Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Well, I came out to the boyfriend last night.
It didn't go as badly as I feared it might, nor as well as I hoped..
He had a friend that worked with him transition from MtF, so he knew the deal, and understood how she was feeling. He was understanding, but very bummed. He says he really wishes he was bi.. because he is still in love with me and wants to do everything he can to make me as happy as possible. But he doesn't think he can do anything about being unattracted to men.
And I think it would be very stressful to be in a relationship like that while transitioning, knowing that I am purposefully becoming less and less attractive to my partner.
So neither of us it sure what to do, now..

I've heard of some married couples that stay together while the wife transitions, but I assume they'd spent years and years together beforehand.
We've only been together about 6 months (but known each other longer), and live in different countries. x:

Anyone have any ideas? Similar experiences? Or have/heard of a straight boyfriend staying with a FtM, "turning gay"? >>

In general I think long distance relationships don't work on their own let alone with someone transitioning. I just think that is a very hard thing to deal with. My experiences aren't like yours so I can't give you the best advice in this situation. My girlfriend is bi and prefers men strongly so my transition may only help her attraction to me.

In your situation I would just see if it pans out. But if he gets uncomfortable I would be ready to let him go. There is no way you are going to be able to force someone into a sexuality they are not.

The nature of intimate interpersonal relationships is such that any radical change in sexuality is most likely going to end the relationship.  That has nothing to do with gay/straight/bi/trans, but works out across the board. 

Well the plan had always been for him to move here as soon as he gets a job, and he's been applying to places nearby. I never wanted a long distance relationship, but this just kinda happened, and I am still glad it did. :3

But aye, I don't plan on forcing him of course. :p Problem is that he /wants/ to be with me, he just doesn't know how he'll feel while I transition, and I'm worried that knowing there is this thing ahead of us will ruin the relationship anyways. >:

Quote from: Banf on December 01, 2009, 01:26:09 PM
Well the plan had always been for him to move here as soon as he gets a job, and he's been applying to places nearby. I never wanted a long distance relationship, but this just kinda happened, and I am still glad it did. :3

But aye, I don't plan on forcing him of course. :p Problem is that he /wants/ to be with me, he just doesn't know how he'll feel while I transition, and I'm worried that knowing there is this thing ahead of us will ruin the relationship anyways. >:

I know of people who started hrt with straight partners and it worked out
good luck! :)

Thank you, Myself. (:

You do have a point, tekla. I was very prepared for this to straight out end the relationship, which was of course scary.. The somewhat promising thing is that he is only unsure! He's still planning to visit in a couple of weeks and we'll see how it goes. I guess time will give us some better insight.

Also, it's turned out all my previous boyfriends were kinda closet bisexuals.. Damn, only one I actually fell in love with, isn't!

I'm sure most people's sexual orientation don't change, but some people's do. It's good he is understanding and was honest with you. Long distance relationships are hard- this will make it harder. All you can do is try.

It's because in a lot of ways the negotiation of sexuality is the very beginning of the relationship.  The only real difference between an intimate relationship and a garden variety best friends friendship is the first one comes with someone's genitals in your mouth - and, hopefully, yours in theirs.

To change the terms of that is to unravel everything, as it was the entire basis that made this more than BFF.

I don't think hed ever consider himself bi or gay, but stuff does happen and if he loves you he may accept you for who you are and not what you look like. Regardless of what happens your lucky he didnt automatically leave you.

Well the thing about sexually is that it's a physical sort of thing. You can't help what you're attracted to, you can't change it and make yourself a certain way because in the end you know you're just lying to yourself. You can change your mind about something, but you can't help what you're attracted to on a biological level. There's no shame in not being sexually attracted to a certain sex nor is it closed minded.

I'm going to have to agree with Tekla. The entire dynamic of the relationship is going to change on a physical and a mental aspect, both of which are important things that need to be established. How much of what depends on the individual people, but what's happening right now is the foundation of the relationship got shook up. Your BF came in thinking he was in a straight relationship, and now things have really changed. If you've only been together for 6 months and live in two different countries then I'd advise you let him have time to think it over. Jumping to another country when you aren't sure where you two stand in the relationship is extremely risky.

Is it possible that he'd go 'bi' or 'gay'? Probably not if he's confident with his sexuality. You can't really 'turn' a person. He might be able to look beyond the physical aspect, but even so this sort of thing requires time.

