This is a general comment to anyone/everyone and is aimed at no one specific. I am just voicing my feelings and what I know a few others also feel.
When we hang out and you invite your friend whom I've never met, please don't identify me as, "Oh yeah she's a cool chick, she used to be a boy I know.". Or when I'm hanging out with my GLBT group of friends and someone new tags along, there is really no reason to tell them that I am trans.
I am so much more than just my "trans" label. I am a musician, a jazz and blues pianist. I am a computer nerd. I am movie lover. I am hopeless romantic. I am a girl.
When I told you my deepest secret, I placed a lot of trust in you; trust that is not easily granted. It is not something I want freely advertised to the world. I simply want to have a life outside of my trans-identity.
So if you are really my friend, and you really care at all about me and my feelings; please stop outing me.
I want to post this on facebook so my group of friends can read it, but then I'd be outing myself to people that I'm still stealth with.
God I totally know how you feel about that!
I spent the weekend with a friend of mine last year who is trans and she kept on introducing me as "this is Annah, my trans friend." Now, I am proud being trans but I don't go to everyone I meet and say "hi! I'm trans!" The only people who need to know my business like that is a prospective lover because he or she should know before hand. However, with friends or acquaintances (especially acquaintances) it really isn't none of their business!
I remember one day I went to a Human Rights Campaign "Party for the striking down of don't ask don't tell" and the first thing Joe Solmonese ask me "how should i introduce you to people as?" And I was like "I am Annah." He smiled and said "fair enough!"
That's what I like...when someone asks you first before they assume you want to announce to the whole world you are trans. Disclosing that you are trans should be reserved for people you either trust or respect or feel comfortable enough in sharing that part of you. :)
Get used to it, human nature, for some reason everyone thinks they can tell everyone else. as time goes on though it does become less.
Yes Yes Yes Yes Yes!!! I've had this talk with a few people and you've captured my sentiments exactly... well said, Samantha!
My wife outed me to my mother in law, when I wasnt even there.
I dont know how to feel about it.
In one way, I am relieved.
In another, I could care less.
but for some reason I tend to feel a little violated.
I know she needed someone to talk too, but Ive been slowly coming out. Ive been picking the easy ones first because I am terrified.
I am not ashamed of being trans, I am scared of my new reality. Not living as a woman, but the people who are part of my life. It is very hard for me to make friends because I work so hard I am exhausted when I get home.
Sam, I can imagine how that must feel...:-(
I dont think they realize you take it how you do though, so you have to tell them. If the cant respect your requests, then they may not be worth your time.
I guess the only way to try to avoid this is to join the coming-out with a request to avoid telling this to anyone, ever. I mean, if someone should know, we should be the ones to decide so... But even so, like any secret, there is always a chance that it will be revealed.
Amen, dude. Seriously, people can be irritating like that -_-;
Best thing you can do is tell them this. (Hell, I think facebook lets you post things visible to only specific people. That, or post it in a note visible to only those who do this, or tell them in person.)
I agree with A on the requesting to keep it a secret.
My sister never outs me as ftm to new friends. (Although she seems to have no problem with telling everyone and their dead grandmothers that I'm gay. -eyeroll- haa.)
This is unfortunately really familiar.
Sometimes asking people to not directly out you doesn't help. When I came out to friends I asked them to not out me, but told them if someone asked about me I would prefer if they tell those people to ask me directly. I don't want others to feel obligated to lie or cover for me, but I would rather have control of the situation and be able to decide for myself whether I was comfortable with the person knowing. And I totally admit to stealing that idea from someone on here, but I don't remember who :embarrassed:
Although one of my friends has respected that wish, my best friend since we were like 11 has outed me to most (probably all) of his friends. When I confronted him on it he told me that he had told "a couple" people that I was changing my gender - slightly problematic wording aside, I figured it didn't matter because I didn't know the people he told and assumed I wouldn't meet them. Except I've since learned that he told a lot of people. And worse, what he told some people was completely ignorantly wrong - to some people he didn't out me as a transsexual woman, he outed me as a gay man. WTF, right?. I've distanced myself from him and I really don't see our friendship lasting much longer.
