Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Okay, I was on a chat room and someone said that everyone has equal opportunities, and I said that they very much did not, and a posh-nob will always have a better opportunity to everyone else...

They responded thus...

it depends on how you see things I think that before you are born you chose your basic life path for the lessons you have to learn once you are you use your free will to pursue what you desire

Essentially, she believes that we choose our lives with certain parameters and lessons want to learn and then live it.

Now I think it is totally insane, cuckoo nut-job, and possibly one of the most cuckoo, insane, nutjob things that I have heard in a week of hearing cuckoo, insane nut-job things. But can anyone else make it sound any less barmy?

Paris Hilton said something similar in her book. She chose to be born rich.
It's a lot of bull.

Quote from: Jörgen, on May 04, 2009, 06:00:34 PM

Do you not believe that everything is possible?

No. I am a believer in Occam's Razor. entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem, "entities must not be multiplied beyond necessity". In other words, I like to keep my ontological categories down low. That includes previous lives and that. The universe is big, but it doesn't contain all that much.

Actually there are a lot of people who do believe that way, although that philosophy does tend to draw its share of wing-nuts. The first time I heard it espoused was by the author Jane Roberts, who began "channeling" an entity known as Seth in the early 1960's. Yeah I know, that sounds nutty too, but there are a lot of things about reality that ring true in her writings. They are quite self consistent and pretty much cover "Life, the Universe, and Everything". She was the author of numerous books, most written through this entity Seth, and she is widely recognized in some circles as a phenomenon in herself. Jane Roberts died in 1984 but her books are all still in print. Worth checking out if you're really curious to know more.

What's the paradox of life?

Indeed the most common elements in the universe are the ones that combine to form life.

To be honest I wouldn't even give it the word theory, I'd say it was a story at best.

I personally find it a sick and immoral story - I 'love' the idea of telling the parents of a recently deceased 5 year old in Somalia that their son picked that life for themselves and have learnt some useful things out of it. It's a story for the privileged, anyone with even the slightest lack of privilege (I'd have thought) wouldn't be able to believe in it - except as you are, at an abstract or possible level.

But I spose you're right in the sense that if you believe anything is possible than it is less barmy.

Some people are truly legends. Some people are legends in their own mind.
We all make our choices. Sometimes that works out well. Other times life hands us something other than what we would choose

i used to think everything was possible but i lost it somewhere...or somewhen.

Re: A pre-chosen life?

I highly doubt I was in a cloud somewhere browsing the catalog of life and ordered 'man born as woman' for myself.

QuoteThe universe is big, but it doesn't contain all that much.

It contains more than you can imagine. Plus everything you are not aware of as well as things you will never know.

We are born into certain circumstances. These circumstances have a probability on how our life will pan out. We are not stuck with those as we can alter the way our life goes. but it take thinking outside the box and the courage to do things other people in our culture are afraid to do. There are no guarantees only probabilities based on your knowledge and strengths.

Quote from: lisagurl on May 04, 2009, 07:45:06 PM
It contains more than you can imagine. Plus everything you are not aware of as well as things you will never know.

We are born into certain circumstances. These circumstances have a probability on how our life will pan out. We are not stuck with those as we can alter the way our life goes. but it take thinking outside the box and the courage to do things other people in our culture are afraid to do. There are no guarantees only probabilities based on your knowledge and strengths.

wow that was well said.  :)

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Post Merge: May 04, 2009, 10:52:23 PM

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Quote from: Nero on May 04, 2009, 06:45:36 PM
Re: A pre-chosen life?

I highly doubt I was in a cloud somewhere browsing the catalog of life and ordered 'man born as woman' for myself.

something we wouldn't wish on our worst enemy, and that's the truth. :-\  I like to think that maybe having gid for the span of my sweet short life has at least given me a much greater admiration, appreciation, and respect for all women than I would have ever had without the affliction, or even if I had been born female on the outside. There's probably other stuff too, if I thought about it lol

We do get a chance to see the world from both sides of the street, which most people never get to see. I'm either learning something, or else I'm rationalizing these events of my life. And these events so often seem to coincide with the feeling that I have learned something by listening to what the events had to tell me- isn't that like seeing the glass half full? It's something I'm trying to do more of and it does seem to help. Either way the results are real, but it's still a hard road to travel no matter how we rationalize it.

I always hated that whole "You can do whatever you put your mind to, you can be whoever you want to be."  Bull.  Pica and I could go out to the court and start shooting hoops, get trainers and coaches and all that, and never, ever given all the time in the universe are we ever going to be Michael Jordan.  People have different skills, talents and all that.  There are a lot of things you can be good at, and people work in different manners to achieve that.

This is actually not the first time I hear something 'bout this. It's fairly common amongst new-age paths to treat "every" aspect of life as chosen.
You don't loose your job because you're incompetent, you loose it because deep down you know it's the wrong job for you and you need to face the challenge of finding a new job.
You are born into your position in life because you need to learn what that's like.
etc, etc, etc,
It "might" seem fine and possibly even reasonable if you believe in reincarnation and that your soul need to learn all the lessons needed to reach enlightenment or whatever, but there are some horrible problems with that outlook, some of which make me wretch.
If everything is chosen, on some subconscious or spiritual level for the lessons you might learn from it, then what of people who live through abuse of any kind.
There are actual cases where a woman has sought shelter with her new-age spiritual group, looking for some love and support after experiencing something horrible (loss of a child or a loved one, or even rape) and the group's idea of helping her is telling her to figure out what she's to learn from it and accept that she "chooses" everything that happens to her.
"They can't take away from you what you don't freely give." as an attitude is older still, and it's horrible.