I'm in a relationship that started as the opposite of your situation. We met as two men, and after a month of dating, I came out to him as trans. We broke up for a few weeks, he did a lot of soul searching, and we talked endlessly about our relationship. What we decided is that no, you can't "turn" someone straight or gay, but sometimes you can have an exception to your sexuality. He's 100% gay, but he's totally ok with being with me even if I have female parts. And yeah, contrary to what you would think, our totally hetero sex life is great. He says he will stay with me no matter what I decide to do about transitioning. So while you probably won't be able to turn your bf gay...you might still be able to work things out. Just because he isn't attracted to men, doesn't mean he won't stay attracted to you and only you. I think most of this is because there are strong feelings involved. Hope this helped a little!

--Konnor

Quote from: konman on December 01, 2009, 09:08:07 PM
I'm in a relationship that started as the opposite of your situation. We met as two men, and after a month of dating, I came out to him as trans. We broke up for a few weeks, he did a lot of soul searching, and we talked endlessly about our relationship. What we decided is that no, you can't "turn" someone straight or gay, but sometimes you can have an exception to your sexuality. He's 100% gay, but he's totally ok with being with me even if I have female parts. And yeah, contrary to what you would think, our totally hetero sex life is great. He says he will stay with me no matter what I decide to do about transitioning. So while you probably won't be able to turn your bf gay...you might still be able to work things out. Just because he isn't attracted to men, doesn't mean he won't stay attracted to you and only you. I think most of this is because there are strong feelings involved. Hope this helped a little!

--Konnor

Yeah, actually I think I can relate to this a little bit. I seem to be leaning towards "straight guy" but I'm already with a straight guy. His masculinity doesn't really appeal to me but I'm too attached already lol. So there may be hope for you yet.

I understand that other people are saying 'you can't help what you're sexually attracted to'; and maybe I'm too much of a pusher, but I've found that almost everyone I've met is at least a little queer once they're honest with themselves. (Uh ohs, am I being controversial? Well, we're ->-bleeped-<-s! Hate it if you need to, but to the rest of the world, our very existence is controversial!)

I mean, if you think about it. We're female men. Many of us eventually become hormonally male with testosterone, or even get something like phalloplasty/top surgery and are able to have our gender marker changed on our papers- but in the end we're still XX chromosome, female from birth. This puts us into a bind because, who are we supposed to date without needing to be 'accepted'? I mean really, think about it.

Being with a straight girl is problematic because we're female, two females together is seen as 'gay', even if one is actually a man, so she'll have issues with your genetics 'making her gay'- loss of attraction because you're female. Gay men have the potential to be an issue because we're not 'real' 'cisgendered' men- we 'used to be women', which gives gay men issues, loss of attraction because we're female. Being with a lesbian is an issue, because even if we're female bodied, we're men, and lesbians are, typically, attracted to women, not men, loss of attraction due to masculine gender identity. Straight guys are an issue because even if they are along for the 'female' ride, they have issues with the relationship 'making them gay' when they come to the realization that you 'are actually a man', loss of attraction due to gender identity. So there are problems with straight women, gay women, straight men, and gay men. That pretty much rules out everyone who isn't already bisexual, pansexual or just already heavily queer-and-otherness-identified, unless they're open to doing some soulsearching and interpreting the guidelines of their own sexuality.

So there's pretty much going to be some kind of roadblock no matter what. I've had a lot of issues with 'previously straight' types- the thing is, a look at what testosterone does to the body points out some of the similarities between females and males; if you're on T for a while, your 'clit' gets bigger, it grows into a 'little dick'. The thing is, really, it's always been 'a little dick'. That nubbin of erectile tissue between your legs is what your boyfriend's penis started as, in the womb. If he licks on that, what's the difference between it being the size of an m&m and the size of a jawbreaker? It's made of the same thing, made of the same person. And even if you've only recently come out as trans, haven't you been a 'man inside' this entire time, anyway?

That's part of my issue with things like this. You're not going into a cocoon and magically transforming 'into a man'. You are a man, and have been a man(I'm assuming), just not in a physically visible way so as to let the world easily know. So whoever you're with has been dating that person, a man, for however many months already. Does this 'turn him bi'? Does sexual orientation really matter? As transsexuals, many of us are forced into a state of in-between-ness and otherness for the rest of our lives, which means that we're at odds with any clean-cut road of sexual orientation.

Using myself as an example: how can a straight girl, a lesbian woman, a gay guy, and a straight man all date the same human being? I've been in relationships with each of these labels of sexual orientation. I've been the same person each time, I haven't been going back and forth. I'm a transsexual man, a female man, I've always been. I didn't 'make' anyone gay or straight, but I've 'made' people actually think about their sexuality for more than a few seconds, and the results aren't always 'horrible'- and face it, there will always be 'soul searching', if it isn't with the guy you love right now and want to live with, it's going to be with some other person. It's never going to be easy. But if you've always been a man, how is your bond magically broken by telling him?

