Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I've noticed a bit on these forums that there are some people who transitioned with a very specific type of a woman as a goal.
In some cases, these people are disappointed when they find their goals unattainable.
Often this seems to be based on premature judgment of the results by themselves.

On the other hand, there are people here who say, "Damn the torpedoes, I'm going to be a woman! Maybe a dog-faced woman, but a woman nevertheless."
I think people with such an attitude are more likely to be happy with their results.
They may even turn out to be not quite so dog-faced! >:-)

That may be the case. But this is a complicated issue. There are probably many different reasons for it happening. Perhaps we each need to rationilise it to ourselves in different ways.

For my own part, when I was younger, I just wanted to look right and be able to play with my friends, who were girls.

As I grew older, I wanted to attract the attention of the people who I felt compatable with, men.

Later I wanted to be able to share my physical feelings in a way that would give the most satisfaction and pleasure to a partner, and to myself.

Now, I just want to be rid of the ugly bit between my legs.

But that's just me. Hopefully others can share their experience and perhaps a bit more consensus.

I always wanted to look like Ellen Page she's cool.. she has the same birthday as me so I'm half way there.. so far so good! ^_^

I would like to look like Sasha Alexander (Kaitlin) off of NCIS but it's not likely any time soon. However my therapist says I will be pleasantly surprised at how quickly I can present as a pretty woman-she makes me feel great about myself! I am satisfied with my progress thus far and am hopeful for the next year or so. If I am able to be attractive as a female I will be so happy but my goal long term is just to be female-pretty or not.

Randi :)

Quote from: Tasha Elizabeth on January 22, 2010, 07:28:13 AM
aint gonna happen!  a good therapist will help someone work through the notion that to be successful, one has to be their feminine ideal. 

Yep and the amount of times I've read for voice training to sing along to a singer who's voice you would like to sound like.
I think it can be part of being female wanting to be pretty and attractive... it's what a lot of guys mostly look for right!?
But attractiveness is not really a specific 'type' of women is it so I'm not sure *shrugs* may need to elaborate on that..

Type? Yea, FEMALE!  :o And it didn't matter what "type". NOT being female was killing me so it didn't matter much what came after ... it HAD to be better than where I was.

It was 1974, I was 24, and nobody knew much about "what came after". Surgeries were rare and those that went before me did just what I did - disappeared into the woodwork - so there was no such thing as "a post-op role model" (except for an unfortunate few who were outed in the media).

I was young and I knew I was very "under-developed" emotionally and socially (fitting neither boy nor girl after puberty limited one's growth potential), so I was just content to find out who I was going to grow up to be.

I did have a role model among women though - the character Mrs. Peel from The Avengers (Diana Rigg). A few years after SRS/transition I looked back on the previous few years and realized I had become MORE than I ever imagined, more in some ways than my role model. (Though I would still KILL to have her figure LOL!)

Norma Rae???

No. I used to imagine myself as a lawyer or a defender of peoples rights when I was a young lass. Not an Amazonian Woman b/c I'm not very tall (5'8....5'10 w/heels) but just a woman who knows how to take care of herself and people she cares about!

I'm gaining more years and it's an unavoidable fracking thing! I'm definitely working on getting some kind of plan in motion here to get the surgery! Whether I get it next month or four years down the line... with or without a dog-face.... I'm still getting it done! I feel it's just me and the thing is nobody around me understands!

*cue violin*  :P

lol. Everyone has their own life and mine involves getting a permanent tuck :)

Candace Bergen and Lauren Bacall

I do the soccer mom kinda look personally works for me :)

Quote from: Renate on January 22, 2010, 06:05:52 AM
They may even turn out to be not quite so dog-faced! >:-)

How about a cat face?
>.>
<.<

I can't say the thought ever occurred to me.

Women I find attractive don't fit into a particular mold, and I never wanted to look a certain way.  Maybe it's because I never imagined I'd be able to pass as female no matter what I looked like.

Quote from: Renate on January 22, 2010, 06:05:52 AM
... a very specific type of a woman as a goal..

I want clarification on these specific types, we seem to be thinking of actual people more than types like the mentioned soccer mum. *shrugs* I don't know exactly what you mean without more examples.
I'm sure most people have an idea or ideal of how they'd like to one day be but I doubt most would be so blind to be sad because they don't turn out exactly the way they'd hoped, and is it not a generalised assumption to say so?