Another one of my friends, who is also in transition, lives her life a lot more openly than I do. I had to ask her to not introduce me as "This is Kelly, she's trans like me too" because she just didn't think about whether I would be comfortable with that. I'm not ashamed of my history or experience, I have no problem associating with other people who also happen to be trans if our personalities mesh, but I'm a lot more comfortable introducing myself or being introduced as "Kelly." Not "Kelly, trans female" not "Kelly the transsexual" and not "Kelly, she's a girl" because that one's just kinda weird. If my trans history comes up for some valid reason and I want to out myself, then I will on my own terms. I wish that weren't so hard for people to understand...
I feel exactly the same. Nobody needs the label to help shove me into some box when just meeting me. Let me introduce myself to people in my own way, let them come to know the person I am, without the trans label hanging in the air forever, in a sense flavouring everything.
My mom has a nasty habit of doing that. She's outed me, I'm sure, to everyone she knows. Since I don't know any of these people and they don't know me, god knows what they might imagine me to be. I was applying for a shipping position at the company she works in; she thought it would be helpful to speak on my behalf to them-- telling them my situation-- to "feel things out" and see what they would say. In her mind she was trying to help me, but as I told her: "My status is none of their business, and I don't appreciate you taking it upon yourself to speak for me before I've had a chance to meet them and let them see who I am." I also explained that the more people know, the harder it will be on me to live my life and be accepted in general society. I mentioned that there are people who HATE trans people, and if the wrong person hears of her "daughter who used to be her son" it could mean the end of me. Telling the wrong person could end up killing me.
She kind of looked at me funny through all of this, no lightbulb popping on over her head at all. "I was just trying to help." I said I appreciate that, but would prefer to get the job on my own merit, and don't need anyone speaking for me or spreading my gender status to people.
It's frustrating, but there isn't much I can do to stop it. I'm sure other people I know start conversations as follows: "My trans friend April.... " or "Do you know my friend April? She's trans... "
:( now I need a hug :'(
Quote from: April Dawne on June 22, 2011, 08:25:53 PM
:( now I need a hug :'(
:icon_hug:
My dad works with a trans woman and always refers to her as "the transgendered woman [her name]." It really bothers me that he seems to define her by that one thing, and it makes me a bit worried for the future.
Thanks Lee :icon_hug: one for you!
I know what you mean, I feel like forever I'm going to be known as 'April the transsexual' or 'April the trans girl', or 'my trans friend April' and not just April. I mean do GLB people feel the need to introduce their friends that way? "Hi this is Samantha, the lesbian." I don't get it.
I made a promise to to my father that I would not keep this a terrible secret any longer - for the sake of his sanity and my safety. I gave him my word and I've been alright.
Though, I say this is privileged information that should only be divulged to those whom you feel most comfortable with. So, yeah, stop outing me for fun too.
Thankfully there was no harm done, but when I came out to him, my (FtM) son outed me to his mother! Not Happy !!
Maybe someone needs to make a MYSPACE (facebook) profile that is anonymous telling the WHOLE WORLD HOW WE FEEL ABOUT OUR TRANSITIONS and privacy
PS: Whats wrong with myspace sheesh like whats so great about facebook???
Ok, I've started the facebook page :) dunno quite how to word the description and whatnot though! The page is called Stop Outing Us ;D
Anyone got tips or suggestions on how to put it together?
Such sweet irony.
It might be an idea to state at the outset that the page isn't a commentary on the nature of social networking sites. ;D
I thought it was a little funny too... liking the page will effectively out the person. I think I can still change the name, so maybe something a little more ambiguous, and not focused on outing trans folk? ???
