Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Only semi-seriously, why would anyone want to be a woman when they could be a man?  😉

Pretty basic part of the human condition that a whole lot of people want what they don't have.

 (https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cosgan.de%2Fimages%2Fsmilie%2Fkonfus%2Fs045.gif&hash=fffc9dd09b999346fd87233bf250be606994a893)  (https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cosgan.de%2Fimages%2Fsmilie%2Fkonfus%2Fs050.gif&hash=2cd6b8640d0a11c39fb4e7bc473e663a22729499)  (https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cosgan.de%2Fimages%2Fsmilie%2Fkonfus%2Fp050.gif&hash=de2f7ad0f1c2cc7201100e7409f2f24ebb90e536)

I might ask why would anyone want to be a man, when they could be a woman? 

Men create war, woman are left to pickup the pieces.  Men just set there, never letting their feelings out.

As far as I am concerned men are good for one thing.  But OMG that one thing.  ::) ::) ::) ::)

But I still love you Nero, even if you are just a guy.  😉 :-*



Hugs and Love
Janet

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 06, 2009, 02:52:32 PM
Men create war, woman are left to pickup the pieces.  Men just set there, never letting their feelings out.

As far as I am concerned men are good for one thing.  But OMG that one thing.  ::) ::) ::) ::)

So much less stressful creating havoc than having to run around correcting other's mistakes :D
And that "men are only good for one thing" mantra you women have...keep chanting that, it makes life so much easier when you have lower expectations of us.

I'm with Nero. Men FTW.

As a woman I am not expected to be tough and macho - though if I do occasionally choose to be I get extra kudos for it.

As a woman in a relationship I get to be a nurturing mother, probably the most important role on the planet.

As a woman I am allowed to cry and generally be slushy if want to.

As a woman I can talk about my feelings to my friends without getting funny looks.

As a woman I am more in touch with my feelings and inner self.

As a woman I will probably live longer.

As a woman I rarely have to get dirty changing a tyre on my vehicle. All I do is stand there looking helpless and some kind man get's dirty for me.  :)

As a woman I have a far better sexual responses and enjoyment. (Seriously, the first time I erm... hit the top after SRS it nearly blew my brains out! - I hope that isn't too graphic.)

As a woman my skin is softer and more sensitive, my eyesight is better and under the influence of estrogen my immune system functions better.

As a woman I can wear either female or male attire without anyone questioning me.

I could go on - but this is already way too long a list. I rest my case.

(well you did ask!)  ;D

Quote from: Christian >.> on December 06, 2009, 03:22:55 PM
So much less stressful creating havoc than having to run around correcting other's mistakes :D
And that "men are only good for one thing" mantra you women have...keep chanting that, it makes life so much easier when you have lower expectations of us.

I'm with Nero. Men FTW.

Not get me wrong Christian,  I love Men, their scent, their eyes, their arms, their kiss.  ::)  Hum, where can I get one? ???

I just never was one, despite the anatomy.  And I may kid you guys, but it is only meant in fun.  :-*



Hugs and Love
Janet

In a general sense, I'm with Tekla.  Personal preference and all that.  It's kind of like asking "Why would anyone eat vanilla ice cream when they could eat chocolate?"  There are upsides and downsides to anything.  You're going to value some parts more than others though, and those values will often determine your choice...if you have one.
.
Though, personally, I wish it were as simple as just wanting something that I don't have.  It's more about living in a situation that doesn't fit me mentally, emotionally, or physically.  It's not a bad situation in-and-of-itself.  It fits many people just fine...but not me.

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 06, 2009, 03:50:03 PM
I just never was one, despite the anatomy. 

I think that Janet nailed it. It's not that we want to be a "man" or a "woman", but rather we want to be our true selves, whatever that may be.

Ah Nero, you said what I have been wondering since I knew the humans had 2 perceived sexes. the grass may be greener and all that but I still have no idea why any one would want to be a woman. Want one yes, be one no.  I have learned, finally, that some really do want to be women and don't understand why I am not happy with "what god gave me".

If only they understood that "god" gave me a male mind, maybe they would get what I feel. Oh well, cis people will never quite get it I think.

Quote from: LordKAT on December 06, 2009, 04:44:01 PM
Oh well, cis people will never quite get it I think.

The worst thing is that when you had SRS as long ago as I did you start to think CIS!  :o  ;D

I personally don't want to be a woman, but I can understand that people want different things. Maybe I don't understand their thinking, but that's okay. They probably don't understand mine either.

I suppose if someone's very maternal, they might want to be a woman.

I'm truly baffled by the logic myself, but eh, i'm sure most of ya ladies are confused at all us guys here... so who can talk?

But i'd much rather cause the trouble than have to clean it up 😛

You made me laugh Nero, cute.

Its all a matter of perspective.

:)

Sarah L.

Personally I don't know why anyone would want to be a man...but thank God that they do! :icon_love:

Quote from: rejennyrated on December 06, 2009, 04:54:58 PM
The worst thing is that when you had SRS as long ago as I did you start to think CIS!  :o  ;D

OK, but at least you still have the knowledge.

Quote from: Wendy1974 on December 06, 2009, 05:55:23 PM
Personally I don't know why anyone would want to be a man...but thank God that they do! :icon_love:

Good point but in reverse.

Quote from: rejennyrated on December 06, 2009, 04:54:58 PM
The worst thing is that when you had SRS as long ago as I did you start to think CIS!  :o  ;D

And for most who went through the mill in "the bad old days" I am pretty sure you "thought CIS" before hormones or surgery to. There is no other reason anyone would have been on this path when the chance of survival was nearly zero! Look at how few survived before the 1970's - it was an impossible quest.

Why would anyone want to be a woman (or a man for that matter)?

You is what you is and there's not a damned thing you can do about it!

In the spirit of just being cute.  There are two phrases that come to mind when thinking about men and women.

Quote from: WomenOh God. What did you do now?

Quote from: MenSorry Babe.  Me and the boys are just having a little fun?

Men.  Got love them.  Can't spank them, they like it too much.



Hugs and Love, Boys.  ;)
Janet

I agree with Northern Jane.
It's not a want but it is who you are inside.
If it was only a want I would want to be what my body is.
That would be allot easier.
Jillieann

I never wanted to be a woman. It's just who I am and who I feel comfortable being  :icon_chick:

I don't think you can list a reason because then you can just say, "Be a flamer to be more expressive". "Be yourself". "Don't care what other say".

It's not about being able to do certain things that women can only do, because it's just not true, you can do everything a woman can do as  a man. Sure majority will label you, but there will be people who will accept you especially in the gay realm. And as time going on, gender boundaries are getting less restricted.

So, the true reason to be a woman is because it is you. And you're just trying to piece the puzzle of you and make it all fit, without losing your sanity because your gender is what gives a foundation of your identity in this life.

I know who I am, but I am multi-dimensional (and I think a lot of other people are as well), so it's hard. I want to be a woman because I see myself as one, I want to live this life shaped as a woman since it's a better way of seeing things. I don't want to be in between male and female, but just female if I am female, which means I don't want to be transsexual since people won't accept me as a woman. While as a guy they will accept me being feminine, and think of me more as a woman. (You know what I am saying?) Like in their viewpoints they will think of a transsexual as a guy in a dress, while a gay guy as a sissy, which is more feminine than just being a guy in a dress.

So if I cannot be a woman, I would want to be an ultra feminine guy that is bending towards a woman, but at the same time male. But that cannot last forever, since age will make me more masculine as time goes on. So, it's like going back and forth with these identities (and they all are in my head) and I represent myself as the average male so far.

And given only 1 life, I want to make the best decisions since this could change me forever. I cannot go back, there's nothing bigger than changing your gender. With the exception of raising kids, I think this is the most profound way you can affect your life and the lives around you.

So many of us girls have answered.  But by replacing the pronouns and woman to man, I think things would fit for the guys too.



Hugs and Love
Janet

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 06, 2009, 07:40:38 PM
So many of us girls have answered.

I'm geniunly curious as to why...

Quote from: rejennyrated on December 06, 2009, 03:30:22 PM
As a woman I am not expected to be tough and macho - though if I do occasionally choose to be I get extra kudos for it.

As a woman in a relationship I get to be a nurturing mother, probably the most important role on the planet.

As a woman I am allowed to cry and generally be slushy if want to.

As a woman I can talk about my feelings to my friends without getting funny looks.

As a woman I am more in touch with my feelings and inner self.

As a woman I will probably live longer.

As a woman I rarely have to get dirty changing a tyre on my vehicle. All I do is stand there looking helpless and some kind man get's dirty for me.  :)

As a woman I have a far better sexual responses and enjoyment. (Seriously, the first time I erm... hit the top after SRS it nearly blew my brains out! - I hope that isn't too graphic.)

As a woman my skin is softer and more sensitive, my eyesight is better and under the influence of estrogen my immune system functions better.

As a woman I can wear either female or male attire without anyone questioning me.

I could go on - but this is already way too long a list. I rest my case.

(well you did ask!)  ;D

I love this post the one thing not sad is I can kiss my boy frind and no one look
   And the most inporting part I can be me

To give a halfway serious answer....   Because the stress of trying to fit in and function as a man for decades has become so corrosive to my soul that I would rather die than continue as things are.  It is as tortuous as living as an expatriate but having to constantly view your homeland all around you.   Because the thought of dying one day as an old man is so disingenuous that it seems ludicrous. 

On a more positive note, I do love the power a smile (or just a tiny bit more) can have over a guy.  Men do not have anything akin to this kind of charm, and I am convinced it is the power that makes the world turn.

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi

This is an old song, but I feel like this when I am thinking about transitioning.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnYQmXlovV0# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnYQmXlovV0#)

I don't know.
Being a woman is just a better fit for me.
I like being open, feeling other people's emotions, looking them in the eye.
I like wandering and looking at everything with the naivete of a 3 year-old.
I like not worrying about being a doofus, which is my true identity.

Kristi put it better than I could

QuoteTo give a halfway serious answer....   Because the stress of trying to fit in and function as a man for decades has become so corrosive to my soul that I would rather die than continue as things are.  It is as tortuous as living as an expatriate but having to constantly view your homeland all around you.   Because the thought of dying one day as an old man is so disingenuous that it seems ludicrous. 

I so much agree.

And we can wear silk pink apparel.   ;)
Jillieann

Honestly, some days I don't even want to be a human. Especially during these cold months I think i'd rather be a mushroom and just stay under my quilts in the warm darkness. I was holding a dog last night and actually found myself envious of him, the way he felt so relaxed and safe is something I've never experienced.

Quote from: Nero on December 06, 2009, 02:10:54 PM
Only semi-seriously, why would anyone want to be a woman when they could be a man?  ;)

Well, Nero, you see there needs to be someone I can oogle at and men just don't do it for me. Is that a good enough answer?  ;D

Quote from: Lachlann on December 06, 2009, 08:32:34 PM
Well, Nero, you see there needs to be someone I can oogle at and men just don't do it for me. Is that a good enough answer?  ;D

And that is why man was made.   😉 Sugar.


