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My tri top is wearing out. And if you knew me, you'd know I'm very anal about how flat my chest is. So I started layering things to bind and even using belts and ace bandages, plus my binder, plus other things. And a couple days ago I thought I was having problems with my asthma but nooooo....turns out I have Pleurisy....which means the membranes in/around my lungs or something are swollen and irritated. From binding too hard. So heads up...don't do this! It hurts. But I don't have exactly enough to get a new tri top yet. Can't really complain cause I brought it on myself, but wanted to warn other guys out there. Be careful how hard you bind.

What size tritop do you wear?

Small.

Ouch! >< I hope things get better man, doesn't sound pleasant...

Thanks for warning us about this, it doesn't sound fun.

Hope it gets better soon.

I'm sticking this to the top of the section. Many people forget the dangers of binding too hard and this is a good thing to warn against. Thank you for posting this zombie and I hope you get better soon dude. 8)

Sorry to butt in on a guy's thread.

I totally understand why you guys bind, but from a medical point of view make sure you can still breath deeply in and exhale without pain. Try having a good cough and make sure you don't get rib pain.

Another little problem to drop on us.

Hugs Guys, and I hope you get better soon Zombie

Cindy

Thanks guys, and thanks Osiris for moving and stickying it.

I have asthma as I said before and it's aggravated it a bit. I get winded alot easier. I'm exactly $5 short of getting a new binder. So I'm waiting.

Oddly enough, I've never had any injury from binding before this. And I've used worse things, including duct tape, and I've never had issues with this. I've had problems breathing before from it and I've bound so tight before that I had to leave work cause I felt like I was going to pass out. But be careful guys.

One wonders if one can use the "dangers of binding" as a reason to try and press for the insurance system to help me...

Yeah...but they'd probably argue that it isn't "medically necessary" and we're just inflicting self mutilation.

I hope that you're feeling better now, Zombie. I find that I make my stomach worse by binding, but I need to bind, I don't feel comfortable without it. I need to save for a proper binder!  :-\

I wish I could take advice like this and make my brain understand that what I'm doing to myself is dangerous, but I just can't. :(

My chest dysphoria is so bad that if I'm not bound "properly" (by my own insane definition) then I feel like complete crap, and that I'm walking around looking like a girl and being an utter fraud.

I wear a wife-beater underneath, then my tritop, then I reach under and flatten and position everything and use medical tape directly on my moobs to physically prevent anything from shifting or coming loose. Then I fold up the bottom of the tritop so that there are essentially 6 layers of compression fabric over the chest and safety pin that in place. Then an underarmour shirt on top of that. Then my tshirt, then a hoodie.

When I take it all off at the end of the day (usually 12+ hours later, up to 18hrs some days), my skin is raw from the chafing on my back/sides, where the tape was (from nips to shoulders) is irritated and sometimes a thin layer of skin peels off, and I put polysporin on all the raw/open areas. My ribs are always tender to the touch, and I probably haven't taken a deep breath all year (even when I'm unbound, such as for sleeping, I tend to breathe more shallowly now as I guess that's what my body is used to).

I know that I'm damaging my skin at the very least (there is already scarring developing in some areas), and potentially my ribs/lungs as well. But I honestly don't know how to bind any more safely while still being able to leave the house without feeling completely exposed, dysphoric, and panicky.

It's no good to just say "it's dangerous for you" because that hasn't helped me quit smoking either. I'm sure I probably sound obstinate, but it's not intentional. I just can't force myself to bind more gently when it's my dysphoria that's calling the shots.

Any thoughts anyone?

Quote from: NES_junkie_James on June 24, 2010, 01:28:38 PM
I wish I could take advice like this and make my brain understand that what I'm doing to myself is dangerous, but I just can't. :(

My chest dysphoria is so bad that if I'm not bound "properly" (by my own insane definition) then I feel like complete crap, and that I'm walking around looking like a girl and being an utter fraud.

I wear a wife-beater underneath, then my tritop, then I reach under and flatten and position everything and use medical tape directly on my moobs to physically prevent anything from shifting or coming loose. Then I fold up the bottom of the tritop so that there are essentially 6 layers of compression fabric over the chest and safety pin that in place. Then an underarmour shirt on top of that. Then my tshirt, then a hoodie.

