Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Since going full time I've experienced so much I never heard from other trans women. What I heard mostly was how wonderful life was and how great it was to finally be yourself.  I heard post surgical accounts that were filled with positive and wonderful things.  It seemed almost everyone was happy as could be.

My experience has not been so rosy.  While I will say I am happier with myself I need to also add the rest of the people in my life aren't so happy with me.

Compared to the accounts of others, surgery was brutal for me.  I've had FFS & BA.  Waking up from both, I experienced pain way beyond the limits of my tolerance. 

My GF & I have had similar experiences and we've had many a conversation wondering why neither of us ever heard from others anything like what we experienced.  Were we alone in our pain and suffering or did the other girls we know prefer not to talk about it?  Or was it something else all together?

If I knew what the realities of coming out at this time and having surgery I probably would have postponed it, for how long I can't say.  For me, losing a job I loved was the worst.  I was not prepared for that!

I'm not meaning to preach gloom and doom.  There has been a lot of wonderful times but I walked into this very unprepared even though I thought I did my homework.  The things I heard never prepared me for the things I experienced.

Julie

hi julie.  i'm sorry you didn't hear those truths you speak of.  they are being said, they're just so often drowned out by the wish and fantasy stuff.  my surgery was about as painful a thing as i've ever felt....and i've been shot twice.  i turned my hands purple holding onto the bedrails the first time the packing was changed.  it ain't gloom and doom, it's reality.  i'm glad you are passed that now and i'm sure you feel like i do, it was worth every minute of it.

transition, for me, has been a wonderful uplifting experience.  i did lose my job and i did lose my church.  those things hurt very badly, but the thing is....i had a new source of strength to deal with them...i had freedom and self-respect.  if you have self-respect then others can think hideously of you but in your heart you know better...that's a matter of great comfort to me.  of course we all want to be highly thought of and whatever the source, we hurt when we are disparaged...all human beings are somewhat validated from without, but we can't control what others think and say, we can only find our own comfort in knowing that we are good and decent people and our motives are clean.  i hope you find some strength in that.

may God bless with...

You never heard the badside of transition??


Did you ever READ a trans forum?

Well It's not a bed or rose's for sure.  I do still have a job, but with the economy as it is, well I coud be unimployed next week, very slow in the engineering world.  I had heard that FFS is very painful.  Most of the people I know that had it, well it's bad so I'm told.  I've not had it and most likely will not have it.  If I had the money and was oh 10-20 years younger, maybe.

BA yes BA is painful,  For me much more so then GRS.  But after a few days it was better and in a week or so,  Not a problem at all.

It is not easy being TS, yet we are and now that we have decided to stop hiding from ourselfs, all we can do is be who we are.  Some will understand,  Others will not and never will.  I knew that would be the case when I started Beni's wild ride.

All I can say is Hang in the Julie, and don't worry about what others feel about you.  Everyone has problems, I know I do anyway. 


Take care

Beni

I am sorry but no. I and others have been having this argument right now on the board. Some people have higher tolerances but that doesn't mean anything. Surgery in fact any trauma on the body is painful. If you aren't in pain your are on drugs or in shock. No matter how many people tell me the opposite I know it isn't true. What is true is they dealt with the pain in their own way. There is no way to compare pain even, it is always subjective. Any surgeon who would agree to operate on a patient that didn't understand this concept would be a dangerous idiot.

In terms of not knowing something went seriously wrong with your transition then. If you transitioned before the age of the internet fine but if not then you, your doctors and therapists have a lot of soul searching.

I am sorry you lost what sounds like some really important things. I hope you are happy with where you are now. I know it is hard to restart a life and the unstable times when money is tight and you either out yourself or take a lesser job just to survive. It isn't fair. I hope you don't think I am trying to put you down. I am not it just angers me to see people ignoring reality for some fantasy because sooner or later the fantasy stops and reality bites. Hopefully in time you will rebuild everything you lost and you will be further ahead then before.

->-bleeped-<-boy

Quote from: ->-bleeped-<-boy link=topic=48275.msg302037#msg302037 date=1226203797


it just angers me to see people ignoring reality for some fantasy because sooner or later the fantasy stops and reality bites.

->-bleeped-<-boy

thank you, ->-bleeped-<-boy.

