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One of the biggest regrets that I have with my original FFS in Illinois 11 years ago was having fat put in my top lip and then a recommended refill.

It has made me look like many other patients of this surgeon's together with his standard 'Cookie Cutter' nose.

I also still look like I have gone through three rounds with former boxer Mike Tyson ... >:(

I understand that this fat cannot be removed although I know of two patients who have tried with limited success.

If someone can tell me how I can post fotos of this without people viewing being able to see other fotos ( as on Photobucket ) then I will do so in order that you can see what I mean.

The best solution I could suggest is opening a second account or using another photo server to hold the pictures you wish to display here. There is a way that staff can directly attach pictures to a post but it's a feature that's restricted to staff and few of us use it.

Interesting, I was actually looking into having this procedure done, along with a lip lift. I think I know of which surgeon you speak and frankly his lips are usually the only thing I like lol.

Hi Janice,

I do know of some of his patients that have had this procedure done and look reasonably OK but they are younger girls.

However in my case, it looks wrong as well as having the effect of negating the upper lip lift that was done at the same time. The fat just lengthened the area below my nose so I am having another lip lift done next April in Spain when my forehead is going to be reconstructed properly for the first time as well as a revision rhinoplasty.

Quote from: JaniceNL on December 10, 2015, 05:07:32 PM
Interesting, I was actually looking into having this procedure done, along with a lip lift. I think I know of which surgeon you speak and frankly his lips are usually the only thing I like lol.

Thanks Dena.

I will do that and post fotos soon ..  :)

Quote from: Dena on December 10, 2015, 04:57:18 PM
The best solution I could suggest is opening a second account or using another photo server to hold the pictures you wish to display here. There is a way that staff can directly attach pictures to a post but it's a feature that's restricted to staff and few of us use it.

There we go


(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FXtpZlGY.jpg&hash=e1abf09a86f6c8f84899d787ba45098cbfa0f6d4)

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F3xr2LA9.jpg&hash=8195226050523e0b0836460b35038bf1ea2123fc)



Mod Edit:Fixed links

Thanks Dena for the edit.

I have sussed out what I was doing wrong and was just about to post them myself ...  ;)

Must get those nasal thread veins zapped ...  :o

Ouch ...  ;D

Thanks for posting Paula. I'm still considering the lip lift and all that so good to know about the fat portion. I'll have to ask the docs about that too

Hi,

You should see my friend's top lip done by him.

She looks far worse than me.

It's his trademark unfortunately and marks out his post-op patients in a room.

I was looking at about twenty of his patients in fotos that I have taken down the years, who's company I have enjoyed both here and Stateside. We all look similar to a large extent and that really angers me.

Also my nose is too small for my face and piggy like and Facial Team is going to sort it out next Spring.

If only reasonably priced surgeons like Facial Team and Dr Di Maggio were around in 2004, I would not have gone to him. All the FT and Di M post-op patients that I have seen or met in person look very good.

Many members of FFS Support at the time of my surgery told me to have X-Rays done as I looked like a candidate for Type 3 and they were right. But he told me that X-Rays are not required and hey presto the sinus cavity was breached during surgery.

Because I felt that they were ill advising me and knocking his burring method of forehead feminisation, this made me very stressed out and I nearly cancelled the operation. But he said his techniques were fine and state of the art, so I went ahead. If only I hadn't.

So here I am 11 years on and Facial Team are carrying out a complicated proper reconstruction surgery of my forehead for the first time.

My face will never be as good as if it had been done correctly in the first place but I know it will be a lot better soon than it is at present.

Finally I feel sad that I am having to tell you all this but without forums such as Susans Place, none of us would learn.

Mod edit- messages that belittle, ridicule, bash, etc a surgeon (even when not named) are against TOS 5 and 10.

When Facial Team's Dr Bellinga reconstructs my nose next April by using cartilage from behind both ears ( Ouch, ouch ...  ;) ), my nose will be longer and larger than it is at present. Together with the fresh upper lip lift, the top lip should look better and shorter. However there is nothing that can be done about the fat ...  :(

Later, I will post a foto of myself before FFS taken in 2003 and you will see what I mean.

