Susan's Place Transgender Resources

any of you guys have any suggestions on what to do about ID's? I've gotten to the point where my drivers liscence is pretty much useless because of the gender marker and such.. :/ I have to provide a bunch of pieces of ID for people to believe it really is me and not a fake.. and it seems to be more of a hassle everytime I use it. What have other people done about this? Can't get the gender marker switched for a while.

I was wondering the same thing. Also if anyone has ever gotten a fake ID just for the name and gender marker. I know you could get in a lot of legal trouble for using one, but seems so tempting to get

so very tempting. I'm pretty sure they just let me into places because.. they figure it's more of a hassle to give me no entry.. then to just met me in.

Depends on your state/country.  In Oregon you need a court-ordered name change and a letter from your therapist.

It's so hard to fake an ID these days though, with the water marks and all. The only people I know who have pulled it off, took the water marks from their real ID and put them on a fake, effectively destroying the original. I wouldn't recommended it. I guess I have no useful advise for you. =/

Some people get a carry letter from their therapist.

Ha, I need to get a new university ID so badly.  It's not like I use it that often, but when I do, people look twice.  In the photo, my hair is at the longest it's ever been and I have bangs.  My friend's 3 year old daughter was rifling through my wallet at a party, found my ID and looked SO CONFUSED. She asked, "who's dat?" and I just told her it was my sister, lol.

Don't get caught with an altered 'official' (state or federal) ID.  Really.  Bad stuff.

I live in cali..n I have my gender marker changed to M on my drivers license.I just provided the proper paper work with my therapist signature.

would it be terrible, or illegal to just like, put a smudge of some sort over the 'F' on mine? like, i dunno a chocolate stain or coffee? people would just think I had a dirty wallet, and it would be rude for them to scratch it off, or to ask my gender..

name isnt a problem, its changed

i've heard that one cannot get the gender marker signed until some sort of lower surgeryor gonad removal is done.. so that seems to be out of the option.. what if i just.. scratched my id in that area.. oops?

smudge it/scratch it. no one's gonna care. if you're not telling anyone you did it on intention, it's not illegal :)
but seriously, people don't ever look at the gender marker. if you pass, you pass regardless of the "f" on your id. as long as the photo is up to date and your name is....not jennifer....or something. even though it even worked with a very feminine name for me, but i understand your fears..

as far as i know a letter from a therapist is all that's required for the change in many countries now, so it helps to get informed as well.

The HBIGDA/WPATH members all agree to provide carry letters to facilitate transitioners.
Go ask your shrink if he/she is a member of these groups and if so ask them to provide a carry letter.

Quote from: Tad on August 03, 2010, 01:30:29 AM
i've heard that one cannot get the gender marker signed until some sort of lower surgeryor gonad removal is done..

It depends upon where you live.  In Cali, I've heard it's really easy to change the gender marker.  Where I live, in WI, they require "the surgery". Which surgery isn't specified, so generally chest surgery suffices.

Fortunately, the State department recently changed their policy to requiring a doctor's letter saying that you are receiving "appropriate medical treatment" in order to get the marker changed on your passport, so if you are on hormones, you should be able to get a passport with the correct gender marker, which you can use for everything you need an ID for, except traffic violations.  The bad news is, passports cost $135 these days, take a couple months to get, and don't fit in your wallet. 

Edit: Now that I'm looking at the passport page, I see there are drivers license-sized passports good only for crossing the border into Canada, Mexico, Bermuda, or the Caribbean via land or sea (not by air) which can be had for $55.  Hmmm.  I think I may apply for one of those.

Quote from: s1ncere on August 03, 2010, 12:38:31 AM
I live in cali..n I have my gender marker changed to M on my drivers license.I just provided the proper paper work with my therapist signature.

btw, i am pre-op (but i've been on T going on 5 months)....I got my "gender marker" changed on my drivers license pre-T. its not federal (e.g cant change my gender marker on my social security till i do top or bottom surgery) but its better than nothing..the state of CA still "recognizes" me as male.

