Susan's Place Transgender Resources

This is a list of my favorite quotes from some of our members.  This list will be updated regularly.

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Quote from: DawnL on August 27, 2006, 08:46:17 PM

Quote from: elleane on August 27, 2006, 03:33:46 AM
Perhaps you'd care to enlighten us as to exactly what you mean.
I must say that I'm increasingly concerned about the use of the term 'Gender Dysphoria'.  An implied incongruity between mind and body.

The mind is not the body - the body is not the mind.
Apples and oranges.

If you are suggesting that one is 'born into the wrong body'; that somehow one's physical attributes are incorrect and that surgical alteration is the solution, then in my mind that lies far nearer body dysmorphia than gender dysphoria. 
(and yes I'm aware of the body of work that is oft quoted/referenced, largely by the TS community, to dispute this notion)

elleane
xxx

Wow!  "The mind is not the body - the body is not the mind. Apples and oranges."

Funny, they're all connected together, more like the apple and the tree or the orange and the tree than apples and oranges.  Your metaphor is suspect and very inflammatory.  Body dysmorphia, gender dysphoria.  Maybe they're the same thing.  One can have many body dysmorphias but perhaps when gender is involved, gender dysphoria is the result, maybe a subset of body dysmorphia.  Fact is, they're all stupid labels.  If a man or woman is considering ending their life because of a life-long dysphoria/dysmorphia, I don't really care what you call it, and if surgery is the cure, then surgery is the cure, the same for a heart bypass patient--the body of work that is oft quoted/referenced, largely by the non-TS, doubting, bigoted community aside.

Dawn

Quote from: DawnL on October 29, 2006, 09:41:45 PM
I'm a woman with a transsexual history, not a transsexual, and my history is my business alone.

Dawn

Quote from: Beyond on April 25, 2008, 12:13:36 PM
I needed HRT to banish the noise in my head and to calm me.  And before you say it's psychosomatic, remember I've been on HRT for 4.5 years and I still feel great.  I never want to stop taking it.  I even went to 2 surgeons that allow you to stay on HRT right through surgery.  But the effects weren't limited to making me feel better, it also changed my body to something more desirable.  It made my skin softer and drier, changed my nails, my hair (including body hair reduction), my senses of smell, taste and touch, and it even changed my eye color!  It gave me a semblance of hips/butt, modest breast growth and I shrunk 1/2 an inch.  I wanted it all, and in my way of thinking that's another defining characteristic of being born transsexual: You want to be what you should have been as much as possible.  I'm done transition and now, for all intents and purposes, am the woman I should have been.

Quote from: Steph on November 25, 2007, 03:32:28 PM
The word "trans" simply indicates that they are in the process of transition, therefore would be included in the term "Men" or "Women".  The words "Post" and "Pre" simply indicate how far along they are in transition and has no bearing on their status as women or men.


Steph

Quote from: Natasha on March 01, 2008, 07:40:45 PM
In any case, transsexualism is a badly defined term. To use transsexual as a noun is dehumanising, leaches people with with this syndrome of their personality, and makes it easy for the bigoted to think of them as being "other", "weird", and "perverted". People with this syndrome have a particular medical condition, it is not the basis and ground of their identity, and we should not see them as "laboratory specimens" or "circus freaks".


The adjectival use is hardly better. People all too easily construe "transsexual man" or "transsexual woman" as "false man" or "impostor woman". Many are confused because of this term as to the proper term to call a person with this condition. They wonder whether they should address them as "man" or "woman". This is the source of such vile constructions as "she-male and "he-she".

After a childhood spent in the wrong social gender, and being in much confusion consequently, a person with this condition is most in need of consonance in their psychophysical identity. The driving need in one's life becomes the achievement of congruence between neurological gender and anatomical reality. At the same time, there is a desire to leave all sexual ambiguities behind, to have wholeness in the gestalt of body, soul, and mind.


It is diabolically cruel to affix the label of "transsexual" onto a person for the rest of their life. They do not engage themselves in a life-long journey between the sexes; it is only a temporary stage on the way to total personal congruency. This usage of transsexual clearly suggests and implies that the person involved is never a true man or woman, but rather a pariah and on a perpetual pilgrimage between the sexes.


Whenever the term "transsexual man" or "transsexual woman" is used, the strong implication is that they are not truly men or women. It matters not if the person involved is at peace because they have finally reached congruence or if their personal appearance is well within the bounds of their sex.


This term robs the person with this syndrome of full completion, it steals the peace of congruence, and it smirkily informs one that no matter how much one tries, you shall never be allowed to end the perpetual wandering of transsexuality. The continual accusations never give you rest, and you shall never be finally safe at home, in concord and harmony.


This is ironic, because we live in an age where we can correct the physical anomalies completely. This is cruel because the time of transition is only a year or two at most, but as long as one is a "transsexual", many shall never allow you to reach the far shore.


You must stay anchored out in the harbour, and only hear the laughter and joy of others ashore in the city. You must wear a placard about your neck proclaiming your status, ring a bell loudly, and shout, "Leper, Leper! Unclean, unclean"! as you make your way amongst the crowd.


