Susan's Place Transgender Resources

How does it effect your well-being, emotions, out-look on life?

How about you energy? Can you feel your muscles weaken?

What's it like? What'll happen if you overdose?
Just curious.

;) cute.
I take injections of estrogen weekly.

Early when you start taking it triggers a whole raft of changes in your body and you do feel VERY strange as your body changes into it's female counterpart your male puberty reverting somewhat and abruptly experiencing a female one instead. I can describe those changes in a separate post if you so desire.

But these days my body is mostly done changing Estrogen just maintains those female attributes I've developed and I infact only feel different and strange if I DON'T take my estrogen injection. Those feelings from doing that manifest as a loss of self confidence, and depression. Women experience this phenomenon in PMT or menopause.

If I "overdose" estrogen I experience symptoms that women get during early pregnancy
ie nausea, dizziness, headaches, Breast tenderness,

More severely overdosing E I'd also have a high risk of developing a lethal blood clot in my leg that could kill me. If I took too much for a long time I'd also experience Hyperprolactemia which is where I'd begin lactating and experiencing crushing migraines running a high risk of developing a pituitary tumor.

In terms of my personal well-being, it was a godsend.  As my dad tried to explain to me when attempting to talk me out of transition, a man (and the part he left out: with a male brain) who takes estrogen will feel more tired, depressed, and just not good.  He cited my grandfather, a very masculine individual, who had to take medicine that raised his E levels because of prostate cancer.

Well, compared to how I feel now, that's how my entire life felt before.  I've always been a very intelligent person.  Even though we didn't officially have one, I was salutatorian of my high school class.  I've been through college and have a good job.  But never in my life did I actually care about anything.  I had no will to live, no ambition, no hopes, and no dreams.  I just went along with what everyone else wanted for me.  Estrogen flipped a switch in my head and now I want to do so many things I will probably never finish them all.  I guess you could say it made my life worth living again at a time when I was seriously thinking about suicide.

Energy-wise, I don't feel any different.  I know that I'm weaker because my muscles are squishier if I try to squeeze them, but it's not something you notice until you can no longer lift something that you could before.  I don't mind though, there's plenty of nice guys willing to carry things for us skinny girls :)

Overdosing on any hormone is bad.  I'm sure you've probably read about what can happen to people on steroids - that's like overdosing on testosterone.  I don't know the specific effects for estrogen, but they're not good.  It probably raises the risk of breast cancer significantly (among other things).  That's why we have doctors monitoring our levels regularly until we get on a steady dosage.

Quote from: pebbles on April 19, 2011, 08:34:16 PM
;) cute.
I take injections of estrogen weekly.

Early when you start taking it triggers a whole raft of changes in your body and you do feel VERY strange as your body changes into it's female counterpart your male puberty reverting somewhat and abruptly experiencing a female one instead. I can describe those changes in a separate post if you so desire.

But these days my body is mostly done changing Estrogen just maintains those female attributes I've developed and I infact only feel different and strange if I DON'T take my estrogen injection. Those feelings from doing that manifest as a loss of self confidence, and depression. Women experience this phenomenon in PMT or menopause.

If I "overdose" estrogen I experience symptoms that women get during early pregnancy
ie nausea, dizziness, headaches, Breast tenderness,

More severely overdosing E I'd also have a high risk of developing a lethal blood clot in my leg that could kill me. If I took too much for a long time I'd also experience Hyperprolactemia which is where I'd begin lactating and experiencing crushing migraines running a high risk of developing a pituitary tumor.

Oh, so it is potentially deadly, interesting. I was told by the FtM's, that if they overdose on Testosterone, then their body produces massive amounts of estrogen to compensate. Thereby, reversing the effects of testosterone.
And, did you call me cute?

After 2.5 years of HRT, I haven't lost nearly as much muscle mass as I would have liked.  I can say that I've definitely lost much of the strength in my arms, though.  Where estrogen been greatest for me is my psychological well-being.  My mind is better and I don't have dysphoria any more.

Quote from: -CRaSH- on April 19, 2011, 08:47:32 PM
Oh, so it is potentially deadly, interesting. I was told by the FtM's, that if they overdose on Testosterone, then their body produces massive amounts of estrogen to compensate. Thereby, reversing the effects of testosterone.
And, did you call me cute?

