Susan's Place Transgender Resources

Over the last year or so we have developed a fine tradition of posting good luck threads for people soon to go in for their surgery. This is obviously a very kindly gesture and a sign of the real concern that we all hold for each other.

However without wanting to criticise anyone can I make a gentle plea for people to be sensitive to the many here who have found themselves stuck and unable to progress to SRS due to circumstances or lack of funding.

Offering our support and good wishes to those approaching a major life changing event is highly to be commended. However we need to be careful that in our enthusiastic support for them we do not inadvertently end up rubbing the noses of those less fortunate in their situation.

It would be terrible if someone committed suicide because of depression brought on by a rather vocal reminder of the blessing that others are soon to receive and that they fear that they may never reach.

I do not want anyone to feel that this is specifically targeted at them. It is not.

However I feel the need to now post some official guidance on SRS good luck threads:

• Please do feel free to post good luck threads, but please keep the tone moderate and sensitive.
• Specifically please be respectful in your tone.
• This is important medical treatment. It is NOT a carnival.
• Encouragement is good. Over excitement is not.

I will emphasis again that this MUST NOT be seen as a criticism of anyone who has posted anything up until now. Anything which has already been posted was, I am sure, done with the best of intentions. I am merely concerned that we avoid any future hurt.

Thank you in advance for your understanding and future cooperation.

Thank you Jenny for this reminder.

Along with others I have wished many, taking their next steps, part time, full time, acceptance by others and going into surgery, best wishes. Today, I and others have sent our wished to our own Jerica.

Many, for a variety of reasons, cannot take the first step, let alone others. Many are in difficult situations.

What makes me feel so comfortable with Susans' is the unconditional support and love that we share. Sharing through common experiences.

I hope we can all continue to express our joy to those who have managed to take another step and our unconditional support and compassion for those that, for any reasons, are having problems.

And I can never tire of saying how grateful I am for Susans' and each of the amazing individuals here who have given me so much support.

Dear All,

May be allowed to back this.

In the days of internet we can quickly send good and happy messages to each other. Which is totally lovely. I for whatever reasons  have to live my life  in stealth pretending to be male. We have many members in the same, and opposite  situations.  It may be OK for you to take the next step. But sometimes it destroys someone else's dreams. 


We at Susie's are a really nice community, let us remember and be thinking of those who, like me, don't have the opportunities
of others. Best Goddess wishes to those who can, Best Goddess wishes to those who cannot, Just wish I was  Goddess and solved all the crap.  Did I use the c word>\? No way.


Hugs and time for bed.

Steven my pillow better be horny tonight


Cindy

It may be OK for you to take the next step. But sometimes it destroys someone else's dreams. 

What?  Is there some zero-sum number of SRS/GRS available?  One person taking the next step (that is right for them) NEVER stops anyone else from taking the steps that are right for them.


The difference between dreams and reality is that one side often does nothing but dream, while the other group works.

Each of us has specific triggers for our dysphoria be in the lack of ability to get SRS, the lack of ability to pass, the lack of youth, etc.  I have my own triggers, for instance, sometimes (and it used to be all the time) it was difficult for me to read about a MTF who is married to a man - something I so dearly wished for and still feel strongly about today. 

In those periods of sensitivity I make it a point NOT to read threads that might trigger my dysphoria.  Granted there are fewer threads related to my trigger than to someone having SRS, often mine often pops up unintentionally in a thread I am reading as someone casually mentions about their marriage.

It is important to know what sets us off, and if we are unable to control the result, we must avoid the stimulus until we have learned to control our reaction to it.  If I am not able to do that and steps are taken to protect me, I create an environment either intentionally or unintentionally that provokes others to not say what they really feel, to be inauthentic, or to cause then to feel they need to walk on egg shells.  My problems, my triggers, are not theirs, and I feel no need for anyone to censor themselves on my behalf - I may just choose not to read your thread if I'm already feeling down.

In fine, I believe people should not rub their successes in the faces of others, but censoring one's successes can only do disservice to this amazing forum.  There are plenty of other forums that are MUCH more highly moderated where people like me cannot even speak - I don't want to see this forum into that one.