The trouble that I have with my looks at present is that I look too much like many of his other patients and I hope to look more natural again.

Wish me luck.

Dr Bellinga's website:  http://www.multiestetica.com/rinoestetica-dr-jimenez-bellinga-vweb-152806.html

and Facial Team:  http://facialteam.eu/facial-feminization-surgery/dr-raul-jimenez-bellinga/

Hi again,

Here I am in 2003 before FFS

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FEukG1Cw.jpg&hash=177b9b81b18c0f125d85ed129f78dc9d245c8d55)

Wow. Although I don't see anything terribly wrong from the pictures, it is distressing to see you are so unhappy with the results. I have no idea what you looked like before. Generally, is it better than before you had the surgery?

While there are several things I do not like about my face, I've always been terrified of having surgery that could potentially damage nerves. I hate my brow line, hate my adams apple, and have a serious dislike for my squarish chin. I've just never had the courage to do anything about any of these features. I had BA thirty years ago and wish that I had never had it done.

I did get liposuction about 25 years ago to get rid of my love handles and the excess fat under my chin. It didn't cost much and that more than anything else (aside from getting rid of Mr. Happy) helped me feel better about my body overall. Even that can be a potential disaster from what I've read since.

This was taken in February this year by me in the mirror after the failed revision done at the Chelsea & Westminster Hospital in October 2014. You can see the inappropriate PEEK implants over the orbital rims and deformity over the left frontal sinus as well as the nose I dislike and the top lip.


(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F62I2AfU.jpg&hash=002936085ae87baebd64b7a42e7fdf90eb70963b)

Hi Cindy,

Thank you for your concern ..  :)

See below foto of me Pre FFS and apart from some brow bossing (hidden by bangs), I looked fine and very natural.

In answer to your question, generally is it better than before you had the surgery?

Answer - I look different not ugly but after the 2004 FFS, I was left with the forehead deformity, fat top lip, piggy nose and vertical raised ridge (sub-dermal lesion) below the right alars due to the poor alarplasty I also had. Too many complications due to poor surgery and he knew it too by his demeanour around me ( very noticeable to my friends)

Pre FFS - September 2003
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FEukG1Cw.jpg&hash=177b9b81b18c0f125d85ed129f78dc9d245c8d55)

Foto showing the vertical raised ridge below the right alars
(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FEQ3UNSb.jpg&hash=67ff4f40c2f2d2a2e23dbef521b6a8c28e0b2a8d)

Quote from: Cindi Jones on December 13, 2015, 02:41:15 PM
Wow. I have no idea what you looked like before. Generally, is it better than before you had the surgery?

I'm so sorry this incapable man ruined your face, Paula. Hopefully Facial Team can make you look like yourself again. Are your brows constantly that raised?

Thank you for being so brave and sharing your suffering with us. We're very grateful. I hope someone considering FFS with him watches this and realizes what he is - the plastic surgeon version of a used car salesman.

I am really sorry to hear this Kittenpower.

But I see that you have removed your post

I had three revisions by him on the forehead - 2010, 2012 & 2013 and it did not work because he simply burred.

I spent a lot of money flying across the Atlantic to do these revisions, money that I could do with right now.

I remember him saying once to me and another patient that when his revisions hurt, then it will dissuade a patient from returning. Don't know if he was joking or not.

Hi Honeybun,

Quote from: BellaSwan on December 13, 2015, 03:39:23 PM
I'm so sorry this incapable man ruined your face, Paula.

Thank you and I am not the only one to have suffered at his hands Their privacy prevents me from telling their tales of woe.

Hopefully Facial Team can make you look like yourself again.

Thank you, I am have great confidence in their abiliities and can't wait to next Spring ..  :)

Are your brows constantly that raised?

I am afraid so BUT they were made worse by the PEEK implants inserted by the London surgeon in October 2014. When they are removed, they will come down a bit.

Thank you for being so brave and sharing your suffering with us. We're very grateful.

You are welcome

I hope someone considering FFS with him watches this and realizes what he is - the plastic surgeon version of a used car salesman.