I think that while yes, there is pain.  The Joy of seeing something one has only dreamt of come true, overcomes the pain.  Ask any bio Mother about child birth.  Yes there was pain, but the joy of seeing their child overcomes it.  I have had surgeries before, although not FFS, BA or SRS.

I was split like a fish from crouch to sternum for a bypass on my lower arteries.  And OMG the days afterward were horrible.  But when I realized that my legs no longer hurt I forgot the pain.

I realize that there will be pain, but I know that it will be for my sanity.  

Quote from: Julie Marie on November 08, 2008, 04:46:54 PM
Were we alone in our pain and suffering or did the other girls we know prefer not to talk about it?

In every account I've ever read, everyone reports that FFS is *brutal*... much worse than BA or SRS. I plan to avoid it ;)

My BA on the other hand wasn't bad at all. It ached for the first hour of the first few days/weeks, but wasn't as big a deal as I feared it would be. Just sore.

Sorry about the pain, but hey... congrats on getting through it all! Are you happy with the results?

Kate

I do think it entirely depends on one's pain tollerance, and complaining of pain depends on how much its taken as read that massively invasive surgery DOES hurt...

Quote from: Julie Marie on November 08, 2008, 04:46:54 PM
Since going full time... <snip>

Read my posts  ;)

And I am not referring to stuff like pain from surgery in my posts so just for you  :) Having the packing removed from SRS was about the most painful experience I have ever had in my life.  I was drenched in sweat from the sheer agony, gripping the bed rails exactly as you mentioned.  The embarrassing thing was that during this procedure the nurse who was removing the packing was doing a "how-to" demonstration for a group of nurses and she asked me if I was faking or putting on an act after she was done, in front of all the nurses of course.  She was not willing to believe the experience was painful for me and said so, to me and the nurses who watched the procedure but I had a lot of really horrible experiences in Trinidad due to just amazingly awful nurses and various other people who worked at the hospital.  It was quite evident that they had moral issues against transsexual women, disgust, revulsion, hatred...  There was some suture that went through my upper vulva, through my body where I am pretty certain it was wrapped around my soul and that same nurse spent a long time jerking on it, pulling on it, tearing on it until she broke it off and then Dr. Bowers had to come in and deal with what was left of it before pulling it out of me.  I had an intense spinal headache due to the removal of the epidural in my spine but mistakenly thought it was a bad side effect of the pain meds, so after day two or three I quit taking pain medicine.  Dilation was pure torture and removing a bloody stent from myself after dilation didn't add to the sunshine and general happiness.  But the SRS stuff was easily forgotten compared to the family issues, people I know issues, etc.  I have never been shot but before SRS I was assaulted by someone who clocked me, in a crowded club.  Everyone backed away from me so the perpetrator could have some space to do his work.  It was terrifying.  And honestly I was afraid the whole crowd was going to lunge at me and kill me.  Other than that transition has been a whimsical prance down the yellow brick road.

While I'm sorry the lot of you seem to have been in pain and suffered socially because of your transitions, it isn't always so.

After my top surgery (DI) I took three pain killers- 1 as soon as I returned home, figuring that when I woke up from my post-surgical nap I'd be sore and 1 each before suture and drain removal, figuring that each procedure would be less than pleasant.  26 hours after surgery I was up and roaming the city and continued to each day until I left, albeit with a 2 hour nap each afternoon.  I was worn out, but my pain was fairly minimal.  My hysto was more painful- three days of painkillers followed by 4 or 5 days of taking things very easy.  After 2 weeks, I was at my normal routine with just a bit of fatigue.

Socially, I was able to keep finding work in my competitive field.  My family didn't take off, my friends are all still around.  My girlfriend stuck with me 'til I cut her loose for other reasons and I found another relationship with no problems at all.

Any physical pain I experienced in the past is meaningless to me.  The only pain that matters is whatever pain I am experiencing in the moment or worse yet.. pain I am anticipating (depending on the circumstance).  But physical pain tends to be fleeting whereas emotional pain tends to linger.  It is easy for me to forget physical pain, I wish it was as easy to forget emotional injury.

FFS hurts tons.  Your skull is broken into pieces, shaved & reconstructed from scratch, at least in my case it was.  It took me about 10 months to get back on my feet again & carry on with my life.  Hopefully GRS will not be that painful; I'm hoping it will not be but if it is, the pain will be worthwile as it was with FFS.