QuoteHowever without wanting to criticise anyone can I make a gentle plea for people to be sensitive to the many here who have found themselves stuck and unable to progress to SRS due to circumstances or lack of funding.

*Raises hand*

I'm a classic example. Speaking for myself only, i DO find it depressing that i'm not able to advance as i'd like due mostly to money, and I do find that heartstring plucked by my awareness that someone else is having, has had, or soon plans their surgery (graduation, as it were)

but i cannot say I've ever been further depressed by the chorus of happiness for the lucky girl. Id be just as moddoy, or not, today because Jerica graduated whether or not she was getting the good wishes.

Again, i agree with your cautions and think they are wise - i speak only for myself here.

Quote from: tekla on March 15, 2011, 04:10:50 PM
It may be OK for you to take the next step. But sometimes it destroys someone else's dreams. 

What?  Is there some zero-sum number of SRS/GRS available?  One person taking the next step (that is right for them) NEVER stops anyone else from taking the steps that are right for them.


The difference between dreams and reality is that one side often does nothing but dream, while the other group works.

Maybe off base but i took Cindy's comment to mean that it would negatively impact someone in her own life, not some other trans person somewhere else.

Quote from: Tammy Hope on March 16, 2011, 02:55:24 AM
Maybe off base but i took Cindy's comment to mean that it would negatively impact someone in her own life, not some other trans person somewhere else.

I wasn't going to reply but I will now. I think people on the journey need the encouragement and the good news stories and our frinds undergoing procedures deserve our love and support during a very difficult time.  We also don't want to 'rub people's noses' into something that they may not be able to attain. But I have to admit I have never seen any sign of that, and I'm pretty certain Mods would be over that like a rash.

A number of us have to make the difficult choice, and there is no right or wrong choice, of how our decisions affect others. Many of my close friends have lost family at all levels because of the decisions they have made.  There is nothing in the slightest bit wrong with those decisions, but there are also others who cannot face that. They remain with partners, family, community because they cannot bring themselves to hurt them. There is nothing wrong in that.  But my thoughts were we have to be very sensitive to peoples feelings in this area.  Because Person A makes a decision it should not be lauded as the 'correct' one, because Person B makes the opposite.

I suppose as ever I try to walk the middle ground; I cry for everyone.

Cindy

Someone will always be offended, triggered, hurt, nonplussed no matter what is said, or not said.

Quote from: mija on March 16, 2011, 03:41:34 AM
Someone will always be offended, triggered, hurt, nonplussed no matter what is said, or not said.

The ability to communicate is  to pass your thoughts in a clear and cognitive manner to others. If you can achieve that, and few can, then people should not be offended. It is after all passing information to be processed, understood or rejected. There is nothing offensive in passing on the information, it is how that information is delivered that affects people.

Cindy 

Quote from: mija on March 16, 2011, 03:41:34 AM
Someone will always be offended, triggered, hurt, nonplussed no matter what is said, or not said.

Yes, but here, in Susans' I hope we can always provide support.

It is sad when someone is so fragile. But realistically, we each do what we can, because that is all we have.

Personally, I find reading about the successes and accomplishments of people on this forum invigorating.  GRS is forever and a day times two away for me, but to read that other people are getting there serves to remind me that it's there, it's real, it's happening right now, and I can make it if I work hard enough.  It helps me keep my eyes on the goal.  I'm grateful for the opportunity to be consistently reminded that dreams do come true.  Life is so hectic, muddled, and filled with distractions, that I frequently lose sight of the big picture.  I love seeing people reach their goals, and especially when the goal is GRS.  It motivates me to keep my chin up and do my best to follow in their footsteps.  Then again, I've become quite the optimist since I started HRT.  I guess I just don't understand this as a dysphoria trigger.  Doesn't make it any less valid, though.

I felt compelled to ante up my two cents worth of contrasting perspective.  Hope it doesn't ruffle any feathers.

I for one will never stop someone from posting a congratulations thread.

Its an exciting time for the person having surgery.  But, yes it does remind others that for one reason or another they will (most likely) never reach that goal.  Whether it be money issues, family issues, or health issues.