Hugs and Love
Janet

The funny thing is, I was thinking about this before, as in "Why would anyone want to be a man when they can be a woman?" and I was thinking about posting it here, but I was afraid of being flamed to death. 😛

Oy vey, straight people.  ::)  ;)

Okay, I'll try to answer the question. Once upon a time, say, several months ago and stretching back a long time, I wanted to be a woman. I'm not really sure why. I guess it had something to do with being allowed to express emotions more, to do girly things without being seen as peculiar, etc. Most importantly, to be able to have relationships with other women without the interference of the gender barrier.

Now I don't see any particular benefit. It's just a way to be, and the way I am. I guess you could say my dreams have lost some grandeur coming true. I mean, if you were Joni Mitchell, you might say that. But, damn, it's good to quit playing a role I wasn't any good at.

Of course, some people might still think it's better to be a man. Fine, I wouldn't know. But it seems to me the only reason anyone thinks that is because of patriarchal notions that still pervade our society. I don't see how it makes a difference. Besides peeing standing up, women can do literally everything a man can do. Besides giving birth and breastfeeding, men can do everything women can do. Some things women do better (on average), and some things men. But most of life isn't a competition, thank goodness; if it were, almost everybody would lose, male or female, and the question wouldn't matter anyway.

ok - a personal answer and then a general theorem

For my own internal processing, it's not so much wanting to be, as not wanting to be. I can think of almost any trait, physical or attitude wise, that is characteristically "male" and the idea that I might be that is repulsive to me.

I know that I'm playing into, maybe a victim of, stereotypical thinking in some of these, but it's a visceral reaction...

I want to be soft, not hard
i want to be weak, not strong
I want to be gentle, not aggressive
I want to be submissive, not dominant
I want to be small and petite, not big and broad
I want to be curvy, not angular....

I could go on and on. when I walk through the store or the mall and i look at the men and women around me I can't even get past this line of thought to get down to what I'm sexually attracted to - I just see a guy of any age, in a suit or in overalls, looking dapper or dirty...and my heart says "I don't want to look like that!!"
and I see a woman, of any age and almost any shape (I confess that the more masculine women kind of trip the breakers a bit) and whether she's a bare-midrift teenybopper or a soccer mom or a graceful older lady I...resonate...with that persons appearance and conduct and mannerisms and all the rest.

In fact, when I force myself through all the fog and really look hard at my sexuality, it's so weird that I can't remember the last time I look at a good looking woman and thought to myself "man i'd like to ____ her!" even though I recognize, on an intellectual level, that she is sexually desirable.
On the other hand,i can imagine myself easily as the sort of woman who is quite promiscuous and insatiable when it comes to sex with guys even though when I look at them (now) I don't really see what there is to be attracted to (not to say that I can't call a good looking man a good looking man...for a man)

I here my sisters sometimes, in other forums, talking about hooking up with this guy or that and I think "damn that sounds like a lot of fun!" but yet I don't find myself looking at guys normally, when I'm not dwelling on my sexuality, in that context.

anyway, that's a pretty huge tangent I guess but what I'm getting at is that all these feelings are instinctive, visceral. When Nero asks "why wouldn't anyone want to be a guy?" the very things he's seeing as advantages are in fact the very things which repel me.

Now, maybe I'm presuming too much to extrapolate these things to a general hypothesis but here goes:

I would suggest that the reason we want to be women is because by nature's designs, men and women respond to and crave different stimuli, different interactions with the world around us.

The very things that are seen, in the abstract, as "male advantage" are the things that are stimuli that the "normal" man responds to. And having female minds, they don't impress us at all.

And the same applies in reverse - the things our female mind craves as stimuli can't be found in the male world, but those things are repulsive to those of you born female in form but male in your thinking.

you crave the very stimuli that I and my sisters recoil from.

we can no more understand the "why?" for each other than a cis person could understand either of us. We just have the experiences which equip us to accept the validity of each other's respective difficulty.

Quote from: LordKAT on December 06, 2009, 04:44:01 PMI have learned, finally, that some really do want to be women and don't understand why I am not happy with "what god gave me".

It seems basic, but I thought everyone would rather be a guy and just "settled" for being a woman. Not true I guess.

Quote from: Alyssa M. on December 06, 2009, 09:57:27 PMI don't see how it makes a difference. Besides peeing standing up, women can do literally everything a man can do. Besides giving birth and breastfeeding, men can do everything women can do. Some things women do better (on average), and some things men. But most of life isn't a competition, thank goodness; if it were, almost everybody would lose, male or female, and the question wouldn't matter anyway.

I really like the way you look at it.

Umm... Can I add a little sanity back to this debate? Have we all suddenly forgotten that boys are icky?!  ;D

(Diana: proudly reliving my childhood since... well childhood probably. But I never got to do it properly, so there!)

Quote from: Diana_W on December 07, 2009, 12:32:05 AM
Umm... Can I add a little sanity back to this debate? Have we all suddenly forgotten that boys are icky?!  ;D

(Diana: proudly reliving my childhood since... well childhood probably. But I never got to do it properly, so there!)

But you girls have cooties! Is that not infinitely worse? 😛

QuoteUmm... Can I add a little sanity back to this debate? Have we all suddenly forgotten that boys are icky?!

Since WHEN?  ;D


Hugs and Love
Janet

Quote from: SilverFang on December 07, 2009, 12:37:11 AM
But you girls have cooties! Is that not infinitely worse? :P

Well yes, that's because guys tend to mistake cooties for cookies and always want some  ::)

Quote from: Virginia Marie on December 07, 2009, 12:44:18 AM
Well yes, that's because guys tend to mistake cooties for cookies and always want some  ::)

If you look anything like the pic in my mind from the personality in your posts,  with or without a cookie, Ye i want some.


What did ya expect?

Simple answer:

I tried. All I ever did when trying to do what I perceived as normal boy things hurt me and the people around me. I awoke from my male puberty as if I were in a flaming city and had no idea that I did it, or how I did it.

The last relationship that was "hetero" male that I had... Basically part of me knew that if I couldn't  succeed, I was sick, or had been affected by weird porn by looking it at out of curiosity too much, and that normal sexual activity for me (The perceived male)... I got into the relationship because I wanted to prove to myself that I could do normal guy things in real life. The dysphoria, which I thought was a fetishistic sickness at the time, and her never seeing me ruined the relationship. Thats pretty much when he started to shed away. I stopped working out like crazy, and stopped the odd martial arts lessons I was getting from I friend. I kinda stopped a lot of things....

So basically I tried because I thought I had no choice. To someone ignorant, why would this craving exist to be a girl? Why would it present itself in such a way?

Eventually I realized it was because I split my life in half. My day life was being him, and my nightlife was letting her out so I wouldn't explode.


Then I realized... Hey.... I've been having these thoughts since way before I had mass media. Since I had the internet, since I had anything which would plant these thoughts into my mind.

And then I started to really really REALLY wonder. My curiosity overtook my utter confusion after the last relationship. And then I found a website with real trans people and drugs... Lots of drugs. I could say in some respects that camwhores and drugs catalyzed me to start my life the right way. : D

I prefer the silly, tounge-in-cheek interpretation of this thread.

Manhood is awesome  ;D

We don't have to wear annoying tight and delicate clothes, heels, or smear weird coloured stuff on our faces when we go out.

(Also, we get all the best clothes... POCKETS FTW!)

It's not weird if we like spending time alone with machines.

We can still build models, play computer games, race go-karts, stay up all night coding, have lan parties, etc well into adulthood - and it's socially acceptable (ok, a little weird.... but still much more acceptable than it is for women).

We don't have to pretend to be interested in someone elses snot nosed brats. Someone shows us their ugly baby on their cameraphone, and it's ok for us to say "Nice Phone!" - and not sound like we're covering for something.

We don't have to be all "touchy-feely" - men get to keep their personal space to themselves in social groups.

We can surround ourselves with cool, latest gen gadgets while still wearing the same free trade show tshirts from ten years ago - and it's normal.

It's acceptable for us to not have a family, or even want a family. We can live the single life, and not get hasseled too badly for it. Fewer people annoy us about getting married and having kids, etc.

We get listened to on technical matters (though I'm still very aware first hand of what you ladies go through...).

We can eat the damn cookie 🙂 (Diet? Isn't that something women do?). It's ok to have an extra 10kg on - you get a little more social wiggle room if you're a man.

Quote from: Teknoir on December 07, 2009, 05:39:07 AM
I prefer the silly, tounge-in-cheek interpretation of this thread.

Manhood is awesome  ;D

(Also, we get all the best clothes... POCKETS FTW!)

I've never quite understood the purpose of the "faux pocket" on women's clothes. If you're going to make the effort to make it look like the garment should have pockets, why not go full out and give em the whole shebang?

Quote from: Christian >.> on December 07, 2009, 06:40:41 AM
I've never quite understood the purpose of the "faux pocket" on women's clothes. If you're going to make the effort to make it look like the garment should have pockets, why not go full out and give em the whole shebang?

Ha! I've got pants with pockets that you'd have a hard time sticking a guitar pick in, well, at least getting it out again!

Pocketbooks FTW!

(I guess this could be its own thread.)

Quote from: Renate on December 07, 2009, 06:48:41 AM
Ha! I've got pants with pockets that you'd have a hard time sticking a guitar pick in, well, at least getting it out again!

Pocketbooks FTW!

(I guess this could be its own thread.)

I have better uses for my hands than to hold onto a 'pocket book'. BTW:It can't be a pocket book if it don't fit into a pocket. And, I certainly don't want to risk leaving anything behind when I leave a place. such as a 'pocket book'.

Who seriously wants big ugly chunky pockets ruining the cut of your clothes when you can have a lovely hand or shoulder bag (or indeed a purse as I now realise you call it over there).

Better still as a bag (purse) has to be colour co-ordinated with ones shoes we've also got a fantastic excuse for spending our ill afforded pounds on those dreamy Jimmy Choo's or Manolo Blahniks :D  After all I can't spoil the effect of my Louis Vuitton by having shoes which don't match 😉

I wonder.....do women just have a shopping fetish and no pockets enables that fetish?


eh  more psycho babble from a non psycho trained type person

No way, Kat.  Women have the PURSE gene.  Observe for yourself.  Men can never navigate the inner recesses of one.  They end up dumping everything out to find something.  I always figured that if they would test for it, the genetic basis for GID would be well established.

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi

Quote from: Christian >.> on December 07, 2009, 06:40:41 AM
I've never quite understood the purpose of the "faux pocket" on women's clothes. If you're going to make the effort to make it look like the garment should have pockets, why not go full out and give em the whole shebang?

Always hated the lack of pockets on women's clothes. First reason for buying men's clothes.