Well, I guess something ambiguous would be:
Please Realise Individuals Value Avoiding Tactless Exposure
You could make it into an acronym... not sure what it would be though. ;)
Haha PRIVATE.... I like that :D
I like that too ;D
I also thought of PARADE-- People Against Reckless Affiliation Disclosure Everywhere
I got alot of 'This is my sister Cyndi, she ussed to be my brother', when I was at my brothers place last weekend.
Hi,
I transitioned 3 months before I started a new job. The HR folks were approached by the GLBT group (I knew a member of that group from before I started at the company), and they had a sit-down with the department manager & supervisors to plan out my arrival before the fact. So I was pretty much outed before I got there, but it was no big deal - I'm 6'0" (or 5'12" as I prefer saying :laugh:) and I didn't kid myself that I'd be as stealth as some of my smaller friends were. I'm just myself & everything's fine. That was 11 1/2 years ago. Work's still going great! I am valued for my intelligence, good work habits, and team skills, which is the way it should be.
Kim
For the most part I am about as open as people come. I had the comforting problem that I didn't lose any friends or family in my transtion.
Which means almost all my friends have known me in my former life.
The only place I have problem is at work. When I am at work I am a nurse; nothing more or less. My co-workers are really good about my
name change, but they screw up the pronouns regularly, which is really confusing for the patients. "Rachel is your nurse tonight, Ill tell him about that."
It is annoying. I've talked to a few of them and they swear they are trying, but it slips out.
In DC, it is illegal for someone to out you without your permission. No matter what the circumstance for the outing or method.
Quote from: girl_ashley on June 23, 2011, 06:32:13 PM
In DC, it is illegal for someone to out you without your permission. No matter what the circumstance for the outing or method.
I never knew about that, I know that they are pretty progressive though, it is amazing that you could get fired in Arlington, and 5 mintues away the government in DC is willing to protect your bathroom rights (even if they haven't done the best job at it). It is amazing how much difference an imaginary line makes.
Well it seems I may have a job at disney, I posted about this on facebook. Unfortunately, I've had to delete several comments talking about "trans" or "->-bleeped-<-", such as "the whole ->-bleeped-<- community is going to start working there".
This is what I'm talking about, unnecessary outing. There are several people on my facebook that I'm not out to, but this is news that I think everyone can join in on, and when people out me for no good reason like that I get very frustrated.
I'm not ashamed of being trans, but once people know that your trans it's always in their head and so many of your conversations with them become about your trans-ness, and it's exhausting. I don't think it's selfish to want some normalcy in one's life.
Quote from: Samantharz on June 29, 2011, 05:06:10 PM
Well it seems I may have a job at disney, I posted about this on facebook. Unfortunately, I've had to delete several comments talking about "trans" or "->-bleeped-<-", such as "the whole ->-bleeped-<- community is going to start working there".
This is what I'm talking about, unnecessary outing. There are several people on my facebook that I'm not out to, but this is news that I think everyone can join in on, and when people out me for no good reason like that I get very frustrated.
I'm not ashamed of being trans, but once people know that your trans it's always in their head and so many of your conversations with them become about your trans-ness, and it's exhausting. I don't think it's selfish to want some normalcy in one's life.
but then again, how can we ever educate the general public for something that is so misunderstood?
I'm always happy to educate, but there is no reason that every single person I meet has to know I'm trans. My trans-identity doesn't need to be a part of every aspect of my life.
Edit -
There is also age to take into account. A lot of late transitioners are comfortable in their social setting and a lot of times they're comfortable in their relationship status as well and don't really mind being out and open to everyone. Being young, my social identity is still malleable. I seek relationships and friendships on nearly a daily basis and I'm always meeting new people. Wanting a normal life style, one free of the trans-label isn't wrong or selfish. It get's exhausting for everything to be about your trans identity. I can't even go into a pool, in my bathing suite without some (trying really hard to avoid vulgarities) jerk looking at my tuck to see if my balls are hanging out.
So yeah, I want some amount of stealth in my life.