Yes I can get frustrated when they brag that the "State" is paying for it, or their parents are paying for it (just examples).  Face it many of us battle depression and you never know what will set it off in someone.  At the same time we need to be careful not to stifle peoples excitement over reaching their goal.

The congrats I will give to someone who will or just had srs is with the best intentions.
Let's face it, it's a major step in life and the person who is going under the knife is excited.
We can only be happy for them because we have known them for several time and we know how they have lived to that point.
Off course, also in that last stage of treatment we want to support them and than there can be a little bit of excitement.

I am aware of the fact that some of our friends can or will never achieve this stage.
For me, they are not less woman,(or man for the ftm's) the feelings they have are the same as the one who get the srs.
The last thing I want is that people commit suicide because of the awareness that others can make their dreams come true and they can't.

The thing they can do is talk about their disappointment, the only thing we can do is to support them as much as we can.
And we will support you, count on that,talk, you're not alone, you've got friends.

love
annette

I really don't want to be insensitive to any one's feelings because I really struggle with negativity at times, during those times I find it difficult to go to the 'look at me, I pass 100% and I'm young and gorgeous' threads it just reminds me that I have left it too late for those kind of results, so I don't go to them when I feel that way, I'll wait for a time when I feel better about myself and can feel happy for those people,  nobody has ever rubbed my nose in it and at the end of the day the responsibility for my emotional well being rests with me, I have to look after myself.

I think that it would be horrible if there was a feeling of superiority/separation between those who could get srs and those who can't, but I've got to be honest and say that I have never seen it here.

To all those commenting about how valuable the congratulations threads are can I just remind you that I absolutely and emphatically did NOT say that these should cease. It was simply a plea to keep things expressed in a reasonable way - in other words it is the subtle difference between offering "Congratulations and good luck to xxxx"  and embarking on some sort of nose rubbing exercise.

The first is, of course, to be encouraged, the second is where it becomes a little problematic.

Quote from: Virginia Marie on March 18, 2011, 05:25:51 PM
But to be honest I haven't noticed that kind of thing going on... or maybe I was just lucky enough to miss it

That is what I was thinking - I haven't seen that going on which leads me to believe the mods are referring to something else.  The only thing I've seen related to this at all was from a suicide post referring to jealousy due to others getting SRS.  In that thread it didn't seem the person who wrote it was referring to anyone being excessive in their celebration so I really have no idea what this relates to.  If it is indeed just about over celebration, then I suppose this is a preemptive message to attempt to prevent such activity in light of the recent suicide thread.

Well I can tell you that it did certainly happen, but not quite in the way you describe. There was no post-op gloating. There were a couple of threads of congratulations that were way, way over the top. I for one can say that I was put into a deep, deep depression spiral of dysphoria that was a total shocker to me. Until then I had not realized that it was still possible to feel that way and it pushed me to the brink.

Again, as Jenny said, it is more about congratulating in a mindful and respectful manner. I think we all know what achieving that sort of dream can mean for any of us. It is the culmination of a long hard struggle usually on the back of tremendous loss and sorrow and probably worthy of more reflection and solemnity than one would find at Mardi Gras.

On the day before and day after I get to SRS, I know that there will be great joy tempered with great sadness. Happiness and melancholy. My personal losses have been both profound and incalculable and yet I count myself amongst the lucky. Others will have lost much more than I can imagine. Still others will never be able to even get to the operating table. So yes, a little sensitivity and decorum are probably not too much to ask.

I am NOT going to name and shame anyone, because the people concerned, and there was more than one, do not deserve that, but as Melody said there have been some recent incidents. They were certainly not malicious, just slightly ill judged, and that is why the people concerned have not been identified or spoken too directly.

In the wake of the threads concerned I was contacted by several members expressing various shades of disquiet which is why this thread was started to avoid any further issues and avoid embarrassing anyone.

Now please can we all stop digging around this because there are no hidden meanings. It really does mean exactly what it says, but for reasons already stated I am not going to say any more. Thanks.