And the sizing, how do you ladies understand the sizing? What's wrong with measuring something in inches/cm? Inches/cm are the same in every country. The women's sizing is different across countries, across companies, even across designs. Why include the number at all?

Quote from: LordKAT on December 07, 2009, 08:18:19 AM
I wonder.....do women just have a shopping fetish and no pockets enables that fetish?

They perpetuate each other in an endless chicken-and-egg style cycle.

If you guys have all these great pockets, why do you always ask us "to hold this for me"?  Because we have a purse, and you think that we are you private pack animal.  Put it in you own pocket, silly.

And why do you guys need to wear your jeans down around your butt? God, Pull Up Your Pants.



Hugs and Love
Janet

Quote from: SilverFang on December 07, 2009, 08:57:38 AM
And the sizing, how do you ladies understand the sizing? What's wrong with measuring something in inches/cm? Inches/cm are the same in every country. The women's sizing is different across countries, across companies, even across designs. Why include the number at all?

Probably so they can have an excuse to use the fitting room and thus extend their time in the store, rather than grab and go like we gents do. 

Quote from: noxdraconis on December 07, 2009, 10:48:31 AM
Probably so they can have an excuse to use the fitting room and thus extend their time in the store, rather than grab and go like we gents do.

Shopping is not something to be rushed, it's a very serious business and it needs savouring!  :D

Sometimes I can happily spend all day buying just one item. (seriously!)

Although it is better if my partner lets me off the leash and I can buy lots  of things. ;D

(although funnily enough she herself doesn't seem to have this female shopping gene - she is more of a grab and go girl - so they do exist!)

Quote from: noxdraconis on December 07, 2009, 10:48:31 AM
Probably so they can have an excuse to use the fitting room and thus extend their time in the store, rather than grab and go like we gents do. 

When is this "Grab and Go'?  At the change of the century?  Men don't shop.  Women do.  And Transwomen do it with Gusto.  Because Gusto has a Platinum AM-EX.  😮 ;D



Hugs and Love
Janet

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 07, 2009, 10:55:58 AM
When is this "Grab and Go'?  At the change of the century?  Men don't shop.  Women do.  And Transwomen do it with Gusto.  Because Gusto has a Platinum AM-EX.  😮 ;D



Hugs and Love
Janet

We have to if we do not have a woman to do it for us  :'(

I have no idea why anyone would want to be, or enjoy being a woman.

Women (generally...)

have to wear tighter more uncomfortable clothes
they have to look nice all the time, or they will get scoffed at
they are expected to be the damsel in distress, and who wants to be that?
if they don't wear makeup, other women may make fun of them
periods for bio women, those suck, its a terrible pointless thing
they are not as strong
their skin isnt as strong, tough (I can't wait for my skin to get tougher lol)
they don't get as much appreciation, or money in their career's
they are expected to raise the children, especially if the father leaves them
if they have sex a lot they are considered a slut, while a guy would be considered a cool guy
sex is better for men, women have to fake it more
and.. girls= drama drama drama!


plus, guys are sexier :)

my opinion, as sexist as it is lol

btw, I may be a bit biassed, seeing as I am a bit bitter, that my body IS female

Quote from: noxdraconis on December 07, 2009, 11:01:55 AM
We have to if we do not have a woman to do it for us  :'(

Do you have a Platinum Am-Ex?  If Yes, Gimme and I will be right back...........in about 8 hours............Oh what is your sizes again?



Hugs and Love
Janet

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Post Merge: December 07, 2009, 11:28:22 AM

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Quote from: Elijah on December 07, 2009, 11:07:36 AM


sex is better for men, women have to fake it more

plus, guys are sexier :)

That is because the man, involved, isn't up to the task.  And I will take that period any day, any time.  And Yes I know what I am asking.  I have been married three times, and my second ex had really bad ones.



But I still love Ya, Elijah
Hugs and Love
Janet

Unfortunately we have designated social roles for women and men so eloquently (if not unintentionally) pointed out here:

Quote
As a woman I am not expected to be tough and macho - though if I do occasionally choose to be I get extra kudos for it.

As a woman in a relationship I get to be a nurturing mother, probably the most important role on the planet.

As a woman I am allowed to cry and generally be slushy if want to.

As a woman I can talk about my feelings to my friends without getting funny looks.

As a woman I am more in touch with my feelings and inner self.

...

As a woman I rarely have to get dirty changing a tyre on my vehicle. All I do is stand there looking helpless and some kind man get's dirty for me.  :)

I far more easily fit into the social role of a female based on my natural tendencies.  But I've found I can now do those things as a man and have similar expectations of me as a man too.

So why would anyone want to be a woman instead of a man?  Certainly there are many social disadvantages, but I've found there to be three main reasons stated during my time with other transsexuals,

1) They believe themselves to actually BE women and cannot see any way to be men.
2) They want the social roles traditionally associated with females.
3) They thing being a woman will make life "easier" - benevolent sexism taken to the extreme and especially easy to say if you've only ever been a man and never taken an interest in the plight of women world wide.  (I don't have a high opinion of people (men or women) who think this way (transsexual or cis), but I believe everyone can be educated 😉 )

Quote from: Elijah on December 07, 2009, 11:07:36 AM
I have no idea why anyone would want to be, or enjoy being a woman.

Women (generally...)

have to wear tighter more uncomfortable clothes

which is nice actually!

Quotethey have to look nice all the time, or they will get scoffed at.

ermm... well I guess I just don't care about that.

Quotethey are expected to be the damsel in distress, and who wants to be that?

Me - especially if there are any knights in shining armor around!

Quoteif they don't wear makeup, other women may make fun of them.

Only in a fun way!

Quoteperiods for bio women, those suck, its a terrible pointless thing

Seriously I still cry about this frequently so please don't jest about it I SOOOOO wish I had them....  :' I would have done anything and paid any price. ( Because if I had them then I could get pregnant which inability is my one real lasting regret about all this. )

Quotethey are not as strong

who wants to be stong! I rather have a hunk to do it for me!

Quotetheir skin isnt as strong, tough (I can't wait for my skin to get tougher lol)

I like my delicate skin I can feel more. (and even when I was supposed to be a guy it was always delicate - thankfully it never coarsened or grew hair)

Quotethey don't get as much appreciation, or money in their career's

Well money isn't everything.

Quotethey are expected to raise the children, especially if the father leaves them

Seriously I would love to have done that.

Quoteif they have sex a lot they are considered a slut, while a guy would be considered a cool guy

Not by me. - and anyway the trick for a woman is to have it without getting caught.

Quotesex is better for men, women have to fake it more

Not in my experience! Seriously - I never had a climax until I was female

Quoteand.. girls= drama drama drama!

= Fun Fun Fun! ;D

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Post Merge: December 07, 2009, 12:10:37 PM

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Quote from: interalia on December 07, 2009, 11:50:05 AM
(I don't have a high opinion of people (men or women) who think this way (transsexual or cis), but I believe everyone can be educated 😉 )

which is fine. (and I realise this is only semi serious) But of course the one thing you can't educate away is the feeling of discomfort and maybe even hatred for ones own bodily appearance and bits. That can only be fixed by surgery (or hopefully some years in the future gene therapy) and for me that is the fundamental - I like being a woman physically - I did not like being male. End of ability to debate for me. Enough said.

Quote from: rejennyrated on December 07, 2009, 07:42:35 AM
Who seriously wants big ugly chunky pockets ruining the cut of your clothes when you can have a lovely hand or shoulder bag (or indeed a purse as I now realise you call it over there).

Better still as a bag (purse) has to be colour co-ordinated with ones shoes we've also got a fantastic excuse for spending our ill afforded pounds on those dreamy Jimmy Choo's or Manolo Blahniks :D  After all I can't spoil the effect of my Louis Vuitton by having shoes which don't match ;)

I actually love cargo pants... I just wish that they made fitted ones with big cargo pockets. I mean... Ones that harmonize and are cute... But pockets that fit stuff...

AND a purse. I mean, I carry around a lot of stuff... Digital recorder, wallet with coin purse, sketchbook, laptop, pens, pencils, xacto knife, daily planner, school badge, drinks...
ETC

Oh... And most essential. 120 gig iPod totally filled up.

Quote from: rejennyrated on December 07, 2009, 12:03:02 PM

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Post Merge: December 07, 2009, 12:10:37 PM

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which is fine. (and I realise this is only semi serious) But of course the one thing you can't educate away is the feeling of discomfort and maybe even hatred for ones own bodily appearance and bits. That can only be fixed by surgery (or hopefully some years in the future gene therapy) and for me that is the fundamental - I like being a woman physically - I did not like being male. End of ability to debate for me. Enough said.

I hope you didn't take my quote personally (unless it actually describes you).  I was speaking only of not having a high opinion of individuals who believe being a woman is easier which is a form of benevolent sexism taken to the extreme and have never taken an interest in the plight of women world wide.

Quote from: interalia on December 07, 2009, 12:35:08 PM
I hope you didn't take my quote personally (unless it actually describes you).  I was speaking only of not having a high opinion of individuals who believe being a woman is easier which is a form of benevolent sexism taken to the extreme and have never taken an interest in the plight of women world wide.

Good lord no! - and even if it had been it's your absolute right to hold that opinion! I totally respect the complete integrity of your point of view even if we diverge a little, and I greatly value our enjoyable little jousts! :)

But as you rightly say we are both slightly in jest in this thread anyway!

Women are MOODY---just today I managed to send my girlfriend near crying out of the room with a pretty harmless comment >.< Took me an hour of getting to hear how stupid and insensitive I am to get her to smile again. I love T, I haven't cried since I started on it--I feel like I can actually think clearly instead of getting off-the-handle upset.

I agree with Elijah, the Red Death is a horrible, horrible experience. Ruins clothing too.

Oh, and as for the pants-around-the-knees thing...I refuse to let my pants sag like that. I buy my pants to fit and usually wear a belt. Hell, sometimes I even tuck my shirt in like a good boy.

Quote from: Christian >.> on December 07, 2009, 01:48:34 PM
I agree with Elijah, the Red Death is a horrible, horrible experience. Ruins clothing too.

If only we could have just swapped organs... but I can understand that for you having it must be as much of a torture as not having it genuinely is for me. But do cry about it because I so wanted to be fertile but the only ovaries I could have had never formed.

Ah well maybe in the future...

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 07, 2009, 10:47:01 AM
If you guys have all these great pockets, why do you always ask us "to hold this for me"?  Because we have a purse, and you think that we are you private pack animal.  Put it in you own pocket, silly.

Well, at stores, the people will start following/stalking you, assuming that you're gonna shoplift stuff


Or maybe that's just me..

Quote from: Christian >.> on December 07, 2009, 01:48:34 PMI buy my pants to fit and usually wear a belt.

Belts are amazing
(says the guy who has to get pants to fit his hips, not waist..)