The term transsexual comes from two Latin roots. "Trans" is a prefix that means through, across, beyond, or to change. "Sexual" is a verb that comes from the Latin sexualis, which means anything associated with sex or the sexes. We can see where the original derivation of the word came from. It referred to someone who was in the process of moving between the two sexes.


It is unfair to burden people permanently with labels that are no longer appropriate or applicable once changes are made, obstacles are overcome, surgery is finished, and they have taken their place in society in their proper gender. If you must give a classification, let me suggest two: "man" and "woman". Full stop.

Quote from: Valentina on May 17, 2008, 11:23:34 PM
I don't dress or act 'like a man' but then I don't dress or act ultra 'femininely' either, unless I go to a wedding or something in which case I'll make an effort and dress up. I would be offended if someone told me I should dress like that as I've better things to do with my time and I find jeans and t-shirt more practical. I'm quite secure in the fact that I'm a woman, and I don't need to go to either extreme to prove it.

Quote from: Susan on February 09, 2007, 01:12:23 AM
When I'm good I'm very good, When I'm bad I'm better, But when I'm evil you better run!!!!

Quote from: Chris on July 01, 2007, 02:47:34 AM
babes r babes. dont matter down below :laugh:

Quote from: Leigh on August 10, 2005, 04:51:21 PM
My definition of TS.  If you have one of those *things*, like *it*, never want to get rid of *it* and enjoy using *it* you dam sure are not TS of any kind.

Leigh

Quote from: Leslie on October 09, 2007, 05:22:23 PM
A person who is not TS would need to be born again, have severe GID, live their lives in the wrong body in order to understand that GRS is not what you implied..,

Quote from: Nichole on May 30, 2008, 12:21:26 AM

Quote from: Kate on May 29, 2008, 10:28:09 PM
You can't get there as a TS. You can't even get there "as a woman."

But Amanda? She's already there, waiting... ;)

O, I believe you can get there if you are a woman, or a man, or an androgyne/neutrois. Dysphoria is an accumulation of crap that you've had piled on you ever since you were like three. "O, no, Nichole, you are a boy! Boys don't do that." "But, I KNOW, you want to be just like Daddy when you grow up!" "I'll show you what you'll get every time you say you're a girl. Don't you EVER DEFY me like that, EVER again." "There, dumbass, you LIKE me in there doncha? We told you you're gay. Woman! Here's what women get."

And every brick makes a very high and strong wall and you know that you are not like the others. In fact, life proves it to you. You've never known any others. You aren't crazy, just in awful pain. "Stop, o, please stop. The belt HURTS." O, so bad, the belt hurts.

And the rape is worse than the belt. Pain, fear, looming death and more fear, pain, horror. "And it's all my fault. I have to go away"

No, you cannot get over pain being a TS or a woman. You cannot dodge fear and loathing, pain and horror as a man or a neutrois or an androgyne or a CD or TV.

But, you can learn to be yourself and screw the world and what those others think and how they act and how they treat you. And you can be held and comforted and find those like yourself. You can learn of care and love and the validity of being one's self and being simply congruent and comfortable with that.

Honestly, I cannot imagine that life gets much better than that.

Nichole never "waited there already." I was always Nichole; I simply wasn't equipped to defy the pain and the terror for so very long to be her, me. So I hid and trembled.

Those days are gone. With whom I choose to be among, to call friend or lover or sister or brother, well that's the end of GID for me.

It's not, in my experience, about transcending gender. It's about finding that place where both I and everyone else accepts that Nichole and woman are the same.

Nichole

Quote from: Natasha on May 31, 2008, 05:44:10 PM

the end of gid happens when we stop talking, thinking, bragging & bitching about it day in and day out!   >:D

Quote from: melissa90299 on August 09, 2007, 10:55:35 AM
So if you are not prepared to make every sacrifice, if you are not prepared to lose everything, if you think you can choose something else to help you get by, do that instead! Do not transition!

Quote from: Dr. Marci Bowers"The Body is a fluid vehicle for the Soul.

Transition is just a catalyst for

spiritual emergence." 

Marci L. Bowers, M.D.

ur quotes gotta be posted to  ;)

Quote from: Tink on July 15, 2007, 07:31:39 PM

Quote from: Pica Pica on July 15, 2007, 08:54:59 AM
Do you think when he was wooden he had all the boy parts? And when he became a real boy do you think he had them then?

I think that he was a real boy even when he was wooden.  Parts don't make anyone a "real" boy.  I know that for a fact. Boys are boys with or without parts.

tink :icon_chick:

Quote from: Beyond on June 04, 2008, 12:00:25 PM

Quote from: Andra on June 02, 2008, 02:47:41 PM

Quote from: Gracie FAISE on June 01, 2008, 05:22:49 PM
Its simple.

Transgender = Umbrella term for all deviations of the gender binary.

Transexual = One of the terms that is under that umbrella. Someone who has Gender Identity Disorder (GID) aka Harry Benjamin Syndrome (HBS) aka a birth defect that makes the sex of your body opposite the gender of your brain.

Restricting the definition of transsexual to binary identified people strikes me as being unnecessarily exclusive.  There are non-binary identified people (by no means all of them I know) who feel they have a birth defect and their anatomical sex doesn't match the sex of their brain.  This condition can exist whether you feel you're supposed to have a binary sexed body or not.  It's perfectly possible to get a diagnosis of gender dysphoria leading to corrective surgery without being binary identified.