When I take it all off at the end of the day (usually 12+ hours later, up to 18hrs some days), my skin is raw from the chafing on my back/sides, where the tape was (from nips to shoulders) is irritated and sometimes a thin layer of skin peels off, and I put polysporin on all the raw/open areas. My ribs are always tender to the touch, and I probably haven't taken a deep breath all year (even when I'm unbound, such as for sleeping, I tend to breathe more shallowly now as I guess that's what my body is used to).

I know that I'm damaging my skin at the very least (there is already scarring developing in some areas), and potentially my ribs/lungs as well. But I honestly don't know how to bind any more safely while still being able to leave the house without feeling completely exposed, dysphoric, and panicky.

It's no good to just say "it's dangerous for you" because that hasn't helped me quit smoking either. I'm sure I probably sound obstinate, but it's not intentional. I just can't force myself to bind more gently when it's my dysphoria that's calling the shots.

Any thoughts anyone?

My warning was just that. I'm taking hormones pills whatever, all dangerous to my health.  I go out and could be beaten at anytime by homophobic animals who think I look like a guy in a dress. I drink too much because of GID.

We do what we can. I have nothing but admiration for my brothers, I was just trying to pass on some helpful advice.

Sorry
Cindy :-*

Cindy, you've got nothing to be sorry about, I took no offense from what you said.

It's just that I know I'm doing damage to myself, and I know I'm kind of powerless against it. I really do want to hear if anyone has found any helpful ways to beat back the dysphoria at least enough to keep myself healthy.

Thanks for commiserating, I really appreciate your reply. :)

My spouse has pleurisy that comes back again and again.  It's because he had pneumonia bad enough to be hospitalized.  Are you sure your pleurisy was caused by binding?  Did you never have any lung disease, like bronchitis or anything?

Well, I have asthma. I have had walking pneumonia and bronchitis in the past, but they weren't chronic. It seems to have gotten better since I quit using the belts and ace bandages and stuff to bind.

Nes_Junkie..I"ve been there. I've tried wearing two tri tops over one another cause it made me as flat as I wanted...but then my extremities started tingling and I got light headed and figured it was probably wise to take off the extra tri top before I passed out. I had to pretty much force myself with reasoning with myself to take them off. Now I'm using a tri top with an exteme cotton concealer over top. It makes me flat enough...and I can still breathe and function. Yet there's days where I look and still think...IT DOESN"T LOOK MALE ENOUGH and I go nuts. Lately I've been folding the tri top I wear up as much as I can to create another partial layer, safety pinning that, then putting on the cotton concealer. Then a tshirt or whatever I'm wearing. In reality, it's probably fine to any person on the street. But as I've said before and will say until I get surgery (hopefully not afterwards..)...it's not flat enough to me when I'm feeling especially dysphoric. I have to force myself to shower some days, cause I can't stand the look of myself.

I completely hear you. I tried two tritops once as well and I also learned quick quickly that I wouldn't make it through a whole day that way so I stopped. I know others say I look flat enough, or that I look like I've just got "pecs," but it's so hard to hear that reason and sanity when I look at myself and just see a huge lumpy "female-looking" chest. I know it's crazy, and I know I probably don't "have to" bind the way I do (to other people's standards of flatness), but I am not actually able to make myself stop. I've tried and I just can't do it. Gah... Here's hoping we both get top surgery before we further damage ourselves. :(

I struggle with this one because the only way i can get anywhere near as flat as i would like is to have so many layers on that when i look down at myself i look like ive got a huge chest anyway so im almost at the point of thinking why am i putting myself thro this much pain when i feel even more self conscious. Just cut the bl***y things off for me someone

Yeah, my drag dad who is ftm told me that not all guys have concave chests...but my chest isn't concave, it's just really flat if I bind how I want to. But binding tight enough to my standards would probably make me pass out. Idk. I think since starting T my pecs have gotten more muscular, but it means that even the small tri top that worked great before, doesn't now.

Zombie: have you noticed any change in your "denseness" since being on T? I'm really hoping for that side effect, but I don't know how common it is...?

Well, I've been binding on and off since I was 12, and I can say authoritatively that mine are less dense than they were when they were growing. Much less dense.