Quote from: Christian >.> on December 07, 2009, 01:48:34 PM

I agree with Elijah, the Red Death is a horrible, horrible experience. Ruins clothing too.

This doesn't do the red death justice.

humiliating, disturbing, horrible, painful, debilitating,

now those are a few (very few) correct terms for it. It ruins your life for the entire time it exists. It follows no pattern comes and goes with no rhyme nor reason. It gives no benefit except as a method for men to put you down as worthless and weak. It costs money just to attempt to survive through. I will never understand someone wanting to be disabled as this does to me. Wishing to have it is like wishing for suicide. it makes no sense.

We don't wise it to have the pain, mess etc. >:-) We wish it because we would love to be able to get pregnant with our own child. 🙁

@LordKat Well I guess I'm pretty crazy then! But I'm happy in my insanity and of course it makes perfect sense to me to wish for it. I just wish I could wave a wand and take it away from you and transfer it to me. If I could I really and truly would and without a moments hesitation.

Quote from: Keroppi on December 07, 2009, 03:13:02 PM
We don't wise it to have the pain, mess etc. >:-) We wish it because we would love to be able to get pregnant with our own child. :(

Understood. Now if it could happen without the bad side effect, it would be even better I' sure. I have met the theory that I'm not trans because I wouldn't give up the time of being 5 months pregnant for anything. That moment you first feel them move.  I know cis men who have wished for this so I feel that theory is wrong. I would that I could share that with you also.

Quote from: rejennyrated
link=topic=69155.msg467109#msg467109 date=1260220648
@LordKat Well I guess I'm pretty crazy then! But I'm happy in my insanity and of course it makes perfect sense to me to wish for it. I just wish I could wave a wand and take it away from you and transfer it to me. If I could I really and truly would and without a moments hesitation.

Your a wonderful crazy lady and I love ya for it.  Sanity is overrated. Insanity has allowed me to act up in some ways and be taken as that is just that darn old KAT again. works for me. I would hand you that wand and tell you the magic words if that is all it would take. As above I would that you could share all the wonders that being pregnant brings, (without the pain and mess if I had that choice).


I don't mean to put any of you down. I do hope to share my abhorrence of what over half my life (red death) is like for me. No more and no less.

I think we can apply soccer logic to this one:

As a man you can play soccer, and everyone thinks you act like a gay man even if you are not - e.g. when scoring a goal, or faking an injury. Women can also play soccer, and everyone thinks you are probably gay and they are probably right. ;).

So as a man, soccer allows you to be more expressive and touchy feely with your fellow man and get a grope of each others privates even if you are not gay. That is a good reason to be a man. But as a woman you get to hang out with a whole bunch of hot sweaty chicks and have soapy showers together. That is an excellent reason to want to be a woman!

Based on the brilliance of soccer logic I think it is a tie people!

Quote from: LordKAT on December 07, 2009, 03:26:02 PM
Your a wonderful crazy lady and I love ya for it.  Sanity is overrated. Insanity has allowed me to act up in some ways and be taken as that is just that darn old KAT again. works for me. I would hand you that wand and tell you the magic words if that is all it would take. As above I would that you could share all the wonders that being pregnant brings, (without the pain and mess if I had that choice).

I don't mean to put any of you down. I do hope to share my abhorrence of what over half my life (red death) is like for me. No more and no less.

We do understand that!

But personally I always like to pay the bill. I would happily go through a lifetime of pain and mess (not forgetting that smell) if I could, and consider it scant payment for the miracle of motherhood without adoption.

I think for me it is also made worse by the knowledge that I came so darned close. Atrophied undeveloped womb and ovaries which sadly could never have developed were found when I had investigations for what was originally thought to be a persistent abcess.

Amen Sister. Ahem



Blessed Be
Janet

because masculinity is a sin.

Because I'm over the man thing. It's over rated  :-*

Alexie

Quote from: Kristi on December 07, 2009, 08:52:03 AM
No way, Kat.  Women have the PURSE gene.  Observe for yourself.  Men can never navigate the inner recesses of one.  They end up dumping everything out to find something.  I always figured that if they would test for it, the genetic basis for GID would be well established.

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi

Metro guys with manbag skills might throw it off.

I think the real test is "Can you fold a fitted sheet?"

I tried. I can't. Even after many years, dealing with those things is a skill that escapes me. The last time I tried to so much as hang one on the clothes line, I poked myself in the eye with it. I didn't even know that was possible.

What?  They are just as easy as a flat sheet.  No wonder you are a guy.  I have folded fitted sheets for years.  Even showed my second ex how to do it.



Hugs and Love
Janet

Then you're a witch...
I don't see how that folds like a regular sheet o.O Really don't.

I actually don't own a fitted sheet since I can't fold one or put one on a bed without a fight. I just take a normal flat sheet and tuck it under the mattress.

I can't fold a fitted sheet, or even put one on my bed well. Lol gotta love stereotypes.

i can't fold a fitted sheet, but i can put it on my bed lol

whenever i try to fold one, it just looks like a lumpy pile

Well I can bring home the bacon, fry it up in a pan, and never ever let you forget you're a man.

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi

Eh. . . what's a fitted sheet?

Getting back to the subject....

What???? ???

Quote from: SilverFang on December 07, 2009, 10:43:55 PM
Eh. . . what's a fitted sheet?

A bottom bedsheet with elastic around the edges. Supposed to keep it from bunching up and uncovering the mattress.

Folding one is near impossible. I end up with a big balled lump, sometimes with an arm or a leg in it.


On the plus side, none of the clocks in my house are ever flashing 12:00. Gotta know what you're good at  :laugh:

Quote from: Teknoir on December 08, 2009, 03:59:17 AM
A bottom bedsheet with elastic around the edges. Supposed to keep it from bunching up and uncovering the mattress.

Folding one is near impossible. I end up with a big balled lump, sometimes with an arm or a leg in it.


On the plus side, none of the clocks in my house are ever flashing 12:00. Gotta know what you're good at  :laugh:

Ah, I know what you're talking about.

It's possible to fold those? They're evil, and impossible to put on beds too. My bed has a blanket and a pillow, that's it. I guess it's a guy thing, huh?

Quote from: SilverFang on December 08, 2009, 04:12:35 AM
My bed has a blanket and a pillow, that's it.

That's so sad. 🙁

Quote from: SilverFang on December 08, 2009, 04:12:35 AM
Ah, I know what you're talking about.

It's possible to fold those? They're evil, and impossible to put on beds too. My bed has a blanket and a pillow, that's it. I guess it's a guy thing, huh?

I maintain that it's not possible, but women with "the gift" will tell you otherwise  :laugh:

Yeah, it's a guy thing. I've got one of those evil sheets, a pillow and a quilt. The pillow and the quilt (think doona) I moved in with (It was great when sleeping in the back of the car - extra padding and could be folded over for warmth) but the evil sheet is my mothers insistance.

Oh, and that's another thing women seem to be able to do that men can't - get the goddamn quilt back into the quilt cover without it being an hour fight (that ends up with us crawling INTO the cover!  :laugh:).

Hmm... perhaps I'm just not domestically oriented? I see housekeeping FAIL in my future when I move back out again!

Ok Boys, get your printer ready.

Shake the sheet out.  Take one corner and tuck it inside out into the opposite corner, right side out.

Do the same to the other two corners.  Now take one set of corners and tuck them inside out into the other corners.  Place on a flat surface smooth out.

On the long end make sure the edges match and fold the edge with the corners over remaining sheet so the edges away from the corners match.  Fold over the top corners over the sheet.

Take the edge that does not have the corners over the entire sheet.  From here you can fold the sheet to fit in your linen closet.

Take your time and it will fit.



Hugs and Love
Janet

Gee, I always thought the fact that I could easily make a bed with a fitted sheet proved what a guy I was. :P  I mean, guys are supposed to have mechanical ability and be good at spatial relationsips.  It was one of my only claims to Guydom, and now I find out that even that isn't true.  Rats. >:(

Of course guys are also really good at being inept, especially if there is a woman around to pull their fat out of the fire. ::)

I once read a study of the lists of personal effects upon death from 16th Century Europe.  Single men too poor to have servants usually didn't own bed linens.  But these are modern times, right?  Right?

- Kate

Quote from: rejennyrated on December 06, 2009, 03:30:22 PM
As a woman I am not expected to be tough and macho - though if I do occasionally choose to be I get extra kudos for it.

As a woman in a relationship I get to be a nurturing mother, probably the most important role on the planet.

As a woman I am allowed to cry and generally be slushy if want to.

As a woman I can talk about my feelings to my friends without getting funny looks.

As a woman I am more in touch with my feelings and inner self.

As a woman I will probably live longer.

As a woman I rarely have to get dirty changing a tyre on my vehicle. All I do is stand there looking helpless and some kind man get's dirty for me.  :)

As a woman I have a far better sexual responses and enjoyment. (Seriously, the first time I erm... hit the top after SRS it nearly blew my brains out! - I hope that isn't too graphic.)

As a woman my skin is softer and more sensitive, my eyesight is better and under the influence of estrogen my immune system functions better.

As a woman I can wear either female or male attire without anyone questioning me.

I could go on - but this is already way too long a list. I rest my case.

(well you did ask!)  ;D

Ok being FtM I had to answer this particular one since I *have* the natural 'female' body parts still.  My orgasms are nothing special and only go off once no matter what I do. So meh to female parts.  I also have BEEN on estrogen and my immune system is not very good. My skin isn't more sensative either. Oh and I'm pre-T btw ;)

I'm with all the guys here who feel having been a 'woman' it sucks, and will probably kill me before I get to change to be who I am.

Quote from: Kurzar on December 08, 2009, 01:48:49 PM
Ok being FtM I had to answer this particular one since I *have* the natural 'female' body parts still.  My orgasms are nothing special and only go off once no matter what I do. So meh to female parts.  I also have BEEN on estrogen and my immune system is not very good. My skin isn't more sensative either. Oh and I'm pre-T btw ;)

I'm with all the guys here who feel having been a 'woman' it sucks, and will probably kill me before I get to change to be who I am.

Well to be fair my answers were intended to be tongue in cheek  like the thread. (it does say in the title semi-serious). A lot of the things I put in that list are just ideas and in some cases myths that you can find floating around on a lot of pseudo scientific websites and magazines.

But actually what I really think is that we are all at our best, function better, have better experiences, feel generally more healthy when we feel happy and comfortable with ourselves. For you that obviously means the male role - whereas I have always preferred female.

You clearly didn't enjoy female sexual experience. I didn't enjoy male and couldn't function in it. I can as a woman and i do genuinely have toe curlers. Neither of us is wrong - we're just different. 🙂

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 08, 2009, 12:11:01 PM
Ok Boys, get your printer ready.

Shake the sheet out.  Take one corner and tuck it inside out into the opposite corner, right side out.

Do the same to the other two corners.  Now take one set of corners and tuck them inside out into the other corners.  Place on a flat surface smooth out.

