Susan's Place Transgender Resources

I am starting to wonder if my plans for transition are being made for the wrong reasons. This doesn't even make sense to me but I wanted to try and write out my thoughts so bare with me :D

I only want to change my body to fit in more with cultural perceptions. I hate being perceived as a girl, but my actual body doesn't bother me all that much. When I think about it, going through drastic hormone treatment and surgery just so I confuse other people less seems a ridiculous thing to do, shouldn't I be doing it for me?

I think I might be genderqueer rather than FTM and the only reason I'd prefer a male body is because it's easier to appear like a "gender bender" from that direction. When I dress in mens clothes, people don't bat an eyelid, it's normal for girls to do that. If I dress in what I actually want to dress in, I don't look queer at all....just like a girl....which I am not.

Female pronouns and such make me cringe and I'm much more comfortable when I'm being referred to as a boy....kinda, I'd prefer it was just neutral, but I'm not sure if this is just because I feel sorta silly being he'd when I'm all womanly.

If I was male bodied, I know I'd act much more girly than I do now, do I just have to insist on going against the grain? Is this a real feeling or am I just going to the extremes of teen rebellion....despite being 21.

Basically I'm confused and don't know what to do, this must sound familiar to some people in here and I just wanted some words of advice and/or comfort :D

You are what you say you are.  It maybe because of the baby that you are confused, maybe not.

Have you talked with your therapist.

Regard less of what you call your self, you are still part of our very large family.


Huggles

aye I did wonder if my hormones being all crazy was warping my perceptions. I don't have a therapist, I've never managed to get referred to anyone.

It's definitely something you should think about.  I had a lot of those same thoughts and realized that I didn't actually want any sort of transition.  The best thing to do is to imagine yourself in every possible state of transition (including not transitioning) and just examine your emotions for each one.  You really have to figure out what it is that you truly want and that can be hard. 

I don't dislike my body at all and that was really what made me realize that I didn't desire transition at all.  I just decided to be comfortable with who and what I am and I am a lot happier now than I was then.  It comes down to what is going to make you the happiest, what's going to bring you the most joy.  Good luck!

I obviously don't have any specific answers for you, but... I can say that I feel almost the exact same way?

And I don't really know what to make of it, either, honestly. Lately I've been feeling pretty apathetic about the whole explaining-my-gender thing. I'm pretty sick of trying to find words for it that I'm pretty sure don't even exist. More and more, I've been leaving it at, "My name is Diane, my pronoun is he, and that's all there is to say on the matter." Whether they see me as a guy or as androgynous is their business, as long as they don't call me a girl. And, much to my relieved astonishment, most people DO seem to use the correct pronouns for me, despite my relatively blatent gender blending.

I've run into a lot of the same issues with wearing feminine clothes as a female-bodied person. I just look/sound like a girl. The closest I've come to a solution to that is to save my more "feminine" outfits for occassions when I'm with people who I know already pretty solidly view me as not-a-girl and are willing and able to view my attire as a form of gender-blending. When I'm meeting new people, I always make a point of making it clear that I'm not a girl (with clothes/binding and occassionally with sneakily constructed comments that indirectly imply that I'm a guy).

...of course, I always have my ever-present earrings and lavender glasses frames (not to mention the soprano voice and tiny body build), so even in what almost seems like "full guy mode," I'm not without a bit of gender blending. I just kind of let my gender speak for itself. Saves me the trouble of doing the explaining (unless people ask, at which point I'm happy to answer more specific questions).

I don't know hwo any of this is going to pan out when it comes to my professional life in the future (because I'm in college to become a middle school teacher-- need I say more), but I guess I'll figure that out as I go. Same for physically transitioning-- lately I've been finding myself less and less worried about that. For now, I'm pretty okay with just going with the flow as long as people use the right pronouns for me.

It could be you're genderqueer (in that case I welcome you to the party ;D ).

I really don't have any advice for you, but I often feel the same way--though I'm going to partially transition because I *have* to be more androgynous looking or I might explode.

I strongly suggest you iron all this out with a therapist way before you start hormones, because T causes permanent changes pretty fast.
Here's a suggestion: look at pictures of men, women, and people who present in-between online, and see which images really resonate with you as to what you want to look like and be perceived like.
As for me:
ATM, this is brand-new, and all I know is, I want more muscles and the layered haircut has to go...if the long hair comes back at all it will be all one length, possibly shaved at the nape for easy ponytailing.
I think if I get in the kind of shape I dream of getting into, and am slowly working towards, I will look quite A/G. 
Competition-level athletes often do.
I've thought about taking T because I'd like to look a little more masculine than I already do-but I'd go BALD! EEEK!
And I'm vain about having thick hair, whether short or long, so I'll just have to get any muscles through my workouts.