I find your curiosity cute yes... the FTM isn't completely wrong a number of things would happen if he took a massive dose of Testosterone it would be like a body builder abusing steroids in a very bad way.
The excess would begin to be converted into estrogen causing undesirable feminisation you might have seen bodybuilders with boobs but the Testosterone would also cause extreme damage to the liver, heart, kidneys and would also most likely cause extreme acne.

Quote from: AmySmiles on April 19, 2011, 08:40:59 PM
In terms of my personal well-being, it was a godsend.  As my dad tried to explain to me when attempting to talk me out of transition, a man (and the part he left out: with a male brain) who takes estrogen will feel more tired, depressed, and just not good.  He cited my grandfather, a very masculine individual, who had to take medicine that raised his E levels because of prostate cancer.

Well, compared to how I feel now, that's how my entire life felt before.  I've always been a very intelligent person.  Even though we didn't officially have one, I was salutatorian of my high school class.  I've been through college and have a good job.  But never in my life did I actually care about anything.  I had no will to live, no ambition, no hopes, and no dreams.  I just went along with what everyone else wanted for me.  Estrogen flipped a switch in my head and now I want to do so many things I will probably never finish them all.  I guess you could say it made my life worth living again at a time when I was seriously thinking about suicide.

Energy-wise, I don't feel any different.  I know that I'm weaker because my muscles are squishier if I try to squeeze them, but it's not something you notice until you can no longer lift something that you could before.  I don't mind though, there's plenty of nice guys willing to carry things for us skinny girls :)

Overdosing on any hormone is bad.  I'm sure you've probably read about what can happen to people on steroids - that's like overdosing on testosterone.  I don't know the specific effects for estrogen, but they're not good.  It probably raises the risk of breast cancer significantly (among other things).  That's why we have doctors monitoring our levels regularly until we get on a steady dosage.

Seems like the main reason that you're happier is because you're finally transitioning. And yeah, it makes sense that you'd be at higher risk for Breast Cancer.

Quote from: pebbles on April 19, 2011, 08:53:24 PM
I find your curiosity cute yes... the FTM isn't completely wrong a number of things would happen if he took a massive dose of Testosterone it would be like a body builder abusing steroids in a very bad way.
The excess would begin to be converted into estrogen causing undesirable feminisation you might have seen bodybuilders with boobs but the Testosterone would also cause extreme damage to the liver, heart, kidneys and would also most likely cause extreme acne.

Oh, thanks.
I understand now.

Umm I did become physically weaker as a result of removing my bodies testosterone... I didn't feel changing per say (unlike breasts who's growth made themselves known) but within 2 months I noticed that a steep hill I cycled up was becoming slightly harder to cycle up everyday rather than easier. Hauling my food shopping home became more taxing.

I also have a friend who is abit rough with people when he's drunk only in a overly boisterous playful way. I used to be 20% stronger than him now I'd guess that I'm 15% weaker than him.

He's a shrimp of a guy so it really highlighted to me just how frighteningly strong men can be.

The best analogy i've heard was from a friend of mine and it is real fitting. It is like outing the wrng fuel in your car and it runs poorly. Put inthe right fuel and it purrs.

If you were to give estrogen to a regular guy it would make him feel crappy and depress him etc.vfor a transsexual it should feel more normal. It did for me.

I can't say, specifically. That is, when I went on hormone therapy 13 months ago, I started estrogen, progesterone, and finesteride as T-blocker, supposedly because of it's hair growth potential - still waiting for that. Anyway, within an hour of taking my first dose of the three, I absolutely knew I was right. The emotional lift was incredible. I don't know if one or the other was responsible, or if 2 or all 3 working together did it, but I do think if it was the wrong decision to take them, I would not have felt that way. I have not looked back.

I don't think my arm strength was seriously affected; I pretty well had feminine appearing arms, so I didn't need to lose in that area. My shoulders were of course fairly broad, but I've lost 2 or 3 inches there, though that's not enough. My old T-shirts are really baggie across the shoulders, though not so much across the chest.  ;D  I don't feel like there has been much if any muscle weakening, my energy level is at least as high, and mbest of all, my temper has been ... well, tempered.