<snip>

Also (call me a cynic if you must), I can't help but think this attempt to change the definition is an attempt to separate binary identified trans people from non-binary identified trans people.

What? ???

It's not unneccessarily exclusive, that's the historical definition of a person born transsexual.  The defining characteristic of people born transsexual is that they identify as the gender opposite of what they were assigned at birth.  Therefore people who identify outside the binary are not transsexual.  That was part of the reason the term "transgender" was adopted, to cover people who do not neatly fit within the binary.

This is what I was writing about before.  Some people are trying to change the meaning of the word "transsexual".  I'm not being elitist either, I'm trying to bring clarity to this issue.  What you want to do is make the words "transsexual" and "transger" interchangeable.  When you do that you only cause confusion because they are fundamentally different as I've explained.  I can only assume you don't understand because you're not transsexual.  I am and it's upsetting to see people trying to co-opt my life experience or at least the official term for my life experience.  Transgender folks may identify outside the binary, but people born transsexual do not.

One is either transgender or transsexual.  They are two separate things.

Quote from: Beyond on June 05, 2008, 07:17:08 AM

When it comes to self-acceptance transition is like an onion.  Just when you think you've got everything sorted out another layer is removed.  As you get farther along in your journey your view of things will change.  Compound that with this being a wide-open TG/TS board and it's no wonder we have misunderstandings like this.  It's all about context-where you are in transition and who you are (androgyne, TG, TS).


If you think it's frustrating, it's just as frustrating on my end.  I'm trying to help people, but there are a lot of lessons people just have to live/experience before they understand.  I'm not trying to drive a wedge.  Our experiences are going to differ and hence we're not the same.  I don't identify as a "transsexual" or "transgender".  I consider myself beyond (pun intended) that now, I'm simply a woman now.  Trying to explain this to you is making me wonder why I come to places like this anymore.  You're so lost in your trans forest that you can't see that for some of us there is a life outside the forest.  Some of you will find it and some of you won't.

Quote from: Lori on June 05, 2008, 06:59:53 PM
There are some people that transition and that is their life. Transsexual. You have a different view of things. You became the woman you were inside and you are nothing more or less than a woman. Transsexuality was a disease you cured, it is in your past like cancer. You are just a woman having dinner with some people that are "professional" transsexuals.

Personally I see your view because I'm doing this just to live a normal female life whatever that is. Being me..just the female version. I don't want anything to do with TS, or TS things when I'm done. Some people do and they are caught up in it and have actually turned it into an art or a lifestyle. They live drink and breathe it. You did it for a different reason and are cured and could care less about those things and are quite offended at being asked stupid questions that normal women don't have to be asked or are required to answer. First it is none of their business and second it is rude.

Quote from: Keira on June 07, 2008, 06:14:03 PM

Not caring if other's clock you, or even accept you is
a way to distance yourself from others.

I'm not so sure its courageous, or oblivious.

I actually see this kind "I don't care what the world thinks" more
often when TS start therapy and they are often mad at the world
because of their past.

The result of this is often not to good integration with society and
failed or marginal transition. Unless people actually care if
the world accepts you, its hard to integrate this world
(that's my observation).

That doesn't mean you should put your self-worth in the hands of
those outside you. But, there should be an equilibrium
between doing your own thing and being in society.

Quote from: Lori on June 09, 2008, 06:42:32 PM

Quote from: Kristi on June 09, 2008, 08:40:05 AM
Lately I see everyone making such wonderful progress.  I am genuinely happy for that!  Really.  But does anyone else feel passed up by their friends?  Personally, I am making progress, but my own circumstances dictate a slower rate, and sometimes, despite my happiness for others, I get a tinge of jealousy.  It is like being on a freeway, stuck behind a slow truck, while most of the traffic is whizzing past in the very next lane.  I have to grit my teeth wondering if I am just evil.  So am I a scum for feeling this way, or are there others who sometimes feel like this?

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi

Kate and I met at a train station. I watched her board, smiled, waved her off, said good luck, and said I would take the next train that she could have that one all to herself.  I watched in empty loneliness as her train pulled away. I wanted to be with her so bad. I stood there stiff, frightened, afraid and waited. I was too scared to get on the next train and waited some more. After several had come and gone, I  finally got on one and but for some reason I jumped off at the next station. I drifted in an empty shell of a life that seemed consumed with thoughts of transition. After a couple of years, I got a letter from Kate saying "I have arrived, when are you coming?"

I had to leave work early that day. I was talking to Meghan and Kate and she was telling me how happy she was, and just burst into tears. I cried all the way home. Jealousy? Heh....is there a more powerful word because that is what I feel. She is everything I wanted for myself and cannot figure out how to get it. 


I'm on the train again....no scratch that.

I'm in a river going over rapids surrounded by high cliffs. I'm in a rubber raft that has a couple of holes in it and its going for a wild ride. I'm in the middle of it paddling like mad and I'm looking for a safe place to bail. There is none. I have to finish the ride. I wished somebody could reach down and pluck me from the terror and pull me to safety so I could be the one looking down thinking "Who ever is crazy enough to get down there in a raft is either desperate or suicidal."