Sure your position is often chosen for you. By where you are born and by the social economic status of your parents and by the society you are born into. Babies are innocent, they have no "original sin" or debt to pay in this world.

To suggest that we choose to live a life of poverty, sickness and brutality is a load of bollocks. It's like all that rubbish about paying the price for previous existences. All stuff made up by those in power to persuade the poor it's their fault they are in the state they are.

BTW, the England football manager - Glen Hodddle, got sacked (rightly) for stating that disabled people must have done something wrong in their previous lives and thus were born disabled.

Quote from: Miniar on May 05, 2009, 02:54:02 PM
This is actually not the first time I hear something 'bout this. It's fairly common amongst new-age paths to treat "every" aspect of life as chosen.
You don't loose your job because you're incompetent, you loose it because deep down you know it's the wrong job for you and you need to face the challenge of finding a new job.
You are born into your position in life because you need to learn what that's like.
etc, etc, etc,
It "might" seem fine and possibly even reasonable if you believe in reincarnation and that your soul need to learn all the lessons needed to reach enlightenment or whatever, but there are some horrible problems with that outlook, some of which make me wretch.
If everything is chosen, on some subconscious or spiritual level for the lessons you might learn from it, then what of people who live through abuse of any kind.
There are actual cases where a woman has sought shelter with her new-age spiritual group, looking for some love and support after experiencing something horrible (loss of a child or a loved one, or even rape) and the group's idea of helping her is telling her to figure out what she's to learn from it and accept that she "chooses" everything that happens to her.
"They can't take away from you what you don't freely give." as an attitude is older still, and it's horrible.

That's exactly the problem with it. It leads to hurtful conclusions like that by ignorant people. If that's the case, then how do those people know it's not supposed to be in their "life plan" to help out this person who is in need, and they are screwing up their own "plan" by refusing to help? No such thing as karma that goes from life to life I reckon. There's enough trouble in one life to take care of itself.

Quote from: Pica Pica on May 04, 2009, 05:53:45 PM
Okay, I was on a chat room and someone said that everyone has equal opportunities, and I said that they very much did not, and a posh-nob will always have a better opportunity to everyone else...

They responded thus...

it depends on how you see things I think that before you are born you chose your basic life path for the lessons you have to learn once you are you use your free will to pursue what you desire

Essentially, she believes that we choose our lives with certain parameters and lessons want to learn and then live it.

Now I think it is totally insane, cuckoo nut-job, and possibly one of the most cuckoo, insane, nutjob things that I have heard in a week of hearing cuckoo, insane nut-job things. But can anyone else make it sound any less barmy?

Soundslike Ekenkar

Quoteand a posh-nob will always have a better opportunity to everyone else...

Not always. Some posh-nobs are idiots and squander the family fortune. ( ex. Woolworth)   Perhaps who you know works better than what you know but then folks like Clinton and Obama were not born with a silver spoon like Bush. But then someone with an IQ of Bush would never have been President without family.

Quote from: Pica Pica on May 04, 2009, 05:53:45 PM
Okay, I was on a chat room and someone said that everyone has equal opportunities, and I said that they very much did not, and a posh-nob will always have a better opportunity to everyone else...

They responded thus...

it depends on how you see things I think that before you are born you chose your basic life path for the lessons you have to learn once you are you use your free will to pursue what you desire

Essentially, she believes that we choose our lives with certain parameters and lessons want to learn and then live it.

Now I think it is totally insane, cuckoo nut-job, and possibly one of the most cuckoo, insane, nutjob things that I have heard in a week of hearing cuckoo, insane nut-job things. But can anyone else make it sound any less barmy?

sounds like, before that person was born, their mother may have indulged a little too much with alcohol.

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Post Merge: June 10, 2009, 10:30:00 PM

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Quote from: lisagurl on May 04, 2009, 07:45:06 PM
It contains more than you can imagine. Plus everything you are not aware of as well as things you will never know.

How dare you question the quality of my education?    :P

Quote from: Krisstina on June 09, 2009, 01:58:50 PM

Soundslike Ekenkar

I have an Ekenkar pop song somewhere called 'For Those At the Grassroots', sounds like Kermit the frog singing nutty religious songs.

Ive Always held the idea that we are given our life to make of it what we will and that the more we appreciate the choices we can make is what matters. It upsets me some of the time to hear things like every choice we make was pre-determined or that everything in life is just what we chose it.

Quote from: Pica Pica on May 04, 2009, 06:32:32 PM
What's the paradox of life?

the paradox is that we are so freakin' amazing biochemically, etc., etc., and at the same time, our lives are wasted in insignificant jobs, petty animosities, ridiculous hatreds, absurd habits. and, of course, the higher you go up in the system, the more damage you can cause. "success" means very little.

-ell

Quote from: ell on June 28, 2009, 12:41:36 AM
the paradox is that we are so freakin' amazing biochemically, etc., etc., and at the same time, our lives are wasted in insignificant jobs, petty animosities, ridiculous hatreds, absurd habits. and, of course, the higher you go up in the system, the more damage you can cause. "success" means very little.

-ell

success means there are corpses piled at your feet.

Quote from: Rebis on June 28, 2009, 03:05:38 PM
success means there are corpses piled at your feet.

yeah, what Rebecca said