Doubt I'm a guy, pretty sure I'm not a woman either...This fence rail hurts my butt.

If people would just accept that I was a guy then I wouldn't care about my body I don't think. If people looked at me and thought "oh that boy looks like a girl, weird" rather than "that girl looks like....well a girl" I'd be perfectly satisfied. My dysphoria about my breasts and curves is more just an annoyance because they hinder my passing.

It's just odd because I was about to start T just before I found out I was pregnant and it was like "thundercats are go!" without any second thought.

I can't see myself regretting any of the changes I would get from T, I'd welcome them. Then once they took affect, I'd go ahead and gender-bend to the point people would probably think I was MTF if they saw me in the street. So I'd be FTMTA? Confusing  :P

I think the main thing I worry about is people just not getting me and what I'm doing, not so much strangers but people who already know me. Anything fem I do/wear/say has family exclaiming "OH YOU'RE A GIRL AGAIN NOW? YAY!" and that grinds my gears, so I act and dress hyper-masculine to overcompensate for my girly body.

You know, to really make yourself happy you have to just stop caring how others perceive you. In the big picture, it doesn't matter. What does matter is finding a way to live with yourself and be somewhat content. It is like, free your mind and just say ,not allowed><not allowed> it, this is me, deal.

Quote from: Jeatyn on October 17, 2010, 10:05:56 AM
I hate being perceived as a girl, but my actual body doesn't bother me all that much. . . Female pronouns and such make me cringe and I'm much more comfortable when I'm being referred to as a boy....kinda, I'd prefer it was just neutral. . .

Quote from: Jeatyn on October 18, 2010, 04:11:21 AM
If people would just accept that I was a guy then I wouldn't care about my body I don't think. . . Anything fem I do/wear/say has family exclaiming "OH YOU'RE A GIRL AGAIN NOW? YAY!" and that grinds my gears, so I act and dress hyper-masculine to overcompensate for my girly body.

I really identify with what you said, especially the stuff in quotes here.  I can't handle being seen as a woman, but I don't necessarily feel like a man.  Even though I know that what other people think shouldn't bother me, it drives me nuts to be treated like a girl, and apparently it's not normal for girls to feel like that.  As much as I enjoy being read as male, I don't think I need it enough to risk surgery, and I don't think the root of my dysphoria is very "trans" in that I don't want male body parts as much as I want non-female body parts.  I do, however, feel like a limited course of testosterone would improve my dysphoria in the sense that people would  probably not identify me as female so consistently, so I'm considering pursuing hormones in the near future.  In the meantime, I'm also overcompensating by wearing masculine clothing all the time.  I think if people would stop reading me as female so much, I'd be comfortable sporting a little femininity (hair tied up, tight shirts, ummm, not sure there are any other girly fashions I like), maybe up to a quarter of the time. 

Quote from: Jeatyn on October 18, 2010, 04:11:21 AM
I can't see myself regretting any of the changes I would get from T, I'd welcome them. Then once they took affect, I'd go ahead and gender-bend to the point people would probably think I was MTF if they saw me in the street. So I'd be FTMTA? Confusing  :P

I think the main thing I worry about is people just not getting me and what I'm doing, not so much strangers but people who already know me. Anything fem I do/wear/say has family exclaiming "OH YOU'RE A GIRL AGAIN NOW? YAY!" and that grinds my gears, so I act and dress hyper-masculine to overcompensate for my girly body.

Jeatyn  - first of all, wecome to the land of unicorns, bacon, and fruitcake  :laugh:

If you think that you may be genderqueer - then you are. If you later decide to go a different way, thats fine too. We're not too big on labels around here.

AND, just because you might choose to take some T - that doesn't immediately force you to choose one side or the other. I suspect that there are more than a few of us that have taken hormones to effect changes that are more in line with the way we feel about ourselves.

Quote from: riven1 on October 19, 2010, 01:10:24 PM
Jeatyn  - first of all, wecome to the land of unicorns, bacon, and fruitcake  :laugh:

Bacon....fruitcake.....now I gotta go back and read that one again. A favorite. Thanks riven1!  :laugh:

Jeatyn... nothing suspect at all about trying HRT, even in a 'limited' fashion. Most of what you are asking and saying rings very true to me. Sounds like you're on track, gaining knowledge by asking and getting answers goes a long way in lessening confusion.