Susan Kay

Quote from: Karynm8621 on April 19, 2011, 09:09:24 PM
The best analogy i've heard was from a friend of mine and it is real fitting. It is like outing the wrng fuel in your car and it runs poorly. Put inthe right fuel and it purrs.

If you were to give estrogen to a regular guy it would make him feel crappy and depress him etc.vfor a transsexual it should feel more normal. It did for me.

ive been checking up on this thread because it was interesting, and I gotta say this is spoken perfectly, and I can say from experience that it works both ways :) (the T working for me, the 'right fuel')

Are you serious!!? Someone just gave me a thumbsdown because I made this thread asking what it's like to take estrogen.... Really..... C'mon. This is ridiculous.

If you're all that curious, take it and find out.

Quote from: tekla on April 19, 2011, 11:57:58 PM
If you're all that curious, take it and find out.

Ummm... I have the information that I needed.

Why would I take it. I think you need to relax.

I don't really understand the response to crash in this thread.

He appears to be legitimately interested in understanding what we go through during transition and is not doing it in a particularly offensive manner.  That's more than I can say for a lot of cisguys!

Quote from: EmilyElizabeth on April 20, 2011, 12:15:23 AM
I don't really understand the response to crash in this thread.

He appears to be legitimately interested in understanding what we go through during transition and is not doing it in a particularly offensive manner.  That's more than I can say for a lot of cisguys!

Yeah, but I'll continue to "take it". For now.

Quote from: Karynm8621 on April 19, 2011, 09:09:24 PM
The best analogy i've heard was from a friend of mine and it is real fitting. It is like outing the wrng fuel in your car and it runs poorly. Put inthe right fuel and it purrs.

If you were to give estrogen to a regular guy it would make him feel crappy and depress him etc.vfor a transsexual it should feel more normal. It did for me.

So true and further evidence that we ARE different in our brain construction.

QuoteTo quote Cirnobyl: So true and further evidence that we ARE different in our brain construction.

I didn't used to think so. I mean, we're all people, right, and do think differently as different people, but I didn't think brain sex thought patterns were much if any different in female vs. male brains. The differences that were there were from gender behavior patterning from birth. So simple. And like most simple things, so wrong. I was totally excluding the massive effect of hormones on the brain, thinking they only effected the body. And no cracks about which hormones created that thought pattern in me please!

We're still all people, much more similar then different. But we are different, not only individually, but by gender. And Hooray for that!

And what's the issue with -CRaSH- asking this anyway? If you're offended, read a different post for goodness sake! Perhaps it should have been started elsewhere or moved from the M-2-F forum, but it certainly is pertinent to me. Thanks for raising it, -CRaSH-.

Susan Kay

I'm going to try my best to explain my perspective....

I'm not a cisguy like Crash, but as a transguy I have wondered how it would be for an MTF to experience the surge of estrogen that I was cursed with at birth. Because I spent 22 years of my life with naturally produced estrogen coursing through my body I never really "noticed" it, you know? I can feel the effects of testosterone and I love what it does for me, but I've always been curious about "the other side" so to speak.

I think this is a good thread and raises some legitimate questions about people's experiences. I find the responses here quite thought-provoking. People have a tendency to only talk about the physical side of transitioning and leave out the amazing psychological effects that having the right hormone in your body can bring.

Props to the engine and gas analogy!

It's like being given water in the desert.

Quote from: EmmaM on April 20, 2011, 02:32:51 AM
It's like being given water in the desert.

Sounds great  :laugh:.

Quote from: Susan Kay on April 20, 2011, 01:11:54 AM
I didn't used to think so. I mean, we're all people, right, and do think differently as different people, but I didn't think brain sex thought patterns were much if any different in female vs. male brains. The differences that were there were from gender behavior patterning from birth. So simple. And like most simple things, so wrong. I was totally excluding the massive effect of hormones on the brain, thinking they only effected the body. And no cracks about which hormones created that thought pattern in me please!

We're still all people, much more similar then different. But we are different, not only individually, but by gender. And Hooray for that!

And what's the issue with -CRaSH- asking this anyway? If you're offended, read a different post for goodness sake! Perhaps it should have been started elsewhere or moved from the M-2-F forum, but it certainly is pertinent to me. Thanks for raising it, -CRaSH-.

Susan Kay

Hey Susan.

I try not to worry about them. Even when I do nothing wrong, they still see me as wrong, I can't win here with some users. If im doing something wrong/actually offensive, sure yell at me.

