Susan's Place Transgender Resources

That's right.  I held no political opinion during the elections.  Now I have one, now I'm going to complain

I can't say I like Obama, he's way too young and couldn't even complete his term in congress before abandoning it to go play with bigger things. He's full of lies already. But hell, that's politics. The sad thing is this country and the people in it. The mentality isn't, "what can I do for my nation" it's, "what can my nation do for me." I'm going to say something blasphemous: I'm ashamed to be an American.

This is going to be a tough 3 years to endure, although I doubt he'll last till then.  Just in his first 100 days he's made a complete idiot of himself and even the liberals are starting to admit to it too.

To all you who were Obama crazy, it's time to start using your heads and admitting that this dude is going to get our troops killed and our schools blown up by setting terrorists free, he's going to destroy the economy even more by pouring money into, "preventive medicine."  As if, as long as fried chicken and burgers are the primary diet for Americans then there's no amount of medicine that will fix their diabetes and hypertension.  It's just going to blow $8000 a month on every fat slob in the country and let them live a few more years so they can keep eating their fried chicken and popping expensive friggin pills and insulin.  Obama's word is going to mean zilch, nothing, zero if he keeps pulling statistics and statements out his butt and not publishing citations or sources for his statements.  He keeps yanking his own chain and making a fool out of himself in front of the entire country.  Then again, that's irrelevant as long as people have their fried chicken and anxiety medicine, right?  They'll believe anything he says...

He might SAY he's going to do all this crap for us, but who's he kidding?  The day that gays can enlist will be the day that 1/2 of the USMC and USArmy go AWOL. 

What about some of this other stuff?  More money for education?  Mmkay, this is what's happening in the school district in my area: my boss's wife is a regional supervisor for the district here.  She had to tell all of her principals to choose 7 teachers and lay them off.  Wow, that's great for education!
He's so against the war?  He's projecting we're only going to spend $50 billion in the desert each year?  Dude, what the hell, this is the dude that talked crap for 6 years about the war  but then voted for spending in Iraq.

Change, change, change.  It's all he could talk about.  I'm seeing change already, and I don't like it.  Who is this guy trying to kid?  The entire planet?


Who am I even kidding?  Any of you Canadians want a roommate?

Obama never voted for the going to war -- he wasn't in the senate yet.

And there are gays in the military, always have been - matter of fact, the military is very much a men 4 men and no women allowed kind of place.  The only question is if they can be open or not.

Quote from: Ketsy on May 01, 2009, 02:13:05 AM
Obama never voted for the going to war -- he wasn't in the senate yet.

He made a speech in 2002, over six years ago, against the war.

http://usliberals.about.com/od/extraordinaryspeeches/a/Obama2002War.htm (http://usliberals.about.com/od/extraordinaryspeeches/a/Obama2002War.htm)

And then he voted in for more money to support it.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/04/09/obama.war.funding/ (http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/04/09/obama.war.funding/)

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Post Merge: May 01, 2009, 02:24:50 AM

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Quote from: tekla on May 01, 2009, 02:18:08 AM
And there are gays in the military, always have been - matter of fact, the military is very much a men 4 men and no women allowed kind of place.  The only question is if they can be open or not.

I've got a lot of friends in there, most of my friends are military.  Most of my friends would refuse to bunk with a, "->-bleeped-<-."

Sure some wouldn't mind, but even so, "macho correctness" will always overcome, "political correctness" in the us military.

Right buy you said "who VOTED for it in the first place" and he didn't.  He's been very clear that he would have voted no if he had been in the senate, but once the troops were already there he wasn't going to vote against funding them.

I've got a lot of friends in there, most of my friends are military.  Most of my friends would refuse to bunk with a, "->-bleeped-<-."

But oddly enough they are friends with you, and several have been your lovers.  Things that make you go "hmmmm'.

Quote from: tekla on May 01, 2009, 02:27:52 AM
I've got a lot of friends in there, most of my friends are military.  Most of my friends would refuse to bunk with a, "->-bleeped-<-."

But oddly enough they are friends with you, and several have been your lovers.  Things that make you go "hmmmm'.

Nope, not lovers.  They just love the food I cook and the support I give: I'm one of the few people who will invite someone over to my house and cook for them solely for the fact that they're serving my country and putting their lives on the line.  That's why I'm buds with a lot of them.

lets see, its only been what......-counts-.....four months since he entered office, give the man a chance.  At least he is trying, and spending money on things that make sense and not just on war/oil/his corporate buddies.  But before we bash the crap out of him, lets let him have at least a year, because things in government take time.

Also, as far as economy goes, well no one really understands it despite what any of them say, its an unpredictable thing because its based on human spending.  the only predictable part is that the more people have money the more they spend, so wouldnt it  make sense to create more jobs for people, they spend and that helps the economy.  I hardly see how this is a bad thing.

and yes, there are many gays in the military, its not something that often gets you kicked out anymore, ask an army/marine/navy/air force soldier some time, they will verify it too.

Money for education is good too, and more scholarships for teaching degree's come out every day, good for me, I'm a music education major.

As for him voting for the war, impossible considering he wasn't in office.  As for his support for funding, yes, he supported funding for body armor and things to help the troops to keep them alive, hardly anything bad as I can see it.

As for people and their gluttony, that's a part of America, and it will take years to uproot, but as more and more people give education into ways to lose weight and eat healthier, more people lose weight.  More and more education about proper diet and exercise exist every year, they are creating it for a reason, the more people know the more they can do with their life.

It seems you need to do a bit of research before you start bashing someone, although its not entirely surprising, most of the people who complain and bash the most don't even do their research.  When you go off of hearsay, it kind of skews your view on the matter.  But if you hate it here so much, then go to Canada, just know their citizenship system is a pain like any other countries, so good luck.

Hearsay?  I'm on the front lines in the pharmacy dealing with all this medicaid and medicare CRAP.

I'm on the front lines there.

That comment about the military?  Already addressed.

That comment about the education?  Already addressed.

100 days in and already screwing up.

I'm going to let my brother James have his say on this thread in a min.

Spending money on things that make sense...

QuoteOBAMA: "Number one, we inherited a $1.3 trillion deficit. ... That wasn't me." — in Missouri.

THE FACTS:

Congress, under Democratic control in 2007 and 2008, held the purse strings that led to the deficit Obama inherited. A Republican president, George W. Bush, had a role too: He signed the legislation.

Obama supported the emergency financial bailout package in Bush's final months — a package Democratic leaders wanted to make bigger.

To be sure, Obama opposed the Iraq war, a drain on federal coffers for six years before he became president. But with one major exception, he voted in support of Iraq war spending.

The nonpartisan Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget has estimated Obama's policy proposals would add a net $428 billion to the deficit over four years, even accounting for his spending reduction goals. Now, the deficit is nearly quadrupling to $1.75 trillion.