Quote from: emil on August 03, 2010, 02:12:09 AM

but seriously, people don't ever look at the gender marker. if you pass, you pass regardless of the "f" on your id. as long as the photo is up to date and your name is....not jennifer....or something. even though it even worked with a very feminine name for me, but i understand your fears..

lol I just recently passed at a hotel who required a copy of my ID because I'm under 21. My ID still says female and my old name (cassandra, which is pretty damn feminine) and the lady was actually talking to me about my last name and how we are somehow related looking at my ID a lot, and kept referring to me as he the whole time. haha I don't know how I pulled that one off.

Quote from: Carson on August 03, 2010, 09:27:01 AM
lol I just recently passed at a hotel who required a copy of my ID because I'm under 21. My ID still says female and my old name (cassandra, which is pretty damn feminine) and the lady was actually talking to me about my last name and how we are somehow related looking at my ID a lot, and kept referring to me as he the whole time. haha I don't know how I pulled that one off.

it's cos you travel with a pretty kitty.

Quote from: Jamie-o on August 03, 2010, 07:13:09 AM
It depends upon where you live.  In Cali, I've heard it's really easy to change the gender marker. Where I live, in WI, they require "the surgery". Which surgery isn't specified, so generally chest surgery suffices.

Fortunately, the State department recently changed their policy to requiring a doctor's letter saying that you are receiving "appropriate medical treatment" in order to get the marker changed on your passport, so if you are on hormones, you should be able to get a passport with the correct gender marker, which you can use for everything you need an ID for, except traffic violations.  The bad news is, passports cost $135 these days, take a couple months to get, and don't fit in your wallet. 

Edit: Now that I'm looking at the passport page, I see there are drivers license-sized passports good only for crossing the border into Canada, Mexico, Bermuda, or the Caribbean via land or sea (not by air) which can be had for $55.  Hmmm.  I think I may apply for one of those.

I live in WI and the only thing you need to change your state ID or DL is a letter saying you are in a gender reorientation program, also known as a carry letter.

Quote from: emil on August 03, 2010, 02:12:09 AM
but seriously, people don't ever look at the gender marker.

Well, sometimes they do. There's one liquor store I'll never go back to--even though my docs are up to date now--because they kept staring at my driver's license and giving me a look like I was some squirming thing underneath a rock.

I have a real male license now despite being pre t and op, and it did cause a problem. I was changed to male on my school record, but someone who wasn't told about this saw the f on my license and changed me back to Ms Kyle. The lady who changed me back to male was annoyed when she found this out and changed me back to Mr Kyle. If you are not eligible to get your license changed it would be best to get a fake id. People can and will use that f against you. It gives them the power to deny your identity. Some people won't care, but I'd rather not take a chance.

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Post Merge: August 03, 2010, 10:31:47 PM

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Well actually...no. Get a carry letter :P

Quote from: LordKAT on August 03, 2010, 12:45:17 PM
I live in WI and the only thing you need to change your state ID or DL is a letter saying you are in a gender reorientation program, also known as a carry letter.

Really?  The people at the DMV (or whatever it's called in this state) said I couldn't change it without surgery.  >:(  Hmmm.  I'm going to have to look into this further.

Edit:  I've scoured the WIDOT website, and I can't find their official stance on changing your gender on your DL.  Do you by any chance have a link, or can you tell me where you found the info?  Thanks.

I found the info at a number of places including  the local DMV, my therapist, and a familiar website which deals with the issue. I will find it and link it. I got mine changed without a letter BTW.