Progress is measured in steps we predefine for ourselves. What I consider progress Kristi, and what you may consider it, are two different things. For me, losing one pound and making it another day on HRT is progress. For some, it may be letting their hair grow out, or starting laser, perhaps its as simple as seeking therapy and stepping into that office for the first time.

Every little step you take towards your goal no matter how small or minute it would appear to somebody else, is indeed progress for the one individual that took that step. We must each go at our own pace. Forcing this is not going to work. One day you will decide to be happy and leave everything else behind.

It's O.k. to be a little bit selfish.

Quote from: umop ap!sdn on June 09, 2008, 11:06:45 PM
If it was "proved" to me that I'd regret SRS, I wouldn't believe it - I'd still go for it - otherwise I'd be left with an insoluble logical contradiction because I already know that I would very much regret not getting SRS. If I were 99% sure that I would not survive the procedure I'd go for it anyway since any chance no matter how tiny of being the way I should be is better than spending the rest of a lifetime as I am now.

Going for SRS means enduring a lot of pain that I don't know if I can endure. In my case I will probably have to go, alone, to a country I've never been before and that's absolutely terrifying. Since none of that is stopping me I doubt there's anything that could.

Now that I've been on HRT for a while I am sure I could not live without it. Now that I've been living full time for a while I know I could never go back - it would be worse than dying.

Quote from: Maggie Kay on June 13, 2008, 12:07:46 PM
I see transition as the cure to a lifelong disease. Why would I stop treatments for a life threatening disease? It is like asking the cancer patient to stop chemo or radiation or surgery for some obscure social or religious reason. The difference is of course, that few would argue that cancer is something to be treated but many argue that we who have such intense problems dealing with gender identity are really in distress. I find it fascinating that people who do not have our condition can proclaim with such certainty that we don't have a valid condition.

Maggie

Quote from: SA-ETwe transitioned to female because we were female...and always had been.  We didn't transition to some special gender status that includes a spectrum.  We didn't transition to some fabricated third sex.  And for dang sure we didn't transition to something that was "less than female".  We transitioned to female...period. 

Quote from: Beyond on August 01, 2008, 03:34:13 PM

Quote from: Gracie FAISE on July 31, 2008, 09:29:42 PM
Okay so, I've been having a conflict in feelings lately. I've been having trouble sorting things out in my head, so if a few of my statements are contradictory, that is why. I don't know whether this belongs here or the edge too, so move it if necessary...


I dislike being considered as/grouped with non-transsexual transgendered people.
Basically: Cross dressers and ->-bleeped-<-s. I feel... demeaned or insulted when someone says "transgendered" when they mean "transsexualism." Now, I'm not saying I dislike them. I'm not stating any prejudices or trying to belittle them. I just don't like being told or described (whether directly, indirectly, knowingly, or unknowingly) as being on the same level as them.

I feel the same way and have been attacked at times for saying so.  They fail to see the point we're making... that we're different.  In fact ALL the groups under this d*mn umbrella have little or nothing to do with each other.  So you have to ask yourself who does this label (transgender) benefit?  Two groups that I can see:

1. The general public because they are too lazy to learn about different groups.  It soooo convenient to jump lump us all together for their convenience.

2. Crossdressers.  They feel a lot of shame about their status and grouping themselves with others legitimizes them, makes them feel better.  Let me finish before you jump on me.  Most of the laws that allow us to do legal name changes, gender marker changes and get new birth certificates pre-date the rise of the word "transgender".  We earned those basic rights back in the late 60's and early-mid 70's.  Legally we became legitimized and now crossdressers want that too.  The problem being the vast majority of crossdressers have a solid male gender identity.  In my mind they have no business being in a women's restroom ever.  Sorry, just being honest.  I have no problem with crossdressers, really, but I do have a problem with them claiming to be just like us.

------------------------------------------------------------


Alicia said we should be separate from the LGB folks.  Well there are 2 problems with that:

1. Many transsexual people are gay/lesbian or bi.

2. Although we are different we ALL suffer the same discrimination heaped on us by ignorant cisgender straight folks.


I think we need to stay together as the LGBT for important political purposes; greater numbers + more power (when we're not fighting each other).


------------------------------------------------


I think we have to reclaim the word "transsexual".  And educate people as to what that adjective means.  I know a lot of people are rolling their eyes right about now.  They hate the "sex" portion.  Well that's why we have to continue to educate folks!  And you are a transsexual person.... don't be shamed by ignorant people.  "Transsexual" is the correct term because we change our bodies sex.  We have to take ownership of this word if we are to succeed.


---------------------------------------------------------


The issue I don't have an answer for is the whole "gender identity" vs. "gender expression" in legislation.  On one hand I think only "gender identity" should be used.  However, that doesn't protect butch lesbians or effeminate gays.  They need "gender expression" included.  But how do we include "gender expression" without opening a can of worms with CD's (who vastly outnumber us) possibly causing havoc?  How do you write such legislation?  I think that's the biggest bottle neck right now.  Any California folks here?  How did they deal with it in their anti-discrimination law?  Fom what I can see from the other side of the country whatever you're doing out there it seems to be working.  Am I wrong?

Quote from: gothique11 on August 06, 2008, 04:42:29 AM
Those who so call "pass" in the worlds eyes pass because passing isn't their focus. They pass because they are who they are and let that shine to the world. People notice when you're confident and see that and don't question you. But when you aren't confident, people also see that and they'll also look for those flaws as well.