___

OBAMA: "I think one basic principle that we know is that the more we do on the (disease) prevention side, the more we can obtain serious savings down the road. ... If we're making those investments, we will save huge amounts of money in the long term." — in Missouri.

THE FACTS: It sounds believable that preventing illness should be cheaper than treating it, and indeed that's the case with steps like preventing smoking and improving diet and exercise. But during the 2008 campaign, when Obama and other presidential candidates were touting a focus on preventive care, the New England Journal of Medicine cautioned that "sweeping statements about the cost-saving potential of prevention, however, are overreaching." It said that "although some preventive measures do save money, the vast majority reviewed in the health economics literature do not."

And a study released in December by the Congressional Budget Office found that increasing preventive care "could improve people's health but would probably generate either modest reductions in the overall costs of health care or increases in such spending within a 10-year budgetary time frame."

___

OBAMA: "You could cut (Social Security) benefits. You could raise the tax on everybody so everybody's payroll tax goes up a little bit. Or you can do what I think is probably the best solution, which is you can raise the cap on the payroll tax." — in Missouri.

THE FACTS: Obama's proposal would reduce the Social Security trust fund's deficit by less than half, according to the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center.

That means he would still have to cut benefits, raise the payroll tax rate, raise the retirement age or some combination of these measures to deal with the program's long-term imbalance.

Workers currently pay 6.2 percent and their employers pay an equal rate — for a total of 12.4 percent — on annual wages of up to $106,800, after which no more payroll tax is collected.

Obama wants workers making more than $250,000 to pay payroll tax on their income over that amount. That would still protect workers making under $250,000 from an additional burden. But it would raise much less money than removing the cap completely.

___

OBAMA: "My hope is that working in a bipartisan fashion we are going to be able to get a health care reform bill on my desk before the end of the year that we'll start seeing in the kinds of investments that will make everybody healthier." — in Missouri.

THE FACTS: Obama has indeed expressed hope for a health care plan that has support from Democrats and Republicans. But his Democratic allies in Congress have just made that harder. The Democratic budget plan that Congress passed Wednesday gives Democrats the option of denying Republicans the normal right to block health care with a Senate filibuster. The filibuster tactic requires 60 votes to overcome, making it the GOP's main weapon to ensure a bipartisan outcome. The rules set by the budget mean that majority Democrats could potentially pass health care legislation without any Republican votes, sacrificing bipartisanship to achieve their goals.

___

Associated Press writers Matt Apuzzo, Kevin Freking and Jim Kuhnhenn contributed to this report.

We got a monkey as president.  First a cowboy, then a monkey, oh well.  Hopefully this one won't last for 8 years.

Honestly, I have to say I agree with it. Obama might claim that he wouldn't have voted for it, but if you recall the primaries, he couldn't seem to get an honest word out. He and Hillary both kept lying and getting caught by one another and the reporters. So, all in all, he seems to be keeping suit with his track record, well... no. He HAS no track record, and can't seem to be honest enough to even tell us where he's guiding us. Over 50% of the people I know that voted for him, did so either because of his skin color, good looks, or simple oratory. He talks a good talk, turns around and does his own thing.

As for gays in the military, I've heard some very good explanations for that, similar to the ones for no women. It has nothing to do with whether or not they can fight, or do their part. It has to do with how the men who comprise the vast bulk of it would react. With women, they tend to do stupid things to be heroes, or to show off... with gays, because they don't want to worry about the man beside them, when they're already being shot at by the guys in front of them. That, and there is a fairly high percentage of homophobes in the armed forces.

I'd bet, and can prove it, that 50% of the people voted for him because the alternative offered was much, much worse - if not an out and out joke.  The 'pubs ran a guy that the majority of his own party didn't like.   Nothing more complex than that. 

either way, bash obama in his first moments of presidency all you want, the alternative was worse.  This country didn't need another prescot/bush cronie to give the rich minority all the tax cuts they want, keeping us reliant on war and middle eastern oil.  The Bush family and republicans have run the highest deficit records of our history, 9 out of the 10 highest deficits.  Do you really think that was any better for this country, keeping us spending money in other countries, dropping off education just to fund the killing of our own citizens for a war of greed?

Not to mention the fact that McCain probably would have died in office to leave us with that moron of a woman to run the country, the woman didn't even understand how politics worked properly, thinking she was good with foreign policy because Russia was across a straight from her.  You have issues with Obama not answering anything honestly or straightly look at her.

Do you really think that that party would have been any better.



Oh, and we cant forget the irreperable damage that particular administration would have done to our cause, if McCain and Palin had been voted in, we would be set back another 8-10 years of work.

Just wait when we recover from this recession.

Actually that should be written apear to recover.

All that money is due in the future.

Welcome to the world of inflation and high interest rates.

BUt for now the deflation and unemployment is "good" enough.

Seems Iraq is also turning violent again. What are we up to now 2 car bombings a day?

Also Obama grovels before hostile foreign heads of state.

In the end the '08 campaign will come back to haunt him. He made so many promises to people. In both what he would and would not do, that his fall will come soon enough.

I just hope were not bankrupt or worse off dead before all is said and done.

Polls are showing that people like Obama, but dislike his policy proposals. In fact his latest primetime variety show numbers are down 29%.

In closing welcome to Corporate Fascism y'all!!!!

Quote from: tekla on May 01, 2009, 02:46:10 AM
I'd bet, and can prove it, that 50% of the people voted for him because the alternative offered was much, much worse - if not an out and out joke.  The 'pubs ran a guy that the majority of his own party didn't like.   Nothing more complex than that.

Absolutely, which is why I refused to vote because both choices sucked.  I complained about then.  Well now it's been decided and since both would have sucked anyways and this one sucks as much as the other one would have, then I'm gonna complain just so I can point out the stupidity of your average American.  Friggin stupid mofos racking up their credit cards and eating their stupid burgers and saying how the LOVE Obama without know a friggin goddam thing about him or his platform(which changes by the day) or his well, short political track record that's getting worse by the week everytime he opens his friggin mouth on television.

What you are claiming is that either it was a unanimous vote, or that his own party did not vote for him. for 50% to vote due to an unpopular republican candidate, while he was not my first choice, the math simply doesn't add up. Or a third option, which is that over 75% of the country is republican, which we've seen time and time again isn't the case.

Please present proof, and not in the form of a poll or survey with less than 500,000 participants, as those are fairly unreliable, and present a small percent of the actual figures.

I'm not saying that the figures I presented are accurate across all of America, but for the 40-50 people I spoke to concerning the election in my college, yes, those figures are accurate.

McCain might not have been the first choice for many republicans, and his VP was fairly controversial too, as she was WAY too honest, but, I'd rather have someone who is honest, and tells us where he's going, and sticks to it, than a liar with a silver tongue.

