Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I've just watched a documentary on MSNBC. They periodically run a series called "Born In The Wrong Body", profiling trans people. This one dealt with two born males who transitioned to female and then, after years of living as women, switched back.

One had lived twenty years as a (very beautiful) woman. It was never made clear why he wanted to change back, except that he said he didn't feel "genuine." He tried to raise money with a web page called help me reverse my sex change dot org or some such. Apparently he caught a lot of flack for it. Now he is this bulked-up man and says he is happy. I don't really have a comment about him, he just sort of left me with my jaw hanging open.

The other guy i felt really bad for, though. He'd been Michelle for years, had friends, had a life, looked great. Then he started going to one of these mega churches and was convinced by the pastor and his flock that jaysus wanted him to transition back to being Michael, so he did. Three suicide attempts, a return to drug use, and minus his life and friends later, there he is. Praise the lord.  >:(

Personally, I'd much rather die than ever go back. I love my life, I love being correctly gendered. Watching this show made me speculate, for about two seconds, what it would be like to transition back, and just that was enough to make me feel physically ill. Yuck.

Stealth

Transition back to what.....Hell.  Never in a million years.  Even if I was stuck and could not get SRS, I will never go back.

Janet

Oh my god, I can't even imagine transitioning back. I feel extremely sorry for Michelle (Michael) in letting the church sway her (her seems a bit better since she regretted changing back).

Without even having gone very far I see little purpose going back.
I want to say more, but we all know the saying about if you don't have anything nice...


ps: Here is a link to the videos (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26392358/) if anybody wants to watch them.
(I don't want to inflate my post count, but I don't know of any other way to correct my links)

Quote from: Stealthgrrl on September 06, 2008, 08:50:30 PM
I've just watched a documentary on MSNBC. They periodically run a series called "Born In The Wrong Body", profiling trans people. This one dealt with two born males who transitioned to female and then, after years of living as women, switched back.

One had lived twenty years as a (very beautiful) woman. It was never made clear why he wanted to change back, except that he said he didn't feel "genuine." He tried to raise money with a web page called help me reverse my sex change dot org or some such. Apparently he caught a lot of flack for it. Now he is this bulked-up man and says he is happy. I don't really have a comment about him, he just sort of left me with my jaw hanging open.

The other guy i felt really bad for, though. He'd been Michelle for years, had friends, had a life, looked great. Then he started going to one of these mega churches and was convinced by the pastor and his flock that jaysus wanted him to transition back to being Michael, so he did. Three suicide attempts, a return to drug use, and minus his life and friends later, there he is. Praise the lord.  >:(

Personally, I'd much rather die than ever go back. I love my life, I love being correctly gendered. Watching this show made me speculate, for about two seconds, what it would be like to transition back, and just that was enough to make me feel physically ill. Yuck.

Stealth

The day I do know I have a lord permanently above me is the day I crash this infernal little gene vehicle off a cliff.

Really though... Being convinced by fear to go back only makes it worse. The other one I feel bad for and stuff, but the website thing is kind of dumb for some reason. Just strikes me that way.

Quote from: SarahR on September 06, 2008, 10:56:53 PM
Oh my god, I can't even imagine transitioning back. I feel extremely sorry for Michelle (Michael) in letting the church sway her (her seems a bit better since she regretted changing back).

You're right, Sarah. SHE seemed to truly mourn Michelle, and spoke about her and her things as one would about someone cherished and missed.

Flan, thanks for adding the links!

Yeah, Devious, I had the same reaction to the web page.

Stealth

I'm watching this now and I think Joseph was  ->-bleeped-<-c. I mean - look at him, for 20 years he got off on exotic dancing and posing nude as a female and now he got it out of his system and being a woman isn't fun anymore.

Quote from: Nero on September 07, 2008, 03:16:23 AM
I'm watching this now and I think Joseph was  ->-bleeped-<-c. I mean - look at him, for 20 years he got off on exotic dancing and posing nude as a female and now he got it out of his system and being a woman isn't fun anymore.

Wow, good point, Nero. I noticed, too, that he got all itchy to transition back when he reached the age at which he wasn't going to be a pin-up anymore. And now he's preening in the gym mirror admiring his stupid muscles.

