Found the link for v7 SOC on ->-bleeped-<-, and the WPATH website has not yet posted the release. The below link is through ugcs.net;
http://ugcs.net/~irene/drop/soc.pdf (http://ugcs.net/~irene/drop/soc.pdf)
This link is also posted in the Science and Medical News board.
SandraJane
Strongly dislike it. I haven't been able to read everything but the new SoC is trans misogynistic.
I keep getting errors that keep it from fully loading for me - but i like what I've seen in the summary overview.
Quote from: Tammy Hope on September 26, 2011, 01:58:54 AM
I keep getting errors that keep it from fully loading for me - but i like what I've seen in the summary overview.
I've read the whole thing.. And on the whole, it makes life much easier for us all.. I must be missing the misogyny that Nygeel mentioned..
Quote from: Nygeel on September 26, 2011, 01:12:06 AM
Strongly dislike it. I haven't been able to read everything but the new SoC is trans misogynistic.
How so?
Have only been able to scan thru it, but noticed there wasn't the time requirements for HRT. Plus the emphasis shift to the "Mental Health" community, not so sure about that. More about informed consent here to.
Nygeel, where are you picking up the misogynistic part?
Kelly, any specific "postitve" changes you noticed?
Tammy, the server is the Cal Tech Under Grad Computer Science Center (http://ugcs.net (http://ugcs.net)), so how they got a hold of this...well...because WPATH has not made an official announcement or released it yet according to their website.
SJ
Quote from: Nygeel on September 26, 2011, 01:12:06 AM
Strongly dislike it. I haven't been able to read everything but the new SoC is trans misogynistic.
Can you point to the spots? Scanned through it, but I guess I'm losing my touch cause I didn't see it.
There were some definitions in the appendix that bothered me, and I don't like that they are still using MtF and FtM. But in practical terms it's a small improvement: informed consent model for HRT, top surgery, hysto, and orchi. Of course quite a few GTs and clinics have already moved to that model, so it feels a bit like they are playing catch up. I guess my therapist and the others of her position lost on trying to change the year long RLE requirement for SRS. Too bad. :-\
Plus we missed out on the Champagne they passed out when it was unveiled at Southern Comfort in Atlanta yesterday :laugh:
It's trans misogyny...not misogyny. The part where trans women have to wait for surgery while trans men are encouraged to get surgery earlier. It holds trans women to a higher standard with stricter requirements.
as may be, if i can do everything else on IC and have to wait a year of 24/7 before surgery - i can do that standing on my head.
The only thing i ask is this: I've been full time for almost 2 years now but NOT able to afford professional treatment. I want the clock to already be running and not start when i get my letter or whatever. I've DONE my RLE twice over and i want it to count.
Quote from: Nygeel on September 28, 2011, 03:42:18 PM
It's trans misogyny...not misogyny. The part where trans women have to wait for surgery while trans men are encouraged to get surgery earlier. It holds trans women to a higher standard with stricter requirements.
Unfortunately we have a new term now, Transmisogyny/Transmisogynist. Though they have loosened the RLE from a near absolute to a now recommended status, still you're right, thanks for pointing that out Nygeel.
Quote from: SandraJane on September 28, 2011, 05:01:54 PM
Unfortunately we have a new term now, Transmisogyny/Transmisogynist. Though they have loosened the RLE from a near absolute to a now recommended status, still you're right, thanks for pointing that out Nygeel.
Not entirely a new phrase, but it's something that's been happening for a long time. It especially happens in lesbian spaces where cis lesbians feel like trans women aren't dateable because they're "not women enough." It's a set of standards where trans women have to be a certain kind of woman in order to be "woman enough" or when trans women act too feminine they're "becoming a parody of what women really are."
All examples of trans misogyny. A few tumblr blogs have posts about it, and there's definitely some stuff on other political trans blogging sites.
Good point Nygeel. I suppose I was looking at v7 relative to the previous version without even realizing that I accepted without challenge the differences between XY women seeking surgical intervention and XX men seeking surgical intervention.
Downloaded, saved and printed :)
All they have done is make it easier for people with money to transition faster. Which is only a reflection on the reality of the more progressive places current practices.
Hmm. On this transmisogyny thing - there's a big difference between not being into someone on some kind of "principle" (e.g. because they're trans and you have some fixed view of what that means relative to yourself) on the one hand, and just not fancying/not liking someone (because we either fancy/like people or we don't) on the other.
I agree there's a lot of phobia around, but it doesn't follow that everyone is phobic/misogynist who isn't attracted to a trans woman. Not that this is what's necessarily being said here, but I wanted to make it more explicit.
Yeah, Pamda. I really dislike the entire 'transphobia' deal, particularly when someone is saying - and we currently have an entire thread based on this - well they must be phobic because they won't accept my store bought penis as the real deal. Look, lots of gay men are gay (and straight women straight) because they want a hot throbbing shaft of flesh that will shoot pecker snot all over their tonsils (or spray baby juice all up in their money maker), and they don't find a plastic/latex substitute to be acceptable. It's not a phobia, it's just knowing what you want.
Good point Padma! But new words and abbrevations, and new uses for old ones appear to have found fertile ground.
Quote from: tekla on September 28, 2011, 06:48:51 PM
Yeah, Pamda. I really dislike the entire 'transphobia' deal, particularly when someone is saying - and we currently have an entire thread based on this - well they must be phobic because they won't accept my store bought penis as the real deal. Look, lots of gay men are gay (and straight women straight) because they want a hot throbbing shaft of flesh that will shoot pecker snot all over their tonsils (or spray baby juice all up in their money maker), and they don't find a plastic/latex substitute to be acceptable. It's not a phobia, it's just knowing what you want.
Tekla, and I thought you were losing your edge..."pecker snot" and "baby juice" (that's actually kinda cute)... :laugh:
Misogyny is a term taken from Greek meaning hatred or dislike of women, so I'm guessing that transmisogyny would refer to a hatred or dislike of trans women? I would question that the SoC meant any transmisogyny or rather, the suggested standards are made out of concern for the health of transwomen
All they have done is make it easier for people with money to transition faster. Which is only a reflection on the reality of the more progressive places current practices.
Are you surprised by that?
Tekla, and I thought you were losing your edge..."pecker snot" and "baby juice" (that's actually kinda cute)... :laugh:
LOL... I kinda got a kick out of that too for some reason :laugh:
For some reason(!) I'm reminded of a situation I was in some years ago where a friend I worked with (who was really difficult) was moaning to me "My manager is down on me cos I'm gay - he's such a homophobe!" and I had to say (because I knew both of them well) "Um... to be honest? He's not homophobic, he's not down on you because you're gay, he's annoyed with you because you're being an arsehole, sorry :)."
Sometimes, some people are very quick to label others' reactions as prejudice, because it's easier than taking responsibility for your own actions.
I recognise transmisogyny as a phenomenon (I've experienced it myself already), I just think it should be used sparingly as an accusation.