I found that my "girl mode" was at its peak while I was pregnant.

Before being pregnant I was pretty dysphoric.  But when I got pregnant it kind of... went away a bit.  Well, I wouldn't say that it went away, it was just not a priority anymore.  I actually enjoyed being pregnant and was happy.

After giving birth 11 months ago, it's definitely all back.  So I know that for me it is a hormonal thing.  I expect that once I'm on T I'll be more comfortable with the feminine side of me again.

There are plenty of times for even non-transitioning people when they doubt themselves heavily and do not know what they want. We're our biggest critics, after all.

Look at it from every perspective. If you hate being seen as a girl, then you must certainly change that. However, if you hate the fact you act girly when seen as a guy, you cannot change that very much. You'll have to learn to accept the unchangeable and change the unacceptable.

I may not be in your boat but I will share my intentions. Perhaps you'll find some use from it. I'm a genetic male that hates every single thing that T does to me, both mentally and physically. I don't act like much of a guy, I don't talk like ..so on and on. However, I am not making the final step to female either (of course I suppose the option will be there if I choose to take it later).  I wish to just be mentally free from T and am willing to accept the physical consequences. If people see me as a woman, I will accept it. If they still see me as a guy, I will accept that as well. It's about my sanity, and how the world views me does not matter.

Consider which step will help you to retain your sanity as well.

Quote from: Jeatyn on October 17, 2010, 10:05:56 AM
When I dress in mens clothes, people don't bat an eyelid, it's normal for girls to do that. If I dress in what I actually want to dress in, I don't look queer at all....just like a girl....which I am not.

Female pronouns and such make me cringe and I'm much more comfortable when I'm being referred to as a boy....kinda, I'd prefer it was just neutral, but I'm not sure if this is just because I feel sorta silly being he'd when I'm all womanly.

If I was male bodied, I know I'd act much more girly than I do now, do I just have to insist on going against the grain? Is this a real feeling or am I just going to the extremes of teen rebellion....despite being 21.

A lot of your situation and thoughts are quite similar to mine (including being 21), so I thought I'd just come by and talk about myself and hope it comforts you somehow :P

I'm female-assigned and mostly view myself as a pretty boy; I feel like a boy, relate to boys, often act like a boy, but I don't want to look manly, I'd rather look like a flamboyant femme queer thing.  I want to be able to keep my long hair and wear jewelry, but presenting in that fashion makes me seem like a girly girl.  I am quite certain I don't want to conform to either of the sets of gender stereotypes out there, but I also want to be able to express who I am.

In principle, I don't mind random people on the street thinking that I am like all the other girls.  I am mostly concerned about my family, who take a femme appearance as evidence that I am happy to be a girl and do not want to transition.  I guess I differ from you in that transition is definitely in my plans - my "female" sex markers don't belong there and are very distressing to me.  I feel trapped in that the only way I see to escape from the body-hell is to look and act hyper-masculine so I'll qualify as ready for surgery.  My therapist encourages me to "just be myself" and present however I want to, but that seems to take me a step backward as far as acceptance from family and friends.  

I really wish I had been male-assigned, so that I could be free of the female hormones that are messing me up, have sex as a boy, get my parents to recognize me as a boy, and dress as I want to dress without appearing to conform to gender norms.  Cross-dressing would be a favorite thing for me if that could be the name for dressing femme.  I'd probably go for some of the non-hormonal/non-surgical elements of MtF gender expression, like facial hair removal and voice training.  I see my ideal in pictures of anime boys, cross dressing boys, prepubescent kids, and David Bowie style androgyny.  

I'm at a loss trying to explain to gender newbies that I feel like a boy, I am a boy, I want to be a boy, but I also want to look like a girl.  I'm unsure whether taking T would help me at all, or simply add on masculine markers that I will then want to erase.  I've been calling myself neutrois to try and express a desire to have my female sex markers removed without adding male sex markers, but... it just doesn't seem quite right, because I don't want to express no gender; I want to be male and express femme.  

It seems stupid that I'm considering going through massive hormonal and surgical changes just to end up with an appearance fairly similar to what I have now through binding and packing, but I know I'm going to have to do something because my body is all wrong.  I think (albeit totally subjectively) that estrogen is wrong for me and it's wreaking havoc on my emotional state and self-concept.  For me personally, that body-focused dysphoria is the main driving force behind my desire to transition.  