I hope so too because I would not wish this on my worst enemy.

Hugs

Paula

PS. The sad part of all this is that I gave him every opportunity to put things right but he failed. Why because he was not capable, I now feel.

Forgot to say but when I had the final revision in 2013, rather than give me a proper general or twilight anaesthetic (as he did in 2012), he simply injected painkiller into the left frontal sinus area and I screamed the place down. Afterwards he said that he could do no more for me.

My friends say " So much for his lifetime revision policy ".

Finally I have been suffering constant nose bleeds and pain in that area ever since. 

Quote from: Paula1 on December 13, 2015, 03:41:04 PM
I am really sorry to hear this Kittenpower.

But I see that you have removed your post

I had three revisions by him on the forehead - 2010, 2012 & 2013 and it did not work because he simply burred.

I spent a lot of money flying across the Atlantic to do these revisions, money that I could do with right now.

I remember him saying once to me and another patient that when his revisions hurt, then it will dissuade a patient from returning. Don't know if he was joking or not.

When I had the three forehead revisions, he made the incision using one of the the old direct browlift scars (left side).

I asked him to do that because I was afraid of damage to my hairgrafts.

So this left side scar is now worse than the right side one.

On reflection, he should have advised me that a careful small incision behind the hairline would cause little or no damage to my grafts but he took the path of least resistance.

Looking back, I think that he was humouring me in the knowledge that his revisions would not work and just got me off his back.

The butcher who performed this old fashioned browlift procedure back in 1991 ( it was old fashioned then ) did not help my appearance either.

Once my forehead reconstruction is healed, I will be getting more hair grafts along the direct browlift incisions and permanent eyebrow make-up to hide these scars.

I will eventually have Brooke Shields eyebrows which are now very fashionable.

A Dutch firm called 'April's Touch' are opening a branch in London next Spring and I consulted with them when Facial Team were in London 3 weeks ago.

Their UK website is opening soon. 

So I have lots to look forward to ...  :)

Your positive outlook is so inspiring. So glad you didn't just give up! You're a great woman, Paula!

Hiya,

A'wwwwwwwww thank you.

When I was visiting the Chelsea & Westminster Hospital before and after my October 2014 surgery, I saw some patients with facial problems that make mine seem nothing at all.

They have to continue living despite their difficulties as I do, so I am blessed compared to them, but actually they are blessed too, if you see what I mean.

I am also lucky to have good health (touching wood) and fast walk 2 miles every day to keep fit.

I often joke to friends that I will be having surgery on my deathbed ...  ;D

Gotta look good when they bury me.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.

Hugs

Paula

Quote from: BellaSwan on December 13, 2015, 06:58:49 PM
Your positive outlook is so inspiring. So glad you didn't just give up! You're a great woman, Paula!

Hi Paula!

Thanks for your candid remarks and photos.  I wish you great success in the Spring.

I'm having the "lip lift" done next month.  I decided not to pursue any additions of "fat"  This rendition of the cons of that process confirms my decision.  Once healed, I can always get the occasional injection that is not permanent whenever I need it.

Happy New Year! &
Hugz!

Joi

Hiya Joi ...  :)

Quote from: Joi on December 28, 2015, 11:46:17 PM
Hi Paula!

Thanks for your candid remarks and photos.  I wish you great success in the Spring.

Thank you so much honeybun ....  :) I am excited but getting nervous too. This has got to be right this time.

I'm having the "lip lift" done next month.  I decided not to pursue any additions of "fat"  This rendition of the cons of that process confirms my decision.  Once healed, I can always get the occasional injection that is not permanent whenever I need it.

I wish you well with you lip lift and I am so glad about your decision not to have fat done.

If I can stop one person having to go through what I and other friends of mine have been through, then I am happy.

Happy New Year! &
Hugz!

Joi

And I wish you too a wonderful New Year ... :)

Hugs

Paula

Hi all, Just wanted to pop in and say I completely agree regarding adding fat to the top lip. In my experience a complete waste of time and it definitely negated the lip lift I had. Others may have better results. From a Dr I went to, he should have known better. When I got encourage to add form fat to my tin upper lip I specifically said "Just a bit, NO FISH LIPS" When I was in the Post-op he made the comment that "he jammed as much in there as he physically could."