Thanks ReJennyrated for posting this, it is important to think of others.
I for myself can not transition and I can not even start HRT and it does trigger my dysporia when I see those that can, or if I see some of you girls here that look so good and some that have had the chance to transition at a young age, that just makes me feel so bad because I can't do that or I can't have those results but you know I feel that way when I see real girls or when I think of my child hood and how I missed out on what should have been a great child hood growing up as a little girl.
But it makes me happy too, it makes me happy to see that others are able to do it and I say go for it.
I am able to find things to distract me and it makes me more happy to see you girls and boys happy so lets ALL BE HAPPY.
Aloha.

Jennie

I guess for so long I always saw tons of people online and even right in my own town have surgery and I was always down about it because it just seemed so unreachable for me. I was in debt, moved cities, lost my FT status at a job, had to juggle a new FT job, and still work PT and also worked at home. And I had an insanely large chest to bind and I looked at so many people who just made it seem like it was so easy for them. That happened while my twin sister had a baby and everyone gave her tons of money to buy a house and made her seem like she is the only mature one who needs help and I just needed to grow up and stop creating my own problems for myself. Now since I had surgery I am surrounded by people who I can't run around and shout it out to because I am not out here. People here just think I had some sort of mysterious surgery. That is the only reason I recently shared my story and posted pictures because I know what it is like to feel like it might not happen. And I think it is important for people not to give up hope. If I ever came across as rubbing it in I didn't mean to, since it was posted recently I thought I would say something just in case.

Wise words Jenny, wise words.
Let's be happy and supporting eachother.
I know your feelings honey, I had them too.
I hope your situation will change.

love or aloha
annette

Speaking as one stuck in limbo, neither fish nor fowl as it were, I must at least slightly disagree.

I find a robust dialogue does no one any real harm, and is a good way for someone like myself to clarify my thoughts, and come to firmer, and better grounded resolutions. 

An over degree of sensitivity, at least for me, doesn't help it just reinforces a deeply held belief that I really don't belong anywhere, while criticisms, even though they may result in bruised feelings from time to time,  engender a sense of belonging.

That's my two cents on the subject.

Ok, so let me be the first one to say
CONGRATULATIONS to Myself!   ;D for managing my disphoria for all these years and still being able to find away to be happy! LOL
Seriously though, it can be both very frustrating or exhilarating hearing about other people's transitions. There are somedays when I have to pull my hand away from clicking the mouse to order hormones on-line, but hearing of others who have not transitioned makes me feel more normal. Make sense? Then there are those days when you see someone who has transitioned and its like know a relative who won the lottery.
So CONGRATULATIONS to EVERYONE for getting through another day!

I'm sorry and i apologize to everyone for using the board to vent frustration and mostly lunatic ramblings

I have learned that over time if I let myself become myself I will.    Even if I am blind to it myself.      Over time I have found myself becoming more and more effeminate because that is who I am.     I just have to accept myself and not be afraid to be myself.    I have been visiting Susan's for a very long time and I have seen you'all becoming.   Everyone here is doing an extremely good job of it.    And so am I.   Keep up the good work, and be happy.   Stressing oneself out does not do a body good.   I am the queen of that. 

Thanks for all of your support over the years.   Luv you all.

Firstly Tekla what's with the weird quoting style of italics completely irritating m'kay?

Quote from: tekla on March 15, 2011, 04:10:50 PM
What?  Is there some zero-sum number of SRS/GRS available?  One person taking the next step (that is right for them) NEVER stops anyone else from taking the steps that are right for them.

Now THIS I completely AGREE with, very well said good sir or is it madam, what is it?

Quote from: tekla on March 15, 2011, 04:10:50 PM
The difference between dreams and reality is that one side often does nothing but dream, while the other group works.

You'd close any non-economical courses at a university or make it a non appetizing prospect for the econonically poor to go there, and thus kill the creativity we all NEED for our prosperity.

Simply put bankers are leeches, not the art student.

Art is the only thing with permanence in this world! And why do we call it the Art of writing. Beauty persists throughout the generations, while finance is forever fleeting!

good sir or is it madam, what is it?
You do realize that that's about the most un-enlightenment statement you can make around here don't you? 

