Susan's Place Transgender Resources

are there any of you who are full-time and in the work force with a job and such? i've heard a lot about how many trans kids end up in ->-bleeped-<-ty labor-intensive jobs despite good degrees because of the transphobia and it's freaking me out.

All kinds of people are getting ->-bleeped-<-ty jobs these days regardless of degrees.  And that's the people who can get a job in the first place.

Being trans no doubt does not help, but it's not the only deal.  One thing I notice all the time is the lack of previous work experience.  I really don't need an employee that comes with training wheels when I can find others with outstanding work records.

One of the things that really works against FtM are the requirements differ for men and women in a lot of things.  For example, a woman working where I do is only required to carry 50lbs, where a guy has to be able to carry 75lbs (note: I did not say 'pick up', I said 'carry' 75lbs.)

My experience is that unless you are well connected or have enough money to live on nothing whilst doing unpaid internships you will be doing a ->-bleeped-<-ty job anyway until you have what they call experience. At which point you will then get a job working for someone your age or younger who did have the connections/ money to live on an unpaid internship.

Oh and Tekla, I reckon I could carry that stuff (well I do after DJ nights) but I would end up electrocuting meself somehow.

I've had some issues but I didn't have a previous job on top of the fact that I haven't finished my degree yet. Best places to look are theme/amusement parks if you have any near by and places of that sort. I had a job at a theme park where I was told I could transition on the job no problem but it was to far away to keep :( If you have glbt center or something like that they may know of a gay owned business that would hire. Short answer: Like Tekla said, everyone is having trouble getting a job but I have a lot of trans friends who are full time and have jobs so I guess it isn't impossible (depending on where you live) just seems impossible sometimes

I think, that at least in the US, it's been a lot harder for kids to find jobs over the last 20-30 years that would give them that experience.  I started delivering newspapers when I was 8, by 12 I was working at the newspaper HQ setting up the runs, I also was doing inventory work when I was 12.  Got my first real job at 17 at some fast food joint, and was assistant manager by 18. That kind of experience is harder to come by anymore.

Quote from: Sameth on August 02, 2010, 01:37:39 PM
are there any of you who are full-time and in the work force with a job and such? i've heard a lot about how many trans kids end up in ->-bleeped-<-ty labor-intensive jobs despite good degrees because of the transphobia and it's freaking me out.

Not true.

I've had many high profile and professional jobs.

I have now fallen off the gravy-train, but it had nothing to do with my history, and everything to do with my own attitudes to work and aspirations to become a writer.

Quote from: Sameth on August 02, 2010, 01:37:39 PM
are there any of you who are full-time and in the work force with a job and such? i've heard a lot about how many trans kids end up in ->-bleeped-<-ty labor-intensive jobs despite good degrees because of the transphobia and it's freaking me out.

Unfortunately degree's do not guarantee jobs and with the current economic climate and job situation you would be lucky to get a ->-bleeped-<-ty labour-intensive job.  Hard work never hurt anyone.  Nothing wrong with starting at the bottom and working your way to the top.

-={LR}=-

I find writery type aspirations are a warning klaxon to an employer - I think there is a big push against people having hobbies or passions (because they must have a passion for soup or pantyhose or accountancy or whatever they work at - I have these images of these passionate workplaces, sounds quite dramatic).

I agree.  If it ain't 1000% pertinent to the job, don't even bring it up.

Quote from: Sameth on August 02, 2010, 01:37:39 PM
are there any of you who are full-time and in the work force with a job and such? i've heard a lot about how many trans kids end up in ->-bleeped-<-ty labor-intensive jobs despite good degrees because of the transphobia and it's freaking me out.

I work as an IT manager and have been working in computer industry all my life pretty much.  I get along well with the other girls in the office who think i am much more social able then their old IT person.  Then again they dont know I am TS, well except for HR, but they cant tell anyone. 

Even my best friend doesnt know I am TS.  We work for the same company, different departments.

There was one incident that someone found out, i think it was in my past, i used to work as a teacher for 10 years and i think i had a student from one of the employees families, anyway, apparently some guy at the job site wanted to go out with me, and the manager said i was a guy.  I didnt know about this till my fiance was transferred to that job site later.  I asked HR how the information got leaked, and they went into action, and reprimanded the manager for spreading gossip while keeping my secret still a secret.  My fiance tried to fix it prior by showing a picture of me in a bikini and saying she is 100% woman and smiled.  The guys at work didnt believe the manager anymore but got some slack for HR coming down and giving everyone a speech about spreading work gossip. They just attested it to an overreacting SO of my fiance not liking being called a guy, either way its resolved. 

Yes, get a ->-bleeped-<-ty job regardless of what stage you are in transition or how you are going about it, you need a bloody job or money to move forward.