Now, there is a certain level of self-respect that comes with being yourself and being happy with yourself. Being yourself doesn't mean you throw on grandma's clothes, go out with facial hair, and unzip your pants to have Mr. Ugly hang out. If you love yourself, you'll go out and find clothes and show that, you'll get electro/laser, and you'll be pretty in your own way. Surgery is also about self-love and being yourself (if that is the route you choose) because you are just being who you are.

So, the opposite extreme of not taking care of yourself isn't a manifestation of self-acceptance or self-love.

When you accept who you are, the rest follows in other words. You'll find clothing styles that fit you and your personality. You'll get ma'amed more often, and not let the odd sir's get you down. You'll find that you'll feel free and actually enjoy life and the transition process. Things will be smoother. You will do your transition for you. You will do your surgeries for you. And you'll be the happier for it.

You won't have to constantly rely on someone else view point (as it will always disappoint in the end). You won't have to spend time worrying. And you won't have to stumble as much. You can actually start on the road, be yourself, and fight for you. You'll be much stronger in the end.

Quote from: gothique11 on August 06, 2008, 03:46:38 AM
In a way, I'm not transitioning into my new vagina -- if that makes any sense at all. I feel complete and happy, but psychologically it takes time for the walls I built up to be taken apart. I realized that I have put up walls sexually with my partners in the past due to having the incorrect parts -- and now that part is gone, and the correct one is in place, the walls are slowly starting to come down.

I had a sense of something I never felt -- a sense of letting go for one moment and finally actually being part of the moment fully without walls or borders. I'm very elated to feel this way, even if I recognize that this is just the beginning.

Even non-sexually, I'm starting to notice more confidence in myself. I don't look in the mirror and question myself anymore. I'm starting to feel a sense of completion. Others are noticing it as well, and I've had a few people mention that "there's something different about you" (ppl who don't know about the surgery, ie, regular customers coming into the store). It's a wonderful feeling.

Even when I am with myself, exploring my own body and check'n out the part that should have been there from the beginning, I feel a lot of good things. Not only is there a physical change, but a psychological one was well.  It feels as if there's a lot of tensions working their way out.  I feel as if a new door has opened up. And most importantly, I feel like myself.

Quote from: DawnL on July 19, 2007, 11:37:56 PM

Quote from: asiangurliee on July 19, 2007, 08:05:09 PM
Transitioning is merely a choice.

Everything in life is a choice but there are multiple degrees of choices from the trivial (what to wear, where to eat), to the
more substantial life choices (career, who to marry, where to live, having children--and even at this level there are those who
will argue these aren't necessarily choices since children just happen, people meet soulmates, or are gifted in a particular field),
to the realm where the word "choice" becomes offensive.  People "choose" to have organ transplants but the choice is so
obvious, the need so overwhelming, that we don't talk about people choosing to have organ transplants, or cleft palates
repaired, or skin grafted on severe burns.  Yeah, those are choices but it's just plain dumb to discuss them in that light. 
For the profoundly dysphoric, I think the same standard applies.  Those other procedures are covered by insurance because
reasonable people recognize treatment as vitally necessary.  So it is (or should be) for severe GID.  Great, you want to have a
philosophical discussion about transition being a choice, that's fine, but you might also try an understand why your viewpoint
is offensive to those of us who have transitioned at great personal cost just for the chance to live a reasonably normal life. 

Dawn

Quote from: Hypatia on August 10, 2008, 12:32:08 PM
I see an important difference between identifying a particular way and merely being included within a given category based on a given trait. I am brown-eyed but I don't identify as brown-eyed. In other words, I don't feel a burning need to be marked out as different from non-brown-eyed people. I do have a burning need to be known as a woman as opposed to a man or an androgyne.

I fit into the category of transgender, but then I also fit into the category of brown-eyed people. I don't think having brown eyes can be an "identity," it's just an external trait of no particular importance. It doesn't define who I am. I don't like to say I'm "transgender," because that word is so loosely defined it doesn't mean anything to me. I also accept that there are individuals who take transgender as an identity. I have no problem with that and support them in however they identify themselves. But it just isn't what makes me who I am.

Transgender is a broad category that accommodates all of us, but it's so vague it says nothing about who an individual is. I can't see it as an identity for me.

Transsexual is specific but I consider it a medical condition, not an identity.

I use the word identity to mean not just a given trait but who I want to be known as. What I take a stand on as to where I fit into the human race. What is important to me to defend with all my might if it's called into question. It's what defines who I am.

Even though transsexual has a more precise definition, and is an accurate description of my problem, I don't identify with my problems. I'm a person.

Who I am is a woman. I really don't think a core trait of my identity can be something that differentiates me from cissexual women. I want to be known as just a woman, not as a special subcategory that sets me apart from other women. The whole point of my transsexualism-- the whole point of undergoing all this struggle, heartbreak, expense, and effort-- is simply to be a woman, not to be trans. Transsexualism has been my route to fully living my womanhood, but is not the destination.

I don't have different identities depending on the context. I'm a woman 100% of the time, same as any other woman.