On the long end make sure the edges match and fold the edge with the corners over remaining sheet so the edges away from the corners match.  Fold over the top corners over the sheet.

Take the edge that does not have the corners over the entire sheet.  From here you can fold the sheet to fit in your linen closet.

Take your time and it will fit.



Hugs and Love
Janet

Can I just roll it up instead? that's faster

Quote from: insanitylives on December 08, 2009, 03:47:36 PM
Can I just roll it up instead? that's faster

Being completely serious...I have two fitted sheets in my closet. Both are rolled into a ball and shoved into plastic shopping bags. They don't come out because it's too much work to put em on, and too much work getting them back in the bags.

Quote from: Kurzar on December 08, 2009, 01:48:49 PM
Ok being FtM I had to answer this particular one since I *have* the natural 'female' body parts still.  My orgasms are nothing special and only go off once no matter what I do. So meh to female parts. 

same here, I mean they feel good, but its nothing like some of my friends who talk about the whole, toe curling stuff.. I can go more then once though, but its just starting over from scratch again, if that is what it means anyway, I cant wait for more male orgasms, because they do change on T.

Quote from: insanitylives on December 08, 2009, 03:47:36 PM
Can I just roll it up instead? that's faster

Why does that not surprise me?  Typical guy!  ;)  That is why guys want girlfriends...to fold the linens.  :-*



Hugs and Love
Janet

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 08, 2009, 04:09:08 PM
That is why guys want girlfriends...to fold the linens.  :-*
Hugs and Love
Janet

Wait..linens get folded?  ???

Quote from: Kurzar on December 08, 2009, 04:24:54 PM
Wait..linens get folded?  ???

Yes, Sweety, they do and believe it or not there is a place called a "linen closet", where they go.  Not just on the floor of the bedroom closet.

God!  Men!  Can't train them, can't shoot them.  But I still love them.  :-*



Hugs and Love
Janet

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 08, 2009, 04:30:16 PM
Yes, Sweety, they do and believe it or not there is a place called a "linen closet", where they go.  Not just on the floor of the bedroom closet.

God!  Men!  Can't train them, can't shoot them.  But I still love them.  :-*



Hugs and Love
Janet

what!? Why do you need to fold them, say you have 3 beds in the house.. so you have 3 sets of sheets, you just put them on the bed, why fold them and put them away? haha

There's no point in having extras, just wash them during the day, and put them back on. Thats what I do.

Quote from: Kurzar on December 08, 2009, 04:24:54 PM
Wait..linens get folded?  ???

TeeHe - they do in our house, and ironed too. But not by me ;D

I'm married (21 years) to another transwoman who definitely has a lifelong ironing and washing up fetish! 😀 She even irons socks and undies!

I do get to cook and do a bit of housework... sometimes - but I have the life of riley really - the best of both worlds - she looks after me like a princess!

(Mind you - I am the one who can get the duvet cover on. 🙂 )

But what if you wish to change the sheets for the different seasons.  Flannel for Winter, satin for Summer.

And extras mean that you don't wear them out in a month.

I guess that is the difference between Men and Women.



Hugs and Love
Janet

I use the linen closet as a pantry >.>

Quote from: Kurzar on December 08, 2009, 04:46:20 PM
I use the linen closet as a pantry >.>

LMAO

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Post Merge: December 08, 2009, 03:49:53 PM

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Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 08, 2009, 04:37:27 PM
But what if you wish to change the sheets for the different seasons.  Flannel for Winter, satin for Summer.

And extras mean that you don't wear them out in a month.

I guess that is the difference between Men and Women.



Hugs and Love
Janet

you girls change them for seasons? pish posh 🙂 lol

It is called being warm, Hon.  Or cool if it is Summer.  Of course satin sheets are fun for other things too.   >:-)



Hugs and Love
Janet

whut? What's so wrong with cotton? Warm in thewinter, cool(enough) in the summer....
Yeah. typical guy..so???

Quote from: insanitylives on December 08, 2009, 06:27:47 PM
whut? What's so wrong with cotton? Warm in thewinter, cool(enough) in the summer....
Yeah. typical guy..so???

I'm with you lol

Obvious you have never slept on satin sheets.  ::) Very sexy.  And there is nothing wrong with cotton there , Boys.

But it is fun flirting over linens.  >:-)



Hugs and Love
Janet

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 08, 2009, 06:54:47 PM
Obvious you have never slept on satin sheets.  ::) Very sexy.  And there is nothing wrong with cotton there , Boys.

But it is fun flirting over linens.  >:-)



Hugs and Love
Janet

i can imagine some red satin, or silk sheets may be fun for sexy time 🙂 lol

And I have red. :icon_redface:



Hugs and Love
Janet

Maya Angelou, the USA Poet Laureate. Here is one of hers.

Phenomenal Woman by Maya Angelou

Pretty women wonder where my secret lies.
I'm not cute or built to suit a fashion model's size
But when I start to tell them,
They think I'm telling lies.
I say,
It's in the reach of my arms
The span of my hips,
The stride of my step,
The curl of my lips.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

I walk into a room
Just as cool as you please,
And to a man,
The fellows stand or
Fall down on their knees.
Then they swarm around me,
A hive of honey bees.
I say,
It's the fire in my eyes,
And the flash of my teeth,
The swing in my waist,
And the joy in my feet.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

Men themselves have wondered
What they see in me.
They try so much
But they can't touch
My inner mystery.
When I try to show them
They say they still can't see.
I say,
It's in the arch of my back,
The sun of my smile,
The ride of my breasts,
The grace of my style.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

Now you understand
Just why my head's not bowed.
I don't shout or jump about
Or have to talk real loud.
When you see me passing
It ought to make you proud.
I say,
It's in the click of my heels,
The bend of my hair,
the palm of my hand,
The need of my care,
'Cause I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

For some strange reason I feel the need to say :

"PVC sheets and a waterbed full of Jello!"

... yeah... I don't know why either. It sure sounds hilarious though!  :laugh:

Maya Angelou is awesome.  She is such a strong person.  Thank you for sharing, Jozzie.



Hugs and Love
Janet

Ok thats enough.

As to sheets, I agree with one set of sheets. Why fold when you can wash and wear so to speak. As to satin sheets, the quilt slides off and you freeze to death in mid summer. worthless things, tried em, red ones even.

Linen closet ..pantry. whats the diff. they both hold the 2 spare towels and my can and box food. just remember that cans are easier since you don't need a pan or to reconstitute anything, just open, maybe heat, use a spoon. meal in a can done in a flash and only one dirty dish, the spoon.   Pizza can be cooked in the micro wave. barley soup can be done by the neighbor, (at least mine will).
  Now, as to rolling the cloths. It is fast and no worries about creases where you don't want them. The clothes fit in the suitcase, duffel bag and laundry hamper better. well, more of them anyway.

Speaking of laundry, whats with this perm press cycle and tons of choices for washing clothes? I just throw everything (sometimes even the 'whites') in one washer, add soap, set to normal wash and let it do its thing. No faded or clothes blending colors, just clean clothes every time.


OOps, end of rant, I yak too much.

Quote from: Nero on December 06, 2009, 02:10:54 PM
Only semi-seriously, why would anyone want to be a woman when they could be a man?  ;)

I don't know, because I *am* a woman. I'm just in the process of fixing the body stuff.  😉

Quote from: Matilda on December 06, 2009, 06:47:59 PM
I have this sort of inner connection/conspiracy with other women that guys don't have.  A smile, a certain look is all it takes.  Guys don't have that. :P

Maybe straight guys don't have it...but we queerboys sure as heck do.

Quote from: insanitylives on December 08, 2009, 06:27:47 PM
whut? What's so wrong with cotton? Warm in thewinter, cool(enough) in the summer....
Yeah. typical guy..so???

<3 cotton

Quote from: FlanKitty on December 09, 2009, 02:09:58 AM
<3 cotton

<3 FlanKitty's Kitty


uh that is avatar, get your minds out of the gutter

Quote from: Arch on December 09, 2009, 02:06:16 AM
Maybe straight guys don't have it...but we queerboys sure as heck do.

When I was male I was het but have always had lots of gay friends.  I asked one about this (what you mention, Arch) and he told me.  I tried it a few times and had gay guys coming on to me like crazy. ::)  I had to stop because it was unfair to them.

Now, as a woman, I do it all the time with other women and love that secret connection.  But between women it isn't at all sexual.  (I think. :-\) 

I never connected the two.  Thanks, Arch. :)

- Kate

Quote from: Laura91 on December 06, 2009, 02:20:59 PM
Because being a "man" stinks.

I would like to say Men are stinky. 🙂

Quote from: LordKAT on December 09, 2009, 01:30:32 AM
Ok thats enough.

As to sheets, I agree with one set of sheets. Why fold when you can wash and wear so to speak. As to satin sheets, the quilt slides off and you freeze to death in mid summer. worthless things, tried em, red ones even.

Linen closet ..pantry. whats the diff. they both hold the 2 spare towels and my can and box food. just remember that cans are easier since you don't need a pan or to reconstitute anything, just open, maybe heat, use a spoon. meal in a can done in a flash and only one dirty dish, the spoon.   Pizza can be cooked in the micro wave. barley soup can be done by the neighbor, (at least mine will).
  Now, as to rolling the cloths. It is fast and no worries about creases where you don't want them. The clothes fit in the suitcase, duffel bag and laundry hamper better. well, more of them anyway.

Speaking of laundry, whats with this perm press cycle and tons of choices for washing clothes? I just throw everything (sometimes even the 'whites') in one washer, add soap, set to normal wash and let it do its thing. No faded or clothes blending colors, just clean clothes every time.


OOps, end of rant, I yak too much.

OMG LordKAT.  You are such a typical guy.  I suppose you eat over the sink, so you don't have to wipe of the table.

As a woman I use the microwave to really cook.  Lasagna, pizza, eggs, bacon, different soups.  But I eat at the table.  And separate whites.  :p

Quote from: Dana Lane on December 09, 2009, 10:53:35 AM
I would like to say Men are stinky. :)

Not all Dana.  Some smell good enough to eat.  :angel: >:-)




Hugs and Love
Janet

Uh, I don't have a table. I eat at my desk, on my weight bench (since it takes up 1/3 of my room) or in bed on my nite stand.

Quote from: jozize on December 08, 2009, 07:20:53 PM
Maya Angelou, the USA Poet Laureate. Here is one of hers.