McCain did have an established track record, military history, and no variance about his voting record. Obama doesn't have any of that. He does have a list of goals for the country... Have you ever read them. Some of them sound quite nice, Others... to be quite honest, scare me. I don't like the idea of a government-run militia larger than our military, on domestic grounds. That reeks of military takeover.

His health care ideas, while appealing, really aren't feasible. What medicaid is doing in South Carolina, seems to be working MUCH more effectively, as prior to 2008, the average medicaid patient was receiving an average of 2000 dollars in free medicine, paid by the hardworking American. Now, they get an average of less than 400 a month, and are still doing well as far as health care.

Please feel free to dispute anything I say.

Quote from: KelarDrioktain on May 01, 2009, 03:02:39 AM
What you are claiming is that either it was a unanimous vote, or that his own party did not vote for him. for 50% to vote due to an unpopular republican candidate, while he was not my first choice, the math simply doesn't add up. Or a third option, which is that over 75% of the country is republican, which we've seen time and time again isn't the case.

Please present proof, and not in the form of a poll or survey with less than 500,000 participants, as those are fairly unreliable, and present a small percent of the actual figures.

I'm not saying that the figures I presented are accurate across all of America, but for the 40-50 people I spoke to concerning the election in my college, yes, those figures are accurate.

McCain might not have been the first choice for many republicans, and his VP was fairly controversial too, as she was WAY too honest, but, I'd rather have someone who is honest, and tells us where he's going, and sticks to it, than a liar with a silver tongue.

McCain did have an established track record, military history, and no variance about his voting record. Obama doesn't have any of that. He does have a list of goals for the country... Have you ever read them. Some of them sound quite nice, Others... to be quite honest, scare me. I don't like the idea of a government-run militia larger than our military, on domestic grounds. That reeks of military takeover.

His health care ideas, while appealing, really aren't feasible. What medicaid is doing in South Carolina, seems to be working MUCH more effectively, as prior to 2008, the average medicaid patient was receiving an average of 2000 dollars in free medicine, paid by the hardworking American. Now, they get an average of less than 400 a month, and are still doing well as far as health care.

Please feel free to dispute anything I say.

your right about all you said with McCain, the problem is, once he started running for president, he only seemed to follow on Obama's ideas that worked.  I would rather has someone that changes views based on a situation, then someone who just follows what other people say, we do not need another puppet for a president.

As for the medicare for south carolina, that is just amazing, its nice to see a cut in costs that doesn't hurt anyone.

But any way you see it, me personally would like to see where he is going, instead of just bashing him 4 months into his presidency.  Can we say jumping the gun and being impatient at all?
I will say it again, give the man some time before you trash on him.  If you just keep bashing now, all your doing is looking for a scapegoat to throw your irritations at, or just a reason to complain.  Give him some time to do things, if it all goes to hell bash all you want, but at least give him a chance.  Not like you have any choice in the matter.

The thing is, it's ALREADY gone all to hell.  And Obama's plans for fixing this hell he's inherited are only going to mess it up even more.  It's easy to look into the future and the experts agree, federal agencies of finance and borough of labor, etc.  After all he yapped his mouth, he should be doing a LOT more than just screwing junk up even more on TOP of yanking his chain further.

It's headed for disaster, hence why I'm ready to leave.

This is quite true. I did not start the thread, merely stated that I agreed with it.

I can't find any huge flaws in it, except for the aforementioned statement that he voted for the war directly. Due to his track record, nobody can say whether he would or would not have voted for it.

I'm all for giving him a shot, to be honest, do we really have any choice in the matter? We're supposed to, but then, that's in the constitution, which we did away with in the 60's and 70's...

If we wanted to change the government peacefully, while we have the right to, and the tools to, would the present government really allow it? We've given them enough tools to stop any attempt, unless the enough of the military sided with the people, and were willing to risk their lives and disobey orders...

So, we'll sit here and watch, while he does his thing, and hope he doesn't screw it up too badly, and just maybe, keeps his word on half the things he's promised...

Has there been a President in the last 50 or so years that wasn't a screw up?

Quote from: Annwyn on May 01, 2009, 03:21:39 AM
The thing is, it's ALREADY gone all to hell.  And Obama's plans for fixing this hell he's inherited are only going to mess it up even more.  It's easy to look into the future and the experts agree, federal agencies of finance and borough of labor, etc.  After all he yapped his mouth, he should be doing a LOT more than just screwing junk up even more on TOP of yanking his chain further.

It's headed for disaster, hence why I'm ready to leave.

well if your so dead set on leaving, then go ahead, because you whine and moan about stupid Americans that think "what can the govt do for me" and not "what can i do for the govt" yet your doing the exact thing.  "oh, its all heading to disaster, im leaving."  its the exact same mindset that you were earlier having issues with.  If your going to leave leave, if your going to complain, then do something about it instead of just venting at people.  Why not try and work yourself above the Americans that you spurn, instead of just following in their footsteps.

So many people have issues with complaining, do you have any good ideas, and if you do, why don't you run for president and try to do this country right.  If your not willing to do anything about it, then don't bother complaining because its not just your fellow citizen's fault or the presidents fault, it is your own as well.  We are all in this together, and we are all part of everything that goes wrong and right in it.

oh, and kelar, sorry if the final paragraph in my last post seemed directed at you, i more just meant it as a general statement not specifically towards you.  Apologies if it seemed directed specifically at you.

QuoteI held no political opinion during the elections.

Does that mean that you did not vote?  If No, then don't bitch.  You had a chance to voice your opinion at the polls.

Second, it has only been 100 days, and it is a known fact it will take the first two years to show his metal.  Anything that happens with in that time is the previous administration.

Janet

QuoteAbsolutely, which is why I refused to vote because both choices sucked.  I complained about then.

Which is why you will always be behind all talk and no action.

I think they have ya on the "not bother to vote" bid-ness there, Ann. :)

As for the rest, I have to admit that I just love reading the marred regurgitations of Michelle Malkin, Bill O'Reilly, Rush Limbaugh, Mike Savage, Michelle Bachman, Ann Coulter and Sean Hannitty.

This all happened once before and not that long ago. In 1992 the Right and the Pubes decided that they were gonna get totally pissed with the electorate because 40% of the people had the gall to vote for someone other than Bush I. And another 20% voted for a Texas dwarf who said he could personally turn the country around. O my, the sky fell.

And actually it sorta did. The policies of Reagan/Bush were carried forward at a very substantial speed with Clinton and then Bush II, Cheney, Ashcroft and crew came in and pretty much did away with anything that even remotely resembled constitutional government while y'all ate that crap as if it were cheerios. Yum.