Completely did against my wishes and thankfully most of the fat has metabolized with the remaining smaller than a pea sized nodule will be repaired later this year. It is not horrible but the lip lift was a fail because if this and more $$ down the drain.

No names as I'm not going  to slag him online. But I will send him a 1 year + review/critique in hopes (I know he will dismiss) he will listen to someone 's wishes or turn down the procedure. I could make other comments but we were discussing lip fill. My vote skip it.

Be safe
Elaine

Hi Elaine,

I understand what you are saying by not wanting to slag him online and you may wish to go back and see him.

One of my USA friends has the same pea sized nodule that you have.

Hope that you resolve the situation to your satisfaction.

Take care and Happy New Year ..  :)

Paula

PS. I know of one patient of his who a lip lift done and said " No Fat " only for him to ignore her and put some in !!!  :o

Quote from: Elaine S on December 29, 2015, 09:18:47 AM
Hi all, Just wanted to pop in and say I completely agree regarding fat to the top lip. Complete waste of time and it definitely negated the lip lift I had. From a Dr I went to, he should have known better. When I got encourage to add form fat to my tin upper lip I specifically said "Just a bit, NO FISH LIPS" When I was in the Post-op he made the comment that "he jammed as much in there as he physically could."

Completely did against my wishes and thankfully most of the fat has metabolized with the remaining smaller than a pea sized nodule will be repaired later this year. It is not horrible but the lip lift was a fail because if this and more $$ down the drain.

No names as I'm not going  to slag him online. But I will send him a 1 year + review/critique in hopes (I know he will dismiss) he will listen to someone 's wishes or turn down the procedure. I could make other comments but we were discussing lip fill. My vote skip it.

Be safe
Elaine

I really don't see all too much danger in having fat grafted to enhance ones lips. It's obvious that the surgeon in this case screwed up and placed the fat at a wrong place. I really don't know how he could have made this mistake to begin with?

Regarding lips, a complication that I see way more than possible complications with fat grafting is that the surgeon lifts the lip too far, making it look like a cleft lip. Now that's something that worries me.

Hi Janice,

I suppose it depends on who does the fat enhancement and where in the top lip?

In my case and many of my friends who have had fat done by this surgeon, we all to a greater or lesser extent look like we have been in the boxing ring !!!  :o

Hugs and Happy New Year

Paula

Quote from: JaniceNL on December 29, 2015, 12:34:58 PM
I really don't see all too much danger in having fat grafted to enhance ones lips. It's obvious that the surgeon in this case screwed up and placed the fat at a wrong place. I really don't know how he could have made this mistake to begin with?

Regarding lips, a complication that I see way more than possible complications with fat grafting is that the surgeon lifts the lip too far, making it look like a cleft lip. Now that's something that worries me.

Quote from: Paula1 on December 29, 2015, 12:48:21 PM
Hi Janice,

I suppose it depends on who does the fat enhancement and where in the top lip?

In my case and many of my friends who have had fat done by this surgeon, we all to a greater or lesser extent look like we have been in the boxing ring !!!  :o

Hugs and Happy New Year

Paula

That does appear to be the case - I do hope you manage to get sorted somehow.  It's terrible!

I had a procedure when I saw Dr. O where he took a small strip of skin that he removed elsewhere and put it in my top lift (as opposed to fat).  It seems to still look fine after 15 years... not sure if this is common or not.

I had surgery by the same Dr everyone is talking about.  I told him in no uncertain terms to leave my eyebrows where they were located and no fat graph on the lips but to just do the lip lift.  I didn't end up with a bizzare nose either but I had to work a little on that. 

I think this surgeon needs very clear and very direct communication.  VERY CLEAR AND VERY DIRECT. I  can't emphasize that enough. 

I don't know how to help you though.  They might be able to pull/fold the lip up. That would help.  The brow thing would really help.  The nose remains a problem.  I know one thing that may work.  Grab the nose between the thumb and index finger like you are going to jump into the water.  Now swivel the hand toward the jaw, pulling down on the top of the nose.  The tissue is cartelidge and skin so it will stretch and move.  Do this for a few minutes three times a day for a couple months.  This expansion would give a surgeon something to work with in a future revision.