Phenomenal Woman by Maya Angelou

Pretty women wonder where my secret lies.
I'm not cute or built to suit a fashion model's size
But when I start to tell them,
They think I'm telling lies.
I say,
It's in the reach of my arms
The span of my hips,
The stride of my step,
The curl of my lips.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

I walk into a room
Just as cool as you please,
And to a man,
The fellows stand or
Fall down on their knees.
Then they swarm around me,
A hive of honey bees.
I say,
It's the fire in my eyes,
And the flash of my teeth,
The swing in my waist,
And the joy in my feet.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

Men themselves have wondered
What they see in me.
They try so much
But they can't touch
My inner mystery.
When I try to show them
They say they still can't see.
I say,
It's in the arch of my back,
The sun of my smile,
The ride of my breasts,
The grace of my style.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

Now you understand
Just why my head's not bowed.
I don't shout or jump about
Or have to talk real loud.
When you see me passing
It ought to make you proud.
I say,
It's in the click of my heels,
The bend of my hair,
the palm of my hand,
The need of my care,
'Cause I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

I love that poem, its me as well.

I spent the first 16years of my life as a ''guy'' Id never never go back, then transition finally srs, I grew up with 3brothers and being a guy really sucks.

Theres a lot of talk of ''male privilege'' but finally being  a girl and the youngest of 4 well I got a lot of female privilege, my brothers could be mean to each other but not to me, on the orders from my Parents I was to be excepted, sadly I never had sisters so when I was finally excepted I was spoiled by my brothers, to my Father I was his ''princess girl'' why why would I ever want to be a man or a guy, when my family excepted me I loved and enjoyed just being a girl.
The years have passed, Im growing old gracefully because Im a lady, Im a WOMAN!
Guys just grow old, smelly and ugly lol
p

Oh wait, being a woman? I know this one, gimmie a sec...

*Getting yelled at for sitting on top of the monkey bars in school, because your school uniform requires a skirt that barely passes your kneecaps. Same thing about climbing trees.
*Horrible wrenching agony every 28 days (give or take) and mood swings that make you want to kill everyone in sight and eat your body weight in chocolate, washed down with a good bottle of port
*Needing to carry a purse because all of your pants have fake or ridiculously tiny pockets, and then loosing it somewhere.
*Not being able to find a pair of cloth shorts or pants that don't have "Juicy" or something else inane printed in sparkly letters across both cheeks.
*Same note, not being able to find a pair of pants that rises past your hip bones.

need I go on?  :laugh:

On the other hand, I do have different sets of sheets - two of them. They take too long to line-dry, so I need a second set to sleep on while the first is washing. The linen closet is a cat bed, so the towels stay on the floor in the pantry; and I don't even own a microwave - only real home cooking for me.  :laugh:

Quote from: Cody Oriole on December 09, 2009, 04:30:47 PM
*Same note, not being able to find a pair of pants that rises past your hip bones.

I agree with you except men's pants are worn at the hips. Women wear pants at the waist (or really, any rise they like.)

Quote from: SilverFang on December 09, 2009, 04:50:30 PM
I agree with you except men's pants are worn at the hips. Women wear pants at the waist (or really, any rise they like.)

Yeah, difference is men's pants don't ride up your crotch like a full-pelvic wedgie.  :laugh:

Quote from: Cody Oriole on December 09, 2009, 04:55:22 PM
Yeah, difference is men's pants don't ride up your crotch like a full-pelvic wedgie.  :laugh:

I hated how girl pants did that, when i started to wear baggy pants, after a while, when i tried to wear tighter pants again, all it did was rub me up and make me horny lol, AND it was uncomfortable

Quote from: Cody Oriole on December 09, 2009, 04:55:22 PM
Yeah, difference is men's pants don't ride up your crotch like a full-pelvic wedgie.  :laugh:

I'll agree with that, it's really irritating.

Quote from: Cody Oriole on December 09, 2009, 04:30:47 PM
*Not being able to find a pair of cloth shorts or pants that don't have "Juicy" or something else inane printed in sparkly letters across both cheeks.

I'm with you on this one. Why would anybody want advertisements on their derriere?

If they want to advertise on my behind it will cost them, not the other way around.



Hugs and Love
Janet

Quote from: SilverFang on December 09, 2009, 04:50:30 PM
I agree with you except men's pants are worn at the hips. Women wear pants at the waist (or really, any rise they like.)

Maybe, but the "let's have pants that barely cover our underpants/pubes" thing is all I've ever found.
Gave up on girls pants years ago

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 09, 2009, 11:05:28 AM
Not all Dana.  Some smell good enough to eat.  :angel: >:-)

Oh god oh god I only need one...one for life...one guy who's into me and doesn't care about my equipment and who smells good enough to eat...I hate the way most guys smell. I mean, they don't smell like potential sex partners; they smell all wrong, incompatible. I wish I didn't still have this keen sense of smell. I used to value it, but now it's such a curse. I think of it as my female sense of smell, too. Urk.

So far, I haven't found a single gay guy who smells right to me. I'm beginning to wonder if I'm hardwired to only like the body scent of straight guys. Then I would be in trouble.

Any of you gals actually enjoying a keener sense of smell? What does it do for you?

I agree with you except men's pants are worn at the hips. Women wear pants at the waist

I have to disagree, its men's pants - like suit pants, you know, grown up clothes - that come up to the waist.  Suit and tux pants come up to just under the bottom of the navel.  It's decades of Levis without belts or suspenders, leading into expando-waist jogging stuff, up until guys really gave up and just went with sweatpants, and then just let them fall off altogether that gave them the idea that lower is better.  That's a recent trend, and it's not lasting much longer.

Quote from: Janet Lynn on December 09, 2009, 06:11:40 PM
If they want to advertise on my behind it will cost them, not the other way around.

:laugh: Lol.

Quote from: tekla on December 09, 2009, 08:21:56 PM
I agree with you except men's pants are worn at the hips. Women wear pants at the waist

I have to disagree, its men's pants - like suit pants, you know, grown up clothes - that come up to the waist.  Suit and tux pants come up to just under the bottom of the navel.  It's decades of Levis without belts or suspenders, leading into expando-waist jogging stuff, up until guys really gave up and just went with sweatpants, and then just let them fall off altogether that gave them the idea that lower is better.  That's a recent trend, and it's not lasting much longer.

Alright.

always hated women's pants that went up to the arm pits. That never made sense to me either.

Arm pits?  Are you sure you weren't wear old man pants?



Hugs and Love
Janet

_{By the way I hate that stupid "Modify" button, I am always clicking it to reply.  Sorry, LordKAT, i did not modify anything.}

You see what you've stirred up here Nero?  LOL ;)
This thread is just going to run and run.  ;D
Great fun!

And run and run and run and run and run and run and run and run,

Just a bump for the thread.  >:-)



Hugs and Love
Janet

Quote from: LordKAT on December 10, 2009, 12:50:26 AM
always hated women's pants that went up to the arm pits. That never made sense to me either.

When I was 5 I used to have these stretchy sweat pants and I would hike them up to my armpits to make my family laugh.

Hey, how many pages is the record for a thread on this forum?

Just curious.

Oh, woops, I've just added to it  😮

When I wore guys' Wranglers, they sat on my hips.  When I wear "classic" women's LL Bean jeans they sit at my waist.  I like these better - they make my legs look longer and are more comfortable.

The fashion of low-slung pants for women, showing off that oh-so-attractive roll of fat just below their waists seems to be on the way out (thank god!).  When I saw a college girl sitting in the coffee shop looking like a refrigerator repairman (i.e. showing off the top several inches of the crack of her behind) I hoped we had gone far enough to let the pendulum swing back.

That old biddy >:(,
Kate

Why would I want to remain a man when I can be who I am?  (totally seriously)
Bev

Quote from: Cody Oriole on December 09, 2009, 04:30:47 PM
Oh wait, being a woman? I know this one, gimmie a sec...


*Not being able to find a pair of cloth shorts or pants that don't have "Juicy" or something else inane printed in sparkly letters across both cheeks.
*

Oh goshy, that so so funny, when I was a slightly younger gal I use to love cute attractive sparkly letters across my pants, and panties, well I always remember a cute pair of pink panties I use to have years ago with ''pussy power'' printed across the front, don't think my Mam would approve lol too funny.
Another reason too, guys clothes are really so so dull and boring, I get to wear all the cute stuff.
p

Replying to this thread again...


I'm much more free to wear ANYTHING assuming I ever passed! :D


like... I can rock the purse as my male friend puts it, and he likes them just for functionality... He usually brings a ton of stuff with him everywhere... Basically a small messenger bag is just that xD



But I have this whole new world of freedom with clothing... I can mash up so much more flavor than I used to be ALLOWED to. I can appease the inner shapeshifter by just having different styles depending on how I Feel.... Like How I did in boy mode for years, only with a larger spectrummmmmmm

:O

and i don't get why anyone would want to be a man.

Hey, how many pages is the record for a thread on this forum?

Oh the game ones, like the title song game have gone on for like 60 pages before they started a new one, the ->-bleeped-<- thread proved very popular back when it ran, as did the one about sexual orientation.

My SO asked me that same question a few days ago – "You have been a "man" all of your life; why would you want to be a woman?  You have had all of the perks and benefits of being a man, you will never have the physical problems that women face (menses, child bearing, etc.) so why would you ever want to be a woman?"

I told her "because I am and have always been a woman since birth, just with the wrong "organ".  I want to be who I was meant to be."

My ex always wanted to know if I thought the grass was greener on the other side of the gender fence.  I told her that I just wanted to be the real me.



Blessed Be
Janet

Quote from: Nero on December 06, 2009, 02:10:54 PM
Only semi-seriously, why would anyone want to be a woman when they could be a man?  ;)

It is not a matter of gender roles which are artificial and set up by society. It is a matter of being physically correct with your mind.

Quote from: lisagurl on December 12, 2009, 08:07:01 PM
It is not a matter of gender roles which are artificial and set up by society. It is a matter of being physically correct with your mind.

But without that artificial roles set up by society, there wouldn't be anything for you to be correct or incorrect with. 😉

Quote from: Keroppi on December 12, 2009, 08:12:11 PM
But without that artificial roles set up by society, there wouldn't be anything for you to be correct or incorrect with. ;)

There's nothing artificial about not having breasts, having a low voice and bony a face, a receding hairline, facial and body hair, and genitals flapping around uncomfortably between your legs. There's nothing artificial about looking at your sister and knowing, "I'm supposed to look like that." The artificial, societal parts just add insult to injury.

Quote from: Alyssa M. on December 12, 2009, 09:01:08 PM
There's nothing artificial about not having breasts, having a low voice and bony a face, a receding hairline, facial and body hair, and genitals flapping around uncomfortably between your legs. There's nothing artificial about looking at your sister and knowing, "I'm supposed to look like that." The artificial, societal parts just add insult to injury.

yeah what she said!

The thing I was "incorrect with" was purely and simply the male aspects of my reflection in the mirror when naked.

There do seem to be various types of transsexual. Some do seem to view their physical state as a barrier to true self expression. They do perceive themselves to have the wrong "gender" role.

Then there are those of us who had a sympathetic upbringing and thus managed to self express reasonably well anyway. We mainly didn't like our physical attributes and haven't ever really changed our societal role. Transition for us was not so much about changing our behaviour as changing our appearance.