I don't think I'll win any beauty contests, but I don't think I'm a total dog either

I just want to be all the woman I can be.....But I def. need to live near the ocean

Which brings up another question.....East Coast or West Coast?  :laugh:

I have a very certain type of woman that is my goal.  The woman l look at every morning, except without the birth defect I was cursed with.  I am and always have been a girl/woman, even if I was raised male.

Yes I have women I look to as role models and it so happens one of them is North and her name is a variation of my own.


Janet

The "specific type of woman" thing hurt me for a long time. I had too much of a rational mind and I knew the limits of HRT and surgery.

But at some point in therapy I finally realized that I would rather be an unattractive woman than an attractive man. That seemed to get me past my mental barrier. And then I just let the chips fall where they may.

I never really considered what "type" of woman I wanted to be.  I already was a woman.

My friends all tell me that I blend in very well.   I have never been "clocked" that I know of.  But I see photos of myself and I think I look awful!

Maybe attitude has more to do with it than we think.  There are a lot of masculine looking women but they are still women. 

I don't know.  I'm doing fine so far, so maybe I'm just too self conscious.

If there is one thing that has been freaking me out recently is from being impatient, I want things to get to a point where I can say the old maleness that was a part of me is now completely gone or at least gone enough for me to be all me. Well I'm not sure it's so much impatience than a part of me worrying that it won't happen and that I'll forever be haunted by a lingering maleness vibe. I see women pretend to act like a guy and you think "oh you ain't fooling anyone!!!", I want to be able to do that...one day! I guess with enough time not having any testosterone should help but it's such unknown ground to me and asking questions like this doesn't always give clear answers as it's so subjective.
I find myself explaining it to people even my parents as I worry that they may thing that this is as good as it gets, I have to keep reminding them for my own sake more than anything that it's still early days. The whole male or female vibe seems like such a hard bridge to cross.. more so when I don't know if it just happens or what?! my house mate gives off a gay vibe sometimes and that freaks me out, I'd hate for that to happen to me as I've never felt that way.
But yeah I agree with you Diana and Janet when you say I'm happy with who ever I'll be just as long as it's 'female'! more or less.

We can be our own worst critics.  We can also be our most powerful enablers.  (in reply to no specific post)

I see a lot of media and advertising, and there are outfits, makeovers and styles I drool over.

It is hard for me to speak of any sort of 'type'.  I've always had my own style and that I doubt will ever change.

I don't suppose this is a reply the original poster was looking for, but I can only respond saying that I strive to be very positive, charming and just witty enough to let my partner think s/he has the winning edge on a debate.

For me, it is really personality that I find makes someone attractive or unattractive - after the first five seconds of visual introduction to someone.

I do not mean to say that I believe personality is everything and looks/figure are nothing, far from it.  Working out on a good diet, HRT, FFS, etc... is only going to go so far for me though, as was stated previously in this thread I believe.

So I mean to say, I don't believe I would have the confidence to be just like a certain type.  But I do have confidence that I can be me and that with my valued traits, I can find looks for myself that are cute, sexy, beautiful... I can work with what I've got.

I am not a true optimist though... looking at this cover of 'Victoria's Secret' (early spring 2010 edition), I can't help but feel the smallest stab into my bubble of hopes, knowing I will never look exactly that alluring/seductive, after all is said and done.

Oh, and I could replace the Victoria's Secret image with hundreds of others.

Don't all women do this though?  (do these pants make my butt look big?)

if we say we would like to transform ourselves to look like a celebrity the shrinks say we have some weird sicko mind...they have even conjured up names for it and stuck them in the DSM...
I'm just happy I get seen as female.

Some peeps can deceive themselves in 2 different ways too.  There are those people that think they look ugly when in reality they look OK & maybe people see a woman when they see them.  Then there are those people that live in a fantasy world & think they look "passable" when in reality they aren't anything like that & get clocked in an instant.

It took me a long whilst to realise that what people were really seeing was a bloke desperately attempting to pass as a woman.  Not fun but that was the cold hard truth.  A year later, a new face & 30 thousand dollars later, people can finally see me.  I don't look like a celebrity.  Beauty was never my goal but I do look like the woman I was meant to be minus the male face.

Quote from: Virginia Marie on January 22, 2010, 09:38:25 PM
I don't think I'll win any beauty contests, but I don't think I'm a total dog either

I just want to be all the woman I can be.....But I def. need to live near the ocean

Which brings up another question.....East Coast or West Coast?  :laugh:

I can only go by your avatar picture, but your look really striking and interesting to me.