QuoteBEING HONEST ABOUT YOUR PAST

Quote from: April221 on August 16, 2008, 02:28:51 PM
You are under no obligation to reveal ANYTHING about yourself that you'd prefer not to discuss. You have every right to your privacy, as a PERSON, and no one has the right to demand answers . This is not about gender. It is a basic right that we all have as PEOPLE. As a woman, and as an individual, I do not tolerate anyone speaking to me with any degree less respect than is just common courtesy.

No woman freely discusses her past, and there is no reason for you to be any different, and that's the bottom line. I will not lie, but I will not give out information concerning my past on demand either. NO ONE has the right to ask.  There are many ways of being part of a conversation without adding your self into it, and there are many ways not to answer an innocent question. Just basic conversational skills, not even evasion techniques.

It's your life, and you have the right to be as open, or as private, as you please. Many people do not discuss their past, men or women, regardless of anything. They just don't.

QuoteLIVING IN STEALTH, DOES IT HURT US?

Quote from: DawnL on October 29, 2006, 09:41:45 PM
Most of us transition hoping to lead a normal life somewhere down the road.  For some people, that may involve living as a post-op transsexual, for others, it's trying to live a normal life as a woman (or man) which often requires some level of stealth. 
I don't think anyone who has endured the rigors and horrors of transition is under any obligation to anyone so I find this idea of an implied debt to the trans community a bit offensive.  If you want to be out, be proud, be an activist, whatever, please do so--I respect your choice--but please don't suggest that I have a similar obligation.  I don't.  The choice between out and stealth should be just that, a choice, an entirely personal decision without any expectations or obligations. 

Dawn

Quote from: Svetlana on August 15, 2005, 10:53:49 AM
What I'm saying here isn't anybody's deliberate fault.

It's just... I've figured out I'm not TS.  Sure, I have the wrong genitals and I'm getting them fixed asap.  But it's now clear to me, you all think different to that.

You're TS.  I'm just a regular girl.  That's all.   As long as I call myself TS, nobody's ever going to treat me like a human being.

I'm not special.  I'm not "extra", I'm not different.  I'm a girl.  That's all there is to it!  I don't belong here.  It's abundantly clear now that I don't belong here.  Quite frankly it ought to be made a bit clearer, in case there's anybody else like me on here.

Why can't I just be some girl?  What's wrong with that?  Other girls do it.

And then I realise - the more I associate with communities, especially (unfortunately) the more inclusive ones, the more I'm effectively telling people that they have to treat me differently.  I'm giving out false signals.  I don't want to be treated seperately, yet I'm part of a group, separating me from the rest.

I'm never again calling myself trans-anything.  If people want to disbelieve my gender, they can go huff themselves.  Doesn't matter what they think - doesn't change a thing.  If they don't know what's real in life, that's their problem.  I don't have to insist I'm a woman - it's true whether I insist it or not.  So I'm going to stop bothering.

I'm not a transsexual, I'm a GIRL!!.  If you don't like it, tough.  Deal with it.  Like I said, if "deal with it!

Better I realised all this now than later.  I owed it to you all to get this off my chest, to be honest for a change, instead of being nice.  I'm not like you lot.  I'm not "female-identified".  I don't have anything to "admit" or "disclose".  I can do without the hassle.  As if I haven't got enough to deal with in the first place.

Nobody's deliberate fault.  Just the way things are.  I'm not one of you and I don't belong here.  None of you have a clue what I'm going through, because it's a completely different thing - and vice versa.  I didn't realise that until now.  It's pointless us all arguing when we're not talking about the same thing in the first place. 

Quote from: Susan on July 24, 2008, 11:56:21 PM

Quote from: Jasmine on July 21, 2008, 06:33:55 AM

Do you think it's possible for a genuine M2F transsexual to like their penis?

The answer is no it is not possible.

QuoteGender identity disorder (GID) is the formal diagnosis used by psychologists and physicians to describe persons who experience significant gender dysphoria (discontent with the biological sex they were born with).

So, If you like it, you are not A MTF TS! Sorry to anyone whose bubbles I have burst, but it had to be said.

QuoteThe current edition of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders has five criteria that must be met before a diagnosis of gender identity disorder (302.85) can be given:

• There must be evidence of a strong and persistent cross-gender identification.
• This cross-gender identification must not merely be a desire for any perceived cultural advantages of being the other sex.
• There must also be evidence of persistent discomfort about one's assigned sex or a sense of inappropriateness in the gender role of that sex.
• The individual must not have a concurrent physical intersex condition (e.g., androgen insensitivity syndrome or congenital adrenal hyperplasia).
• There must be evidence of clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.

Quote from: Steph on August 18, 2006, 05:51:43 PM

Quote from: EmThis is not the Tower of Babel, it's a TG Support Forum!

    Of course this is not the Tower of Babel, of course it is a support forum, I have never stated otherwise.  I am simply stating what "I believe".  Hmmmmm it seems you are implying that I am not being supportive, ??? and I fail to see where I have not been supportive.   Yes this is a support forum, but telling people "you go girl" and everything nice, and sugar and spice, and not the truth, is not support.

Chat later

Steph

Quote from: Leigh on June 29, 2006, 10:59:04 PM
Its easy to tell who is not real.

Put your face up close to your monitor and inhale through your nose.  You can smell the testosterone.