Stealth

yep. he just wanted to be a hot babe and when he hit middle age, it was time to be he-man again.

I just want to be a hot babe. To hell with the he-man bit. So not interested in that. At all.

Although I'd settle for just being a less-than-grotesque babe.

I suppose he was fortunate to get the chance to be what some of us girls can only dream of, even if he decided to throw it away once it no longer suited him. :-\

god poor Michelle. she wasn't strong minded enough to stay as herself. she let those church people get to her.

After living as who i am for the last 8 years I have come to be proud and love the person I am. For me to go back would be like killing my best friend or my own sister. It is sad what happened to those two individuals.

Cindy

Quote from: Stealthgrrl on September 06, 2008, 08:50:30 PM
Watching this show made me speculate, for about two seconds, what it would be like to transition back, and just that was enough to make me feel physically ill

Absolutely. Just thinking about a MTF having a mastectomy gives me the shivers. That's mutilation.

Hearing about cases of regret is so strange. I recently met somebody who said that they were transitioning back MtFtM. They didn't seem to have regrets about it. I would have liked to ask them questions about it, but I thought it too prying.

Renée Richards is another who, if not having regrets, has said some strange things. She also had cold feet and had a mastectomy during transition.

I guess it all comes down to people having unrealistic expectations and fantasies of what life will be like post-transition.
It almost makes you think that there is some sense in the Standards of Care, even if it is just an impediment for most of us.

For me, the reality of being a 50 year-old woman is exactly what I expected and it's great.

Quote from: Leiandra on September 07, 2008, 03:55:58 AM
I just want to be a hot babe. To hell with the he-man bit. So not interested in that. At all.

Although I'd settle for just being a less-than-grotesque babe.

I suppose he was fortunate to get the chance to be what some of us girls can only dream of, even if he decided to throw it away once it no longer suited him. :-\

Aw, Leiandra, you could never ever ever ever be grotesque in any way. Anyone who's been lucky enough to know your heart knows that you ARE a hot babe!  :)

Nero, those church people may just as well have killed Michelle with a gun. I could just cry for that person. The way she was so proud of Michelle's things and even wanted to show the camera crew how she had decorated the bathroom, which she had left beautiful and feminine. I thought churches were supposedly about saving souls, not killing them.

Renate, Dr. Renee Richards was one reason I waited as long as I did to transition. I thought, I don't want to be some publicly confused punchline. Her life just reinforced my belief at the time, that no matter how much I wanted to be a complete woman, it wasn't really possible. Imo, she did more harm than good.

Stealth

My favorite wrong-headed quote from Renée Richards was in her recent book, "No Way Renée"
where she says that if she had been interested in women, there would have been no point in transition.

Say what? I didn't know that transition was dependent on sexual orientation!

After hearing what that pastor had to say, I have half a mind to drive over to the other coast and have a chat with him.  I could put holes in his theories.  They say God made you male, well I say God made you with a heart defect, yet you fix that, there are so many procedures that Christians don't condem.

Quote from: Gabrielle on September 07, 2008, 09:25:30 AM
They say God made you male, well I say God made you with a heart defect, yet you fix that, there are so many procedures that Christians don't condem.

:laugh: :laugh: That's SO true!

AFAIC, I stay away from churches because I don't feel the need to connect with them.  I have a personal connection to the Goddess, and she doesn't know why I was born in the wrong body, but she's proud of me for changing it.  I don't blame her for my birth defect.

And yes, I feel very sad for Michelle.  She was VERY beautiful and happy as a woman.  "Deny herself to follow jesus" ???  The church ruined her IMO.  >:(

"I miss her [Michelle] so much that my life has been a daily struggle ever since"  :icon_cry: :icon_cry:

Quote from: Stealthgrrl on September 06, 2008, 08:50:30 PM
Three suicide attempts, a return to drug use, and minus his life and friends later, there he is. Praise the lord.  >:(

That's not living, that's hell like Janet said.  Why would anyone want to go back to that?  ???