But not when I'm being nice/asking a neutral honest question.

Crash don't worry, you have been nothing but curious and respectful, you have done nothing wrong. Some trans people get bothered by personal questions. I view it as, if someone is interested in asking it means they want to understand it better and knowledge is never a bad thing. I'd rather they get the right info then to get wrong info.

One of the things I did in my transition is to try to be as open to questions as possible. It does get repetitive and some questions can be a bit out there, but I have been told by several people that my open attitude helped make them more comfortable with the whole process. So it cant be a bad thing

Keep asking my friend, knowledge is power

Many thanks to the original poster and for the excellent replies, as I look forward to starting it as soon as I can I find the information most useful....

I agree that there are risks i.e. breast cancer and such but I view them as worth the fact that it will help me become my true self...

One question I want to ask.. I am 44 from what I understand the hormones etc will have less effect as i am older than say had I transitioned when I was younger and that the older you get the less effects there will be? is this correct or not? i am aware that results vary with the individual. 

Quote from: Anaeta_Desiree on April 21, 2011, 02:41:18 AM
Many thanks to the original poster and for the excellent replies, as I look forward to starting it as soon as I can I find the information most useful....

I agree that there are risks i.e. breast cancer and such but I view them as worth the fact that it will help me become my true self...

One question I want to ask.. I am 44 from what I understand the hormones etc will have less effect as i am older than say had I transitioned when I was younger and that the older you get the less effects there will be? is this correct or not? i am aware that results vary with the individual.

Aneata:

It is true that the will have less effect as you get older.  The sex steroids have their most dramatic effect during the first years of puberty.  However that doesn't mean that they will have no effect.

Those hard tissues such as cartilage and bone will not be affected at all.  But all soft tissue will be affected to one extent or another.  Usually skin texture and breast tenderness are the most common.  Loss of libido, spontaneous erection and ejaculation are also quite common.  Body hair is often softened and reduced, though not the terminal hairs of the face.  Upper body strength loss and fat redistribution, I.E. hips, will be somewhat affected.  And breast development is usually least.  But going through a second puberty takes as long as going through it the first time.  It can take five years or more for all the effects to manifest them selves fully.

Additionally, the use of androgen blockers such as spironolactone and aldactone will cause permanent sterility after the first eight or nine months and cause testicular and prostate shrinkage.

-Sandy

Quote from: Anaeta_Desiree on April 21, 2011, 02:41:18 AM
Many thanks to the original poster and for the excellent replies, as I look forward to starting it as soon as I can I find the information most useful....

I agree that there are risks i.e. breast cancer and such but I view them as worth the fact that it will help me become my true self...

One question I want to ask.. I am 44 from what I understand the hormones etc will have less effect as i am older than say had I transitioned when I was younger and that the older you get the less effects there will be? is this correct or not? i am aware that results vary with the individual.

I started hrt at 40 so I figured I'd be in that boat. I ended up with a 38 ill b cup, I expected nothing. I had a very hairy chest and a hairy back, all the hair on my back is gone all my frontal hair is just like a natal female.

So you still have a chafe, it depends on your genetics. Each person is different

Karyn I'm very hairy right now lol, it's great to hear all yours disappeared:D  I was checking out my areloas earlier today and they are actually bigger than standard female issue at 1.4 inch woohoo another result :D

On the age thing, I'm far more fitter, stronger though I am ageing at near 37 than I was at 20.  I could get better results now than I would have at 20 though of course hips is not going to happen.

I'm told hips still have a chance after srs. In fact you should get more changes after srs.

I didn't expect much change and I got quite a bit. I'm happy with my results but yeah, I'd love more hip. I have very narrow hips already.

Quote from: Anaeta_Desiree on April 21, 2011, 02:41:18 AM

One question I want to ask.. I am 44 from what I understand the hormones etc will have less effect as i am older than say had I transitioned when I was younger and that the older you get the less effects there will be? is this correct or not? i am aware that results vary with the individual.

This may just be an urban legend. (http://www.t-vox.org/index.php?title=Hormones_:_Urban_Legends#Urban_Legend_.233:_The_younger_you_are.2C_the_better_you.27ll_do_.28FTM_and_MTF.29)

Quote from: Karynm8621 on April 21, 2011, 09:14:11 AM
I'm told hips still have a chance after srs. In fact you should get more changes after srs.