Of course, this time they are truly pissed because dammit they had the country right where they wanted it: 2 wars, a huge housing bubble that they truly thought would go on forever and regardless of the unconstitutional actions of those who were running the show and their intent to bankrupt the goverment completely they, instead, bankrupted each other and needed some serious government assistance which, of course is nothing at all like the AFDC/TANF benefits they convinced y'all were bankrupting the country and giving away "free money" to those who didn't deserve it.

Well, now the piper's being paid and trust me, bad as it will get for Obama it will be worse for the know-nothing Pubes who will be all into crawling under people's blankets to see how many people are in bed with them and trying to find ways to transfer the remaining 35% of real-wealth in the economy to the top 10% of the population.

And fascinatingly they'll manage to bamboozle a lot of you just as they managed to do the first times around because, quite honestly, they know a group of shills when they see them. Too many of y'all don't seem to get the fact that they think that y'all are not deserving of any wealth. None, Zip. Zilch. Their only concern is that they and their children have all the wealth (different than money.) And, of course, y'all agree with them thinking that somehow you're gonna manage to be seen for the brilliant and worthy person who should be right there with them. :laugh: :laugh: OK, with y'all as examples of political sophistication and insight I'm reasonably sure that they'll manage to keep y'all on that leash forever. Y'all never learn nuthin'.

So, y'all please do go to Canada where maybe someone might teach you something about your own best interests and how you've been eating those cheerio-lookin' pieces of crap. But, to tell the truth, I doubt it.

Instead you'll wind up eating this stuff till the day ya die because when it comes right down to it you never learn nuthin.' At least not politically. Here's to ya.

Things will get worse before they get better; especially since Obama seems more than willing to trust the thieves to be in total charge of the banks. And since y'all are so eaten up with moronic platitudes spouted by the lackies (who are invariably quite well-paid) of those who've stolen most of the value from everything here and placed it tidily in their own trust-funds and properties over the past twenty-nine years (in some cases for longer than many of you've been alive, let alone "thinking") I would imagine that you'll never realize what hitcha. Haven't yet obviously.

Mencken was righter than he knew "no one ever went broke underestimating the taste of the American people." He should have added the corollary: no one ever worried about under-estimating the bone-moronic economic understanding and the political sophistication of the American public. 

Nichole

Quote from: Nichole on May 01, 2009, 08:56:10 AM
I think they have ya on the "not bother to vote" bid-ness there, Ann. :)

As for the rest, I have to admit that I just love reading the marred regurgitations of Michelle Malkin, Bill O'Reilly, Rush Limbaugh, Mike Savage, Michelle Bachman, Ann Coulter and Sean Hannitty.

This all happened once before and not that long ago. In 1992 the Right and the Pubes decided that they were gonna get totally pissed with the electorate because 40% of the people had the gall to vote for someone other than Bush I. And another 20% voted for a Texas dwarf who said he could personally turn the country around. O my, the sky fell.

And actually it sorta did. The policies of Reagan/Bush were carried forward at a very substantial speed with Clinton and then Bush II, Cheney, Ashcroft and crew came in and pretty much did away with anything that even remotely resembled constitutional government while y'all ate that crap as if it were cheerios. Yum.

Of course, this time they are truly pissed because dammit they had the country right where they wanted it: 2 wars, a huge housing bubble that they truly thought would go on forever and regardless of the unconstitutional actions of those who were running the show and their intent to bankrupt the goverment completely they, instead, bankrupted each other and needed some serious government assistance which, of course is nothing at all like the AFDC/TANF benefits they convinced y'all were bankrupting the country and giving away "free money" to those who didn't deserve it.

Well, now the piper's being paid and trust me, bad as it will get for Obama it will be worse for the know-nothing Pubes who will be all into crawling under people's blankets to see how many people are in bed with them and trying to find ways to transfer the remaining 35% of real-wealth in the economy to the top 10% of the population.

And fascinatingly they'll manage to bamboozle a lot of you just as they managed to do the first times around because, quite honestly, they know a group of shills when they see them. Too many of y'all don't seem to get the fact that they think that y'all are not deserving of any wealth. None, Zip. Zilch. Their only concern is that they and their children have all the wealth (different than money.) And, of course, y'all agree with them thinking that somehow you're gonna manage to be seen for the brilliant and worthy person who should be right there with them. :laugh: :laugh: OK, with y'all as examples of political sophistication and insight I'm reasonably sure that they'll manage to keep y'all on that leash forever. Y'all never learn nuthin'.

So, y'all please do go to Canada where maybe someone might teach you something about your own best interests and how you've been eating those cheerio-lookin' pieces of crap. But, to tell the truth, I doubt it.

Instead you'll wind up eating this stuff till the day ya die because when it comes right down to it you never learn nuthin.' At least not politically. Here's to ya.

Things will get worse before they get better; especially since Obama seems more than willing to trust the thieves to be in total charge of the banks. And since y'all are so eaten up with moronic platitudes spouted by the lackies (who are invariably quite well-paid) of those who've stolen most of the value from everything here and placed it tidily in their own trust-funds and properties over the past twenty-nine years (in some cases for longer than many of you've been alive, let alone "thinking") I would imagine that you'll never realize what hitcha. Haven't yet obviously.

Mencken was righter than he knew "no one ever went broke underestimating the taste of the American people." He should have added the corollary: no one ever worried about under-estimating the bone-moronic economic understanding and the political sophistication of the American public. 

Nichole

lol you go girl!! (https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fthe-big-bang-theory.com%2Fimages%2Fsmflags%2FUnited_States.gif&hash=522e331f4b7a15692a121a3c01888bb5b2ea7505)
Oops, edited the wrong post by mistake. :) I knew I was editing my own words. :) Just on the wrong post. -- Nichole

Well said Nichole :) Here in the rest of the World we have looked on in horror at what has happened in the US.

Hate to break it to you hun, but not all of us are bone-moronic. I've said little and done less, because I'm still in school, working on getting my doctorate, so that the average person will take me seriously when I speak.

I realize that the people who have the wealth, have it for a reason, and the fact that they have it, makes it that much easier to hang onto it, and gives them the tools they need to grab the remaining little pieces and argue over it, whilst convincing the rest of the ignorant masses that they are doing a just cause, and they'll get the crumbs if only they'll side with the current puppet/thief.

My objection to Obama, is that he's a smooth enough talker, that he's doing the job much better. That, and he has about the same brains and political sense as the previous administration, while the media chalks him up as the savior of the country, while he manages to mangle things that he shouldn't be having trouble with. His goals are frightening, thankfully he seems inept enough that he won't get his bigger ones into realization.

"The average person will believe any lie you tell them, either because they want it to be true, or because they fear that it is true" (Goodkind) The media has made a business destroying America, and blinding us to that they are doing, by providing the proper scandal to cover up any major crimes. (I.E. Clinton with nuclear weapons technology, who ->-bleeped-<-ing  cares if the man can't keep his pants up, I'm more concerned with the fact that suddenly, thanks to our government, we can be targeted by a nuke in less than 15 seconds, and they now have the range to get here....)