Quote from: Stealthgrrl on September 06, 2008, 08:50:30 PM
Personally, I'd much rather die than ever go back. I love my life, I love being correctly gendered. Watching this show made me speculate, for about two seconds, what it would be like to transition back, and just that was enough to make me feel physically ill. Yuck.

Completely agree sweetie.  I contemplated it once and felt dirty and violated.  I could never go back.

Quote from: deviousxen on September 07, 2008, 12:33:20 AM
The day I do know I have a lord permanently above me is the day I crash this infernal little gene vehicle off a cliff.

:laugh: Oh Xen, you really are precious my dear!  In all seriousness though I know what you mean.  ;D

As for Joseph, he should have been more careful in the first place and not transitioned.  I agree that the website was a little ridiculous and def agree with Nero that he was  ->-bleeped-<-c, he was clearly enjoying being a gorgeous woman posing and dancing, and just didn't want to become an old crone.  When you transition, you have to picture yourself 20, 30, 40yrs down the road as an old woman, and I don't think he did that.  I honestly don't feel bad for him, because he makes the rest of us ladies look back in the eyes of the general population.

Jenn

Quote from: Renate on September 07, 2008, 09:19:04 AM
My favorite wrong-headed quote from Renée Richards was in her recent book, "No Way Renée"
where she says that if she had been interested in women, there would have been no point in transition.

Say what? I didn't know that transition was dependent on sexual orientation!

What a dillweed! :laugh:

I loved women before, and I love women now. But before, I had to masquerade as something that I was not. And if I was loved or desired, I felt it was for a construct, not for myself. Now, I can give and recieve love in an entirely natural way. There's no comparison.

She must have got beaned by one tennis ball too many.  :laugh:

Stealth

I used to have dysphoria in control of my sexuality and had some  ->-bleeped-<- to an extent, but I've found out way too much about myself the last few years to question who I am again. I don't think there are simple answers to anything in transsexuality. I just know my motives to transition were never merely sexual.

I don't get any confusion about it anymore, just things that confirm it 100 times more.

I feel terribly for MtFtMs though D:

I watched most of the videos and it sticks me that both of them like to go from one extreme to another.  Josef goes for Judy ( an exotic dancer ) to Josef ( a body builder).  Micheal goes from all out Femme to biker dude.  They both were searching for inner peace.  Then the church goes along with another extreme.

I feel sorry for both as they are still unsure of who they are.  I would like to see in twenty year where they are at.

IMHO


Janet

Quote from: Stealthgrrl on September 06, 2008, 08:50:30 PM
The other guy i felt really bad for, though. He'd been Michelle for years, had friends, had a life, looked great. Then he started going to one of these mega churches and was convinced by the pastor and his flock that jaysus wanted him to transition back to being Michael, so he did.
Stealth

I had a MTF friend who ended up in a similar position (or so I would assume). After transitioning sho got work as a care assistant and after having several posts, she ended up as an assistant in a home run by nuns.

That was when the rot set in. They obviously didn't approve of her lifestyle and then embarked upon an isidious campaign of brainwashing her to the extent that she was 'converted' and began to feel guilty. The last I heard from her was that she was going to do penance for her 'sin' (can you believe it!) and (if she was a good little girl, no doubt) she might, just might, be forgiven.

That was about twenty five years ago, and nothing has since been heard from her.

Why can't people stop interfereing in the lives of others.

Religions and dangerous cults are a fine line when its only regulated by the governments dubs on things.

i quit church when I was 16 and never look back, to my own opinion I wouldn't go close to a church for as long as I desire to continue to live as Cindy. I had my other reasons for quiting the church back when I was 16 suffice it to say it did have some thing to do with certain feelings I had inside although I didn't even know what the word transsexual was back then.

I consider myself as Spiritual, I believe in the Oneness   of creation and the One Who Is All's right hand maiden, Sacred Feminine. Nature is my church.

Cindy

Both stories are pretty sad. They both seemed to tend towards extremes, I think they had some personality issues to deal with in addition to their gender dysphoria. Josef also mentioned that he found out that he was intersex, so that's different than being transsexual, but the interview glossed over this. The show was definitely looking for the most sensational angle.

Z