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Post Merge: August 07, 2010, 01:58:47 PM

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Wisconsin: DOT- DIS division allows gender change on drivers license prior to surgery if such person is enrolled in a transgender program leading to SRS. Wisconsin does link their driver record with the SSA, but this should not be a problem as long as the SSN, Name, Address, Age, etc. is all correct.

     http://www.tsroadmap.com/reality/drivers-license.html (http://www.tsroadmap.com/reality/drivers-license.html)
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Wisconsin

Need: Therapist or doctors letter verifying living as male full-time and undergoing treatment. Est. Fee: Unknown

     http://www.thetransitionalmale.com/dlchange#57 (http://www.thetransitionalmale.com/dlchange#57)
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If you have questions (si tiene preguntas):

    * E-mail: driverrecords.dmv@dot.state.wi.us
    * Call: (608) 266-2353
http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/drivers/drivers/apply/getlic.htm (http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/drivers/drivers/apply/getlic.htm)

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I had a few problems with people questioning my id because the picture didn't look like me anymore. I got a new id with an updated photo, and no problems.  See if you can get a new picture on yours, so even though it still says F, at least it looks like you.

Letter from WI DMV

QuoteHello,
Thank you for contacting WisDOT for information on how gender discrepancies between the driver record and the Social Security
Administration (SSA) record will be handled with the implementation of  SSOLV.

The SSA record match compares the name, date of birth, social security number and gender, with the driver license record and identifies any  driver with a record that does not match the SSA name, date of birth, social security number and gender exactly. Only about 2% of the WisDOT records have any type of discrepancy as a result of the match with SSA records.

Wisconsin has always required an affidavit or statement that the driver is enrolled in a program leading to gender change, or has completed the surgery prior to changing the gender designation on the driver license.  The statement must be from a medical doctor or director of a facility specializing in gender change. This requirement is not new and will not change with the implementation of the Social Security Online Verification system (SSOLV). Drivers who provide appropriate physician documentation will be allowed to change the gender designation on their driver license one time. This will allow the driver time to complete the procedure and obtain a new Social Security Card. The WisDOT record will be notated and no future driver license will be issued until the SSA record is updated to reflect the new gender designation.

Wisconsin has never allowed a person to change his/her gender designation on the driver license until the applicant is enrolled in a gender change program or has completed the gender change surgery. All drivers must designate their physical birth gender on the application, to obtain a driver license.  The gender designation can be changed only if the driver provides physician documentation that he/she is enrolled in a gender change program or has completed the surgery.

The driver license must designate the physical gender of the driver, while the photo may reflect the appearance of a different gender. Although it may be inconvenient for a driver, if the physical gender and photo on the driver license do not match, it does not impact the driver's ability to obtain a driver license or to use that driver license for identification purposes.

Implementation of SSOLV did result in WisDOT changing its name change policy. Effective July 5, 2005, documentation (such as court order, marriage certificate, divorce decree, etc.) will be required to change the name on the driver license. When there is a name change, drivers need to:
1)  take the appropriate documents to the SSA to record the new name and
2) bring appropriate documentation of the name change and new social security card to DMV for a driver license in the new name. For more information regarding SSA acceptable proof of identify documents or SSA locations see the SSA web site at:  www.social (http://www.social) security.gov. The SSA name change form can be obtained at http://social (http://social) security.gov/online/ss-5.html.  Complete information on WisDOT acceptable proof of name change and date of birth documents can be obtained at:
http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/drivers/drivers/apply/doc/proof-dob.htm. (http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/drivers/drivers/apply/doc/proof-dob.htm.)

Although SSOLV and the new name change policy will result in some inconvenience for Wisconsin applicants, it will result in a safer
environment and help prevent identify theft.

Feel free to contact me if you have additional questions.

Sincerely,   Karen Schwartz, Chief   Qualifications and Issuance Section

Note the part in bold, letter confirming enrollment in gender reorientation program.

from: http://www.intersexualite.org/BirthRecord.html (http://www.intersexualite.org/BirthRecord.html)

Thanks for the info, LordKat.  I notice they say that no new DL will be issued until the SSA has its records changed.  I wonder what they would do if the DL expired before one was able to save up for surgery.  I'll have to email them and ask.

Quote from: kyle_lawrence on August 07, 2010, 02:36:15 PM
I had a few problems with people questioning my id because the picture didn't look like me anymore. I got a new id with an updated photo, and no problems.  See if you can get a new picture on yours, so even though it still says F, at least it looks like you.

I was about to say the same thing .... just go get a replacement of your ID with a new picture on it. It should suffice.