As far as flatness...I can't find any look that makes me happy for more than a day or so. I'd be perfectly happy to look like I have pecs (rather than being completely flat, or having moobs) but there is *nothing* I can do that will make my chest be flat at the sternum, which all guys' chests are. So binding too tightly doesn't really appeal to me because all it does is make the uniboob a little smaller.

I did just order an XS double front though (down from the Small, which I went to after the Medium didn't fit me despite my measurements). So maybe the ultra-flat-chest obsession is sucking me in. But mostly I'm just hoping the arm holes are smaller. If not, maybe I'll alter it so they are...the armpit fat is the worst, but I can't wear the T-shirt style binders in summer because the spandex layer is way too hot.

Quote from: NES_junkie_James on June 29, 2010, 09:18:02 PM
Zombie: have you noticed any change in your "denseness" since being on T? I'm really hoping for that side effect, but I don't know how common it is...?

Not much. I mean, the tumors have shrunk a bit. They mostly lost denseness by binding pre-T for nearly 3 years. My issue is the muscle growth. My pecs have grown, so they seem to stick out more when I bind and that's primarily the issue that's bothering me right now. Cause before, one tri top made me as flat as I wanted. Now I'm wearing two of them...and it's still not flat enough to me. Guess I have to quit obsessing. But that's easier said than done.

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Post Merge: June 30, 2010, 10:22:57 AM

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Oh, and the lack of flatness in the sternum is the MAIN thing that bothers me...cause i'd be flat enough to me if it weren't for that.

Quote from: zombiesarepeaceful on June 30, 2010, 10:18:36 AM
But that's easier said than done.

^This^

Update...the increased muscle in my pecs seems to be not as much of an issue...hopefully...cause now the fat in my chest is shrinking. So maybe it'll all level out to a bearable balance of muscle and fat until I can get surgery. My fat pattern is changing alot lately. I've gone from a 30 waist to a 32-36 waist pants, back to a 32. Lol. The same has probably happened to my chest.

Another note:

I just was talking to another trans guy on the issue of heart palpitations. His were from binding too hard. I've been having this issue since starting T but it could also be from binding. So beware.

Quote from: zombiesarepeaceful on July 15, 2010, 06:17:31 PM
Another note:

I just was talking to another trans guy on the issue of heart palpitations. His were from binding too hard. I've been having this issue since starting T but it could also be from binding. So beware.

Well.. that explains a lot then. =\

thaxs for the warning get better soon

Thanks for the warning... that could explain why I've never had heart palpitations in the past. I think now that I've gained weight I'm not wearing tight shirts and noticing it as much. Once I loose the weight I'll be back to the obsessing. Who knew gaining weight could be a good thing 

OUCH! You have my sympathy. I've had plaurisy a few times, but it was brought on by bronchitis and ashma + having an inflammatory autoimmune disease. I bound when I was first getting boobs; 13-15, but got over some of my shame, but always wore sports bras until I was older. I identify more as Androgyn, but am probably more male in my brain/heart than female. It upsets me that I can't wear tight sports bras or anything like that now, not even a minimizer bra. I have D cups. Ugh. I've developed costochondritis, which is inflammation in the ligaments and tissue between the ribs, due to the autoimmune disease.  It hurts. Regular bras hurt if they're not loose enough. I wear camis with a tank bra, but of course, that does very little for support and no compression. It's just not an option for me to compress at all.

Please be careful not to hurt yourselves. For those with chaffing issues, I have psoriasis in some not so nice areas(thanks the to autoimmune stuff again) and I found a product they sell in the South(my dad lives in Alabama). It's called "Monkey Butt Powder"  You can find it online.  It really helps.  I've also found that Desitin- aka baby butt ointment heps with bad chaffing until it can heal.  My regimen to keep the bad, irritted, chaffed psoriasis at bay is OTC hydrocortizone cream after shower, followed by "Monkey Butt Powder." In the evenings, after cleaning the area again, I use more hydrocorizone cream, folllowed by aloe vera gel. I know my bad psoriasis isnt the same, but it hurts similarly to the chaffing I had when I would bind.  The hydrocortizone helps the inflammation. Just an idea to try.

I've been much more responsible with my binding practices lately (my bf and another good friend were both very persistent in getting me to stop injuring myself), and my cuts are almost all gone now. There's still a lot of bruising and scarring, but those are improving too.