I suppose some might define as androgyne. I personally couldn't do that. I feel I am definitely a woman, but I am also happy to be what I would describe as a fairly down to earth, practical, no nonsense and no frills woman. Thats why I walked out on my first gender psychiatrist in 1979. John Randall thought that if you were going to "choose" to be a woman you had to choose to be ULTRA femme. I violently disagreed.

There is after all more than one type of woman that one can choose to be, and I come from a family where even as far back as the 1880's a lot of the women were high flying. My great great Aunt for example (Charlotte Angas Scott) was a professor of Mathematics at Bryn Mawr college in Pennysylvania.

Thats the type of woman that I choose, and who would be a mere man when you could be someone magnificent like her.

Quote from: Nero on December 06, 2009, 02:10:54 PM
Only semi-seriously, why would anyone want to be a woman when they could be a man?  ;)

why you ask? umm pretty simple for me really, yes i was born a male. fortunately
my inner desires, feelings, emotions, an how i feel are  that of a woman . im a very sensitve,
person. im nurturing,  very understanding, i care bout peoples thoughts, an how they feel.
i enjoy feminine things colors, clothing, my man hehe. i love the way he holds me in his arms
cuz i feel safe, when im with him!! how to describe it in words is really hard omg!!! umm but ill try thou. so here goes. he looks at me the way i look at my inner sole as a female. he doesnt see me as a male. so how i see myself is a real 100% female but on the outside youd think of jus 2 gay guys. ive got my girl friends an ive got my guy friends who all accept me for who an what i am.

yes i wanna have a family, but the way i want my family? is i wanna carry him/her for 9 mons an give birth. ha yup i said it id rather get knocked up then knock up some one!! yea i kno. i would rather live the life of a female. for the simple reason of this, guys are into manily things an im like so not!!! they wanna go to the parts store n live there. i dont so i dont go. guys r so mean lol, as
they hold in there feelings well alot do. they r rough an tough, id rather be held by that then be one. does this make ne sense? to you i hope cuz i feel like im jus rambling on here haha
 

It really shocked me the day I realized most women don't hate being female.  I had just assumed it was the natural state for most girls.  I have trouble understanding why someone would want to be female but I can completely understand someone not being happy with the body they were born with, no matter what gender/sex they are.

Quote from: jmaxley on December 17, 2009, 07:49:05 PM
It really shocked me the day I realized most women don't hate being female.  I had just assumed it was the natural state for most girls.

Ditto

Quote from: jmaxley on December 17, 2009, 07:49:05 PM
It really shocked me the day I realized most women don't hate being female.  I had just assumed it was the natural state for most girls.

And how!  :laugh:

I was under the impression it was just part of being immature, and one day I'd "grow up" and change gender.

Why would anyone want to be a man? ewww.... yucky and hair and just not me at all!

Quote from: Aaron Chris on December 06, 2009, 05:05:22 PM
I personally don't want to be a woman, but I can understand that people want different things. Maybe I don't understand their thinking, but that's okay. They probably don't understand mine either.

But you look like a very attractive woman in your profile pic? that's the biggest problem for many of us being in this situation no matter which way were going..

Naturally Blonde, 
For some of us our looks are a curse.  Some of us look very masculine but know in our hearts that we are women.  Some of us look very feminine but in our hearts know we are men.  (And I don't think Aaron looks all that feminine, but perhaps you see things I don't.  To me he just looks young, but then I'm more than three times his age.)  In the same light, some of us take hormones for years but our bodies don't seem to change that much despite the fact that our brains are hard-wired as the opposite gender.

I always knew I would never pass as a woman because I was too masculine-looking.  But for many of us there comes a point where we no longer care whether we can pass or not – we must live in the gender we are.

I know that men are far superior to women ::), but I am a woman regardless.  I really didn't get a choice in the matter.

Excuse me, I have to go clean the house and get the meal ready before the big, strong men come home. :)

- Kate

Quote from: Naturally Blonde on December 19, 2009, 11:51:50 AM
But you look like a very attractive woman in your profile pic?

What?
Why.. Did you just call HIM a woman?
How's that even remotely acceptable?
Would you like it if I insisted on calling you a man? No? Show a little respect.

Quote from: insanitylives on December 19, 2009, 07:58:43 PM
What?
Why.. Did you just call HIM a woman?
How's that even remotely acceptable?
Would you like it if I insisted on calling you a man? No? Show a little respect.

Well said, and probably that didn't even warrant a comment, but well said anyway.

Quote from: insanitylives on December 19, 2009, 07:58:43 PM
What?
Why.. Did you just call HIM a woman?
How's that even remotely acceptable?
Would you like it if I insisted on calling you a man? No? Show a little respect.

I wasn't going to say anything, but thanks.

Quote from: K8 on December 19, 2009, 03:01:29 PM
(And I don't think Aaron looks all that feminine, but perhaps you see things I don't.  To me he just looks young, but then I'm more than three times his age.)

Thank you. Though I look a lot more feminine in person unfortunately.

Quote from: Naturally Blonde on December 19, 2009, 11:51:50 AM
But you look like a very attractive woman in your profile pic? that's the biggest problem for many of us being in this situation no matter which way were going..

WTF?! FACEPALM.

You can't be serious.

The biggest problem is being attractive? What, more important than being yourself?

You wouldn't be suggesting people that were attractive in their birth assigned presentation should not risk transition for fear of losing that all so important attractiveness, would you?

I expect this sort of comment from the general public because they don't understand what we go through  - but from someone here? Wow. Just wow.

I really hope we've all misinterpreted that post.

Quote from: Aaron Chris on December 19, 2009, 08:14:06 PM
I wasn't going to say anything, but thanks.

Thank you. Though I look a lot more feminine in person unfortunately.

Aaron - obviously not having seen you in person I can'y comment on that, but to me you honestly look like a fairly typical teenage boy!

My adopted son had something of the same look when he was about 15 or 16. He's now a strapping young man of 24 and not in the slightest bit feminine - so don't listen to anyone who questions you. You are who you say you are!

I'm sorry for the previous comments Arron and all to other forum members. It can be confusing sometimes with female to male TS's and it wasn't meant to come across the wrong way.

Quote from: Naturally Blonde on December 20, 2009, 10:16:57 AM
I'm sorry for the previous comments Arron and all to other forum members. It can be confusing sometimes with female to male TS's and it wasn't meant to come across the wrong way.

Generally speaking, it's safer to just go by the gender marker.

Quote from: K8 on December 19, 2009, 03:01:29 PM
Naturally Blonde, 
For some of us our looks are a curse.  Some of us look very masculine but know in our hearts that we are women.  Some of us look very feminine but in our hearts know we are men.  (And I don't think Aaron looks all that feminine, but perhaps you see things I don't.  To me he just looks young, but then I'm more than three times his age.)  In the same light, some of us take hormones for years but our bodies don't seem to change that much despite the fact that our brains are hard-wired as the opposite gender.

I always knew I would never pass as a woman because I was too masculine-looking.  But for many of us there comes a point where we no longer care whether we can pass or not – we must live in the gender we are.

I know that men are far superior to women ::), but I am a woman regardless.  I really didn't get a choice in the matter.

Excuse me, I have to go clean the house and get the meal ready before the big, strong men come home. :)

- Kate

Hi Kate, thanks for an excellent and honest post. You are mature enough not have any hang ups or pre-conceptions about the limitations of transitioning.

Sometimes it's like treading on egg shells in gender forums where every word is muted and every thought or perception has to be carefully presented or changed in order for it to be acceptable.

---

Post Merge: December 20, 2009, 10:40:29 AM

---

Quote from: Lachlann on December 20, 2009, 10:25:49 AM
Generally speaking, it's safer to just go by the gender marker.

Yes, agreed! and I will definitely take that on board.

I'm late to this thread but for me it's not a matter of wanting to be a woman. My wife often refers to my transition in these terms and I get riled when she does it. The matter is because I never was a man and basically couldn't hack it.

I believed most of my life that being a man was better, certainly as I watched women having so many problems with other men. I did what I could to change attitudes amongst men I worked with or was "friends" with but it did little to change anything.

Many times, I am reminded of my second class status and the restrictions I face as a woman. I am also dealing with the sad truth that I have occasionally to defend my true gender to other women. I admit that when I get buried in these thoughts, I do look back before I transitioned and remember that it was not all bad.

I never went to the place where I considered detransitioning but the daily barrage of the media and organized religion calling us evil or freaks or perverts also places a huge burden on my psyche. I don't agree with them. However, when I lived as a man, I was not a target of their hatred. Now, I am and that frankly scares me.

I am a woman and I can't live as a man even if it kills me. Wanting doesn't even enter into it.

Maggie

Quote from: Naturally Blonde on December 20, 2009, 10:35:15 AM
Yes, agreed! and I will definitely take that on board.

It's...really hard to miss...Right there. Next to the avatar...The blue/pink (depending on gender picked) thing...

Quote from: Olly on December 20, 2009, 01:49:51 PM
I guess I always figured that every bio female hated being female and would rather be a guy. I still find it weird to see girly girls who actually enjoy being female, I figured they were always putting on an act to cover up how much they hated being cheated out of a real life as a male.

I feel the same way

Being a man sucks  :icon_blah:  Being a girly girl woman rocks  :icon_chick:

I can certainly understand where you guys are coming from, but it reminds me of when I came out to a GG friend.  She just looked at me and said: "I love being a woman.  I can see why you'd want to be one." :)

I never corrected her "want" concept, but now we are really good girlfriends, much closer than when she thought I was a man(:icon_blah:).

- Kate

Yes, that "want" concept is sure annoying.

I also do nothing to correct it at the moment - those people saying "want" are trying to get their head around it as best they can. Acceptance is acceptance - I figure there's no point in dwelling on a slight misunderstanding after a certain point (a few attempted explanations).

Quote from: Olly on December 20, 2009, 01:49:51 PM
I guess I always figured that every bio female hated being female and would rather be a guy. I still find it weird to see girly girls who actually enjoy being female, I figured they were always putting on an act to cover up how much they hated being cheated out of a real life as a male.

Most biological girls I know absolutely love being a girl and wouldn't dream of wanting to be a guy.

Quote from: Olly on December 20, 2009, 01:49:51 PM
I still find it weird to see girly girls who actually enjoy being female, I figured they were always putting on an act to cover up how much they hated being cheated out of a real life as a male.

Oh god, same. I always look at them and think "can she really enjoy acting/dressing like that?" I guess to each hir own.

Quote from: Aaron Chris on December 21, 2009, 12:23:14 PM
Oh god, same. I always look at them and think "can she really enjoy acting/dressing like that?" I guess to each hir own.

for me it wasn't the acting dressing part, I could never understand the wanting to BE part. I stil don't. I just cannot get how or why anyone would ever choose to be female if they had a choice. The concept just loses me.