I doubt a multiyear repeat of vietnam was what anyone in upper administration had in mind. Admittedly the reasons for the war were silly, I'd have gone in with spec ops to get the same job done. Nobody can deny that we've done that country a lot of good. We need out, but the Bush admin made the mistake of promising to help them turn the country around.

And yes, the economy is mostly the result of complete and utter idiocy on the part of the American people. If the media says we're in a huge depression, than dammit we must be! Stupidity... There was no huge spike in unemployment, not like the great depression which hit 35% unemployment if I'm not mistaken. People just decided to hang on to their money, because "depression" had struck. Employers THEN started laying people off..... less than 2% of the population, but then people started to get scared, and it was a convenient excuse to not give raises, etc... CVS for instance, is making just as much money as it was prior to all the depression nonsense, and yet they are withholding all raises greater than 2%, wanna know where that money is going? Two places, expansion, and bonuses for the upper corporate money-grubbers.

Quote from: Rachel on May 01, 2009, 03:45:03 AM
you whine and moan about stupid Americans that think "what can the govt do for me" and not "what can i do for the govt" yet your doing the exact thing.  "oh, its all heading to disaster, im leaving."  its the exact same mindset that you were earlier having issues with.  If your going to leave leave, if your going to complain, then do something about it instead of just venting at people.  Why not try and work yourself above the Americans that you spurn, instead of just following in their footsteps.

Why do you think I'm putting in 60 hours a week at work on top of being a med student?

Jeez, out of all the people, at least show some gratitude, I put in my taxes and spend my income into an economy that's failing, I don't take out of federal spending like Medicaid as appealing as it would be because I work in the system and know HOW I could get the system to pay for my hormones and my surgery, but I don't.  I could go out and get high like I really want to, but instead I invest money in exercise and anime and other things so that I know my money is getting back into the flow instead of going out to other countries in drug money and crap.  I do as much as anyone does for my country, so's my brother Kelar, so STFU.

Half the people on this forum can't say they do as much as I do, and the other half that can aren't the ones I'm talking about and I'm sure agree with me for the most part.

"Hate to break it to you hun, but not all of us are bone-moronic."

Hate to break it to you darling, but I never said they were!

I object to the US Government and it's foreign policy, not the American people.

As for Obama, it was naive to expect anything much different from him. While corporatism continues to rule the country the US will remain on the verge of National Corporatism, which was was once defined by a very famous person as the definition of ...

The problem with the economy isn't half the problem Nichole made it out to be.  The main problem is like I said: the people.  The one fact that James(Kelar) failed to mention was well: credits cards and loans.  We're addicted to them.  If the average American were to consolidate, re-consolidate, and and budget out to be living on only half of they after-tax income, it would still take them up to 17 years to climb out of the whole of debt they'd dug themselves into.  They say, "spend, spend, spend, it's good for the economy."  I fail to see how enslaving everyone into debt so bad that they end up giving it up to bankruptcy or a major company goes bankrupt because they're not turning a profit because everyone's debt is so great that they're not paying it out.

And then dumbfuk bush comes along and bails them out so they can get even more in debt...

The whole system is messed up.

People keep yelling at me that I should have voted.  For what?  Someone I'm complaining about now for being a complete NOOOB or for someone who was going to keel over from a heart attack but not before putting us in the next cold war with China?  It's like handing me a gun and telling me to shoot a little kid or a pregnant woman, either way I'd be a murderer and neither choice seems more appealing than the other.

Obama sucks.  And since he's the one who's won, and he's the one blowing his own horn and proving already with virtually every action he's made that he hasn't got a clue what he's doing... I don't NEED two years to make this statement, and even if I were to wait two years from now what I'm saying now would only be painting him as a saint compared to what's to come.  The other presidents at least had some experience so they knew how to screw us over a bit more discreetly, this dude is just like putting a monkey behind the stick of an airplane: crash.

Indulgence

Straighten yourself and you will not stand steady;
Display yourself and you will not be clearly seen;
Justify yourself and you will not be respected;
Promote yourself and you will not be believed;
Pride yourself and you will not endure.

These behaviours are wasteful, indulgent,
And so they attract disfavour;
Harmony avoids them.

Quote from: Annwyn on May 01, 2009, 10:55:38 AM
Why do you think I'm putting in 60 hours a week at work on top of being a med student?

Jeez, out of all the people, at least show some gratitude, I put in my taxes and spend my income into an economy that's failing, I don't take out of federal spending like Medicaid as appealing as it would be because I work in the system and know HOW I could get the system to pay for my hormones and my surgery, but I don't.  I could go out and get high like I really want to, but instead I invest money in exercise and anime and other things so that I know my money is getting back into the flow instead of going out to other countries in drug money and crap.  I do as much as anyone does for my country, so's my brother Kelar, so STFU.

Half the people on this forum can't say they do as much as I do, and the other half that can aren't the ones I'm talking about and I'm sure agree with me for the most part.

That is all well and good, shows that you at least have the brains to not ruin it all like the rest of America is.  The fact still remains, from the way your speaking sounds like, your not doing anything to change the things your complaining about.  Are you an activist against the things you dislike, or do you just complain about them, hoping that someone will have the brains to think about it and fix it so you don't have to.  If you are actually being an activist against the things you dislike, well then good for you, your doing something about it.  If your not doing anything, then there is no point complaining about it.

Its wonderful that your going to med school, and spending money in the economy, your investing somewhat properly (I don't know your specifics so I cannot say how well).  That still doesn't change the fact that your not doing anything politically and complaining.

QuoteI don't NEED two years to make this statement, and even if I were to wait two years from now what I'm saying now would only be painting him as a saint compared to what's to come.  The other presidents at least had some experience so they knew how to screw us over a bit more discreetly, this dude is just like putting a monkey behind the stick of an airplane: crash.

Well I'm glad your psychic and have the clairvoyance to know exactly whats going to happen in the next 2 years.  So please, tell me how I'm going to die, I would really like to know.

But seriously, be patient, just because you think you know what your talking about doesn't mean you do.  So please stop tooting your own horn.

I'm not saying the man's a saint, and I'm not saying that he isn't going to screw up like you say.  What I am saying is he deserves as much of a shot as anyone else does.  Despite what you say, the people who think they can predict the financial future are deluded and often wrong, overshooting or undershooting what actually happen by a fair margin.  Lets wait out the next 4 years, its not like we have a choice in the matter.  There are only three ways that he is getting out of that office.

1) He does something ridiculously illegal, and is removed
2) He resigns (this one is the least likely)
3) He is killed

If you want to complain, be an activist and change things through your senators, they do the real work in this country law wise.
If your not an activist, don't complain because your tooting your own horn.

words without action are useless.

