Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Hello, I'm Kristie, and I am cautiously taking my first step (removal of facial hair).  My question is this, and don't laugh, but I'm curious to know if after the procedures have been completed and you finally have the full body of a female, does the vagina produce its own lubrication?  and if not, how do you deal with that issue?  I'd just like to know what i can expect when everything's finally done with.  I know, as far as I can tell from my reading and research, that a workable clitoris is created...can you comment on that as well.  Thanks for your time ladies, the fledgling, Kristie

I'm not post-op, but from what I've heard, you do produce your own lubrication, although it's generally not as much as a natal female.  You can alway use KY Jelly or something similar.  I've heard a product called astroglide works well.  Many post-op women also have the ability to orgasm, although because of psychological issues, some may not.

P.S. Not a stupid question.  One I had to research though.

Melissa

Thanks Mellisa, that fairly well answers my question.  You girls are great!  Kristie

I've looked into this too, and never really found a definitive answer.

I don't think there is a direct source of lubrication from the usual SRS method. Some people have told me that what can happen is that a little, errr, "excited leakage" (seminal fluid? I'm not good with terms here) can occur from the urethra and dribble downward, creating some lubrication.

This is what my surgeon told me. He said that because we still have a prostate that it will lubricate a little. I guess it would depend on the girl. I know I have a little moisture down there and I have tried my stretching exercise without lubricant, very slowly. So I know there is a little. It is better with an artificial lubricant, like some of the ones talked about. As far as orgasm and the clitoris, it does happen. Not every woman is orgasmic, natal women. Given the right circumstances and the right person, I think you can be.
Sheila

definitely not a stupid question hell I found it enlightening!

I don't know why this is funny but melissa when you mentioned astroglide & KY I just started to laugh... ;D :D

PS you can also use something called orgasma - spelled in correctly I think

Chynna

KY is nasty and sticky.  The best product price wise is Surgi Lube.  Once you are post and needing to dialate at least twice a day, you can't use enough lube. I bought mine by the 12 pack and then two bundles of paper towels.  This stuff is slick and 1/3 the price of KY.

Some self lube and some don't, thankfully this isn't a problem I suffer from normally.  Now if I'm attacked  ;D with a silicone John Holmes look alike then out comes the bottle of Liquid Silk.

Leigh

You girls crack me up!  It's so good, the humor we all seem to share about our situation and life in general .. it's either laugh or cry i suppose.  Thanks again to all of your comments and suggestions.  I laughed too when I read KY jelly, don't know why.  Anyway, here's to a lubricated and orgasmic future...cheers!
Kristie

Well, there's the older method of building a neo-vagina out of part of your large colon, which is lined with mucosal tissue.  Kate Bornstein commented that girls so equipped are kinda' sloppy all the time because the skin just keeps producing mucus, which might not be a bad thing, but pack plenty of pantyliners...

There was another surgeon (I forget which,) who, for an additional fee, would take the unused portion of the urethra, slit it open, and stitch it into the inverted-penis vaginal sheath.  That's also mucosal tissue, and would produce a bit of lubrication, but, I'm told, would need to be supplimented.

You'll still have a (shrunken) prostate, so I imagine that if you experience orgasm, there's a bit of ejaculate that's contributed to the festive atmosphere...  Any post-op ladies care to comment on that?

Karen

Quote from: Karen on June 25, 2006, 11:46:26 PM
Well, there's the older method of building a neo-vagina out of part of your large colon, which is lined with mucosal tissue.  Kate Bornstein commented that girls so equipped are kinda' sloppy all the time because the skin just keeps producing mucus, which might not be a bad thing, but pack plenty of pantyliners...

From what I hear, it also produces an odor that smells kind of like a sewer.  It's also more expensive.  It did not sound like something I wanted.

Melissa

WOW!!!!
Thanks for giving me yet another reason to refuse SRS

That's only for the version that uses the sigmoid colon and is usually done by doctors that use penile inversion on a small penis.

P.S. The sigmoid colon is the part of the digestive tract (a portion of the large intestines) that is just before the rectum.

Melissa

Thanks for all the participants to my post, I keep gaining knowledge.  Since I am not taking HRT prior to any surgery, I wonder if my "normal" sized penis will be enough to form a fairly good vagina?  I have small testicles, how much tissue is necessary to form the labia?   ^-^

If it's normal, it should be fine.  HRT doesn't change it much anyways, except shrink testicles.

Melissa

Be aware that more than one Dr. may not touch you without prior HRT. You may want to contact a few to see what they say.

Thanks Kimberly, I've addressed this and had respones, most of which noted that HRT is not necessarily a pre-requisite to SRS.  However, you're right, a good idea to check first.  I don't have an adam's apple, my voice is always mistaken for female, I have gynocomastia since i was a teenager (women-like breasts...even when thin), thick black hair, and when trying to appear "butch" have even been mistaken face to face with waiters, grocery checkouts, etc as a female, even with wearing a baseball cap and not shaved for a couple of days, my hips are rather wide...i suspect I have higher than normal estrogen already in my body.  And at my age, 47, the further enhancement with HRT is limited, and the side-effect, some lethal, are maximized...so I will not be using HRT...frankly, I don't need it.  But thanks for the heads-up Kimberly, I appreciate your input.  Kristie

Robyn, 6 years post op and old.