But what's best is "Doctor".  That way its not a self-designated (and what are those worth anyway?) statement, but a designation placed upon me by others, which is much more valid in the real world as it more than adequately reflects what 'others see me as' which is of far more value than than any internal dialog offers.  It's also gender-neutral, which makes it even better as it does even less to answer the original question.

Oh yeah, that 'weird style of quoting" is called formal writing, which was far more important for my generation to learn than apparently it was to yours, so we were taught to write like that.  But the main reason is I don't want to attract more attention to the quote (which is merely my starting place) than to the more important stuff, which is what I'm actually writing.  And by important, I mean what I'm writing and thinking, not what you are simply reading.

Art is the only thing with permanence in this world!
I don't think that 'permanence' is necessary to art.  Most of what I've done in my life is not permanent by any means.  It's all "one night only" and not all nights are equal.

Quote from: tekla on May 24, 2011, 02:14:01 AM
good sir or is it madam, what is it?
You do realize that that's about the most un-enlightenment statement you can make around here don't you? 

I agree. Plus how is that even relevant at all?

What on earth is this thread about?

I hated it the first time around and it has radically altered the way that I operate on this site. Just when I thought that it was done and dusted it seems to have become an excuse to start an argument.

Sensitivity to others? Pah! ??? >:(

Millie,
  We have to reminded of this at times and to others who just joined this forum and to those whom are reliving their adolscence through the treatments they are receiving.  I am lucky that I have the love and respect of my friends and family that others here do not.  I've been through a lot of hell over my dysphoria, as it is called now, for the most part of my 58 years.  Despite that, I had a stint in the Navy, worked for a Fortune 500 company and was awarded regional "Top Gun" several times during my 19 years there.  I had the ups and downs with this condition over this time that I would like to share with others in the same boat. 
  I did not relate to others too well before transitioning, nor gave the proper sensitivity to others when they were down.  I dunno, probably it is the hormones that are changing things here.  I remember my grandma and her generation, born 1900, tell me that if you don't have anything good to say about a person, don't say it!
  Joelene

Nope, you have lost me again! ???

I know what sensitivity is! I just think that the original thread was very vague and has made me question myself any time I might want to express happiness or excitement on this forum, but cest la vie.

However, the latest installment I have no idea about or how it relates to the original narative, it just seems to be an argument for arguments sake.

Btw Not all of us are fortunate enough to have been voted 'Top Gun'   in anything. I feel bad now! >:(

I would like to start by acknowledging that since I am not transgender this may be none of my business. Still in all, I just had to add this. It is something that I took note of while studying today.

I noticed that sometimes in the Christianity section some that do not believe are very quick to ridicule. I personally do not mind Christian bashing as it does go against what the non believers think when spoken in truth and not twisted into that which makes people happy. But, there are other issues that come into play.

I realize that many have been hurt by churches and so-called Christians. I realize that these so-called Christians have done a mighty fine job of making a mockery of Christianity with no outside help.

Still in all, I do imagine that there are some transgenders out there that rely on their faith to help them in times of trouble. That faith may be the only thing that stops them from committing suicide. Why risk destroying their faith when that may be all that is giving them the strength to live another day?

Slamming Christianity isn't important enough to remove the only hope some may have.

There are plenty of Christian sites out there that the non believers can visit to ridicule those whom believe in the good Lord. On those sites they may not be on the brink of self harm. I am referring to the straight / cisgender sites such as christianet and christianforums and such. These sites are full of arrogant straight and cisgender folk that could probably stand to have their haughty attitudes abased.

From what I see the people on the straight and cisgender sites probably don't have near the problems and likelihood of self harm as the sites that are for the GLBT people. They seem to be the ones that look down their nose at you all. They seem to be the ones that are quick to say you all are going to hell without knowing anything about you.

I just hope that those who do not believe in the good Lord will stop to think before posting contrary to the Christians. I would imagine that it would be the equivalent of you posting about meds, hormones or a favorite doctor or procedure just to have someone ridicule that and try to destroy your hope of transitioning.