I didn't expect much change and I got quite a bit. I'm happy with my results but yeah, I'd love more hip. I have very narrow hips already.

Karyn you got fantastic results like everyone else has said you look like someone who is a natal female :D
To hear that hips have a chance after srs, like wow you've really made me smile :D

Quote from: Forum Admin on April 21, 2011, 10:16:31 AM
This may just be an urban legend. (http://www.t-vox.org/index.php?title=Hormones_:_Urban_Legends#Urban_Legend_.233:_The_younger_you_are.2C_the_better_you.27ll_do_.28FTM_and_MTF.29)

I love you Forum admin haha :D

Karyn, you remind me of the lady who does my laser  :)

Quote from: EmilyElizabeth on April 21, 2011, 07:02:52 PM
Karyn, you remind me of the lady who does my laser  :)

Is that a good or bad thing?  ;D

Quote from: Sophie on April 21, 2011, 10:21:04 AM
Karyn you got fantastic results like everyone else has said you look like someone who is a natal female :D
To hear that hips have a chance after srs, like wow you've really made me smile :D

It's funny but the very features that got me picked on in school were what helped me look more female. I got teased constantly for my nose as a kid ...go figure

Thanks for making this thread -CRaSH- (love the upper/lowercase mixture, I wanna make a band called HyPEr TAnGL>.>) The responsis have been really good on informing me on what's going to be happening in the next few months+.

Hey Crash, ok, first, good questions. You can be curious for whatever reason you want to be, it's cool. Sometimes coming to a place like this, you'll get responses from people and you'll be like "um, what the heck" but try not to let that derail you from finding out what you are trying to find out. As long as you are respectful and are genuine, most people will be cool to you.

So, questions...I thought about this and I have to tell you, even though it's only been three and half years for me, I don't really remember what it was like NOT to be taking hormones. I know I'm happier now, but I really don't think that has much to do with hormones at all. I think it's because never in my whole life could I ever have dreamed I'd be living the life I am living now...and I had a great one before transition. I'm finally genuinely happy with where I am :) Oh, back to your questions!

I never felt my muscles weaken or anything. If you get a chance, check out my blog on Susan's in the blog section and look for the posts labeled stuff like "3 weeks on HRT" and "6 months of HRT" because I describe what I was going through pretty clearly. I did notice my neck and upper body muscles going away pretty fast, but I was losing weight RAPIDLY before and during the beginning part of my transition.

I don't know that the physical changes were as much as emotional. I made a blog post recently about crying at work and during stressful situations. That's the kind of thing I probably notice more than physical. I will tell you that I started HRT and electro at the same time. I knew where I was going with my transition and I wasn't going to be derailed no matter what. In the beginning I tracked EVERYTHING!!! My labs, body dimensions, etc. It's all in my blog. I don't do that anymore but I will tell you it was an exciting time because I was hopeful that I'd end up in a good place, better than where I was at the time, which wasn't a terrible place.

Look forward to hearing more from you on the forums. Be well :) meghan

i agree with meghan as far as physical strength goes it kind of deteriated slowly i never really felt my muscles getting weaker. too much estrogen dosnt speed up the process but it can be fatal by increasing your risk of blood clots and posibly liver damage. as for the emotional effects ive become moodier i think but my depression has left me which in itself is a god send i spent so much time repressing emotions over the years that i litterly had a difficult time feeling anything. (males dont have emotions) lol thats what my father drilled into us. its interesting he wasnt that good at at parenting but he sure knows how to turn a girl into a man bleh
jessie

Hi Crash, I have not taken any estrogen yet but my doctor says that because I have a female brain and a male body that my female brain is being starved of estrogen, it needs estrogen, it is femail but my male body does not produce enough, then he says because the brain needs estrogen and it is  not getting it that is what can creat the dysphoria, it is the brains way of saying hey there something wrong here.  He says that when I start taking the estrogen the the brain is happy and the dysphoria will begin to go away.  I hope this help a bit, aloha from Hawaii.

Jennie

Forgive me for re-opening up a topic that's rather old, but while searching on the internet, I found This, and I'm rather new to Susan's place.

I'm wondering about the short term effects of estrogen, specifically, Estraven?