If the vagina is made from a section of the colon it will be self lubricsting for 3 years or so.  It will be constantly lubricating, 24x7x365.  It is mucosal tissue.

If penile inversion, there is no self lubrication.  It is not mucosal tissue.  Some post ops will have a bit of lubrication when sexually aroused.  That is seminal fluid from the atrophied prostate gland.

I have to dilate twice a week and prelube the vagina with a dab of the Walmart KY substitute.  And I prelube the stent, as well.  Hey, I paid almost $20K for it; I sure don't want it to close up.

Robyn

Hey Robyn, thanks for the information ... so you must continue with the stint forever?  Oh well, I learn something new every day, which is a good thing, thanks to all of you.  I know they have artificial saliva for the mouth, be nice if they had artificial, other than KY, etc, vaginal lubrications.  So Robyn you keep your vagina lubricated every day?  Perhaps one day, they'll be able to create a workable natural lubrication, preferably when sexually aroused...dream on i'm sure.  I don't think I'd want part of my intenstines to create a vagina.  But a girl's gotta do what a girl's gotta do i guess,  ::)  If i could only find a man who secrets KY jelly from his salivary glands  ;D.  I have learned so much from you girls already, and the differing opinions about certain procedures, etc.  is actually helpful, there seems to be many options and each person is different and takes their own individual path towards their goal.  I like that concept.  It forces you to really learn as much as possible and make your own "treatment plan."  I'm already a woman, I just need a few adjustments to my body and I"m good to go.  I have a long journey ahead, but I am resolved to see it through to its desired end...I have to at this point, I can not relate to any other alternative.  THANK YOU GIRLS!  Kristie

There are a variety of factors that may impact lubrication in the neo-vagina. In my personal experience I have found the internal use of Premarin cream to be helpful. Then too if sufficiently aroused and if the Cowpers gland hasn't atrophied ue to hormone usage there may be a modicum of lubrication produced by it.

The Cowpers gland is found under the prostate gland, and is responsible for the pre-cum or clear fluids that you see emitted from the penis.

In a post op women that fluid may provide lubrication to the neo-vagina.

If the amount of lubrication provided by the Cowpers gland is insufficient or if the woman does not want to use a topical lubricant, then she may consider opting for the sigmoid colon technique of GRS.

The sigmoid colon technique, involves using a piece of your colon to increase the depth of the neo-vagina. There are a few advantages to that, one is the vagina will be self lubricating, along with the increased depth.

However disadvantages are:

1. It is a more invasive surgery.

2. As a part of the colon is used, there are anecdotal accounts of the vagina, not always smelling fresh, though this may be impacted by personal hygiene.

3. The vagina tends to be constantly lubricating, and some woman may need to wear a tampon, to absorb the moisture.

I can say personally I produce a ton of vaginal lubrication, and it generally also covers the labia as well.

Those are definitely intelligent questions!

The use of a section of the sigmoid colon does not involve any smell. The scent of excrement is produced by the E coli bacteria which inhabit our lower gi tract.

As far as I know the best known docs are all using a relatively new penile inversion procedure using the extra section of urethra as part of the neovagina and yes, that affords some lubrication on arousal (precum comes from two different sources and one purpose is to change the pH of the urethra to one that's hospitable to sperm).

I believe Marci Bowers uses this method now, the new team at Boston medical center also and probably also the surgeons they've been observing in preparation. I believe Satterwhite also and I'll be verifying that when I have my consult with him next week. I don't think there's additional cost, the amount of extra work is quite small.

Normally not all of the skin on the testicles is used for the procedure and yes the PI  technique gets a lot of its depth from the length of the penis. Average size before should get you 6" depth post op. A neovagina does not lengthen on arousal so depth can be an issue (addressable by choice of sexual position).

As far as I know the current WPATH does allow for any of the normal prerequisite to be waived if medically necessary as determined by your psychologist or psychiatrist and PCP. Estrogen carries far less risk when taken transdermally or by intramuscular injection, FYI.

Getting criteria waived may be no small hurdle, I suppose it depends on the doc(s) - it's taken me 4 months of discussion and a consult with a PhD psychologist for me to clear that my recommendation will be made including an RLE that's non-binary. The reason for the extra diligence is that the insurance requirements document for my insurer is more restrictive than the current WPATH (I think it's based on WPATH 6) and my psychiatrist and I agreed that the i's and t's needed to be carefully dotted and crossed to be avoid problems there.

Quote from: Doreen on September 27, 2016, 09:55:41 PM
I can say personally I produce a ton of vaginal lubrication, and it generally also covers the labia as well.

Hello, Doreen. May I ask which kind of surgery did you have?

 
The current penile inversion techniques allow the creation of vaginal canal using some tissue that turns into lubricating mucosal tissue. I was just in at 15 weeks and My Surgeon said that tissue just inside my Vulva of was already mucosalizing. Seems pretty slippery to me already. ;D