Quote"The average person will believe any lie you tell them, either because they want it to be true, or because they fear that it is true" (Goodkind)

goodkind was surprisingly insightful in his novel series "The Sword of Truth", an amazing writer that one.  Good quote too, and your point afterward is well made.  People rarely want to see the truth, only what they believe to be the truth.

As for Obama, it was naive to expect anything much different from him. While corporatism continues to rule the country the US will remain on the verge of National Corporatism, which was was once defined by a very famous person as the definition of ...
and the irony here, even from the doctoral candidate, is that no one appears able to see that what's being screamed from the rooftops after 100 days by the Pube-puppets who are puppeteering this crap is "yeah, that's what we want, throw us into the briar patch br'er fox."

I'll start believing in the efficacy of Economics, Business Administration, and other "economic scientist" grads when they first get an education and THEN go to professional schools. We've had this all turned around since at least the fifties. That's when the university-going public started going to school to make money. Well, you got money, just very little sense of how to use it and how to control it's uses. Money is a figment!

At least you see that with credit debt, Ann. Good for you.

Nichole

And religion being, indeed, the opiate of the masses, what could be more true than that money and it's pursuit has anesthesized most of the sense people have? The American religion is money, not wealth or health or well-being and community. That's why they do, indeed, needs edumacations.

Sayanora, I'm done. 

Why are you so angry? Please calm down, no need to be shouting at people to "STFU". There's room enough here for others' valid opinions as well as your own. I must tell you though, I'm sure you didn't mean it that way but referring to any black man as a "monkey" is getting dangerously close to a racial slur, which I'm sure is not well tolerated here.

I have no credit cards and no credit card debt; I pay my mortgage on time and am not now nor have I ever been in danger of losing my house. I own my own small business and pay the government plenty of taxes, which I'd much rather see go to feed hungry, needy children or provide them with good schools and healthcare, than buying bombs to blow them to smithereens with. I have no children but agree with the sentiment that says if you think education is expensive, try ignorance.

I'm just wondering... if you hate Obama so much, why did you vote for him? Because not to vote is the same as voting for the winner. Simple, irrefutable logic that has nothing to do with the amount of taxes you pay. you can't avoid culpability by not voting; it makes you just as guilty and your opinion far less credible.

If you had decided to post this opinion before the election in hopes of swaying the minds of those who do their patriotic duty and actually vote, just remember that one who learns to state his/her opinions calmly and articulately, as those on both sides have done here, may in fact convince others to listen to your reasoning. Angry, unreasonable rants however, convince no one of anything except the vulgarity of the ranter.

I hardly think that the monkey statement was referring to "any black man".. more so the one presently in charge of the country.

*puts moderator hat on*

As always in discussing politics that are undeniably close to us all, tempers seem to get a little flaired. If anyone starts to want to scream at people from reading this thread, please take 5 minutes to breathe and consider ignoring this thread altogether.

Quote from: Miniar on May 01, 2009, 11:52:24 AM
*puts moderator hat on*

As always in discussing politics that are undeniably close to us all, tempers seem to get a little flaired. If anyone starts to want to scream at people from reading this thread, please take 5 minutes to breathe and consider ignoring this thread altogether.

O.O noooooo, the moderator hat, it foils me again

hehe, jk, but yeah, your right, i do sometimes get lost in my political arguments, sowwy

(disappears from thread)

Quote from: KelarDrioktain on May 01, 2009, 11:48:22 AM
I hardly think that the monkey statement was referring to "any black man".. more so the one presently in charge of the country.

But how does referring to him as a monkey help get anyone's point across? you could say "buffoon", which is probably more accurate to the previous administration, but at least it can't be misconstrued. Trust me, someone would interpret it the wrong way, doesn't matter what the original intent of the statement. Like yesterday when the media was trying to put a good spin on Biden's statements that airplanes are seething hotbeds of viral infection. Turns out people have studied this and they're actually not, but the words were out there.

My take on all politicians is this: if they really, really want to be elected, then they shouldn't be. We should have to drag them into office kicking and screaming. We could hardly end up worse off.

Now on that point I agree with you wholeheartedly.

I don't care about the skin color of any man.  Christ, it's a reference to his political IQ, not about his skin color.  I really get sick of people claling me a racist simply because I'm southern, when if anyone will follow my blogs the only people I've been dating are well, BLACK men.  Christ.

Take it down a notch Annwyn, lets try to keep things friendly here.

Sarah L.

Quote from: Annwyn on May 01, 2009, 12:37:23 PM
I don't care about the skin color of any man.  Christ, it's a reference to his political IQ, not about his skin color.  I really get sick of people claling me a racist simply because I'm southern, when if anyone will follow my blogs the only people I've been dating are well, BLACK men.  Christ.

do you mean Christ was a black man or that you're dating him?  :P lol no offense hon, I'm a proud Southerner myself (and didn't know that you were too). It's just that I've seen that very word used to describe and denigrate African-Americans, and while I understand that you didn't mean it that way, it could be taken that way and has been in the past. I know I know, political correctness and all that, but sometimes it is useful.  :laugh:

I'd rather have someone who is honest, and tells us where he's going, and sticks to it, than a liar with a silver tongue

Umm, that was Jimmy Carter, and we all know how well that turned out. And, in retrospect, Jimmy was right, and Regan was wrong to dismantle all the energy stuff that Carter got rolling.  We'd be a hell of a lot better off had we pursued that course since the 70s.

And I sure hope that medical school you're going to is not a STATE school.  And that the highways you ride on are private highways and not state funded projects.  And really, really stay off the freeways, them thangs are Federal Gub'ment projects, lock, stock and barrel.

Those diets you talk about, that's more or less a regional deal.  And for sure that classic 'cookin with lard' Southern Cuisine is just a big old heart attack on a plate looking up at 'cha.  But its not everyone in the country.  Half the people I work with are veggies, and of them, 30% are vegan.  So, I don't think its them. On a nice Saturday or Sunday afternoon the trails through Annendale are so packed with trail bikes (the pedal kind) that they are going to need traffic lights soon.  No matter what time of day I'm out riding around I see other people riding, walking, running - so again, its not everywhere.

And it's not just Obama, nor even Bush.  State governments, republican and democratic states alike are in big financial trouble.  Local counties and cities are also having huge budget issues from coast to coast, so it's not just a Federal problem.

When companies that have been in business for over a hundred years are failing that would seem to indicate a more systematic problem. One that is not just an issue of debt load.

Nor is it just an American problem.  Its worldwide.  Something is very wrong on a fundamental level.

Are these people going to solve it?  I doubt it.  Not because they are not going to try, or because the solutions they implement are wrong in some political sense, but because the problem is so deep that band-aid solutions will not solve the massive at the core issues.