Just wanted to give you all an update since I haven't been around much lately :)

Good on the updates...I still have plenty of scars and occasional broken skin/cuts from binding but as of now I wear two tri tops normally. Trying my damndest to save up money for at least a down payment on surgery..that way, it's already there, it's deposited, and I can keep working towards it. A down payment is only $500 at the surgeon I want to go to...and it reserves a surgery date.

Wow, thanks for the warning.  Note to self: avoid the duct tape.

I went out today for a short time (two ish hours) bound up a bit tighter than I usually do, and I had some pain in my right side, in the back. I honestly can't tell if I bound too hard or if I just put too much pressure on my back (I have a pretty messed up spine). I had a little trouble breathing but I also can't tell if it was from that or from being out of the house (yay more issues). Thoughts?

well i wanna start off sayin thx for the warning. personally since im not on T im only on hormone blockers but my moobs are small wich is good because im starting off early. but let me get to the point i try to not work out my pecs because i feel that makes them look bigger (mayb just my disphoria) as for the showering bit i shower with my binder on (yes i do get clean) wich makes me feel better about myself. the one thing i absolutely hate about my binder is the armpit fat that hangs out. and im not even that fat! it makes me not want to wear tank tops anymore.

Wow...no good brother! I hope you start feeling better soon!

Wow this is old.

I haven't had issues with this since then. I still wear two binders at once. Steadily saving for surgery and get my letter in May.

Andrew, I don't know how you shower with the binder on....wouldn't that make it stretch out? Mine stretch when they get wet and dry on my body. Freaks me out, I hate teh feeling of my binders stretching out.

hmmm whenever i shower it doesnt feel like they stretch. and they dont look/feel any bigger. but also putting them in the wash makes them shrink so after a shower if it feels stretched you could put it in the washer/dryer.

I take that back, I was wearing a new underworks xs tri top along with an old one of the same type, at the same time, and got the same symptoms again. Ow.

Dude I got pleurisy from it too back in March. I have the same binder, same size.  >:(

maybe if its not too hot where you live you cud try and under armour tanktop under your binder. im not sure how comfortable it would be but its just a thought.

If it's any consolation, guys, I can't bind to my satisfaction either, because I have fibrocystic breast disease, which makes it extremely painful if I bind too hard.  Like, I'll seriously be gasping just from sharp, stabbing pain in my breasts, pain that makes me want to go kill things, it's so bad.

But my Ds turn into A-small Bs, and because I'm a little chubby anyway, it works for me.   ::)  Thanks for the warnings on 'why NOT to bind too tightly' and good luck with everything, guys.   :)

It's a great idea to have a few strong coughs after you take your binder off. Unfortunately, binding can cause many different lung problems, but the coughs do help.
When you're sick with any sort of respiratory symptoms, binding is just a bad idea. It will hinder your ability to heal and you'll stay sick longer. Just try to stay home or around people who know you're FTM.

I am getting the Tri-Top binder - Style: 983 from Underworks, I have no idea how to find the right size. D: I measured the biggest part of my chest and it was about 34-36 inches. I'm pretty flat now and I don't even wear a bra I wear a Compression shirt from Under Armour and they work pretty good. I need something that I can wear for about 8-10 hours to school pretty comfortably. I don't want it to be so tight that I can barely breathe tho, but I want it to fit so it will make me a little flatter. Also, what color should I get - black or white. I wear alot of collard shirts will they show?
Thanks in advance! :D

BTW: I'm new I have no idea about this site so I just asked this question here. :/
X-Small: (28-30 inches)
Small: (31-33 inches)
Medium: (34-36 inches)
Large: (37-40 inches)
PLEASE HELP! D:

I don't know much about binding but I have heard about this problem from other FTMs. Does it always cause problems like this? I have small breasts that can be hidden almost completely with a sports bra and I smoke, is binding a bad idea for me?