As I said, this may be little or none of my business but I personally feel that it is something to think about.

As for me, the Bible says I should consider myself in all things lest I be haughty and fall or bring the problems of others on myself. I would not be considerate of you all or attempting to help by not posting that which I felt I should.

If this has been brought up elsewhere I am sorry for duplicating a concern.

If this offends anyone I am sorry. It was not meant to.

So.  Let me get this right.  You, and your fellow Xians get to write whatever you want about all of this, and people who don't agree with you should not say anything because it could be upsetting to many of those who believe many of which seem to be on a rather slender thread to begin with. 

Slamming Christianity isn't important enough to remove the only hope some may have.
Here's the deal.  I don't think it's hopeless.  I think that for those people in that situation good psychological care and a solid medical diagnosis and treatment offer much better odds of success.  And I don't think anything anyone writes on the web, or in science, or says in any way changes the way anyone feels about god.  That belief is something that an individual can only do themselves.

Quote from: tekla on June 24, 2011, 12:10:45 PM
So.  Let me get this right.  You, and your fellow Xians get to write whatever you want about all of this, and people who don't agree with you should not say anything because it could be upsetting to many of those who believe many of which seem to be on a rather slender thread to begin with. 

Slamming Christianity isn't important enough to remove the only hope some may have.
Here's the deal.  I don't think it's hopeless.  I think that for those people in that situation good psychological care and a solid medical diagnosis and treatment offer much better odds of success.  And I don't think anything anyone writes on the web, or in science, or says in any way changes the way anyone feels about god.  That belief is something that an individual can only do themselves.

First off, I don't think Del advocated being able to say anything without reproach.  I read an impassioned and well-written plea against baselessy denigrating a spiritual path that may provide a great deal of fulfillment and meaning to those who believe.  There are people who profess to be on that path who use that path to attack others, going against the very teachings of Jesus.  Granted, the message is as open to personal interpretation as is any other message, but the fact remains that they give decent followers a bad name by association.  That there are decent followers who are willing to stand up and denounce these charlatans speaks volumes about their characters, and I think Del did just that.

Now as for your second comment, it's spot on: spiritual views are highly personal and not generally open to change by external force.  But the fact is, some bold pioneers in modern psychology have begun to study spirituality and belief as part of mainstream research, something that used to result in expulsion from the field.  It's starting to gain traction as well.  The February (I think it was February) issue of Monitor on Psychology, the official magazine of the APA, devoted half the issue to the role of spirituality in life.  What's being found is that those who have some form of belief, regardless of what that belief is, are generally in better health, better spirits, and have faster recovery times after surgery (among others).  So why disturb their peace by belligerently attacking something that is now being shown to have medically proven benefits?  That's what Del was on to: why attack them for their belief when it can help in immeasurable ways?

And it goes beyond Christianity... why attack anyone for their beliefs so long as they aren't harming others?  And especially if their beliefs mean so much to them.

Jennie, I read you're comments and I wish to say this , I'm a recovering alcoholic and substance abuser from years back . The comments are most welcome . I am one of those who for health reasons had to come off the H R T . I had to do a lot of meditating and deal with a conclusion that I wouldn't be able to fulfill a lot of what many here enjoy. Still, I'm determined to be all that I can, to share and support ALL Transgendered individuals weither they be Crossdressers  , Androginines , Gender Benders , Gay , fetishests or whatever ! hey, I want to do every thing I can to enrich all on this forum . ellen

Wow! So many posts, so many different views! Some I agree with, some I don't And a couple I thought were a bit insensitive. Kind of ironic, given the topic.

"The difference between dreams and reality is that one side often does nothing but dream, while the other group works."

So are you saying that no matter what your obstacles are, you can always overcome them? Wow! I wish I had known that when I was 9 or 10 and under the strict control of my parents.

Had I not had a dream to sustain me for the first 58 years of my life, I doubt I'd have lived long enough to be in a position to take the steps to work to make my dream become a reality.

"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one." --John Lennon.

Quote from: mija on March 16, 2011, 03:41:34 AM
Someone will always be offended, triggered, hurt, nonplussed no matter what is said, or not said.