Quote from: Samantharz on June 29, 2011, 08:36:27 PM
I'm always happy to educate, but there is no reason that every single person I meet has to know I'm trans. My trans-identity doesn't need to be a part of every aspect of my life.
Exactly how I feel about it too... I'm more than happy to educate those who want to know, and to be able to do it on my terms. But at the same time, not every store clerk has to find out about me when I pay for something with a credit card. Couldn't be happier now that I have new cards and my new license! ;D Good riddance to being forced out everywhere.
Quote from: Jamie Nicole on June 29, 2011, 08:25:02 PM
but then again, how can we ever educate the general public for something that is so misunderstood?
last I checked, being born with a birth defect did not carry with it the incumbent requirement that I participate in the education of the free world about how otherwise normal I was...
so when the free world says...and has said, that we are nothing but men dressing in womens clothes and that we're perverts for using the female restroom, you're ok with that? And of course this is just a generalization of the what society thinks when they here the umbrella term "transgender."
when we are the recipients of discrimination...denied employment, an education, housing, etc because we are transgendered, you're ok with that as well? To date, their are limited local and state gov'ts in which gender identity is a protected class against discrimination. I have no problems with telling anyone I am transgendered or my life story or what it's like to be different. I do whatever I can to help educate others so that the common misconception about us is better understood. The only way we will be 100% accepted by society in general is when society has a better understanding of us.
It's not about being okay about it or anything. It's hard to compare, but let's say Africa. No one is "okay" with the fact that people there have their rights, food, money and even health sipped out of them by people linked to rich countries' millionaires, but not everyone wants to make the effort of dedicating their life to helping those people.
In the case of transgendered people, the price to pay is not money or time like with Africa; it is to be partly stripped of the "normal" life one has struggled incredibly hard to get.
Sacrificing oneself for the others is good, but not everyone can do it, and on ->-bleeped-<-/transsexualism, I am not sure I can either. Some people are okay with being fully open regarding their "special" status. It's great. But not everyone is capable of maintaining a mental health and happiness in such a state.
Being open and honest is a plus, not an obligation. Similarly, choosing not to outright reveal secrets is a right, and whilst willingfully refusing to use a right to defend that in which one believes in and for the future generations is good, it is not an obligation.
To continue the comparison with Africa, being absolutely open about one's ->-bleeped-<- is not like chipping in a few dollars a week to feed the poor or signing a petition to force a factory there to be more ethical. It's like becoming a politician and working every day, without ever being able to retire, to change politics regarding Africa, or to enroll to be a missionnary over there.
It's no small thing. Transgendered people struggle with an enormous amount of problems already to just be allowed to live. It is not on THEM that a life-long burden must be placed. That's what activists, petition authors and politicians are for.
Direct throw back to trying to educate the public "we are trans and we are just like everyone else, just don't call us trans!". eerrrrrrrr.... so you are this but you're not? Or you don't want people to know? wait I'm confused so what are we suppose to..?? huh?".
I've always been against educating the public, it should of stayed like it was back in the 60-70s... no one knows and if they see a women that is slightly less womanly than the next then they just assume they were born that way and had never actually transitioned from one sex to the other.
Now all these people want to "educate" the public but they want conditions on that and to control it so far beyond reality that it's just delusional.
I'm not shocked or surprised by any of this, more amused.
Quote from: Jamie Nicole on June 29, 2011, 09:53:49 PM
so when the free world says...and has said, that we are nothing but men dressing in womens clothes and that we're perverts for using the female restroom, you're ok with that? And of course this is just a generalization of the what society thinks when they here the umbrella term "transgender."
I'm not sure you really want my true opinion on that, especially since I abhor the term 'transgender.' If someone wanted to run a genitalia check on me to confirm that I actually have what my DL and birth certificate have shown for much of the past 20 years, then so be it. Good luck finding a paper trail on any of it either since I worked through the cracks in the system and did not leave a paper trail...