Except for the guys who admit they are dudes and they are forgiven.

Leigh

Quote from: Elwood on September 04, 2008, 07:02:20 PM

Quote from: Shades O'Grey on September 04, 2008, 10:18:56 AMTS folks can escape the roles of their bio-genders, but they'll end up being held to others instead. Growing up male in the US isn't all it's cracked up to be, believe me.

I don't really want to be male for the societal benefits of being male. I want my body to feel the way I believe it should. I want the pain to stop and I want my urges to "cross dress" to be urges to "dress normal" for my gender. Know what I mean? I'm biologically female, but so desperately want to be biologically male.

Quote from: Shades O'Grey on September 04, 2008, 10:18:56 AMYou want to be thought of as male? Don't ever cry.
You want to be thought of as male? Only express anger and hate and contempt. Joy is OK, if it's joy at getting laid or joy at seeing someone you hate suffer.
You want to be thought of as male? Don't desire to be loved.
You want to be thought of as male? Be prepared to make others suffer.

I struggle with all of these except the last one. The first one especially. I fee very often like crying, but a voice in my head keeps saying, "Boys don't cry, boys don't cry, boys don't cry, boys don't..."

Quote from: Shades O'Grey on September 04, 2008, 10:18:56 AMManhood and womanhood are defined both by the individual and by the society. As mentioned in another thread here, "passing" is adhering to other people's standards of what is male and/or female. It's quite the same with manhood and womanhood. We will always be judged by others; it seems unavoidable. Whether we accept the roles society assigns to our birth bodies or surgically reassigned bodies, it's still accepting roles. The only real problem I see with that would be if one is uncomfortable with the role but takes it on anyway. If one is comfortable with the role and that role makes them happy, so be it.

Passing isn't my goal in life, really. I want to be a man who blends into the crowd. Who is extraordinarily average. A guy who doesn't get stares on the street like he's some kind of freak. A guy who doesn't scare a lover because of his mixed genitals.

Quote from: Lori on December 02, 2006, 07:27:42 PM

I wished somebody was still here, unfortunatley she is not longer with us. But I will quote somthing she used to say,"If you want SRS bad enough you WILL figure out a way to get it". A person who truly wants SRS will sacrifice everything and anything to get it. It's nobodies fault but the person themself if they cannot afford it and pissing and moaning about it and blaming others online is sad.

Post Op to me is having major surgery to change your gender, in MTF its vaginoplasty, in FTM I'd say it was top and hystorectomy. So I guess I am Selfish, Shortsighted and Egocentric and I disgust you. Wich is fine with me. Somebody that sounds like a whiny crybaby that wants to blame everybody for their problems and lack of money disgusts me as well. If I want something bad enough I will work 3 and 4 jobs, overtime or figure out a way to make more money. Until a person start working towards their goal, they are either making excuses or don't want it bad enough. 

Quote from: Yvonne on September 13, 2008, 11:52:29 PM
I think the specialists in transsexuality have gone beyond reality to try to categorise who is a transsexual and who isn't, who genuinely suffers from severe gender dysphoria and who doesn't.   There are many peeps that are clearly not transsexual but they've taken over the definition of transsexual the same way they change silky lingerie or choose a new wig.  Transsexuality isn't a gag, it has nothing to do with being dressed in soft, ballerina dresses or "feeling" like a girl.  Transsexuality is a serious medical ailment and very simple to understand. Body-mind incompatibility.  Same thing with post-op GRS, it doesn't mean to remove a single testicle, half of a penis, both testicles, or a quarter of a willie!  Post-op GRS in trans gals is the lack of male genitals, testicles, penis, internal reproductive organs, and the creation of the female vulva & vagina.

Also it's possible that an inappropriate candidate may attempt to transition.  If they learn the right things to say or outright lie to their gender specialist, a non-transsexual might slip through the screening process and obtain mones, letters & GRS.

I'm just bloody tired of peeps trying to conveniently change the diagnosis of transsexuality to their advantage & in that process, I get lumped right there with them & medical coverage's denied for the peeps that genuinely suffer from transsexuality.

Quote from: Leslie on September 14, 2008, 05:30:31 AM
I want to be complete.  I want to live a normal female life without the burden of looking down and realising I have something extra natal females don't have.  I don't want to explain to anybody, the law, doctors, why I don't have a vagina. I don't want to be stopped, searched at some foreign airport & get questioned endlessly because my anatomical sex doesn't match my gender on my passport.  I want to be sexually comfortable in my own skin when I make love with my mate.  I want to go to the beach, wear a thong & not worry about whether things show or don't show.  Is that "ordinary"?

Quote from: Leslie on June 11, 2007, 12:30:50 AM
In my experience, you can only learn from persons who are at the same level of transition or further along than you are.  Most of the time, it is a challenge though since their experiences are far different from ours and thus, its difficult to form a common bond.  Its like when youre learning to play a new instrument.  Other pupils will be able to share only what they can or want to share; the rest you will have to learn yourself as you progress towards your goals.

Quote from: Hypatia on September 28, 2008, 05:52:38 AM
I am not ashamed about what I've needed to do for my health and well-being. I wish the world didn't cast me in the role of a freak, because I do not feel like a freak. To myself, I'm just a woman the same as other women. It's exasperating when the cissexual world can't see that. Susan Stryker's classic essay on transgender rage speaks to this.