Quote from: LordKAT on December 21, 2009, 12:44:33 PM
for me it wasn't the acting dressing part, I could never understand the wanting to BE part. I stil don't. I just cannot get how or why anyone would ever choose to be female if they had a choice. The concept just loses me.

Two links which I posted in another thread go someway to explaining how our thoughts can be so similar but opposite. I feel exactly the same about anyone choosing to BE male. I can understand wanting the lifestyle perks... but the being... like you that's what does my head in.

According to some research only published last year in turns out that for some of us at least, to some extent how we feel is probably partly down to genetics.

If you are FtM this one:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/2471724/Gene-variant-may-make-people-transsexual.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/2471724/Gene-variant-may-make-people-transsexual.html)
And for MtF this one:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/3265125/Gene-could-hold-key-to-why-transsexual-men-feel-female.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/3265125/Gene-could-hold-key-to-why-transsexual-men-feel-female.html)

Quote from: LordKAT on December 21, 2009, 12:44:33 PM
for me it wasn't the acting dressing part, I could never understand the wanting to BE part. I stil don't. I just cannot get how or why anyone would ever choose to be female if they had a choice. The concept just loses me.

Yeah, but it's the whole thing. It just seems weird. Though I am glad that some people are women. 😛

And I'm glad some people are men. :)  But I sure never wanted to be one.  Somehow, it just isn't me. :P

- Kate

Grumble, grumble... :(

QuoteGene-could-hold-key-to-why-transsexual-men-feel-female.html

This article is about why transsexual women feel female.

Transsexual men feel male.

Grumble, grumble... 🙁

Quote from: Renate on December 21, 2009, 09:45:05 PM
Grumble, grumble... :(

This article is about why transsexual women feel female.

Transsexual men feel male.

Grumble, grumble... :(

that would be one for failblog if the comments there weren't fail themselves...

Let's do this pro/con style (and this is just my opinion, so no offense to those of you who like the male bits):

Men -
Pro:
* Usually get paid more for the same amount of work.
* Can carry heavier things (usually)
* Don't have to suffer periods
* Uh, am I missing anything?

Con:
* Genitals are ugly.  Sorry, it's true.
* Orgasms are shorter and less fulfilling (scientifically guestimated)
* More and worse acne
* Can't get pregnant
* Usually lose custody rights if they get divorced
* Usually have to pay money to ex-wife even without custody rights
* Subject to draft/conscription in many countries, many countries mandatory service for 2+ years
* Often expected to provide all or most of the income for the entire family
* More likely to be violent
* Expected not to admit to or talk about vulnerable emotions
* Hurts a zillion times more if you get kicked in the gonads.
* I'm sure there's some I've forgotten.

Women -
Pro:
* More clothing options
* Less clothing expectations
* Can admit vulnerablity and talk about emotions without being ridiculed
* Can get pregnant
* Usually get custody rights
* Less acne
* Usually not subject to draft or mandatory service (only exception I can think of is Israel)
* Less violent
* Not always expected to provide most/all income for family
* (In my opinion) more attractive physical features
* Better/more orgasms

Con:
* Periods
* More likely to be subject to violence from men (I blame men for this)
* In some countries, expected to put family over personal ambition (but this is personal choice)
* More pressure to conform to some ideal of beauty
* Usually get paid less for same work

I'm sure people in the man-camp have more pros on the men side and more cons on the women side, but from my perspective it's pretty slanted towards woman-are-better :P.

Quote from: Ketsy on December 22, 2009, 04:03:26 PM

Con:
* Genitals are ugly.  Sorry, it's true.
* Orgasms are shorter and less fulfilling (scientifically guestimated)
* Can't get pregnant

Sorry, but I actually think that girl's genitals are really gross
I would rather have a strong short orgasm then a hard to achieve one
I consider not getting pregnant to be a pro!

Quote from: Elijah on December 22, 2009, 05:01:35 PM
Sorry, but I actually think that girl's genitals are really gross

I agree to an extent, I think they kind of look like The Predators face. I'm sure for the Predator that's fine but you won't catch me licking it.

I too consider not getting pregnant a big, big pro.

Also - I'd say women have higher expectations on them when it comes to personal grooming, and clothing choice. On average, they have to spend a lot more time on it.

Men's clothes are actually comfortable.

It's easier to do physical tasks without tits in the way. LIke working under lowered cars (though I will say - smaller hands also help in tight spots. Transmen have the advantage here for once!).

We don't have to shave / wax / pluck body hair.

We get to grow facial hair.

We may be expected to bring in the paycheck... but that means we get out of the housework!  :P

It's all perspective. Men are geared to think being a man is better, women are geared to think being a woman is better.

It's all very Brave New World, really :laugh:. (I'm so glad I'm an Alpha a man... pass the soma)

Quote from: Teknoir on December 22, 2009, 08:18:51 PM... but that means we get out of the housework!

Woah, hold on there fella! What fantasy world are you living in? This is 2009! Get off your lazy backside and help with the dishes!  😀

And get back to your dusting.  And get me another tea.

;D ;D ;D ;D
Janet

_{Had to follow you Jane}

Quote from: Ketsy on December 22, 2009, 04:03:26 PM
Let's do this pro/con style (and this is just my opinion, so no offense to those of you who like the male bits):

Men -
Pro:
* Usually get paid more for the same amount of work.
* Can carry heavier things (usually)
* Don't have to suffer periods
* Uh, am I missing anything? Easier orgasms, clothes are more durable, can be assertive and not "a bitch," can sleep around without being criticized
* Judged less on attractiveness than women are

Con:
* Genitals are ugly.  Sorry, it's true. I would say all genitals are unattractive. But their function is not "look pretty"
* Orgasms are shorter and less fulfilling (scientifically guestimated)
* More and worse acne
* Can't get pregnant No way, that's a pro.
* Usually lose custody rights if they get divorced
* Usually have to pay money to ex-wife even without custody rights
* Subject to draft/conscription in many countries, many countries mandatory service for 2+ years
* Often expected to provide all or most of the income for the entire family
* More likely to be violent
* Expected not to admit to or talk about vulnerable emotions unemotional men aren't rejected socially like unemotional women are.
* Hurts a zillion times more if you get kicked in the gonads. If you managed to kick a woman in the ovaries, she'd be in the emergency room. Serious internal bleeding would happen, possibly coupled with a broken pelvis. Much easier to kick testicles though.
* I'm sure there's some I've forgotten.

Women -
Pro:
* More clothing options
* Less clothing expectations
* Can admit vulnerablity and talk about emotions without being ridiculed
* Can get pregnant
* Usually get custody rights
* Less acne
* Usually not subject to draft or mandatory service (only exception I can think of is Israel)
* Less violent
* Not always expected to provide most/all income for family
* (In my opinion) more attractive physical features
* Better/more orgasms

Con:
* Periods
* More likely to be subject to violence from men (I blame men for this)
* In some countries, expected to put family over personal ambition (but this is personal choice)
* More pressure to conform to some ideal of beauty
* Usually get paid less for same work
* Female genital mutilation, it happens in some countries
* Lower social status
* Breasts are painful and get in the way of things
* Get objectified by men more than they objectify them
* More possibility for rape
* More fear
* Less likely to get hired based on sex

I'm sure people in the man-camp have more pros on the men side and more cons on the women side, but from my perspective it's pretty slanted towards woman-are-better :P. Yes I do.

Con:
* Genitals are ugly.  Sorry, it's true. (As a gay guy, I have to disagree with that. 😛 )
* Can't get pregnant (Pro if ever I heard one)

Quote from: Teknoir on December 22, 2009, 08:18:51 PM
It's easier to do physical tasks without tits in the way. LIke working under lowered cars.

Thank goodness I'm not expected to crawl under there anymore!  Now I can get the men to do it for me.  What do you think eyelashes are for?

*Kate gives a look of helplessness, blinking in wonder at the manliness about her*

- Kate

Quote from: K8 on December 23, 2009, 07:12:16 AM
Thank goodness I'm not expected to crawl under there anymore!

Funny thing is I did far more of that sort of thing after SRS that I ever did before...

In a funny sort of way I have found that being physically female has freed me up to enjoy some aspects of behaviour more traditionally associated with being a man. It's almost like I can enjoy them now that I can do them as a gender rebel! ::)

I know, I know I'm just weird  ;D

Quote from: rejennyrated on December 23, 2009, 07:23:45 AM
Funny thing is I did far more of that sort of thing after SRS that I ever did before...

In a funny sort of way I have found that being physically female has freed me up to enjoy some aspects of behaviour more traditionally associated with being a man. It's almost like I can enjoy them now that I can do them as a gender rebel! ::)

I know, I know I'm just weird  ;D

Weird? Not on your life. It must feel good to be comfortable in who you are. I hope to get to that point.

Quote from: rejennyrated on December 23, 2009, 07:23:45 AM
Funny thing is I did far more of that sort of thing after SRS that I ever did before...

In a funny sort of way I have found that being physically female has freed me up to enjoy some aspects of behaviour more traditionally associated with being a man. It's almost like I can enjoy them now that I can do them as a gender rebel! ::)

I know, I know I'm just weird  ;D

No you're not. My mom did all that sort of stuff while my dad was a teacher and never really did the 'manly' stuff. And my mom is far from 'butch'.

Quote from: rejennyrated on December 23, 2009, 07:23:45 AM
Funny thing is I did far more of that sort of thing after SRS that I ever did before...

In a funny sort of way I have found that being physically female has freed me up to enjoy some aspects of behaviour more traditionally associated with being a man. It's almost like I can enjoy them now that I can do them as a gender rebel! ::)

I know, I know I'm just weird  ;D

Well OK I do not know of anything more sexy than a woman who is unafraid to get down and dirty, yet still able to get glam.  For me, that is what it is all about being a woman.  Freedom.

(https://www.susans.org/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fganjataz.com%2F01smileys%2Fimages%2Fsmileys%2FloopyBlonde-blinking.gif&hash=4545ddf8251cf9c32ae6074d56e48bc34a755857)Kristi

you might as well turn that pro and con list into a sticky  😀

I too am in the camp that thinks not being able to get pregnant is a pro.  Having to shove something the size of a watermelon out of something that's usually the size of a pencil...ouch.  No thanks!  😉

Quote from: jmaxley on December 28, 2009, 07:48:59 PM
I too am in the camp that thinks not being able to get pregnant is a pro.  Having to shove something the size of a watermelon out of something that's usually the size of a pencil...ouch.  No thanks!  ;)

i'm mtf, and that's how i see it. i have no desire to get pregnant or have monthly cramps. it wouldn't make me feel more or less female. girls who haven't had their periods yet can't get pregnant,but no one thinks they are anything less than female.

When I was first transitioning, every woman I mentioned not being able to mentruate to assured me I wasn't missing a thing. :P

And, being in my sixties, I take the inability to get pregnant as a blessing - just like almost every other woman my age. ;)

- Kate