Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I hear a lot of folk saying HRT has made them feel weak or tired, being a distance runner it's a bit of a concern for me.
I know i'm going to loose muscle mass and slow down, but I don't want to come to a grinding halt.

There's also the question of form and centre of gravity as my body mass shifts.

Any transitioning runners here care to share their experiences? Running keeps me sane, so it's important for me to continue. I just want to prepare myself psycologically for change or any challenges I might have.

I guess my body will be going through a lot starting HRT, I'm worried about over-stressing things.

Thanks

shy

I have run three marathons, my best was 3:32 in 2012, so I have run a lot.  Unfortunately, I had let myself fall out of shape during the year before I started HRT.  Since then I have started running again.

The biggest thing that happened to me was a decline in my red blood cell count.  This may have been partly due to four blood donations since last July.  I am now trying to recover that.

Beyond that though my running fitness no longer improves as rapidly as before and my average easy run pace, measured by heart rate, has declined by 1 1/2 minutes.  I also feel unable to train as hard as I used to although that might just be a mental thing since running used to be a primary coping mechanism for dysphoria.  I used to pretty much flog my body six days a week and still improve.  I am running six days a week again but not punishing myself nearly as much as before.

A couple of years ago I could push out a 6 min mile (max effort) after several months of training.  Now that's also around 1 1/2 min slower.

Complicating that too is my age.  Maybe some of all that is age related decline.

Form wise I have not noticed any change.  I run minimalist in sandals so that may have something to do with form consistency.

One good thing is that maintaining a lower body weight for running is easier than it used to be.  This seems to contradict the experience of others on HRT.  I do pay pretty close attention to my daily calorie balance to get that.  For a few months last year I quit paying attention to it and started gaining two pounds a week.  Left to my own devices I can eat a lot non stop, LOL.  Fortunately, at the start of that I was pretty skinny so even with a 21 pound gain I was still in normal BMI and bodyfat ranges (my avatar pic was taken around that high point).  Half of that gain is gone again since the beginning of the year leaving me in a pretty good place right now.

Beyond all that though I still enjoy it a lot, nothing hurts, and it still feels just as good as before.


It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.
André Gide, Autumn Leaves

I'm not a big runner but I've already noticed that the weight loss I've seen on HRT has counter-acted some the strength loss (as in I can go longer, but I can lift less).

Anecdotally, a friend of mine who is also transitioning lost a significant amount of weight (40 lbs) during her first six months on HRT.  I have to admit she looks amazing, nice long thin legs, beautiful face, etc.  However, she was rather disappointed that she has had no breast development or fat redistribution.  Although I'm only a medical layperson (rather educated though), I could understand that if she was losing so much weight during a period where "development" requires resources (as in fat), that there was no fat left to develop into the breasts and curves she hoped for.

So I guess that it's all up to your expectations.  Most runners have low body fat, so if you maintain that through transition, I suspect you won't get those curves.  I started with some extra resources so I've seen breast development as I'm slowly losing weight (already lost 12 lbs in 2+ months on HRT).

Quote from: Deborah on February 21, 2017, 03:33:03 AM
I have run three marathons, my best was 3:32 in 2012, so I have run a lot.  Unfortunately, I had let myself fall out of shape during the year before I started HRT.  Since then I have started running again.

The biggest thing that happened to me was a decline in my red blood cell count.  This may have been partly due to four blood donations since last July.  I am now trying to recover that.

Beyond that though my running fitness no longer improves as rapidly as before and my average easy run pace, measured by heart rate, has declined by 1 1/2 minutes.  I also feel unable to train as hard as I used to although that might just be a mental thing since running used to be a primary coping mechanism for dysphoria.  I used to pretty much flog my body six days a week and still improve.  I am running six days a week again but not punishing myself nearly as much as before.

A couple of years ago I could push out a 6 min mile (max effort) after several months of training.  Now that's also around 1 1/2 min slower.

Complicating that too is my age.  Maybe some of all that is age related decline.

Form wise I have not noticed any change.  I run minimalist in sandals so that may have something to do with form consistency.