Most cissexual people who haven't specifically studied how to be a trans ally are confused about who and what we really are. There's a common assumption we're the same as crossdressers who are the same as transvestitic fetishists. I've always liked art that looks at reality from a skewed angle-- the surreal, the bizarre, the avant-garde. But I'm sickened by the way artistes like Andy Warhol, Lou Reed, and David Lynch have exploited trans people on the same level as midgets and other denizens of freak shows and the fringes of society. The whole voyeuristic attitude that puts the "bearded lady" on display for rubes to gawk at. Then there's Diane Arbus. <gag!> Their works date mostly from a time when the world really had no clue about us, so in their vision, ->-bleeped-<-s and drag queens are the public image all trans people are cast in. They exploited the suffering of trans people to make their art "edgy." (These days, there's no concept in art more overused and worn out than "edgy"-- give me a break!) I am exasperated by how the word "transsexual" in the massively popular Rocky Horror Picture Show was misused as a synonym of drag queen. No wonder people are confused about who we really are.

I am exasperated by the awkwardness each time someone uninitiated finds out about my transsexualism. They're like "ohh... kayyy..." Why can't I just be just another person? Our lot has been objectification by the world. It feels churlish to complain about our cissexual allies who do their best to be supportive... but they often objectify us the most! I want to give them a clue: Your putting me in a positive light does not make up for your placing me into a category separate from other humans. Some allies, to feel like heroes defending poor us, place a stress on our otherness when that is the last damn thing I want emphasized.

You know, this thread is such an invitation to rant... I'm having an "Oh don't get me started!" moment.

Posted on: September 28, 2008, 05:45:50 pm

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Quote from: pennyjane on October 17, 2008, 10:07:21 AM
i don't get a lot of that stuff about how a woman can be so "in" on male feelings as anyone who gets a look into my feelings knows i'm trans.  it's such a large part of my experience as a human being i find it difficult to keep out of anything beyond the mundane.

by being part of diversity panels and giving talks about the trans-experince i came up with a little short story i use in my introduction.  i call it, "the mantribe".  it's a response to the question i always get..."so, you were a man...and now you are a woman?" 

essentially the story goes like this:  "no, i was never a man.  however; i was captured by their tribe as an infant and held for many years.  i was raised among them, as one of them.  i became familiar with their traits and habits and did my best to conform.  they weren't mean to me, they all treated me as one of them, the fact that i was captured from another tribe as an infant wasn't of concern to them, i was raised with them and as one of them.  but i was never at home there.  i didn't know for a long time of my birth tribe but i always suspected there was something different about me then my peers.  i found very little enthusiasm in myself about things that made the other boys tick.  i always felt distant, not quite right.  then i learned of my birth tribe...etc...etc...

this little analagous story connects with a lot of people, and i think it's really pretty accurate in the outcome.  the things i know about being a man are superficial, superimposed on a female nature.  however hard one tries to make an apple out of an orange, you might be able to paint it up and make it look pretty good, but inside it still tastes like an orange.

Posted on: October 18, 2008, 03:04:52 pm

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QuoteGender Identity: I don't understand

Quote from: nerdychick on October 19, 2008, 01:54:46 PM
Have you (generic you, those who are not trans) ever looked in the mirror and thought "hmm I'm not a bad looking gal (or guy)".... or felt good about some aspect of your physique, or had a social situation that made you think "I'm so glad I'm [whichever gender]"? When your body was changing did you wish for the changes/development to come quicker, did you welcome them when they came? For us who are trans, our bodies and the changes they go through are opposite what we hope for or expect. We don't get to feel good about about our bodies until/unless we transition.

For me I watched as I became (in my mind) uglier. I saw things happen to me that were horrifying because they were in sharp contrast to what I wanted to see happen. I heard my voice start to turn into something that sounded very bad to me, and I resisted that. I've always had an image in my head of what "I" (my essence, spirit, whatever - that which makes me me) look like; my thoughts have a definite pitch and timbre that I know is mine. None of these changes were anything like that; they weren't me, and worse they were repulsive to me. That is what's meant by "should", I think we all have that innate vision of ourselves and any mismatch with the exterior translates to emotional hardship. For some reason this phenomenon seems to be particularly intense as it pertains to gender.

Socially, we feel that our society and upbringing has pigeonholed us into a group of people we don't identify with and can't relate to. We feel more at home socializing amongst the other side of our species, but we're usually denied that and denied acceptance there. So we're taught to express ourselves in a way that is completely unnatural, and it makes us self conscious every moment of every day because deep down we know we can't keep up the act.

Quote from: Sasha2 on October 19, 2008, 12:30:01 PMI am so lost and confused and don't want to go on in this trans hell that my child is putting me through. I don't want to accept the mutilation of her physical body in order to accomadate her mental one.

Hi Sasha,

Your child needs to do this. There is a powerful inborn drive that moves transpeople towards transition and it cannot be changed. It cannot be suppressed successfully; the person will always feel this way until allowed to be themself. To say that you're going through "hell" because of it sounds so selfish; don't you want your child to have a happy life? Denial and repression are literal hell for us. Not accepting what this person must do will only drive a wedge between you both.