preop transexual;
QuotePre-op means "pre-operative transsexual," someone who has begun the hormonal and surgical procedures and is very close to the operation.
what about those who haven't begun the hormonal and surgical procedures? are they still preop transexuals? do you have to be in treatment to be [transexual]? opinions?
Katia I have been asking the same question. I am sure that is it. I am new to all this so have been podering about labels. I have Labels but what am I. A very confused man who thinks he should have been a woman. I havent started HRT and dont know if Im going to. So am I a transexual? I dont know.
Yea... if you think you're going to go through with it all.. consider yourself in.
Cindi
but the point here Cindy is I dont know if I am going to go through with it. I havent decided yes. Got to go and get some help.
Quote from: Lucy on February 14, 2007, 03:01:36 AM
but the point here Cindy is I dont know if I am going to go through with it. I havent decided yes. Got to go and get some help.
If you are TS then you won't have a choice
Steph
Quote from: Steph on February 14, 2007, 04:25:56 AM
If you are TS then you won't have a choice
I am sure I am TS I am trying to get to see a theropist to help me out there. my problem is Im married and my familiy wouldn't understand.
I may just live my life out in this body (Some How). I just dont want to hurt anyone aspeshily my wife. Im just to frightened to look at that right now. One step at a time..
TY Lucy
Self-identifying as transsexual and getting a diagnose from a doctor saying that one is transsexual are two different things.
Knowing what one is and what one wants to do about it are important - but there is no hurry. The diagnose is needed for getting medical treatment - but the details vary from country to country. Finding a good therapist is important and can help to clear things out.
There is the choice of living as one's true self or not - but running away from it, drugs or suicide didn't sound like tempting alternatives.
Quote from: taru on February 14, 2007, 05:17:37 AM
There is the choice of living as one's true self or not - but running away from it, drugs or suicide didn't sound like tempting alternatives.
Taru
I know exactly what you are saying, this last 15 years has been a very long and hard road to stay on. Do you not think in my early years I didn't concider ending it all. I have moments every now and then when it does cross my mind. But let me tell you I am much stronger now and theropy is the way forward for me. Im not hiding from anything, I just want to do what is best for me and my wife.
I've been hiding away YES and Running in a fashion thats why I came to susan's place. I've been reading the posts here for 12 months + and decided to throw my self in and get help. YOU KNOW WHAT. Comming here has been the best thing I ever did, being able to talk to someone has really helped and lifed my mood. What a great place this truley is.
A Life Saver :angel:
Hmmm...
I think for any kind of condition, we will all read books, the internet and convince ourselves we have this condition or this illness. Self diagnosis is perhaps a step on the road, but until an official disgnosis is made I guess, you can not be classed as anything
Once you have that diagnosis as a Transsexual (after the absence of all other possible causes), I guess you then start treatment, hormones in the main. Electrolysis, voice therapy etc..at this stage I would consider this to be pre-op, a diagnosis followed by hormone therapy... followed by RLE and then surgery.
I knew I was different, suspected I was TS, but denied that for fully 20 odd years, because the consequenses at times where to frighteneing to even contemplate.
So to keep on topic I guess , I was a potential TS, in denial without a diagnosis... Hmmmm
Quote from: Buffy on February 14, 2007, 07:17:44 AM
So to keep on topic I guess , I was a potential TS, in denial without a diagnosis... Hmmmm
OK thats it then. All over... I agree whole heartedly. that must be me.
Doesn't really take the pain away does it.
shame..
Katia
Your question has been solved.
So Im protenshally TS but with out a diagnosis We can't be sure.
But wasn't the original question.
So using my self as the example.
If I was diagnosed but dont take hormones or go for surgery what am I then.
Personal opinion your not transsexual unless you change your "sex". If you are in the process of making that change you are a pre-op transsexual. If you aren't in the process but plan on that destination your a pre-transsexual <insert your "gender">
However in all stages you are a <insert your "gender"> and transsexual merely describes the medical treatment(not the person) to make your sex match your gender.
Quote from: Lucy on February 14, 2007, 07:50:21 AM
Quote from: Buffy on February 14, 2007, 07:17:44 AM
So to keep on topic I guess , I was a potential TS, in denial without a diagnosis... Hmmmm
OK thats it then. All over... I agree whole heartedly. that must be me.
Doesn't really take the pain away does it.
shame..
Katia
Your question has been solved.
So Im protenshally TS but with out a diagnosis We can't be sure.
But wasn't the original question.
So using my self as the example.
If I was diagnosed but dont take hormones or go for surgery what am I then.