I don't know quite what to advise you since we're different in that regard, but I'll take a shot at it anyway.  You'll find no end of people who tell you that hormones and surgery are for "becoming a man/woman," but they're not really "FOR" anything.  They're just the tools we have to manipulate physical gender traits.  Don't let anyone tell you that you're considering transition for the wrong reasons; I don't think you should have to qualify for transition by checking off certain signs and symptoms.  Unfortunately I haven't found any medical providers who agree with me.  They mostly seem to subscribe wholeheartedly to the gender binary as society sees it.

Thanks guys, reading about other people in the same boat makes me feel less insane :P

That's interesting to read SnailPace and definitely something I will keep in mind. I have hated being pregnant though, not so much now but around the half way mark when my hormones were raging I felt like my head was going to implode. I do feel much more at ease with my body as a whole lately though and I can't figure out why that is. Hormones are a crazy thing.

At the moment all I know is....I'm DEFINITELY not a girl. How far to the other side I'll be going I'm not sure, I do have to do something though.

Quote from: SnailPace on October 20, 2010, 03:37:59 AM
I found that my "girl mode" was at its peak while I was pregnant.

Before being pregnant I was pretty dysphoric.  But when I got pregnant it kind of... went away a bit.  Well, I wouldn't say that it went away, it was just not a priority anymore.  I actually enjoyed being pregnant and was happy.

After giving birth 11 months ago, it's definitely all back.  So I know that for me it is a hormonal thing.  I expect that once I'm on T I'll be more comfortable with the feminine side of me again.

That's interesting. So, the flux of hormones during pregnancy lessened dysphoria? Or just made you feel more girly (understandably)? I assume it's just estrogen that gets a surge during pregnancy?
Congrats on your new addition! Boy or girl (far as we can see yet)? :)

Quote from: Nero on October 20, 2010, 02:17:36 PM
That's interesting. So, the flux of hormones during pregnancy lessened dysphoria? Or just made you feel more girly (understandably)? I assume it's just estrogen that gets a surge during pregnancy?
Congrats on your new addition! Boy or girl (far as we can see yet)? :)

Yeah, it did lessen dysphoria.

When you're pregnant; estrogen, pregesterone, and a crazy hormone called human chorionic gonadotropin (HCG) all steadily rise.  HCG is often just called "The pregnancy hormone" because that is the only time it is present. 

In high school I went on hormonal birth control and that definitely did NOT help.  In fact, it made me a crazy lunatic!  Therefore, I'm assuming the presence of this mysterious HCG hormone is what helped me out a bit.  But who knows? I'm no doctor.

Also, I put a picture of him in my display so you can see him, Nero.  He's looking like a boy so far :P

Quote from: SnailPace on October 20, 2010, 03:16:27 PM
Yeah, it did lessen dysphoria.

When you're pregnant; estrogen, pregesterone, and a crazy hormone called human chorionic gonadotropin (HCG) all steadily rise.  HCG is often just called "The pregnancy hormone" because that is the only time it is present. 

In high school I went on hormonal birth control and that definitely did NOT help.  In fact, it made me a crazy lunatic!  Therefore, I'm assuming the presence of this mysterious HCG hormone is what helped me out a bit.  But who knows? I'm no doctor.

Also, I put a picture of him in my display so you can see him, Nero.  He's looking like a boy so far :P

Aww sweet! Good looking guy.  :laugh:

Way Cute Kid!

working out where you fit is the hardest part of being different.  I tried fitting in for a long time when I started to see that I wasn't being true to who I am because I was following the rules of what it is to be "normal".  I've pushed aside the things I'd try to do to be "normal" and just try to stay true to who I am.  I knew what I wanted to look like ever since I saw someone on a late night TV Comedy/variety show I see myself strongly as both male & Female at the same time. So that is how I present (as a bearded lady) you need to choose how you want to be seen (Male, female,both, neither or somewhere in between), is fitting in important how do you feel about being seen as any of the other posibilities.  Once you know where you want to be you may be able to work out what how transitioning to being true to yourself.  You are welcome among us androgynes and other gender diverse folk.  If you think you are then you are even if that changes later.

Good luck on working out where you fit

I admire people like you kinkly. I would LOVE to walk around in a dress with a beard but I'm not sure I have the metaphorical balls.