I have a lady that is willing to help me with my questions an training, as it were, but she is many states away. Also, the wife is not so supportive of being married to a tgirl....

This lady friend has suggested that I take the OTC Estraven, Maximum Strength and double up on the dosage. I am hesitant about doing so, not knowing the effects. and I'm wanting the more subtle changes, rather than beginning breast growth, for right now, anyway...

Any thoughts on this?

Thank you everyone

With the other meds I take. It's like in the words of Randall Skeffington. "Like a rainbow... wrapped in a screaming orgasm."

Estroven is an herbal supplement of dubious transitional value.

Go see a doctor or gender therapist first.

Thanks CRaSH for starting this thread.  I had a bad afternoon and reading this made me think about where I started, and who I was so many years ago.  In my twenties I fanisized in my own thoughts with the same questions about taking birth control to see if it would help how I felt.  There were no forums to turn to back then, and the library didn't carry the kind of books I needed to read.  So ask all the questions that you think need to be answered.  Then, after you get the answers to your questions, be very honest with yourself about where you're going. 

Kathy

Estrogen is a beautiful thing.

Thanks for the interesting post, Ian and welcome to Susan's. Personally, I would not use such drugs without them being prescribed by my doctor, but firsthand accounts such as yours are certainly interesting to hear.

This is another example of reviving an old thread that was well worth bringing back. There's a goldmine of worthwhile info in Susan's vault here.

~ Lyric ~

I've heard a lot of people describing HRT as a fog lifting or a filter being removed from the world.
My analogy is that it was like having lived my entire life with a radio playing white noise. After all these years I didn't know how loud the noise was until I got the medication that turned the radio off. Suddenly there was no white noise in my head, and I could finally hear myself think.
The filter analogy works for me as well, but for other reasons. Before coming out it was like there was a filter between me and everyone else; there was something about me no one knew, and I couldn't talk about. So that created a filter (or a gap) between me and the outside world.

Quote from: AmySmiles on April 19, 2011, 08:40:59 PM

Well, compared to how I feel now, that's how my entire life felt before.  I've always been a very intelligent person.  Even though we didn't officially have one, I was salutatorian of my high school class.  I've been through college and have a good job.  But never in my life did I actually care about anything.  I had no will to live, no ambition, no hopes, and no dreams.  I just went along with what everyone else wanted for me.  Estrogen flipped a switch in my head and now I want to do so many things I will probably never finish them all.  I guess you could say it made my life worth living again at a time when I was seriously thinking about suicide.

I just came across this very old post and what AmySmiles wrote here 5 years ago is exactly how I've been living the past few years: No ambition, no hopes, no dreams. Plus, I've been a terrible dad and husband to my family due to all this - I was just running my life on Auto Pilot.

There is just one way now... HRT.

Love
-J

Hi all, every one is talking about the wonderful effects of HRT on brain chemistry. I was wondering is this true or more of a placebo effect?

I'm pre everything so do not know, but wonder if the liberating feeling from dysphoria comes from that and other aspects of transition for example comming out, self acceptance, a feeling of moving forward finally.

I guess for me I would like to know does the feeling of welbeing persist 5 - 10 - 20 years on?

Thanks.

Debs.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

I think there's a little of both. It's pretty clear from studies that estrogen has beneficial effects on the psyche (and progesterone) BUT psychosocial factors also play a role, a very important role (support group, how well you pass, if you love yourself, employment status, lifestyle habits, etc). It's not just about hormones.

Quote from: Incarlina on October 30, 2013, 06:48:12 PM
I've heard a lot of people describing HRT as a fog lifting or a filter being removed from the world.
My analogy is that it was like having lived my entire life with a radio playing white noise. After all these years I didn't know how loud the noise was until I got the medication that turned the radio off. Suddenly there was no white noise in my head, and I could finally hear myself think.
The filter analogy works for me as well, but for other reasons. Before coming out it was like there was a filter between me and everyone else; there was something about me no one knew, and I couldn't talk about. So that created a filter (or a gap) between me and the outside world.

I haven't started HRT but I do already identity with this. There is significant emotional benefit for me for coming to terms with my gender identity and the increasing freedom to express myself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8_hGlwau3A

like the day you stop putting 91 into a fuel tank that has a 95+ warning.