Quote from: Cairus on December 01, 2009, 10:30:08 PMBut if you've always been a man, how is your bond magically broken by telling him?

If he starts HRT, he will start to look the part. Straight men may be attracted to masculine people who look like women, but not masculine features. The issue will be the OP's attempt to masculinise himself, which is detrimental to the relationship.

I was in a "straight" relationship for nearly two decades. My ex has a little bit of a queer streak; he's totally straight but is a part-time virtual lesbian. I was pretty butch when I first met him, and I came out as transgender a few years later. He was okay with it. Didn't even mind when we were "mistaken" for a gay couple and heckled.

But he is not attracted to men. A couple of months into my HRT, he broke up with me.

We had a great fifteen years, ran into some snags, and were trying to work them out when I came out as transsexual. It could be that if I'd come out at a different time, we would have stayed together. No way to tell. But our twenty-year relationship did not survive my transition.

I've heard of a couple of FTM-cisgender male relationships that survived transition, but only secondhand--and in one, I know for certain that the cisgender guy was bi. The only relationships that I've personally witnessed that survived an FTM transition started out as lesbian relationships.

I wouldn't say that your relationship is doomed, but I'm with Tekla on this. The odds are extremely against you, especially if the relationship is long distance.

I wish you the best, though--keep us posted. It would be nice to see someone beat the odds.

Wow, those are a lot of seriously insightful responses, guys. Thank you!
I have a lot to think about, and I may even suggest he read this stuff.. Whether it's resolved with us being together or apart, I would like him to be able to figure out how he really feels, so that he can accept that choice and hopefully start to become more comfortable with it, and happier. Saying that, he was never any good at making decisions so all the information in the world may not help him, since he can't know how he'll feel in the future. p:

I believe he always understood I was not your average girl. And definitely not a girly girl. Though it's still a giant hurdle from that to transguy. But he is already making an effort to think of me as male it seems, eg. calling me my brother's brother. :)

I'm just a few steps ahead of you, Banf, and with a lot of parallels. My boyfriend and I had known each other for years, but when we got together I was living in another country and it was 6 months before I saw him after our declaraciòn de amor.  :icon_flower:

I came out to my soulmate mid '08 about being a ->-bleeped-<-, a few months before I returned to the US. At first he was pretty cool with it, just wanted to know more. We hit some rough patches further on in our relationship when I started dressing and acting more masculine, especially in the *ahem* bedroom. ;)  But he did some soul-searching and so did I, and we're still together today, 2 mos shy of 2 yrs. We might hit more rough spots once I've save up enough money to get T and top surgery, but that's a few years in the future, so we'll see. :)

We do plan to get married someday, so this is def a long-term relationship.

Sorry to bump this topic, but I was wondering if your relationship worked out. I'm currently in a similar position as your boyfriend was a little over a year ago and I'm looking for any sort of hope that a straight relationship can survive this without the partner being attracted to men (at least not before the transition).

Thanks.

Replying for the new "original poster"/tread bumper:

I am an FTM who is sticking together with my before-transition spouse, who had previously identified as straight and for the most part is. Our relationship is better now, because I can be who I am and not have to try hard or pretend to be something I'm not. And he rocks. Hehehe.

In my opinion, based on my relationship and others I am aware of that are successful, here is what it takes:

(1) Guy must have *somewhere* in him an attraction to masculinity and/or being sexual with men, independent of everything else.
(2) Guy's attraction to FTM must not be particularly linked to the female gender (this not the same thing as feminine sides and aspects - that's not my deal, but I know for others, playing with femininty even as a guy is ok).
(3) Guy must have open or laid back attitude about how others see him & view him, including being seen as GAY, because it will ultimately be a gay relationship.
(4) FTM must not be type to be jealous of or threatened with guy checks out women, watches straight porn, etc. Both partners are open and honest about boundaries that are kept, whether monogamous or not.
(5) GOOD COMMUNICATION!!! (This is true for everyone, of course.)

If you have the emotional fortitude, you could enjoy it while it lasts and allow it to shift "naturally" into a close friendship instead of a romantic/sexual relationship as the dynamic changes and he stops seeing you as a chick

this was the thing with my boyfriend when i came out to him as FtM. He loved me and he said he would go gay for me. but, in the end it just didnt work. he still saw me as a girl. We had to breakup because he wanted a girlfriend and i just couldnt give him that. You might have to let things go...hes striaght and wants a girl, unfortunatly you cant change who you are for him. I do know there are FtMs whos realationships do work out, mine just didnt haha Hopefully you guys can stay together, it'll just take some hard work on his part haha