Quote from: shiinee on October 20, 2010, 10:25:20 AM
A lot of your situation and thoughts are quite similar to mine (including being 21), so I thought I'd just come by and talk about myself and hope it comforts you somehow :P

I'm female-assigned and mostly view myself as a pretty boy; I feel like a boy, relate to boys, often act like a boy, but I don't want to look manly, I'd rather look like a flamboyant femme queer thing.  I want to be able to keep my long hair and wear jewelry, but presenting in that fashion makes me seem like a girly girl.  I am quite certain I don't want to conform to either of the sets of gender stereotypes out there, but I also want to be able to express who I am.

In principle, I don't mind random people on the street thinking that I am like all the other girls.  I am mostly concerned about my family, who take a femme appearance as evidence that I am happy to be a girl and do not want to transition.  I guess I differ from you in that transition is definitely in my plans - my "female" sex markers don't belong there and are very distressing to me.  I feel trapped in that the only way I see to escape from the body-hell is to look and act hyper-masculine so I'll qualify as ready for surgery.  My therapist encourages me to "just be myself" and present however I want to, but that seems to take me a step backward as far as acceptance from family and friends. 

I really wish I had been male-assigned, so that I could be free of the female hormones that are messing me up, have sex as a boy, get my parents to recognize me as a boy, and dress as I want to dress without appearing to conform to gender norms.  Cross-dressing would be a favorite thing for me if that could be the name for dressing femme.  I'd probably go for some of the non-hormonal/non-surgical elements of MtF gender expression, like facial hair removal and voice training.  I see my ideal in pictures of anime boys, cross dressing boys, prepubescent kids, and David Bowie style androgyny. 

I'm at a loss trying to explain to gender newbies that I feel like a boy, I am a boy, I want to be a boy, but I also want to look like a girl.  I'm unsure whether taking T would help me at all, or simply add on masculine markers that I will then want to erase.  I've been calling myself neutrois to try and express a desire to have my female sex markers removed without adding male sex markers, but... it just doesn't seem quite right, because I don't want to express no gender; I want to be male and express femme. 

It seems stupid that I'm considering going through massive hormonal and surgical changes just to end up with an appearance fairly similar to what I have now through binding and packing, but I know I'm going to have to do something because my body is all wrong.  I think (albeit totally subjectively) that estrogen is wrong for me and it's wreaking havoc on my emotional state and self-concept.  For me personally, that body-focused dysphoria is the main driving force behind my desire to transition. 

I don't know quite what to advise you since we're different in that regard, but I'll take a shot at it anyway.  You'll find no end of people who tell you that hormones and surgery are for "becoming a man/woman," but they're not really "FOR" anything.  They're just the tools we have to manipulate physical gender traits.  Don't let anyone tell you that you're considering transition for the wrong reasons; I don't think you should have to qualify for transition by checking off certain signs and symptoms.  Unfortunately I haven't found any medical providers who agree with me.  They mostly seem to subscribe wholeheartedly to the gender binary as society sees it.

I really identify with what you say, shiinee. I feel like I should have been a cross dressing, camp, boy. I was born female and I really enjoy dressing high femme to go out, false eyelashes and the highest of heels, but every day I wear men's clothes and no make-up. Though I just grew my hair to counterpoint it. If I didn't have long hair, I probably would wear make up. I don't want to pass as male. But I would really like male genitalia. I just always imagined that. But I don't really want facial hair or any other signifiers of masculinity.

Jeatyn, I know how you feel.  Honestly, before hanging out here, I didn't know that there was such a wide spectrum.  I understood about intersex and transgendered people, but I had always thought that emotionally, people were either female or male and have felt out of place for it.  I hope that you can identify how you feel and build up the metaphorical balls to work with it.

I think I know how you feel...I think that, more than anything, you're struggling against the narrowness of society's perceptions, which I think is a good thing to do. Questioning the status quo generally brings about positive change, at least the way you're doing it. :]

Yeah, I definitely know what you mean. I think that it might be easier to accept male pronouns because they are just marginally broader than female pronouns (i.e. we tend to refer to things/people/etc. we're unsure of the gender of by male rather than female) and male pronouns do not have the double standard that female ones have attached to them. That's part of the reason, I try to avoid them, anyway.

You seem like a peace seeker to me, and if that means defying gender then that is perfectly alright. Once you think about it, both "standard" genders have heavy connotations attached to them, and if you don't identify with either of them, that's not surprising. Actually, I would have to commend you for being yourself rather than buckling under the weight of society as so many, trans or not, have.

Sorry, this is really broad, and I just hope it helps you. :]