My jobs were working in a variety store, cleaning, draughtsperson (technical trade) and finally in the education industry (professional).  Each time I moved up the 'ladder'.

While you are working go to 'school' and study to get that next piece of 'paper' because that piece of paper usually will lead to a much better paying job and one that you will like or love doing.  Yes times are tough, however they were saying the same things 30 years ago when I first started out about finding a job was difficult, so have things changed much in that sense 'not really'

So go to bloody work and take care and happy job hunting!

Kind regards
Sarah B

I can think of a couple of things that are very different in the current climate.

1.  The amount of information I can get on any perspective hire now huge.  Much more detailed, and much more informative.

2.  The number of entry level positions has shrunk.  It's a lot harder to find that 'first job' because of the number of people applying who have a work history, and the requirements for entry level have increased upwards.

3. the very stagnant nature of the current economy has a lot fewer people changing jobs, moving up or whatever, and as a result, a lot fewer openings.

4.  A lot of things are working out like our union contract re-negations, more money, but fewer slots.  So that I'm making a lot more cash than I did a few years ago, but we have 20% fewer people doing the work.

I waited until I was pushing 40 & sitting on top of a big, fat mortgage payment to transition. I have extensive work experience in my field and had been with my current employer for over 3 years when I started HRT.

I'm stuck with the problems of people having to learn a new name, pronouns, etc., but they powers that be decided that the quality of my work & my attitude are what matters.

I'm a certified IT professional and a Journeymen CNC machinist but I work as a waitress. Not because of transition but because unemployment is at 17% here.

I lost my $40,000 a year job back in September of 2008 and after submitting over 500 resumes and applications and only getting one interview I decided that my resume sucked. I have lots of skills but resume writing is not one of them so I had my resume professionally done three weeks ago. Since then I have had four interviews and the one I had today looks like I may get it. Starting at ~$30,000 a year. It's a CNC Machining position and typically a "mans" job but dammit, I got a vajayjay to pay for!

The jobs are out there but more skill is required to make the cut because right now it's an employers market. They can get the cream of the crop on their terms.

let me rephrase to all of you sounding a little hostile and implying that i am turning up my nose at ->-bleeped-<-ty jobs.

i have nothing against ->-bleeped-<-ty jobs. i am aware as anyone that the economy sucks and it is a miracle to get a ->-bleeped-<-ty job at all. that's fine, that's life, whatever. entry-level jobs are rare and i am fully prepared to end up in a ->-bleeped-<-ty job for a couple years until i get experience. i am freaked out about getting a ->-bleeped-<-ty job because of my transition, not because of the ->-bleeped-<- economy.

hopefully it will be easier for me since i am already two years into RLE and not even graduated high school so i will be taken more seriously, but i am still terrified. i live in a very academically driven area, so if you're not off to an ivy league with aspirations for a well-paying corporate job, the general mindset is that you're going to be a hobo and dead by 22. ::)

Actually, having had plenty of both, I'll take the manual labor job over the corporate whore/cubicle clown stuff any day.  The happiest people in the world go home stinking to high heaven and need a shower after work, and not before.

Quote from: tekla on August 03, 2010, 04:48:07 PM
Actually, having had plenty of both, I'll take the manual labor job over the corporate whore/cubicle clown stuff any day.  The happiest people in the world go home stinking to high heaven and need a shower after work, and not before.

I do what i love, but yeah sometimes i wouldnt mind just doing a hard days work and coming home and not feeling the stress of whether this or that project will be on time as well as bringing your work home...  I think my fiance has it down, works hard, comes home and does what he likes, he is extremely happy.  Meanwhile i stress over issues and cant relax even when at home, but he helps with that...

I do what i love

I thought you stayed at home and did 'high finance' stuff.

i am freaked out about getting a ->-bleeped-<-ty job because of my transition, not because of the ->-bleeped-<- economy.

Just my experience, transition has played very little if any roll in my ability to get a job paying what I was accustom to, aside from the fact that women still get paid less then men for the same job skills more often then not.

I work in a very public place and have only the random customer here and there that giggles or glances sidelong at me. Just this week I've had three interviews and I start a new job tomorrow and also have an interview with one of the largest national telecommunications companies for a management position.

I said all that to say this, I don't think transition will have as much of an impact on job placement as experience will. if you have or acquire the skills the job will come.

I think transition will affect it to this end: if you wind up feeling better about yourself, that translates into being more confident, and confident persons give better interviews.  That's a pretty awesome power to be bringing, for sure on that.

But, nothing beats having been successful doing it.  It says (in crayon cause they won't give us anything sharper) at the Fillmore 'you don't get trained here, you get here trained.'  And in my office the sign reads, "in theory there is no difference between theory and practice, in practice, there is."  (Which I think is Yogi Berra, or it should be.)