Lucy,
As I have said before - take your time and do not worry about labels. If you where diagnosed but do not do any changes that is great. Many people say do not go onto HRT ETC unless you really need to do it. I have been thinking alot about my situation and I know I will be looking at all the alternatives before decided to change. You are about to start threapy and have a great marriage - do not go onto HRT ETC unless you really need to and are convinced there are no alternatives.
You are yourself - do not worry about what other people have done in the past - know it is an alternative but worry about what is best for you.
Alice
Alice.
I thank you for that last comment because most people keep saying if you are TS you know what you will have to do. Well, I dont beleive that hrt is the only way. Yes I have my moments where the pain and lonlyness become unbearable but It passes. Thats what borght me here in the first place. I had hit rock bottom and just didn't know what to do. I have a new lease of life not and feel quite confident inmyself again. OK so I might be TS, undiognosed, but I feel as if I am. The issue remains that if I can learn to just deal with it I will. Nodoght I will be back in a couple of months screeming again. Lets see what the docter has to say first and move on from there.
I have to ask myself... Does all this really matter. A transsexual is a transsexual, does it matter that they are pre-op, pre-transition, pre-hrt, pre-rle. It's almost as though there are some who think this is some form of rating system. A transsexual will transition and that's all that counts. During their journey a TS could expect to be pre something along the way couldn't they.
Steph
Thats a great attitude Lucy. There is a process that we all go through when we come out of denile and where we end up depends upon many things. Sure many people decide they are TS and go through HRT etc but there are other alternative ie just dressing to express your feminine side.
I know it is scary - I am going through that process myself.
Alice
Quote from: Steph on February 14, 2007, 04:41:48 PM
I have to ask myself... Does all this really matter. A transsexual is a transsexual, does it matter that they are pre-op, pre-transition, pre-hrt, pre-rle. It's almost as though there are some who think this is some form of rating system. A transsexual will transition and that's all that counts. During their journey a TS could expect to be pre something along the way couldn't they.
Steph
I now officialy hate that steph. I have been called a TS person by a few people and my actions indicated that I have fooled myself for so many year. Someone in depression ETC definatly needs help - I know about the mood swings and suicidal thoughts that come with it - it is truly a scarly experience looking at your life and wondering why you need to change.
But for someone new who is trying to sort out their feelings asking them if they are TS and then saying you need to transiston is just to much. Heck - it is hard enough for me and I have been here for months. Just give people the time they need to come to their own conclusion.
Alice
*edit Spelling
Quote from: Alice on February 14, 2007, 04:44:31 PM
Sure many people decide they are TS and go through HRT etc but there are other alternative ie just dressing to express your feminine side.
I know it is scary - I am going through that process myself.
Alice
I know this may sound crazy, or not, I have read many stange and wonderfull things in here. Although I see my self as female (TS). I want to be able to live my life our as one or the other. I have found ways of boosting my mascaline side, but it involves staying very very busy at work and the gym. When I put my guard down for any lenth of time im back to me (just Lucy). I will either have to live my life out as him or her, I dont want to have to switch back and forth or dress to express.
I just want a normal life doing normal things without the torment of gender issues.
Quote from: Lucy on February 14, 2007, 04:58:45 PM
Quote from: Alice on February 14, 2007, 04:44:31 PM
Sure many people decide they are TS and go through HRT etc but there are other alternative ie just dressing to express your feminine side.
I know it is scary - I am going through that process myself.
Alice
I know this may sound crazy, or not, I have read many stange and wonderfull things in here. Although I see my self as female (TS). I want to be able to live my life our as one or the other. I have found ways of boosting my mascaline side, but it involves staying very very busy at work and the gym. When I put my guard down for any lenth of time im back to me (just Lucy). I will either have to live my life out as him or her, I dont want to have to switch back and forth or dress to express.
I just want a normal life doing normal things without the torment of gender issues.
Yeap - That is or I want - what everyone wants - I can very much relate to what you just said. The question is how do we get there - I am sure the answer is different for all of us.
Alice
LOL..OMG....are you trying to get me in trouble again? ;) ;D Pre-op means pre-op, post-op means post-op, fulltime means fulltime, and you know what means you know what! ;)....what is soooooo difficult to understand? LOL ;D...just kidding! :D
I concur with what Buffy has said:
Quote from: BuffySelf diagnosis is perhaps a step on the road, but until an official diagnosis is made I guess, you can not be classed as anything.