I would say that if a sports bra is working for you, and you're comfortable with how you look, stick with what you're doing. don't bind unless it's really necessary. binding is, at best, uncomfortable. and as zombie and others shared, can lead to medical problems. binding isn't something you have to do to be a transman. go with what works and what's more comfortable. i'm about a 36 B and i wear a velcro style binder from lezloveboat. i don't fasten it especially tight, but it's good enough. the problem i deal with most is a heat rash of sorts under my arms from wearing it in this hot weather and sweating so much. some talc powder applied to the areas affected helps. also, smoking is going to cause lung issues that will probably be worsened by binding. i suggest cutting back as much as possible or quitting, though i understand it's not easy. hope this helps!

Hey, just wondering if I can get any tips on this from anyone who's had it, or just severe coughing. The last three weeks since I was camping and so was binding almost 24/7 for a week (though noticed I was coughing a lot for weeks after the last cold I had in May...not sure if this 3 week bout of coughing is carried over from there, or if it's separate) I've been coughing a lot in the morning and at night. Basically, lately I've been coughing bad enough that it makes me puke and/or retch when there's nothing left to puke. I also coughed up some weird ->-bleeped-<- this morning that looked red, and I don't know if it was a bit of blood or something else. I even called in sick to work because I was coughing/puking/retching for so long that I'm not sure how I'd make the hour and a half bus ride without a bathroom. I'm gonna hit the walk-in clinic tomorrow after work, but I'm just curious if this sounds familiar to any of you guys.

Do you think it could be coughing left over from the cold back in May. That aggravated by binding almost 24/7 for a week and being stuck out in the rain for a few days while camping? Just random ->-bleeped-<- that has nothing to do with not taking off my binder for almost a week straight?

I dunno, I've had bad coughing bouts before following a cold, but never to this extreme, and I didn't have a cold directly before this last bout start...so I've been googling around to try to find out wtf is wrong with me.

Berserk - it sounds like bronchitis or (God forbid) pneumonia. I can't say for sure that it was caused by binding, but I can say that binding almost certainly isn't helping. Definitely get yourself checked out.

Hey Kyril, thanks for the reply. I went and got checked out today at a walk-in clinic. The doctor there gave me a prescription for an inhaler and some antibiotics. He couldn't specify what it was beyond that it was a chest infection of sorts, and that this was the best way from stopping from developing into something worse.

Binding isn't helping, but at the same time I can't remember not wearing a binder and I don't think I would be able to stand leaving my room to be around my roommates let alone going to work without a binder...so I feel kind of stuck, because it was suggested that I stop for a bit. I think I'm gonna chance it and just stick with the inhaler and antibiotics and hopefully they'll clear the infection up without having to stop binding until it does clear up. Times like this I really wish top surgery were in my near future... It's ->-bleeped-<-ing sad when I can't even decide if coughing weird ->-bleeped-<- up and coughing so hard I puke is worse than not binding. I have one binder that's one size looser...so maybe that's a temporary solution?

@Berserk I had walking pneumonia before (basically pneumonia where you're not bed ridden) and it sounds like what you have

I have asthma, get chest pains, and parts of my chest go numb...but I still wear 3 xs tri tops in various stages of stretched outed ness at one time..but I'm stubborn.

I have asthma and lots of cysts in my breasts. I bind for too long, but not very hard. I've noticed that my cysts have shrunken and gotten a lot less painful since I started binding. My nipples get numb, though. My breathing is definitely worse. I get winded faster.

I'm trying to be careful. It's not always easy to know where to draw the line with risks that make me happy, though.

I'm going to add to the warnings...

I've just been diagnosed with Pleurisy as well, and binding is the only cause I can find. Three weeks of chest pain I finally caved and went to the student health center. They gave me some anti-inflamitory pills to help with pain, told me to stop binding for a few days and see how it feels then.

Does anyone have suggestions for how to support the moobs without binding? The only bra's I have left are A sports bras (I'm a B-C) that I used for binding before I got my underworks medium binders. Even if I managed to turn up an old bra I don't know if I could wear it without feeling...girlish. I've fought so hard to get out of them so going back seems like a failure.

Felix, I'm with you on trying to figure out where to draw the line. I'm on campus for 10-14 hours with an occasional 19 hr day thrown in and I've been binding for all of it for a few months and feeling great. Now with the pain I'm having to figure out where I NEED to bind and where I'd WANT to bind, but can miss due to health. My friends have made it clear that if its harming me that I not bind around them. They're good about the dysphoria, one even lets me take my shirt off as well so I can feel more like a guy (I love being shirtless).