But confidence is very sexy, and very persuasive. 

I'm actually pondering going back into industry for the money and to see how I woudl be accepted in amostly male environment...I presently work in hospital office but there are lots of good jobs for skilled machinists and multitalented engineers that look very tempting and pay good money.  but do I want to come home and be all smelly from a factory?

Quote from: lilacwoman on August 04, 2010, 02:35:45 PM
I'm actually pondering going back into industry for the money and to see how I woudl be accepted in amostly male environment...I presently work in hospital office but there are lots of good jobs for skilled machinists and multitalented engineers that look very tempting and pay good money.  but do I want to come home and be all smelly from a factory?

I work in the IT industry where i am both feared and hailed as a godess. LOL.  Typically IT people are like ~ i wish their were more women who did IT... then they see you, omg its a woman that does IT~ RUN! 

BTW men dont like it when you beat them in anything.... makes them sad and not want to play with you anymore... ~_~

I hire and do hr as part of my job.  I am not "out".  I have hired "butch" lesbians and would have no problem hiring a FTM as long as they could do the job.  We do high rise concrete construction.  IF you get the guy thing down about keeping mouth shut, putting up with pranks,BS,general farting, urinating with bathroom door open etc.etc. they will eventually accept you. Some of the women I've hired have gone on to start their own businesses.  MTFs have a much more difficult time of it in most occupations.  I am pretty fem, and been on hormones for quite a while.  I refuse to visit sites (too hot), cannot use those port-o-johns, etc. I am sure that I am considered a "Wuss".  Everyone knows that I have done the work in the past and have taken extensive educational work to get higher in the food chain.  I have a wife, who works here, so no ones sexuality is threatened by me. In male dominated industries that is the problem.
Good luck, FIND A MENTOR in your field for support.  You are lucky in that there are many "out" lesbians that support each other.  I am not suggesting that you are, just that you will probably find a much larger successful support group than most MTFs who want to truely help you get ahead.  I wish we had more on our side. 

do I want to come home and be all smelly from a factory?

Is it somehow rewarding to come home smelling great but with a hella lot less money?

In the end, the works hours are the same, but the off hours wind up being way different.

Quote from: tekla on August 04, 2010, 01:06:29 AM
I think transition will affect it to this end: if you wind up feeling better about yourself, that translates into being more confident, and confident persons give better interviews.  That's a pretty awesome power to be bringing, for sure on that.

But, nothing beats having been successful doing it.  It says (in crayon cause they won't give us anything sharper) at the Fillmore 'you don't get trained here, you get here trained.'  And in my office the sign reads, "in theory there is no difference between theory and practice, in practice, there is."  (Which I think is Yogi Berra, or it should be.)

But confidence is very sexy, and very persuasive.

And desire and ambition. Interviewed two weeks ago for a technical officer in a hospital lab. Ninety percent of the resumes and letters were rubbish. "Deer sir I wont to have the gob advertised in ...... I can start soon" . I got text messages as applications, in text ??? ???. Applications sent to the wrong address. If someone doesn't have the ability to read the instructions they will never get a job (or even a gob).

People I interviewed were great. And the thing that ended up separating them was their enthusiasm and ambition.  I didn't need experience, they needed an  appropriate degree, but we would train them. But the person bursting out of their skin to do stuff is the one I want.

I know are economies are in different stages but I hope you guys over the pond get the act together again soon and people can get jobs again.

Cindy

Quote from: rejennyrated on August 02, 2010, 01:59:26 PM
Not true.

I've had many high profile and professional jobs.

I have now fallen off the gravy-train, but it had nothing to do with my history, and everything to do with my own attitudes to work and aspirations to become a writer.

Hey, I don't mean to go against the tide here, but Jenny's got a good point.  My doctor who oversees my HRT is a transwoman who transitioned in her early-40s.  She OWNS the practice ... with about 32 doctors in it.  Having a transdoctor is the bomb!  Last time I saw her about 3 weeks ago, the first thing she said to me was, "Are we a happy girl?"  Gotta LOVE that!

May I refer you to 2 websites that prove that transpeople CAN and DO succeed out in the marketplace?  Here you go:

(1)   Lynn Conway's Website:

http://ai.eecs.umich.edu/people/conway/ (http://ai.eecs.umich.edu/people/conway/)

Lynn is one of the best-known and professionally-successful transsexual women around.  On about the middle-third of the first page on her website, you'll see categories labeled "Transsexual Women's Successes" and "Successful TransMen."  Take the time to really read these stories and to deeply think about them.  You'll be glad you did.