Quote from: Jörgen on November 08, 2008, 04:52:34 PM

QuoteFor me, losing a job I loved was the worst.

What happened for you to lose it?  :-X  :o

I transitioned.  Or as one woman at work put it, I broke the rules.

Quote from: Beni on November 08, 2008, 10:02:00 PM
Everyone has problems, I know I do anyway. 

Buddha was quoted as saying everyone has 83 problems.  When one is solved another comes up to take its place.  ;D

This wasn't intended to be a whine and the people who know me here know that's not my personality.  My intention was to find out why so many transwomen don't discuss the down side of transitioning.  The women I know seem to be in a state of bliss when it comes to describing their transitional experiences.  Or maybe they just don't want to think about it. 

As my GF & I went through the most difficult parts of transitioning we both looked at each other and said, "No one ever said a thing about THIS!"  And when I looked back I thought, "Yeah, that's right."

What kept me sane while living in the old life was denial.  I often times wonder if the women I know are in denial a bit themselves when describing their experiences.  They described their experiences much like men do, statements like, "It wasn't bad" or "I was a little uncomfortable."  Women go into great detail with just about everything, men just pass over things, unless it's sports or girls.  :D  Maybe it's years of male conditioning.  I know I still have a lot of that in me.  But, according to my GF, I'm very female, and she's more woman than most GGs I know.  For something this life changing I guess I expected very detailed accounts.  Steph posted her GRS experience here a couple of years ago and it was the best account I have ever heard.  That's the kind of thing I expected from my friends.

It really doesn't matter now as I've already gone through the worst of it and I know what to expect for the remainder but for those who are coming upon this road I'm sure they would like to know what lies ahead.  I, for one, won't sugar coat the realities and I have been both honest and thorough with those who ask and will continue to be.

Julie

I can't comment on pain as I am preop but I have dealt with issues just as every other TS women have.  I have had to change jobs, ive lost my family except one or two of my siblings, but I realize that its my life to live and I choose not to dwell on the negative things that have happened.  Re living those experiences won't get me anywhere.  I try to think about the positive aspects of my life tranisition related or not.

Audrey 

Quote from: Julie Marie on November 08, 2008, 04:46:54 PM


Were we alone in our pain and suffering or did the other girls we know prefer not to talk about it?  Or was it something else all together?

The things I heard never prepared me for the things I experienced.

Julie

Hi Julie,
I had full FFS (except scalp advance) in July. I did not know what to expect other than pain and a long adjustment period. Honestly, I don't really remember the two days before or the first seven days after surgery at all. The morphine, vicodin, percocet and valium in addition to 13 1/2 hours of anesthesia the day of the operation kept me way, way out of it. I had my Mom and Laci there to help me and that really helped a lot. I am eternally grateful to the for being there for me when I really, really needed it.

I massage my chin and forehead and scalp every day. My scalp and forehead are still numb. My bottom lip and chin are slowly regaining feeling as is the tip of my nose. When people ask me if FFS was painful I say "OF COURSE!!!!" but I also tell them that I was so out of it I don't remember the pain much. I remember waking up and feeling like someone was ripping my skull apart for the first few weeks. I remember the feeling of not being able to breathe, coughing up blood clots and thinking I was dying, the bruising all over and the facial hair coming back and NOT being able to get electrolysis (I thought I was pretty much done at 150 hours). I also remember crying in the shower after like the third week when I realized that I had shadow and felt ugly.

I had a really bad few days of depression like 10 - 12 days after surgery and it gradually tapered off to mild blues then like a month later I was so focused on other stuff I just kind of worked my way out of it. I can tell you that I was probably more concerned with finding a job (my company went under) than I was transition in the three months after surgery. I've documented a lot of this stuff in my blog in excruciating (lol for my readers who read the first paragraph and don't go any further because it's wayyy too long) detail.