Once you have that diagnosis as a Transsexual (after the absence of all other possible causes), I guess you then start treatment, hormones in the main. Electrolysis, voice therapy etc..at this stage I would consider this to be pre-op, a diagnosis followed by hormone therapy... followed by RLE and then surgery.
...and...
Quote from: StephA transsexual will transition and that's all that counts
Yes indeed! a transsexual
will transition. However some people may be diagnosed with other conditions which do not meet the criteria for transsexualism according to the DSM. See
this link. or
DSM-IV.
tinkerbell :icon_chick:
Lucy,
Get a therapist and talk it over. If there is any way you can keep yourself from transitioning, then I heartily suggest that you follow that path. I really do. You have strong bindings to a marraige and family. Unless you can break those, you should not proceed.... you shouldn't even think about it. Ultimately, your family and spouse may come along... but unless you can give them up, don't start. For chances are very good that you will lose them in the process.
Many of us could not do that. This thing pushed us. There was no way to deny it. That's why Steph always says that "transsexuals WILL transition". It's like starting a big truck rolling down a hill. You can put yourself in front of it to attempt to stop it, but it continues to roll.
Don't worry about what to call yourself. You don't need a label.
Chin up!
Cindi
Quote from: Alice on February 14, 2007, 04:52:20 PM
Thats a great attitude Lucy. There is a process that we all go through when we come out of denile and where we end up depends upon many things. Sure many people decide they are TS and go through HRT etc but there are other alternative ie just dressing to express your feminine side.
I know it is scary - I am going through that process myself.
Alice
Quote from: Steph on February 14, 2007, 04:41:48 PM
I have to ask myself... Does all this really matter. A transsexual is a transsexual, does it matter that they are pre-op, pre-transition, pre-hrt, pre-rle. It's almost as though there are some who think this is some form of rating system. A transsexual will transition and that's all that counts. During their journey a TS could expect to be pre something along the way couldn't they.
Steph
I know officiy hate that steph. I have been called a TS person by a few people and my actions indicated that I have fooled myself for so many year. Somone in depression ETC definatly needs help - I know about the mood swings and sucuicidal thoughts that come with it - it is truly a scarly experience looking at your life and wondering why you need to change.
But for someone new who is trying to sort out their feelings asking them if they are TS and then saying you need to transiston is just to much. Heck - it is hard enough for me and I have been here for months. Just give people the time they need to come to their own conclusion.
Alice
I know Alice, many also hate that line of mine but I really feel it is true, sorry hon.
Steph
QuoteSo using my self as the example.
If I was diagnosed but dont take hormones or go for surgery what am I then.
That's a very good question Lucy. I can relate to this as I transitioned in 1993, was diagnosed by my therapist as TS, did RLT for over a year, then for a number of reasons haven't ever done HRT or pursued surgery. As I see it, the definition of being TS is the feeling that one doesn't belong to the gender of their physical sex. Whether one chooses medical intervention (or not) isn't necessarily a requirement of being TS, IMO, it is simply one of a number of possible options. Another option is the one I have chosen (at least for now), to live somewhere in between. Now, as to what term to describe this, I don't know... non-op, androgyne, whatever, just don't call me sir or he and I'm happy ;)
zythyra
This is just the "she-male" thread with a different focus point.....why must we continue to debate about who is what and what is that what? It is pointless, petty and arguementative.
After watching the progress of the other thread I saw tempers flaring, feelings hurt and members who felt uncomfortable posting now because they no longer felt like they were seen as equals. I really hate seeing that kind of thing happen....maybe there are just times when it's best to agree to disagree and move onto something that is beneficial to the group.
A couple quotes from one of my favorite sources...Chief Joseph of the Nez Perce.
QuoteI am tired of fighting.... from where the sun now stands, I will fight no more.
Good words do not last long unless they amount to something.
Too many misinterpretations have been made... too many misunderstandings...
I am tired of talk that comes to nothing.
Just my opinion..............
Quote from: Buffy on February 14, 2007, 07:17:44 AM
Self diagnosis is perhaps a step on the road, but until an official disgnosis is made I guess, you can not be classed as anything
I like to use the term pre-transitional ofr that point in time for a TS. If you are not TS, then why even bother trying to figure out what term to use?
Melissa
Quote from: BrandiOK on February 15, 2007, 12:12:23 AM
This is just the "she-male" thread with a different focus point.
Just my opinion..............
no the title of this topic is the term preop, the ->-bleeped-<- topic was a different thread, apples and bananas iow. but thanx for the opinion.
That is so great, that one little question should cause such controvocy. Brandi, It seem that you feel that you dont like this disscusion, my appologies. I have been playing "devils advocate" to see what sort of responce I may get, I get more information that way and findout more aabout them as a person.