(2)   Karen Serenity's Website:

http://www.karenserenity.com/OldSerenity/links.htm (http://www.karenserenity.com/OldSerenity/links.htm)

Karen was/is very professionally successful herself.  Best of all, she's all about "positive thinking" transsexuality.  That's the winning attitude we all need.  There are scads of inspiring stories there.  By all means, take your time and absorb the ones you like the best.  You'll like them, I'm sure.  

There are other well-known transsexuals past (Renee Richards) and present (Andrea James) who are well-educated, well-accomplished people who did/do well considering their circumstances.  Many transsexuals have done well without higher education.  These are the ones I personally admire the most.  Both Lynn and Karen's websites highlight several of them.  Check them out!

Last, but by no means least, there are several people HERE who are doing quite well. 

Finally, the worldwide economy is way down.  No surprise.  It's nonsustainable by its very design.  It's based upon one very false premise:  Infinity.  We live in a finite world.  We're running up against the logical limits of "economic growth."  Sorry, Harvard Business School, Wharton Business School, Chicago Booth School of Business, Kellogg Northwestern School of Management (I think that's what it's called), London School of Economics, etc., etc., etc., but you've ALL overlooked this most fundamental tenet of economics.  This tenet is to economics what relativity is to physics:  A look at the boundry value conditions underlying the entire discipline.  Gotta add quantum theory into the physics lexicon to get a more complete picture, but you get the point.  I digress.  I'll stop now.  I'm opened to discussion about this, by the way.  Private message me, and I'll be glad to politely talk it over with anyone, the aforesaid business schools included.  Anyway, ...

You can make your own "breaks" (good luck) if you have to.  It may not be easy, but it'll be worth it.  Women, minorities and foreigners are making tremendous headway toward accomplishing the duly-deserved success that was denied them for eons.  You can too.  Be determined to make your way, and you will.

Good luck!    ;)

Apple hired me when I was 18, My birth name was Rebecca (omg...) but as soon as interview #1 started, I told them I preferred to be called Reece. No problem with that. About 3 months in, I was feeling more comfortable and I told my managers that I was trans, and that I'd prefer male pronouns but wouldn't be mad if they slipped. Instantly, all 150 of the employees started using male pronouns and had absolutely no problem. When my mom finally picked my new name, I told my managers again, and they even offered to get my corporate email address changed so it started with a 'J'.
SO IN MY OPINION, it really depends who you work for. I know what you mean though because as soon as I hit 17 I started looking for jobs. GameStop sucked. Zumiez was fine. Idk, I'd look around and see the people they hire. Diversity of any kind.

Who knows about Microsoft...

I'm very much full time (over a year, legal name change + T for quite a while) and I have a kick ass job.

Great people, enjoyable job, very stable and it pays pretty damn well too.

It can happen. You've just got to not make a big deal about the trans thing. Don't fall into the trap of using it as an excuse for failure. Self pity makes people hate you. Just stand up, be confident, and kick ass - and other people will be confident in you.

Oh yeah - and there is nothing wrong with "blue collar cultured" work. Some of it is highly skilled and pays very nicely :). Just because you don't wear a suit and sit in a cubicle doesn't mean your job is unprofessional, menial or brainless. Some of those jobs can also be downright fun! I love getting paid bucketloads for doing something I'd probably do for free if they asked nicely enough :laugh:.

I graduated from uni this summer and I'm very lucky in that I walked into a job someone I knew had just left, and recommended me for.  I'm working in a bookshop and it's not amazingly well paid, but will pay the bills and get me independence and look good on my CV.  I would like to become a teacher but I'm waiting to start a PGCE course till I get T on the NHS/ can afford it privately - I would like to have been on T before starting any sort of work really, but I'm still waiting for it! I just couldn't face going home and sitting around on the dole, particularly as my parents are only just accepting that I'm now their son. 

I'm not sure if my boss knows I'm trans - I haven't told him, but he may have guessed or my friend who had the job before me may have told him.  Everyone in work knows me as male, but unfortunately I don't pass with all the customers, and some keep saying "I'll pay the lady" etc in front of my co-workers - argh! So they may have guessed! Still, I think it's less hassle than if I'd gone straight to a teacher training course and had to teach a class of 11 yr olds who would have been asking me what I was all the time, as kids tend to do! And hey - it's a job, and Britain's a hard place for new grads to find jobs at the moment, so I'm a lucky boy really. 

Good luck everyone finding jobs  :) Just be confident in interviews, be positive on your CV's, and think about how you'll deal with the trans question before u go to interview or your 1st day.

jamesdc

That is really great. It just shows that companies that think about productivity and success function so much better.

It's such a no-brainer really, happy employees are better employees. They turn up for work, they produce more and they take care of the comapny.