At root - and I have no idea of how they will work it out - the system just got too big to be stable any longer.  It's not that Obama can't fix or control it, or that Bush couldn't do it either - but that I don't think anyone can.

On a micro level, there was a band.  Phish.  Kind of a dumb name, and not all that good, but they were doing OK.  They were selling out shows, making money, working.  But it got bigger, and bigger, and bigger.  By the end they were selling out 3 day festivals that featured them, and pretty much only them.  And then it all fell apart on them.  Did they get tired of being big rock stars?  No.  Did they say 'hey, we've got enough money now, let's quit?"  Not likely.  What happened was it just got too big for them to run.  It took all their time planning and doing logistics for these huge events, it was just one headache after the other.  In the end (or by the end) putting on these shows had become such a huge deal that the music (the reason they were doing it in the first place) became lost in all that.  They had pretty much stopped being a band and had become planners, and that's not what they wanted to do.

On the macro level, all the finance, all the economics, the banking, stocks, bonds and all has lost any relevance at all to what it was originally intended to do.  So enamored in the process, they lost sight of the product and the reason.

So too with Iraq.  So enamored with the process of war, they lost sight - if they ever had it, and I don't think they did - of what the goals really were.
After the Tet Offensive, LBJ got an old Washington hand, Clark Clifford to come in and try to do something to run things.  Clifford called all the generals in and asked them some pretty obvious questions.

How many more men were needed?
Would that number do the job?
Could the enemy respond in kind?
Could bombing by itself stop the war?
How can we win?
How long will it take?

When there was no agreement on the answers, and in particular as Clifford noted in his memoirs: "Not only was there no agreement, I could find no one willing to express any confidence in their guesses."*

And not only is that Iraq today, its the economy too.  Not just the Federal one, but just about every state and city.  And most Western nations too.

As Clifford found out, there is no agreement, nor any confidence in the guesses.



*You can read Clifford's own writing on it here:
http://books.google.com/books?id=tGvq4ORMMzoC&pg=PA111&lpg=PA111&dq=clark+clifford+vietnam+questions+to+generals&source=bl&ots=EqzR-7_7M_&sig=McACc-x48Ducdph5FsVhI6o4_68&hl=en&ei=kjj7SbrqDpDutQOkp_3XAQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1#PPA113,M1 (http://books.google.com/books?id=tGvq4ORMMzoC&pg=PA111&lpg=PA111&dq=clark+clifford+vietnam+questions+to+generals&source=bl&ots=EqzR-7_7M_&sig=McACc-x48Ducdph5FsVhI6o4_68&hl=en&ei=kjj7SbrqDpDutQOkp_3XAQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1#PPA113,M1)

Quote from: KelarDrioktain on May 01, 2009, 11:48:22 AM
I hardly think that the monkey statement was referring to "any black man".. more so the one presently in charge of the country.

And that makes it any better? Still remains a racist statement...

QuoteAs always in discussing politics that are undeniably close to us all, tempers seem to get a little flaired

This thread was started to promote arguments. It is the author's style. Check out the history.

The American political system is the art of confrontation.  Always has been.

On a lighter note, I can't wait to see Annwyn there at customs in Canada telling them she's escaping the US because of socialism.  The customs people are going to wet their pants laughing at her.

Quote from: tekla on May 01, 2009, 03:38:04 PM
The American political system is the art of confrontation.  Always has been.

On a lighter note, I can't wait to see Annwyn there at customs in Canada telling them she's escaping the US because of socialism.  The customs people are going to wet their pants laughing at her.

Probably not wise to head south either...

Quote from: daisybelle on May 01, 2009, 03:53:13 PM
Probably not wise to head south either...

I didn't think Venezuela or Bolivia had a border with the USA. O good grief. The things we think of as "so-cal-ism" :laugh:

Let's get a grip folks. Part of reading and listening too much to that lot I mentioned in my first post is that this talk of "Corporate fascism through Socialism" they are coming with is just propaganda for the shills.

That way the shills will be thinking that some very lenient and meager "regulations" as currently proposed are "so-cal-ism." (And of course Rick Parry is gonna hep Texas suck-seed fum  the newnited states) Y'all will believe that so when they start their corporate nationalist agenda up again y'all gonna be even more inclined to think it's a dimo-cratic revulushun than most of y'all are now! And that seems ta be pretty willin'.

Nichole

Fascism can be defined as Corporate Nationalism - Benito Mussolini

'Nuff said.

Tekla once again has earned my silence in awe of her statement.

Guess there's not anything more that I can say.

Awe honey, just today Nichole and I were PMing about how much we like you, despite (or perhaps even because of) what you say.  You rant on this post about people being irresponsible and have another post running asking "how can I get away with being irresponsible."  It's kind of cute in its own way.

As Ralph Waldo Emerson said (and both Nichole and myself are big fans of the Transcendental Vision, at least in Lit): "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines."

Its a huge problem, one that was not caused by us or them, but by all of us.  Its not for one person to solve, ain't gonna happen in 100 days either.  It may well be a long, long, long, long way to get home, if we can even get back to that home again.  And I don't think we can.

But that's another post.

Quote from: Sarah Louise on May 01, 2009, 12:46:46 PM
Take it down a notch Annwyn, lets try to keep things friendly here.

Sarah L.

You said Annwyn and friendly in the same sentence  :laugh: >:-) :laugh:

Quote from: Annwyn on May 01, 2009, 02:05:14 AM

Who am I even kidding?  Any of you Canadians want a roommate?

You'd hate it here worse. We're very into preventative medicine, socialized medicine, peacemaking, and no firearms. I think your guy is a step in the right direction, although the culture may be irredeemable. At least he's trying.

Dennis

although the culture may be irredeemable

Awe hell Dennis, that's the best part of our culture(s).  We're pretty much irredeemable ourselves.  Damn proud of it too.

I'm just wondering, If Annwyn does go to the Canadian border. Can I film it?  :laugh: >:-) :laugh:

If Anwyn moves to BC, I'm a movin to Newfoundland.

Cindy

Ooohhh now, have some patients and understanding for the lassie  :laugh:

Quote from: Virginia Marie on May 02, 2009, 02:48:02 AM
Ooohhh now, have some patients and understanding for the lassie  :laugh:

What does she need patients for? I know she works in a pharmacy but she's not a doctor! ;D

OK, maybe just understanding of impetuous youth  :laugh:

Quote from: tekla on May 01, 2009, 11:58:10 PM
Awe honey, just today Nichole and I were PMing about how much we like you, despite (or perhaps even because of) what you say.  You rant on this post about people being irresponsible and have another post running asking "how can I get away with being irresponsible."  It's kind of cute in its own way.

That's pretty messed up, holding a one time thing where I attempt to squeeze out some well earned off time and have to take drastic measures to do so.