First time I saw it I thought, Wow, she looks a whole lot of fun.

Though I'm pretty boring myself and would probably get quite tired before you. :D

Quote from: Kaori on January 23, 2010, 04:04:26 AMI am not a true optimist though... looking at this cover of 'Victoria's Secret' (early spring 2010 edition), I can't help but feel the smallest stab into my bubble of hopes, knowing I will never look exactly that alluring/seductive, after all is said and done.

Whether a model or an actress don't forget that only 1 in maybe 30,000 women look that good. The rest of us have to settle for something more realistic.

I don't care any more, even if I do transition, and am not in fact solely androgyne-I look more female than some of the women around this city, even with a 3 day growth of beard, and with my head shaved!

I have always been a woman inside, i am just doing a little remodeling to make the outside match the inside, when i started transition i could care less if i passed or not, that was not the major concern, i consider it a bonus that i do pass, i am more of a tom boy more than a girly girl.

Paula

Quote from: Renate on January 22, 2010, 06:05:52 AM
I've noticed a bit on these forums that there are some people who transitioned with a very specific type of a woman as a goal.
In some cases, these people are disappointed when they find their goals unattainable.
Often this seems to be based on premature judgment of the results by themselves.

I did have this vision of the woman I wanted to be, based on a close friend of me.

It didn't take me long to realize that it would be impossible for be to become this short, petite, blonde and sexy woman that I dreamed of. But on the other hand, I am probably more satisfied as I am now. Slightly tall, not at all petite, brunette and good looking woman with a much better taste in clothes.

It was a long time ago but I don't really recall having any particular role model other than perhaps my mother, who unsurprisingly, I do look very much like. I think I was just one of those who wanted to be myself, and didn't care as long as that self was a reasonable approximation of female.

I just figured I'd be happier being an ugly woman than any kind of (pretend) man.  I thought I'd never pass, but for some reason I do.  I had no particular image of what I would look like or be like other than happier.

Just today I saw my secondary therapist (for my second letter), a woman I've known socially for six years.  She said I seem to have the same personality I always did, just as a woman.  As a psychologist, she seemed to think that was a good thing - that I wasn't trying to layer on some perceived notion of who I should be.

It turns out I make a sort of mannish woman but undeniably a woman.  I'm delighted. 

(And Emma Peel was one of my ideals!  That face.  That body.  That accent.  That intelligence.  That bravery.  How could you not love her?)

- Kate

I thought I'd never pass, but for some reason I do.

That resonates with me. 

I was stunned to find that I have no problem passing.  I could point out fifty reasons why I should not, and yet...

Quote from: Kay Henderson on January 25, 2010, 07:36:06 PM
I thought I'd never pass, but for some reason I do.

That resonates with me. 

I was stunned to find that I have no problem passing.  I could point out fifty reasons why I should not, and yet...

That kinda gives us all hope really.

Thanks for sharing it. Both of you.

Quote from: Kay Henderson on January 25, 2010, 07:36:06 PM
I was stunned to find that I have no problem passing.  I could point out fifty reasons why I should not, and yet...

same here...my first time out properly dressed was to go see the best known psychiatrist...had to go two short and one long train ride each way and pass thousands of folk along the way and no trouble at all until walking out of the shrink's office two girls doubletaked and came out with 'thats a bloke'.

Quote from: Diana_W on January 22, 2010, 09:51:27 PM
The "specific type of woman" thing hurt me for a long time. I had too much of a rational mind and I knew the limits of HRT and surgery.

But at some point in therapy I finally realized that I would rather be an unattractive woman than an attractive man. That seemed to get me past my mental barrier. And then I just let the chips fall where they may.

Word. I'm to this point, as well. I don't really care what I look like, so long as I am not burdened by "that."

Allison

I have a very specific type of woman in mind. Something between this (http://particle.physics.ucdavis.edu/Graphics/physics/LisaRandall.jpg) and this (http://lh4.ggpht.com/_8ISIK2q5fVw/RrXTAfgV1XI/AAAAAAAACl4/LepoPHco95w/Lynn%20Hill%20-03-%20Bobo%20dodo%20%287b%29%20-%20Fraguel%20-%20Mallorca.jpg).