One good thing is that maintaining a lower body weight for running is easier than it used to be.  This seems to contradict the experience of others on HRT.  I do pay pretty close attention to my daily calorie balance to get that.  For a few months last year I quit paying attention to it and started gaining two pounds a week.  Left to my own devices I can eat a lot non stop, LOL.  Fortunately, at the start of that I was pretty skinny so even with a 21 pound gain I was still in normal BMI and bodyfat ranges (my avatar pic was taken around that high point).  Half of that gain is gone again since the beginning of the year leaving me in a pretty good place right now.

Beyond all that though I still enjoy it a lot, nothing hurts, and it still feels just as good as before.

Thanks Deborah :)

You've put my mind at ease. :) Calories is one thing I hadn't thought of, but makes sense you'll need fewer with less muscle mass.
I'm all about trails and endurance; also minimalist :) So speed isn't that important to me, but 330 marathon pace is none too shabby girl!.
I've alway been too, well um dysphoric to enter races. Seriously all that testosterone floating about at the start line just had me 'running for the hills'.
Funny how the dysphoria monster has kept us both fit though, not that i'd recommend it for 'coach of the year' award any time soon. ;)

Happy trails

Shy

Quote from: kat69 on February 21, 2017, 06:06:53 AM
I'm not a big runner but I've already noticed that the weight loss I've seen on HRT has counter-acted some the strength loss (as in I can go longer, but I can lift less).

That's good to here Kat :) Distance is my thing, never been into weights other than bodyweight exercises. So seem like it's all going to be fine. Seriously, this is one thing I was really worried about as I need my weekly dose of running endorphins. ;D

Thanks for the insight, it's put a my mind at rest.

shy

My plan is to start with a roller ski workout.  I was an avid cross country skier and roller skis are the closest I can get in a warm climate.  It gives a good aerobic workout for upper and lower body with emphasis on the lower body (good for the booty).

As far as fat distribution: What I have learned is that to change to the female distribution one first has to burn off all the fat from the male locations and then replace it in the female locations.

My plan is to start the fat burning exercise and eat high fat foods with a good cholesterol content; like cheese, nuts and fish.  Also, foods high in protein, which is needed for breast growth, the above foods are good, and adding a high protein snack bar will help.

Quote from: Shy on February 21, 2017, 10:24:06 AM

Funny how the dysphoria monster has kept us both fit though, not that i'd recommend it for 'coach of the year' award any time soon. ;)

Happy trails

Shy

I know.  It made me fast enough to do pretty well in all the local races.  It also eventually made me badly over trained to the point I had to stop everything for months to recover.



It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.
André Gide, Autumn Leaves

I have resumed running ( i had been down to basically brisk walking and some biking) and with it weight loss in the last several months. Nothing fell off the cliff for me. Like Deborah, the training is harder and recovery a bit slower but that is ok with me.

I have noticed that i don't heat up as quickly or sweat as much as compared to before HRT and that is a good thing.

I have noticed my times are slower, harder to attain, and the conditioning takes longer to return after time away from running, from years of HRT.  I also had voice surgery (glottoplasty/chondroplasty/cricothroidApproximation) and cannot pass air as easily as before, either.  I noticed the more restricted windpipe access on my first run after voice surgery.  I also have full C cup breasts to deal with in runs.  In short, I feel like I run like a girl.  Not in a bad way, or demeaning way, but I am dealing with female attributes and it affects me accordingly.  I am actually happy to be in the female category for official races because I feel like they needed to be there for me and it is not a one-to-one competition with males.  I just do not run like I used to with male breathing structures and male hormones.

Quote from: Shy on February 21, 2017, 10:24:06 AM
I've alway been too, well um dysphoric to enter races. Seriously all that testosterone floating about at the start line just had me 'running for the hills'.

How about this race then?
http://www.runlikeadiva.com/

Nothing but estrogen in those races.  :)  I'm an avid runner myself, and I'll be running in the 5K Divas race in Chicagoland with my friends in 2 months!

I've always only trained for endurance and have been glad that a year into HRT with effective feminine levels I'm just as strong today as before starting. I can rock climb as hard, u blow glass and I'm able to lift work as heavy as I did a year ago swim a mile at exactly the same pace I did when I was last in triathlon shape (5 years ago) etc, etc.

I'm sure I'll be just as slow a runner as I always was if I decide to return to that :-).

I've been following a blog of a runner who transitioned fully mtf. She is VERY detailed about her transition and running experiences.

http://www.entirelyamelia.com

Hope the site helps.

I really like Amelia's blog as well. She's one of the few public transgender individuals I can relate to.

Thanks for all the advise and links ladies :)
Seriously, it's help to put my mind at rest about HRT as running is my passion. I really have no more clouds hanging over me preventing me from moving forward. Just a waiting game now for my appointment to come through so runnings going to help take the edge off that. Patience, on foot in front of the other, I'll get there. :)

Happy trails,

shy

I think it will depend on hormonal status. If your T levels drop very low, like low female range or below (measure free Testosterone and take into account any blocking from anti-androgens), then you might suffer, depending on your genetic predisposition. Premenopausal women will typically have more T than us, post-op because they still have their ovaries producing some T. Estrogen might help with endurance, keeping the heart healthy and pumping and use fat for energy if needed whereas progestogens might make this harder as they make the body hold on more to fat.

My 2 cents.

Quote from: KayXo on February 24, 2017, 04:04:32 PM
I think it will depend on hormonal status. If your T levels drop very low, like low female range or below (measure free Testosterone and take into account any blocking from anti-androgens), then you might suffer, depending on your genetic predisposition. Premenopausal women will typically have more T than us, post-op because they still have their ovaries producing some T. Estrogen might help with endurance, keeping the heart healthy and pumping and use fat for energy if needed whereas progestogens might make this harder as they make the body hold on more to fat.

My 2 cents.

Possible links to oestrogen and endurance is music to my ears :) I tend to run fasted and prefer to burn fat as fuel instead of munching on carbs, so there may be some issues there. I suppose I won't really know until I get my prescription how my body's going to react, I'm sure it will add a different dimension to my runs. Thanks for your 2 cents KayXo:)

Quote from: Shy on February 25, 2017, 02:05:28 PM
I tend to run fasted and prefer to burn fat as fuel instead of munching on carbs, so there may be some issues there.

I'm sure you know this but if anyone else reads it you can train your body to burn predominantly fat regardless of your hormonal levels.  It's all about building a giant aerobic capacity and then exercising at an intensity where fat can supply half or more of the energy.  It's not particularly complex but it is specific and does take a long period of unbroken training. 

The reward is tireless legs, a faster pace at the same intensity, and a fat burning machine that burns increased levels of fat over carbs all day long.  Weight control then becomes very easy even while consuming fairly prodigious amounts of food.

The only down side is the time commitment and the reality that those prodigious quantities of food tend to stick around if one stops training.

Having said all that, I have read that women do have an advantage in fat produced energy at ultra marathon distances.


It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.
André Gide, Autumn Leaves

On the matter of fat burning versus carb burning a useful reading is "The art and science of low carbohydrate performance" from J.S. Volek (PhD, RD) and S.D. Phinney (MD, PhD).

Quote from: Lucie on February 26, 2017, 04:46:18 AM
On the matter of fat burning versus carb burning a useful reading is "The art and science of low carbohydrate performance" from J.S. Volek (PhD, RD) and S.D. Phinney (MD, PhD).

Thanks for that.  It was free to read with Amazon Unlimited so I just downloaded a copy.  I'm looking forward to learning something new.



It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.
André Gide, Autumn Leaves

Here is another really good and very long book I've read before.  Dr. Phil Maffetone's "Big Book of Endurance Training and Racing".

It contains an extensive section on nutrition and shifting your body's metabolism to reduce its reliance on carbs and burning more fat.


It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.
André Gide, Autumn Leaves

Shy, you still need enough blood sugar to be able to burn fat, it's not a lot but if you don't supply it then the body will start to metabolize protein to make carbs, the process is called catabolysis and is pretty hard on the body.

Once you build this capacity it seems to stick around. I discovered a decade ago that I couldn't bike to Dr office for blood tests because i would register very high triglycerides. If I drove or took the bus my tri-g would be rock bottom (~50). This persists to this day, even though I am not training hard in 5 years now I still can't bike to a test if I want an accurate fasting result.

Early studies of training to utilize fat in exercise had negative results because the study durations were too short, it takes a minimum of 6 weeks to start the training effect.

Quote from: SadieBlake on February 26, 2017, 08:12:36 AM
Shy, you still need enough blood sugar to be able to burn fat, it's not a lot but if you don't supply it then the body will start to metabolize protein to make carbs, the process is called catabolysis and is pretty hard on the body.

I believe the process is called gluconeogenesis. When you stop eating carbs, your body shifts to relying mostly on fat and ketones (brain included) while the little amount of sugar needed is provided by conversion from fat and protein. I ate no carbs for about a year and did fine so it is possible. Inuits have done this for thousands of years.

The process of adaptation from burning carbs to fat/ketones takes a few weeks. My triglycerides were the lowest they had ever been and my HDL through the roof! :)

My roommate used the Atkins Diet for a while and the goal was to drive the body into ketosis. Unfortunately one of the side effects of shifting the body that much is your breath contains ketones which don't really smell all that good. She gave up on the diet and I shifted her to one with fewer calories and more vegetables that she was able to lose and maintain weight on. We also limited sugar and I gained skill in making diet desserts. 

I have been successful in getting   most processed carbs out of my diet.  In their place though I have been eating a fairly massive amount of vegetables and lentils along with a relatively high protein allotment.  (Weight is still dropping pretty steadily).

The books mentioned above state that carbohydrate consumption should initially be less than 50 grams a day.  I could substantially reduce my carbs from their current level of around 250 grams but 50 grams seems very aggressive.  My diet is also pretty high in fiber, 55+ grams per day.  I wonder if those fiber grams count as part of the 50 grams of carbohydrate goal?


It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.
André Gide, Autumn Leaves

Quote from: Dena on February 26, 2017, 12:02:42 PM
My roommate used the Atkins Diet for a while and the goal was to drive the body into ketosis. Unfortunately one of the side effects of shifting the body that much is your breath contains ketones which don't really smell all that good. She gave up on the diet and I shifted her to one with fewer calories and more vegetables that she was able to lose and maintain weight on. We also limited sugar and I gained skill in making diet desserts.

Acetone odor in breath may occur during the first weeks while the body is not yet fully keto-adapted. But once keto-adaptation is acheived there is no more ketone (or very few only) in expired air neither in urine. This is because ketones are then burnt (especially in the brain) as soon as they are produced by the liver.
As for me I have been on a ketogenic diet (carbs < 30g/day) for 8 months and my breath does not smell acetone or fruity. It has just no odor.

Quote from: Deborah on February 26, 2017, 12:22:38 PM
I wonder if those fiber grams count as part of the 50 grams of carbohydrate goal?

No, they don't. Only digestible carbs.

Quote from: KayXo on February 26, 2017, 02:15:39 PM
No, they don't. Only digestible carbs.

Thanks.  With that information 50g does not seem nearly so extreme.


It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not.
André Gide, Autumn Leaves

Quote from: SadieBlake on February 26, 2017, 08:12:36 AM
Shy, you still need enough blood sugar to be able to burn fat, it's not a lot but if you don't supply it then the body will start to metabolize protein to make carbs, the process is called catabolysis and is pretty hard on the body.

Once you build this capacity it seems to stick around. I discovered a decade ago that I couldn't bike to Dr office for blood tests because i would register very high triglycerides. If I drove or took the bus my tri-g would be rock bottom (~50). This persists to this day, even though I am not training hard in 5 years now I still can't bike to a test if I want an accurate fasting result.

Early studies of training to utilize fat in exercise had negative results because the study durations were too short, it takes a minimum of 6 weeks to start the training effect.

Thanks Sadie
I'm vegetarian so I gets me carbs. Just don't munch on them when I'm running. I really don't like the sugar rush/crash scenario with carbs. My energy seems more stable running fasted, mainly for shorter training runs though.
If I'm hitting the 50k distances I'll take electrolytes and usually a healthy snack or two, but never the sports drinks, or anything crammed with sugar. I'd just barf that all up come mile20;D.
I certainly don't drop into ketosis, at least I don't think I do. I haven't set up a diet to promote that beyond avocados, olives, nuts, legumes and soy milk;) Yes I crave soy, and feel rubbish without it, even though I know it's just a placebo for real oestrogen. But needs must until the NHS backlog clears.
My main worry was with starting HRT, and how it might effect my running in the future. I can see now that it's going to be different, but no less rewarding or healthy judging by the responses to this thread. I'm actually excited to get started now, another box ticked. So thank you all ladies! A few years from now and It'll be questions on getting a sports bra to fit;D

Happy trails

shy