friend.

I've never met a girl named Dean before, but I guess you never know. I faced the same issue though, my name is Leo  and before I started T people were constantly misgendering me. I guess if people are convinced enough that you're a girl they'll just completely disregard your name. It kinda sucks.

I have never heard of the name "Dean" on women, unless they were the dean over something, but not the name itself. 

Thanks for all the replies guys. I'm glad to know that I had the right idea about my name. I never intended to change it because of this, it means too much to me being a family name, but I am really bummed about it. I'm just getting so fed up with this misgendering and I turn to this forum whenever I'm feeling really bad. Every time I fix what people say the problem probably is, it never works, so I'm just grasping at straws here honestly. I'm just struggling with the fact that it's gotten harder, nearly impossible, for me to pass, when at this point on T, I should be passing all the time, considering I passed about 80% of the time before T. At the very least I expected to be passing the same amount, but instead, it's less. Just doesn't make any sense to me at all.

AndrewB- I'm not necessarily stealth but I'm trying to be close. I am fully open to anyone within the Queers and Allies club at school, and I open up to many classmates that I talk to a lot and feel comfortable with. I don't like dodging around parts of my past, I like to be able to openly say things like 'at my all girls high school.' However, I do want to go into classes and not have people know. I don't want most people to know. I would like to be able to 'pass' as a cisguy in my classes to all these new people. Someone once said to me I was kind of 'half-stealth' and I think that was a good way to put it.

Hey, Dean.  Have you considered that maybe the people who could help you the most with this are cis gendered?  I don't know about other trans people, but sometimes I think my perceptions are skewed because of forums like this and other places where I may see trans people.  Meaning, my perception of gender is so not binary anymore, is so stretched from outside the "norm", maybe I can't tell if people pass or not.  Especially when it comes to transmen.

Does anyone know what I mean?

I would ask some of the cisgendered people (especially females), at school.  Tell them they need to be straight up blunt and that they will not hurt your feelings.

Additionally, anyone in person is going to be a better gauge than people on the internet who can't see your mannerisms, how you move your body, etc.

Quote from: Bimmer Guy on May 21, 2015, 04:21:11 PM
Hey, Dean.  Have you considered that maybe the people who could help you the most with this are cis gendered?  I don't know about other trans people, but sometimes I think my perceptions are skewed because of forums like this and other places where I may see trans people.  Meaning, my perception of gender is so not binary anymore, is so stretched from outside the "norm", maybe I can't tell if people pass or not.  Especially when it comes to transmen.

Does anyone know what I mean?

I would ask some of the cisgendered people (especially females), at school.  Tell them they need to be straight up blunt and that they will not hurt your feelings.

Additionally, anyone in person is going to be a better gauge than people on the internet who can't see your mannerisms, how you move your body, etc.

I have asked basically everyone I am comfortable asking, which is mostly cis friends and cis people who know me enough to know I'm trans. I know I can't tell very well anymore if transguys pass, because once I know they're a guy, then well they're a guy to me. Especially when it comes to voice, I am HORRIBLE at judging whether people's voices sounds male or female. So I get what you're saying. Everyone in person I have asked has says they don't understand why I get misgendered, that I look absolutely 100% male to them. Some of these people have lots of experience with trans individuals and others don't. I wish I was the type of person who could ask a stranger, but I can't, it's just too weird to me.

yeah it must be something else and not your name. I can't really say anything as to what it might be. I very briefly jumped to your tumblr page, but (unless I didn't look hard enough) I couldn't see any images of you that showed anything aside from a couple vids of you, which of course is just from the neck up. You do have a rounded face, but lots of cis guys have round faces really...So I don't know what's holding you back really....Mannerisms? Body shape? I have no idea.

Quote from: CursedFireDean on May 21, 2015, 04:28:40 PM
I have asked basically everyone I am comfortable asking, which is mostly cis friends and cis people who know me enough to know I'm trans. I know I can't tell very well anymore if transguys pass, because once I know they're a guy, then well they're a guy to me. Especially when it comes to voice, I am HORRIBLE at judging whether people's voices sounds male or female. So I get what you're saying. Everyone in person I have asked has says they don't understand why I get misgendered, that I look absolutely 100% male to them. Some of these people have lots of experience with trans individuals and others don't. I wish I was the type of person who could ask a stranger, but I can't, it's just too weird to me.

No way I could do that either.  lol

Hang in there, friend.  I am sure it feels awful and feels like it will go on forever, but things will circle back to you being read as male once again.  I'm sure it is frustrating, though. 

I had a little bit of that paradoxical problem with passing when I was early in transition. When I had been trying to be a real girl I got read as male a lot, maybe half the time depending on how I dressed. I assumed I would naturally be seen as male much more once I took medical steps but it felt sometimes like I was just calling attention to myself and giving people more to be confused about.

It all stabilized after awhile though, and my situation was helped along by my relative social mobility. People who didn't get it or who were unkind were easy to walk away from and I was able to mostly only be around respectful people.

I've always heard Dean as a male name. I'm so sorry that people are misgendering you :(

that name screams masculinity to me, nothing gender neutral about it

but then again i picked a name i thought was super masculine until i found out everyone else thought it was "girly"

Quote from: AmandaMarie on May 19, 2015, 11:33:59 PM
If it is any consultation, my mine goes right to Dean Winchester. XD

Same. I always think of Dean Winchester. :)

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages4.fanpop.com%2Fimage%2Fphotos%2F22100000%2FDean-dean-winchester-22187490-500-566.png&hash=d7f0195281b8d4823b6d3fabdf64a61118b1a64f)

My mom's name is Deane, funny enough.

Anyway, it's not the name, it's mannerism and/or appearance. Usually a mix of the two. One thing I've noticed is that a lot of pre-T guys are more self-conscious about their behavior coming off 'female' and put in effort to appear more male. Such as clothing, how you stand/walk, your vocal inflection and general body language. But then after some time on T, they think it washes away misgendering and stop paying attention to how they behave. Thus, they suddenly get misgendered when pre-T, they weren't.

Maybe that'll help.

It makes me think of James Dean

James is a great name, i considered that for myself, especially cause i never met another trans guy with the name

I've never heard of a female named Dean. Just tell them you're a male.

I think it is quite possible that a woman could be named Dee or Deen. It would be one of those nonstandard names. But there are many of those these days.

I know 5 guys named Dean, and 1 lady named Deanie, so I don't think it's your name.  Gotta be something else, body language maybe?  My birth name is gender neutral in my culture background but pretty feminine in the west and I've decided not to do a legal name change but just have a nick name preference as Jack.  I went to have my bloodwork done the other day, even with my birth name on the requisition, the tech said "have a seat here son" and that just made my day!  ::) 

At the end of the day, we need to present ourselves with confident and be firm with others on our pronouns.  If they keep mis-gendering you, perhaps you can start mis-gendering them back to make them realize how stupid it sounds?  Some people just need more education on trans related issues because all trans suffers psychologically for years and takes a lot of courage to start transitioning and the process is a life time, not to mention the financial aspect.

Jack

someone shouldnt have to modify their body language just to pass....u are who u are