I fully agree with Mija. If may "good wishes" post offend anybody please feel free to sit on them. Where does stupidity stops.

Kate D

This thread reminds me of college. There people in some of my class who were offended because they could not keep up with the intelligent debate or narrative initiated by your truly. So what it was expected to me was to "play dumb."

As far as any Xtian or religious or not posts, this is a public forum ,if you post your opinions or beliefs be ready to hear dissent, if you post scientific beliefs be prepared to back up your claims with references.

My post above may be consider out of line by some, and I may even get the PM to send me an email "to do better," but it  was my choice of words when I posted, and thus I should be abler to take the good and bad that may come out of it.

Kate D

Quote from: Da Monkey on May 24, 2011, 07:16:07 AM
I agree. Plus how is that even relevant at all?

I would assume it is a sincere intent not to mis-gender tekla in replies. I've had occasions when I had to re-word a reply over just that concern but i assumed it would be more obvious if I was supposed to know.

i do realize there are members here who prefer to be "non-gendered" and respect that, but i can certainly understand that someone would consider that courtesy would impel them to make sure they got it right.

One might even argue that, in this setting especially, being deliberately vague about it if you were NOT in fact wishing to be understood as androgynous or "non-gendered" would be an act of rudeness.

but I never saw it as worth commenting on. perhaps tekla is trying to make a point.

If we keep in mind the difference between a mutually respectful discussion about different beliefs or opinions on the one hand, and rudeness on the other I think we can all get along.   There is always the chance of learning something new. 
I have always regarded  Tekla as "Tekla", gender generally irrevelant  to most discussions anyway! More interested in the opinion than the appearance, knowing that any posts will be interesting.

Karen.

Quote from: justmeinoz on July 03, 2011, 02:53:06 AM
If we keep in mind the difference between a mutually respectful discussion about different beliefs or opinions on the one hand, and rudeness on the other I think we can all get along.   There is always the chance of learning something new. 
I have always regarded  Tekla as "Tekla", gender generally irrevelant  to most discussions anyway! More interested in the opinion than the appearance, knowing that any posts will be interesting.

Karen.

Oh i agree.

but what I'm referring to is this:

Let's say that tekla says something controversial (shocking i know, lol) and a reply misunderstands (IMO) what was said.

i jump in and say. "I believe you misunderstood tekla, what she meant was..."


Screeching halt.

She? Maybe? should I have said "he"? Maybe?

so I go back and re-word the post to avoid gendered pronouns.

maybe that's the goal, but if there is NOT such a point-making going on, and tekla is NOT trying to present and androgynous persona, then it's a perfectly understandable thing that someone would trip a bit on the conundrum of how to handle things like pronouns without giving offense.

the saving grace, of course, being that tekla doesn't strike me as the sort who WOULD get offended if mis-gendered.

Quote from: tekla on May 24, 2011, 02:14:01 AM
good sir or is it madam, what is it?
You do realize that that's about the most un-enlightenment statement you can make around here don't you?

The word you're looking for is most unenlightened and I ask because you make pretty judging statements.

Twice about tattoos, saying to one person "when they are ready to be a man come to back to you", and also the general public can comment on other people's tattoos according to you, you're not going to be doing that we know tekla unless you're in a safe environment.   Now this thing about tattoos and your claim to working in the entertainment industry raises a warning flag, quite a few artists and performers and the stage crews and roadies are likely to have tattoos, tattoos are everywhere you apparently work with these people, I'd have thought you'd know tattoos can enhance beauty or just be simply part of someone's uniqueness.  So I doubt you work in that industry in the capacity you claim, that's my opinion.

You've also said women here need 'more backbone'.

I'd like to know where you're coming from, one of the binaries, dual, questioning, none or a variation.  If tekla you're making statements about people like the ones I've raised I'd like to know who is making those statements, an avatar pic to back up the judgements, up to you of course not too. 
What I see is someone making unenlightened and also bragging statements.  Too try and make something of being asked your gender and actually most people want to pass as one (being one does not have to be a cliche if it's from a place of  personal expression).  You also probably made something of me wanting queer and straight junked, I see nothing as queer or straight, end of story.