Hugs

Jen

Thank you very much for your good wishes .. :)

Quote from: Denjin on December 29, 2015, 01:14:01 PM
That does appear to be the case - I do hope you manage to get sorted somehow.  It's terrible!

I had a procedure when I saw Dr. O where he took a small strip of skin that he removed elsewhere and put it in my top lift (as opposed to fat).  It seems to still look fine after 15 years... not sure if this is common or not.

Hi Jen,

Quote from: JLT1 on December 29, 2015, 02:29:44 PM
I had surgery by the same Dr everyone is talking about.  I told him in no uncertain terms to leave my eyebrows where they were located and no fat graph on the lips but to just do the lip lift.  I didn't end up with a bizzare nose either but I had to work a little on that. 

This is very interesting what you say and I am delighted that he listened to you ..  :) When I had my pre-surgery talk with him, I showed him the VFFS fotos that Alexandra Hamer had prepared for me and I said that " I want to look like that". However he completely ignored my instructions and turned me into one of his ' Trademark girls'. That is sheer arrogance ... >:(


I think this surgeon needs very clear and very direct communication.  VERY CLEAR AND VERY DIRECT. I  can't emphasize that enough. 


Indeed but what can you do if he ignores you .. NOTHING

I don't know how to help you though.  They might be able to pull/fold the lip up. That would help.  The brow thing would really help.  The nose remains a problem.  I know one thing that may work.  Grab the nose between the thumb and index finger like you are going to jump into the water.  Now swivel the hand toward the jaw, pulling down on the top of the nose.  The tissue is cartelidge and skin so it will stretch and move.  Do this for a few minutes three times a day for a couple months.  This expansion would give a surgeon something to work with in a future revision.


You advice seems excellent thank you. When he performed the first attempt of reburring my forehead deformity in October 2010, we talked about him also redoing my nose and he said that he could rotate it down. I thought about it for a few minutes but his demeanour and attitude were very negative and I thought that he did not really want to do it. I lost confidence in him then as far as my nose was concerned and this forehead revision and the two later ones in 2012 & 2013 which did not work either were the final straw and anyway he said in no uncertain terms, " He could do no more for me".   So much for him saying "I stand by my work."


Hugs

Jen

Take care

Hugs

Paula

PS. The amount of stress this surgeon has caused me is awful and unforgiveable. I just hope that in a few months time, these last 11 years of nightmare will simply be a bad memory. In a few months time, I am looking forward to coming on here and saying something positive about me for a change.

Oof. For me it came down to Facial Team and the surgeon that I assume everyone is talking about, and I ended up settling on Facial Team and am thrilled with the results at only 9 weeks postop. Everyone who works with them, from the patient coordinators, to the nurses, to the anesthesiologist, to everyone on the surgical team, is just so wonderful and all on the same page when it comes to your individual needs and wants. They run a tight ship. I am so so sorry to hear and see what happened to you Paula, but if anyone is going to be able to fix it, it's going to be Facial Team. You should have the utmost confidence in them.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good Morning Dana,

Your post is the best " New Year's " gift any girl could wish for.

You have made my day, thank you.

I am so delighted that you chose Facial Team to carry out your FFS and congratulations on your result.

From all my meetings with Dr Capitan, Dr Simon, Dr Bellinga and the rest of the team, I have never received so much care and attention from medical practitioners.

My case is very complex but I have the utmost confidence that they will be able to sort me out.

Can't wait to April but naturally I am getting more nervous by the day which is normal, of course.

I once remember a surgeon saying that he would be wary of operating on someone who is not in the least bit nervous or apprehensive.