I try to make myself occasionally go a day without binding, just to give my body a break. I tend to do that on days off and mostly stay home then, but it still feels weird. On those days I wear a large t shirt and a large sweatshirt or hoodie (not the zipper kind). Sometimes a wife beater underneath. All this leaves me shapeless, which is alright. If my breasts' movement makes me aware of them and bothers me, I wear a sports bra, but sometimes the bra bothers me more.

I don't think I'd feel good about myself if I dressed like that very often, though.

I don't know where you live, but when it gets cold enough, you can wear enough layers that binding might not matter so much.

I'm sorry to hear about that...have you tried slowing down on binding?

Quote from: GamerJames on June 24, 2010, 01:28:38 PM
I wish I could take advice like this and make my brain understand that what I'm doing to myself is dangerous, but I just can't. :(

My chest dysphoria is so bad that if I'm not bound "properly" (by my own insane definition) then I feel like complete crap, and that I'm walking around looking like a girl and being an utter fraud.

I wear a wife-beater underneath, then my tritop, then I reach under and flatten and position everything and use medical tape directly on my moobs to physically prevent anything from shifting or coming loose. Then I fold up the bottom of the tritop so that there are essentially 6 layers of compression fabric over the chest and safety pin that in place. Then an underarmour shirt on top of that. Then my tshirt, then a hoodie.

When I take it all off at the end of the day (usually 12+ hours later, up to 18hrs some days), my skin is raw from the chafing on my back/sides, where the tape was (from nips to shoulders) is irritated and sometimes a thin layer of skin peels off, and I put polysporin on all the raw/open areas. My ribs are always tender to the touch, and I probably haven't taken a deep breath all year (even when I'm unbound, such as for sleeping, I tend to breathe more shallowly now as I guess that's what my body is used to).

I know that I'm damaging my skin at the very least (there is already scarring developing in some areas), and potentially my ribs/lungs as well. But I honestly don't know how to bind any more safely while still being able to leave the house without feeling completely exposed, dysphoric, and panicky.

It's no good to just say "it's dangerous for you" because that hasn't helped me quit smoking either. I'm sure I probably sound obstinate, but it's not intentional. I just can't force myself to bind more gently when it's my dysphoria that's calling the shots.

Any thoughts anyone?

i totally understandd wat ur talkn bout n judge from ur pic u look like w/o oin that u couldd pass for a guy who has nice chest muscles w just wearin a bindder thats wat helps me bot go overboard w doin that bc i ct stan bein confined eityr freaks me out if im not free. So I'd try just puttn the binder on n look at urself w/o the other stuff n flex ur muscle b oput urself ina trance in ur mind sayn im a muscle man...look at thee awesome pecs n arm muscles grrrrr lol. but for real do it bc it helps me thats wat i hafta o as well n if lookin at pix of bioguiys n there chesy after u put ur bindder on will help as well bc u lookn down on urself u think they r still "poppedd" out but they aint. look at vin diesel for example his pecs r huge n if u look at him from the side looks like he has booobs...

I wonder if daily breathing exercises would help long-term binders with lung problems. Has anyone here tried?

I haven't been binding long enough to have any problems, but I usually try to incorporate some kundalini yoga into my day which has a lot of breathing practices (Possibly the best Kundalini practiceS I've found ( by Snatam Kaur ) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvztQ8HZ9tM&feature=related#)).

I used to have a binding too hard problem as well. For some reason, i just felt more comfortable having an extremely tight bind. But after I started working it, my chest shape got better and it was okay for me to let loose a bit. And I found that different binders gives me different affects. the high performance velcro binder from love boat is what i wear most now, it allows me to adjust the tightness and worked best for my body shape.

It got to a point where I figure, if i have to wear binders all day all the time, might as well make it comfortable.

Wow. Crazy to look back on this thread. Zombiesarepeaceful was my original account and at some point I think it got deleted somehow by accident, for not logging in or something? idk

I've come a long way from when I posted this thread. I finally got top surgery a week ago.

But that aside, I learned awhile ago that my asthma was induced by smoking cigarettes and when I quit smoking, binding got much easier. Still had pain and numbness on my skin and cuts and bruises and scars from binding but no pleurisy. I had never considered smoking to be a contributing factor, so there's something to think about