So ... yeah. Good looks would be nice, but that's not really the point. ;)

Quote from: Muffin on January 22, 2010, 09:27:49 PM
I want clarification on these specific types, we seem to be thinking of actual people more than types like the mentioned soccer mum. *shrugs* I don't know exactly what you mean without more examples.

It's difficult to explain the soccer mom (mum) look, usually a casual simple look in age appropriate clothes with light makeup and a trendy hair style I guess.....

 ::)I have never actually attempted to mold myself into any specific type of woman. I think being mature and feminine is sufficient. I think I shall grow old and become a grouchy old  spinster.

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Post Merge: January 28, 2010, 07:00:10 PM

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ativan, dear.  When using chalk pastels use a art gum eraser and all errors dissappear. Also "art" is relative to what we like to see or percieve.

I want to be passable so bad that it's almost agonizing because I think about it a lot. I tend to be very self conscious about it. Though I am still very early in my transition, and am only part time, so I need to take it easy and stop being so anxious.

My friends tell me that it shouldn't take much to make me passable, and that the transition should do a lot, and makeup even now should do the trick, but blah, it's scary. I only go out at night when it's a little harder to see me clearly.

Quote from: azSam on February 01, 2010, 01:47:46 AM
I want to be passable so bad that it's almost agonizing because I think about it a lot. I tend to be very self conscious about it. Though I am still very early in my transition, and am only part time, so I need to take it easy and stop being so anxious.

My friends tell me that it shouldn't take much to make me passable, and that the transition should do a lot, and makeup even now should do the trick, but blah, it's scary. I only go out at night when it's a little harder to see me clearly.

same thing happened to me, but my way of dealing with it was by being more androgynous in my appearance to begin with. Making people question whether I was female instead of saying "is that a guy dressed as a woman? what the?".
I see diving in the deep end as getting ahead of one's self, unless you are passable without hormones then it's a different story.

I look back to my CDing days and think "how in the hell did I manage to delude myself so well... that's just a heinous crime against society!", *writes personal apologies to everyone in my city*.

But anyway I Think it's a very realistic way to approach transition, and a very safe way. ^_^
I do wish I started IPL earlier though, like most of us though I'm sure!!! lol nothing worse than going out looking perfect except for a bit of questionable shadow action :-/

Sam,
I was sure I would never pass but got to the point where I didn't care.  Attitude is important, because if you are anxious and driving yourself crazy worrying about whether you pass or not, you won't.

I would go out very early in the morning sometimes but I never went out at night unless I was with others.  There are a lot of creepy people who come out from under their rocks at night.  Plus, a number of them have some alcohol or other substance in their system by then.

When I went full-time, I had a woman's haircut, a little makeup, and fake breasts.  I wore women's jeans and top – nothing too girly.  I carried a workaday purse and wore earrings and a small pendant.  I probably looked like I had the day before in man-monde but with the breasts.  As everyone, including me, got used to me walking around that way I became more openly female.

The hard thing about going from the closet to the street is that there is a lot to learn.  If you can ease your way into it somehow, you can learn as you go.

And friends are a wonderful resource.

Good luck, Sam. :icon_flower:

- Kate

I certainly would like to be a pretty woman but I will be happy as any kind of woman. Of course I am a woman inside so I assume we are talking externally.

Pam

This is such a thought provoking question... Thanks so much for asking it!

I guess I've never pictured myself as specific type, physically, of any one particular woman, like 'looking' like someone famous or something (except, of course, for Vida Boheme... j/k!  :D ). I imagine myself more as the type of personality I want portray. Like what I would present myself as, my mannerisms, my demeanor, my attire... That sort of thing.

Quote from: Renate on January 22, 2010, 06:05:52 AM
I've noticed a bit on these forums that there are some people who transitioned with a very specific type of a woman as a goal

Personally I hope to be the girl that people are a little afraid of, not because of my looks but because they sense I can see through them. Professionally I want to be the sort of person who can see through them, too. I want people to be comfortable around me, but not in the sense that they can walk on me, rather in the company of a respected equal.

Romantically when my husband is talking with the guys and they call me an ice queen, I want him to say "oh hell no, you just have to get to know her".

Appearance is really the only thing standing in the way of these goals, I pretty much already described my personality  :icon_wink: I'll happily take a plain appearance, just as long as its deviance from the norm isn't always the first thing people notice about me unless of course they are noticing fabulous hair or magnificent breasts, then I can live with it.

I've never really pictured myself as a particular type of woman either....I'm just me.....The woman that I am