Quotewhen we are the recipients of discrimination...denied employment, an education, housing, etc because we are transgendered, you're ok with that as well? To date, their are limited local and state gov'ts in which gender identity is a protected class against discrimination. I have no problems with telling anyone I am transgendered or my life story or what it's like to be different. I do whatever I can to help educate others so that the common misconception about us is better understood. The only way we will be 100% accepted by society in general is when society has a better understanding of us.
again, I never laid a claim to anything 'transgendered' and damned sure won't be doing anything to advance a cause that insists on using that term. I may have a past history of having a transsexual medical condition that has been remedied vis a vis medical intervention MANY years ago, but it is also not a condition that has cause me a problem with employment, education or housing. In fact, unless someone digs up a transcript from a high school that no longer exists, good effing luck finding anything that links that part of my history to the me that has a credentialed professional career...
What is it with people who constantly say "Please, stop outing me." If you do not want to be outed period then "DO NOT BLOODY SAY ANYTHING". Because once you say something then you will not have any control over what people will say and do. It is just fortunate that I virtually gave up everything over 22 years ago and by doing that I have not had the troubles that others are constantly having today. Yes, I know some have children and partners and it is up to you in those circumstances, what you do.
Whose we? I'm have not, have never been and never will be a part of the community, because as Ann Onymous alluded to, I also hate and detest anything trans*. If anyone wants to run a check on me, they are going to have a extremely hard time digging up any information on me and I will wish them, "the best luck in the world". Why? Because I just recently as a matter of interest, checked all my background through Freedom of Information (FOI) laws and even I could not come up with anything.
The only exceptions are 2 long time doctors, 1 surgeon and 2 government departments and of course my family. The first 5 are bound by confidentiality and privacy laws. The last of course is my family and I have said to them I do not want to be 'outed' and if they do and I find out, I will not associate with them again. My privacy is paramount to me and my family and if you want to live your life, where others do not know about you then "don't say anything". I used the system as much as possible to make sure I left no indications of my past medical condition or my past life.
I also will not advanced any cause for those that want to use the trans* whatever or any other label. Yes I do understand my medical condition and I had corrective surgery over 20 years ago and I have had an extremely successful life ever since. As far as I'm aware I have not been 'discriminated' in any shape or form and whoa behold anyone that does.
As Ann Onymous said "good effing luck" to anyone trying to find any links with my previous life.
Warm regards
Sarah B
Quote from: Sarah B on June 30, 2011, 12:34:20 AM
What is it with people who constantly say "Please, stop outing me." If you do not want to be outed period then "DO NOT BLOODY SAY ANYTHING".
I don't. I've lived in Orlando for the past 16 years of my life. I am close to family, who is supportive, I am close to my friends who are supportive. They know me as Samantha, but they also know my past. They tend to out me for any number of reasons. I've also made a lot of friends from a local trans support group, because when you're so early in transition, having the extra support is extremely beneficial.
These friends of mine, they know I'm trans. I didn't necessarily have to say anything about it. But they have a nasty habbit of outing me. So I'm left with 2 choices. Choice number 1 is to ask them kindly to stop outing me. Choice number 2 is to leave and abandon my family and friends whom I love and who also support me.
I'm not walking around saying, "
Oh hey I'm transsexual. Wah stop outing me!!!" - This is happening from people who already know I'm trans, be it from knowing me in the past, or from my support group. I've really only ever come out to maybe 3 people I've ever met, 2 of those being prospective partners. I can't exactly -not- tell them, because I haven't had my srs yet.
yeah tell them you told them in confidence and it's not for public consumption and if they don't respect that then you'll just share one of their secrets right after they've shared yours. Taste of their own medicine should be enough?
Wouldn't outing someone technicaly be violating HIPPA?
Quote from: cynthialee on June 30, 2011, 08:42:43 AM
Wouldn't outing someone technicaly be violating HIPPA?
HIPAA does not apply to an individual who discloses information they have learned about another's medical condition. Only Health Plans, Providers and Health-Information Clearinghouses are bound by the disclosure provisions of the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act...even employers are not strictly bound by it.