I feel like I was and am prepared for a tough transition. I did not go into this expecting anything to be easy. I think I got most of that thinking and foundation from reading forums posts, meeting TS in real life and talking to people I knew. I think the best thing for me was thinking I'd have it REALLY ROUGH and then kind of like adapting from there. It is tough at times, I definitely have my days. It's different now than before. Every day is met with new challenges and I feel a little more comfortable each day. I just went full-time (I wasn't even part-time or whatever) in August. I have a long road in front of me but I can tell you that will meet each day with a positive energy, I will not let transition break me of who I am fundamentally and I will move forward each day. As hard as some days might be, I need to move forward, even if it is really painful. I truly believe that we have one chance to get it right and I want to make sure I live each day like it's my last :)

Oh, and I've read your posts since I came here a year and a half ago and I don't think I've ever read anything negative or complaining or anything. You totally need to vent sometimes and get it out. Hey, start a blog! I'm sure many of us would just love to read what's going on it your life and it would probably be pretty therapeutic for you too :) Take care, k? Meghan

I began transition after my first therapist recommended against it, telling me I'd lose my job, my kids, my family, my friends, everything.  I found a gender therapist and began transition anyway, knowing some or all or none of those things might happen.  I knew all that could happen; read accounts of people it had happened to.  But I chose to transition anyway.

In my case, so far, none of those things has happened.  Could they still?  Yes.  I am prepared for that.

If I did NOT transition I have no doubt I'd be dead sooner rather than later from the constant depression and anger and discomfort.

I'm sorry you lost your job.  That bites. 


Jay

I'm sorry about your loss but who said that transition was a walk in the park?  We lose many things if not everything to be who we are.  For some peeps it's family, spouses, children, jobs but everyone loses something we hold dear along the way and not to mention the hideous pain of the surgeries we've got to go thru, being FFS, GRS, BA or what not.  Transition & surgery aren't a game & takes balls to do. No pun intended.

I didn't feel I needed FFS, the fates having been (to some degree) kind. However, I did research it, and everyone I ever heard speak about it, before I transitioned, said they woke up feeling as if they'd been hit by a truck and they wanted to die.

As for BA, it wasn't nearly so bad for me as you have described. For a short while, I couldn't lift stuff or rake the leaves or that, but it really was no big deal. My complaint is that I never regained feeling in the lower half of my breasts. All I can feel there is pain, wouldn't ya know, like if my dog sticks his paw in my boob.

The biggest surprise to me was finding out that I would cycle. Obviously, I don't bleed, but I absolutely have the bitchy/weepy thing every 4 weeks.

Another surprise was that my sense of smell noticeably improved.

Everybody is so different, sometimes pain can be down to tollerance and expectations, before I had my FFS nearly everybody told me it was going to be painful, but it turned out I looked worse than how I felt, I did look as if I'd just been run over by a train, the bandages bruising and swelling, had a lot of numbness and discolouring but got a very feminine face afterwards, my BA wasn't too bad, more soreness than actual pain, I was happy with the results.
But SRS was different, I was in no hurry at the time but my Mother was anxious that I have SRS to complete my transition, more or less told me it would be a breeze, it was anything but, I surpose I didn't expect it to be so painful, well it was for me, I remember coming round after the surgery, feeling the pressure, and the pain I thought I was going to die, then some days later having the packing removed, it looked awful, about 3months later I had a labia plastic done under a local, lots of stiches afterwards, that wasn't too bad, finally my vulva looked normal.
Its not an easy journey, I wish there was another way, but at least now Im complete, a complete WOMAN.
P 

Quote from: Julie Marie on November 09, 2008, 10:38:19 AM
I often times wonder if the women I know are in denial a bit themselves when describing their experiences.  They described their experiences much like men do, statements like, "It wasn't bad" or "I was a little uncomfortable."

Oh for sure I'm in denial, but about how GOOD things really are, not how bad. As my wife keeps reminding me, I have this penchant for melodrama (no, seriously I do!), so it's when things are going great that I can actually afford to take the time to brood and pout, lol.

But honest, for me SRS just wasn't a big deal. Of for sure it was messy and icky and time-consuming, and the sutures and catheter ached a bit, and I was sore for a long time. But it wasn't anything bad at all, and that's *without* taking any painkillers (although I took them once home, as it just gets annoying being sore 24/7 for days on end). I actually had a great time in Montreal, and was walking around the block and park next door a few days after surgery. Removing the stent was the only nasty pain, but it was over within about 3 seconds, and was more frightening than anything as I was afraid something was gonna be damaged.

BA hurt more than SRS, but only for the first few hours of the first few days. And even that was just kinda like sore muscles the day after a workout. Just really sore until the muscles loosed up for the day, not OMG! painful.

