Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Hey all, i have the following question i had a consultation a couple of day ago at the hospital here in Amsterdam regarding my surgery and the doctor there suggest that i have a colon srs because i am circumcised and i have little other skin and that this would be the best option for me to get enough depth. From what i gather on here most doctors around the world would suggest against this i am right about this? I really wanted to go to dr Suporn because of this but my insurance will only pay half the surgery in Thailand and unfortunately i dont have the money to cover the rest and since i dont have a job at the moment and i dont expect this to change very soon i am kinda in limbo about that to do.

Greetings Sam

You might ask them to do regular surgery with a skin graft.
They take a piece of skin and use it to gain additional lenght.

There should be more than one surgeon in your country... you might ask a few...
and then do some research on each surgeon...

you additionally might look at transgender boards in your country, and ask there...

and look up some experiences from your country...


*hugs*

I was circumcised and had a penis inversion procedure which left me with about 5 to 5.5 inches of depth which should be enough. Blockers weren't available so they were not a part of my medication and erections kept the skin stretched out before surgery. You didn't mention another condition that result in the lack of skin but you should look at as many options as possible before considering the colon procedure as there is a bit more risk with that procedure.

Quote from: Dena on October 10, 2015, 03:57:25 PM
I was circumcised and had a penis inversion procedure which left me with about 5 to 5.5 inches of depth which should be enough. Blockers weren't available so they were not a part of my medication and erections kept the skin stretched out before surgery. You didn't mention another condition that result in the lack of skin but you should look at as many options as possible before considering the colon procedure as there is a bit more risk with that procedure.

The us surgeons are more used to circumsized clients and therefore often have an adapted technique.
Imo resulting in smaller inner labia.

The thai and european surgeons are more used to uncircumsized patiens, possibly resulting in more generous labia.

The use of an additional skin graft if necessary is quite common though.

Thank you for your reply Laura, but unfortunately all the doctors that do srs over here in the Netherlands work at the sa,e hospital where i am under treatment and they are the only ones that do the surgeries over here.He said he could use a skin graft but then he could not guarantee i would get enough depth plus i would get a very ugly scar as he put it, he was also very negative about dr Suporn i got the vibe that they were irritated that dr Suporn doesnt want to share his technique with them.If anyone has any links that scientific reports that report the risks of colon srs and the disadvantages is has i could possibly use it to put in another request to my insurance company to fund my surgery with Suporn.

Quote from: Laura_7 on October 10, 2015, 03:41:23 PM
You might ask them to do regular surgery with a skin graft.
They take a piece of skin and use it to gain additional lenght.

There should be more than one surgeon in your country... you might ask a few...
and then do some research on each surgeon...

you additionally might look at transgender boards in your country, and ask there...

and look up some experiences from your country...


*hugs*

Well you might argue that:
the sigmoid colon method usually is the last ditch method if others fail... not before...
here are more arguments:
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,188226.msg1706134.html#msg1706134

another one might be costs...
if suporn is of advantage here they might see it more positive...


hugs

Quote from: sh1982 on October 10, 2015, 04:39:34 PM
Thank you for your reply Laura, but unfortunately all the doctors that do srs over here in the Netherlands work at the sa,e hospital where i am under treatment and they are the only ones that do the surgeries over here.He said he could use a skin graft but then he could not guarantee i would get enough depth plus i would get a very ugly scar as he put it, he was also very negative about dr Suporn i got the vibe that they were irritated that dr Suporn doesnt want to share his technique with them.If anyone has any links that scientific reports that report the risks of colon srs and the disadvantages is has i could possibly use it to put in another request to my insurance company to fund my surgery with Suporn.

How is it that a surgeon can invent a new technique and others can't replicate it once they know its possible. Is he really that much better? I can understand not wanting to copy it if you don't think its good, but but being upset he won't share it with you is pretty bad. That would worry me.

Quote from: AnonyMs on October 10, 2015, 05:29:27 PM
How is it that a surgeon can invent a new technique and others can't replicate it once they know its possible. Is he really that much better? I can understand not wanting to copy it if you don't think its good, but but being upset he won't share it with you is pretty bad. That would worry me.

From what I've read he started out as specialist for reconstructive surgery.
So he might have looked for a way to stretch usable material.

Sounds like others wait for a textbook explanation  :)

suporn stretches it by punching holes in the skin doesn't he? Anyway I had an inversion with a graft, haven't noticed any unexpected scars

Quote from: Serenation on October 11, 2015, 01:44:25 AM
suporn stretches it by punching holes in the skin doesn't he? Anyway I had an inversion with a graft, haven't noticed any unexpected scars

He seems to use some kind of machine to mesh the tissue.
Healing time is longer, and there is more dilation afterwards.
Some people reported problems if they were well endowed.
https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,193067.msg1721458.html#msg1721458

It depends on from where the graft is taken.
If its taken from near the surgery site the scar might be hidden in a fold.

Meshing tissue, or rather fenestration as it is more properly called, is a a standard technique with skin grafts I've personally assisted in several of this type of procedure. It is not primarily about stretching though, but paradoxically rather is done to improve the healing. The major cause of skin graft failure is collection of exudate under the surface of the graft causing poor adhesion. The fenestration process allows the fluid to drain reducing odema at the graft site and ensuring good adhesion of the donar layer of dermis, to the wound.