No Labels for me, just going to see the theropist and take my time.
thanks lucy ;D
Quote from: Lucy on February 15, 2007, 02:08:35 AM
That is so great, that one little question should cause such controvocy. Brandi, It seem that you feel that you dont like this disscusion, my appologies. I have been playing "devils advocate" to see what sort of responce I may get, I get more information that way and findout more aabout them as a person.
No Labels for me, just going to see the theropist and take my time.
thanks lucy ;D
clever girl! ;)
Quote from: Katia on February 15, 2007, 02:05:31 AM
Quote from: BrandiOK on February 15, 2007, 12:12:23 AM
This is just the "she-male" thread with a different focus point.
Just my opinion..............
no the title of this topic is the term preop, the ->-bleeped-<- topic was a different thread, apples and bananas iow. but thanx for the opinion.
Hence the reason I said "with a different focus point"...apples and bananas are both fruit and this is just another debate over semantics.
I'm all for discussion, it's the basis of support afterall, however when these topics are discussed down to the point that they become debates over who's terminology is right and who's is wrong it's no longer about support or information and that doesn't benefit anyone.
This thread has a completely different flavor. It's more like comparing bananas and meatloaf. Their both threads about terms, but that's where the similarity ends.
Melissa
While both threads did start out differently they have broken down into the same debate. It boils down into the same arguement of what one person thinks a TS or what one person thinks a she-male is or what one person thinks a woman is etc, etc, etc.
One person may believe that there is no "pre-op transsexual" because you must have SRS to be TS.
One person may believe that "non-op"s can not be considered TS.
One person may believe that being a woman is dependant on physical characteristics.
One person may believe that being a woman is dependant on psychological characteristics.
My point is simply that we all have different views and argueing about who is who and what is what is counter productive. Apparantly I'm the only one who see's it this way so I'll hush now and let the ball bounce how it may.
QuoteMy point is simply that we all have different views and argueing about who is who and what is what is counter productive. Apparantly I'm the only one who see's it this way so I'll hush now and let the ball bounce how it may.
I agree with you BrandiOk, I really hate arguing about things, and will usually just stay out of these sorts of things, but I do agree, we are all going to have an opionion on things, and ultimatly people can just call themslevs whatever they want and it really doen't matter. they are just words, I just consider myself to be a girl, the rest is just a semantics argument.
-pass-
Quote from: BrandiOK on February 15, 2007, 11:25:17 AM
While both threads did start out differently they have broken down into the same debate. It boils down into the same arguement of what one person thinks a TS or what one person thinks a she-male is or what one person thinks a woman is etc, etc, etc.
In other words, a pointless discussion that doesn't go anywhere? I'll agree with that. :)
Melissa
Oh... I don't know... it is discussions like this that may allow some to come to terms with themselves. Semantics? Words are wonderful! It definitely makes for some interesting reading.
Cindi
Quote from: BrandiOK on February 15, 2007, 11:25:17 AM
.
One person may believe that there is no "pre-op transsexual" because you must have SRS to be TS.
One person may believe that "non-op"s can not be considered TS.
One person may believe that being a woman is dependant on physical characteristics.
One person may believe that being a woman is dependant on psychological characteristics.
My point is simply that we all have different views
exactly!
Quote from: brandiokApparantly I'm the only one who see's it this way
dunno. we'll see as the topic progresses.
Quote from: cindi jonesOh... I don't know... it is discussions like this that may allow some to come to terms with themselves. Semantics? Words are wonderful! It definitely makes for some interesting reading.
atta girl! clever, put together thoughts
Quote from: Cindi Jones on February 15, 2007, 03:19:46 PM
Oh... I don't know... it is discussions like this that may allow some to come to terms with themselves. Semantics? Words are wonderful! It definitely makes for some interesting reading.
Cindi
Cheers cindi
I was a little confused about all this labaling lark and now I am lost.. ;)
not really, nice to here other ideas.
For newbie to this like me it helps to here the old ones argue, I watch and learn about the TS thorght process.
Im not interested in what I am, I know that allready with out a sticker on my back.
But the bottem line is it does help me realise it's not about words but what inside that counts
Quote from: Cindi Jones on February 15, 2007, 03:19:46 PM
Oh... I don't know... it is discussions like this that may allow some to come to terms with themselves. Semantics? Words are wonderful! It definitely makes for some interesting reading.
Cindi
Words of wisdom as always my angel without wings! :)
tinkerbell :icon_chick: