Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I've been in voice therapy for two years. Emily my Speech Pathologist did a great job. But I still could do better. I was wondering if anyone would be interested in creating a voice work group via Skype?

Here is a tool that can help you feminize your voice. After downloading the app to android or Ipad/phone read the passages to "Dorian Gray" Don't forget to push the record button. After reading the passage press the button to analyze. Your speech is recorded in two indicators. The first being a graph of your voice inflections and second an analysis of your speech pattern of how you maintain your pitch over time. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.lilithwittmann.voicepitchanalyzer&hl=en_US   Also available from Apple store.

I'd be willing to join in but I'm no voice trainer.

I'm not either but I do have the instructions Emily gave me and there are a number of references to use. One of the great things about cooperation is that we proceed on a consensus. In other words what do we agree is the best advice to follow.

I would be very interested but I'm not sure how much help I would be to others or how much of my time I could commit and when.

I was playing around with a voice pitch analyzer and it helped me dial myself in this evening. My results and I think they turned out pretty good. The only thing is it only shows the frequency range it doesn't let you play the recording back.

https://imgur.com/a/h3qLuJd

Quote from: NatalieRene on December 09, 2018, 10:27:24 PM
I was playing around with a voice pitch analyzer and it helped me dial myself in this evening. My results and I think they turned out pretty good. The only thing is it only shows the frequency range it doesn't let you play the recording back.

https://imgur.com/a/h3qLuJd

I think your range seems to be good enough. But range is only one part of the equation. What is really hard, at least for me, is to sound natural and feminine in that range. I can talk in that range, or even higher sometimes(see image below) but it still doesn't sound naturally female. I think the pitch over time graph shows my problem, the lowest parts are too low.

https://imgur.com/a/FWFxICL (https://imgur.com/a/FWFxICL)

https://imgur.com/a/qRJvtWW (https://imgur.com/a/qRJvtWW)

Quote from: NatalieRene on December 09, 2018, 10:27:24 PM
I was playing around with a voice pitch analyzer and it helped me dial myself in this evening. My results and I think they turned out pretty good. The only thing is it only shows the frequency range it doesn't let you play the recording back.

https://imgur.com/a/h3qLuJd

Something is wrong here!  I am supposed to be the partially girly person from birth on, and your pitch is even better than mine!
I reach top 240 Hz, and bottom is around 170 Hz.  But again, it is not only the voice pitch, but the speech pattern that gives us away.  Speech pattern is a learned behavior, and it needs to be unlearned to have a male pattern, and learned to have a female pattern.
That is the reason that i can sing mezzo soprano without any problem, because the voice pattern is dictated by the composer of the piece.

If I could go my day around with only singing, people would feel that I am a beautiful princess. The speech pattern is the reason that i converse with check out people and people in female restrooms only with single words or very short sentences!

Quote from: Lynne on December 10, 2018, 04:34:22 PM
I think your range seems to be good enough. But range is only one part of the equation. What is really hard, at least for me, is to sound natural and feminine in that range. I can talk in that range, or even higher sometimes(see image below) but it still doesn't sound naturally female. I think the pitch over time graph shows my problem, the lowest parts are too low.

https://imgur.com/a/FWFxICL (https://imgur.com/a/FWFxICL)

https://imgur.com/a/qRJvtWW (https://imgur.com/a/qRJvtWW)

Te question is also, is this your natural voice when you reach the high frequency, or is this an artificial produced sound?

For me, the frequency range I show, is the frequency range of my natural voice, I do not really have to work on keeping that range, I just have to watch it that I don't go low at the end of a sentence (the male thing).
When you have to strain your voice, talking in a female frequency range, you will not be able to maintain that and might even hurt your vocal cords.
With my voice, I have to force myself to talk in a low frequency range, and that hurt me after a while pretty bad.

Quote from: DawnOday on December 07, 2018, 12:13:53 PM
I'm not either but I do have the instructions Emily gave me and there are a number of references to use. One of the great things about cooperation is that we proceed on a consensus. In other words what do we agree is the best advice to follow.

I would not mind to participate in a Skype session to get some vice training.

Quote from: Lynne on December 10, 2018, 04:34:22 PM
I think your range seems to be good enough. But range is only one part of the equation. What is really hard, at least for me, is to sound natural and feminine in that range. I can talk in that range, or even higher sometimes(see image below) but it still doesn't sound naturally female. I think the pitch over time graph shows my problem, the lowest parts are too low.

https://imgur.com/a/FWFxICL (https://imgur.com/a/FWFxICL)

https://imgur.com/a/qRJvtWW (https://imgur.com/a/qRJvtWW)

What app did you use?

Quote from: Dietlind on December 10, 2018, 07:23:00 PM
Something is wrong here!  I am supposed to be the partially girly person from birth on, and your pitch is even better than mine!
I reach top 240 Hz, and bottom is around 170 Hz.  But again, it is not only the voice pitch, but the speech pattern that gives us away.  Speech pattern is a learned behavior, and it needs to be unlearned to have a male pattern, and learned to have a female pattern.
That is the reason that i can sing mezzo soprano without any problem, because the voice pattern is dictated by the composer of the piece.

If I could go my day around with only singing, people would feel that I am a beautiful princess. The speech pattern is the reason that i converse with check out people and people in female restrooms only with single words or very short sentences!

My voice was never very deep to begin with. Sometimes it does take me a while to find my voice. I had voice training for several years to help practice the resonance and inflection.

I found a app for my phone to log the pitch over time and I can play it back and listen.The link has a a second image with my frequency and decimal range.

https://imgur.com/a/now4Rii

Quote from: NatalieRene on December 10, 2018, 08:27:16 PM
I found a app for my phone to log the pitch over time and I can play it back and listen.The link has a a second image with my frequency and decimal range.

https://imgur.com/a/now4Rii

What is the name of that app?  The app I use is called Voice Pitch Analyzer.  It is in the google play store

Quote from: Dietlind on December 10, 2018, 08:33:44 PM
What is the name of that app?  The app I use is called Voice Pitch Analyzer.  It is in the google play store

On the iPhone Voice Analyst. However it was $9.99.

Cool app. Female voice result. Whew! As a girly person, I taught myself a guy voice to fit in with my assigned at birth gender. I consciously pushed my voice down lower into my chest. My female voice was a process of unwinding that voice and rediscovering my more feminine voice, which is more up in my head and throat. When I first transitioned, I often got clocked over the phone, but not in person. That drove me crazy. Finally over time it doesn't happen any more.

Quote from: NatalieRene on December 10, 2018, 08:37:58 PM
On the iPhone Voice Analyst. However it was $9.99.

It is the same in the Google play store, same price, too. 

Quote from: Dietlind on December 10, 2018, 07:23:00 PM
Something is wrong here!  I am supposed to be the partially girly person from birth on, and your pitch is even better than mine!
I reach top 240 Hz, and bottom is around 170 Hz.  But again, it is not only the voice pitch, but the speech pattern that gives us away.  Speech pattern is a learned behavior, and it needs to be unlearned to have a male pattern, and learned to have a female pattern.
That is the reason that i can sing mezzo soprano without any problem, because the voice pattern is dictated by the composer of the piece.

If I could go my day around with only singing, people would feel that I am a beautiful princess. The speech pattern is the reason that i converse with check out people and people in female restrooms only with single words or very short sentences!

The question is are you using your head voice or your chest voice. Women normally use the head voice and that gives them a much higher working range. Singers learn how to use the chest voice which allows them to hit the lower notes. The most notable one was Karen Carpenter who did nearly all of her singing in the chest voice.

Males on the other hand drop into the chest voice and with the effect of Testosterone end up with a much lower voice. By moving our voice up to the chest voice, often the pitch ends up in the feminine rage. In my case before voice surgery, the highest pitch I could reach was about 190HZ with my comfortable head voice at 130-140HZ. Naturally my male voice was really down there in the gutter. The only fix for my voice was to remain silent or voice surgery and that was what originally brought me to Susan's.

Quote from: Dena on December 10, 2018, 10:09:49 PM
The question is are you using your head voice or your chest voice. Women normally use the head voice and that gives them a much higher working range. Singers learn how to use the chest voice which allows them to hit the lower notes. The most notable one was Karen Carpenter who did nearly all of her singing in the chest voice.

Males on the other hand drop into the chest voice and with the effect of Testosterone end up with a much lower voice. By moving our voice up to the chest voice, often the pitch ends up in the feminine rage. In my case before voice surgery, the highest pitch I could reach was about 190HZ with my comfortable head voice at 130-140HZ. Naturally my male voice was really down there in the gutter. The only fix for my voice was to remain silent or voice surgery and that was what originally brought me to Susan's.

I have a hard time to use a chest voice.  My throat hurts when I try to do this.  Because of not having an Adams Apple, my voice box is smaller than the one of the typical male, it is similar to the voice box of females.  this set up gives me a way higher voice.  As a male I had a hard time to keep a baritone speaking voice, the singing voice was more like that of a tenor.
Now that I try not to speak in a low frequency range at all anymore, my singing voice is close to the one of a mezzo soprano.
If you just take my voice, and leave the speech pattern outside, I am clearly are in the range of a little lower female voice, but that stupid speech pattern still gives me away.  And that is a lot of training to get away from it, after all, it took many decades to learn it!
I am pretty lucky that I hardly need any modifications to my voice or my face, just eliminating the little bit of beard growth, training my voice to eliminate the male speech pattern, and I am optically and acoustically 100% female.

I don't know how much RT will help to achieve this goal, but I believe i better not count on it, and go to the torture chamber to get the facial hair removed.

Becoming a female is relatively easy for me, because I do not have most of the male identifiers you ladies have to fight with, and this could be the reason why I do not have any real bad dysphoria?

This is my voice. Keep in mind it was recorded through a Apple iPhone headset so it might not be a perfect recording but I guess it is close enough.

Dietland, I also don't have an Adam's apple. I don't think I sound perfect but I guess I am passable. I don't get strange looks and I get ma'amed on the phone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7A01nX-KiI

Quote from: NatalieRene on December 10, 2018, 10:55:57 PM
This is my voice. Keep in mind it was recorded through a Apple iPhone headset so it might not be a perfect recording but I guess it is close enough.

Dietland, I also don't have an Adam's apple. I don't think I sound perfect but I guess I am passable. I don't get strange looks and I get ma'amed on the phone.

https://youtu.be/q7A01nX-KiI

Well, as we thought, you might be intersex after all!
I think the missing Adams Apple and the resulting smaller voice box and shorter vocal cords are the culprits that allow us to have a higher pitched voice without working hard on it!

Are you able to avoid the typical m ale speech pattern?  This pattern gives m away, no matter how nice and female my voice sounds.  It is a 100% learned behavior, but I worked so hard on it to learn it!

You sound pretty good to me!  Definitely higher in pitch than me, but I am way older than you, and older women tend to have lower voices!  I don't think that either of us needs any surgical intervention with our voice!  What did the speech training do for you?

Quote from: Dietlind on December 10, 2018, 11:05:17 PM
Well, as we thought, you might be intersex after all!
I think the missing Adams Apple and the resulting smaller voice box and shorter vocal cords are the culprits that allow us to have a higher pitched voice without working hard on it!

Are you able to avoid the typical m ale speech pattern?  This pattern gives m away, no matter how nice and female my voice sounds.  It is a 100% learned behavior, but I worked so hard on it to learn it!

You sound pretty good to me!  Definitely higher in pitch than me, but I am way older than you, and older women tend to have lower voices!  I don't think that either of us needs any surgical intervention with our voice!  What did the speech training do for you?

It helped me learn how to control my voice. Mostly the inflection and resonance. I can still do a guys voice. My full range is roughly 275Hz to 100Hz with and without inflection and resonance. However if I go low my voice gets tired.

Here is the app. It's not on Microsoft. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.lilithwittmann.voicepitchanalyzer&hl=en

Looking for a date to start. I live in the pacific time zone and it my be 9:00 am where you live but I'm not awake yet. So let's pick a time and day. We can all agree on. I am available most days. Do we want to go through the relaxation exercise. Otherwise we can go through the steps Emily led me through. Looking forward to getting together, You all rock.

Quote from: DawnOday on December 10, 2018, 11:19:07 PM
Here is the app. It's not on Microsoft. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.lilithwittmann.voicepitchanalyzer&hl=en

Looking for a date to start. I live in the pacific time zone and it my be 9:00 am where you live but I'm not awake yet. So let's pick a time and day. We can all agree on. I am available most days. Do we want to go through the relaxation exercise. Otherwise we can go through the steps Emily led me through. Looking forward to getting together, You all rock.

I am living in the state of the eternal summer, right next to the Gulf of Mexico.  I m ready to have lunch when you lazy bombs out west just crawl out of bed!
I am retired, and as any retired person, have hardly time enough to get anything done.  But if we all agree on a time and day, I will try to make it happen for me!

I'm in central standard time. 7:00PM CST would work for me.

Quote from: DawnOday on December 10, 2018, 11:19:07 PM
Here is the app. It's not on Microsoft. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.lilithwittmann.voicepitchanalyzer&hl=en

Looking for a date to start. I live in the pacific time zone and it my be 9:00 am where you live but I'm not awake yet. So let's pick a time and day. We can all agree on. I am available most days. Do we want to go through the relaxation exercise. Otherwise we can go through the steps Emily led me through. Looking forward to getting together, You all rock.

Oh wow it has so much more on the android version.

I think yes the relaxation would be beneficial.

Quote from: Dietlind on December 10, 2018, 07:31:58 PM
Te question is also, is this your natural voice when you reach the high frequency, or is this an artificial produced sound?

For me, the frequency range I show, is the frequency range of my natural voice, I do not really have to work on keeping that range, I just have to watch it that I don't go low at the end of a sentence (the male thing).
When you have to strain your voice, talking in a female frequency range, you will not be able to maintain that and might even hurt your vocal cords.
With my voice, I have to force myself to talk in a low frequency range, and that hurt me after a while pretty bad.

The highest of my highs definitely require effort. But I don't really know what would be my natural range because I tried so hard to be male for a long time, I think I subconsciously 'trained' my voice to be lower than what would be natural for me. There are moments when I'm really feeling good about myself and my voice is higher than usual but still not strained.

Quote from: NatalieRene on December 10, 2018, 07:45:55 PM
What app did you use?

The one from the first post.

Quote from: DawnOday on December 10, 2018, 11:19:07 PM
Here is the app. It's not on Microsoft. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.lilithwittmann.voicepitchanalyzer&hl=en

Looking for a date to start. I live in the pacific time zone and it my be 9:00 am where you live but I'm not awake yet. So let's pick a time and day. We can all agree on. I am available most days. Do we want to go through the relaxation exercise. Otherwise we can go through the steps Emily led me through. Looking forward to getting together, You all rock.

I live in Central Europe, UTC+1 time zone. On workdays I'm usually available from around 7 PM to 1 AM(local time), that would mean 10 AM to 4 PM for you in the Pacific time zone. I can arrange anything on weekends.

Relaxation sounds useful.

I can do weekends more flexibly but week days would have to be after work.

Quote from: NatalieRene on December 10, 2018, 11:32:40 PM
Oh wow it has so much more on the android version.

That is the app I am using to analyze my voice!

Quote from: Lynne on December 11, 2018, 02:05:11 PM
The highest of my highs definitely require effort. But I don't really know what would be my natural range because I tried so hard to be male for a long time, I think I subconsciously 'trained' my voice to be lower than what would be natural for me. There are moments when I'm really feeling good about myself and my voice is higher than usual but still not strained.

My psychotherapist and I talked about this today.  We came to the conclusion, that my voice is the only real sour of dysphoria I have left.  And she said that many rather feminin men try to be extra male by training their voice to a level as low as they can get, in order to prove their masculinity.  I did the same, I  tried to be so low that it almost hurt my throat.
she told me the best start for ditching this is trying to watch that one does not go that low, and from there on trying to raise the voice to a natural pitch.  We just have to unlearn the bad male behavior, because we don't need to pound our chest anymore (will hurt anyway once the boobs are bigger).

I checked myself a little, I basically do not have a chest resonance, the lowest my resonance is, is somewhere around the voice box or a bit below.  When I talk to have a chest resonance, my throat hurts pretty fast.

Any decision as to when we should start meeting for this?

Quote from: NatalieRene on December 17, 2018, 12:36:11 PM
Any decision as to when we should start meeting for this?

Maybe while the group is forming here we could at least create the Skype group and add people who are interested?

Quote from: Lynne on December 17, 2018, 03:13:33 PM
Maybe while the group is forming here we could at least create the Skype group and add people who are interested?

I can do that this evening. Anyone that wants added to the group please pm me your skype handle.