Happy New Year and take care

Hugs

Paula

Quote from: Dana88 on December 31, 2015, 12:36:42 AM
Oof. For me it came down to Facial Team and the surgeon that I assume everyone is talking about, and I ended up settling on Facial Team and am thrilled with the results at only 9 weeks postop. Everyone who works with them, from the patient coordinators, to the nurses, to the anesthesiologist, to everyone on the surgical team, is just so wonderful and all on the same page when it comes to your individual needs and wants. They run a tight ship. I am so so sorry to hear and see what happened to you Paula, but if anyone is going to be able to fix it, it's going to be Facial Team. You should have the utmost confidence in them.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Paula,

You are really courageous and I'm glad you are sharing your experience with the members here.  I really am sorry for all of the surgical misfortunes you've had to endure throughout your life, but sharing your story will help many others make an informed decision before committing to any particular surgeon for what I consider to be a life changing decision. 

I definitely know which dr you are describing because I consulted with them last year for my FFS.  I also had a VirtualFFS done by Alexandra and had her evaluation compare to the types of procedures that the infamous dr wanted to perform on me.  It confirmed what I initially thought - that all those extra little procedures they wanted to throw in were completely unnecessary and excessive for a 28 y/o girl.

The advice provided to me by Alexandra as well as the input from the members here on my own FFS thread led me to FacialTeam and I just had my surgery with them last month.  I really could not be happier with my decision!  I feel the same way Dana does about FT and I am VERY thankful for the advice of all of the members here on the forum who pointed me in there direction.

I want to wish you the very best for your surgery with FT and know that you will be in very caring hands with their entire staff from start to finish.

Hi Kaley,

Quote from: Kaley on January 17, 2016, 12:29:08 PM
Paula,

You are really courageous and I'm glad you are sharing your experience with the members here.  I really am sorry for all of the surgical misfortunes you've had to endure throughout your life, but sharing your story will help many others make an informed decision before committing to any particular surgeon for what I consider to be a life changing decision. 

Thank you for saying this, it's very sweet of you ... :)

I definitely know which dr you are describing because I consulted with them last year for my FFS.  I also had a Virtual FFS done by Alexandra and had her evaluation compare to the types of procedures that the infamous dr wanted to perform on me.  It confirmed what I initially thought - that all those extra little procedures they wanted to throw in were completely unnecessary and excessive for a 28 y/o girl.

Well it's not good to have procedures that you don't need especially at your age. Having one's face cut up is a big deal and the less the better.

The advice provided to me by Alexandra as well as the input from the members here on my own FFS thread led me to Facial Team and I just had my surgery with them last month.  I really could not be happier with my decision!  I feel the same way Dana does about FT and I am VERY thankful for the advice of all of the members here on the forum who pointed me in there direction.

This is wonderful to hear and congratulations on your surgery with FT.

I want to wish you the very best for your surgery with FT and know that you will be in very caring hands with their entire staff from start to finish.

Thank you so much and I know that I have made the right choice. Ever since I met Dr Capitan and his team in February last year in London, I knew that I was in safe hands. Their professionalism is outstanding.

Take care and thanks again.

Hugs

Paula

Quote from: Denjin on December 29, 2015, 01:14:01 PM

I had a procedure when I saw Dr. O where he took a small strip of skin that he removed elsewhere and put it in my top lift (as opposed to fat).  It seems to still look fine after 15 years... not sure if this is common or not.

That's called a dermal fatgraft. I've had the same procedure 11 years ago with dr Chettawut in Bangkok.
It felt and looked horrible at first; restricted smile, incredibly swollen upperlip...it took a year before the implanted skin stretched out and 'shrank' to normal proportions.

Now it looks perfectly fine and it looks totally normal. Which means no 'shelf lip' or 'duck mouth'

I understood dr Chettawut stopped doing dermal fatgrafts because of the restricted smile etc at first.

Hi everyone,

My friend who had her face lift with Dr Bellinga at Facial Team yesterday also had a great load of fat removed from the area below her nose and above her top lip.

She always hated this procedure and it was far worse than mine because she was also given a top up while she was undergoing other revisions and was angry when she realised it was being done but too late to prevent it because she was so drowsy. 

I will be also asking Dr Bellinga next Tuesday during my pre-op consultation with him, Dr Capitan & Dr Simon, on how he feels about removing some of mine when he performs my secondary upper lip lift and complex rhinoplasty revision.