QuoteIt may well be a long, long, long, long way to get home, if we can even get back to that home again.  And I don't think we can.

But that's another post.

I'm quite inclined to agree.

If I thought there was still really hope, then I wouldn't have said I'm ashamed to be an American.  Fact is, I really am.

Quote from: Dennis on May 02, 2009, 12:36:09 AM
You'd hate it here worse. We're very into preventative medicine, socialized medicine, peacemaking, and no firearms. I think your guy is a step in the right direction, although the culture may be irredeemable. At least he's trying.

Dennis

Won't do crap.  Besides I'm sure I'm fine with no guns as long as I still have motorcycles.

Quote from: cindybc on May 02, 2009, 02:28:13 AM
If Anwyn moves to BC, I'm a movin to Newfoundland.

Cindy

Just be sure not to forget your wigs.

Quote from: Virginia MarieI'm just wondering, If Annwyn does go to the Canadian border. Can I film it?

Bite me.



Obama is still a screwup.

Whether that's relevant in the slightest is another issue I suppose.

---

Post Merge: May 02, 2009, 10:15:45 AM

---

Quote from: imaz on May 02, 2009, 03:16:58 AM
What does she need patients for? I know she works in a pharmacy but she's not a doctor! ;D

Yet.

It's time for all Americans to take charge of their lives and show the power elite that we've had enough. Form grassroots organizations which will speak to your concerns. I'm a veteran myself and vets are treated like crap.

I agree with the saying 'what can I can do for my country' because I am involved with projects that will help others.


Gennee

Quote
Won't do crap.  Besides I'm sure I'm fine with no guns as long as I still have motorcycles.

Bikes we got, and awesome roads to ride them on. Got to wear a helmet, but you can't beat those mountain roads, and the smell of the ocean as you ride a twisty highway with no other traffic.

I love Canada. I'm an immigrant here and will be forever grateful my parents chose to move here. It's the most beautiful country in the world (imo - although when I travel I do appreciate different scenery), great people, and I do like that we have a political system that takes care of the people that don't or can't take care of themselves.

I think the US picked the right guy in Obama. He's redeemed your foreign reputation amazingly and that is a huge thing. I don't know a whole lot about what's going on domestically, but just the fact that, for the first time in 8 years, you actually have someone who can function internationally and has a clue about what goes on outside his own backyard is huge.

Dennis

Quote from: Dennis on May 03, 2009, 02:59:26 AM
Bikes we got, and awesome roads to ride them on. Got to wear a helmet, but you can't beat those mountain roads, and the smell of the ocean as you ride a twisty highway with no other traffic.

I love Canada. I'm an immigrant here and will be forever grateful my parents chose to move here. It's the most beautiful country in the world (imo - although when I travel I do appreciate different scenery), great people, and I do like that we have a political system that takes care of the people that don't or can't take care of themselves.

I think the US picked the right guy in Obama. He's redeemed your foreign reputation amazingly and that is a huge thing. I don't know a whole lot about what's going on domestically, but just the fact that, for the first time in 8 years, you actually have someone who can function internationally and has a clue about what goes on outside his own backyard is huge.

Dennis

My Mum emigrated from Canada to the UK, her parents had emigrated to Canada!

What you say about Obama being more acceptable internationally is true. Bush was seen as a dreadful man in most of the world together with his lapdogs Blair, Berlusconi, Aznar and those weird identical twins running Poland.

As for the US, I happen to have family members including my own son who would refuse to travel there even if it was free. It's very, very hard for many of us to forgive it's foreign policy and military interventions. Too many lives lost, too much support for Fascist and Para-Fascist regimes and then there are Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan and probably soon Pakistan and Iran as well.

Definitly from an international perspective, Obama is a good face. The confidence in him to run such a world power is huge compared to bush. Our confidence that we would see a rational, more peace inclined America has been pretty high.

I do know we seem to get more press about Obamas wife than Obama himself at my end of the world. I took that as a good sign and he was not doing anything drastic like choking on a pretzel or freaking other heads of state out by taking them for impromptu rides in his golf carts, not that I understand much about politics and economies  :embarrassed:.

As anyone who has studied the American Constitution knows, the American Government was designed to move very slowly.  Before we dismantled them the checks and balances deal made it even slower.  But radical change is all but impossible. 

I happen to have family members including my own son who would refuse to travel there even if it was free

Irregardless, we still have a lot more people applying to get in then we have people getting out.  It's not Mexico worrying about people crossing the border in waves. 

And, there is not one America, there are many, some existing with in each other. 

In a micro view, there was a post recently asking about 'California' in some general way, and people, those of us who live here, and love it, kept trying to say that there is no one Cali, there is a dog pile of Cali.  Which, considering that the state is pretty much the same area as Savanna GA to NYC, ought to be expected. 

Quote from: tekla on May 04, 2009, 10:42:56 AM
Irregardless

-brain breaks for a second-

please don't say that word -shivers- please

Of coarse there are many issues at hand. The economy being one of the largest.

I'm mostly hoping Obama will get us out of Iraq. Maybe the rest of the world would stop trying to blame the whole country for the decisions of a small few. Most Americans never agreed on the war and it's been nothing but a drain on our economy.

Quote from: Rachel on May 04, 2009, 12:19:04 PM
-brain breaks for a second-

please don't say that word -shivers- please

It's not in formal usage.

Of course it's been a screwup for decades and well continue to be so. 

I <3 dictionary.com

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Post Merge: May 05, 2009, 01:50:40 AM

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This is my myspace blog where a heated offset of the health aspects has come into effect.  Just figured you guys might wanna take a peak:D

http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendId=299178286&blogId=486524503 (http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendId=299178286&blogId=486524503)

Quote from: Annwyn on May 01, 2009, 02:05:14 AM
He might SAY he's going to do all this crap for us, but who's he kidding?  The day that gays can enlist will be the day that 1/2 of the USMC and USArmy go AWOL. 

Whereas the Navy will instantly double its recruitment. :P

If what you say comes true -- GOOD. If some thickneck bigot can't deal with the horrifying possibility of serving with openly gay people, then I don't want my taxes paying his (or her) salary. I don't trust that person to defend my freedom.

(Sorry, I'm pissed; I just heard a jackass military officer today spouting off about the evils of gays in the military, not getting how much he sounded like someone complaining about integration of the military under Truman. Tough luck, bub, you lose.)

Whereas the Navy will instantly double its recruitment

Something about the Royal Navy being run by Rum, soddomy and the lash comes to mind, and the British Navy did rule the world, for no small part of time.

Quote from: Annwyn on May 04, 2009, 08:01:11 PM
It's not in formal usage.

Of course it's been a screwup for decades and well continue to be so. 

I <3 dictionary.com

still doesn't help the fact that it hurts my brain when i hear/read it.