And transitioning itself? It's been a fairytale. Hallmark couldn't have written me a better experience. Work was cool with me, neighbors and relatives were all "hey, whatever makes ya happy..." about it. People I've needed to out myself to have been nothing but kind to me.

I kinda feel bad posting all this, as I don't wanna sound like I'm gloating. But I also want lurkers to know it CAN work out really well too. I'm not denying or sugar-coating it. If anything, my gazillion melodramatic posts here make it sound *worse* than it really was. Strip away all my fears and emotions and OMG WHAT IF? worries, and transitioning for me was actually uneventful in Real Life, practical terms.

Kate

Julie, I think I have responded to your question before you had surgery. I didn't have FFS or BA. I have only had GRS. It was just uncomfortable to me. I do have a high tolerance to pain due to things that have happened to me as a child. I do know that everyone is different and that pain scale that they talk about is really an individual account of your pain.

Im preop so I still have alot of pain to look forward to all the surguries + electrolysis but im not unfamilar with pain i was in a severe car wreck and had 3 broken lims my right heel was crushed into 4 pieces they said it looked like someone had hit it with a hammer as hard as they could. Due to my bodies resistance to narcotics ill not get any post surgeory pain relief either, but whoever said you get over physical pain faster than emotional is right i rember it hurt like hell (my accident was back in feb 8 2007) but can't remember the actual pain just that it did hurt. Beside people have varying pain tolerances I also find personaly that pain is relative to type and area ie certain parts of the body are more sensitive for some than that area is for others my weak spot personaly is my ears and type in that there is differneces in say bone pain versus intestinal pain they both hurt alot but it is a differnet kind of hurt from the other.

Quote from: Julie Marie on November 08, 2008, 04:46:54 PM
Since going full time I've experienced so much I never heard from other trans women...

My experience has not been so rosy.  While I will say I am happier with myself I need to also add the rest of the people in my life aren't so happy with me.

Compared to the accounts of others, surgery was brutal for me...I experienced pain way beyond the limits of my tolerance. 

My GF & I have had similar experiences and we've had many a conversation wondering why neither of us ever heard from others anything like what we experienced.  Were we alone in our pain and suffering or did the other girls we know prefer not to talk about it?  Or was it something else all together?

For me, losing a job I loved was the worst.  I was not prepared for that!


Julie

You and your GF are certainly not the only ones who have had a bad time.  I think that maybe there are lots and lots of us you don't see on the forums, simply because they are so desperately in survival mode, they don't have the time for forums.  Or maybe they can't afford computer OR internet access.

My experience has not been so rosy either, Julie.  I KNOW what it is like to have that kind of pain. 
The pain part of it.....well, I have had genital surgery in the past, and I was in severe pain, like pain I couldn't deal with.  Well, I'm here now, so it didn't kill me.  This year I'll have additional genital surgery, going into it knowing that it will be as painful.  Why?  Well.....because I have to.  I'm driven by my GID.  Even if the pain is as bad, I will do it.

I know what it's like to lose almost all my friends, because they cannot "deal with it".  Over time, though, I've made new friends, who like me for who I am. 
The biggest 'rosy' part of my experience has been with my family.  I managed not to lose the love or connection to any of them, and my marriage is better than ever.  Okay....enough of the 'rosy' part.

I know what it's like to be discriminated against because of my 3rd class citizenship......a transitioned mtf.  Yes, I lost my job because of it, even though I work for a company with a zero tolerance diversity policy, like you!  I have a bigot for a GM, and he didn't care about 'policy'.  Did you pursue legal action?  I did.  I really can't discuss it here on the forums, because I believe some of my coworkers read my posts here from time to time.  I will say that I got my job back, with back pay, and no interruption in my tenure there.  My coworkers cheered my coming back, because I was not the only person to be discriminated against.  I don't believe it, but I've have a number of people tell me that I'm somewhat bullet-proof now. Yeah....I don't believe that for a minute.

Anyway, the pain goes away, after a long enough time. 
You had the courage to transition, so I'm sure you have the courage to stand up for yourself, and not let people treat you like sh#t.  You and I are about the same age.  I'm 58 (today, actually!), and I am digging in for the long haul at my workplace.  I know how hard it will be to find something at my age, especially where there are discrepancies in my gender markers between MVA, IRS, health insurance, etc.

If you want to share stories about losing a job, or getting one back, let me know.  I'll email my phone number, and I can talk without a written public record.


Bev