Quote from: tekla on May 24, 2011, 02:14:01 AM
But what's best is "Doctor".  That way its not a self-designated (and what are those worth anyway?) statement, but a designation placed upon me by others, which is much more valid in the real world as it more than adequately reflects what 'others see me as' which is of far more value than than any internal dialog offers.  It's also gender-neutral, which makes it even better as it does even less to answer the original question.

You're a doctor as much as you've stage managed Cyprus Hill, or worked with David Copperfield, making bragging statements without evidence?   Any normal person provides photographic evidence or a website (even bevariationstter) adults know making claims like those is a fantasy internet life like me claiming to be a pianist without evidence it's a fantasy internet life.  You could plead not backing up your claims with wanting to protect yourself because of the nature of this site, personally no evidence at all because of that?  I think I'd not make up silly fantasies and just actually start living my life.  But really the issue is I think you might want to transition but you can't for some of the many reasons people don't or haven't, that's my take on it, I hope you do take the plunge if it will make you happy.

Quote from: tekla on May 24, 2011, 02:14:01 AM
Oh yeah, that 'weird style of quoting" is called formal writing, which was far more important for my generation to learn than apparently it was to yours, so we were taught to write like that.  But the main reason is I don't want to attract more attention to the quote (which is merely my starting place) than to the more important stuff, which is what I'm actually writing.  And by important, I mean what I'm writing and thinking, not what you are simply reading.

I graduated from a top 20 university in the UK (no that's not bragging haha) and what you're doing is called unreferenced quoting, it's easier to know who exactly you're replying too tekla and if you look in academic papers all citations have author and the work, so you want to call what you do formal writing?  Imagine a book or article without referencing any authors names.

This is old, get over it.  Put it down and walk away.  Everyone else has.  Hell the original poster has left the site.  Get a grip.

Hugh, Am I having trouble following this thread, or am I having trouble following this thread.    On the subject of Sensitivity to myself and others, a strange thing happened to me today in the sensitivity to myself which probably will transfer over to the sensitivity of others.  Or not.   I got up and I felt like very effeminate like I was like cotton candy inside.   All sticky and mushy and warm.   I wanted to take the world between my boobs (which I have little of because not taking hormones yet).    I feel like female is really getting real for me.   So, that's all folks.

I have elected not to have surgery or take hormones and I'm fine with that. EACH Person's situation is different and I am mindful of that.   GENNEE

Quote from: rejennyrated on March 07, 2011, 02:58:50 PM
Over the last year or so we have developed a fine tradition of posting good luck threads for people soon to go in for their surgery. This is obviously a very kindly gesture and a sign of the real concern that we all hold for each other.

However without wanting to criticise anyone can I make a gentle plea for people to be sensitive to the many here who have found themselves stuck and unable to progress to SRS due to circumstances or lack of funding.

Offering our support and good wishes to those approaching a major life changing event is highly to be commended. However we need to be careful that in our enthusiastic support for them we do not inadvertently end up rubbing the noses of those less fortunate in their situation.

It would be terrible if someone committed suicide because of depression brought on by a rather vocal reminder of the blessing that others are soon to receive and that they fear that they may never reach.

Thanks Jenny; for looking out for some of us, in the interest of all. I'll keep my inner cheerleader in time out while in such threads. When I read that when of my sisters is about to have surgery though, my heart leaps and I want to go bouncing round the room. I may never have surgery, due to some health issues, but I've reconciled that. That isn't what makes me me. I promise though, that I will curb my enthusiasm.

Surgery of any kind is scary to say the least. I been through two back surgery and need a third one. For the most part I faced them all alone (glad I can walk now.)
People who face any kind of surgery have to remember till you wake up you don't know what has transpired?? I know they need to stay in a positive frame of mind so so so any word or time u give them is Great (Says Toni the tiger.) Ps only my thought

Hey, may be all the people who have been rub the wrong way by the posting of the people "over" congratualting those who are getting their SRS can go an occupy wall street

Jen61