As for the use of colon as a primary technique it does seem to be the preferred route in europe, but sadly I am not sufficiently aware of the pros and cons to comment.

Quote from: Rejennyrated on October 11, 2015, 04:35:47 AM
As for the use of colon as a primary technique it does seem to be the preferred route in europe, but sadly I am not sufficiently aware of the pros and cons to comment.

Well pro seems to be lubrication and depth.

Though there are studies showing that with estrogen influence from hrt, the tissue of a skin (not colon) neovagina can turn into a mucosa over months. A mucosa doesn't have hair by the way... so should there be hair it might get lost. If not some estrogen cream from time to time might help. And the skin inside a skin neovagina might be more sensitive since it might have nerve endings.

Cons as stated in the link above:
-there are people who say it should be some kind of last ditch effort
-possibly scar on the stomach
-possibly technique necessary to make the canal stable. Some report extra stitches. Imo a review of the surgeons results should be looked up.
-area from the vulva to the colon tissue might be needing extra care during surgery. I'd also look up some reviews.

Quote from: Rejennyrated on October 11, 2015, 04:35:47 AM
Meshing tissue, or rather fenestration as it is more properly called, is a a standard technique with skin grafts I've personally assisted in several of this type of procedure. It is not primarily about stretching though, but paradoxically rather is done to improve the healing. The major cause of skin graft failure is collection of exudate under the surface of the graft causing poor adhesion. The fenestration process allows the fluid to drain reducing odema at the graft site and ensuring good adhesion of the donar layer of dermis, to the wound.

I believe Suporn does it for the purpose of stretching, otherwise there's not enough donor tissue. I understand this technique is used in burns, and possibly not coincidentally he also uses Silvex cream (silver sulfadiazine) which is sold specifically for burns.

I'm not too clear on this but I don't think Dr Chett does it, and its why he has such a high incidence of skin grafts.

Well yeah that  worries me to, he was also very confident that Dr Suporn wouldnt be able to gain anymore depth with me unless Suporn would also use a skin graft which as far as i know Suporn never does.And you also get the usual blabla about having surgery in Thailand which quit frankly annoys me because beside some exptions the health care provided in Thailand is as good or sometimes even beter then in some european countries.

Quote from: AnonyMs on October 10, 2015, 05:29:27 PM
How is it that a surgeon can invent a new technique and others can't replicate it once they know its possible. Is he really that much better? I can understand not wanting to copy it if you don't think its good, but but being upset he won't share it with you is pretty bad. That would worry me.

Hello Sam, I was operated in Amsterdam a few months ago and also to me was suggested as 1st option, the colon plastic, which I refused and I got the skin graft. To be honest I am not so happy about the result.
Thailand? I think everyone can do mistakes and they promise many things from the web sites, you need to check carefully. I am not so sure, if I could go back I'd like to be operated in Amsterdam, but there is an advantage: if you need any advice, you just call the plastic surgery team and they are there for you.  If you are operated in Thailand it is more difficult.
Valentina
P.S. may I ask who gave you the 1st consult?

Quote from: valentina123 on October 11, 2015, 10:47:46 AM
Hello Sam, I was operated in Amsterdam a few months ago and also to me was suggested as 1st option, the colon plastic, which I refused and I got the skin graft. To be honest I am not so happy about the result.

Well there are quite a few people who do revisions...
this is an example:

phuket-plasticsurgery.com/P-PS-post-procedure.html
phuket-plasticsurgery.com/fees.html

genitalsurgerybelgrade.com/

and there are a few people in the us ...

What would you prefer to be different ?
Depth ?

Hey Valentina , i am sorry to hear that your surgery didnt go as you hoped.I had my consultation with Dr Bouman did he also do you surgery?I also spoke with dr Buncamper before but that was sometime ago.And yes you are right about there are no guarantees about depth etc and things go wrong in Thailand to but i just have more confidence in Dr Suporn to be honest then in the VU.Personally i dont like doctors badmouthing other doctors if they dont even understand what the other doctor does and if you think you are so much better then there is need to talk bad about another doctor but that is just my view.

Quote from: sh1982 on October 11, 2015, 08:54:37 AM
Well yeah that  worries me to, he was also very confident that Dr Suporn wouldnt be able to gain anymore depth with me unless Suporn would also use a skin graft which as far as i know Suporn never does.And you also get the usual blabla about having surgery in Thailand which quit frankly annoys me because beside some exptions the health care provided in Thailand is as good or sometimes even beter then in some european countries.

Suporn doesn't need skin grafts, or not that I've heard of, because his technique is so different. He's also well known to get good depth even from small donor material. For what its worth I know someone with 8" from Suporn. You get different disadvantages with Suporn, mainly the longer and more difficult recovery.

I believe health care is better from Suporn than you'd get in a western country because you're basically very wealthy by their standards and get treated like it. Unless you happen to be very wealthy by western standards, which not so many of us are. Some of these western surgeons also have a pretty much guaranteed income no matter how bad they are; that's not the case at all with the top Thai surgeons. Too many bad stories and they would lose a loose a lot business.